00:00:01.32 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal All right, we're live studio.

00:00:04.27 alexei sayle Hi everybody and welcome to episode 61 of the now once weekly AlexiSale podcast. And um ah hi Talal.

00:00:15.86 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, hey, Alexi. How are you dad? Number two.

00:00:19.15 alexei sayle I'm fine. Thank you. I'm okay.

00:00:20.76 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I'm enjoying our weekly little catch ups. It's quite nice.

00:00:24.47 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah. I think the audience seemed to quite like it as well. So the the topics that we were We left on last week for aircraft and um but aircraft aircraft.

00:00:35.93 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:00:37.33 alexei sayle Well, wo whoo I mean, that's a that's a widespread none airplane.

00:00:41.85 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Airplane food, am I right?

00:00:44.24 alexei sayle fit Well, first of all, somebody mentioned planes that are crashed due to their window design. but the on the in the comments on YouTube what that means yes of course I know what they're talking about they're talking about the the the first commercial jet airline in the world which again was the de Havilland Comet which was a British aircraft um and but um you know like all these things in the way they've been talking about like the hovercraft

00:00:53.62 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah, do you know what they're talking about?

00:01:12.70 alexei sayle yeah British inventions that didn't quite make it. The problem, one of the well, two problems, I think, with the comet. One was that, as the comet says, they it had square windows rather than round windows. And that meant, so the people knew, I mean, engineers, I think, knew very little about ah what we now call metal fatigue.

00:01:37.15 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Uh huh.

00:01:37.36 alexei sayle And so because the plane had plain hat square windows, this placed a lot more stress on the um skin, the aluminum skin of the of the plane and caused tiny cracks to appear. And these cracks um ah widened when the plane was pressurized. And so several comets essentially broke up in flight.

00:02:01.90 alexei sayle and

00:02:03.17 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal it didn't just happen once and then they just

00:02:04.74 alexei sayle No, no, no, no, they didn't know not at all.

00:02:04.95 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal called a halt to everything

00:02:08.05 alexei sayle They didn't know there's no water. Well, they didn't know what happened partly. So you can suppose you cannot blame. No, I think it it happened at least there were two. There were two fatal whole loss accidents with comets in which and everybody on on the plane died before it was withdrawn from.

00:02:29.24 alexei sayle service and I think they were then later put back into and put back into service but by then of course it was too late really and us the Boeing 707 by then had come onto the scene so I mean the other problem with um the Comet was that the the engines were sort of in the and the and the wing route as it were the engines were

00:02:43.26 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Fucking hell.

00:02:49.71 alexei sayle Inside the wing, um four engines inside the wing, whereas the Boeing 707 had the modern design, had the engines on mounted on pylons beneath the wing. And so it made I think it made the comet much more difficult to um to service. And also it made it more dangerous in that yeah i mean engines are highly explosive and and I mean, when know sometimes I'd go on about the and the incredible inefficiency of and British arms industry and British arms procurement because there was also a few years ago there was ah they decided to build a British AWACS A1

00:03:16.35 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal You don't.

00:03:37.09 alexei sayle radar system and they chose the, it was called the Nimrod, but it was basically a comet. And so they chose for this system of plane, which by then the InDesign was, came from the 1950s.

00:03:49.27 alexei sayle So it's like now would be 70 years old. I remember that there was problems with one of them, one of them blew up, I think over Afghanistan. I'm not sure. Anyway, the whole, the whole project cost a vast amount of money.

00:04:02.48 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal But it's it's a radar system that goes on the plane.

00:04:05.53 alexei sayle It goes on the plane.

00:04:06.23 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It's not to detect planes.

00:04:06.57 alexei sayle Yeah. So there was, no, no, it was a radio system that went on the plane.

00:04:07.63 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Okay.

00:04:09.52 alexei sayle So the plane was, ah they used to comment.

00:04:09.77 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And it was designed to go on the fucking comet from the fifties or whatever.

00:04:14.04 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah. I mean, probably some of the listeners can but mes talk more about this, but I don't know.

00:04:18.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal What's wrong with these people?

00:04:20.60 alexei sayle It was, I mean, they wanted to use a British plane, but they could have used, I think the, I mean, it was another commercial failure, but was the Vickers. Oh God, I can't remember what it was called.

00:04:31.97 alexei sayle It had four engines basically attached to the tail in pods. What the hell was it called now?

00:04:38.61 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal What? That doesn't sound good.

00:04:40.51 alexei sayle No, that was all right. That worked. And that never had an accident that plane. I mean, they didn't sell that many of them, but that never ever had an accident.

00:04:48.45 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Vickers plane.

00:04:48.61 alexei sayle It was used by the ah RAF for a while as a kind of troop transport, but that rather than V I C K E R S.

00:04:52.00 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal How do you spell Vickers?

00:04:56.82 alexei sayle Oh, that's one thing. just to change direction. i Yeah, what was the jet?

00:05:01.19 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Vickers Armstrong.

00:05:05.10 alexei sayle VC-10, it was called, the VC-10, which has an exemplary safety record.

00:05:06.59 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal VC10.

00:05:10.35 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, on the tail.

00:05:10.36 alexei sayle And they could have used that.

00:05:11.88 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah, that's quite like 60s, 70s style.

00:05:13.06 alexei sayle You like a business jet issues? Yeah, well, they're still all business jets basically have the engines mounted right at the back.

00:05:15.98 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:05:22.91 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So.

00:05:22.95 alexei sayle And they could, I guess they could, but for some reason they chose to use some leftover comments they had lying around and it was catastrophic and it cost billions. I mean, it was finally abandoned. that I think they bought an American system as they used to do. But interesting, I think I was going, every year I do this Radio 4 appeal, which is, it's broadcast on a Sunday morning and it says, will you, it's for St. Martin's in the field and I'll be doing it.

00:05:53.22 alexei sayle this Sunday and I go into a place in the city of London with other minor celebrities and we answer the phones so people ring in to donate and it's usually it's mostly it's mostly old people but but I've done it for about four or five years now

00:06:06.97 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh. Wow, that's so old school.

00:06:18.06 alexei sayle Typically it's the people who give to charity, the poor give to charity more than the rich, the rich know because they're greedy and so they're addicted to money, but the poor give to, but it's mostly old people, because really a full party.

00:06:22.63 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:06:32.09 alexei sayle It's mostly old people who ring in. So I answer the phone and I say, you know, take, it's

00:06:38.17 alexei sayle But one of the things that always surprises me is that particularly the women, the old women in there, how fluent they are in the United Nations phonetic code, the United Nations phonetic alphabet, the United Nations phonetic alphabet code, which I think like,

00:06:53.77 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh.

00:06:54.47 alexei sayle We all know I am adept at Alpha Brava Charlie, Delta Echo, Foxtrot, et cetera.

00:07:00.54 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Foxtrot.

00:07:02.05 alexei sayle So when you ask these sort of ladies in their 80s for their their postcode, they'll often go, Delta Charlie won Whiskey, Whiskey Yankee 75.

00:07:13.26 alexei sayle I don't know whether it's there.

00:07:13.97 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Is that something to do with they all used to be like ah phone operators or secretaries or something?

00:07:18.27 alexei sayle Oh, they'd done like, they'd done service during the, I mean, even in their races, they couldn't have served in the war, could they? Maybe they, I don't know if they served in the force, but it's remarkable that most, it's just these old women, they go, okay, because you have to take their details, the bank details and that.

00:07:33.70 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:07:36.19 alexei sayle And they often go like Charlie Delta, seven and nine there. I don't quite know why it is, but the old women, Giving to charity are surprisingly well versed in the United Nations phonetic alphabet code.

00:07:55.32 alexei sayle So there's something.

00:07:55.51 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Always get stuck on G.

00:07:57.54 alexei sayle Golf.

00:07:58.63 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Golf is the most simple one.

00:08:01.00 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:08:01.42 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So I'm normally like, you know, uh, Foxtrot, Indigo, uh, uh, Gary, and then you can, um,

00:08:05.22 alexei sayle It's Foxtrot India.

00:08:10.93 alexei sayle um So, well anyway, that's so that's a bit of a rundown of the comet and its failings and then...

00:08:15.71 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal just even as an amateur lay person, you just know that squares aren't an aerodynamic shape, but I guess this becomes common knowledge through incidents like this through,

00:08:27.10 alexei sayle Yeah,

00:08:27.81 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal trial and error, isn't it?

00:08:28.07 alexei sayle I think they thought it'd be just nicer to look out of. I think this that was part of the reason.

00:08:32.24 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, windows are square, aren't they?

00:08:33.89 alexei sayle Well, Windows in the house, what is...

00:08:34.28 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal That's just kind of, yeah.

00:08:37.19 alexei sayle what What can we see through the square window?

00:08:37.26 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal That's what a window is supposed to be.

00:08:39.81 alexei sayle We can see the plane breaking up.

00:08:45.10 alexei sayle ah um

00:08:46.20 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal What's that a reference to?

00:08:47.66 alexei sayle Play school.

00:08:48.94 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal they li it did did did did it a Great show.

00:08:51.54 alexei sayle yeah The round window.

00:08:54.03 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Why are you, you weren't even a kid when play school was out. Why do you know that?

00:08:57.47 alexei sayle And now I just... um It was popular among students, I think.

00:08:59.83 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Just zeitgeist. ahha

00:09:02.61 alexei sayle Students, she we were talking about they used to bet on which window which window the story would be through. was and Somebody was talking about that. I mean, you only had a choice of like three windows, but they were the best students every day.

00:09:15.20 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um

00:09:16.73 alexei sayle They were better on which window did' have a bat on which window of the story was going to be through.

00:09:19.71 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal ah Speaking on on faulty aircraft, someone on YouTube, Michael, commented um that ah the problem with the airship We were speaking about the airship last week, the big floating bum.

00:09:31.84 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:09:35.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal The problem with the airship is that Europe has prevailing westerly winds. So like you can go to Turkey quite easily, but getting back, you have to like pedal back.

00:09:41.53 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:09:43.95 alexei sayle Yeah. Well, I mean, that's what they have engines, isn't it? But I don't know how, how hard they would have to fight the, they're going east. stuff ah they They would, you would have hard, you would have to fight the Wesley wings.

00:09:54.72 alexei sayle I don't know.

00:09:55.03 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal You'd have to, yeah, especially if Stormbert was around or something, it'd be really tough.

00:09:55.12 alexei sayle But that that would be why, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But you'd have to have, I mean, that's where the engines come in, I suppose.

00:10:01.34 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I guess.

00:10:04.15 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:10:05.70 alexei sayle So I don't know.

00:10:06.89 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Interesting.

00:10:07.93 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:10:07.99 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and So yeah, the things seem so ideal and beautiful and or could be carbon free air travel, but then there's not, nothing's perfect.

00:10:14.03 alexei sayle yeah i'm very i'm still yeah i still maybe yeah maybe uh i don't know what's happening with the airlander i hope it's i hope things are going things are going ahead for them and we'll see them we'll see them soon i've seen the good year blimp yeah the american uh

00:10:37.66 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Did it say ice cubes a pimp on it?

00:10:39.62 alexei sayle Yeah. Well, there's also, it's a line in and Bill and Ted, isn't it? When Bill and Ted's amazing, Bill and Ted's first Bill and Ted film, Bill and Ted's extraordinary adventure.

00:10:52.57 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Excellent adventure.

00:10:54.66 alexei sayle Yeah. Well, they go back to the Wild West and they're in a fight in there.

00:10:55.81 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Excellent.

00:10:59.00 alexei sayle And Keanu looks up and he's having a fight with the guy. He says, look, you got your blimp. And the guy looks up and he punches him.

00:11:04.27 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal yeah

00:11:04.40 alexei sayle So me and me and Linda were driving through Los Angeles once. And I said, look, look, to cut you a blimp. No, really.

00:11:13.05 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal right

00:11:13.26 alexei sayle And there it was. I don't think it did.

00:11:15.36 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal But even that has to be tethered by a rope, doesn't it?

00:11:18.30 alexei sayle Well, it's not going anywhere. Yeah.

00:11:20.98 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, do they let it do they release it sometimes and let it and it can fly around on its own?

00:11:23.41 alexei sayle Yeah, of course. Yeah. Yeah.

00:11:25.07 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Okay.

00:11:25.23 alexei sayle Flies around all the time. Yeah. I haven't seen it for a while. I used to see it over here when he used to do Wembley football matches, do you aerial shots of that for a while.

00:11:35.39 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Really?

00:11:36.10 alexei sayle But yeah, but as it reads, Iced Tea is a Pimp from Good Day.

00:11:41.46 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Have you ever been in a blimp?

00:11:43.21 alexei sayle I've never been in a blimp, no.

00:11:44.59 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Have you ever been in a hot air balloon?

00:11:46.31 alexei sayle No, I don't fancy that. That looks frightening. Don't buy me that as a Christmas present.

00:11:50.90 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and you ever been Have you ever used the parachute?

00:11:54.18 alexei sayle No.

00:11:54.76 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Done a bungee jump?

00:11:56.42 alexei sayle No, don't fancy that.

00:11:57.02 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Have you ever been in a jet plane?

00:11:58.95 alexei sayle Yeah. I mean, I used to be, to I used to be frightened of flying and then I had a hypnosis and I became completely blase about it.

00:12:07.02 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Wow.

00:12:07.10 alexei sayle And so since then, I've never been, you mean like a jet fighter?

00:12:09.71 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:12:10.42 alexei sayle No.

00:12:13.00 alexei sayle No, I've never been in it.

00:12:13.11 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um I'm surprised, because in all your like documentaries you've made, you've never done one about like arms and military stuff and jet planes.

00:12:19.90 alexei sayle No, people have often proposed it, but then the, yeah, the powers of, yeah.

00:12:23.09 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Because that's how you get a free ride on one, and they do loop the loops and stuff. and

00:12:28.85 alexei sayle I remember a friend of mine, she, she, she won like a free flight in a tornado or something, but then she, she's very thin. So she was, she, you have to be a certain weight for the ejector seat. And she was actually too light for it. So she never got to go in a tornado in the back seat. Um,

00:12:47.29 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal You've driven a tank, we know that.

00:12:48.92 alexei sayle I've driven a hovercraft as well around Southampton Bay.

00:12:51.66 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, wow. Like a big one or a little one?

00:12:54.37 alexei sayle A little one I did when I was with the Telegraph. I did a feature on the Was. I hope there still is a hovercraft factory down in Southampton in the place where they used to make Spitfires.

00:13:08.28 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh.

00:13:08.60 alexei sayle It's super marine. I don't know what it's called now. I went down there and interviewed them and then they let me take out like a six year of a craft to let me drive it around ah Portsmouth Bay or whatever it's called.

00:13:23.06 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, wow. Now they've got a funny, when you turn, it's not just, it's, it's, you've got a bit of drift going on at the same time, don't you?

00:13:32.65 alexei sayle Yeah, it was yeah.

00:13:33.25 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So you've got to completely change the way you think about driving, right?

00:13:37.01 alexei sayle yeah it's Yeah, it's not precise. It's not like a speedboat where you can make, you know, yeah, it's more of a drift, you know, because essentially you're creating this gap of air between you and the water. So it's a bit, you're scooting along on that. So you can't make, yeah, my memory is you can't make very sharp turns.

00:13:56.30 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal yeah you're gliding everywhere oh yeah going through like swampy forests and stuff you got to be able to traverse water and land

00:13:58.31 alexei sayle Yeah, they sit there. Most of their contracts seem to be for the Colombian police at the time to, interdicting drug traffic up the Amazon or whatever it was. Swampy stuff, yeah. Yeah, I hope they're still going. I don't know, but um ah I think the article I wrote wasn't particularly, you know, to anybody, didn't please anybody particularly.

00:14:29.45 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and what about a fan boat fan boat you've driven a fan boat jet ski

00:14:35.74 alexei sayle No, I've been on one of those. No, like in the in the Florida Keys. Now I think they're, I think Linda's one of Linda's, if Linda ever becomes world president, she's going to ban jet skis.

00:14:46.46 alexei sayle She finds some particularly repellent jet skis and shipping mineral water over long distances. So she'd ban like Fiji water, which is stupid really.

00:14:56.80 alexei sayle I mean, using up the earth resources to ship water around the country.

00:15:00.87 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So this September I went on holiday to Toucan in the south of France and just for a little beach holiday with my partner and um we were at the airport, we landed really late at night and we ended up sharing a cab with someone from the airport in Nice, Toucan.

00:15:07.45 alexei sayle yeah

00:15:23.23 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um And it was this super rich guy who insisted he pay for the cab and everything.

00:15:25.65 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:15:27.91 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal We got really lucky ah that we've met this guy.

00:15:28.89 alexei sayle Hmm.

00:15:30.98 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal But it turns out he was on his way to the yacht festival in Cannes, the largest gathering of fucking twats who sells completely unnecessary pollution machines to other billionaire twats and stuff.

00:15:41.73 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:15:48.29 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And we we were chatting to this guy in the cab and we were obviously being polite to him. He's ah paying for our cab. And it was also an interesting opportunity to learn a bit because he was very talkative.

00:15:59.48 alexei sayle Right.

00:15:59.97 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And um you don't even realize. So there's a couple things I wanted to let you know about. ah First off, just on this topic with jet skis, a lot of billionaires who own a big massive super yacht He said there's a big market in selling smaller yachts that follow the big yacht around. And the only thing that yacht is for is to carry the toys.

00:16:24.70 alexei sayle The toys, like the jet skis and stuff.

00:16:26.01 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal The toys, and that's jet skis, little helicopters, ah even a speed boat that pulls around like the rubber ding eating the rubber rings and stuff like that.

00:16:33.52 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:16:35.49 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal They just have a whole boat just to carry toys, he said.

00:16:37.98 alexei sayle It's obscene, isn't it?

00:16:38.91 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And to a billionaire, a toy is a fleet of jet skis you know for him and his mates.

00:16:42.21 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

00:16:44.23 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal But then he started telling me, he's like, you got really hushed and started telling us about this whole other thing. ah Like super billionaires are prepared, like doomsday preppers.

00:16:57.19 alexei sayle All right. Yeah. Yeah.

00:16:58.52 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And you think of doomsday prepper. Oh, some guys built a bunker in their garden and has a bunch of tin cans in it or something. No, a billionaire will have, will buy a multi-million pound yacht.

00:17:10.19 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And the so the sole purpose of it is for when the shit goes down, he can jump on his yacht and he has a whole team of staff, people on full-time wages that are just sitting on this yacht, looking after it.

00:17:10.37 alexei sayle Right.

00:17:20.81 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah.

00:17:24.91 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And on the yacht is all the guns you could ever need, all the food you could need that will survive for ages. And then not only that in South America, they buy these massive plots like farms that are currently functioning just sitting there.

00:17:38.91 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal with cows and crops and everything and they're just keeping maintaining these farms just so when either the apocalypse or the revolution or the lower classes have had enough and decide to storm their mansions or whatever, just gets in his chopper, goes to his yachts and just has ah has a crew of people that take them to their farm, which is in some isolated place in the middle of the jungle in South America.

00:18:01.46 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And so they have they have these these billionaires have these backup, backup, backup plans, you know?

00:18:06.83 alexei sayle Yeah, it's just depressing, isn't it? My sort of

00:18:11.41 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So pirates are going to save like there, that'll be our last chance to catch them would be pirates.

00:18:15.40 alexei sayle Well, that's my my my consolation is that I assume their their servants will rise up and murder them.

00:18:21.53 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:18:21.77 alexei sayle I don't know whether they've thought of that, but um mean um that's that's I take consolation in that.

00:18:26.97 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and he said sometimes they have to think about that because the servants want room for their families on the on the yachts so they have to get even bigger yachts than they think so these these billionaires get caught off guard and they're like oh actually no i think i need one that's even bigger because when the time comes if they don't have their families with them or their the servants will rise up won't they you know if they they have to be treated well

00:18:34.45 alexei sayle Right.

00:18:45.51 alexei sayle That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think that, yeah, that's a depressing cut. I mean, that's why we're destroying the planet is for these people. It's why, you know, we have genocide. It's essentially for the benefit of these people, these multi-million. That's why there's a war in Ukraine is to benefit the shareholders of Blackrock. Who are those people?

00:19:11.25 alexei sayle That is why we have injustice everywhere. That's why the gap between rich and poor is constantly getting bigger. It's for those people. It's not strictly relevant, but there's ah there's a writer there was a writer called Tom Sharp, who was very big in the South African writer. He was very big in the 60s and 70s, now sort of forgotten, but um he wrote about South. There's ah one of his books.

00:19:37.78 alexei sayle and um set in South Africa. And this white woman says to her, one of her servants, her black servants, she says, Oh, you know, if, if the natives of South Africa rise up, you wouldn't kill me, would you?

00:19:50.49 alexei sayle And he says, Oh, no, madam. He says, I have arrangement with the house next door. The house, the, the servants there will come and kill you. And I'll kill them.

00:19:59.94 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal ah oh my god and you got the so you'd probably there's a like a billionaire would have

00:20:02.11 alexei sayle And so that was a brilliant kind of idea. A brilliant concept. And he said, Oh, no, madam, yeah I like you too much. I, I would, I couldn't kill you. The servants from next door will come and kill you and I'll I'll kill the people next door So Yeah, well exactly yeah Yeah, yeah

00:20:23.69 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal the their security team probably prepped and briefed on what to do in that situation. But then would the security team rebel? And then who would he have to ah protect him from them? I wonder how deep it goes, their preparations.

00:20:43.35 alexei sayle They must have thought, I mean, they're kind of, they're not, they're not, I mean, they're slimy, clever people in a sense.

00:20:45.41 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And all, sorry, sorry, but all,

00:20:51.16 alexei sayle So they may have thought of this kind of contingency.

00:20:56.97 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal contingency plans.

00:20:57.92 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:20:58.68 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal But all that means is they know they're evil.

00:21:02.28 alexei sayle Do they, do they though?

00:21:03.61 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal What if they have to plan?

00:21:03.69 alexei sayle Do they tell out? Do they know they're evil? They know people are out to get them, but they think people are out. I don't think they think that's because they're evil.

00:21:12.10 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Okay, fair enough.

00:21:13.12 alexei sayle I mean, hit always always says ah you know Hitler thought he was a nice bloke, didn't he? i mean ready yeah we go Why is everybody having go at me? Hitler would think, I'm only trying to make things nice for German people.

00:21:28.41 alexei sayle Why are they shouting at me? Why are the wide Russians at my door?

00:21:33.21 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I wonder I wonder could hit the could surely there was a day Hitler looked at himself in the mirror and says oh wait but I'm too far in I'm too deep in to go backtrack now

00:21:43.02 alexei sayle Oh, well, it is. I mean, it is. ah Yeah. Yeah. I suppose. I mean, it is, you know, I. hate ah ah You know, giving props, as it were, to all the comedians, but the greatest, I think what the greatest comedy schedule time in many ways is the we do shitly share an agent, the Mitchell and Webb.

00:22:05.94 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal are we the bad guys yeah it is a good one worth a re-watch

00:22:06.44 alexei sayle sketch, are we the bad guys? I mean, it is i mean it it sums up everything about the human condition and in that one sketch really. I mean, it is absolutely fantastic. And I don't know whether whether it's like Jesse Armstrong wrote it or David and and Robert wrote it, but it is just the, I mean, it you know i mean it it is the cleverest come comedy sketch. It's so brilliant.

00:22:32.84 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Jesse Armstrong, yes, speaking of billionaires who went on to do succession.

00:22:37.42 alexei sayle He did. Yeah. And which is a very good show.

00:22:39.84 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And me and my girlfriend have just started watching Mad Men for the first time, which I think is a bit of a precursor for succession and is, in terms of like, just let me finish, in terms of like the heroes being absolute assholes, but for some reason you're compelled to like them, you know, and you're compelled to care about them.

00:22:44.69 alexei sayle Oh, really? I mean, mud. Yeah. Right.

00:23:00.16 alexei sayle Um, yes, you identify with them. Yeah. I think Mad Men is like, I mean, it slightly goes off towards you. I mean, it's got one of the greatest endings of all time. I think Mad Men. oh yeah it spot but But, um,

00:23:09.84 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal No spoilers, please.

00:23:15.30 alexei sayle yes, it's an amazing show, Mad Men, I think.

00:23:18.14 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It's brilliant.

00:23:18.26 alexei sayle i I remember feeling ashamed really, ah cause thats because I was sort of, you know, the 60s. I mean, the attitudes that those people had, I, I don't know if I, you know, that I lived through an age when, you know, when those attitudes were still, I mean, attitudes are bad enough now, but.

00:23:35.30 alexei sayle you know, the attitudes, the sexism and the racism that's displayed in Mad Men is, you know, it was what it what was existed at the time.

00:23:43.20 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal That's horrific.

00:23:47.12 alexei sayle And it's, ah you know, it really shone a light on that. I thought it was absolutely, I mean, it is one of the top 10 greatest films of all.

00:23:59.17 alexei sayle And also, of course, you know, I think I probably questioned before that William Goldman line about, You know, for ah a TV or for a movie and the same is true of a TV series to succeed.

00:24:10.79 alexei sayle um You know, the seven people at least have to be at the top of their game, you know, which is right.

00:24:15.08 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, yeah, yeah.

00:24:15.67 alexei sayle It's a director producer. And in that' this case, cost ah casting. I mean, finding Jon Hamm, I think, to play the central character is he's the perfect because he's so handsome.

00:24:26.98 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:24:30.23 alexei sayle And I'm starting to forget the other that woman with the red here.

00:24:34.46 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal but Okay, director, writer, producer, lead actors.

00:24:37.52 alexei sayle Producer, casting, at the actors, yeah.

00:24:41.96 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal ah Costume, makeup, one more.

00:24:42.08 alexei sayle ah Casting, costume, makeup, set design, and general set design.

00:24:48.22 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Set design.

00:24:49.22 alexei sayle And these days probably CGI as well.

00:24:49.84 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Although sound is quite important, I might swap out costume for sound or makeup for sound.

00:24:51.85 alexei sayle And sounds, yeah. Yeah. Well, it doesn't have to be seven. I mean, but it just has to be a lot of people, you know, has to be everybody. Yeah. And whoever does the incidental music.

00:25:00.35 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And like you said, last time you brought this up these days, there's probably more than seven because there's CGI and post-production, other post-production things that have advanced so much.

00:25:05.14 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

00:25:11.44 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Um, I did watch kneecap in the last week.

00:25:14.26 alexei sayle All right.

00:25:15.00 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Um, and yeah, I was, I was blown away by it.

00:25:15.06 alexei sayle Okay.

00:25:19.41 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Just the subject matter is something that obviously has not been really been tackled in cinema. That being, you know, the story of Irish language and and the struggle they had in Northern Ireland to, to not even just to have it legal, have it being taught in schools and having people be able to hold on to their traditional, their indigenous language, which.

00:25:42.38 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal ah is obviously very reflective and and analogists analogous is that word of what what's happening in like Israel and other countries around the world um and it was really fucking rude and lots of drugs and it really reflected party culture quite honestly I think and I was so shocked to see that all three of the leads were actually

00:25:52.98 alexei sayle this is there is a power though. Yeah

00:26:08.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal the three guys from kneecap ah because they all performed so well.

00:26:10.03 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:26:12.57 alexei sayle Amazingly for their first acting job.

00:26:12.83 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um

00:26:17.40 alexei sayle Remarkably confident performances.

00:26:18.52 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah. And having fast bender in there as kind of a throwback to his role in hunger was really interesting.

00:26:25.24 alexei sayle Was it? All right.

00:26:27.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal There was even like a reference to it because he played the guy who did like the dirty protests and stuff in the prisons and um he's,

00:26:29.40 alexei sayle It probably sounds there. All right. What's happened to him? I think did he get caught up in some

00:26:39.82 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Fassbender.

00:26:39.89 alexei sayle Scandal, yeah. You can see him around so much these days.

00:26:42.92 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, he was a kneecap.

00:26:44.29 alexei sayle He's a kneecap, yeah. He is Irish, isn't he?

00:26:48.95 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um

00:26:49.25 alexei sayle I think.

00:26:50.59 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Is he?

00:26:52.77 alexei sayle Surprisingly. You're looking it up.

00:26:56.16 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I'm trying to. Oh, he's German Irish.

00:26:58.45 alexei sayle German Irish, yeah.

00:27:01.93 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Anything in the news about him? No, I saw the killer. He did the killer recently as well.

00:27:07.44 alexei sayle Of course he did. You're right. Yeah. No, he's all over the place.

00:27:09.47 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And that was, that was pretty good. Quite a simple stripped down film.

00:27:11.28 alexei sayle I didn't.

00:27:13.00 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal You didn't like it?

00:27:13.05 alexei sayle Yeah, not really.

00:27:17.24 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Okay. Do you think it was a bit too pretentious or something? Well, didn't you like?

00:27:22.20 alexei sayle Well, I'm sort of, I'm a bit sort of that whole, the whole hit man for hire sort of storyline is always vaguely annoys me really.

00:27:35.06 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Hmm.

00:27:36.46 alexei sayle It's sort of lazy writing, in a sense. There's so many. There's an episode of the new series The Sandwich Bar, which is sort of about that part.

00:27:46.37 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal kind of like celebrating murderers kind of thing.

00:27:46.51 alexei sayle um well Well, yes, exactly. I mean, it's is this one of the... I wonder sometimes whether those films exist to habituate us to mass murder.

00:28:01.13 alexei sayle somehow justify it, you know, although it does work.

00:28:03.52 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:28:04.36 alexei sayle Oh, I'm doing and we should get him on the podcast. that's yeah I am doing well this. This is um when we're recording this on a Tuesday. It goes out on the Saturday so that u our I am doing the stop the war benefit.

00:28:19.93 alexei sayle this Thursday so it will have two days ago for you yeah ah so but one of the people who will be appearing there is Khaled Abdullah.

00:28:22.74 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal two days ago, if you're listening to this on Saturday, yeah.

00:28:33.18 alexei sayle Khaled Abdullah is I think Egyptian I met him over the years a lot of um uh palestin benefits he played dodi fired in succession and he also plays this carrot dick in the crowd shit sorry changed that yeah he plays dodi fired in the crowd not editing it out oh he's gonna make me look people think i'm perfect and now they will see that ah so i picked the color

00:28:45.37 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah. No, in the crown, in the crown.

00:28:54.02 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I'm not editing that out. You're a flawed human being. No, they don't. Have you not read the comments?

00:29:05.17 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Everything we say on the podcast, Alexi's not got an encyclopedia in front of him. So like in the comments, you don't need to be angry when you're correcting us. Just politely inform us of a mistake.

00:29:15.63 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It's fine.

00:29:16.42 alexei sayle the the crown he plays and he plays a character called ugc in this new series of the jackal which is on uh sky and he didn't he's got nothing to do with the jackal so you're wrong now you're gonna leave this in where you're wrong it's called the jackal this one it's got nothing to do with steve mcqueen

00:29:17.54 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal But yeah, he was in the crown.

00:29:26.63 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh yeah, on Sky. Made by Steve McQueen, who went to my school. The director. Day of the Jackal. Day of the Jackal.

00:29:46.21 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, the new series, The Day of the Jackal, is by Steve McQueen.

00:29:48.90 alexei sayle Yeah, it's not.

00:29:54.99 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal then why did I seem being interviewed about it?

00:29:57.06 alexei sayle You just read about his new film Blitz.

00:30:01.75 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, there you go. We can all make mistakes, folks.

00:30:04.34 alexei sayle You gonna leave this in? I'm gonna listen.

00:30:06.69 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Of course I'm edit it out.

00:30:10.67 alexei sayle Well, anyway, Khaled Abdullah is doing this and we should maybe get him on. He plays a character called UGC, a kind of, like not Elon Musk, really, because he's anti-establishment. He plays the kind of a good but but character, anyway, who the jackal is after, in the new series, which I do find really um exciting to watch.

00:30:28.69 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Hmm.

00:30:36.41 alexei sayle Everybody's fantastic in it. I mean, red Eddie Redman is,

00:30:38.28 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, you recommend it then I've been kind of avoiding it.

00:30:40.83 alexei sayle Yeah. No, I think it's terrific. I mean, I love the original movie. And obviously Eddie Redmayne is and you know one of those upper-class actors who and you know I am.

00:30:48.03 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:30:53.52 alexei sayle by definition kind of against, but nevertheless he is terrific and perfectly cast oullahanna lynch as is kind of am i i mean it paints mean it paints antimiex in it. far too rosy light obviously, although actually she's very flawed, I mean she's, LaShana Lynch as the, his Bianca, his nemesis in MI6 is also, it's a terrific performance.

00:31:21.00 alexei sayle I'll tell and also it's written by tell you it is written by is Ronan Bennett who himself was an Irish Republican it all it's all connected you see and actually did time in prison I think falsely and was falsely imprisoned for the murder of a British soldier I think and then was finally released

00:31:31.02 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Wow.

00:31:42.09 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Is this based on the book that Carlos the Jackal got his name from?

00:31:49.19 alexei sayle Yeah, or I think they may have, check but the the book, the original book is written by Frederick Forsythe, which is, it's a terrific book in itself, but it it is, and then it was made into a movie by Fred Zimmerman.

00:32:02.40 alexei sayle See, I'm doing all this without any notes in front of me at all.

00:32:04.86 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah, I'm fact checking you as you're going along.

00:32:06.36 alexei sayle and um It's about an attempt on the life, which is sort of loosely based on reality. It's about an attempt on the life of General Charles' goal by um people who, the OAS, who were I think were, um you know, because Algeria was a colonial possession of France and there was a lot of French people who wanted that to remain the case and in the end after an extraordinary brutal civil war and a film I would recommend is The Battle for Algiers which is used as something as a hand as of a handbook by anti-colonial forces and but

00:32:51.63 alexei sayle ah So anyway um these Algerian white colonialists hire this British hitman to assassinate Charles de Gaulle and it's about his his attempt by a policeman is hunting him down and It's a terrific 60s movie. It's shot in a kind of I think Technicolor or Eastman that kind of really rich really rich colors, and it's one of the foxes, Edward Fox, I'm not sure which one, but he is fantastic as the Jackal.

00:33:23.69 alexei sayle Now, I don't know whether the Jackal got his nickname from, Carlos the Jackal got his name from the film or whether the film took, yeah,

00:33:31.20 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal it was Edward Fox 1973. I think Carlos the Jackal did get his name from the book and ah speaking of it all being connected I know that because in the Iranian embassy siege

00:33:36.81 alexei sayle from the movie, right?

00:33:46.76 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um where my dad was a hostage, the housekeeper, Ron Morris, um had that book and he would sit and read it.

00:33:57.94 alexei sayle Right.

00:33:57.98 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal While he was a hostage, he'd get that book out and read it. And Carlos the Jackal actually, ah his actions actually inspired the terrorists that took over the Iranian embassy, partly inspired them.

00:34:08.80 alexei sayle Right.

00:34:10.92 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It's all connected.

00:34:12.53 alexei sayle It's all connected, man.

00:34:13.76 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And my dad had a fist fight with Carlos the Jackal.

00:34:15.66 alexei sayle And yes, maybe we should do a deeper dive into the history of Karsten Jackal at some point. i see um But there's also a terrible, terrible Bruce Willis remake.

00:34:22.70 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Hmm.

00:34:28.96 alexei sayle um

00:34:29.94 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah, wasn't that just called jackals?

00:34:30.78 alexei sayle Was it called Jackal? It's awful. I mean, it's an utterly pointless remake. But as you know, so many remakes are really the Bruce Willis one.

00:34:42.95 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Mm hmm.

00:34:47.58 alexei sayle I was actually, I was talking to the, I watched some film.

00:34:53.15 alexei sayle I mean, I watched some film the other night or a few weeks ago on one of the platforms and it was a Bruce Willis film, a cop thing. And I think they've kind of discovered halfway through that Bruce Willis has got dementia.

00:35:05.14 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh.

00:35:05.21 alexei sayle So he actually doesn't, it's rather, it's really kind of sad and odd film because All that Bruce Willis says throughout the film is like, yes or no.

00:35:14.07 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:35:14.44 alexei sayle And they go, boss, he's playing like a police commissioner or something. They get out of the car quite slowly. And then they say, boss, the gang are running down East Street. Should we go and, you know, stop them at the 7th Street bridge?

00:35:28.52 alexei sayle And Bruce Willis will go, yes. Oh, no. And I wonder whether he got on set, you know, whether they found out with the producers.

00:35:34.01 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal rather than give the command himself.

00:35:38.56 alexei sayle I think we've got a problem with Bruce.

00:35:38.99 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, no, the truth is um in the last kind of few years before it got really bad, he was aware that he had ah early onset gement dementia was kicking in and it was gonna get worse.

00:35:48.99 alexei sayle Right.

00:35:51.23 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So he just started accepting jobs.

00:35:53.62 alexei sayle Right.

00:35:53.82 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And that's why in his last few years before his retirement, he did like 50 films and they're all very bad and his parts,

00:35:58.97 alexei sayle Right.

00:36:01.95 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal are quite minimal. They just wanted him in there so that they could put his name on the title above the title, his face on the poster.

00:36:05.85 alexei sayle Right. So the producers knew that he was it' it's a right.

00:36:10.26 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Whether it was an understanding between him and the producers, or whether it was just him saying, yeah, I'll do the job, but I have a maximum word limit and I'll only be in this many scenes.

00:36:19.82 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:36:21.00 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and and But people would give him the job anyway, just so they could have Bruce Willis in it.

00:36:21.92 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:36:25.10 alexei sayle It's it' just with this.

00:36:25.75 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So they were practically student movies that spent all their budget on Bruce Willis.

00:36:27.70 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

00:36:30.94 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um

00:36:31.10 alexei sayle Well, this is a strange, sad film.

00:36:32.58 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And he was doing that to save money for his retirement and his kids.

00:36:34.63 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:36:35.66 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and

00:36:36.14 alexei sayle Yeah. No, I mean, obviously user you know, at his best he was a fantastic actor and it's just a strange sad movie to see this

00:36:50.13 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:36:50.62 alexei sayle clearly, um you know, confused man in the middle of these scenes. I can't remember why it's called that. It's some kind of cop thing anyway.

00:37:00.39 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal yeah

00:37:00.87 alexei sayle And it's, I mean, it's in a sense, it's, it's quite a, it's quite a cap compelling watch, but not obviously not for, for really, for reasons that are inherent in the movie itself.

00:37:15.35 alexei sayle So yeah, so it's an odd one.

00:37:19.73 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal We're rough roughly halfway through. So I just want to take this opportunity to remind our listeners that you can support the show. Please support the Alexa podcasts. Future and ah growth by ah buying us a coffee every month, you know, and you can do that by going to Patreon dot.com forward slash Alexa sell podcast.

00:37:39.42 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I won't use that money literally to buy coffee.

00:37:42.66 alexei sayle forward slash.

00:37:43.71 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Um, ah ah patreon dot.com forward slash Alexi sell podcasts, you know, give us a hand. And if we have, if we get up to five, I found out that the name of it is called a stretch goal.

00:37:55.02 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal We have a stretch goal.

00:37:55.01 alexei sayle Right.

00:37:55.94 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal If we get up to 500 patrons, um, we will do a live streamed episode where we can, we will allow you listeners to join the stream and ask us a question.

00:38:10.40 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:38:10.49 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal uh i think that could be quite fun uh so come support the show patreon dot.com forward slash lxcel podcast chuck us a quid a month a couple of quid a month five quid a month whatever you can uh it would mean a great deal

00:38:23.60 alexei sayle Yeah. so well sir but So we're halfway through the show, so let's play and Africa by Toto.

00:38:34.83 alexei sayle right away down in Africa. Okay, we're back. um Talking things that were poignant, actually, I was saying Linda would ban jet skis.

00:38:49.11 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:38:49.62 alexei sayle And there was a night of, a few weeks ago on BBC Two, there was a night of music from Kirsty and McCall. And again, that was poignant. You know, not not nothing to do with music, but I mean, well, but because she was she was on a holiday, wasn't she in Mexico and was either decapitated or was killed by some oligarch on a jet ski, a Mexican oligarch.

00:39:12.57 alexei sayle And what he did was he got his which is like he got his chauffeur to kind of admit to it in the end. And it was either the oligarch or the oligarch. So the chauffeur or some servant went to prison for for killing Kirsty Macabre.

00:39:23.69 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal took the...

00:39:26.75 alexei sayle It was You know, I mean, obviously one gets used to seeing dead people, but it seemed, it seemed particularly, I mean, I don't know if I'd ever, I must've met her somewhere or that, but no, she didn't host the show.

00:39:39.60 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal How did she host the show then?

00:39:42.79 alexei sayle It was, sorry, it was Kirsty McColl at the BBC or whatever. So it was, it was a Kirsty McColl night on BBC four, I'm guessing.

00:39:54.98 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, she was.

00:39:55.44 alexei sayle And so it was just, you know, it's just heard singing, you know, on top of the bops, or Jules Holland on, you know, videos and interviews and, um,

00:39:59.36 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal She was a singer. OK.

00:40:10.35 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Wait, so how did she end up in that situation?

00:40:10.56 alexei sayle and that is actually also, I think she was just on Aldi when she was swimming off a beach in Mexico in this twat on a jet ski, probably from his yacht was to hurtling around and just ran her over.

00:40:22.99 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal oh Oh wow.

00:40:31.27 alexei sayle ah so But also since we seem to I seem to be thinking about point and see there's a very, there's a documentary in about fairy tale of New York.

00:40:43.73 alexei sayle And that was produced by Steve Lillywhite, who was Kirsty McCall's husband at the time. And when he talks about making, and she did her vocals separate to Jane McGowan's, she just recorded them, I think, in the studio. And so he's got the tapes there and he's just playing and he's just fading up. So he hears his dead wife's voice on the tape.

00:41:05.99 alexei sayle and seems to show no emotion. And you can you can hear his dead wife singing unaccompanied, really, because you know it's a hair vocal track.

00:41:14.65 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal oh well does he know he's being filmed well you can't no you can't people react people grieve in their own way man

00:41:15.10 alexei sayle And that's a rather odd moment as well, I think, if we're looking for odd moments in the answer. Yeah, yeah, he's in the documentary and he's talking about Fairy Taylor.

00:41:28.80 alexei sayle Yeah, no, not I'm not criticizing him for it. I'm not saying he's heartless. It's just an odd kind of byproduct of yeah the voyeuristic as but You know, the voyeuristic aspect of what is being a TV viewer really is that you see a man, you're interested. there So there's this documentary about the making a photo in New York, it was written, and then you see the man who produced it.

00:41:54.50 alexei sayle in his home studio with big, you know, 12, you know, with those big thick tapes that people used to use. And he says, oh, and this is Kirsty's vocal and, you know, flips up a slider and her voice pure and the voice of his dead wife comes up pure and unaccompanied on out of the speakers of this mixing desk, you know, it's just, it's not, I'm not, I'm not criticizing him for showing no emotion.

00:42:22.93 alexei sayle It was just, it's just, it's just odd, you know, it's an odd, unintended consequence of watching this documentary that you shouldn't see a man

00:42:26.85 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:42:38.49 alexei sayle playing the voice, the unaccompanied voice, singing voice, of a but very sweet voice, of his deceased wife. That's a theme that seems to have developed in this, that I seem to have teased out of this particular part of the show.

00:42:56.00 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal they ah um There's lots of talk at the moment about um on the social medias at least about how um do they know it's Christmas should fuck off and it's an evil song.

00:43:07.30 alexei sayle yeah Yeah, well, again, I've got a bit in, I mean, I've always obviously been, I've always been anti-celebrity charity and there is a, I mean, I think times are catching up with me.

00:43:08.89 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um

00:43:21.51 alexei sayle I hope I'm still slightly ahead of the times, but there is an there is a a thread in the new series, The Sandwich Bar, which is about celebrity charity events, you know, and children in need and specifically comic relief.

00:43:33.69 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal nice well this song they're they're releasing this year i think a super cut of its song which includes ah vocals from the original and from like i don't know they did two more versions in 2004 and then another year with more contemporary singers and ah there are people and it's it's it's African voices actually

00:43:50.68 alexei sayle Right.

00:43:54.46 alexei sayle I think, yeah.

00:44:00.08 alexei sayle Oh, they finally allowed some Africans.

00:44:01.04 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal who were saying like, can this song fuck off?

00:44:02.05 alexei sayle Oh, no. So for a minute, you're saying they'd allowed Africans to actually sting on the fucking record.

00:44:05.46 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal No, oh, if only, no.

00:44:07.58 alexei sayle Nothing.

00:44:07.75 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal African voices have been speaking out on social media saying, when this song came out, ah tourism to Ghana dropped because everyone just thought it was a wasteland.

00:44:13.80 alexei sayle I really.

00:44:18.56 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal You know, this this song promoted the image of Africa being a deprived wasteland where there's no food and everyone's disease.

00:44:20.57 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:44:25.88 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And it's like we actually had a tourism is in industry it tourism industry and you've lost us billions and billions of pounds.

00:44:28.36 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah.

00:44:32.21 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Like the year he says that the year before this song came out, we made however many millions in tourism. And then the year after the song came out that we made like two quid 50 out of tourism.

00:44:40.68 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:44:41.19 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And it's like, and um there was another argument as well, but yeah, the song has cost Africa billions of pounds. It's not, it's been counter helpful.

00:44:48.85 alexei sayle yeah

00:44:53.42 alexei sayle Yes.

00:44:54.16 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal That's not a good word.

00:44:54.18 alexei sayle Well, yeah. Well, I also think, you know, I mean, I sometimes talk about this with the, you know, the philosopher, Immanuel Kant, who said that, you know, the only moral act is one done out of duty.

00:45:06.67 alexei sayle And in terms of charity, what it means is if you profit from a, it's immoral if you profit from, for instance, an act of charity and of the career, particularly of Bob Geldo, which wasn't going anywhere before life.

00:45:20.24 alexei sayle I took off after life. And I think that that is, you know, that is, a you know, a moral failing on his part, if ever.

00:45:29.30 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Do you think he knew that? Similar to our bill billionaires when he was doing it at the time, when he was getting all his celeb friends together because he could at the time in the moment.

00:45:37.80 alexei sayle i No, I don't think he was doing that, but um well, I don't know.

00:45:38.86 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Was he rubbing his hands and in in evil laughter behind everyone's back?

00:45:48.08 alexei sayle ah

00:45:50.38 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It's hard to say.

00:45:50.82 alexei sayle I'll avoid comment. I think that he subsequently clearly that the fame that it brought him, he subsequently profited from.

00:46:01.90 alexei sayle I don't think he's a particularly nice man.

00:46:04.09 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:46:04.73 alexei sayle And I think that, you know, yeah, i think that ah yeah there are the the whole notion of, um that this whole notion of celebrity charity events and and and charity in general, I think is much more morally ambiguous than you would at first think.

00:46:25.54 alexei sayle you know And it does, yes, the damage that that Live Aid has done, I think. I never knew about that tourism thing, but I mean, many people say that Live Aid prolonged the brutal Ethiopian civil war by as much as five years.

00:46:40.08 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, fuck.

00:46:40.50 alexei sayle um it it's not it's It is at best charity celebrity not not ordinary peoples and I do stuff for charities.

00:46:52.40 alexei sayle I do stuff for, you know, freedom from torture. I do stuff for medical aid from Palestinians. I do homeless charities. You know, that, that is, I think, I do this St.

00:47:04.04 alexei sayle Martin's in the field thing that I'm doing on Sunday.

00:47:04.74 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Hmm.

00:47:07.30 alexei sayle And I think, but I don't, I don't think I invest profit from it. I hope I don't, i you know, I think they are things that, you know, by and large, just do good.

00:47:17.68 alexei sayle But I think there is an awful lot that is wrong with those big, big celebrity things. And Live Aid was the start of it. And Comic Relief and Children in Need, I think they're highly, they're morally dubious.

00:47:33.75 alexei sayle And they're actually, the good that they do, I think is, can you know, if you it's viewed through a broader lens, is it any good at all? Is it in fact, Uh, you know, it's their ultimate effect.

00:47:45.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yes, but the world got the world got an amazing Freddie Mercury performance out of it that will live forever in history.

00:47:45.85 alexei sayle Bad thing.

00:47:50.92 alexei sayle Yeah. Well, yes, that's in sandwich. butt Yeah. Yeah.

00:47:54.82 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and And as someone who's been with you during some of your charity gigs, I can assure the listener that you don't enjoy it.

00:48:04.14 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal He's not doing it for pleasure or his ego.

00:48:05.93 alexei sayle I certainly know. I don't know.

00:48:07.88 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal He's doing it. He's like fucking miserable.

00:48:09.52 alexei sayle That's a duty. Yeah.

00:48:12.24 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It is like self-flagellation. Watching Alexi have to fucking perform.

00:48:17.08 alexei sayle ah Backstage. I mean, I'm all smiles when I'm on stage.

00:48:20.55 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh yes.

00:48:21.35 alexei sayle yeah

00:48:22.35 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um And you get very angry and passionate. It's nice to see. um No wealth today with you.

00:48:27.14 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:48:29.62 alexei sayle And now he's... I don't know where he is.

00:48:31.44 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It's being quiet. Well, send him our, send him our regards.

00:48:32.76 alexei sayle He's quiet. yeah Yeah. Yeah.

00:48:37.00 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Um, when we do the live stream, can we see Wilf asks Ruth? Yes. When we do the live stream, we'll get Wilf involved.

00:48:41.96 alexei sayle Yes, definitely.

00:48:43.73 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal He was involved in your Christmas message as well. Have you been thinking about what you're going to do this year?

00:48:45.89 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:48:48.52 alexei sayle Oh, fuck. I mean, Christ, what are you gonna say? I mean, it's hard to know.

00:48:53.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well,

00:48:53.63 alexei sayle It's hard to know. I mean, obviously, I mean, i it it organically came out of my anger with Stephen Fry's shady bloody message.

00:49:01.74 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

00:49:02.22 alexei sayle um And so it had a kind of, it had the you know, I I feel like we should do one, but I mean, let's see what the official one is really.

00:49:13.94 alexei sayle It won't necessarily, I mean, it's also he knew that this ship would be going on 14 months later.

00:49:20.12 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal This long.

00:49:22.58 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:49:24.24 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, we're going to have to get angry again. Um, or, well, yeah, we'll think of something. and Um, looking through some of our comments.

00:49:39.51 alexei sayle Oh, it's done pretty well.

00:49:40.85 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah, we've done very well.

00:49:41.31 alexei sayle When are we supposed to be talking about with now next week, is it?

00:49:44.50 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yes. I've been, I've been holding onto that because yes, we're going to do with nail. and I, we're gonna talk about With Nail and I next week in the Alexi Sale Film Club, a first podcast of every month.

00:49:53.95 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:49:56.75 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal We'll have a new film. I'm wondering if the original Day of the Jackal might be our next film, but, um and also do...

00:50:01.94 alexei sayle Oh yeah, again, well, these are films that I can do from memory really without, uh,

00:50:06.10 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah, I think that would be, I think it should be films that you know extremely intimately and very well.

00:50:12.38 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:50:13.64 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I was, I was talking with the idea like to suggest that maybe we should ah take turns picking a film, but no, it's the next cell film club and I want to learn from it. And I think it helps the audience, the listeners, ah enjoyment of it.

00:50:27.26 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal If I am ah like them kind of, ah you know, watching something maybe I'm not so familiar with and it's something you're very passionate about.

00:50:31.34 alexei sayle Right.

00:50:34.86 alexei sayle Mm

00:50:37.63 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And so we get to hear your,

00:50:39.14 alexei sayle hmm.

00:50:40.00 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal your opinions on it and and I will speak as a new watcher because I've not seen with now actually and I've never seen day of the jackal I'm sure there's a lot of stuff that because but also on the other hand people a lot of people suggesting stuff in the comments as well so I'll always bring them up and if they are something you're you're keen to do um but yeah ah with nail and I watch it for next week someone said on the comments that it's available on channel four on demand so that's

00:50:54.89 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:50:58.41 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:51:06.43 alexei sayle Oh, cool. Okay. I was wondering where to watch. Yeah.

00:51:08.65 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal That's free with adverts. You can also watch it probably illegally. So we do not advise it, but on a website called Daily Motion, you can watch it for free there as well.

00:51:18.30 alexei sayle but

00:51:19.52 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I'm not sure the quality will be very good either. Probably best quality you'll get is will be on Channel 4.

00:51:21.27 alexei sayle No.

00:51:25.11 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um Did you see that documentary about the loaded magazine culture of the 1990s? That was on BBC Two the other night.

00:51:32.38 alexei sayle You're asking me. Yes, I did. Yes. I know James Brown a little from because he's at Laan every year. Laan is in ah in no idlan in and North Wales, which is, of course, where Dylan Thomas spends a lot of time with him.

00:51:42.57 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, not the singer, okay.

00:51:51.40 alexei sayle What? South Wales. Oh, it's in South Wales.

00:51:53.85 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal A little correction from Linda.

00:51:54.29 alexei sayle Sorry.

00:51:56.27 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal She's been listening this whole time. Hi, Linda.

00:52:01.01 alexei sayle Hi, Linda. Hello. So it's South Wales, yes, it's in South Wales. And of course it's where Don Thomas wrote On The Milk Woods and it serves as the, it is On The Milk Woods.

00:52:12.75 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So I didn't see this show, but it was a comment from the YouTube. um What did you think of it?

00:52:17.52 alexei sayle Yeah, it's ah it's ah it was an intro. Well, I sort of thought, because I also watched, I think there's one more episode to go, I watched um The similar in some ways, there's a series on again, I think on BBC two called boy bands forever, which is for one hours. The first one's about take that second one's about the.

00:52:38.11 alexei sayle next generation of boy bands. and the third I partly wanted it to see episode three because Blue were in it. And of course I did i did Richard Osman's house again with Anthony Costa from Blue.

00:52:47.11 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal You did House of Games with...

00:52:50.63 alexei sayle yeah And so I just wanted to see my new friend Anthony Costa. and because you know i was in i didn't I was obviously lost in Justin. I never i was interested in take that.

00:53:01.73 alexei sayle And um I remember bumping into Robbie a couple of times. I think I thought he was one of the other ones but obviously I have to take that era.

00:53:12.76 alexei sayle I really was not interested in boy bands.

00:53:15.96 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Are you up to date with contemporary music? Is there anything that you like that's kind of in the chance?

00:53:20.33 alexei sayle Well, just let me finish with this stream, but but also it was interesting because the source of in a sense, the parabola of all the boy bands and the parabola of Loaded magazine seemed in a way to mirror each other.

00:53:21.81 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Please finish, yes.

00:53:34.03 alexei sayle In that, it starts out as fun, then everybody has a breakdown and has to go to a mental hospital. which is the sort of story of, or into rehab really, which is obviously, which is the story very much of Loaded magazine, but also of a lot of the boy bands that, you know, one of them will have a breakdown.

00:53:46.26 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal wow yeah

00:53:59.43 alexei sayle I mean, Robbie, I mean and like so i mean rob mean, I think Robbie has either done a lot of He's been to a lot of AA meetings or doing a lot of therapy, I think probably both. um And generally there's one member of the band who's, I mean, poor Brian Harvey. In terms of E17.

00:54:19.74 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal yeah and that one direction kid

00:54:22.52 alexei sayle for Liam Payne, yeah, Liam Payne. We haven't got to one direction yet, but Liam Payne, you know, there's this terrible casual, you know, it starts out and everything's great.

00:54:32.59 alexei sayle And then there's a at least one terrible casualty along the way. um And loaded was kind of, I mean, load, there was a lot, well, we we could probably talk, we perhaps we could talk in greater depth about, maybe don't have the time, but it was,

00:54:46.10 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, maybe that's also just reflective of men's mental health in general. I think one in four men or something is is very depressed and doesn't know how to get the psychological help they need.

00:54:58.50 alexei sayle Yeah, well, being in a boy band won't help with that.

00:54:58.56 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal and

00:55:04.61 alexei sayle But the loaded thing was also, I say James Brown's at LAN every year. um And I watched him, he did a

00:55:14.77 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And who's James Brown for people who don't know?

00:55:16.56 alexei sayle He's the founder of Loaded Magazine, working class, leads,

00:55:18.59 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Thank you.

00:55:22.39 alexei sayle um very, I mean, still, I think still, I mean, you know, it was seminal that magazine for, I mean, obviously again, it was not, not something that appealed to me or was part of my experience, but it was a magazine that kind of either changed the face of Britain or mirrored changes that were going on in Britain.

00:55:45.65 alexei sayle And ah I think he's still wrestling with the legacy in a sense of it. um But he youin't know and it it's all crazy antics, and then it gets a lot darker.

00:55:57.69 alexei sayle And and he talks you know about his mother died with drugs overdose, so on and so forth.

00:56:04.86 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Right.

00:56:05.92 alexei sayle He's an addict himself. um

00:56:09.50 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Were you ever on the cover of that?

00:56:11.60 alexei sayle loaded. No, we were talking about this. I was on the front cover of, I think it was f eight for FHM, which became later became a very which became a kind of rival of um i've loaded and and just featured on its cover.

00:56:20.41 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal For him magazine. Loaded. Hmm.

00:56:32.25 alexei sayle um with Girls from Hollyoaks with no in their underwear. um I, but before that it started out as a kind of a, it was going, it was as a kind of rival to GQ.

00:56:46.78 alexei sayle So it was a men's kind of fashion magazine. And I was on the front cover of that when it was called For Him magazine. And the, our local news agent, our local news agent told me that, you know, like,

00:56:57.21 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal in your knackers as well I think the bikini was a bad choice probably

00:57:03.05 alexei sayle the copies that they didn't sell they would return them and get a refund and that was the most returns he'd ever had to send back was the copy with me on the front cover of For Him magazine had sold the worstest yeah now this was when it was still obviously a kind of rival to GQ and it that that

00:57:26.92 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, that's funny.

00:57:28.21 alexei sayle that for him, that ah copier for him, magazine with me on the cover had sold. Worst selling magazine he'd ever had in his shop.

00:57:36.32 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal For fuck's sake.

00:57:39.24 alexei sayle He told me that, thanks for that. ah But ah yeah, so that's why I have been on the confront cover for him. magazine, but then, and then there was, that may have been at the point where they thought, fuck it, we'll change the name to FHM and just have naked young actresses on our cover.

00:57:47.94 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Because that was the one my. Hot girls on it.

00:58:00.15 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal That was the one.

00:58:00.45 alexei sayle It's an interesting documentary. I think it leaves, the loaded magazines, it leaves a lot of questions. Um, one answered and it also features David Badil, some of you, a regular character on this podcast, really, he really doesn't, again, doesn't dig very deep into his own.

00:58:21.33 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Because he was part of that whole culture, wasn't he?

00:58:21.37 alexei sayle Complicity. Yeah. Yeah. And again, I don't think he reflects very honestly on his part in it really.

00:58:27.90 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Interesting.

00:58:30.14 alexei sayle And maybe he did in the bits they didn't use in the interview. I don't know, but certainly the bits that they show of him is there's no, it's not a great deal of honesty there.

00:58:39.90 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Apparently Badil was um part of the voice that kind of ah misrepresented what happened in Amsterdam the other week.

00:58:47.59 alexei sayle Yes, he did. And he should, if, you know, if he's got any moral decency, he should, you know, issue a retraction, really. Now that it's become uncle clear what ah exactly what went on in those, during those riots by the racist Maccabee Tel Aviv.

00:59:05.32 alexei sayle Hooligan support us. like I guess he won't. People don't do that, really.

00:59:10.27 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh, are those Maccabee guys coming to London at any point or coming to the UK for a match?

00:59:15.07 alexei sayle That would be interesting. and Not that I know of, but I'll keep you.

00:59:20.17 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal If they went and played against like, is it Celtic or Rangers that are pro-Palestine?

00:59:26.94 alexei sayle Salty.

00:59:29.25 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal That would be interesting, isn't it?

00:59:30.40 alexei sayle Mmm.

00:59:30.57 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Wouldn't it? Glasgow versus Maccabee.

00:59:32.49 alexei sayle Yeah.

00:59:33.87 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um Yeah, any ah lot just yeah was I asked you earlier, do any any contemporary music that you've been listening to? Anything that's...

00:59:41.79 alexei sayle I've been listening to, and I've used it to come on to the, come on stage at the museum of comedy where I'm doing these triads. I use Nadine Shah's 20 things.

00:59:55.66 alexei sayle I think my, I, I subscribed to just like a music, you know, service and, uh, through up, I just, I just thought it was an amazing song.

01:00:04.88 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Nadine Shah.

01:00:05.05 alexei sayle And i so I've been listening to Nadine Shah recently just to make me myself see my hip. She sings in this, she's from the Northeast somewhere.

01:00:11.77 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Never heard of her.

01:00:13.66 alexei sayle She sings in her own accent, really.

01:00:17.33 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Cool.

01:00:17.85 alexei sayle Can we play anything with 20 things? Can we do that?

01:00:21.25 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, yes, certainly.

01:00:21.63 alexei sayle Do we have to pay somebody if we...

01:00:23.71 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Now I'll put a little clip of it in. I'll play it at the end of the episode. Last week I played that Isla White song at the end of the episode.

01:00:27.00 alexei sayle Right.

01:00:29.11 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I'll put a bit of Nadine Shah. I don't think I can put more than 30 seconds of it because she signed to a record label.

01:00:34.23 alexei sayle Right.

01:00:36.58 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Very interesting, I'll be interested to hear that.

01:00:36.86 alexei sayle Yeah. man it's and It's a story song as well.

01:00:39.29 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Okay.

01:00:40.74 alexei sayle It's really interesting.

01:00:42.09 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal 20 things.

01:00:43.81 alexei sayle So yeah, it's a kind of, it's not exactly a story. What would you say? it's just it's ah It's a painting a picture song of a kind of world. um

01:00:53.83 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Hmm.

01:00:54.81 alexei sayle yeah Yeah.

01:00:56.31 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal What about Charli XCX?

01:00:56.44 alexei sayle Reminded me. Yeah.

01:00:58.48 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Have you listened to her album?

01:01:00.01 alexei sayle I used to actually, funnily enough, of course, she's been going quite a long time, as you can know, this old brat thing was like last summer.

01:01:03.09 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal She has, yeah.

01:01:06.09 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

01:01:06.16 alexei sayle But I used to come on stage to that one, you know, I drove my car into the bridge. I don't care. That's Charlie XCS, isn't it?

01:01:12.50 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

01:01:13.52 alexei sayle And I remember hearing that in like 2017 or something, just like, wow, this is amazing. So I used to come on stage to that, actually.

01:01:22.40 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Have you heard Brat?

01:01:23.81 alexei sayle ah No, I haven't really, no, I should have a listen really, I guess.

01:01:28.25 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Now, uh, it's wild. It's wild. It's like not what you'd expect for like a number one pop album. It's really, I think cause the, the, the album before that and the album with I don't care and it was very poppy.

01:01:42.29 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And it was like, she was very beheld and beheld to beheld into the record labor and what they would label and what they wanted her to kind of make.

01:01:47.69 alexei sayle Right.

01:01:49.72 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And then they finally with brat, they like do what you want.

01:01:49.71 alexei sayle Right.

01:01:53.16 alexei sayle Right.

01:01:53.34 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And she's made something really kind of really weird. It's fucking weird. and And and and hardcore in a way, like it's lots of drug talk and like real issues of being spoken about um and partying brat, the whole brat and you know culture that she's kind of coined this phrase is like not giving a shit, you know, going out partying really fucking hard all weekend and then

01:01:57.54 alexei sayle right

01:02:04.43 alexei sayle Right.

01:02:20.57 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um

01:02:23.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And it's, it's, it's i f I got into it through my girlfriend and it's, I really actually grew to really like the album because it's just not what I was expecting for a pop album.

01:02:31.07 alexei sayle All right.

01:02:34.12 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It's not clean. It's not sweet. It's not cute. It's, it's quite heavy electronic stuff.

01:02:39.80 alexei sayle Okay.

01:02:41.18 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And, uh, for, for her birthday, me and my partner are going to see her this Friday. This is why we're recording on a Tuesday.

01:02:45.73 alexei sayle Oh my God! Where are you going?

01:02:47.81 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I'm going, we're going to Birmingham arena to see her and the brat tour.

01:02:50.21 alexei sayle All right. Oh wow, you the aren't you, won't you be a bit old for?

01:02:55.31 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal yeah i'll probably be the oldest guy there no no she's universal people i'll probably be the straightest guy there i'll say that much but um no she's quite got because it's so weird such a weird album it's got a ah a weirdly wide appeal and it obviously it's such a huge part of the zeitgeist this year brat girl summer and all this

01:02:56.90 alexei sayle Yeah, I think.

01:03:02.00 alexei sayle Right.

01:03:13.20 alexei sayle Yeah. I just, I just started reading about it in the Guardian, which immediately put me off.

01:03:18.66 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah. And it was annoying that she said, you know, Kamala is brat, which pissed me off because she's not.

01:03:19.09 alexei sayle But, uh, yeah, that was, that was a misstep. I've also been actually, cause yeah, it's all women.

01:03:25.65 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And also Charlie. Lastly, Charlie's in so many adverts at the moment. So she's truly like this year.

01:03:30.66 alexei sayle Really.

01:03:30.81 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal This has been the year where she's just trying to make as much money as possible. It's clearly the case.

01:03:34.87 alexei sayle Right. But that was like 2017, or 16, wasn't it? Like, guess we're going to the...

01:03:38.92 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal No, what brat? Oh, that song.

01:03:40.83 alexei sayle I don't care.

01:03:40.92 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah. But brat is from this year.

01:03:41.93 alexei sayle Yeah.

01:03:42.86 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

01:03:43.50 alexei sayle Yes, and I know that.

01:03:44.51 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah. I don't care.

01:03:44.70 alexei sayle I've also have been listening a bit to Kate Nash.

01:03:45.40 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal It was huge.

01:03:47.22 alexei sayle There's a really rather... It starts out all right, but then goes really, really terrible series on BBC called Night Sleep, which is about um a night train from Glasgow being hijacked by cyber terrorists or something.

01:04:02.83 alexei sayle And it just, it just goes so stupid because I'd love a film upset on a train. And we could talk about that. I just had another film we could do actually, which I'd love to talk about, which is one Ryan's express, which I saw with me dad in Southport many years ago.

01:04:16.30 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal ah

01:04:17.98 alexei sayle Yeah. Von Ryan's express would be an amazing film to, to talk about.

01:04:22.47 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Well, maybe next month, um you can think about that for now.

01:04:23.79 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah. but it but i' was gonna just say that just it's a But for some reason, they the woman the hero the woman hero is the sort of head of cybersecurity at the British rail, an odd rail to be a heroine.

01:04:40.94 alexei sayle And the the the kind of disgraced former policeman who's on the train is helping, you know, trying to stop these hijacking.

01:04:41.12 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Yeah.

01:04:49.39 alexei sayle At one point, just for no reason at all, they they exchanged a couple of lines for Kate Nash song.

01:04:55.48 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh.

01:04:55.47 alexei sayle One way she says, I think something like ah you seem really bitter. Is it because your friends are fitter? And so it made me start listening to Kate Nash. It was an interesting career. It was also an actress in that series GLOW about Lady Restless.

01:05:12.41 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal I was talking about Kate Nash this week, but I can't remember why. um Well, fascinating, but I think we're out of time.

01:05:21.23 alexei sayle Yeah. All right.

01:05:21.68 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Oh yeah, Kate Nash opened, has an OnlyFans page. She's just ah she's just um launched an OnlyFans page.

01:05:26.06 alexei sayle Still, our only fans. I was thinking of Myspace.

01:05:30.68 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um I think kind of semi as a protest, semi as a joke. um She's been posting pictures of her bum on OnlyFans because I think it's cause something to do with how musicians aren't making as much money as they should, you know, and especially with, yeah.

01:05:47.11 alexei sayle They're getting Rob blind.

01:05:50.97 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And like the only way they can make money is to perpetually do live shows, which is very bad for mental health and and and and physical health to just be touring all the time.

01:05:55.50 alexei sayle Yeah.

01:05:58.71 alexei sayle I mean, it's outrageous how the music is revenue for music has been diverted away from artists.

01:05:58.83 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal um

01:06:07.68 alexei sayle I mean, it was never that good. But I mean, as somebody who had a hit in the 80s, I remember talking to Tracy Thorn through everything, but the girl about it just saying, wasn't it great?

01:06:19.42 alexei sayle You know, music money he just seemed to fall out the skies or any idea it's in the 80s.

01:06:23.75 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal yeah yeah i should also add i should also add that kate nash is making a statement about sex work and how it's taboo and sex workers are often seen as criminals and scum and and this when

01:06:24.48 alexei sayle And you're still getting robbed by everybody, but I mean, now it's just how music has been diverted away from the artist into the pockets of crypto billionaires, you know, it's it's a the scandal of gigantic proportions.

01:06:53.88 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal when it's such a largely consumed product and we should be ah treating a sex worker as a bit more respect. And yeah, so she's making a point about that and agency, female agency stuff, taking ownership of your body and that.

01:07:05.01 alexei sayle Okay.

01:07:09.36 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And homework listeners, watch With Nail and I before the next episode.

01:07:16.03 alexei sayle Yeah.

01:07:16.17 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Your time your time starts now. um

01:07:20.24 alexei sayle you know fifty yards You have a good week too Talam.

01:07:23.01 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Have a good week, Alexi. That was fun. God, we start these not having a clue what we're going to talk about.

01:07:28.30 alexei sayle No, it's true.

01:07:29.37 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal And the time passed pretty quickly there.

01:07:31.44 alexei sayle It did. Yeah.

01:07:32.33 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So well done us.

01:07:32.75 alexei sayle ah should have Well done everybody. We should have our own show on LBC.

01:07:37.15 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal We fucking should, listeners at home, let us know we're doing a good job.

01:07:39.12 alexei sayle Yeah.

01:07:40.27 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Give us a pat on the bum and support us, patreon dot.com forward slash alexisalepodcast.

01:07:41.69 alexei sayle yeah

01:07:45.73 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Follow us on social medias at alexisalepod. I've started filming our episodes and put, and I just posted a little video clip of last week's episode on our Instagram.

01:07:57.29 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal So go and give that a like and and encourage me to make more of those. ah Anything else? No. Can't think of anything else ah much lovelessness.

01:08:07.42 Talaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalaltalal Thanks for the support

01:08:08.17 alexei sayle Bye-bye. Bye-bye.