Hi Folks, it’s WellRead.

Before we begin episode 4, we wanted to give you all a trigger warning: this episode contains discussions of self-harm and suicide. This part of the discussion happens between 11 minutes and 24 minutes. Feel free to skip this bit if you want or need to.

If you or someone you love is experiencing these kinds of feelings, please call 988 for the US National Suicide hotline, text 678678 to speak with the Trevor Project Suicide Assistance, speak with a healthcare professional, or tell someone you trust.

You are loved. You are valuable. The world is better for you being in it.

Thank you.

Welcome back to Sensibility and Chaos, where logic meets emotions, and we all collectively forget what we were talking about mid-sentence.

I'm WellRead, your go-to for obscure knowledge deep opinions, and the occasional literary tangent.

I'm Busy, here to bring the emotions to the chat.

And I'm Tall Girl, your expert in sarcasm, unnecessary observations, and committing to bit humor like it's my full-time job.

Every episode, we take on the absurdity of modern life. From the tiny social mysteries to the things that make us all go.

To the things that make us all go Wait, why did we do that?

It's like a late night group chat, but with slightly better audio and fewer typos.

So settle in, grab your favorite drink, and let's dive into the chaos.

Sensibly, of course.

All right. We are in episode four and today's topic are when sensibility meets chaos and ways to stay grounded when life gets wild and out of control.

Or not at all.

I'm basically an expert.

We don't know anything like that, do we?

I'm cool as a cucumber. So this is going to be an episode totally run by you. I've never had a freak out ever.

Oh, that's wonderful.

You got to lie to your listeners every once in a while.

Until we're sponsored by some kind of like antidepressant Yeah, whatever.

Yep.

Yeah, it gives them reasons to come back.

All right. So I think one of the ways grounding I'll start us off. So I think one of the good ones is knowing when your life is spiraling your contacts quick and easy to go to.

And not only knowing who you have as contacts to go to, but what type of person you need in the moment.

I think Red has taught this to me and I've implemented it outside of our friends and all that But understanding sometimes when understanding when I go to a certain friend, am I going to vent? Am I going to get feedback?

Or am I going… for the hard truths.

No, it's difficult to know, especially when you're in the middle of a crisis.

And that sometimes helps get me grounded.

What you need. So knowing… who you most want to talk to in that moment.

Can give you a direction on what you need. In the middle of your crisis i think that knowing who to call is really important.

To stay grounded. And I think that it's also important to listen to your instincts.

You know the first the first phone call you make is typically the right one to have made.

Except if you're drunk dialing your boyfriend, don't do that. Ex-boyfriend, don't do that.

Don't do that ever. Yes.

That's why you take their numbers out of your phone. I don't understand why some people leave it like Dave the ex. No, no, that leads to bad things. Delete.

Oh, 100%.

I am the opposite of you guys. I know they say this is a trauma response, but honestly, I don't think it is.

No, they could burn.

I need to figure it out for myself first. Like, what do I want to do about this? And then I will listen to other people It's not that I don't want to hear from other people, but what do I want to do about this?

Like, how do I want to handle this? And then I will come to you guys and I'll be like, hey.

And like there's a body. There's a body. What should I do? Like in my head, I don't want to go to jail. I have figured out for me in that moment

Does this make sense?

Why are we going? Wait, why are we jumping to there's a body like what are you trying to like

We're from Jersey. Come on. Like at some point we had to own up to this.

Hyperbole. It's fun.

Let's not… Yes, but that's like one of those stereotypes I can't stand.

Oh, I absolutely would. I'm just saying that I wouldn't I don't feel like we need to constantly bring up like we're taking out people Okay.

You're saying you wouldn't bury a body for me?

Okay. It's because we never would.

There are things that will blow up with friendship. There are mistakes for whatever. There's like, whoops, I just drove my car through my garage like The body thing will never happen. So it's the example. I'm like, there will never be a body.

There will never be a body or maybe I'm just very good at watching CSI episodes and disintegrating DNA. Who knows?

But there's like in the moment, it's like, what do I want to do about this? Like if I am having a complete meltdown at work unrelated to death and homicide.

Like, do I want to quit my job? Do I want to sue my employer or do I just want to like go start my own company and like, you know.

Make margaritas on the beach. Like, am I just done here When I figure out how I want to handle that, I will then tend to go to people and be like, okay, here's the situation.

Here's what I think in my core I want to do. Now I am willing to hear from you what like your feed might be. You could change my mind.

But I don't like going to people until I have it settled in my mind.

Like, what do I think I want to do or like Do I want to blow up my career at this moment or do I just need your professional feedback on like how not to blow up my career at this moment?

I think that's…

I think that is a bit of… I don't know if this is trauma sense, like you've had something happen to you, but I think it's part of your you are very independent.

In a lot of ways and you are very take charge So I think that is just your natural It's how you approach everything else in life. So I don't see why it would be any different for a moment when

Life is spiraling. That it's just your natural response.

I mean, emotional maturity can come out of trauma response if you you know.

To life in general. And then…

Work at it hard enough and i think that it may have started off as trauma response.

But it can also be a sign of like I said, emotional maturity. You have the ability to sit down and figure out logically what is logically what your next step in any given situation.

But it's not necessarily born out of something that you know was hurtful to you or whatever

I will say over the years, I have gotten better about who I will talk to like there are certain people like I am friends with a bunch of teachers going to them about a work situation they're like, you know, whatever, there was a blow up at work. Like you get flown across the country. I'm like, that's not the point.

I need you to focus on the fact that, like… There was no body in the hotel room.

I get what the body is. Listeners, there are no bodies.

No, but like there are times when one of our friends is a teacher and it's like, I am trying to explain to her like a work trauma situation. Like, I don't know what to do or like this is really killing me.

And it's like, they're like, but you get catered lunch. And I'm like.

Forest for the trees. I might not have a job in three weeks.

Like, I know as a teacher you don't get catered lunches, but could you please skip over that?

Like, it was just like the meeting got interrupted. The caterer walked in. This was a side conversation so like giving them context to the story And they're like catering.

So like for work things, I tend to, I have this years ago, I went to this business thing and like we created this accountability group. So like.

Right.

It's other women in business and we kind of talk to each other about business stuff because we're all kind of in marketing. So like there's a understanding of the underlying kind of like situation.

So when it's like, oh, you know, I launched a bad campaign And it's spiraling and like social media hates us I can shortcut that. I don't have to explain that side of it.

Of course.

But when it's more like emotional and I text you guys and I'm like, panic level 11.

Right.

Like full on busy, like crying level six level Like, I will give you where I am and then what my situation is. But generally, it's like I think I've gotten better at going to the person that I think would give me what I need to hear.

Is I know I can go to certain people and be like, oh, let's hug. And I'm like.

Yeah.

No, no, my entire career might blow up right now. I need this. I don't need… I don't need that. You can hug me later. Right now, I need to like

We need actionable items.

I need to formulate a plan. Let's talk this out who can help do that with me.

Yeah.

I've gotten really good because I've gotten really good I am the first phone call for several people.

At asking, what do you need from me right now? Do you need me to tell you the hard truth? Do you need me to hug you? Do you need me to just listen to you? What do you need?

So that I can better then give them actionable items.

Either this point or later point.

And just, I think sometimes because sometimes Let's say at the moment you are being me just listening person does not mean at a later point when that person is ready to hear the hard truths?

Yeah.

Or you think like it's they've calmed down. Sometimes someone comes to us and they're upset and then now is not the time to be like.

In a better spot.

You know this is where you could have done better or what you did wrong. That's not the time. But maybe a couple of days later when things have calmed down You can say, hey, I want to just bring this up. And so it's also knowing not only who to go to and what you need me to be.

But when do I need to be that type of friend at what time.

I also think it's also When things are going out of control, try to be accountable.

Yep.

With people. And… Oh, yeah, absolutely.

Unaccountable to yourself. This is a big thing.

Yep. And I think that's even if it's outside your norm. So a couple of my friends and i we have our chat about many things.

A couple of us were all of us were actually trying to get into better health habits.

So, you know, we'll say, hey, you know, a couple times during the week, this week so far.

For the two of them, they are not big water drinkers where that's pretty much all I drink and so They always love to tease me. I am drinking water. I am making the effort. But we try to hold each other accountable.

So that we don't spiral out of control. And we also give grace we'll say, listen, I did not get to do the, I wanted to work out three times this week. I only got the two this is why and this is how i'm going to

Change it next week. I think also when we're having moments that are really rough, including I would say depressive moments. And I mean, I had I am I had one of those this year, you know, a couple months ago

Where I had a day and it was a really just mentally bad headspace And it was moments of thoughts that I haven't had since I was like a teenager. But to me, that it is so outside of my norm.

That and haven't been someone who always is tell my friends, whatever you are going through mentally you have that safe space with me.

I needed to, if I want to promote that to my friends, I needed to be accountable for myself. So I said to That same day, I spoke to one person I think you were Maybe out of country and Red was on a work trip. I forget what it was.

And the next day I'll fill people in and I said, hey.

Just to be accountable, this is what happened. This is what I was feeling.

This is, you know, it's nothing to be worried about it was just a bad headspace day But I just wanted to be accountable to myself and to you because I ask you to do the same to me.

So it's a way to, I think, continue to build a friendship and foundation.

Yeah, knowing that knowing knowing what you're going through.

Is half of the battle, like identifying why you're feeling what you're feeling and being able to convert those thoughts into actions saying, okay, I'm feeling, you know, I've had an intrusive thought For those of you who are listening and don't know what an intrusive thought is.

Typically something that is typically Out of nowhere.

And it can be violent toward yourself or others.

And it makes you… feel as though you are as you are not in control.

Is really what it comes down to with an intrusive thought. So when you're having those and being able to effectively pull apart your emotions and emotions say, yes, this is why I'm feeling this particular or this is why I've had this particular thought and then

Knowing what you need to do to counteract that. Is a big part of staying grounded when life gets crazy.

You have thoughts. I can see them formulating. I can see talls thoughts formulating.

Yeah. I have what?

No, actually… So when… busy told me.

I've never had that thought. And my biggest Okay, one, I was like, have I ever? And then I went on like an existential crisis of like, why haven't I?

That doesn't surprise me.

Like, why is it everybody else gets to feel feelings and I don't?

But then I was like. Am i like had she called me on the day What I've been able to do something or if she hadn't mentioned it, would I have picked up on it?

Like it was more that I would fail as a friend had you called me on the day And not a week later. Like a week later, I can just be like, oh, Lo siento. Like.

Hmm.

But, like… Years ago, somebody I went to school with was like, after school, I drove her to like taekwondo so she could like learn to kick her bully's asses Like years later, she was like, you know, that's like the reason I didn't like off myself like

I don't know if you know that. And then I had it with a few other people who were like, this thing that you did that I'm like, I don't even remember.

They were like, that's the reason I didn't or that was the day I was thinking about and I didn't.

And I was like, I never caught it. Or I never realized it at the time that that's where you were.

And I worry that if Busy had called and just been like, today's a bad day, I wouldn't have recognized what today is a bad day meant for her.

So I had more of a freak out about like what to do when your friend is thinking about veering into traffic like I had more of a crisis reacting to it than like, oh, great. She would tell me. I would be like, of course she would tell me when she was comfortable, she would tell me. And if she never was, she never would.

Yeah.

But I was more like, I don't know if I would have had the tools to deal with it. And I like you I think you told me like in the front yard or in my driveway or something, you drove away and then I spent like six hours Googling

I love to just send you down a spiral. You're welcome.

Now, and I think the thing was with the So when it happened and it was so weird because I have not had any kind of intrusive thought in that way. And I think intrusive doesn't only just mean when you're going to

Listen.

You're thinking of harm or something of that nature. It could be just a completely dark thought about yourself or your view of yourself.

I, of course, have had moments where I'm like, oh my God, I'm the worst person. Like that stuff, of course. We're human.

But the way this hit me, because I don't normally have the intrusive thoughts.

And I haven't had one of these since I was a teenager going through my parents divorce.

And that is like, oh, okay. And I had two in the same day.

And it was just, I was like, and I don't even know what happened. The weird thing was, it was just the day I woke up and it was, that's how it was. And then the next day I woke up and I was completely fine feeling.

But I know people who have people who have I have walked people through moments when they're like, I need you on the phone now to talk Or things might happen. I've been on the phone and people have talked about, thought about it and that happened.

Processes.

So I'm so i'm comfortable being in that environment to listen to others I don't want people to think that I'm perfect or anything of that nature, that it can happen at any time randomly Even someone who does not deal with depression

Or treat depression or anything or anxiety of that nature, it can still just happen.

And that's why And all the people who I spoke to that night.

Like the first thing was, do I need to get you help? I said, nope.

It happened earlier today. Since then, I've calmed down.

I am fine. These were the thoughts. This is what I thought afterwards.

But I wanted you to be aware of it. And the person I talked to unfortunately is familiar with people who have been in the same mindset set and taken those steps to act on it. And so I said, no, I'm fine. This is where we are. When the conversation happened, by the end, we were joking.

Because we are both very comfortable with dark humor. Same thing the next day I told Wright, I told a couple of other people and it was in a, hey, I'm being accountable.

And they were like, all right. And they said, is there anything we need to be? All the same thing. Do I need to help you with anything? Nope.

I actually woke up fine and i actually woke up and That I think… Even when I wasn't feeling the best in those moments, being able to say that to knowing I had those people.

Knowing how grateful I am that I have people who I could say this to And even if there was something really bad in that moment.

Could have said, hey, I need you on the phone now.

And that we've talked about things in other and we have people who are in the mental health field who i could have said What do I need to do at this moment? Even if it's not my normal MO, what do I need to do?

So I knew just having support system was enough.

To also ground me in the moment. Maybe not the exact moment afterwards of just being like okay you have these people.

You need to let them know. So that it doesn't come up later.

And it might seem like it's a bigger thing than what it was.

Yeah, vocalizing is a big part of my therapy works Because… you know half the battle is being able to pull apart what you're feeling in the moment. The other half of the battle is being able to say hey I am feeling this way and this is what I need as a result of that.

And I think that just helps the ground too.

Which I know. All of us have struggled with.

At some point or another. Being able to say this is what I need.

In the moment doesn't come naturally doesn't come naturally any of the three of us, and I'm sure it doesn't come naturally for any of the people in our audience either.

It's one of those things about being independent and independent hyper independent at some points of our lives that we just have difficulty vocalizing but i I think vocalization is the other half of the battle and knowing, again, knowing who you can go to, who you can't go to things like that.

I will say for the friends I have who've had addiction issues, a lot of the time a call when they're like, I need a distraction. I need you to not talk about this.

But like… distract me and make me laugh or tell me it's not going to be so bad so I don't do this shot so we don't whatever, like, you know, or they'll call and they'll be like, let's go to a bar. And I'm like

No, we're not going to the bar, but let's go to the pottery place and paint ceramics kind of thing.

Yeah, because sometimes maybe it's not, you know, an interest thought. Sometimes it's maybe just, you know.

Someone is trying to get their lives in order. And it's a simple thing that maybe like so drinking, maybe they're not an alcoholic, but they're just trying to cut back And so, you know, you saying you No, let's not go to the bar. Let's do something else is trying to support

Them in choices they've made outside of the moment. And being supportive in that way.

I will say I also get people like calls from people who are like, okay, so just tell me it's not going to be that bad. And I was like, it's not.

Yeah.

Like we're going to get through this kind of thing like I don't think I'm the most optimistic person, but people are like okay just I'm going to call you and you're going to tell me like the world isn't ending. And I'm like, of course the world isn't ending. Like, no, we have work tomorrow. Like, you know.

It feels weird, but I'm that person who's like, yes, then the sun will rise and the sun will set and tomorrow will just be another day kind of thing. And I I tend to be that call. So I'm like, oh, okay.

Oddly enough for some friends, I'm also the call that's like, oh, God, why isn't the world ending? On the flip side, I could, you know.

Interesting.

With the right person in the right moment. It's like, oh no, we have to work and wake up again tomorrow.

Damn.

That is true. It will be quick and painless.

I'm the one who makes jokes about living in the blast radius you know

But I will.

But I also… Well, break out your launcher.

Now, our one mutual friend, we were joking that Where he lives, he's outside enough. If there was ever a blast zone, he goes, look, I not only have to see all of you disintegrate, but like half my face would melt off and then eyeballs popping out and I go through life like that.

Won't even know what happened.

That's where that dark humor comes in. Hey, listen, we made it to episode four before we started to show our dark side. I'm you know Good on us. That was impressive.

Right.

I was like, we should probably start with a small trigger warning. Like we might need to put an audio clip in the beginning.

Oh, yeah. I was thinking about that earlier. I was thinking about that earlier. Put a GW on arm

That is true.

Welcome to episode four, Sorrow.

And I'm like, this is like when you feel bad because you're not spicy and you're just like, but I want to live in the spicy people world. I am on the other side. Like, why can't I have an intrusive thought? Like, why do you… Why can't I be part of the cool club?

It got dark.

Yeah. Yeah. It's a weird thought.

So what are some of the other ways that when your lives are spiraling or you're trying to find grounding in your life Brett, how about you?

I'm big on Somatic therapy.

Learning to read your body's responses to trauma or anxiety or depression or any of the various things and then using like deep breathing techniques or stretching techniques to help get out of whatever it is you're feeling in the moment.

I'm also really big being comfortable in my own solitude.

Yes. That is a glorious thing.

I think that's something that is deeply underrated and unfortunately not everybody can have access to like we've talked about the fact that we all have friends with multiple children and children their everyday lives are very different from ours being on your own is something that is

So glorious, especially when you can just sit with yourself and not have any particular thoughts.

Just being able to sit in crisscross applesauce position and not think.

And even if that's not even if that's I think also solitude can be where you need it to be so knowing yourself to know that it's just sitting in your room or your house or your apartment by yourself with maybe some like relax and chill music.

Is something that is highly underrated.

Or maybe it is you know you're if you're a nature person and you go hiking or you go for walks just in the local parks If you have access to that, you know, sometimes you know for me the other day.

I was trying to, I realized this midway as I was talking to Red here, as I was saying, like I was messaging her about, I was looking for a recipe to make like a yellow or a white cake that did not require butter from scratch.

And I don't know why I was hung up on not wanting to use buttark. I think because I would have to take it out of the freezer.

And let it defrost. And I just was like, I just wanted a cake with oil.

And then I realized midway, I was like, you know what, I'm just doing this because I'm looking to channel cooking and baking for me is one of my grounding.

Yeah, it just makes it just, it calms And it like soothed me. So I think that's also like, oh, I'm trying to use this as a way to get around something else I'm dealing with. And then I was able to redirect myself and be like, all right

We'll do that on the weekend. We'll make a cake. We'll figure it out.

Like get back to where you need to be going.

As much as I hated it as a kid. Like my hippie dippy parents in the meditation stuff and like It really sets you up as an adult when people are like, oh, I need to learn to meditate. I'm like, what do you mean, you just like

How do you like, I was like, oh, right. Because I got taught this when I was tiny. Like the visualization and the meditation after a lifetime of practice, it just becomes second. Like, how do you handle stress i'm like

I use visualization techniques and I'm done with it in like 10 minutes but I'm also designed that I don't hold it for very long. So like whatever my build is like I have anxiety. I deal with anxiety. And then I'm kind of like.

Cool. I'm kind of over this for me to like hold on to it long term. It really has to be bad. Most of the time. I'm like, okay, we're good. You know, like.

I think that's you in general. You tend to like, there are things you will hold on to.

Let it go.

If you manage to hit the list of like, I'm holding on to it.

But I think Red and I are more likely to hold on to things Whether… Yeah, I will be dead still holding on to things. I think that is part and that's not only just like anxiety it's being mad at someone. I mean, I think we moved past it, so it's not in our daily life, but it's still

We know that.

We keep receipts for receipts generations.

Correct.

Like we can recall that at any moment and be like, oh, wait a minute, let's talk about this And that's where you are able to process address it, process, move on, and keep going.

Which is i like i'm jealous of like, what's it the clampets and the whatever the family in Tennessee that feuded for like decades Like, I am so jealous that I want that passionate loathing of an entire generation. I'm like, that must feel so satisfying to just like constantly be able to pick at it and like, you know, like.

Oh.

Oh, the Hatfields and the McCoys.

I have nothing better to do today. I shall rage. And I'm like I feel maladjusted because I'm like rage lasts like no more like In a relationship, I will have a fight And then like, okay, we had our fight. And it's usually not a fight. It's like a conversation followed by like a little bit more like

It's not, though. It's not, though.

I don't tend to yell. I have given you a lot of ample warning before yelling.

Like you saw it. I think you've always been a little scared about like how I end things and then you saw real time when I gave somebody like very clear three warnings of like Don't do it. Don't do it again. Like this is your last warning. You do this thing one more time and we are forever done. And that's it. But like.

I give you very clear, like I don't play games and I don't like subtle and like, oh, they didn't read the room. I'm like, no, I put up a neon sign that says like last chance.

Seriously, last chance. But then like, I'm so done with you.

After that, I'm so done. Like, I'm no longer angry about it. It's more just like it's a thing that happened and it processed, but like, oh, to be able to sit on multi-generational, like, I shall rage I feel like it would be so fun.

Yeah.

It's not. It's not.

I know, but it's like you want what you don't have. Like, I want your hair so bad. And then like the first time it took me six hours to dry my hair, I'd probably lose it and just buzz it off.

It's not.

But you want what you can't have. And I'm like, I want trauma and I want rage and I want intrusive thoughts and I want to feel the feelings. I want to live out my like rom-com moment of sorrow.

Yes, 100%.

Absolutely.

People like you're not upset about a breakup. I'm like. No. Honestly?

And see. I had a year ago, I had a surgery and for the first couple of weeks It was kind of weird because where most people you should be feeling pain While there was some soreness, of course, I did not have any of the pain

I'm done. I was done.

The surgery was on a Friday by mid-afternoon Sunday. I was done taking the prescribed pain pills because I wasn't feeling anything to the point that people were concerned.

But for those couple days and like a week and a half where I wasn't overly emotional.

People were sending me things and I wasn't like crying or feeling like all like, I was like, is this what everyone else gets to have in their normal daily? Like people who don't get overly emotional And let me rephrase that people who don't

Express emotion to the level I do. I mean, because people do feel that they just may not express it the way I do. And I was like, oh my God, do you know how much time I could save?

With not having to feel all the time to the level that I feel.

With the emotions that I feel. My God.

Do you remember like two months ago, I hormonally went off track and I became you for like three days Any TikTok that remotely involved romance or like kindness or animals I sobbed and I didn't know how to like live with myself. I was like, this is

Or an animal.

How do you know how Like I was, I couldn't understand There was a cup Oh.

I have also asked her how she deals with this because I have gone through moments of that myself.

I don't have this many tears. I've used up my yearly quota in two hours. I don't How do you just not have stock in Kleenex? Like, how are you doing this? No wonder you need to keep on water.

Yeah.

I'm going to start texting you daily. Are you hydrated enough? How many times have you teared up?

Or you are hydrating enough for your crying? And it's not like… And it's not only the crying sometimes, it's just sitting there in the emotion and just like feeling just and I'm just like, oh my God, it was so wonderful. I'm like, oh my God, I can move about my day. Look at

I'm overly hydrated and I don't need it. Like, let me give you some of my hydration.

Look at how much more time I have to do other things.

I will say, though, we went to some, what was it the organist over at the church in like prince I remember like we were sitting in the pew and I remember looking at you at some point and you were just having such joy listening to this piece. Like, I think it's the piece that she had played that you were familiar with.

Yes.

You just had this like elated joy on you. Like you were feeling it. And I was like.

Oh, if you could bottle that right there, that's what your bliss looks like. You are just so happy, but like your entire body was radiating like this is my happy.

I think it's Anna Lapwood. She's an organist from England and she was doing a tour and I did not know I was going to get into organ music.

But she placed such beautiful piece. And I just sat there and it was absolute heaven here in her play in this on this organ and it was just like, you could feel the passion So it's not always crying. It could be just

No, it's like a core memory in my head of you. And I was like, I kind of felt awkward because at a certain point I stopped watching her and I'm just dead staring at you and I'm like.

It could be anything but it could be anything

This is an awkward moment in our friendship. Like this is getting creepy. And if I heavy breathe right now, it's like over Because you were like in the organ zone that i was like I didn't even know you liked orchid music when you texted me. I'm like…

I didn't even notice.

A concert in a church of 14th century music? Of course I'm there but like you were so blissed out. I was just like, oh, my God.

He didn't know me. I didn't know I like it.

She was doing a lot of pieces with, oh, Hans Zimmerman. Hans Zimmer? Zimmer.

And it was just it was just so good when you have some any kind of music, when you hear something that just moves you like that and you're just like, oh.

Hans Zimmer.

But yeah. I know. I'm learning that.

Yeah, but you have to understand that not everybody gets there The fact that you feel as deeply as you do is something that most people have to learn.

I have them for everyone. My cup runneth over.

Because we're taught to suppress our emotions.

And they're fun when they turn to rage. It's not often.

You do.

But your rage is kind of adorable. Like, I know you think it is, but your age is kind of adorable.

But you've both seen it.

It is kind of cute.

Why is it a door? I was shaking. So hold on both please let's explain. It was the same situation that Paul is talking about where she gave the clear one, two, three, we're done. This is the same situation.

I just, I know, but something about it just…

And it was the same Time.

And the people had also annoyed Red and I, but to the point that I was beyond.

Oh. You were vibrating like physically like it could have shown on a Richter scale.

You were vibrating.

I am, for the audience at home, I am very quick to anger It's one of my go-to emotions.

My whole body is shaken.

Especially when someone that I care about has been wronged. She, Busy was so busy enraged. I was calm.

And when we've told our friends like, Red was calm.

I - Yes, I like I managed to keep it level.

Oh.

And not freak out on people I could see what was happening with these two. And I understood that if I was not calm.

The whole room was going to go up in flames. Not figuratively. It was going to be literal flames.

One of us had to be grounded. And it sure as hell was not me or at all.

We were in we were in We were in the kitchen close to knives. Thank the Lord none of those knives have been sharpened since 1982. So you couldn't have done damage if you wanted to, but like Don't piss you off in a kitchen ever. But I was like, oh.

Yeah.

My rage will come quicker when it has to do with people Not so much if someone's doing to me it can.

Yeah.

But if it is happening to people who I love, I will get to that level quicker.

And people were clearly disrespecting you and being rude and you had set boundaries and And that is when that's when my body started to that you had to get me out of the house because my whole body was vibrating with rage.

Uh-huh. And it took you… Like, I think it was like, what, a half hour drive into town like you were still just as mad when we were like Let's have some sake and like maybe stop at a bar on the way home and like touch rocks and

And that is not even an exaggeration.

Yep, got to go. Mm-hmm.

Collect pebbles on the lake shore front before we go back.

Look, a river. Let's go stand in it. And that's what we actually do.

I'm not even making any of this up. We literally found a river and it was shallow because it hadn't had a lot of rain that's that winter. And so you could walk on the pebbles and we had flip-flops on and we took the flip flops off and we were in the side of a river and randomly.

Are you really? But, like…

But it's also like, I think we are all three very aware of like our comforts and like you know, wubbie kind of things like these are the things to do, to have, to wear, to eat to like chill out to like calm down like

And that's just how we grounded ourselves.

I don't think everybody has that. Like, I'm raging and I don't know what to do. I'm like, you don't have a playlist?

Yes.

Like, I can tell you six pieces of music that are on like a rage playlist. And then we step down to like soothing classical music so I don't kill people. And then there's like soft and melodic, let's meditate now like that's

Yeah.

I have a playlist very much dedicated to like And we're progressing down in 18 easy minutes.

That's your step down.

I think it's a lot easier Because of how we're socialized for women to recognize those things but for our male listeners if we have any.

It can be a little bit more difficult, again, because we're taught to suppress. We're taught to not, I'm not saying we as I am a man i'm not But culturally as a society we are taught not to acknowledge.

Emotion. And not to… use it.

So a lot of the time where it can be easier for those of us who are

Socialized female to be in touch with our emotions. It can be tougher for those of us who are socialized male to do so.

I will say i do have… No, but like guys who are like, go hit it or like pump iron or like go pew pew something like it must be so nice to just be like, I punched something three times. I over it like

So yeah, not everybody has a playlist.

I've had moments it's been like, all right, I need to go work out because I need that Sometimes the anger or the feeling or whatever it is, is I need to have that physical tire.

Oh, the satisfaction.

And for me, like some people, when they work out, they get that endorphin and they get the boost and like all excited for me.

I've always been one of those people And I've always liked, well, I will do it different times a day now. For a while, I used to do it towards the end of the night because it relaxes me.

I swear that's a lie. I swear that's a lie.

Because it lets me work out the energy and the energy to put into the emotions or whatever I'm feeling or thinking. And it just brings a level of relax to me.

And that's why I didn't like doing it in the morning because then I'm like so chill like I could pretty much go to sleep again. And that's not what I want to do I found ways of doing it differently

I could see how that is for different people or like you said, you have a comm playlist When I have those moments and sometimes if i'm at one of your houses and you know we tend to text when we're home and whatnot

I'll say, hey, I'm going driving after this, usually if it's at night.

Because sometimes you just need nighttime, not a lot of people on the road.

And a playlist of driving music. And just that just clear your mind. Go as high, you know, wherever you're going on the highway and I will just go up to a certain point.

Until I get in certain songs where i feel like I've released whatever I needed to.

And then do a UI and head home. And I'm like, hey, I'm home, went driving.

Okay. Just so that, you know. Not worrying that something's happened But that's another way of like with where I ground is like going out and just driving in with music

Yeah, I don't drive so much as I listen to music.

I am fairly new to driving. So I don't use that as a go-to getaway Typically when i need to escape i will just put music on really really loudly and clean I will scrub a counter or some baseboards or whatever um

Especially if I am rage filled, I can take it out on the dishwasher easier than I would take it out on other people.

Especially while driving. So I choose to keep that.

At home where not a lot of people are going to see it. But I think another good way of grounding yourself is taking care of your space. We've talked about this before like Cleaning, yeah.

Cleaning. And sometimes Because I've noticed I think it was this week and I said to you, I'm like, hey, I was on a call dealing with something and while that call was happening, I just sat here and cleared off my desk because it was just

Mm-hmm.

Making space for yourself.

There are post-its. There's just random things and I hadn't done that like in a bit. And I was like, you know what? I just took the time and it wasn't perfect But it was cleared up a lot of the clutter. And I think sometimes

Cleaning is a way also to help You know, obviously smarter people than me could say how when your space reflects your mental space So I think when I, it doesn't always for me, there's not always a correlation. But at that moment I was like, you know what, let me just clean this up and it helped keep

I felt a little more, okay, I have space to do what I need to And things may feel more focused.

So I could see where the rage cleaning helps keep one grounded.

It's also an easy win like this thing is difficult but like cleaning my desk in comparison is like okay, you know, if I can conquer this, I can conquer bigger things.

Yeah.

Yeah, no, that's 100%. I could, if I do, excuse me, if I do this one little thing and accomplish that.

I might not be able to control these other things that I'm working on.

And that are outside of my control, but at least I feel accomplished and I've contributed to something progressing in my life.

And, you know, for those depressive days that we've talked about a little bit earlier the active achieving something.

You know even even if it's a bare minimum moment the active, okay, I showered today or i you know put the put the laundry away Or I didn't clean the whole kitchen, but I did clean this one counter.

Those little things can add up to a lot, especially if you're going through something.

Right.

Yeah, and I think that there are different people do different things. We both talked about using apps A couple people I know, a couple people you know.

Had turn to using these apps where they help you either you tell them what tasks you need to do and around what time. And it gives you a gentle nudge of like, hey, like.

This is time for you to clean the kitchen or whatever it might be.

And sometimes it also, I think the one you've referred to can also help generate if you say, I want to clean my room, but I don't have a list of what needs to be done and it could generate the list

Yeah. That's Goblin AI for those of you who are listening at home.

And so I think… What was that?

Goblin AI, goblin.ai. It's an automatic task generator.

And so those are things that are so using tools to help keep us on track that ultimately help keep you grounded and when things get overwhelmed, it's like, where do I go next And… Hello?

Yep. There's also If I'm remembering correctly, let me look on my phone. Finch.

Finch is another good one. It's a self-care app, but you take care of like it's a Tamagotchi for your phone For those of you who remember Tamagoti's They were pretty popular a couple of years ago everybody should know what a tamagati is but um

They're popular now. I've been giving them to my godchildren for like the last two or three years. They're back like the we're not that old. They exist now.

Nice. Yeah, I know. That's true.

But yeah, but yeah it's basically like a Tamagotchi for your phone. You take care of a hatchling bird and you feed it and you care for it and you are encouraged to do those same things for yourself. So that's another one that

Another tool that can be really useful. We are having a bad day.

We're just trying to find like help yourself create the habits help find you know.

In the storm of, you know, in the chaos as we're saying helps to help ground you and help healthy habits and know what works.

Yeah.

I know a lot of people like calm the calm app It helps you through deep breathing and meditation and stuff like that.

I've seen it. I've never used it.

It's a little bit of ASMR, which I love. I love ASMR.

I listen to it every night before I go to bed.

I don't get it. I desperately want the chills up and down my spine like it just it must be so magical.

I don't either.

I have a friend who when we go to like a concert and the organ hits a certain part She says she feels it up and down her spine. It feels like somebody's tickling her. And I'm like.

Why don't they have all these cool things that everybody else has?

Oh, yeah. It's called Frisian.

Now, I will have that with certain music. If I hear a certain note or certain tone of singers usually male singers with lower voice ranges Or certainly.

Registers?

What? Can you prank?

Let's not talk about our fantasies.

Okay. But there are certain times like music like that or a certain instrument. I guess like with the organ when she was playing and it will like my whole body will break out into chills and all. So I will have that, but the ASMR does not do it for me.

I think it's why I like metal and trance because the music is so loud it physically vibrates your body. Like if you go to the concerts.

You like it interrupts almost your heartbeat because the bass of the music itself is like pounding on your like sternum.

Hmm.

Like that but i've never felt the chills. It must be so awesome, but I wish I could because i watched the people Like the nails and the clickety clickety like

Really? With all the music you'll listen to? Now, that doesn't do anything for me.

It can be a lot of different things. It can be the crunching of like, um.

Foil or ASMR, it can be a lot of different things. I know, I know.

That's not one that a lot of people find soothing There are a lot of ASMR creators out there that actually do ASMR for people who don't experience tingles.

Like for some people, the thought of their hair being brushed is enough.

To give them to give them I'm not one of those people.

But I do, I know. It's because i you can't You cannot brush my hair.

What? You have that glorious hair and there's Well, I mean, no, we can't brush your hair because it'll be a lion's mane, but like

Or you should not brush my hair.

I will not be able to walk through a door sideways.

If I find out that I'm like. Leaving this earth due to some medical malady like i'm running off to france No, no, no.

You can have, I'll shave my head and you can have it.

There will be never a shaving of your head. We know how I feel about this.

Oh.

Apparently, one of my comforts is you having long, lustrous locks.

I will run off to like a cave and a cheese cave in France with like all the wine and just pay somebody to rub my head until I die. Like I will die of wine, cheese, or head rubs. And that's like.

Hey.

Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. No head rubs. I do get friction from head rubs, but the thought of somebody doing it doesn't give me Doesn't give me freedom.

That's the thing.

Oh, I was like, how can you be dead in the scalp? Like, I feel so bad for you now. Okay. Thank you. That gives me comfort and joy in my soul to know that.

Now, see, I would actually, if you could tell me if you could describe that like because I enjoy having like a head massage or something like that we're just talking about it would do it.

What's the little like spork thing you can put on your head with a little metal, whatever you can like massage your scalp?

We give you the friction.

Oh, the soul extractor. They call it the soul extractor you know the soul extractor. It's metal tines with little plastic balls at the end and sometimes they vibrate, the handle vibrates so that you can You can scratch at your scalp with the

Oh. Somebody…

What?

Mm-hmm.

Somebody gave me one that like it was a promotional thing and I was like, you cannot hand this out in offices. I sat in my office for like most of the day.

The metal tines vibrating yeah

Oh, those things. Okay.

Just making my own scalp happy. And I was like, I was on calls. I was like, this is wrong. This is not something that should be an office promo item.

It's also good for stimulating hair growth. Fun fact, massaging your own head.

It's just, you know, like financially I need to hit lotto just so I can have head scratching money.

Or having somebody massage your head for you.

Yeah. Definitely.

Happy. Yeah, that makes sense.

Like everybody else is like, I want a mansion. I'm like, no, I just want head rub money.

So here's a question for you guys. What is a weird self-soothing habit that you have?

Well, I think we kind of meant to look for me I enjoy, I go to the kitchen.

It. It just, I don't know.

Ties into my i enjoy feeding people.

I enjoy being creative and trying new things. In that regard.

I love traveling. So when I could take a recipe from a different culture, even though I've never had it and God love you too. You've been on the end when I've fallen down holes. I'm like, all right.

So Moroccan. Moroccan food. I want to try. I know I owe you a tall girl lent me her, what is it, her tagine And I have yet to make you anything. I'm working on that.

We love those holes.

Yeah.

You fell down a homemade tomb hole? Like, we're fine. We're fine. You rolled up to my house with a cup and a half of tomb and we're like, here, it's terrible.

That is true.

I then consumed 80 cloves of garlic before you had even left my town.

If anyone's had, if you go out for shawarma Or, you know, when you had the white garlic sauce, that is what she's referring to and um then i felt the need to make it, which shawarma that i made one time and then because it is of a consistency of a product that tall girl does not like to have

Yeah, how to.

That, you know, you bring out the best out Not for her.

She can't have potato salads that have that ingredient, but this that i made she enjoyed so i transferred you know, made that into my garlic herbed potato salad.

It's no.

That I have to put in two separate containers when I bring to her house.

So at her. That there's no fighting going on over who gets to eat the potato salad.

Honestly, every single time you drop it off in my driveway, I consider locking myself in my car and not bringing it inside and just hoovering 12 pounds potatoes and garlic sauce and like, you know.

Just muscling my way through the after effects of all that.

So yeah, I would say that i would say that Yeah.

But it's like, that's like the love language thing that you do like You do it to comfort yourself, but also if you know we're down, you will tend to like find something yeah Like…

Just show up with food. Or some random gift night.

You saw that made you think of us through Yeah.

3
Yeah, so cooking is definitely cooking, baking is definitely one of my comfort habits.

What would yours be, Tall? But I don't know if that's weird so much level at which I Thank you. I'll be weirder next time.

No, it's… I am a water baby at heart. So like comfort is to find a pool, to find a body of water, to like go get my hair washed or something like something that involves water will make me happy but also like

It's not weird, but we'll accept it.

Hippie-esque bare feet on real grass. Like not in Central Park because I don't want to die of a foot fungus but like standing on like grass makes me very, very happy and makes me feel grounded. And I know that's so weird and people like touch grass and I'm not like, no, literally my feet on grass is like

No, that's there's a there's a specific There's a specific term and I can't remember where at the moment.

No, it's a thing.

Where that is where that is Give me a moment. I'll go look.

And then for some reason, and I don't know why, and you guys know this in like the most stressful moments, and it's not like I grew up with this a sub like crap white bread, crap deli turkey Turkey, lettuce, tomato, oil, vinegar, no mayo because that's unnecessary in this earth.

Turkey. Yep.

Salt, pepper, oregano. I don't know why. It's not something I grew up with. It's not something I choose to eat really on a regular basis, but like that lo mein with kimchi are like, for some reason it does it. And the other day I ended up eating papaya and Chinese mustard greens and like i wasn't even stressed it was just like

I don't know what to eat for dinner. And then I was like, oh, I just found a food combination that's going to make me happy. Like there's no good reason for it, but like Yeah, I don't know why. You guys now when I'm truly like when i

Nice.

I worked for a startup for a while and at one point I had like evaporated off the grid I think I didn't talk to you guys for like three, four days

That was a lot longer. Yeah.

Oh, no, sweetheart, that was a lot. It was like, we… It was…

Was it? I was so stressed. My hair was falling out from that job like that was… I was stressed like I've never had before.

At some point you guys sent me Like, what do you need? And I'm like, I need a turkey sandwich and it's only eight in the morning and somehow you guys got it delivered to the office.

I don't know why. I don't know why. It's not something I would naturally gravitate to. It wasn't a treat when I was growing up. I have no idea why, but that was like all my soul wanted.

Yep.

Yeah, I door dashed that shit to you.

I'm sitting there. And at the time, like it was a glass office. I'm just sitting there staring at this sandwich.

Best friends in the world. They send me turkey I think everybody left me alone for the rest of the day because they were just like, uh-huh.

Do we know these friends phone numbers? Because he looks like you're having a breakdown.

Good luck, Bear.

I don't know why. It was just the thing in my soul that like, I don't know.

Oh, for a turkey sandwich?

Yeah, I think that's the weirdest. I mean, except for my shawl collection, but that's just Because I'm a grandma.

No.

I love a good shawl. It just… Oh my gosh.

Golden girls are where it at. Orthopedic shoes, shawls, loose clothing I have date nut bread.

Shawls and mumoos.

And they're making cute orthopedic shoes now too.

I'm so ready to be a senior citizen. You have no idea. Everybody else is like, I don't want to get old. I'm like, those will be my glory years.

Bingo? Bingo every Tuesday? Okay.

What about you, Rod? What is your uh Possibly.

I'm a texture baby so i anything soft and velvety or silky is what I gravitate toward when I'm feeling off.

I'm like, I have a 25 pound weighted blanket that is covered in velvet that makes me And the velvet has little nubs on it And it makes me very happy. It's like being massaged.

Okay.

I love them for like 10 minutes. And then I'm like, oh my God, get off me.

All over.

Oh, I sleep with mine when I'm having really bad anxiety, I sleep with mine. I love those things.

I've actually looked for heavier than 25 pounds I want to feel like I am sinking into the bed.

Oh, Jesus.

Or the couch, depending. But yeah, that's that's what it tends to…

Because it makes you feel… Like you feel grounded or you feel contained?

Both. Both.

Like, what is the feedback you get from it?

So oftentimes with anxiety and depression and especially when those two things combine.

You can feel like the world is kind of spinning off its axis.

And the weight keeps me feeling contained and the texture of the blanket helps me feel grounded. It's something that I can tangibly have that makes me feel like the world's not spinning apart.

So not to be insulting in any way when I ask this, but you know, like dogs have those thunder vests Like, do you think you could… But do you think you could head off a panic attack like if you got

Yeah, it's exactly the same idea.

I have. Yeah. Yep.

If you get under it, you can… Oh, okay. Oh, that's super cool. I'll buy you a 25-pound blanket.

Yep. I have one.

Well, no, she has the 25. Heavier.

I know, but like two is a 50. Like, you know, we can just layer them right like

That's true. But yeah, those are some of the things that maybe a little bit weird that keep me grounded but i think that texture and weight.

Are probably my two go-tos. I love anything soft.

I think. I think it's interesting that each one of us have different things and variety and i hope that our listeners that this could resonate with different people because people are so varied in what comforts them, what grounds them.

Yeah. For those of them who haven't really thought about it, maybe this gets them thinking about it.

So hopefully

I used to work with somebody who the bubble wrap they would buy it in particular because the pop sensation really did something for them.

I think what? Yeah.

Or looking for a new one.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. We all know people who paint, who draw who produce art. Sometimes when I'm feeling particularly rageful, I will stab a needle into a piece of fabric several hundred times and come out with a picture.

Okay.

You know, it's It's needle work yeah it's.

Very pretty picture.

Needlework.

Thank you. There are so many different things that can help you to help you remain… in a good headspace.

And head things off at the pass or or make things better when things have gotten difficult for you And hopefully it gets everybody thinking about what's good for them and what can be what might be something that they hadn't thought of before.

Or just start a podcast with two of your friends and you know Hedge off.

Yeah, like basically induce anxiety about something else and then just, you know.

I head off the insanity that way.

And that's it for today's episode of Sense Sensibility and Chaos.

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