Transcript:
Adam Stoker: [00:00:01] Hello, everyone and welcome to another episode of the Destination Marketing Podcast. I'm your host, Adam Stoker, and I'm here at the Utah Tourism Conference. And boy, do I have a special guest? I am joined today by a good friend of mine. We've known each other for years. And his name is Ryan Starks and he is the executive director of the Governor's Office of Economic Opportunity. And it is so good to have you here on the show. I appreciate you taking the time. Ryan Starks: [00:00:26] Well, thank you, Adam. I was on your show three or four years ago. Really enjoyed it. So it's been a minute since we caught up. Adam Stoker: [00:00:32] Yeah, in a much different capacity at that time, I believe we were in a kind of a client-agency relationship. Joint BYU fans, big, big BYU fans. Ryan Starks: [00:00:41] We were, I was working for Heber Valley and I was leading the Tourism in the Chamber of Commerce there. We had a great partnership with Relic and one of the highlights is when speaking of BYU and we went to that Tennessee BYU football game. Knoxville is a wonderful place, very hospitable people. The game went into overtime and our cougs pulled it out. Adam Stoker: [00:01:05] It was one of the coolest football memories I've got and we got to share it together. It was great. Ryan Starks: [00:01:09] It was great. Adam Stoker: [00:01:09] And so basically I've stayed on the exact same career trajectory of where I was. And you've kind of skyrocketed through the roof here, Ryan. So tell us a little bit about your journey from when you were at the Heber Valley Office of Tourism and what led you here to your current role. Ryan Starks: [00:01:27] That's a great question, Adam and so loved my job in Heber Valley. It's one of those places and jobs where you wake up every day and you never sigh or think, oh, I don't want to go to work today. I just love the people. I love the cause. It was putting a great place like Heber Valley on the map. Heber Valley was home to two of the 2002 Olympic games, the biathlon, and the cross country. And in my capacity in Heber Valley, I also let out on rural economic development. Now, if you rewind way back to 2002, a guy named Val Hale used to be the athletic director at BYU. He had a son who served a church mission in Ecuador. I served a church mission in Ecuador. Val came to pick up his son, Chris and I met him then and in Ecuador, we had a great conversation in a little indigenous village in the mountains of Ecuador. We chatted and when I returned home from my mission connected with Val and kind of we just picked up where we left off and he instantly became a great mentor and a friend. So he kind of followed my career and I followed his career. He ultimately became the executive director of the office now that I work in. After working eight years in Heber Valley, he called me one day and he said, hey, Ryan, I'm wondering if I can steal you away from Heber Valley and hire you at the governor's office of Economic Development at the time. So I thought about that and it was a good fit and kind of ready for that next step and so accepted the position and I was the managing director there. I was kind of like a vice president equivalent and learned a lot from Val and then he eventually retired and a new executive director, Dan Himmer was brought on and learned a lot from Dan. He was there for two years. Then this past January, the governor asked me to lead the agency and to serve on his cabinet and so been leading the agency for just about a year now. We have a great team of about 100 staff and loving every day. Adam Stoker: [00:03:34] Awesome. Now you brought up Val Hale. And so before we continue the interview, I've got to tell you my Val Hale story. Are you ready for this? Ryan Starks: [00:03:40] Let’s hear it. Adam Stoker: [00:03:40] So, my dad credits Val Hale with his marriage to my mom. Ryan Starks: [00:03:46] Wow. Adam Stoker: [00:03:47] So my dad was dating my mom at Brigham Young University and Val and my dad knew each other and we're pretty well connected. My dad was talking to Val and saying that he just wasn't sure about whether or not he should marry my mom. And Val said, are you crazy? You marry that girl. So I guess the rest is history, right? So, would I be here without Val Hale? I think that's the question. Ryan Starks: [00:04:14] And would I be here without Val Hale? Adam Stoker: [00:04:15] Is this a tribute podcast now all of a sudden? Ryan Starks: [00:04:18] This is a tribute to Val, our mentor, and our friend. Adam Stoker: [00:04:21] Oh, I love it. So, you talked about making that move to the Governor's Office of Economic Development, which became the Governor's Office of Economic Opportunity. You may have made that switch during one of the most tumultuous economic times that has ever hit our country. What was it? And especially our state, what was it like to be in the Governor's Office of Economic Development and then opportunity throughout the impact of COVID and then the recovery from COVID and all of that? Ryan Starks: [00:04:51] The thing that really struck me was how much our agency cares about small businesses. I started in November of 2019. And as you know, COVID really settled in, in March of 2020. So first of all, I questioned what the heck have I done with my career decisions. But then when it became apparent that this was a long-term battle that we had to face, we didn't turn away from the battle. We rolled up our sleeves and we got to work. A lot of times government agencies are slow, they're intentionally slow. But we learned that we had to work at the speed of business. So we would receive grant applications, we would have to screen them and make funding decisions the same week and cut a check out because it was a matter of life or death for a lot of these small businesses. So just learning the resilience of our business community, seeing the impact that our team had and just not putting ourselves ahead of other people, but just focusing on the end goal and that's to maintain our economy. Adam Stoker: [00:05:54] Yeah. And so I believe that the Governor's Office of Economic Opportunity did a great job of that between the programs that you launch to support small businesses and a lot of the work that you guys have put together. I think it's been very beneficial. I'm definitely happy to be a business in Utah compared to a business in other states that may not have been so quick and especially may not have recognized the value that small businesses add to the economy. Why is it that small business is such a focus for your organization? Ryan Starks: [00:06:22] Well, we have 330,000 small businesses in the state of Utah. It's really the lifeblood of our economy and these are companies with 50 employees or less. So, it's a lot of your mom-and-pop shops or a lot of your small startups. We value their contributions because they create jobs. Our goal is to support industry and kind of get out of their way. One of the cool things that we're focused on is starting a new campaign and you're going to hear more about it in the coming months. It's to put Utah on the map as the startup capital of the world. Adam Stoker: [00:06:56] Really? Ryan Starks: [00:06:56] And we're putting some financial resources behind that, some mentorships, a really cool website that will be a one-stop shop for small businesses to learn what resources are available for them at the state level. So more to come. But we just really are convinced that as our small businesses succeed, the state succeeds. Adam Stoker: [00:07:15] That's an interesting plan, especially with what's happened in the state of Utah over the last 10 years that this Silicon Slopes area where you've got all these startups that started early in Utah and then scaled and several of them became unicorns and now you've got this tech scene and tech industry in Utah that wasn't there before. I really like that you guys are recognizing that those were the startups of yesterday. Right? And if you do a good job of attracting the startups of today, there's more unicorns tomorrow. Ryan Starks: [00:07:46] That's nicely said. And we have the ingenuity, we have the innovation and the hard work mentality. And so it's just a question of moving forward and getting it done. Adam Stoker: [00:07:56] Great. Let's talk about how tourism fits into that plan because of course this podcast is the destination marketing podcast. Destinations are listening. Let's talk about tourism-related small businesses. And then I'd love to understand how should destinations be looking at their role of supporting small businesses. Ryan Starks: [00:08:15] Absolutely. Well, tourism is a form of economic development. As visitors come from different states or foreign countries, they typically spend a lot of money within a local community and that's just tourism 101. That's why we do what we do. And so the state's approach to tourism is very open. It's very supportive. We view visitors as an important guest of the economy and we want the right visitors as well. People who are going to respect our natural assets and our beauty, people who are going to really enjoy the experience and not just come and make a mess and leave. We have a Red Emerald Initiative that's focused on attracting that right type of visitor. As it relates to small businesses, our businesses have done a really good job in Utah of rolling out the red map and making sure that these visitors have the best experience they can possibly have. That includes our hoteliers, our restaurantiers, our retailers, there's just so many opportunities for them to connect with visitors who are coming to the state, who are spending money and looking for a wonderful experience. Adam Stoker: [00:09:24] Awesome. And then as far as small destinations or even medium to large destinations, how do you support those businesses specifically? What's the DMO's role in helping these businesses succeed? Ryan Starks: [00:09:36] That's a great question. So a DMO typically will do a lot of the marketing to get the visitor to the local community and then it's up to that local community and the businesses to put together their plans and so there are things that they can do to welcome the visitors to kind of attract them. Things like beautification, putting flowers in front of your shop, putting some beautiful signage up that's clear on what you sell. So those are just a couple of examples. But really, I would recommend that any small business in a visitor town works hand in hand with the DMO because that partnership is really going to yield great benefits. Adam Stoker: [00:10:14] So now let's talk about other destinations whose offices of Economic Development may not be thinking ahead the same way that you are. What's the best way for a destination to reach out to their counterpart like Utah has with you to make something happen? Ryan Starks: [00:10:31] There's a lot of rich resources. One is a group of state DMOs that meet on a regular basis. So get involved with that association of state DMOs. Attend conferences. I think our team is willing to meet with anybody looking to take that next step in tourism. It is an essential part of our economic development strategy. So we can't separate tourism from economic development. They're inherently one and the same and be happy to visit with anybody who had questions. Adam Stoker: [00:11:02] Great. And what games are you going to this year for BYU? Ryan Starks: [00:11:06] So far, I don't have any on the books. Like my work schedule just gets really complicated. I've had to watch a couple from my phone while on the road and that's probably going to be the theme of the year. Adam Stoker: [00:11:18] Okay, well, you know what, when things calm down for you, let's go to a game. Ryan Starks: [00:11:21] Absolutely. Adam Stoker: [00:11:22] Ryan. Thank you so much for taking the time. Really appreciate you. Ryan Starks: [00:11:25] Thanks Adam, great to visit with you. Adam Stoker: [00:11:27] All right, see you. Okay, everybody Bandwango has been a sponsor of my show now for almost a year and it's been a great ride. They create passes for your destination where you can help guide your visitors through the destination and maximize the revenue generated per visitor. I like that you can create passes for things that traditionally you probably wouldn't have thought of. In Fort Wayne Indiana they're actually creating a holiday lights pass and they've been able to get over 1000 signups, 1560 unique check-ins and 565 users opted in to visit Fort Wayne's email communications. It's just another great example of how Bandwango is thinking outside of the box and building really unique passes to help destinations, interact better with their users and generate more revenue. If you would like to learn how to create passes for your destination, make sure to check out bandwango.com/dmp. DMP stands for Destination Marketing Podcast. That's bandwango.com/dmp. Hello, everyone and welcome to another episode of the Destination Marketing Podcast. I'm your host, Adam Stoker. We are still here at the Utah Tourism Conference in St. George, Utah and I am with a good friend of mine. His name is Kevin Smith and he is the President and CEO of Tuacahn Amphitheater, which is one of the most dynamic tourism assets that I've ever seen. Also, a very, very fun client that we get to work with on a consistent basis. Kevin, thanks for joining me today. Kevin Smith: [00:12:59] Glad to be here. Adam Stoker: [00:13:01] Yeah, it's great to have you here at the show. It's great to meet in person. I would love to have you for our listeners maybe just give the overview of what is Tuacahn Amphitheater. I know it's impossible to visualize without seeing it in person because it's one of the most unique things people will ever see but let's take a shot. Kevin Smith: [00:13:18] Sure. Well, Tuacahn comes from a Mayan word that means Canyon of the Gods, loosely translated. So we are nestled in a red rock canyon, formerly known as Padre Canyon in Ivins, Utah. That 1500-foot red rock cliff kind of gives us the backdrop of one of the most beautiful settings that have an outdoor amphitheater in the world. We have 2500 seats as of this coming year because we're adding more seats. We've been operating with a 2000-seat amphitheater for over 25 years now. We also have an indoor theater that seats about 425. And we do theater about 7 to 8 months out of the year and we draw in over 350,000 people a year to come see theater. 70% of those come from outside of the county and so we're drawing in a lot of people from almost every state in the nation and even people from all over the world to come see theater in that beautiful Red Rock Canyon. Adam Stoker: [00:14:15] Wow. I've got to tell you over the years, I've been able to attend several shows, whether it's your Christmas show at the indoor theater or whether it's been taking my daughters to When You Wish, which I believe that When You Wish was one of the most underrated shows that you guys have ever done, it highlights every, not every but most Disney Princesses and allows at least it allowed my daughters to kind of enjoy the magic of each Disney Princess in one show. And then, The Little Mermaid over the years, but I'm so excited for your 2024 campaign because my daughters are going to freak out over that as well. But tell me how you take these shows which I believe and you're hiring the actors to prove it, Broadway-level productions in this Amazing Canyon. How do you bring these shows to life the way you do? Kevin Smith: [00:15:04] Yeah. Well, it starts even now for next year. So next year we're going to have Disney's Frozen along with Anastasia and Jersey Boys in our outdoor amphitheater. And then we'll be doing Ring of Fire, which is a Johnny Cash musical along with Christmas Carol with Alan Menken's music. Of course, he wrote all the wonderful music for a lot of the Disney films that you're aware of. But it takes a lot of planning and preparation. We'll do auditions in January and we'll go to several places including New York, LA, Salt Lake City Provo. We'll go to Las Vegas, of course, here in St. George. We'll see over 1600 potential cast members and we're casting 60 to 65 for jobs. And so there's a lot of competition out there to be a star. But we're finding Broadway professionals in New York and LA. We're finding really quality talent that you might have to go to New York to see. We're bringing him here to Ivins, Utah, Ivins, Utah, people can't even say it right. But they come and they just fall in love with the area and many of them want to come back. We have a lot of repeats. But then we're also having to bring in craftspeople, people who build the sets, costumes who are good with technical things like lighting and sound, bringing in from all over and having them work together. Some of them are locals who don't have as much professional background and they're learning from those that we bring in. Same thing with the cast. And they all work together. It's interesting, you'll have a Broadway professional who is a mentor for some of those who are first starting. Pulling that together, Scott Anderson, artistic director does a great job of with varying degrees of talent bringing together a cast, a crew that puts on something truly professional that you don't have to travel to New York to see because it's right here in Southern Utah. Adam Stoker: [00:16:54] Yeah. And I love that. One of the things you mentioned is that it's not just the actors, right? Last week, I had the opportunity to see Hunchback of Notre Dame at Tuacahn. I've got to tell you, it may have been the best show I've seen at Tuacahn. I felt like the talent or the actors were the most talented that I've seen. But then you had a full-on choir to support the actors and then they were all, if I remember correctly, some of them were kind of behind the stage, but there was also an area off to the side and I can't remember how I would describe it, but it kind of under a ledge there where the audience can't necessarily see everybody. But the amazing musical performance from that choir to support what was happening on stage, it really is something that you just can't find anywhere else. Kevin Smith: [00:17:43] Yeah. And the choir is all made up of local talent. We have Utah values as our culture here. Magnifying or increasing or expanding our talents. That's just something that's built into our culture. And so many young people are taught in school and in their homes to do everything they can to try anything in music or art and to expand on those talents that they discover as they grow up. We're the beneficiaries of that to be able to have a business here that takes advantage of that talent. I will tell you a lot of people know this but our Charlie Stover in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory So this is Charlie playing Charlie. It's a local kid. Adam Stoker: [00:18:24] Really? Kevin Smith: [00:18:26] Yeah, he's got talent and that we didn't have to go to other places to find the talent for our Charlie and Charlie and Chocolate Factory because he lived right here. So there is a tremendous amount of talent here in St. George. The other thing I want to say is that we also do concerts. So, and we bring in comedians. We'll have Jeff Foxworthy, Brian Regan. We've had, you name it, lots of comedians but also groups like Stick, Foreigner, both of which are coming up and a lot of other artists who are coming in. And so the concerts as we've even done professional bull riding on the stage. Adam Stoker: [00:18:58] I've been to that. It’s amazing. Kevin Smith: [00:19:00] Yeah. So we try to have complementing our musical theater season, some of these concerts. We've done a thing called Thriller that you've heard of. Adam Stoker: [00:19:08] Yes. I've been there. Kevin Smith: [00:19:09] Yeah. So all of these and then one thing that's coming up is our Christmas in the Canyon where you can come see a live nativity. We use a real live camel and what have you and re-enact the story of the birth of Christ to remind us of the true meaning of Christmas. So, and in fact, those casts that re-enact, that are all volunteers, right from the community. So we try to involve the community, but also bring in the talent that our community can enjoy. And of course that attracts tourists from all over the surrounding states and all over the country to come and enjoy the theater that we present. Adam Stoker: [00:19:40] Great. So my listeners are mostly destination marketers, people that work in a DMO and are trying to figure out whether it's getting more visitors. Some of them, it's get better quality visitors that take care of the destination a little bit more when they come in. Some of them are trying to be better stakeholders in the community and better stewards of the community. And so as you think about that, not every destination has a Tuacahn, Tuacahn is one of a kind, but they all have resources and assets related to the arts. How can a DMO make sure that they are supporting correctly or adequately an organization like yours in the destination that does do so much for the culture of the destination? Kevin Smith: [00:20:30] Sure, I think a couple of things. One is there are people out there, particularly musicians who want to have festivals, a blues festival, or some kind of music festival. There are artists out there who want to have art festivals and they attract crowds and so whatever that idea is that you may think, oh, we'd never be able to pull it off in our area. If you've got a group of people that are talented and passionate, that encourage that because that can become an annual event sometimes biannual event that attracts visitors and puts your area on the map for having that festival. So I think festivals can be a one way. Another way is just as you see organizations who are developing as nonprofits that start out really small, don't underestimate the growth that can happen. Support those organizations that are truly trying to provide the kind of entertainment that would attract others to stay an extra day to enjoy and – Adam Stoker: [00:21:25] Can I jump in on that one real quick? Kevin Smith: [00:21:27] Sure. Adam Stoker: [00:21:29] So this is a very unique destination for that reason is you told the story on stage this morning that when Tuacahn started, you had a $2 million operating budget, you've now grown to a $20 million operating budget for Tuacahn and a lot of these destinations that have nonprofit arts organizations that could potentially become such a pivotal part of the community, they need the support and I'm assuming that in order for you to get to get from the 2 to 20 million, you guys got a lot of support from the community in the processes. Kevin Smith: [00:22:00] Absolutely. Our local city, the county, and especially our state. Then of course, just the general I think sort of generosity of our community and donating and supplying volunteerism, all of that contributes to us being able to grow. So don't underestimate what can be done with that kind of energy. We also have, I think in Utah kind of this pioneering spirit where people want to take something that may start out small and have it grow and be a part of that. If you can create that vision and then as a DMO support the vision, it's amazing what the community will support and the success that will come from that because of that support. Adam Stoker: [00:22:00] Great. Give me some examples of how the Greater Zion DMO has supported you and helped Tuacahn kind of get to where it is today. Kevin Smith: [00:22:52] Well, it's a combination, their marketing efforts have always been very beneficial to us. They've given us great advice about where we should go with our marketing. They also have contributed financially through TRT Tax Direct. So for example, the 500 seats we're going to add this year into next. They donated half a million dollars to the cause so that when we went to the state, the state knew that the county was putting in that kind of money and they pitched in $980,000. The states like that, when they see the local county and cities involved in your activities, then they want to contribute to that and partner with everybody involved. It's really leveraging that, that's helpful. I think we're the beneficiaries also of some tremendous hire Miguel Smith, who are the one the benefactors of Tuacahn. They've given to so many things. There are other people like them who have come along to help Tuacahn in our time of need to gift and to donate and to participate in the process of our growth and we've been very blessed by that. Adam Stoker: [00:23:58] Yeah. And their contribution really has been amazing and their legacy I think is represented pretty clearly at Tuacahn. I want to go back to one of the previous things that you said because I think it's really important for our listeners to take away from this discussion. The snowball of support has to start internally before you can expect external support. And so as a local DMO, if you've got an arts organization that's trying to make it, you've got to be kind of the center of that snowball of support if you want eventually for the state to invest in that asset or other organizations to invest in that asset. I think that's a really critical point that even if you as a DMO are not seeing state support work for an organization, it doesn't mean, oh, well, they might not make it. It means you need to demonstrate that support first so that the state can be influenced to do the same. Kevin Smith: [00:24:48] Yeah, I remember when Dave Clark, who used to be the speaker of the House and the legislature, we had come to him, even Hiram Smith was involved in that dialogue of saying, hey, we need state support. We're becoming a large enough organization and he said, well, you need to do two things. Number one, you need to ask, we hadn't been asking. Really. We maybe been complaining or whining that we weren't getting the support, but we weren't properly asking. So you need to ask number one and number two, he said you need to get your local county and city and DMO involved so that we know of that support and then that mushrooms into their support. You're absolutely right. It takes those two things you got to go and ask and sometimes you have to ask in the right ways and make those connections. Takes a lot of work and time and effort, but it's worth it in the end because the state and the county, they want to partner with great organizations that are growing because they know the benefit it has to the economy of the state. Adam Stoker: [00:25:42] Yeah, I love it. Kevin as we kind of wind down the discussion, I guess. First of all, congratulations on the lineup for 2024 because I mean, the way my girls go crazy for Frozen inside our house, I can't imagine the way on a national scale when people see that you're going to be showing Frozen as one of your shows. Of course, the other shows are amazing too. It just seems like you got a lot of momentum going into 2024. Kevin Smith: [00:26:09] I appreciate that. And already we had our reveal last Thursday announcing the shows for next year, 2024. We've already tripled the number of season packages sold from the previous year. So there does seem to be an excitement for the shows next year and we're going to try and match The Majesty of the Canyon by putting on the best Disney's Frozen you've seen anywhere and all our other shows as well. Adam Stoker: [00:26:34] I love it. Kevin, thanks so much for taking the time. Really excited to see what's happening at Tuacahn and of course, for the opportunity to be a part of it. Kevin Smith: [00:26:40] Thank you. Appreciate it. [End of transcript]
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