Patrick Manning: [00:00:01] I think the key really is caring about your community that you're in, caring about the guests that are coming, caring about your lending partners, caring about everybody because that's how you get united and be able to overcome obstacles.
Adam Stoker: [00:00:18] Hey guys, I've got to tell you about a company in the industry that I'm really excited about. I was able to meet A.J. Brown who's the founder of Wander a couple of years ago and Wander is a really unique mapping technology for destinations that is kind of taking the industry by storm right now. A few of the things that you can do with Wander that I think are pretty unique is first of all you can update this map in real-time so that your visitors can get reliable information that's timely and that hasn't been outdated.
You can also kind of see interesting data, Google Maps doesn't necessarily share with you all the data of how people are navigating your destination. But with a Wander map, you can actually have this custom map that allows you to see visitor location, what are the places that are most visited, what are the most viewed categories on the map, and then you can use Q. R. Codes at each location to help visitors use the wander map for the rest of their trip. You can also really seamlessly integrate it into your destination website and it just takes a few weeks to get up and running.
So, if you have not yet engaged with Wander, make sure you get a free demo at wandermaps.com/dmp. That DMP is for Destination Marketing Podcast, wandermaps.com/dmp. Check it out.
Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the destination marketing podcast. I'm your host, Adam Stoker. I'm really excited about the show we've got for you today. Before we dive in though I want to make sure that everybody that's listening remembers if you're not yet following us @destination_pod on your social media channels or if you haven't subscribed wherever it is you're listening to podcasts like Apple Podcasts or wherever else, please make sure to subscribe. Also, I would say if you haven't yet joined our LinkedIn group, destination marketers. Now is the time to do it. I'm getting new applications every day of people clicking through to join and we're getting people approved and getting more discussion going in that LinkedIn group. So don't miss it.
Other than that, we're going to dive into today's episode. I had the opportunity last weekend to visit what's going to be one of the most unique resorts in the United States and they're currently working on it but recently they opened the golf course portion of the resort. It's called Black Desert Resort. It's in Southern Utah and it is really one of a kind. So I've got the visionary behind that here on the show today. We'll talk a little bit about my experience and then of course tell a little bit of his story. His name is Patrick Manning and he is the project director and board member for Reef Private Equity. He's the originator of the Black Desert Development Project. Patrick, thanks for joining me today.
Patrick Manning: [00:03:17] My pleasure.
Adam Stoker: [00:03:18] So I'm really excited to chat with you and dive into this resort. It really is one of a kind. But before we do give me the answer to a couple of questions here and we have a tradition here on the show where we ask, what is your dream destination Patrick, if you could go anywhere in the world, where would it be?
Patrick Manning: [00:03:34] Well, it's going to be pretty vanilla. But I've lived three separate times in the Florida Keys and Isla Morada and Sugar Loaf and I've been in a lot of places, but I think I am happy just going back to the Florida Keys anytime I get a chance.
Adam Stoker: [00:03:53] So it's, it's interesting you say that I came very close last year to booking a trip to the Florida keys and we ended up, my, my wife talked me into going back to savannah instead and, but it was, it was very close and I've heard a lot of good things. What is it about the Florida keys that makes it such a special place for you?
Patrick Manning: [00:04:11] It's just a feeling you have when you're there. It's very laid back, very chill. It's like, there's no signs that say no, no shoes, no shirt, no service because nobody wears shoes anywhere. And I just love the life of fishing and not knowing what you're going to catch the next cast. It's just a really, really chill place that makes you feel like everything is right in the world.
Adam Stoker: [00:04:37] So it's, it's the lifestyle.
Patrick Manning: [00:04:38] Yeah, for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:04:39] Awesome. Okay, well let's maybe, do you have a specific travel memory that stands out to you, a place that you've been that really other and it can be in the Florida keys, but maybe a specific memory that stands out?
Patrick Manning: [00:04:52] Well yeah, last time we were there, we usually go for when we vacation, we usually go for a couple three months and we would been catching off of our private dock. We've been catching a lot of sharks and lots of other things. But my kids were down at the dock and I got about a 7-foot shark on the line and it got wrapped around the pylon of the deck and the dock and my daughter's crying that it's going to die. And my kids actually talked me into because it was a metal long metal leader. They actually talked me into diving down and cutting the shark loose. Luckily obviously it didn't eat me.
Adam Stoker: [00:05:32] You're here today. So that went okay.
Patrick Manning: [00:05:35] So that was pretty good. It was down about eight feet. So I had to go down with a seven-foot shark about eight feet deep, about a foot from its mouth and cut the metal leader so I could swim away.
Adam Stoker: [00:05:46] So what kind of shark was that?
Patrick Manning: [00:05:47] I think it was a reef shark.
Adam Stoker: [00:05:49] Man, so okay, what was that like going down there right next to the shark and trying to cut that leader? At least he was out of energy.
Patrick Manning: [00:05:55] Yeah, he was pretty tired. It was scary. I mean honestly, I mean you don't really have a contingency plan if the shark decides to attack you. I mean it's not like you're going to like punch it or whatever. So it was pretty scary. It was good coming up out of the water and my daughter yelling, my dad's my hero kind of thing. So it's fun.
Adam Stoker: [00:06:14] Yeah, I got to say at that point, once your dad has swum down right next to the face of a shark, you're a superhero for the rest of their lives. So that part's worth it. Right?
Patrick Manning: [00:06:24] Yeah. Absolutely.
Adam Stoker: [00:06:25] Oh man. Well, interesting. Patrick, I'd love to hear your story and what led you to this vision for this resort in Southern Utah.
Patrick Manning: [00:06:36] Well I came out to Southern Utah in 2005. I was living in the Florida keys and somebody told me I needed to check out this property, but they said Entrada and I said, okay, great, where's Entrada? And they said, Saint George. And I said, okay, where's Saint George? And they said Utah. And I said, okay, where's Utah? Obviously, kidding. But, I came out and I looked at Entrada and so this land is essentially part of Entrada if we wanted to be.
So I became part of the development company that ended up developing the Entrada at Snow Canyon Country Club. It's one of if not the highest in country club in the state of Utah. It's actually, there was the location of the Disney chose over 300 country clubs visited they chose and trotted to shoot the highest grossing made for TV movie of all time, High School Musical. And so, I could have made Black Desert, in fact, at one point it was called Black Desert Resort ad Entrada. I've now dropped the ad Entrada because it's taken on a life of its own.
Entrada is a gated private country club and very exclusive. I wanted to do something quite opposite with Black desert and make it a resort and inclusive and have basically anybody and everybody come in and enjoy it. So just a different vibe, so we dropped the ad Entrada.
Adam Stoker: [00:08:01] Okay, great. And, so you talk about how you wanted this to be inclusive, not exclusive and that you wanted to build a resort that's different than what was already there. What led you to feel like that's what needed to happen? How did you evaluate this is the product that Southern Utah needs? And then of course, how does that evolve into a vision for all the unique amenities and plans that you have for this resort?
Patrick Manning: [00:08:28] Yeah. So I looked at six million visitors per year coming to Southern Utah and realized that we were the only destination that I know of in the United States that didn't have what I call a there, there. Like, where is that spot in Southern Utah that people go and stroll and dine and just a gathering spot of community and Saint George doesn't have that? And so I wanted to build the there, there so that six million people had a shot at going somewhere that they felt like had a little bit of nightlife or a stroll during the day and had a sense of place. So that was the main reason.
And then also I really wanted to embrace the locals, the residents, the community, and have it feel very, very inclusive and together.
Adam Stoker: [00:09:18] Great. So I've got a client down there called Tuacahn Amphitheater and they have an amazing product, but I think you're making a really interesting point because there's a lot of places in Saint George that are go-and-do, but there's not go and gather and I think that's a real difference. I also lived down there for four years in Saint George. And so got a really good idea of that market as well. When people would say, well what is there to do? The answer would either be like Texas Roadhouse or because there's not a great place to gather.
So while there's amazing amenities, there's not a place that pulls it all together in a gathering place. And so I think that's a really interesting insight about Southern Utah and as I went and experienced the golf course, I already caught a little bit of the vision of what you're talking about with a gathering place. And so I went and before the round of golf, you get to this practice green. Now a lot of people when they think, golfers will understand this, but a lot of people when they think of a practice green, you're thinking maybe I don't know, a few 100 square feet of grass where you're putting into a few holes while you're waiting for your round to start. You have a full 18-hole practice course on this putting green.
And the pro there, Zack was telling me a little bit about the vision to have it lighted so that people can do it at night and there was music playing there, which I thought was really interesting, we'll talk about the customer experience side of it a little bit later in the discussion. But you're building an atmosphere which is actually not only foreign to Saint George but foreign to golf of gather and play and we're not uptight, but we're creating a place where we can, all people beyond just golfers can come and have a great time.
Patrick Manning: [00:11:16] Yeah, for sure. I mean, the Yard is what we call the putting green area. It's actually, it can accommodate a 36-hole course, the nearly two-acre putting green. It's one of the largest in the nation, but yes, like you said, it's going to be lit at night music playing. We're getting ready to start building the open-air food and beverage for that area and we'll have fire pits and hot tubs. So, you'll be out there barefoot after getting out of a hot tub putting around. The Yard really epitomizes what the ethos of Black Desert is, which is luxury without pretense.
Adam Stoker: [00:11:51] Great. So let's talk about the big picture vision then, because I'm making it sound like it's just a golf resort and it is far far beyond just a golf resort. So let's talk about what is the resort as a whole. If you were to define and let's mention the amenities that are coming along with it, but what's that experience going to be like?
Patrick Manning: [00:12:11] Well, I think I should start with, sharing that. It'll be about 5 to 6 times larger than the current largest hospitality offering in the state, which is Grand America. So about five or six times that size and it's somewhat centered around the 19-hole Tom Weiskopf golf course. I'll share some new things about that in a little bit, but the project right now is coming out of the ground substantially with what we call resort center, that's about 450 hotel keys or hotel rooms and condos, 150 hotel rooms, 300 condos. It has three restaurants.
Because it's a 19-hole golf course, now the sports bar is called the 20th Hole. Then we have an open-air restaurant that's right on the lake in the 19th green and then we have on the third floor a steakhouse called Basalt. Then we have a 24,000-square-foot convention center a 15,000 square foot spa and that's essentially an 11,000-square-foot pro shop. That's essentially the resort center.
Outside of resort center, we have the family village which is situated about 250 condos situated around a water park that is probably bigger than anything in Vegas. It has a lazy river, then it has a not so lazy river rapids, it has a massive wave pool and then it has two surfing stations, so, actual surfboards, not boogie boards. So two surf stations and climbing walls and it's about 5 acres of just full, awesome water park.
Then we have the golf village, which is going to be centered over by the Yard, the putting course and in the short game area. Then in the center of all of that is kind of the heartbeat it is that there, there it's called the Boardwalk. So when you enter into Black Desert from Snow Canyon Parkway, Black Desert drive begins to dip down the slope down so that when it gets midway between the entrance and the hotel we’re 14 feet below grade, which means that the boardwalk, the bridges that span over the top of the roadways allow for over 1000 feet of shopping and dining, walking, strolling over cobblestone experience with no steps and no cars.
So we have a total of 15 restaurants just in the Ivan's portion, which is half a Black Desert. The other half is in Santa Clara. And so there you're talking about in Ivan's 15 restaurants, convention, and about 1200 rooms. Then in Santa Clara, we're going to do some really, really, really exciting things. But you mentioned golf destination. My goal is to have it be a culinary destination. I want people to come to Black Desert, get on an airplane and come here because of the diversity and the chef-driven menus of these food and beverage establishments. But also we want to make it a music destination. The Boardwalk's going to have music, we going to have tie-ins in Tuacahn. Then in Santa Clara, we're planning on building a roughly 3000-seat concert venue with a hotel that surrounds it.
Adam Stoker: [00:15:28] Wow, okay, so many of us have gone on a trip and said, you know, what would make this city a little bit better is if it had this or that. You went in and found all of the missing things and are putting it into one resort, one amenity. What is the process to go from showing up in 2004 and evaluating this property in 2023 building the largest resort in the state of Utah?
Patrick Manning: [00:15:58] A lot of dreaming. A lot of hard work. I think the thing that I'm probably most proud of is how much we have shown up for the residents of the area. I've sat in 100-plus living rooms filled with residents that just want to know what's going on. We've been very, very transparent, we've gotten really good ideas. We've made concessions. In the end the residents I would say 99% of them really support Black Desert, which is a huge thing because when you're building something this size in smaller towns, it can be fairly scary for the residents. But over the years we've shown up for them and they feel like they're part of the resort. Made the entitlements go pretty easily. We got all those entitlements with very, very, very, very little pushback from the residents of the municipalities.
Adam Stoker: [00:16:55] Great so I know that one of the things that happens when you're looking at a project I say of this size and scope as if I've ever tried to bring something of this size and scope to anything and I haven't. But I do know that anytime you're working on a major project that actually transcends multiple municipalities and governments and the different licensing and all that stuff that you need to work on, there's so much collaboration that needs to happen. What do you do in your role to foster a great relationship with each of these stakeholders that have to buy off in some way shape or form and get everybody on board? I know you talked about the residents but what are you doing with these other stakeholders to get them involved?
Patrick Manning: [00:17:40] Well, Black Desert spans all of Santa Clara, Ivan's and Saint George. we have not worked with Saint George on this project because other than with water and lakes and irrigation and things like that, we haven't worked with them because the land that is inside Black Desert that is in Saint George is really important it's a hill but it's a really important view shed to protect. So we put that in the conservation easement and so we're not building in Saint George but just in Santa Clara and Ivan's and to directly answer your question, I've become, I don't want to say friends but very friendly with planning commission member, city council. I mean they're to me not much different than the residents. I mean I kind of lump them in with the residents. They are a voting member but they're no different than the rest of the residents.
And they see that we have shown up and that we care and we've made like I said, lots of concessions that were good for the city, not just financially, but with for example we are investing about $110 million 1800 underground parking spaces so that we can try to keep people on the resort and give them everything that they need so that we don't create the congestion on the streets as if we had done surface parking that people are more likely to get in their cars and go.
Adam Stoker: [00:19:06] Got it. Okay. So the types of concessions that you're talking about is, hey, people are worried about congestion. So how are we going to solve that problem? And looking at what the objections are and then demonstrating a solution in your planning.
Patrick Manning: [00:19:18] That's correct. And that goes with energy conservation, water conservation, all of those things have been taken into account. I mean we spent over $200 million just on water conservation measures and the most aggressive energy-efficient measures as well.
Adam Stoker: [00:19:34] Wow. Okay. So let's talk a little bit about customer experience and you talked about it early on. You said Saint George needed a gathering place, right? Or Southern Utah, I should say needed a gathering place. You've obviously, as you've described the amenities including the water park in the Yard and the dining and the Boardwalk and all the different components of the resort, you've definitely created a gathering place. But for the audience that you're attracting here, you said you wanted to be inclusive, not exclusive, but at the same time, if you want to build a destination you have to have components of that customer experience that you can't get anywhere else. And some components probably need some exclusivity to it, meaning you can't get this anywhere else, right? As opposed to you can't come.
So, there's a difference in the definition of exclusivity there. But what I would say is there obviously has been a lot of thought put into what do we want it to feel like when people come to Black Desert Resort. And so as you're crafting that customer experience, what do you want people to feel?
Patrick Manning: [00:20:41] Well, it's not easy, but we want everyone to feel like they're the only ones at the resort and that's hard. It's a lot easier said than done, but we are investing heavily in technology to help us with that. We have selected our operator of the resort that is willing to operate it the way we want it done, which we had spoken with lots of brands or flags that just were not willing to commit to that level of service. So we brought in benchmark hospitality, they won the stellar award for the top lifestyle hospitality brand. Disney came in second, so we're selecting our partners carefully.
Then we're supplementing those services with our own key staff members. Most of your listeners are probably too young to remember the show Fantasy Island, but I like to say we want to have 100 Mr. Rorcs walking around, making sure everybody feels welcome and we can get them anything they need.
Adam Stoker: [00:21:42] I wish I got that reference, I really do Patrick. So I'm going to give our audience just a taste of the customer experience that you're building because I think detail has so much to do with a great customer experience. One of the things that I noticed is every tee box and every green and especially on the way to every green, I noticed that every green 360 degrees has an amazing vista behind it and most golf courses when you go, the ocean golf courses maybe two of the holes will have this beautiful ocean view and then everything else is kind of like you'd find another golf courses.
This one, every single hole felt like it had this amazing vista, but it was all Instagram-worthy. It was all like, it was incredible and those little things and the attention to detail that you guys are using in every portion of the amenity I think it's the attention to detail on those little things that play so much into the visitor experience because that for me was what made this golf course different than anywhere I've ever played is that every single hole was a signature hole.
Patrick Manning: [00:22:51] Yeah, I mean on the downside, we blew our budget by literally two times. But on the bright side, we probably have a 200% better golf course than what we originally set out to build and I appreciate your statement. So there's been a lot of work that's gone into just positioning things just right to catch all of the views that are like you said 360.
Adam Stoker: [00:23:16] And you had to go find an amazing designer to make sure that you could get that result. I know Tom Weiskopf is a big name in golf. What was that process like choosing a designer and deciding where to go with that design?
Patrick Manning: [00:23:30] Yeah, Tom was such a special guy and we interviewed probably 20 designers. I'm not going to name names, but your listeners would know most of them. In the end, Tom was just a real dude. He gave us his cell phone. There was no entourage and he just hung out and he's such a cool, cool guy. I wish I could share some of the stories, but I probably shouldn't. They're not inappropriate, but they're his stories not mine. But it was fantastic. Tom, I loved it when tom came into town just to welcome the Utah tech golf teams to their new home after we dedicated space for them to create their facility. He came and the boys said, if you could go back in time Tom, what advice would you give us? And I thought everybody thought he was going to say, do more stretching or do whatever, nutrition and he said, take some time right now and look into the future and ask yourself what type of a person do you want to be. Like, what do you want you to be and then never let a day go by that you compromise on the person you want to be. And it was so awesome. That’s just the kind of guy he was.
Adam Stoker: [00:24:49] Yeah, it gives you a little window into who he was. Because of him coming and designing it, first of all, it was an amazing product. I think I've kind of beat a dead horse on that one, but on the other side you have a unique opportunity coming up that Brian shared with me and Brian is the marketing director for Black Desert Resort. He said that with the masters coming up, you guys are being featured on a special the day before the Masters, which is like some of the best exposure that you could ask for. Can you share a little bit about how that came about and what the plan is there?
Patrick Manning: [00:25:27] Yeah. So CBS reached out to Phil Smith and they asked him if they could do an interview with him about Tom Weiskopf. Of course, he said, yes. And so he was interviewed by Jim Nance and the special is going to be called The Masterful Tom Weiskopf and it's actually an hour, just one hour before the final round of the masters. And so Phil Smith wore Black Desert gear and he talked about how Black Desert was Tom swan song and he knocked it out of the park and how it helped Tom get through some of his final months battling cancer as a light in his world. And so yeah, you're right. I mean, you can't write a check for that kind of publicity.
Adam Stoker: [00:26:13] Yeah, yeah. Pretty amazing. That's going to be quite the opportunity. I'm excited to watch it. I'll definitely tune in. I want to go back a little bit. Our listeners are mostly tourism destinations around the world and so think like Greater Zion in southern Utah. What's it been like to build a relationship with Greater Zion because you're now going to be their largest asset in Southern Utah to promote other than Zion National Park? What's it been like building a relationship with them? How have you guys worked together? And then, especially if there's any advice you could give destinations that are trying to maybe attract a resort like you to their destination, what they should be doing.
Patrick Manning: [00:26:59] So I've really enjoyed the relationship with Greater Zion. We recently lost Kevin Lewis as its director. But I've also enjoyed working with Brittany and Joyce and Sarah and, and lots of them over there. They're very, very supportive, very helpful. They have been instrumental in helping us lure an LPGA event. And then there's some other things we have coming that I can't share yet. A short hint would be bigger than the LPGA.
Adam Stoker: [00:27:32] You know what, I might be able to put that together.
Patrick Manning: [00:27:36] So, but they've been very helpful both financially and to show how much they will support having those large events in the area and the ability to help pull it off. So that's been great. As far as advice to other visitor bureaus attracting other resorts, I have no advice for competition.
Adam Stoker: [00:27:59] You know what, I think that's fair. That's a fair response, Patrick. I like the competitiveness there. Well, you know, I want to go back a little bit too to the Yard because I want to make sure visitors understand just how significant of an asset just that small component of the resort is. I've golfed all over the country at some really cool unique places. I had the opportunity to play Payne's Valley at Big Cedar Lodge in Missouri just outside of Branson. Payne's Valley has a putting green that's probably the closest thing I've seen to what you've built at the Yard. Have you had a chance to play at Payne's Valley?
Patrick Manning: [00:28:42] I haven’t.
Adam Stoker: [00:28:43] Oh man. Okay. Well, we might have to figure something out there for us to go play Payne's Valley because it's amazing. But they do have a putting green with a full 18-hole kind of practice course, you guys are 36, so you're way bigger and better, but it's the closest thing I've seen and other than that I haven't seen anything like it anywhere. You're going to allow families to also recreate on that area and not make it exclusive to golfers, correct?
Patrick Manning: [00:29:11] That’s correct.
Adam Stoker: [00:29:12] Yeah. Love that. I guess let's back it up to the resort level, Patrick. Not many people are going to be building a resort like this so I don't think we can give, oh, if you're going to build hundreds of millions of dollars resort here's what I tell you to do. But just more along the lines of how do you take a vision or an idea and get through all the roadblocks, all the challenges, all like you said, you doubled the amount of money you needed or you originally budgeted for the golf course. So that obviously was an obstacle you had to overcome. How do you bring a vision like that to life and knock down all the obstacles in your way?
Patrick Manning: [00:29:50] I wish I would have kept a ledger of all of the miracles that happened along the way, things that just made no sense that just happened. I think that I think the key really is caring about your community that you're in, caring about the guests that are coming, caring about your lending partners, caring about everybody because that's how you get united and be able to overcome obstacles. When you start to fight with any of those, it becomes really, really, really almost impossible to get things done. You have to be friends and care about everyone around you and that's involved and you can't compromise on that. You have to care about the environment, you have to care about the land, you have to care about the air, you have to care about all of it. And then it seems to just things seem to fall in place when everybody knows that you really sincerely do care about all of it.
Adam Stoker: [00:30:47] Interesting. Because really, when if somebody on the outside looking in would try to categorize what you're going to be caring about the most they're probably how in the world do I get a return on this major investment? Right? And that's where a lot of people would expect your answer to be is, well, we're making decisions on how we're going to get the best return on investment. Your answer is we have to care about all the other things around us. I think a great example of that is that you sat in over 100 homes and listened. I think a great demonstration of care is to listen to what other people need. And I would imagine that listening led you to be able to knock down the barriers and challenges that came along the way.
Patrick Manning: [00:31:27] That’s absolutely correct.
Adam Stoker: [00:31:28] Very cool. Well, Patrick, is there anything about Black Desert that I haven't asked you and then I want to kind of move on to Reef Capital Partners because there's a couple of interesting things there that I don't know maybe have been in the news here or there recently.
Patrick Manning: [00:31:44] Sure. The only other thing I think I'd like to share about Black Desert is I mean we've talked a lot about the stuff and a little bit less about the experience, which is okay because I think people could envision what that experience is going to be like. But one of the things that I am also very proud of is I had a goal of breaking the world record to have the biggest C-PACE financing funding ever done. The record was around $104 million. What that funding covers are things that you do that are over and above code for energy efficiency, for water conservation, for seismic conditions, things like that. And it always requires a third-party engineer audit, energy audit.
It was determined that we are spending about $200 million in excess that ended up making us eligible and we received $153.8 million in funding from C-PACE and very proud of that and the fact that that also is leading to us being the largest resort in the world powered over low voltage. So instead of running 110 and essentially wasting 100 volts of electricity for every light, lock, security camera, you name it, we're only running 10 volts. It's a massive energy savings on the resort and not wasting electricity essentially.
Adam Stoker: [00:33:06] Now you said that you wanted to break that record. I'm sure it wasn't just to break the record. What was it about that? What would that record have indicated? I'm assuming that it's that you've gone farther than any other resort on being as sustainable and responsible as possible. But tell me a little bit about why that record was important to you.
Patrick Manning: [00:33:30] Well that's just it. I mean, it's proof it's third-party proof that we've done more than anyone else in history on those measures regenerative media, in our pools. low flow valves everywhere on across the project. I mean just every technology we couldn't think of to use we did. Now the headlines are we broke the record and that means we've done the most and so that was important to me. Again, not for the headline but for everybody to know that yes, we're building something big or building something that people local could see as scary but it makes them feel good and makes them feel part of it when they see it being done with good stewardship of the land and our resources.
Adam Stoker: [00:34:15] And again if you were just focused on ROI, that's it. Some of those decisions might not have been as fiscally responsible but fiscal responsibility is not your only focus from the sounds of it.
Patrick Manning: [00:34:25] It's not, frankly I don't want to sound cavalier and hopefully my investors aren't listening in maybe. But I'm not that good at worrying about the ROI. And I mean that sincerely. I drive my chief financial officer absolutely crazy. But no, it's way more important to do it right and way more important to be proud of it and way more important to have the best guest experience than it is to make a little bit more money.
Adam Stoker: [00:34:50] Awesome. Well, I think that's pretty commendable and I think that's probably part of why you've been able to get this done is that you've had a more selfless view than I think a lot of people in your situation would have. So congratulations on what you've done with Black Desert Resort. And I can't wait to see it all come to fruition.
Patrick Manning: [00:35:09] Thank you.
Adam Stoker: [00:35:10] Let's talk about Reef Capital Partners briefly. For those that might be listening, they've been in the news a lot lately but it was right next to a name that was a little bit more recognizable and I don't want to offend Reef Capital Partners here, but a little more recognizable than Reef Capital Partners. That's your name has been next to Tiger Woods' name in the media a lot lately. Can you tell us a little bit about why that's the case?
Patrick Manning: [00:35:33] Yeah. So we are also in Northern Utah in the Park city area. We are building it's called Marcella Mountain and Marcella Club and Marcella Jordan L. Ridge and Marcella on Main. So we've bought an asset at the bottom of Main Street in Park City to be our downtown location. We've got 150 estate lots that are all ski in, ski out going in. And then we also have 330 ski-in, ski-out condos going up. So we have a downtown location, a ski location and so then right around the corner from the ski on the Jordan L., we are putting in another 500 or so estate lots and a 36-hole golf course.
The first 18 of which just hit the news with Tiger Woods designing his first mountain course in the first course in the western part of the United States. And it'll be the longest and the highest elevation course in the state of Utah.
Adam Stoker: [00:36:31] Amazing, amazing. And I mentioned Payne's Valley, Tiger Woods also designed that one and it was incredible. I can't wait to see what it does on a mountain course design here in Utah.
Patrick Manning: [00:36:42] Me too.
Adam Stoker: [00:36:42] Well, Patrick, I'm not going to make this entire episode about Marbella because I want to do a follow-up episode once you get a little further along. But brief question, how does one enter into a partnership with Tiger Woods? I'm assuming you don't just get a cell phone number and call him. What's that process like?
Patrick Manning: [00:37:02] We actually help use Phil Smith and his network to get into Tiger. Then we had some phone conversations with his people and eventually, that led to him coming out and walking the Marcella site and committing to design. Not to be flippant, but the follow-up to that is you have to write a big check.
Adam Stoker: [00:37:29] Sure, I'm sure that helps. Well, Patrick, I think I'm going to wrap up with this, you've obviously been able to bring a lot of your dreams into reality and you've got more coming. I'm going to ask you the same question that Tom was asked at Dixie… Excuse me. Oh my goodness. At Utah Tech. It used to be called Dixie State University. Now it's Utah Tech. What advice would you give people that have dreams and might feel like they're unachievable? You've got a little bit of a formula I think a lot of us would benefit from hearing how you think you've done it.
Patrick Manning: [00:38:05] I would say show up that means in your community, show up to all the things like I'm on the stakeholder board of the Housing Action Coalition to find ways to solve the affordable housing crisis. You have to show up to the things that may not feel like it's relevant to you but things that matter, things that are important to other people. Show up and improve your network, be friends with people and people will help you realize your dreams.
But again, it's that caring and showing up in the community that goes a long way. Everybody that I know that has reached an accomplishable dream didn't do it alone and they didn't do it with a whole bunch of adversaries. They normally did it with a group of good people.
Adam Stoker: [00:38:55] Great advice. Patrick, thanks so much for taking the time. This has been an amazing episode. If people want to learn about you or the resort or even Reef Capital Partners, what's the best way for them to do so?
Patrick Manning: [00:39:06] Blackdesertresort.com, reefcp.com.
Adam Stoker: [00:39:10] Perfect. Thanks, Patrick.
Patrick Manning: [00:39:12] Thanks.
Adam Stoker: [00:39:12] And thanks everybody for listening. I hope you enjoyed today's episode. If you've not yet followed us on our social media channels, make sure you check out @destinationpod and also make sure that if you are listening consistently that you hit that follow button or subscribe and make sure to leave us a rating or a review. By doing so you help us continue to bring you amazing guests like Patrick. Thanks, everybody. Have a great day.
[End of Transcript]
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