Narrator: This podcast is intended to support UK healthcare

professionals with education.

The information provided in this podcast is not a substitute for professional

medical advice or treatment, and patients are encouraged to consult

healthcare providers, including nurses, for any medical questions or concerns.

Hannah: Welcome to Stoma and Continence Conversations from Coloplast Professional,

where healthcare professionals and experts by experience discuss the latest

hot topics in the worlds of stoma, continence care and specialist practice.

I'm Hannah Patterson.

I've worked in specialist care and I'm currently the ostomy care associate

education manager at Coloplast.

This time we are celebrating the strength of stoma mum.

Maddison: Mum kept a lot of it to herself, she wasn't always telling us

everything, she'd keep a lot to herself.

that she didn't want me and Finny to know at the time to us, like herself,

because she just didn't want to upset us with how unwell she actually was.

I learned a lot from mum having the surgery, and it's taught me a lot

as well to do, like, if anything happens in the future more with,

like, my IBS, like, then I'm more aware of what, like, could happen.

Hannah: Now, I know I say it a lot of the time, but today really

is a very, very special podcast.

As we all know, it's Mother's Day coming up very soon and I am joined

by two of our, I'm going to say they're quite regular experts by

experience that have joined me before.

So hi Sophie.

Hi Yvette.

How are you both?

Hi Hannah.

Hi Yvette.

Are you all right as well?

Hi.

Yes.

I'm good.

Thank you.

Good.

Now, as I said, this is a little bit more special, not that you guys aren't

special coming on with me all the time.

You guys are actually joined by your own special guest this time, aren't you?

So I'm not gonna spoil the party.

I'm going to let Sophie do an introduction with her special guest first.

Sophie: So my special guest is my daughter, Madison.

Hi.

Hi Madison.

How are you?

I'm good, thank you.

Hannah: How are you?

I'm very good, thank you.

Very excited to have you on here.

I have heard so much about you, and don't worry, it's all been good.

So how old are you, Madison?

Maddison: I'm 17.

17, gosh.

And you guys, I would say, but Sophie and Madison are absolute

dead spits of each other.

You probably don't want to hear this, Madison, but you look more

like your mum's younger sister, I have to say, than anything else.

You are absolute little carbon copy of one another.

Hannah: But thank you so much for joining me and without further ado, Yvette, do

you want to introduce your special guest?

Yvette: My special guest is my youngest daughter, Ruby.

Hannah: Hello, Ruby, how are you?

Ruby: Good, thanks, how are you?

Hannah: I'm very well, thank you.

And how old are you, Ruby?

Ruby: 12.

Hannah: You almost had to think about that one.

Yeah, don't worry.

It gets even worse when you get older, Ruby.

Don't worry.

Now, as we said, this is Mother's Day.

So I thought what better thing to be joined by two stone mums

and their wonderful daughters.

I'm going to come to you first, Madison.

So how old were you when your mum first had her surgery?

Can you remember?

Maddison: I was 14 years old at the time.

Hannah: Do you remember much about it at the time?

Maddison: Yeah, a lot because we used to call you a lot when you were in

hospital and stuff and we knew she was going downhill because obviously she

was at the hospital a lot for operations and surgeries and appointments and

Yeah, we could tell, but Mum kept a lot of it to herself, like, she

wasn't always telling us everything.

She'd keep a lot that she didn't want me and Finny to know at the time to us, like,

herself, because she just didn't want to upset us with how unwell she actually was.

Hannah: And I remember, because it's something you've spoken about before,

Sophie, that a lot of your times when you were poorly, well, when you, it

was during COVID, so of course you weren't even really able to see your

mum a lot at that point, were you?

I said a lot of the communication was over the phone.

Maddison: Yeah, we FaceTimed a lot.

Um, but obviously when we did FaceTime, mum was obviously very

much out of it, um, because she was.

Dosed up on a lot of medications and stuff, so she didn't remember

the majority of the calls.

And there was a few voice notes sent that she doesn't even remember sending,

but it's alright, we still got love.

Hannah: Not too much to embarrass her with in the future.

No.

And Ruby, I'm guessing you don't even remember mum before

she had a stoma, do you?

Ruby: No, it's always just been stomas, really.

Knowing, uh, having a stoma.

So, yeah.

Hannah: Do you remember thinking at some point that, that your

mum was different to her?

Because obviously, like you say, when you, growing up,

your mum only ever had a stoma.

That was all you ever knew.

Was there a point where you knew that your mum did things a little

bit differently to other mums, or?

I don't know.

I can't really remember.

It's just always been that way.

Ruby: Yeah, it's just, yeah.

Hannah: Now I know that because you've got children that were sort

of like pre stoma and post stoma, was there that sort of difference in

conversations for you at that point?

Yvette: Ruby was only 13 months old when I had my stoma.

She's my youngest.

Um, and then all the others.

So.

Amber was 22 months older than that and then, uh, Alex and Morgan, they

were probably I'd say six, seven, maybe a little bit older, 10 maybe.

And they, they all kind of dealt with it all in their own different little ways.

Um, Alex, I think I've mentioned before, um, on one of the podcasts, he

was very much into, he wanted to help me make sure all my clothes looked

good and that, you know, there wasn't, you couldn't see my bag or anything.

So he was, he was on clothing duty.

Um, and then Morgan was on naming the stammer duty.

Um, and he was, I don't know if I have told this story before,

um, but he was very much into Spongebob Squarepants at the time.

And there was me thinking, oh I've got a really nice name for my statement.

No, we ended up with Sheldon.

from Spongebob Squarepants.

I

Hannah: thought you were going to say Gary, because you're like,

Gary, the cat that's the, well, the snail, that goes meow, and I'm

thinking like, that's stomery sort of noise, isn't it, that meow?

Yvette: Exactly, I mean, that could have been fitting, but no, we

ended up with Sheldon the stomer.

Um, and then Amber was very much involved and Ruby at the time, but she Like I said,

she was only 13 months old, so she hasn't ever really known anything different.

But the girls were very much involved in when the stoma nurse came round

to visit in those first early weeks.

She was very much involved in, in giving the dry wipes and more dry wipes

and more dry wipes and how many of a million more things that they could find

out the bag to help the stoma nurse.

There was one interesting comment that Morgan made when we told

him about the fact that I was gonna have to have a stoma.

He's like, wait, what?

That means when you're playing Lego You don't have to get up to

go to the toilet to have a poo.

I was like, no, exactly.

It's like, it's brilliant.

Why hasn't

Hannah: everybody got one?

This is such a genius idea.

Why wouldn't everyone want to?

That is absolutely brilliant.

Of all the things in the world, it's being able to play with LEGO that

is clearly the most important thing.

Yvette: Yeah, obviously.

I'm

Hannah: going to commend you on this one, Madison.

Obviously being a little bit older, you were a little bit

more aware of what was going on.

Did you know what a stoma was or anything like that before your mum had her surgery?

Maddison: No, I learned a lot from mum having the surgery and it's taught me

a lot as well to do like if and if it happens in the future more with like my

IBS like then I'm more aware of what like could happen but I've definitely learned

a lot more and like obviously mum's very like big on her platforms about it.

So, um, obviously a few of my mates do turn around and ask, like, things

about it and I just feel like I'm a lot more educated now on, like, how

to answer to, like, the questions.

Hannah: Yeah, you feel like you're confident to answer those questions now.

Yeah, definitely.

How about you, Ruby?

Do any of your friends ever ask you any questions?

Ruby: No, not really.

They just sort of like, they know that my mum's because obviously

sometimes they come round and stuff, but like, yeah, they're not bothered.

But like, they know and stuff, which is good.

And if they do have any questions, they can ask me.

So Yeah,

Hannah: I suppose it's good really that they're not bothered.

It's obviously with that with all due respect to it You're not

that interesting or that anything like that in that respect.

So it's not that that much of a big deal Now I must be boring really

I won't tell you that I almost saw Ruby nodding her head there in the corner

Now Ruby, what is the thing you are most proud about for your mum with

everything she does with her stoma?

Ruby: That she's more confident in the way she was, probably.

Hannah: Aww.

Has she told you a lot about how poorly she was and before she had her surgery?

Ruby: Yeah, she's told me a lot of how, um, poorly she was and going

to the toilet and stuff like that.

Hannah: Must have been quite hard for you to hear about how

poorly your mum was, mustn't it?

Yeah, it was.

And I know it's your mum, something you've talked about before as well, Yvette,

that, especially when Ruby and Amber were so little it was something that you

were very aware of as well when in those early days before you had your surgery

about how poor you were and it's quite nice really that in Ruby's just shown

now she doesn't remember that at all.

Yvette: Exactly, I mean Ruby only really ever experienced one flare up

and that was in the month she turned like one to 13 months old she, she

didn't ever really experience any of my flare ups because actually while

I was pregnant with her I had, I had a really terrible pregnancy with her

out of all four of my pregnancies, her pregnancy was the worst pregnancy.

Um, but yeah, when I delivered her, I was, I was, I was really well after that.

So she hasn't ever experienced me apart from about that, that one month

when she was from 12 to 13 months old, she hasn't ever experienced

a flare up, but the others have.

And the others have definitely, particularly the boys, they do remember,

you know, the days that I was glued to the toilet all day, you know, I used to keep

a box of toys and books in the bathroom, especially when they were little, just

so I could sit on the toilet and still be doing the mum things like reading

the books and playing with the toys.

You just, when, when you are a mum with a long term chronic illness, you do learn

to adapt to life and try and make it.

easier for you to still be a parent but still deal with your, you know,

your long term chronic illness.

The hardest part for me was, you know, getting up in the morning and knowing it

was going to be a bad day and knowing that I wouldn't be able to do the school run.

And having to, you know, speak to like grandparents and things like

that, trying to get them involved and, and asking them to, you know,

can you come and pick the kids up?

Can you come and do the school run?

And I think, again, I think I've probably spoken about this before, that my lowest

point as a mum with Ulcerative Colitis was breastfeeding Ruby on a hospital

toilet at three o'clock in the morning, weighing, I only weighed five stone five.

So my body was putting all the energy into her to grow her.

And, and it was literally four days, three, four days after that, that that's

when they performed emergency surgery.

Hannah: Gosh.

And it really is heartbreaking to hear stories like that, but then so

apparent to what a difference it's made to your life and, you know, seeing

how, and hearing how confident Ruby is and speaking the way she does, what.

How wonderful it has been really moving forward.

Now I'm going to ask you the same question as I asked Ruby.

Madison, what are you most proud about with your mum?

Maddison: I think about the fact that she's obviously a lot more confident in

herself now and that she can She's been able to achieve so much that she wasn't

able to do when she didn't have a stoma and she can go out now Not worrying having

to like worry about where a toilet is or whether she's got a change of clothes

with her Like she's just able to do so much more now Like we can't come out

Snowden after you got it done, didn't you?

And even like that that was a big achievement for mum because obviously she

really wanted to do that But I think also another thing is That she's there for

like everyone else now when it like when they come to have been like the surgery

and stuff So the amount of people and they're honestly the amount of times you

can look over at mom And she's messaging people like making sure they're okay or

making sure that they're ready for their surgery Or if they've got any questions

like she's always there for anyone and she's made such a big community out of

Raising awareness about the stoma It's really, it's a really big achievement

and I'm very proud of her for it.

Hannah: Oh, bless.

She'll pay you later for it, so it doesn't matter.

Sophie: I mean, 20 quid on the side here.

Hannah: And think about that with the commute today.

Obviously your mum's got her local stoma group that she's got as well.

Is that something that you're proud of too?

Ruby: Yeah, definitely.

She's always been, you know, going on meetings and stuff and I'm

just really proud of how far she's come from, like, when she was,

like, on the toilet and things.

Hannah: And is it something, I know that she's, obviously you were so

young when she had her, so is it something that you ever talk about

with, you know, Amber, Morgan and Alex?

Is it something that they ever tell you about what they remember?

Ruby: Um, yeah, definitely if Alex wants something from me, he'll definitely

be like, Well, when you were a baby, I had to do this and that because Min

was on the toilet and things like that.

Um, but other than that, they don't really talk about much.

It's been more mum telling me stuff than them, really, because Amber was,

like, however old and Alex and Morgan were obviously more growner ish.

So, yeah.

Hannah: But they still like to use it as a bit of a bribing tool with you.

Yeah, definitely.

Proper big brothers there, aren't they?

How's that make you feel, Mum?

Are you thinking, maybe time to have a word with Alex now?

I

Yvette: don't know if I dare get involved.

I'm sure Ruby can find her own bribery techniques.

Yeah.

Hannah: Ruby's thinking, what can I use now?

You can say you're a podcast star now, Ruby.

You can say, hold on, I'm the podcast star now.

Yeah.

Coloplast

Professional offers a lot of educational material for specialist

nurses and healthcare professionals.

Visit coloplastprofessional.

co. uk to find out more.

Girls, I'm going to give you your little moment now to almost, I'm

going to want you to forget I'm here.

I want you girls to now, I'm going to let you go first on this one, Madison.

Just have a couple of minutes now, speaking to your mum and

telling her everything that you feel about what she's achieved.

This is like just you and your mum.

Maddison: So, I feel that you're doing really well with your Instagram

and raising awareness to everyone.

And I feel that you need to be also alongside of it, spend a lot

of time to take time for yourself and also focus on yourself.

Cause you, you're like, you're like all of us.

You love to put everyone else before yourself.

And sometimes I feel like you just got to sit back and focus, like your

recovery, like focus on yourself.

And you've done that.

You've taken time away from social media and you've.

Done what you need to do to make yourself better before coming back to everyone

else and being there for everyone.

And yeah, I feel you're doing really well and you're getting through

your recovery really well and you should be proud of yourself.

Sophie: Aw, do though.

I'm mega, mega proud of these kids, like what they've been through.

You know?

It is.

It has been really tough on them, Hannah.

'cause their whole lives have been me.

Ill, they haven't, you know.

I feel, I feel like Ruby, I think you're, you know, really fortunate in a way that

you didn't actually see mum like that because it really isn't nice and I've

got some really awful memories of, you know, little things that they'd say to

me when I was bedridden and everything.

And I just think.

I am mega proud of my kids as well, because although Finlay,

he's like, uh, it's literally an alien sticking out of your stomach.

He just, he, he won't entertain you.

No, no, no.

But Madison has just learned so much from day one and she's been my nurse.

She's been my beck and call everything.

So yeah, they definitely deserve their credit back, these kids as well.

Cause it's not like I said, it's really hard for children to live with parents

that have got chronic conditions.

It's really not easy.

So, um, yeah, right back at you, Madison.

I also

Maddison: feel though, like going on the lines of that.

So when mum went in for her surgery just recently gone, I had a bit of a

tumble while she was in because the last time she was in for surgery,

I got a call, obviously it was your first one, I think it was.

And the phone call we got from mum was she was very out of it and she just,

She didn't look her best, obviously.

Like, she was very, like, pale and

Hannah: That was very diplomatic, Madison.

That was very diplomatic.

Maddison: Obviously, she had tubes and everything going and everywhere, and

it wasn't very pleasant, obviously, to see at first, because all we

wanted to see was that she was okay.

So, this time around, I made sure that I got, whether she was out of it or not,

I was like, please still FaceTime me, because I was really struggling to get

myself around the fact of picturing that image of her first end and like, now.

So when she did call me I was a lot more relieved because I was like,

okay, like, she looks herself.

She's more herself this time round.

I

Sophie: was as high as a kite.

I went and stole my phone from Morphine, and I was like,

Maddison: Oh, your phone!

I can't see the phone, she was like, I can't see what I'm texting you, but, she

Sophie: was

Maddison: like, where to call you?

I don't know.

It is, it is a big thing to come around a few of the things that you've seen,

especially when, like, your parent is really unwell, but I feel like

when you see it another time around, or when they come, come around from

recovery a lot more better, you know?

it's a lot more relief off your shoulders because you know that

they're getting well or they're they're looking more well than what they were.

Hannah: Yeah because like you say it's almost brought up like a previous trauma

for you of remembering how poorly your mum was and especially at that time

when you couldn't almost get to her as easily as what you could you can now and

things like that and Just really good for you that, not good for you Sophie that

you've had to have another operation, obviously, but it's, it's obviously for

you Madison, it's helped address a few of those previous traumas and actually helped

a little bit for you in that respect.

Yeah, definitely.

And then Ruby, what else would you like to say to your mum?

Ruby: Well, I'm just really thankful that I didn't have to go through all the, um,

Toilet situations and things and that I'm so glad that you're here and not on

the toilet and things like that and I'm just really happy that you are here.

Hannah: Oh, girls, you, you're getting me all emotional on a

thanks.

So Nice.

It's, and hearing how proud you two are to have.

Your mums doing what they're doing is so, so lovely to hear.

I mean, I always tell your mums that I'm really, really proud

of them and everything they do.

I always tell them and I'm so glad that you two are there every day telling them

that as well because I can't be there to nag them and tell them every single day

that I'm really proud of them and I think they're absolutely blimmin marvellous.

So knowing that you two are there to do it is absolutely brilliant.

And be really proud of yourselves as well because, as Sophie

rightly said, I'm proud of it.

It's not easy having them always having a mum that's got a chronic illness.

So you two are remarkably brave as well, remarkably brave.

From your point of view, you had to grow up with it, Madison,

almost seeing your mum so poorly.

And then you've had to grow up in a world where you've never known anything

different, Ruby, where it's always been stomas, stoma bags, things like that.

So you've grown up in that world.

And again, That's not necessarily an easy world to grow up in.

So both of you need to be very, very proud of yourselves as well.

Yvette: I think it's also really important for us to realise that these kids have

got amazing, just from having, having us as mums who have been poorly, they've

got amazing skills that some other kids wouldn't even have, have any idea.

On how to look after somebody who's poorly, how to empty a stoma bag, how

to change a stoma bag, how to sort themselves out when mum isn't feeling

well, all those kind of things that the, you know, these kids have learned

amazing skills out of a awful situation.

Hannah: They've got a pair of future nurses here I reckon.

But thank you all so, so much for joining me.

As I said, it was really nice having special guests joining

my special guests today.

So it was absolutely brilliant and Happy Mother's Day to you, Yvette and Sophie.

I hope you have a lovely day and I know now that your girls

will be spoiling you rotten.

So have the best day.

And to everyone listening, Happy Mother's Day and we will

see you on the next podcast.

Thank you for listening.

To see more of the wide variety of education we offer, please

visit colplastprofessional.

co. uk.

See you next time.

Narrator: Stoma and Continence Conversations is a Vibrant Sound Media

production for Coloplast Professional.