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Freddie Bennett 0:21

Welcome to Over the Influence in association with dry drink.com. This is the game changing podcast helping people to change their relationship with alcohol and live their best lives.

Sharon Hartley 0:32

I'm Sharon Hartley. I am 46 years old. I am a former professional drinker, mother to three children, married to Paul, and from Lancashire in the northwest of England.

Freddie Bennett 0:42

I'm Freddie, I'm 37. I am formally fun time/stressed corporate worker, hardcore party boy who is now pretty much celebrating a year alcohol free. I'm a father, I'm a husband, and I am the person who was least likely to ever stop drinking if you'd asked me just over a year ago… but I made that choice. I changed my life. And now I'm trying and sometimes failing to make my dreams come true.

Sharon Hartley 1:12

And it's not just myself and Freddy. We've also got background Ben joining us on the podcast today. Hello background Ben.

Ben Anderson 1:18

Hi. I’m background Ben because I don’t have a mic.

Sharon Hartley 1:19

And Ben just before we move on, it's the year 2020. Just tell us just tell us what you're doing for this year.

Ben Anderson 1:26

So, unlike you guys, I haven't given up drinking completely, but I am cutting down dramatically. So I've chosen 20 days this year, where I can have a drink.

Sharon Hartley 1:35

Here we are episode two of over the influence. And we're gonna call this episode Mind the Gap. Freddie, mind the gap? What does that mean?

Freddie Bennett 1:44

When you first stop drinking alcohol, you do find you've got lots more time on your hands. You've got this new lease of life, you've got more energy, you've got more focus. But what the hell do you do with that, because if you don't fill that gap with something, that's when the temptation to start drinking starts to rear its ugly little head.

Sharon Hartley 2:01

I think it's fair to say there are some really clear-cut gaps that appear aren't there, particularly in the really early days. And in this episode, we really want to focus on those trigger points, those gaps that might appear when you would normally have a drink when you're socialising or when you're at home. And we're going to look at the physical and emotional benefits of avoiding alcohol.

Freddie Bennett 2:23

Yeah, it's not just about thigh gaps. It'd be very easy just to talk about all these brilliant physical benefits that we all know like, it's not really a newsflash, that alcohol has got calories in it, and if you stopped drinking alcohol, you take on less calories. I am the proud owner of a thigh gap. Yes, yes. It does appeal to men as well. Yes, not just a female thing. My thighs used to rub together like a couple of mating seals. But now I've actually got a thigh gap. And I've actually started not spending all my time in pubs actually doing some exercise. But you’re absolutely right Shazza, we're not going to be starting talking about running ultra-marathons and hanging out in the gym all day long. It's so much about the emotional benefits and all this time that you've got on your hands and how best to fill that. And no matter whether you're young or old, rich or poor fit or unfit, there is so much time that it can give you with this new lease of life. But you do have to fill it in some way. And that's what we're going to go through today.

So now, as I've clearly said that I'm an expert in all types of gaps. But Shazza, what do we really mean by the gap?

Sharon Hartley 3:39

I think one of the key things about the gap, it's time. So, when you're not drinking, you know that the kids go to bed or whatever, then it's your time, isn't it? It's wine o'clock, it's all this when you've not got that bottle of wine to open. And you're not sitting on the settee, scrolling Facebook for hours with a glass of wine in your hand. It's what you do during those early days. I think it's fair to say this, this doesn't last forever those gaps because the whole journey changes. But I think in the early days, it's really key to find ways of plugging the gap and not falling down it.

Freddie Bennett 4:15

Totally agree with that. And you know, being conservative, I would get pretty smashed once a week. So, let's say that's one day a week lost to a hangover. Yeah. So, in a year that's around, let's call it 50 days, again, that's being pretty conservative for me. So I've lost 50 days a year. So then you start adding those years up. I mean, what I was drinking for 1820 years, adding all that so I was literally I've lost years of my life to hangovers, and I decided that I didn't want to lose that time anymore. By not drinking, I could literally not add years to my life in terms of the health benefits but actually in terms of my time, and that's why I started doing things like extreme ironing… yeah it's actually a thing. So I Yeah, we used to have your drinking marathons, but now I’m like right – kids’ school uniforms – done, work shirts – done… all these sorts of things.

I remember a night out that we had and Ben, you were there in Liverpool last summer. And everyone was getting on it, it was one of those amazing warm Saturday nights when the sun’s shining and it feels like the whole world is out in a beer garden. And I was suffering. I'd had all those alcohol-free beers and dealing with the pubs that didn't really have a good selection. And I was I was climbing the walls. And I thought, right Saturday night, I'm gonna get in a taxi, get myself home, and I cleaned the house. So being the guy that was you know, at 11 o'clock at night, I'd be really getting into my groove when I was drinking or be, you know, at the front of the nightclub and dancing on the tables. I was mopping the floors and doing the windows and thinking, well, you know, those curtains really need a dusting. And I was like what has happened to me? I'm 37 years old. It's Saturday night. And I was pretty pissed off to be honest. I was like, what has my life become? I've I said no to all this fun. And I've gone home and I've cleaned the house. But you know what, on that Sunday morning, waking up to a clean house bonus. And also, to having a clear head. I was like you know what it is actually all worth it. And you can do this amazing stuff, or this really crappy mundane housecleaning stuff with your time. But you've got that control back, your time is your own. Once again, your time isn't handcuffed to alcohol, you can just do what you want and make those things happen.

Sharon Hartley 6:32

And I think as well, it's fair to say my mantra has been throughout the 17 months I've been doing this – is do something different. Try something you've never done before. I mean, I'm not gonna go down, you know, take up jigsaws, or crocheting or whatever. But we know people don’t we who have started learning another language. Yeah, taken up exercise… I started doing part runs on a Saturday morning. And park runs start at nine o'clock, which is just being up and about, you know, because you're not feeling the effects of the Friday night before. And doing things you wouldn't normally do a big one for me. And it's the same for you making new friends – sober friends. Yeah, mixing in sober circles. If somebody had said to me a couple of years back, Sharon, you'll enjoy mixing with a sober crowd. People who, you know, have a similar mindset to you, I would have laughed and have had them pour me another large glass of rose. I thought, not a chance – it'll be boring. It'll be dull. But it's been amazing. And it's about maybe doing things that push you out of your comfort zone. Yeah. And you know, things you wouldn't normally have tried in the past. We hosted an event with a couple of weeks back…

Freddie Bennett 7:40

Absolutely… like that Manchester event that we ran. And that was just getting a bunch of people together in a pub. Ironically, there's something a bit crazy, we, you know, we gathered 50 people around, we were all queued up outside a pub 11 o'clock in the morning, which is could be seen as a bit of a risk. But we thought no, because we've got this this confidence. We're not hiding away in a dark cellar, trying to get people into a sect or something. Yeah, it's about saying, we're still doing awesome stuff.

Sharon Hartley 8:07

You can still socialise, you can still have fun, you know, that that event in particular for me was so important because what it showed was so many people, like us, in the same boat that just wanted to get together, socialise, and have a chat with no alcohol.

Freddie Bennett 8:24

Yeah, absolutely. I think the whole something you said around the comfort zone. I know it's big in our society at the moment. I mean, you go on LinkedIn, or Facebook or YouTube and everyone's saying smash your comfort zone, do something different. You've got your, your David Goggins. And everyone's who's an ex Special Forces person, say, like, yeah, do this extreme stuff. And, and I think that's great. It's really inspirational. But for a lot of people out there, they can't relate to it. Yeah. If they say, well, yeah, I know that these people can go and run up Everest, and swim across oceans and all these sorts of things. But we could all step out of our comfort zone just by doing something that feels a bit different to us. So for someone else that might just be as you say, starting to read new books, or to take up a new language or learn an instrument or just go to an event that they wouldn't normally go to or that they wouldn't normally go to without as I used to do, you know, a couple of confidence sharpeners in the kitchen at home before you go and do it.

Sharon Hartley 9:23

I think it’s really important to say as well that filling that gap doesn't have to be extreme does it? It can be the most mundane thing. For me, in the really early days, I felt wrecked. I just wanted to sleep. So sometimes, you know, particularly at nine o'clock at night when I would have normally been drinking the wine, I just went to bed. You know, had the most glorious sleep. So, it’s keeping it simple a lot of the time isn't it?

Freddie Bennett 9:46

Yeah, absolutely. I think it's about having that that strength to actually do what you want. And I felt weirdly guilty sometimes, especially when I was drinking, because you'd have some drinks then you wouldn't be feeling 100% and you’d think, strangely, I can't afford to go and treat myself to a health spa or I can't afford to go and buy that jumper because for some reason, or say that you want to buy some new shoes. (I'm being very metrosexual, by the way. Talking about my buying shoes and health spas… Yeah, I really am the new age man.) But although I used to be like, I want to buy a new pair of trainers, but oh that's 100 pounds, I can't treat myself to that. But go a night out when you're getting the drinks in and the 100 pounds will just disappear. But now you say, well, I've got this new lease of life, my bank balance – we talked about in the previous episode – that's looking a bit healthier, you know, I'm back up to zero, which is always a bonus, and you can actually treat yourself and give yourself a reward. Because you have to remember every day you are doing something bold, you are doing something different. And you know what, in our society, you are being a rebel, because society is all about drinking. I'm not saying that's bad, because plenty of people can enjoy a drink. And you know what, good luck to them. Well done to them, have one for me. But for so many of us that are wanting to do something different, is about being a rebel is about moving away from the crowd is about being you know, a wolf and not a sheep. And then you should recognise that you are doing something really bloody brave, and that you should reward yourself. And if that means having a lie in or you know, a Netflix binge or something else, or just going to the park, with your kids, absolutely why not do it?

Sharon Hartley 11:42

When I hit my 365 days with no alcohol, I really wanted to treat myself. So, I booked a night in a swanky hotel in the Lake District, and I had a boat by myself and Windermere. It was joyous.

Freddie Bennett 11:55

And you're actually like, drive it yourself?

Sharon Hartley 11:59

I did! I didn’t sail it… It was a motorboat. And I was terrified. But it's what I wanted to do. And it was my little treat to myself. And I think it's so important to do that. You know, there's a lot of perception that when you remove alcohol from your life that you are, in some ways missing out. You know, life's not going to be as good… well, if you don't drink you couldn't possibly enjoy that. For me, it's been key just to treat myself along the way, a spa day here and there. I've been to the spa with my mum and my daughter. When I've been there in the past I've only ever gone with friends to get sloshed, you know, completely missing the point. But giving up alcohol, I've done the same things and actually probably enjoyed them even more. So I do think that treating yourself along the way, and filling those gaps with things that make you happy is really, really important for you. Well, for your mental wellbeing if anything.

Freddie Bennett 12:53

Yeah, absolutely. I think one. One thing I did, I guess a couple of things that changed for me. So I did see some physical benefits, as we said, yeah, that the thigh gap, amazingly appeared.

Sharon Hartley 13:05

I need to talk about this in far more depth, because I still don't have on Freddy.

Freddie Bennett 13:17

Really? Well… where do we go from there? Yeah, so I started doing a bit of exercise. And I thought, well, you know, I'm gonna run a marathon. And then I ran an ultramarathon. And then I did an Ironman, and this is, you know, we've all got those friends and they're very sporty. And you can just look at them and say, right, you, do CrossFit or you do Ironman races, and you usually realise because they talk about it nonstop every single time you see them. So, it’s not going to be about that. But I did do these physical challenges and I broke a world record… I became the world's fastest fisherman, I did run a marathon dressed as a fisherman in massive rubber Welly boots. And, you know, I hopefully I raised some money for a local children's charity, but it was about showing kids that that you can do anything you set your mind to. Obviously, these are a bunch of five year olds. So, I didn't go in there and talk about the all-nighters in Vegas, or the being at the clubs or that sort of thing, because that would have terrified them and inspired them in a different way. But growing up. I wasn't in a particularly fit, I wasn't fast, I was asthmatic. I was the slowest kid in my class, but once I started to get this alcohol-free confidence, I thought, well, you know, if, I can give up drinking for a long period of time, then why can't I go and break a world record? Why can't I do an Ironman? Never having done a triathlon before? So there are those physical benefits, but I don't want to start being one of those podcasts where we bang on about crazy exercise… I also wrote a book… I just sat down one day and I thought I'm gonna write a book about my experiences to try and help people. No, I would have never thought about that. And on a practical note, I could never have done it because I'd always be drinking or hungover and you have that lack of motivation. When wake up in the morning and you think I just can't be asked, I'm gonna sit on the sofa. But with that more focus and energy, you could do all these things. As I say with parkruns. I took my kids to, to a junior Park run on Sunday mornings, they moaned the whole bloody way around. When you they're saying, come on kids. I'm more present now. Look at me, I'm present. I'm engaged. Okay, look at my love for you… look at my clean, sober love. And they're like, Daddy, shut up. I want to go and watch Peppa Pig. Why the hell am I standing here in this like cold, wet, rainy Park. So, I dragged them round it. But I would have never have done that. If I was lying on the sofa with a hangover, I would have just said, Yeah, let's go next week, go and play on an iPad or something.

Sharon Hartley 15:43

I think to pick up on something you just mentioned there, it's about the alcohol-free confidence. And trying these new things you don't know where it's gonna go. When I stopped drinking, I started doing a little bit of running on a Saturday morning because I was, you know, feeling fresh at nine o'clock on a Saturday morning, I kept going, I didn't give in. And now I'm in training for the London Marathon, and that would not have happened at all, if I'd still been drinking. So you just don't know where it's gonna go. You know, every little step you take, it does sort of build up those alcohol-free superpowers. Yeah, it's, it's quite incredible. But I think you've just got to be brave. And in trying those different things, it can be very, very surprising.

Freddie Bennett 16:28

You know, Ben, you're straddling the gap, which again, presents a bit of an image, but they say you're, you're not going right ‘this is all or nothing’. It's about getting that that balance in your life?

Ben Anderson 16:42

I think for me, there was some things coming out this year, I didn't want to straddle honestly. I said to myself, ‘can I really do a full year without alcohol?’, and I thought, actually, if I went for that, straightaway, I'd probably fall to the first hurdle, because it feels like too big a thing to overcome. So by easing my way into it, I think that will give me a healthier relationship with alcohol in general.

Sharon Hartley 17:07

But I think, if you don't mind me jumping in Ben, talking to you earlier, you've done two occasions now out of your 20, is that right? Alcohol-free? You've already said that you're feeling the benefits and you're already seeing changes in the amount you drink because of that.

Ben Anderson 17:23

Well I thought, because it was a beer tasting in London for a mate's wedding, I thought I'd get absolutely smashed. I did. It was the second one where because I hadn't been drinking for about a month, I drank much more slowly. Yeah, drinking real beer. And I also then decided to – because remember, I went out, it was me and my girlfriend, we went out in the afternoon, we then got home and I had some bought some San Miguels on the way back, because it was my drinking day. And if I had one, I’d crack open an alcohol-free, because I just didn’t want to drink.

Sharon Hartley 17:59

That's amazing.

We're just taking a quick break from episode two of over the influence. We do hope you're enjoying it. And we know there are at least half a dozen people that have enjoyed the first episode, if not many, many, many more. And it's so important for us to say hello, and most importantly, thank you. You've been to the website and you very, very kindly bought us a brew or an alcohol free beer - clicked on that button and given us a donation. Thank you so much. Harvey thank you to you. Harvey said he loved it and he can't wait for the next ones. We can't wait to have you on board Harvey. Really kind of you. ‘The man in the aubergine mask’… who is this mysterious person… ‘have a coffee each on me’. Thank you so much mystery mask man. Sarah, thank you to you for buying us an alcohol-free beer and Andy Deldafield ‘awesome first podcast’, he said he's ‘as proud as punch’… We hope that's an alcohol-free punch, Andy. We know you're in lockdown in Spain at the moment so we send our love we send our best wishes. Stay at home and stay safe. Thank you also to Vegas Al. He bought us a coffee and another mysterious person… somebody… we don't know who this person is... Somebody bought us a coffee. Thank you so much! And finally last but by no means least Gemma. Thank you, Gemma. You took the trouble to listen first of all, thank you – and then went on to the website and clicked the big blue button. And I believe you were listening to our podcast as you cleaned the bathroom in your pants – a delightful image. Gemma, thank you. Thank you all so much. If you'd like to buy as an alcohol-free beer or a coffee virtually of course and just contribute in a small way towards this podcast. It will be hugely appreciated. As you know, listening to podcasts is free. There are some production costs behind them with regards to marketing, equipment, that sort of thing, anything you might be able to donate would be hugely appreciated by all of us here at over the influence. So, thank you so much. Absolutely brilliant.

Freddie Bennett 20:16

Right, let's get back to the episode.

Sharon Hartley 20:30

So, we've talked about some of the obvious ways you can fill the gap, when it's sort of in your control, maybe you know, you're at home, I'm going to do this tonight, I'm going to do that tonight. I'm not going to go to that social occasion. But that isn't real life is it? And quite often, when you are still trying to live life as best you can, and having as much fun as you would have in the past, sometimes it can really just creep up on you. And a gap can simply BITE YOU ON THE arse, and you need to be prepared. You need to be ready for those moments where you think I've got this, I'm in control, I'm not drinking. What about that time when somebody comes up to you and says, oh, there's there was no alcohol-free options at the bar. Or you think I might just cave… and then have a wine instead. What did you do in those situations?

Freddie Bennett 21:14

Yeah, I totally agree. They were the most risky times for me. As we talked in the previous episode about how you know, these big scary events like the weddings or birthdays, or the Christmas or anniversaries. For me the biggest dangers when I was most likely to drink was when the neighbour comes around with it with a pack of beers and saying, right, you know, let's just have one the footballs on! Or you bump into a friend in the street and they're like, oh, let's just go for a quick one in the pub. It’s the ambush… when your mind isn't thinking about not drinking. And just when it comes at you from The Blind Side, for me, it was difficult. It was really difficult. Your mind get scrambled. And so for me, I had to I had to try to get… almost like a reflex where you have to start saying, Oh, I'm not drinking or come up with different excuse. But I think it's about having your story straight. And it's a really corporate word, but you’ve got to have your elevator pitch. I had to have that ready to go. So, if someone says why aren’t you drinking? If you’re there going ‘umm… erm.. there’s this thing’. Then they go ‘oh go on just have one!’. To be honest one of my biggest dangers is being with friends. I don't mean that against my friends in a bad way. But there have been times I’ve failed and had my friend say to me, but you don't have a drink problem! You're absolutely fine! And then you’re like oh sure. Because you said I'm fine. I'm gonna use that as an excuse to have a drink. So having that elevator pitch of, ‘I'm not drinking right now because…’ you know, if you want to be all self-help guru about it, because I want to live my best life baby. Or you can just say, look, I'm trying to save some money, or I'm trying to get a bit healthier. Or you could say, I'm trying to write this book at the moment, or I've got this thing with my kids. But having that excuse can be powerful. Because if you say to people, oh, no, I'm not drinking at the moment, then you're leaving yourself open to ambush. If you say I'm not drinking, because, and apparently something happens in our brains, where you sort of accept it… research shows (I’m not a researcher as is probably very clear by now) that if you say because then you are actually giving a reason behind it and people accept it. It doesn't really matter what that reason is, if you say I'm not drinking, because I don't like to drink alcohol at the moment or anything else, then people start to say, oh, okay, and they back off a bit.

Sharon Hartley 23:47

Sorry to interrupt. I think you've got to be quite bolshy as well. Yeah. On these occasions, and you've got to look, instead of looking for your excuses, like why to cave or why to give in or you know, an excuse to drink. You've just got to remind yourself these points of your reasons why you're doing this, which is what you've just said, because, and the balls to say… you know what, no, I'm not drinking because I'm done with it. Because I'm bored with it. Because I'm sick of wasting my time. And not be scared of saying that and not be scared of people's reactions.

Freddie Bennett 24:19

I could feel another Freddy phrase coming on. I think background Ben might have to have some sort of like klaxon alert sound, but one of my biggest mantras that I told myself from the start is if you want to have the things you've never had before, you need to do the things you've never done before. And so, I wanted this life that I'd never had before. So, I knew I had to do something that I'd never ever done before. And for me that was giving up drinking. Once you have something like that in your mind, then you think well you know, it's difficult. It's you know, have a beer with Dave who you haven't seen for six months or live the life of your dreams… like it's a tough one, but I think I'm gonna try and live the life of my dreams. And I know that sounds a bit grand and new age and everything, but it is giving yourself that reason. And then the day if, you're really gonna lose friendships, and let's say I have lost friendships by not drinking, then you have to say to yourself, then they weren't real friendships. And that is so difficult for me who put so much value and emphasis on being social and having a big, loud, large group of friends. But if you're willing to make that change, and potentially say, look, without being too Greatest Showman, this is me, then it is about making a positive change in your life. And being prepared to make a trade, you have to be prepared to lose some things in order to get some things that are so much more beneficial that can make your life so much better.

Sharon Hartley 25:46

And I think it's really important to say as well that this doesn't last forever. No does it you know, when you feel like you're fending off drinks and every occasion, every time you choose to remain alcohol-free, or to maybe not drink as much that night, it just set you up for the next occasion, and you do become stronger. And you do care less what other people think, yeah, it does get easier.

Freddie Bennett 26:06

Yeah, the gap does get smaller. In those first few days, that gap feels like the bloody Grand Canyon stretching out. You're teetering on the edge, and you're like, there is no way I can cross these things. But it's like, every alcohol-free day, you're building a little bridge, step by step forwards and forwards. And that big, scary, crazy gap does get smaller. And I think that's why it's so important to reach out to people who are also not drinking… to use websites like dry drinker.com To get this whole big range of alcohol-free drinks, to get these little things in place to try and make that gap less big and less scary. And then to help you cross it and reach the other side.

Sharon Hartley 26:46

When I used to go out Freddy, in my drinking days, before now I've been known to take a gift bag, in which was was my own wine. If I was going somewhere really expensive, I would take my own drinks in… shameful, absolutely shameful. Now, I would have no qualms doing it with an alcohol-free option to make sure that I'm under no sort of risk of caving. And also, if you do cave, if you do have a couple of drinks, it's not the end of the world. Get back on the waggon. And start again tomorrow. You know, we're not saying you must not ever drink again, or you must not touch alcohol – do what works for you. And don't be scared.

Thank you so much for joining us. Again, this was episode two of Over the Influence, an alcohol-free podcast in association with drydrinker.com. Please do find us on social media and get in touch. And please do contact us direct. We would love to hear from you. We would love your ideas, your thoughts on the podcast, what you'd like to hear us talking about, send us an email over the influence at sound rebel.co.uk. And please please please give us a rating and review on your podcast app!

Freddie Bennett 28:09

Next week's episode is called the shift. We're going to be talking about society and how mindsets all around the world are changing and why this is the best time in the history of humanity to ditch the booze and get over the influence of alcohol.