1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,600 Mountain State Mysteries contains adult content that may not be suitable for all audiences. 2 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:07,920 Listener discretion is advised. 3 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:09,040 I'm your host, Mark. 4 00:00:09,040 --> 00:00:10,400 And I'm Courtney. 5 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:40,240 And this is Mountain State Mysteries. 6 00:00:41,280 --> 00:00:53,120 The case we have for you today is about a woman who seemed to have it all. 7 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:59,520 A loving husband, a 19 month old daughter, a family who loved her and plans for the future. 8 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:03,200 That is, until two men stole it all away from her. 9 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:07,520 This is the case of Patricia Sue Richmond. 10 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:16,560 Patricia Sue Brogan Richmond was born on February 23, 1954, to Thelma Jean Thompson Brogan 11 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:18,720 and Homer Harrison Brogan. 12 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:24,160 In 1971, between her junior and senior year, Susie was dating Bruce Richmond. 13 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:26,880 The two got married in Parisburg, Virginia. 14 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:31,600 Susie ended up dropping out of high school due to her getting pregnant with her daughter, 15 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:35,760 Angela Arlene, and giving birth in March of 1972. 16 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:39,360 The couple would move to Pluto Road in Shady Spring, West Virginia. 17 00:01:39,360 --> 00:01:41,760 Everything was perfect in Susie's life. 18 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:45,760 That is, until November 8, 1973. 19 00:01:46,560 --> 00:01:51,680 The morning of November 8, 1973 started out as a normal day for Susie. 20 00:01:52,480 --> 00:02:00,080 She was wearing a white dress, a blue sweater, white boots, and a red ribbon tied in her black wig. 21 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:06,000 She dropped off Angie at her parents' home in Beaver, West Virginia at 10.30 am. 22 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:09,200 Thelma said in an interview with the Raleigh Register, 23 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:13,280 quote, it was 10.45 am on Thursday when she left. 24 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:15,360 I know because she asked me what time it was. 25 00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:18,800 I'll never forget that day, end quote. 26 00:02:18,800 --> 00:02:24,800 According to Susie's mom Thelma, Susie was going to deliver some Amway products to customers on 27 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:26,720 Old Crow Road in Beaver. 28 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:31,120 After dropping off the products, Susie met up with her friend before she took her grandmother 29 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:33,200 to Ransom's Market in Beaver. 30 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:35,840 After taking her grandmother to Ransom's Market, 31 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:39,520 Susie was seen at the Emiko service station around noon. 32 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:43,920 The same Emiko service station that Margie Dodd was abducted from. 33 00:02:43,920 --> 00:02:50,560 Susie was driving her orange 1970s Volkswagen Beetle with the West Virginia license plate 34 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:54,080 7D-2267. 35 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:57,600 After she left the Emiko station, she drove her grandmother home. 36 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:01,760 For some reason, Susie did not return to her parents' home like she was going to. 37 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:07,040 As the day went on, Thelma got more and more worried about her daughter. 38 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:11,840 So she called the police to report Susie as a possible missing person. 39 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:16,960 She was of course told to wait 24 hours to a couple of days because her daughter may have 40 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:18,240 simply ran off. 41 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:21,760 The hours turned into days and there was still no word from Susie. 42 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:30,320 Bruce felt like something was wrong so he posted a $1,000 reward which would be $7,217.55 43 00:03:30,320 --> 00:03:31,600 in 2024. 44 00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:35,840 The reward was for any information leading to the return of Susie. 45 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:41,520 Over 100 of Susie's friends and relatives started to organize search parties to search the area. 46 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:46,560 The search included a helicopter to look for possible car accidents that cannot be seen on 47 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:52,400 the ground. Bruce even went up to the sky twice in a friend's airplane in hopes to find Susie's 48 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:54,000 orange Volkswagen Beetle. 49 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:59,760 What no one knew while searching is that tips had already came in involving the disappearance of Susie. 50 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:06,480 On November 8th, the day Susie went missing, calls were being made in Minden, West Virginia. 51 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:13,920 About 48 minutes away from Pluto Road where Susie and Bruce lived, residents reported a car 52 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:18,160 that was on fire over the hill at the Concho trash dump. 53 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:21,280 Thelma said in her interview with the Raleigh Register, quote, 54 00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:26,880 Nine days after she was missing, they found her car over an embankment near Minden. 55 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:32,320 It had been saturated with gas and burned, but it sat there for about a week before anyone went to 56 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:33,520 investigate it. 57 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:38,320 Neighbors told me they called the police about it when it was on fire, end quote. 58 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:41,440 The car was finally investigated on November 16th. 59 00:04:41,440 --> 00:04:50,480 In an article, it said, quote, A burn car identified by state police as belonging to Patricia Sue 60 00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:57,840 Richmond, 19 of Pluto Road in Shady Spring was found Friday over an embankment at Minden. 61 00:04:57,840 --> 00:05:04,240 She had been missing since November 8th, reportedly leaving her 19 month old baby with her mother, 62 00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:07,680 saying she was going to visit a friend for about an hour and a half. 63 00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:13,680 Police said an extensive search by more than a hundred friends and relatives has turned 64 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:14,400 up nothing. 65 00:05:14,400 --> 00:05:20,880 Police said the case is being investigated by Trooper J. O. Cole of the Beckley State 66 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:22,000 Police Detachment. 67 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:29,920 Anyone having information concerning the woman last seen in Beaver, old Crow Road area should 68 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:33,280 contact state police headquarters, end quote. 69 00:05:33,280 --> 00:05:37,760 Investigators with the state police searched through the remains of the vehicle and searched 70 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:39,280 the surrounding area. 71 00:05:39,280 --> 00:05:42,960 Sadly, there was no trace of Susie or anyone else. 72 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:47,840 Authorities were able to determine that the vehicle did not go over the embankment due 73 00:05:47,840 --> 00:05:51,200 to an accident, but that it had been rolled over the embankment. 74 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:56,240 The traces of gas showed them that it had been set on purpose. 75 00:05:56,240 --> 00:06:01,440 Authorities were able to find one single clue from the burnt remains of the vehicle, 76 00:06:01,440 --> 00:06:05,600 a gold wedding band with the name Gold Circle engraved on it. 77 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:12,480 From our research, we gathered that Gold Circle was a discount department store, mostly covering 78 00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:16,240 Ohio, New York, Kentucky, and Western Pennsylvania. 79 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:22,240 To us, it looked like it could be the same vibe as Kmart selling clothes, bedding, jewelry, 80 00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:23,280 electronics. 81 00:06:23,280 --> 00:06:25,280 You name it, they sold it. 82 00:06:25,280 --> 00:06:29,760 Gold Circle stayed in business from 1967 to 1988. 83 00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:34,400 And from our research, there was not a Gold Circle store in West Virginia. 84 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:37,760 However, authorities believe that the ring belonged to Susie. 85 00:06:38,240 --> 00:06:41,040 However, her family told them that it didn't. 86 00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:46,240 Another thing that made authorities scratch their heads was how did Susie's Volkswagen 87 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:47,360 end up in Minden? 88 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:54,240 While investigators were trying to find Susie, there were two men raccoon hunting at Plum 89 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:56,720 Orchard Lake in Fayette County, West Virginia. 90 00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:04,160 Around 11 p.m., James Shea and Harvey Williams were on the eastern shore of Plum Orchard 91 00:07:04,160 --> 00:07:09,440 Lake when they found the remains of Susie lying at the base of an overturned tree, 92 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,000 approximately 50 yards from the road. 93 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:17,280 The man went and found the superintendent and told him they found a person's body with 94 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:20,560 its, quote, head blown off, end quote. 95 00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:24,240 The superintendent at Plum Orchard Lake called the state police. 96 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:28,880 This state, a decomposition, made identification impossible. 97 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:33,680 When they saw a white dress and a blue sweater, they knew it was the same type of clothing 98 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:36,240 Susie was wearing on the day she went missing. 99 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:41,200 The state of her remains made it impossible to determine if sexual assault had occurred. 100 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:46,000 Susie's dress, bra and skirt were filmed wrapped around her neck. 101 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:52,160 A GenCare ambulance driver said that Susie's face looked as if it had either been 102 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:55,680 in a way by animals or being beyond recognition. 103 00:07:55,680 --> 00:08:00,000 Susie's body was taken to the Tyree Funeral Home in Oak Hill, West Virginia, 104 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:07,040 where an autopsy was performed by Dr. M. Jamil Ahmed, a Beckley pathologist. 105 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:13,040 Susie's body was positively identified by her dentist who checked her teeth with dental charts. 106 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:20,000 Dr. Newell said he could not immediately see any indications of other physical injury 107 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:22,480 other than the decomposed face. 108 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:27,680 Dr. Newell said the body must have been in a particular spot for several days. 109 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:33,360 Despite the clothing being wrapped around Susie's neck, Dr. Newell said the cause of death was due 110 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:39,680 to two stab wounds in the area of the left breast which punctured the lung and caused hemorrhaging. 111 00:08:39,680 --> 00:08:45,200 The murder weapon was never identified, but it was determined to have a blunt end to it. 112 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:52,080 Police kept investigating the crime scene and they discovered Susie's wig with the red ribbon attached, 113 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:57,040 a dental plate and a gold chain with the emblem of a selling ship on it. 114 00:08:57,040 --> 00:09:03,040 The only thing at the crime scene that belonged to Susie was the wig with the red ribbon attached, 115 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:08,800 dental plate and a gold chain who it belonged to is still a mystery to this day. 116 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:15,040 Police did notice one of the items of Susie's was missing, the white boots she had been wearing 117 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:19,440 were not at the crime scene or even at the scene of her burned car. 118 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:25,440 One of the main questions police had in this case was how did Susie end up at Plum Orchard Lake 119 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:31,440 in her car burned over an embankment in Menden a round trip of 30 miles? 120 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:38,080 With all the media coverage of this case, police started to get some tips on what happened to 121 00:09:38,080 --> 00:09:47,040 Susie on November 8th, 1973. Two salesmen who worked at the Murphy Mart in the Raleigh Mall area 122 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:54,880 of Beckley contacted the state police. The two men reported around 1.30pm on November 8th. 123 00:09:54,880 --> 00:10:01,440 They both observed an African-American male with a petite Caucasian female with dark hair sitting 124 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:07,280 inside a bright orange Volkswagen Beetle. They both said the woman did not appear to be an 125 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:14,320 any distress. Something about it just fell off to them. The female was seated on the passenger side 126 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:19,440 of the car by the male within the driver's seat. They said the male seemed to be having trouble 127 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:25,920 with the car as he attempted to drive out of the parking lot. To both men, the action of the man 128 00:10:25,920 --> 00:10:32,160 in the driver's seat were similar to those of someone who had never driven a stick shift before. 129 00:10:32,160 --> 00:10:38,960 They witnessed the man turn on to what was route 19 and 21 heading north towards Mount Hope. 130 00:10:38,960 --> 00:10:44,800 One of the men who witnessed this thought he recognized a woman in the car. So he was smart 131 00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:50,240 and hurried up and got something to ride on and wrote down the car's license plate number. 132 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:55,520 The day after Susie's body was found, the salesman gave the piece of paper to the police. 133 00:10:55,520 --> 00:11:00,800 And by what seemed just pure luck, it was the same license plate number that was on the back of 134 00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:06,720 Susie's car. So the state police started to wonder why Susie drove all the way into Beckley. 135 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:12,800 It wasn't something that seemed to be in her plans. But from the podcast, Cold Case Crew, 136 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:18,080 they have said they believe that Susie used to work at a restaurant in the area. A restaurant 137 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:24,400 that is still there in the same spot. Today, although it may be a new building. Susie was 138 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:29,520 rumored to have worked at Long John Silver's at some point and was said to still have some 139 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:34,320 friends that work there. So maybe she just went there for some lunch or to stop in and say hi 140 00:11:34,880 --> 00:11:40,480 to a friend that was working. It did cross my mind while putting this episode together 141 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:46,000 that maybe she was delivering some Amway products to someone that wasn't home and she knew they were 142 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:53,280 at work. So maybe she just went there to drop them off. 30 minutes later around 2pm, not one, 143 00:11:53,280 --> 00:12:00,000 not two. But three different cold truck drivers spotted Susie's car driving along the narrow 144 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:06,160 mending drive. The sighting happened near where Susie's car was actually pushed over the embankment 145 00:12:06,160 --> 00:12:12,160 and set on fire. All three drivers said that the car was flying down the road with the windows rolled 146 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:19,440 down and the cold drivers saw two African American men, one driving, one in the passenger seat, 147 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:26,240 and a Caucasian female seated in between them. These sightings caused police to focus on the 148 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:32,640 mending area. They actually ended up finding out that one of the residents who reported Susie's 149 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:38,800 car being on fire had a story they wanted to hear. A man who we were going to call Robert saw the 150 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:45,120 flames from the car and went to investigate it himself. At the top of the hill, Robert saw two 151 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:51,040 African American men walking up towards the road and away from the car. Robert thought that there 152 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:57,760 could have been an accident so he asked the men if anyone had been heard. One of the men said no 153 00:12:57,760 --> 00:13:03,920 and said that they had been the only ones in the car. So Robert offered to drive the man back to 154 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:10,720 the main road but the two men refused and continued on foot. Mind you, this is November in West Virginia 155 00:13:10,720 --> 00:13:17,360 and we all know how cold it gets the second the sun goes down. So why did these men refuse to get 156 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:23,440 in to a track to help them get away from the scene of the burning car? Quicker blows my mind. 157 00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:29,680 However, when Robert told this encounter to the police, he described the men as African American 158 00:13:29,680 --> 00:13:37,280 ages around 19 to 20 years old. Robert described one of the men wearing what he called army pants, 159 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:43,520 army jacket, and his height was around six foot and his complexion was medium and he had a slight 160 00:13:43,520 --> 00:13:51,440 stutter. He also noticed he had a square face diver's watch with a wide band and black boots. 161 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:57,920 But what stood out to him about these boots is that the right boot sole was built up three to 162 00:13:57,920 --> 00:14:03,840 four inches higher than the left boot. Robert described the other man as five foot six inches 163 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:11,120 tall with the stocky build, a leather cap with built in ear muffs, and an afro hairstyle. 164 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:19,040 With the accounts given by the salesman, truck drivers, and Robert, please think that the description 165 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:25,680 of the men seemed to be a perfect match. However, the descriptions of the men were still too vague 166 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:32,400 to release composite sketches. Along with this, police found it hard to put together a perfect 167 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:38,480 timeline of Susie's day. Like we said earlier, Susie was last seen around noon at the Amaco 168 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:46,240 service station in Beaver. Two hours later, Susie's car in a woman thought to be Susie was seen in the 169 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:53,600 Raleigh Mall, Beckley Plaza area of Beckley, roughly six miles away. Side note, like we said in the 170 00:14:53,600 --> 00:15:00,800 episode of Marjorie Dodd, this area has basically not changed and the bank Margie worked at at the time 171 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:06,160 is still in the same area. So it's still exactly just six miles away from the service station. 172 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:13,040 30 minutes later, Susie's vehicle was spotted on Menden Drive near the Concho trash dump from 173 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:18,400 where Susie's car was dumped and where her body was dumped were 10 miles away from each other. 174 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:23,680 I think this is what really stumped police in the investigation. How did they get her 175 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:31,040 car from point A, which would be Menden Drive to point B, which would be Plum Orchard Lake? 176 00:15:31,840 --> 00:15:36,720 To me, if Susie's car was taken to Plum Orchard Lake, people would have saw it. 177 00:15:37,440 --> 00:15:43,760 I mean, Scarborough is a very populated area where houses are all around and to get on the 178 00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:49,600 interstate, you have to go by houses no matter what way you go. The more Susie's friends and 179 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:54,880 families pressed for questions, they began starting to receive threatening phone calls 180 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:59,760 and letters mail to them. The calls and letters basically all carry the same message, 181 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:05,040 leave the matter alone or your younger daughter Sharon's life will be in danger. 182 00:16:06,880 --> 00:16:14,320 With time, this case lost the media intention and fearful for the threats to Sharon, 183 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:22,560 Thelma, Homer, and Bruce stayed as quiet as they could about Susie's case. In July of 1974, 184 00:16:22,560 --> 00:16:30,960 Bruce married Roberta Ayers and became a Methodist minister. And in 1989, when Angela married her 185 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:37,520 husband, Bruce lit a single candle in honor of Susie. Sadly, the investigation into the murder 186 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:46,400 of Patricia Sue Brogan Richmond went cold and has yet to be solved. If you have any information on 187 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:55,680 the murder of Patricia Sue Brogan Richmond, please call Crime Stoppers at 304-255-STOP. 188 00:16:56,720 --> 00:17:03,520 That's 304-255-7867. You can even submit a tip at 189 00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:12,960 www.crimestoppersofrallycounty.com or on the p3 app. You are not required to give your name 190 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:21,440 and are able to submit anonymously. Courtney, do you have any final thoughts on this case? 191 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:34,160 I just felt it's another case that her family was failed. She was failed justice. I mean, I understand 192 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:43,680 that her body was decomposed, but I also still feel at the same time that she could have possibly 193 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:52,880 been sexually assaulted. Even though the medical examiner said no, I just kind of feel that it was 194 00:17:52,880 --> 00:18:01,440 possibility with her clothes and everything up around her neck. And I mean, they would have had 195 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:08,400 to hit a major vein for her to bleed out. And that would be her cause of death. And I feel maybe 196 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:15,360 some strangulation was put in there also too. I do know that a majority of stabbing victims, 197 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:22,960 it is not because they got stabbed to death. It is because there is multiple stab wounds 198 00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:27,920 that causes them to bleed out. And that is actually what their cause of death is, 199 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:37,120 not just single handedly being stabbed. I hate this because her baby was robbed of a mother. 200 00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:47,120 And her husband was robbed of a wife. And her family was robbed of an aunt, 201 00:18:47,120 --> 00:18:58,480 a niece, a sister, cousin, everything. Her family was robbed. And I feel that in a way that 202 00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:03,920 it's a possibility this could be somebody who knew the family for the fact that they were 203 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:12,160 putting threats against her younger sister. Mark, do you have any final thoughts? 204 00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:16,560 I kind of debated on talking about this and I don't think I'll get into it, 205 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:21,360 but there is a rumor around how and about this case. I kind of believe it and I kind of don't. 206 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:26,320 If you know the rumor I'm talking about, you definitely do know what I'm talking about. 207 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:36,320 I still wish they had evidence to do DNA testing on. I wish that they could find the dental plate. 208 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:44,960 I wish they could do DNA on the ring on the... There was a necklace, right? Yes, I wish they 209 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:53,120 could find the necklace. And I never knew this until really going into this case that I'm actually 210 00:19:53,120 --> 00:19:58,640 related to one of the men who found her body. I've never really been out to Plum Orchard 211 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:04,960 rather than one time and I never knew about this case. I do know it's secluded. So it's 212 00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:10,640 literally just like a happenstance that they found her, I believe. Like you, I do kind of 213 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:18,640 worried about the sexual assault aspect of this case and to me you would have to be strangled with 214 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:26,000 all of that stuff wrapped around your neck. And you know, I know, which I don't think we left in 215 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:30,480 this case, but there were different license plates. There was a license plate in the back of the car. 216 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:36,640 So that kind of leads to the rumor of it not being her vehicle that she kind of just slapped 217 00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:43,440 her license plate on it because she had a bug and it might have been the same color and such. 218 00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:51,680 Can I say something? My very first car was a 1969 Volkswagen Beetle. It was my very first car. 219 00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:58,080 And the way that the one man described how they were sitting in that car, 220 00:20:59,360 --> 00:21:05,600 there is no bench seat in that front seat. See, I always wondered if she could just been in like 221 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:11,120 the back seat. She would have been in the center back for it to have appeared that way. That's 222 00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:17,200 the only thing I could think of. Because in my bag, it was the driver's seat, your clutch, 223 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:26,080 well, your stick shift was in the middle and then your passenger seat. Yeah. And then you had a bench 224 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:31,360 seat in the back. Yeah, to me, she would have had to been in the back. Yeah, that's the only way possible. 225 00:21:31,360 --> 00:21:42,000 There was also in other reports, Burry Mountain Road. There is no way that they could have went 226 00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:51,520 from Murphy Mart where like Elder Bearman and all that stuff was to Thurman, 227 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:58,720 get up on Burry Mountain Road or no, it would have been they would have had they would have had 228 00:21:58,720 --> 00:22:10,000 to drive through Beckley, go through Stanford, go past Prince and loop cut up, go by houses and get on 229 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:18,800 Burry Mountain Road, which took me and Courtney actually did this during the break. It was 230 00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:28,880 October of last year. We done it. I wasn't. I'm happy you remember. So it took us two hours, 231 00:22:30,080 --> 00:22:36,080 no cell phone service. We kind of had a guess what way to go at one point. 232 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:44,960 And we were kind of shocked where we like popped out at. So to me, Burry Mountain Road just 233 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:53,280 has never been a factor in this to me. They went down through Mount Hope through 234 00:22:55,600 --> 00:23:04,800 wherever to get to Palomortr Lake. They killed her and then went to Menden, burned the car to try 235 00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:11,760 to get rid of evidence at the Contra Dump. And technically, they were kind of caught in a way. 236 00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:20,000 And the reason why we feel like Burry Mountain doesn't pay much of any aspect. It just it doesn't 237 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:29,600 add up. There is no way you would have to be the most skill driver to get down that road. There's 238 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:34,720 no way somebody could have been flying down that road, especially with cold trucks, because that 239 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:42,320 road is so small. It's very narrow. There was only two other vehicles on that day on the road that 240 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:47,760 day. And we passed one and I'm like Courtney, I don't think we can do this. She's like, you got it. 241 00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:55,200 You got it. And luckily we did get it. And I mean, the road is very well graveled. So I don't know 242 00:23:55,200 --> 00:24:00,480 how it would have been back in the day. I figured it would have been good from cold trucks and stuff 243 00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:06,320 being on. I feel it would have been like if it was graveled where the cold trucks had traveled 244 00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:12,000 over it, it would have packed down like any other gravel road. So possibly that could have given them 245 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:16,880 a little bit of speed, but even at the same aspect, I don't see them being able to fly around through 246 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:24,640 there, especially with cold trucks. Me neither. Because I mean, if you drove like cut off one of 247 00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:31,120 those cold trucks and they went off that hill, they would be over the mountain. They would go 248 00:24:31,120 --> 00:24:38,000 into Thurman, like into houses, into the train depot, all of this. So I mean, it really makes no sense. 249 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:46,720 Stay tuned for the next episode where we are going to tell you about the case of the socialite 250 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:52,320 from Charleston, West Virginia. If you find yourself enjoying Mountain State mysteries, 251 00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:57,840 take a second to follow and rate it on your favorite podcast platform. It helps others 252 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:04,560 find good West Virginia true crime podcasts. Don't forget to follow us on Instagram, Facebook, 253 00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:09,840 and TikTok. I'll add Mountain State Mysteries. Do you have a case you want us to cover? 254 00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:18,960 Send us an email at MountainStateMysteries304 at gmail.com. For the show notes, check out our 255 00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:24,560 website, MountStateMysteriesPodcast.com.