03:52.03 Talal K oh

03:52.42 alexei sayle Hello everybody, welcome to episode, what is it? Episode 82 of the Excel podcast and Talal, would you like to explain what that was?

03:56.73 Talal K 82. Oh, yeah. Well, Alexi, you were sent this song.

04:03.46 alexei sayle Yeah.

04:03.92 Talal K It is available on Bandcamp. It's called If I Must Die. It's by a collection of musicians up in Edinburgh ah called Giza.

04:12.33 alexei sayle yeah

04:14.68 Talal K They've called themselves Giza. That's G-E-A-S-A. ah a um beautiful there with some cello and some pipes. um The website is geasa.bandcamp.com.

04:31.39 Talal K Again, that's geasa.bandcamp.com. You can donate any amount and and

04:39.28 alexei sayle That's a famous poem, of course, by... Right.

04:40.90 Talal K oh Oh yes, yeah. ah You can donate any amount and get a download of that song and all money is going to medical relief for Palestine.

04:45.16 alexei sayle right

04:48.44 Talal K They're not taking a penny from it. That is of course, the lyrics there are from the poem of um the poet, um Rafat Al-Ariir, who was assassinated December 6th by the Israeli army. That's a very famous poem, I think.

05:07.79 Talal K I think every Palestine Relief ah fundraising event I've been to, there's been some actor on stage we're reciting that poem, isn't there?

05:13.17 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah, indeed.

05:15.83 Talal K Including the one you and our guests were at the...

05:18.76 alexei sayle Yeah, well, I was just, we were talking before we began, we were talking about benefits over the years where, you know, I've done benefits where they say, you know, kdish Kurdish rebels are being thrown into pits and shot and their bodies burned with acid.

05:18.89 Talal K um

05:35.67 alexei sayle Now, ladies and gentlemen, Alexei Zayel! So we've just provided you, Jen Brister, with a podcast version of that, really, haven't we? I'm sorry.

05:45.99 Jen yeah

05:46.35 alexei sayle ah

05:47.27 Jen Here is one of the saddest songs you'll listen to today.

05:47.52 alexei sayle I guess...

05:50.51 Jen Welcome, the comedian, Jen Brister.

05:50.82 alexei sayle Yeah.

05:57.10 Talal K how we roll it.

05:57.72 alexei sayle as a ah It is a powerful piece of work we do.

05:57.86 Talal K We're not afraid.

06:00.56 alexei sayle Yeah,

06:00.82 Talal K It really was, yeah. And we felt... um we felt like it would be right to just open a podcast with it.

06:05.70 alexei sayle yeah it seems like a... Yeah, yeah, it is.

06:08.30 Talal K um I'm shivering. I'm still kind of recovering.

06:09.43 Jen I loved it.

06:10.32 alexei sayle Yeah, it is.

06:10.71 Talal K It's beautiful.

06:10.82 Jen Just for the record, I think it's beautiful song. and

06:13.53 alexei sayle I mean, the poem is extraordinary, and then I think that setting is is highly, yeah you know, adds to it, really, and I think it's very powerful.

06:23.72 alexei sayle And I hope the people, you know, it helps. So, Jen Brister, we've got you on, hoping to... leech off your million and a half is it?

06:36.57 Jen Yeah, leech away.

06:37.89 alexei sayle yes

06:39.34 Jen the Leach away through the the very heavy shadow ban, which has limited that million to to probably 15,000, but you're welcome to them.

06:40.31 alexei sayle ah yeah

06:45.07 alexei sayle really really fuck really I didn't know well there's no point then that's uh

06:51.74 Jen Yeah, what why have you got me on?

06:53.35 alexei sayle but

06:53.38 Jen you think but yeah You'd be better off getting someone with 20,000 and no shadow ban than me, I tell you.

06:54.81 Talal K ah

07:00.30 alexei sayle is that that's yeah

07:00.51 Talal K to help Explain a shadow band to our listeners or our readers back home, please.

07:05.35 Jen Well, shutan the shadow ban is something that is um ah created by an algorithm that i imagine is what you know is also created by Meta to limit certain speech and to limit to certain subjects from becoming, um you know having the potential to become viral.

07:05.58 Talal K well And how does it happen?

07:29.23 Jen So I am very vocal about Palestine and Meta is not happy about that. And so I have a I've got a really big shadow ban on my account, which means that whilst I do have a million followers, all of my posts will be limited to about 17, 18, 20,000 people seeing it Unless other people that don't have a shadow band share share my stories and share it.

07:57.14 Talal K Mm-hmm.

07:57.27 Jen so um But i had a lot I had a conversation with Frankie Boyle about this and he's he's given up using Instagram now. He just goes on Blue Sky because he said, ah like literally, he you know nobody sees anything he's posting so he doesn't see the point.

08:13.10 alexei sayle Yeah, indeed. And his blue sky, blue sky doesn't, uh, is not owned by the empire.

08:17.71 Jen No, so he can, it's not owned by the empire yet.

08:21.76 alexei sayle Yeah.

08:21.81 Jen um And so he can he can he can say whatever he wants on there. But yeah, it's ah anyone anyone that is vocal on a subject that Meta is unhappy about, you will get shadow banned.

08:33.27 Jen And that's why people are reluctant to talk about Palestine because it means compromising their social media output, you know?

08:42.45 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah. And it's, yeah, go on, sorry.

08:45.00 Jen but I don't give a fuck, so...

08:49.11 alexei sayle I mean, have you noticed any real world um effects because of this? Or are you able to get get your, you know, your tour information out and so on in other ways? Yeah.

09:00.04 Jen i i you you know, if i I mean, i I do notice it's harder for me to get if I've got a post out where I'm talking about actually my job comedy and I go, oh, I'm doing this show and I'd love you to come to this.

09:14.73 Jen Then it's a real ball ache because the algorithm is still like, oh, well, we're still just suppressing your account generally.

09:16.29 alexei sayle Yeah.

09:20.06 alexei sayle Yeah.

09:20.39 Jen So so then it it can be annoying when I'm trying to sell a tour, which I am at the moment. and But yeah. Yeah, it's just one of those things. there's not there's not really And I don't really know if there's any way of shifting that shadow ban or if it's just there forever.

09:35.16 alexei sayle No, no. I suppose you can say, well, still being shadow banned and being hit by a drone coming through your windows.

09:44.21 Jen Exactly.

09:44.85 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah, it's a sense of proportion, yeah.

09:45.66 Jen So, do know what I means Yeah, and um I would rather be vocal about it and sleep at night than...

09:51.87 alexei sayle Thank you. Yeah, yeah, well, it's you're very yeah very, you are brave, I think, to do it.

09:53.45 Talal K Yeah, exactly.

10:00.80 alexei sayle um to Just go back a bit. you I noticed that you actually did um the comedy module at the ah University of Middlesex. let's how you

10:10.90 Jen Yeah.

10:11.50 alexei sayle yeah Was that with you, Thomas?

10:13.63 Jen Yes, it was with you Yeah.

10:14.41 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

10:16.03 Jen Back in 1996. six

10:18.91 alexei sayle Yeah, well, I, because I met Hugh, I think he used to come to the comedies, the original comedy store occasionally. And I actually bought a routine off him, which was, which he was very kind to sell me, which is that, um about riding a motorbike, drop down a cog, give it handful, come round round about.

10:35.28 alexei sayle um it so Yeah, yeah. it was one It was just one good routine, really. I just, I said, can I have... He very kindly let... I mean, I paid him for it but, you know, he said he very kindly let me have it, really.

10:47.92 alexei sayle And it was a staple of my act for many years.

10:50.51 Jen Oh, that's great.

10:52.07 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah, yeah.

10:52.08 Jen I did not um did not know that.

10:54.38 alexei sayle yeah,

10:54.51 Jen also Also, I didn't even know that Hugh, well, I suppose I did know that Hugh bobbed about and at the Comedy Store in the 80s, but I, yeah, he was he was, I mean, I still see Hugh.

10:55.19 Talal K Oh.

11:02.29 alexei sayle and it was, yeah.

11:06.52 Jen Actually, I did ah i did a gig for him um in a theatre in Deal Kent for him um last year.

11:12.85 alexei sayle Right.

11:13.77 Jen But yeah, he's on good form still.

11:15.76 alexei sayle Yeah, because it seemed kind of, i mean it's I mean, it seemed to, because that was the first, I think I used to do a bit about it in my app, but he that was the first kind of attempt to teach comedy, wasn't it, rather than to approach it in some sort of chaotic fashion.

11:33.57 alexei sayle it was the It was the, there's a few courses, I mean, I don't know, probably a lot of courses now, but yeah.

11:38.68 Jen I think there's loads now, but but at the time, yeah, Hughes was the only one.

11:39.77 Talal K Yeah.

11:39.81 alexei sayle Yeah.

11:43.37 alexei sayle Yeah, I think I did teach there once. I mean, just ah give a talk once or twice.

11:48.55 Jen um it was it was great.

11:49.41 alexei sayle Yeah.

11:50.08 Jen is's it I mean, you I suppose you can't really teach comedy, but you can give people a few sort of notes and skills you know like skills to use, and then but comedy is like, you don't know how to be a comedian so you until you're gigging all the time and writing and...

11:57.02 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah.

12:03.99 alexei sayle Do it. It doesn't... Yeah, yeah. It's one of those things that, you know, it doesn't exist unless you do it. You can't you can't just think it, can you really? It's not like being a philosopher or something.

12:13.48 Jen No. And some people are just good at it naturally.

12:15.23 alexei sayle Yeah.

12:16.72 Jen Like they've just got the natural timing. And and even when you see them right at beginning, you're like, the material's not quite there, but you've got something.

12:21.64 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah.

12:24.81 Jen And then other people are really great at the writing. And then you watch them on stage and you go, you need to give that to someone else to us say out loud.

12:29.84 alexei sayle Yeah, absolutely.

12:31.51 Jen Because you're killing a brilliant joke.

12:33.58 alexei sayle That you wrote, yeah.

12:34.41 Jen You're murdering it.

12:35.77 alexei sayle Yeah. So, I mean, well, tell us about how you got into it, really, and, well, everything. Tell us everything about yourself.

12:42.81 Jen and

12:44.63 alexei sayle Absolutely everything.

12:45.05 Talal K Gets me every time.

12:45.46 Jen Let's start at the beginning, Alexi.

12:46.14 alexei sayle Leave nothing out.

12:47.76 Talal K Gets me every time.

12:48.21 alexei sayle I had this.

12:49.44 Jen ah this is Strap yourself in for one of the most tedious stories of your life. I, that was the point when um when I did that course at Middlesex University in 1996. I had absolutely no desire to do stand-up comedy, but I was obsessed with comedy comment you know if comedy in general.

13:06.60 Jen And I used to go to the comedy store and I used to go and I used to watch like everything. So I a big fan of yours, Alexi.

13:14.59 alexei sayle Thank you.

13:15.02 Jen And um my brothers and i were, I suppose now you would call us nerds. Like we watched absolutely any comedy that was on British television because that's all we could access was whatever was on terrestrial TV on the four channels.

13:24.91 alexei sayle Yeah.

13:29.36 Jen We watched it. It doesn't matter. it didn't matter if it was like, you know, the two Ronnies or the young ones or not the nine o'clock news or French and Saunders or, you know, Hugh and Laurie, Smith and Jones, all of that.

13:39.08 alexei sayle Yeah.

13:41.63 Jen We we we were... absolutely obsessed and then we would watch and then we would video when when we finally got a video uh recorded then we would video stuff and then say shit back to each other like even even now that we're like in our 50s we will there'll be like quotes from various black adam episodes or episodes of the young ones that we'll quote to ask each other ah now which is

13:53.88 alexei sayle Right. Why why as you got have you ever thought about why that was really in your family?

14:07.49 Jen um No, don't know. just think it was something that was very a communal thing that we could do together that we really enjoyed. And, so ah you know, um I've got three brothers and one of the ways that we really bonded was to rip the piss out of each other, which I think is a very British thing to do.

14:26.32 alexei sayle Yeah.

14:27.14 Jen um So it was either um getting each other in a headlock, which I was trying to avoid at all costs, or just breaking tension with... with jokes.

14:38.36 Jen And, you know, my brothers are all really funny and we all have a you know a great sense of humour, but they had absolutely zero desire to do any kind of performance.

14:50.05 Jen And i when I did that, gi when I did that course, I suppose that was the first point where I went, oh, is this, God, you could, this is a job.

15:01.18 Jen You could actually, because when I used to watch stand-up comedians, I thought they were just,

15:02.62 alexei sayle Hmm.

15:02.69 Talal K and

15:07.18 Jen Do you know what I

15:09.37 alexei sayle You couldn't see what yes, yes, absolutely. Yeah. but How it worked.

15:12.63 Jen I couldn't see how they would, I had no idea how it worked.

15:13.11 alexei sayle Yeah.

15:15.38 Jen I couldn't see how they got there. I didn't understand the craft of standup that a lot of it was written. i didn't know what was being improvised and what had been, and what was like fixed. It all seemed like it had just come off the cuff, you know?

15:25.91 alexei sayle Yeah.

15:29.02 Jen and And those, you know, the really good comedians that could make you think that.

15:29.10 alexei sayle Yeah.

15:35.31 Jen And so the very idea that I could do that was just like a nonsense. No way. But then when I did that course and i and I got to see a little bit how the cogs work, I thought, oh, maybe I could do this.

15:44.72 alexei sayle yeah yeah

15:46.63 Jen So that's when it started. And then after that, I started to do open mics. And I was bad.

15:53.30 Talal K Well,

15:54.72 Jen I was so bad.

15:56.41 alexei sayle yeah but you have to have that confidence i think to succeed you know um

15:56.62 Jen But I was kind of deluded. So I kept going.

16:05.43 Talal K it sounds like um getting your driving license. You you really, you start, you you learn how to drive after you've gotten in your license.

16:08.85 Jen Yeah.

16:11.99 Talal K They always tell you, on the road.

16:13.41 Jen Yeah, well, that's, I mean, stand-up, yeah, stand-up comedy.

16:15.49 Talal K Yeah.

16:16.74 Jen i mean, you can be the best student in the group, but it's it is meaningless until you get out there.

16:21.23 alexei sayle Yes. Yeah.

16:24.35 Talal K Was that a degree, full on degree?

16:26.93 Jen It was a degree in theatre with a module on comedy.

16:29.49 Talal K Right.

16:30.16 Jen Yeah. And we and and and at Middlesex University, and I don't know if they still have this, but they have a library.

16:31.06 Talal K Cool.

16:35.64 Jen I think it's one of the only places in the country that has a library of almost every single comedy performance that has been on TV. They have a library of it. So and that's everything, whether it be sketch comedy, stand-up comedy.

16:51.47 Jen They've got a library of every single... performance it's it's so if you want to say oh joan rivers in dut dedu to du they've got it it's wild i don't know if the i don't know if it's still there because that particular comedy that particular ah course uh at ivy house which is where the the we were based that doesn't exist anymore so i don't know it might not exist but

17:00.13 Talal K Wow.

17:13.51 alexei sayle Really? um

17:15.36 Talal K I wonder if there was a Jim Davidson section, maybe.

17:17.64 Jen Oh, sure. Oh, God, yeah.

17:19.16 alexei sayle Well, you know, yeah.

17:19.89 Jen There was. There was Jim Davids, Roy Chubby Brown. They had it.

17:22.89 Talal K Roy, that's the one.

17:24.08 Jen Yeah.

17:24.10 Talal K I kept thinking, oh so I wanted to pull him, but i kept thinking Fatty Arbuckle. i' like, that's not his name.

17:28.86 alexei sayle No.

17:30.90 Talal K Roy Chubby Brown. Fuck's sake.

17:32.03 Jen but i think

17:32.12 alexei sayle Who were you? Go on, Sam.

17:33.75 Jen ah But I think it was really different. Like, when I used to watch stuff in the early 90s, even, and it was probably a bit of a leftover from from the 80s, it just felt a bit more...

17:42.73 alexei sayle Yeah.

17:46.66 Jen Well, it was very much more man heavy for a start and a bit and much more white, but it was just felt a bit more anarchic.

17:49.64 alexei sayle Yeah.

17:53.47 alexei sayle Yeah. I mean, but by 96, I'd actually sort of come and gone, hadn't I, really? I always think.

17:58.58 Jen Yeah.

17:59.33 alexei sayle I was like back. I've been in intensely in fashion and now was very out of fashion. You I do did a bit, I think in San Francisco, about 1990s Alexei Sale, you know, sort of.

18:11.98 alexei sayle hanging around the Zanzibar Club with their Anthony Warrell Thompson, you know and sort of, ah you know, other figures from the 90s in his Armani suit, you know trying to figure out quite where his career had gone because he was...

18:25.09 Jen What happened to Anthony Morrilly Thompson?

18:27.58 alexei sayle I don't know, what you remember?

18:27.66 Jen No one speaks about him anymore.

18:28.58 alexei sayle be he was arrested for shoplifting cheese.

18:29.91 Talal K He's still in Zanzibar, I think.

18:32.52 Jen Oh, that's right.

18:33.60 alexei sayle i think i think for his I think for his restaurants, I think it was like, I'm not sure, but I think it, um I mean, a a lot of chefs are, you know, alcoholics or, yeah, drug users.

18:33.62 Talal K Wow.

18:45.22 Jen Alcoholics.

18:49.98 alexei sayle I think his empire was collapsing because he yeah you met he branded all, you could buy Anthony Warrell Thompson branded frying pans, couldn't you?

18:59.58 Jen when he was, and that was peak Anthony Warrell-Thompson.

19:01.93 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah, yeah.

19:02.05 Jen I mean, this is it. I mean, Jamie Oliver's taken over, but...

19:03.65 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well, that's what, we you know, us 90s rejects, like me and Anthony Welch, we still see each other. and

19:12.85 Jen but

19:13.42 alexei sayle ah you know, Anthony Costa from Blue and 1990s, I think.

19:17.72 Jen Yeah, it'd probably be late nineties, noughties.

19:18.58 alexei sayle and We're all mates.

19:21.22 Jen Not, is it more noughties?

19:21.29 alexei sayle Yeah, we've...

19:22.22 Jen Maybe, I don't know.

19:23.13 alexei sayle I don't know. We've recreated the Zanzibar Club, which was a kind of prototype of the crowd show, which was in...

19:27.95 Talal K Mm-hmm.

19:29.63 alexei sayle We've rebuilt it in a ah basement in Deal in Kent.

19:36.42 alexei sayle I don't know how far I can go with this.

19:36.75 Jen Hugh's there. Hugh's there.

19:38.55 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

19:38.63 Jen is He hosts it, actually. He's still selling material.

19:42.10 alexei sayle You see, in Deal, that's right, you put it in So who were your cohort?

19:43.79 Jen Yeah.

19:45.72 alexei sayle or Who were you coming up with? Who would that be?

19:48.58 Jen Well, i because I did this thing of going in and then coming out and then going back in, so I didn't commit. But I guess when I was first starting, i don't know, it would have been people like Alan Carr,

20:05.91 Jen Nina Conti, um who else? i've just got I'm just trying to think. like that that That sort of time and then I guess a little bit later was ah russell all the Russells, um Russell Howard, Russell Kane, yeah Russell Brand.

20:19.87 alexei sayle oh good and bad. but but

20:24.54 Jen yeah All the Russells were coming up at the same time.

20:25.11 alexei sayle In fact, are there any good Russell? Yeah.

20:27.92 Jen um Yeah, so that those were the people that were coming up. Let's sidestep the Russells. um And...

20:36.07 alexei sayle Yeah. Who's the other one? The Joshes. There's no good Joshes.

20:41.12 Jen Listen, Alex, you can't have me on your podcast slacking off my peers.

20:44.18 Talal K it Slagging off comics.

20:46.81 alexei sayle I'm sorry.

20:50.19 Jen um good ca I'll be cancelled.

20:50.29 alexei sayle I told you.

20:52.48 Jen um So it was the Russells and then it was...

20:53.95 alexei sayle I'm a bitter old man from the Gone.

20:54.91 Jen and that

20:56.29 alexei sayle Right.

20:57.55 Jen Oh, yeah. I mean, it was it was very at that time when I was coming up, there was just it was very little space for women. And there was certainly was no space for some gobby lesbian. And it was I really feel like what people wanted, certainly what TV people wanted was young men in T-shirts.

21:15.73 alexei sayle Yeah.

21:17.61 Jen and in in

21:17.63 alexei sayle Yeah.

21:18.74 Jen in stretchy t-shirts and faded jeans um at talking about their trials and tribulations of of being a white guy.

21:26.50 alexei sayle Big hell. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

21:30.20 Jen And they didn't... they it was So it was a very... i found that that time for me was very frustrating because it was very difficult for me to break in, even into the clubs. It was very much a one woman and...

21:43.31 Jen one woman on a bell

21:43.96 Talal K Do continue.

21:45.32 Jen and I feel like every time i was performing, it was an audition rather than a gig. And it was it was like, let's see how good you are.

21:56.14 Jen And, you know, i felt like the men really had their feet under the table, but I never once felt like I had my feet under the table. So I i approached every single gig like it was live at the Apollo.

22:02.93 alexei sayle Right.

22:07.60 alexei sayle Right.

22:07.84 Jen Do you know what mean? i was

22:08.69 alexei sayle Yeah.

22:09.78 Jen Because I thought I've got, because this this is my job. And i if i don't if they don't ask me back, I don't get another weekend here, then I can't pay my rent.

22:13.06 alexei sayle Yeah.

22:16.96 Jen so

22:17.31 alexei sayle Yeah.

22:18.92 Jen I felt like there was a lot of I'm going to say people that were quite blasé about their work and I was not blasé ever about stand-up.

22:26.02 alexei sayle yeah

22:29.38 Jen I was really serious and yeah, I just, I needed to walk away from every gig feeling like I was the best.

22:38.98 alexei sayle Right. I mean, it's it's it's not fair that that situation pertained with the the maleness of the second. On the other hand, that struggle is not a bad thing to go through.

22:50.15 alexei sayle I think i don't know if you feel it like that about it, but your attitude seems to have been the right, know.

22:53.18 Jen Yeah,

22:55.27 alexei sayle Yeah.

22:56.19 Jen I think I needed... that struggle to get good at stand-up and actually you know with my personality because I'm quite stubborn if I feel like ah someone's trying to stop me from doing something rather than going oh I guess I'll never make it I have to prove to everybody that I can do it so in that in in fact not to everybody to myself it's that's who I'm proving it to

23:00.19 alexei sayle Yeah.

23:24.13 Jen And, and I suppose, yes, having that struggle made me work a lot harder and made me made me realise I had to be not just good, but I had to prove that I was almost better than everybody in the room to be, to be seen to be accepted and to to get more work.

23:28.74 alexei sayle Yeah.

23:36.28 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah.

23:39.47 Jen And that was, That was no bad thing. And I still, ah to be honest with you, Alexi, I still feel like that. I don't feel any different about comedy.

23:45.69 alexei sayle no

23:47.28 Jen I always feel like I need to work really hard in order to convince people that I should be there, that I'm allowed to be in the room.

23:55.86 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is, you know, I've i've i've grown i've grown lazy and complacent over the last few years, but your attitude is better, really, I think.

24:04.98 Talal K Yes, yes, we have.

24:05.60 Jen Oh, i'm I'm looking forward to Losing Complacent. I can't wait for that.

24:08.81 alexei sayle It's a lovely place to be. It is a really...

24:10.66 Jen I love, ah I'm thinking, I want to be there in 10 years, please.

24:11.21 alexei sayle Yeah. Now, well, I think it's you you need to be you need to be old and harmless, and and then I think it's only when...

24:15.35 Jen Lazy and complacent.

24:20.33 alexei sayle It's only when you can get to that place then. I think I think i remember reading somewhere in France that, you know, once you sort of reach a certain level of celebrity, then you can never go away. People will come and laugh and enjoy whatever you do, no matter at what but tremendous crap it is, really.

24:37.01 alexei sayle I don't think um I'm at ima that stage now.

24:37.41 Jen don't i I don't think I'm likely to ever reach that that level of celebrity.

24:43.33 alexei sayle No, I mean, I think, yeah no, i mean i of I mean, for me, just, I mean, because, i mean, that um there's still a lot that drive. I think, and you do you know, it does make, i mean, it there are, as you say, there are performers who don't have that and get by on, you know, at a social advantage or, but I mean, it's it's it's no bad thing, I think, to have that drive. So what changed anyway? I mean, how did it how did things improve here then?

25:13.76 Jen I think ah i I got some good advice from my mum at the time. what i was kind of doing a little bit of radio stuff. I was doing a little bit of sketch writing and sketch performing stuff. and ah But in my head, I always wanted her to be a stand-up comedian. And my mum just said, why are you doing all these other things?

25:33.28 alexei sayle Right.

25:33.87 Jen Stop doing all of these other things that you're not passionate about and you don't really enjoy.

25:33.98 Talal K and

25:38.41 Jen When you love stand-up comedy, just do stand-up.

25:41.52 alexei sayle Right.

25:41.76 Jen and and And it was kind of like a lightning bolt. i was like, yeah, she's absolutely right. Why am I doing all this right? I don't even enjoy it. I get nothing from it. It's not it's not my personality at all. I think I was trying to figure out what success was.

25:55.48 alexei sayle Yeah.

25:55.67 Jen So I... And I realised success is just... and ah It's just an ephemeral thing. It's not... And it never... but Whenever you when have you achieve whatever success is, it's not... you don't think you You don't think of yourself as successful. So I just thought, right, okay...

26:11.82 Jen I put my head down and I made a decision that I was just going to do everything I could to be the best of it stand-up comedian that I could be and within whatever abilities I have as a human being. And that's what I did. And it took me 10 years.

26:26.27 Jen And um so at the end of that 10 years, I got Live at the Apollo for the first time.

26:35.82 alexei sayle Right.

26:36.59 Jen and And then that's when, um after I did the first Live at the Apollo, and it was very gradual after that, it wasn't like a big seismic break and all of a sudden things started to shift.

26:47.59 Jen But after, that was the that was the first big shift for me, was and doing Live at the Apollo for the first time.

26:51.59 alexei sayle right

26:54.13 Jen And then gradually, ah you know, it's it's taken another seven, eight years. And I can't remember when I did that. was It was, i think it was, Jesus, I don't remember, 2015.

27:04.84 Jen twenty

27:04.89 Talal K Yeah, it's rarely overnight any any of this kind of like explosive success kind of thing, isn't it? And that's probably a good thing because you probably, not yourself, but like it's it would be hard to be prepared if you're suddenly in extremely high high demand and ah you might get stretched too thin and stuff.

27:11.01 Jen It's yeah.

27:20.89 Jen oh

27:22.84 Talal K So it's probably a good thing that it doesn't.

27:25.37 Jen definitely good for me because I wouldn't have been able to deal with it and by the time I got to the point where I was being offered things and saying do you want to do this do you want to do that I didn't it I because I've got so many gremlins on my shoulder anyway I by the time I was like oh do you want to do mock the week do you want to do this you want to do that I said if it had been 10 years earlier I'd been like oh my god I can't do that I'm not good enough to do that I was like oh I've done my time I can do it I can do it be fine um so

27:51.68 Talal K yeah

27:53.90 alexei sayle And so now you're actually so you I mean, you're touring you have your own show now which goes out in large venues. Okay.

28:02.26 Jen Yeah, i'm i'm

28:03.83 Talal K Tell us about your upcoming tour, Jen.

28:06.49 Jen I'm going to tell you about my upcoming tour. Thank you, Talal, for crowbarring that in. and Well, I go to i get in New Zealand in a week, so i'm um start my tour so my tour in the New Zealand Comedy Festival, and then and then I'm touring Australia.

28:14.64 alexei sayle okay

28:14.86 Talal K Whoa.

28:19.78 Jen And then my UK and Ireland tour begins in October 2021.

28:25.38 Jen of this year 2025 and then it'll go straight through to 2026 and we're adding more dates um so you can check

28:31.05 alexei sayle but What sort of venues will you be playing?

28:34.30 Jen Well, it's a mixed in mixed venue. So I'm doing like, I think Bristol Old Vic, for example, that's 400 plus.

28:42.11 alexei sayle All

28:42.80 Jen And then i'm doing like um then I'm doing the Apollo in London at the event in Apollo, which is we which is an insane amount of people. So um it it varies from place to place.

28:50.35 Talal K That's amazing. Yeah.

28:51.49 alexei sayle right.

28:53.20 Jen and um

28:53.46 alexei sayle Yeah.

28:54.80 Jen And, so you know, i i like i like that, i like that mix of of of venues. So, you know, I'll be doing bigger venues in places like Birmingham and London and and Manchester and and smaller venues in Cornwall.

29:06.39 alexei sayle Right.

29:10.35 Jen You know, much smaller venues in Cornwall.

29:11.09 alexei sayle Well, yeah.

29:12.31 Talal K yeah

29:13.30 alexei sayle But still, you're you're taking your message to the the people of Cornwall who want to hear it. How do you like, i mean, I don't know if anybody else, I mean, I'm always interested in the and the logistics.

29:17.97 Jen Yeah.

29:22.79 alexei sayle I had the tour manager who just died, but he he knew the distance from the power sockets to the state. He knew where all the power sockets were in every every venue in Europe.

29:36.33 Jen What? Oh my God.

29:38.70 alexei sayle He toured with a lot of bands and stuff as well.

29:38.75 Jen i

29:41.67 Jen I was just going to say, can I have his number?

29:43.97 alexei sayle I just find that stuff.

29:45.96 Jen But he, and sadly, no.

29:45.98 Talal K That's a professional right there.

29:46.36 alexei sayle And now he's dead. Yeah.

29:47.88 Talal K but

29:49.47 Jen Yeah, this will be, so this is my fourth tour and this will be the first time I have a tour manager because I've never had a tour manager before.

29:54.68 alexei sayle yeah

29:57.91 alexei sayle Really? Shit, that's tough.

29:59.36 Jen um

30:00.49 alexei sayle i don't why How will you travel then?

30:00.60 Jen so

30:01.89 alexei sayle What will you travel in? Name the vehicle and the tour manager.

30:05.98 Jen It'll be a Toyota Yaris. um ah I don't know, actually. the this because like like The last tour I did was like an insane tour. did 115 dates and I and i i had you know organized all the travel and I mainly went by train and sometimes one of my supports would drive to venues.

30:25.42 Jen But on the whole, I was just doing i organized it all myself, including hotels and everything.

30:26.31 alexei sayle Yeah. Wow, really? So you do your own promotion?

30:30.94 Jen I did everything. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

30:32.16 alexei sayle Fucking hell, really?

30:32.83 Jen um and um

30:33.18 alexei sayle Jesus.

30:35.30 Jen ah But this time my tour producer is is great and and they are organising my hotels and stuff and all of that so I don't have to do that.

30:41.93 alexei sayle Right. Which promoter is it? Right.

30:44.46 Jen this His name's Paul Willis and he's amazing and he's doing an incredible job. And my... so haven't got a tour manager organised yet but I think I'm going to get one somebody that can hold my hand and and deal with the...

31:00.83 Jen Deal with all the stuff when you come in so you don't have to deal with all that.

31:01.05 alexei sayle Yeah, you need it. ah Yeah.

31:04.35 Jen And then I can just go and sit in my dressing room and do the show.

31:04.47 Talal K you

31:07.11 alexei sayle Yeah.

31:07.39 Jen So this will be the first tour that I do that. And I'm i'm um excited to have someone, some help, you know.

31:14.03 alexei sayle Yeah. um Yeah, no, it...

31:16.59 Talal K I'll fucking do it.

31:16.83 alexei sayle it

31:18.09 Talal K Do I get to come with you to New Zealand and Australia?

31:22.13 Jen Unfortunately, Talal, I literally wish ah wish I could have a ah tour manager with me in Australia and New Zealand, but I can't afford it because the rooms aren't big enough.

31:22.23 alexei sayle You'll get pick up somebody local there.

31:32.04 Jen But, you know, when I hit the big time, Talal, I'll give you a call, mate.

31:37.40 alexei sayle is Yes.

31:39.18 Jen We can...

31:40.43 alexei sayle He'd be a good tour manager, I think.

31:41.82 Talal K yeah

31:42.77 Jen I think you'd be bored, Talal.

31:45.54 alexei sayle I think on my last tour...

31:45.85 Jen It is a lot travelling.

31:46.57 Talal K i'm I'm a professional at maximizing my time off.

31:46.67 Jen Yeah.

31:50.86 Talal K Like, yeah, I'll have like three hours to myself and I'll go to a zoo, do a bungee jump, climb climbed the Sydney Harbour Bridge and then be back in the hotel lobby in time to take you to the show, yeah.

31:51.15 Jen Oh, yeah.

32:02.83 Jen And they're back in time for the show. God, I like that. God, you're like...

32:08.09 alexei sayle You have to get the right...

32:08.65 Jen That's it that's intimidating.

32:11.84 alexei sayle i am Years ago, i because I was friendly with Victoria Wood for a while, and um she had a...

32:17.08 Jen I love Victoria Wood.

32:17.74 alexei sayle Yeah, she was... yeah People thought she was shy, and she wasn't, actually.

32:19.49 Jen my God.

32:21.71 alexei sayle She was extremely confident and arrogant in that way, you know, in a good way.

32:27.68 Jen Good for her.

32:27.85 alexei sayle but she had But she she could find herself bullied by people, and she did... I remember her telling us, the tour manager, that wouldn't... Like, wouldn't iron her, you know, say, can you iron my top? I'm about to go on in front of 3,000 people. And they'd say, no.

32:42.72 alexei sayle and she I mean, I think she learned, she got some steel eventually. But and I think in the sort early days of big success, she'd often, you know, and i had ah I had a tour manager like on my last tour, I think, was like who had sex with every female receptionist in every hotel that we, um,

33:00.47 Jen Wow.

33:00.56 alexei sayle we stopped off at. Yes. He wasn't exactly concentrating either. Um, so you need to get the right person.

33:06.94 Jen um I like the way he's ah he's really slotted in the time there. He's really maximised the spare time he has.

33:13.64 alexei sayle yeah

33:14.43 Talal K Yeah, bloody hell.

33:16.25 Jen Yeah. what sorts of What sort of, you know, like cubicles have you got available just to bang on out before I take Alexi to work?

33:23.17 alexei sayle ah ah

33:24.36 Talal K ah

33:25.83 alexei sayle Well, they could always find an empty room, you know I think. I i don't know.

33:29.12 Jen Yeah. ah Cleaning cupboard. Here we go.

33:32.66 alexei sayle but so but I mean, a good tour manager is... ah is ah I mean, obviously, have I have Linda with me as well, my wife. Your partner wouldn't come with you?

33:42.14 Jen No, she'd rather she'd rather drag her face down a pebble dash wall than do that. That's not her thing. I mean, the very idea that she'd come with me to watch me perform every night. She'd... No.

33:53.14 alexei sayle Really?

33:53.43 Jen She'll come once.

33:53.55 alexei sayle Really?

33:54.55 Jen She'll come once. That's very good. And then bye-bye. um But also, we've got young children, so it would be impossible as well for her to come.

34:00.55 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

34:02.50 Talal K Yeah.

34:02.75 Jen But even, Alexi, even if we didn't, she just... Also, let's be honest, touring isn't fun. It's not like super fun.

34:11.78 alexei sayle No, no.

34:12.77 Jen It's a lot of like, oh, when people say me, you're taking the family? No, because I'm going to be like Wellington two days, Auckland a day, fly to Melbourne three days, Canberra one day, Brisbane three days, then I'm going to Melbourne again, Sydney.

34:26.98 Jen I'm like, the children will be like, what the fuck are we doing? Yeah.

34:31.67 Talal K yeah

34:31.92 Jen This is horrendous.

34:33.08 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

34:35.01 Jen So, yeah, I, but you know, what I would like to do is what is, is to be able to go and tour where I can spend, ah have a few more gaps between and then be able to take the family out and then have like a little holiday at the end of it.

34:52.71 Jen That's what I'd like, but i just can't, you know, at the moment it's, it's not affordable.

34:53.84 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

34:57.38 Jen It's a long way to go Australia.

34:59.29 alexei sayle but and It is a long way. you know if well ahll um the other thing one of One of the things I'm interested in is business class seating on airlines.

35:08.24 Jen Oh, God, I did my first business.

35:09.75 alexei sayle So you go...

35:11.00 Jen No, I'm not going business class. I'm like, fuck. But I flew.

35:13.29 alexei sayle Fuck, really?

35:13.92 Jen Someone flew me business class to Australia last year to do a gig.

35:17.72 alexei sayle Yeah.

35:17.83 Jen And I couldn't. And I've never. I've never flown business class or anything, anything close to anything outside of economy.

35:25.80 alexei sayle Right.

35:25.96 Jen And i I literally don't know how I'm ever going to fly again.

35:29.17 alexei sayle No, it's impossible.

35:32.16 Jen I just can't believe that all of these years these fucking pricks have been up front living the Vida Loca up there while I've been crammed in the back with my knees up to my chin eating with plastic cutlery.

35:37.96 alexei sayle Oh yeah.

35:41.16 alexei sayle It's yeah.

35:44.91 Jen I mean... I was excited I got a gin and tonic once. Well, I'm sorry, but I got to business class, Alexi, and they offered me an old fashioned. And I was like, this is absolutely out of, you know.

35:53.03 alexei sayle Yeah.

35:55.35 Talal K wild, it's wild.

35:55.65 Jen Yeah, it's incredible.

35:56.31 alexei sayle Yeah.

35:57.82 Jen Bag of gummy bears. Why? Just because. OK, there was nuts, as many nuts as you wanted.

36:00.97 alexei sayle Yeah.

36:03.78 Jen They had a they had a pot full of pastries that you could just go in and help yourself.

36:07.80 alexei sayle Yeah.

36:09.64 Jen M&Ms were on the were just like flowing like like water.

36:13.03 alexei sayle Yeah. Well, it's...

36:13.81 Talal K Oh yeah. there's On the double-decker planes, there's even like a bar.

36:18.25 Jen It was, yeah, I was on the, there was a, there was a bar.

36:19.98 Talal K There's like a bar lounge. You can just go and hang out.

36:23.97 Jen I was on the double decker thing.

36:24.00 Talal K Yeah.

36:25.25 Jen There was a blinking bar.

36:26.97 alexei sayle Yeah, bus A380.

36:27.09 Jen I couldn't believe it.

36:28.10 alexei sayle This

36:28.84 Jen Yeah. and but

36:29.98 alexei sayle but this is

36:31.35 Talal K Sorry, Alexius, of course.

36:31.64 alexei sayle is a technical term.

36:31.80 Jen Alexi.

36:33.89 alexei sayle Yes.

36:35.04 Jen ah Anyway, that'll be the one and only time I do it, but it was lush.

36:36.08 alexei sayle I know it's

36:37.98 Talal K ah Alexi, there is a very, i've I've had a couple emails suggesting the prospect of us doing a live podcast in Australia.

36:39.25 alexei sayle you be You'll get there.

36:50.11 Talal K What would you think about that?

36:50.42 alexei sayle Oh, right.

36:51.23 Talal K Would you be asked to fly out there if they took care of it all?

36:54.62 alexei sayle a

36:54.72 Jen ah way.

36:56.27 alexei sayle If they...

36:56.59 Jen It's a lot.

36:56.95 alexei sayle um Yeah, if they... I mean, I've been to Australia seven times, so...

37:00.14 Talal K I know, i know. That's the thing that I'm like scared that you would just be like, nah, can't be fucked. And I'm like, all right, I guess we won't go to Australia.

37:05.06 alexei sayle Well, I can't see that the... like

37:09.08 Jen You gotta to go.

37:09.21 alexei sayle up I can't see that the economy would would work out. But yeah, yeah, no, if they could if they could make it work um economically.

37:16.79 Talal K Well, you do have a fan base there and they miss you. Okay.

37:23.17 alexei sayle But it would yeah would have to be club class and all that shit. you know so But yeah, I've done that before.

37:29.57 Talal K okay

37:29.58 Jen I mean, if you're going to go, don't do what I'm doing and go to Australia when it's winter there.

37:35.20 Talal K Oh, yeah.

37:35.33 Jen You've got to go when it's winter here, summer there, because I've really messed up big time going out now.

37:37.52 Talal K Yeah.

37:37.62 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

37:37.71 Talal K Yeah.

37:41.49 alexei sayle Still, I mean, Brisbane and that would be all right.

37:41.92 Jen it's like

37:43.47 alexei sayle It would be sunny up there.

37:45.19 Jen Brisbane will be nice and I've got three days there, so I might i will get sunshine in Brisbane.

37:46.46 alexei sayle Yeah.

37:49.15 Jen I'm looking forward to that.

37:49.86 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah.

37:51.50 Talal K Brice Vega.

37:51.58 alexei sayle I did. I had... That's the only time it's ever happened to me. I had that where... I don't really know why. I did a tour there in 1990, and it just was one of those...

38:03.97 alexei sayle You know, where we really took off and we were put in putting in extra dates. And um I was like on the news when I got there. And for some reason, I was just briefly.

38:14.77 alexei sayle And I found that in hotels, the secret floors where you get like a special.

38:20.59 Jen What?

38:21.18 alexei sayle Yeah, the secret floors, which are like where have like a but ah butler and you have to have like a special key to get off of that floor.

38:29.92 Talal K Oh, wow.

38:30.72 alexei sayle And I was staying in the place.

38:31.63 Jen What hotels is this?

38:33.88 alexei sayle ah Most of them.

38:34.15 Jen What all? They have a special floor.

38:35.58 alexei sayle Premier Inn. Premier Inn, Ashford Kent.

38:37.26 Jen Premier ring.

38:38.74 alexei sayle Yeah, there's a special celebrity floor. They have their own cocktail bars and stuff like that. Yeah, and that's the only time I ever graduated to the secret floor, though. went I went back, like, I think I left it too long. I went back in 96, I think it was.

38:53.56 alexei sayle Yeah. And, you know, rather than putting in an extra dates, we were taking dates out. Yeah.

39:00.33 Talal K Thank you.

39:01.17 Jen Oh God, that's,

39:02.48 alexei sayle Well, no, but we didn't. We we sold the dates we could, but we didn't. And the the the promoter had actually...

39:06.92 Jen you just didn't add the extra ones.

39:08.97 alexei sayle Yeah, we just didn't have the extra ones. But, but and yeah, the um the promoter ended up owing me money. And aye ah they for some reason, they televised.

39:23.71 alexei sayle You remember when Michael Hutchins died? They televised his funeral.

39:26.80 Jen Yeah.

39:28.66 alexei sayle And the promoter was one of the pallbearers. But also there was a friend of mine who was another pallbearer, Andy Gill from the Gang of Four. um also And so I was sort of ringing Andy and saying, because he was live on the he said, that bloke behind you carrying Michael Hutchins' coffin, he owes me $5,000 Australian dollars.

39:45.87 alexei sayle Can you ask him to?

39:47.91 Jen Can you have a word?

39:48.97 alexei sayle Yeah, can you have a word with him about that?

39:51.95 Jen Mate, I've got Alexi on the blower and he's saying,

39:52.57 alexei sayle but ah yeah like she's other five Harley you owe me he says you owe me Australian dollars and

39:59.75 Jen I hate that. with that it That is classic promoter, isn't it? is there's

40:03.29 Talal K but

40:03.56 alexei sayle yeah

40:04.15 Jen There's always... I don't know what it was like back in your day, but there's always promoters that every comedian knows absolutely notoriously that never pay and yet everyone still works for the prick and you see the conversations going around on Facebook and stuff.

40:12.46 alexei sayle yeah

40:21.76 Jen Why has so-and-so not paid? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. was like, why do we keep working for them if we know?

40:27.02 alexei sayle Yeah, it's kind of it's the eternal optimism of comedians, I suppose.

40:27.39 Jen they're not going to pay.

40:33.00 alexei sayle isn't I mean, I've been very lucky, really. I started out with the McIntyres and then I went with David Johnson, passed Password Promoter, and they're both very good, really.

40:43.64 alexei sayle but Yeah, yeah, I was the first comedy act that he ever did.

40:44.16 Jen yeah You mean Phil McIntyre, in case so anyone's thinking, really?

40:49.85 alexei sayle Yeah, before me, he was doing guy called Blaster Bates, who was a demolition expert, who gave talks.

40:56.37 Jen This sounds so 80s to me.

40:58.04 alexei sayle I know, he gave talks about blowing up chimneys. And he did he had a psychic called Doris Stokes. That's what Phil McIntyre was doing. Ask him about that.

41:08.58 Jen Really?

41:09.30 alexei sayle Tell Phil McIntyre, yeah, biggest comedy.

41:12.26 Jen um what?

41:14.03 alexei sayle And I was the first comedy actor he did.

41:16.98 Jen So Phil McIntyre is one of the oldest comedy producers, promoters

41:17.22 Talal K wow

41:21.52 alexei sayle Yeah, he was right there. Yeah.

41:24.96 Jen Wow, I did not know that.

41:26.42 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah, no, he was he did like the first, he did the Young i mean much more successful he did the young Ones tour, and that's how he and then he he became Ben Elton's manager and stuff like that. But he he was, he was ent I mean, like a lot of them, he was an end secretary, I think, at Preston Polytechnic, and I think he had a T-shirt, remember he had a T-shirt printing firm and stuff like that. And he did heavy metal bands, and then somehow he he did a few dates on my very first tour.

41:53.79 alexei sayle And then after eventually I gave him exclusive, you know, rights to all my, yeah.

41:57.44 Jen Okay.

41:59.81 alexei sayle Yeah.

42:01.18 Jen it's ah It's a wash with promoters, producers now.

42:04.45 alexei sayle Yeah.

42:04.56 Jen Absolutely.

42:05.39 alexei sayle And i I mean, it must be, it's a, it's a game that attracts sharks, isn't it? Really? I mean, I think it's. Hmm.

42:11.86 Jen i think if it's, you know, um ive been very fortunate with the ones that I've had who have not been sharky at all, but, but you know, and very sort of... um ah You know, very transparent about the the the the money and all of that. So, but yes, it it does.

42:29.57 Jen ah and Anything where you're taking money creaming money off someone else tends to attract sharks.

42:34.63 alexei sayle Yeah. It's capitalism. I mean, it was in the early days because we were all so defined. you know no There was no circuit. When I started, there was no circuit.

42:45.05 alexei sayle There were no venues.

42:45.41 Jen No.

42:46.03 alexei sayle you know We were inventing it all for the first time. So you could either... somebody In some towns, you'd just get... somebody who was the local fantasist, you know, who just, you know, and you didn't really know, you couldn't work it, you know, you'd, so it was just like a lunatic in Loughborough or somewhere, you know, and you'd, yeah, you know, that he couldn't fulfill.

43:05.77 Talal K with a vision.

43:09.55 Jen I mean, this that's still the same today.

43:12.00 alexei sayle Really?

43:12.90 Jen i mean, I've just listened to you going, it that that these people are still going.

43:18.05 alexei sayle So you end up in a yeah you end up in a fucking old age pensioners care home or something performing on milk crates.

43:18.14 Jen Either that...

43:24.06 Jen Yeah. oh And you walk in and they hand you a mic and go and you go, where's the stage? And they go, just there in the corner. And you go, and there's just people milling around. And you're like, is that when when does the comedy start? Whenever you walk on stage. You're like, there is no stage.

43:39.54 alexei sayle Yeah.

43:39.82 Jen it's It's just me in the middle of a room having a breakdown. What are what is this?

43:42.38 alexei sayle Yeah.

43:42.98 Jen This is a nightmare.

43:43.26 alexei sayle and

43:44.08 Jen Yeah.

43:45.05 alexei sayle That's what, yeah, I mean, people don't realise that they see, also they, I mean, again, they see you being funny and on a stage with lights and a sound system and an audience is paid and they don't, they think you can therefore be funny anywhere that you can be in the back room of their meat warehouse that you can, you know, you can do it there.

44:02.80 Talal K Yeah. Yeah.

44:06.80 alexei sayle And of course it's entirely contextual, isn't it? You know, of course it is, you know, it's not, no.

44:10.47 Jen Yeah. But people don't know that. And the thing is, it's really hard to explain to people, you know, stand-up comedy is really hard when everything is in place.

44:13.85 alexei sayle no

44:19.33 alexei sayle Yes.

44:19.80 Jen It still can be an absolute shit show.

44:22.41 alexei sayle Yes.

44:22.67 Jen So if you take any of those things away, take away the lights, take away the microphone, take away the stage, then we are, all intents and purposes, fucked. Now, every now and again, it might still work.

44:31.51 alexei sayle yeah

44:32.21 Talal K yeah

44:34.43 alexei sayle yes

44:34.61 Jen It might still work. But that's not because it works. That's because we got lucky.

44:39.50 alexei sayle yeah oh you your skill as well you

44:40.24 Jen So, and your skill, yeah.

44:42.12 alexei sayle you post to kind of yeah

44:45.19 Jen But um yeah, all of that still is going.

44:46.82 Talal K Have you um you ever played ah the Glastonbury Cabaret tent?

44:50.64 Jen Oh, yeah, I'm going again this year. So this will be um my fourth year in a row Glastow Cabaret.

44:57.45 Talal K Yeah.

44:58.94 Jen But the thing with Glastonbury is, and the Cabaret 10 is great, by the way, and there's loads, there's always loads of stuff going on. But one, most people don't know what's going on in the Cabaret 10 because they haven't gone to Glastonbury to so watch, ca to see comedy.

45:11.49 Talal K See comedy, yeah.

45:13.96 Jen So, you know, that person, often there's a person playing the cabaret tent that, but there's no you know, people say to me, oh i'm I didn't realise you were at Glastonbury.

45:25.49 Jen And i've I've always wanted to see you do stand-up. And I'm like, well, i don't know what to tell you. I've put it on my social media, maybe the shadow band did get in the way a little bit. But, um yeah you know, people don't look to see what's happening in the cabaret tent.

45:36.95 Jen And often the people that, the comedians that they can't get tickets for the rest of the year, they're there.

45:37.55 Talal K yep

45:42.25 Jen They're going to be there. And you can just waltz in.

45:43.13 Talal K yeah

45:45.77 Jen and they'll be doing half an hour set, you know. So it's also, it's fucking huge.

45:51.32 Talal K ah It's a huge room. I love it. I love it. ah We love it. Me and Alexi were there last year. I'm going to be back this year. It's fucking huge room, cute tall, tall ceiling. There's loads of sound bleeding in from some clown show across the field, ah juggling antics and fire breathing all that.

46:06.41 alexei sayle Yeah.

46:09.53 Talal K And it's just blasting in through the through the canvas walls. um

46:13.59 Jen yeah

46:14.72 Talal K And it's a hard one to do for your first, like, I was gonna ask you for advice basically, cause I haven't had a gig in fucking months and i'm i' I don't have any books before Glassnose. So I'm, I'm, I'm, started to shit myself a bit, but I remember just enjoying it when I just took my time and was, took it real slow and just enjoyed it for myself.

46:34.03 Talal K And then, but um yeah, a room like that, I don't know. I feel like they should have a curtain in the middle of the room to kind of squeeze the space in.

46:42.08 alexei sayle It's a cross between a venue and a stable, isn't it, really? Because there's a straw on the floor and everything.

46:48.88 Jen And it depending on your rights and also it depends what time you're doing it and what's happening. If there's suddenly some sort of brass band street performer suddenly just plants itself outside your cabaret outside while you're on, which happened to me, I think, the second year.

46:59.78 alexei sayle Yeah.

47:00.51 Talal K Yeah.

47:01.58 alexei sayle We had that.

47:07.38 alexei sayle Yeah.

47:08.50 Jen And all you could hear was some bloody, some tuba and a trombone going at it. You know, it's quite hard to ah keep your focus. But

47:18.11 Talal K So what's your approach and what's your mentality before you step out on that stage?

47:18.43 Jen I mean, I just get through it. Just get through it. Don't keep your expectations low.

47:24.03 alexei sayle So you

47:27.03 Jen Don't expect to hear any laughter and just plow on until, until, oh, that's 30 minutes.

47:31.64 alexei sayle you can get off. Yeah.

47:34.24 Jen i think if you if you go with any expectation, because I think you know when you hear, I'm going to be playing Glastonbury, and you think, wow, this is going be great. And then you walk on, and you're like, this is a massive tent, and there's 12 people.

47:46.45 Jen One of them looks like they're on ketamine.

47:46.76 Talal K Yeah.

47:48.50 Jen okay um you know yeah it's You've got to steel yourself for the fact that there's not many people in a very, very big tent, in a very, very big space.

47:57.84 Talal K And they're spread out as well.

47:59.57 Jen And they are spread out. So you've got to see what i do is is, and don't speed up because then you're half an hour set, what you'll do in 10 minutes.

48:10.70 Jen So just little bit of pacing around, a little bit of talk, little bit chit chat, a little bit of like ah going into the crowd a bit. If if if you feel like the energy is dropping, acknowledge what's happening in the, because sometimes something absolutely bananas will be happening and the comedian doesn't acknowledge it And I'm like, dude, you can't,

48:27.63 alexei sayle Yeah.

48:28.48 Jen Continue your set when, you know, ah flip in a French theatrical troupe is singing, you know, Jacques outside. and You've got to like, you've got to acknowledge, always acknowledge what's happening in the space.

48:42.91 Talal K Yeah.

48:43.09 Jen and And if you keep your expectations low and you don't think, um oh God, this is a reflection on me.

48:45.31 Talal K That's a good one, yeah.

48:50.69 Jen It's no reflection on you because literally it's only full for James Acaster and Nish Kumar. Then you... you You'll just enjoy it.

49:00.35 Talal K Yeah.

49:00.59 Jen I think just dick about. Dick about and then once your set is over, just go out and enjoy Glastonbury because that's why we're there.

49:09.08 Talal K Yeah.

49:09.25 alexei sayle yeah that's really right so i mean just to we haven't covered nearly your your many aspects of your life but having attained this um success you decided to blow it all by supporting palestine basically

49:10.33 Talal K Fuck yeah.

49:24.24 Jen ah Yeah.

49:26.28 alexei sayle said it to

49:27.38 Talal K Yeah.

49:28.49 alexei sayle ah

49:28.71 Talal K but

49:29.22 Jen yeah Well, I don't know that I've blown it, but it certainly makes people uncomfortable and it certainly splits the room.

49:34.41 Talal K no

49:39.39 Jen But i came to the conclusion quite quickly that I would rather have in my audience a room full of people that shared my values and shared the things that I believe in

49:53.56 alexei sayle Yeah.

49:53.88 Jen And for that reason... um I was willing to, at the time, I i didn't know if it was going to be a sacrifice or not, to be honest, um of of just being, speaking out for what I believed in, which I which i and i so you know which i completely 100% in every single bone of my body believe in.

50:12.78 alexei sayle Yeah.

50:13.14 Jen So i it didn't feel like a big deal at the time. um People have kept telling me it's a big deal. And I have lost work. it's not I'm not naive. I have lost work. And I'm sure there's work I didn't even know that's out there that I haven't gotten because of it, I'm sure.

50:30.11 Jen But I stand by my decision. And in time, if I'm not vindicated soon, I will be. And um I think everyone really, i think if you've got a platform, I believe personally that you should be using it.

50:38.16 alexei sayle Yeah.

50:47.89 Talal K Use it.

50:48.64 alexei sayle Yeah, it's the great I think it's the great moral question of our age.

50:48.76 Talal K Yeah.

50:49.40 Jen You should be

50:52.40 alexei sayle We didn't ask to be, you know, but I mean, the actions of Israel, you know that you know, in its various manifestations. If you're not vocal about this, what are you going to be vocal about, I think, you know?

51:06.00 alexei sayle And those who stay silent are condemned by the silence, I think.

51:06.28 Jen Yeah. And

51:08.43 Talal K Fucking A.

51:12.31 Jen I think that's everyone.

51:14.84 alexei sayle Yeah. Yeah.

51:15.29 Jen Somebody said to me Jen, you know, you're quite judgmental, which I try not to be. and i And I think I'm trying. I think I'm a lot less judgmental than a lot of my friends on the left. um And I tried because I don't think it's very helpful because what I want is for people to be involved. And I and i don't give a shit when you get involved. I don't care if it's tomorrow.

51:33.27 Jen Please join us. I would love to have you.

51:33.99 alexei sayle Yeah.

51:35.10 Jen That's my view and opinion. But a friend of mine said to me, you know, Jen, there's lots of people doing stuff, but you just don't know about it. You know, and I went, well, if I don't know about it, it doesn't count.

51:47.13 Jen It's meaningless. i mean, if I don't know that they're doing it, ah it's absolutely fucking meaningless.

51:53.29 alexei sayle What do they mean they're doing it in their heads?

51:53.45 Jen You know, like, Yeah, like they're very cross-gen. You just don't know about it. Well, like I was like, and well, then it doesn't mean anything.

51:58.40 alexei sayle Yeah.

52:00.00 Jen If they're not vocal about it if I can't see them, if they're not making a stand, if they haven't said out loud, then if they're donating money in the background, it's kind of, I, it's, that's like okay.

52:08.22 alexei sayle Yeah, fuck you. that Yeah.

52:11.15 Jen I'm glad if that assuages your guilt, but it doesn't make ah a tangible difference.

52:12.57 alexei sayle Yeah.

52:15.93 Jen And bravery comes in in numbers. The more people that are vocal, then that gives other people the bravery to come forward.

52:21.32 alexei sayle Yeah.

52:23.31 Jen Because lots of people are going, this feels wrong, right? but there is seat the But the propaganda of the Israeli ah PR machine has made people afraid.

52:31.10 alexei sayle yeah

52:33.87 Jen What if I say this? Will I be cancelled? What if I do this? Will I lose my job? It's like, you're going to be okay.

52:42.89 Jen And I think now, maybe not a year ago, when it was really, when it was, but I think we can see the mask has slipped and the wheels are falling off.

52:42.93 Talal K Yeah.

52:45.59 alexei sayle yeah it's uh yeah we can yeah yeah the holes are starting to show it's true yeah yeah

52:52.96 Jen When you've got a Tory politician standing in parliament denouncing Israel, the rats are leaving the sinking ship, babe.

52:57.99 Talal K Yeah.

52:58.04 alexei sayle yeah a

53:00.44 Talal K That was wild. Yeah.

53:01.22 alexei sayle yeah

53:02.14 Jen You can join in now. i mean I mean, I will say it's quite late, but but please do join.

53:04.31 alexei sayle yeah

53:06.26 Talal K Yeah.

53:07.99 alexei sayle Yeah, yeah. or I agree completely. um Jen, I think you, do you have to go? you have to leave us?

53:15.60 Jen um I have a meeting at 11.30 but I told them I can be five minutes late.

53:18.19 alexei sayle All right.

53:20.28 Talal K Okay, while we're doing that edit point here as well, ah Jen, when we say goodbye, please don't close the website.

53:20.48 Jen Yeah.

53:25.23 Jen yeah

53:26.94 Talal K We're just saying goodbye for the podcast. And then when I stop the podcast, we just need to let everything upload before you sign out.

53:33.24 Jen Got you. Got you.

53:34.01 Talal K Understood? So we'll say goodbye at the end of the pod.

53:35.02 Jen Yeah.

53:36.94 Talal K um But please don't shut the tab just yet. Stay with us, okay?

53:40.84 Jen Okay.

53:41.34 Talal K Until the official goodbye.

53:41.41 Jen Yeah, yeah.

53:43.36 alexei sayle He...

53:43.42 Talal K ah edit Edit point there.

53:43.53 alexei sayle He...

53:43.55 Jen Okay.

53:44.67 alexei sayle he yeah

53:45.47 Talal K Well, Jen, ah where can people buy tickets for your bloody tour and other shows and find out more about your ah gigs and shit?

53:51.66 Jen um

53:54.77 Jen Yes. ah You could...

53:56.32 Talal K You got a website, Jen?

53:57.86 Jen Yeah, I've got a website. I've got website to learn. So it's jenbrister.co.uk. You can find all of my shows there, please.

54:05.00 Talal K Mm-hmm.

54:05.73 Jen um There'll be more dates added. i think we've got a Leeds date coming up and um we've got some um more dates in the southwest of England coming up. what We haven't announced yet.

54:17.18 Jen So keep an eye on that. um But there plenty there's plenty of shows already up and on sale.

54:21.59 Talal K Sick.

54:22.05 Jen And also, if you're in London, i'm ah the Apollo show, next year so please do it's big it's a big bloody room and yes no we can so i also would like to say that we are not we but i am involved with um helping to put on a show for health workers for palestine at the trotsky on the 19th of july um i have asked alexi to to be there as well

54:26.66 alexei sayle Yeah, it's a big room. you want Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah. Yeah.

54:30.72 Talal K Can we mention the July thing yet or not?

54:50.64 alexei sayle Yeah.

54:53.11 Jen um

54:53.23 alexei sayle It's put me on the spot. I have to do it.

54:55.76 Jen on his podcast.

54:56.83 alexei sayle now yet No, no, I'm busy.

54:56.88 Jen So now, unfortunately, wait he's obliged now to do it.

54:58.68 alexei sayle I'm at Alistair Campbell's place in Tuscany.

55:06.85 Jen Does he have one in deal as well? I just want to know, just asking for a friend, just in case.

55:08.94 alexei sayle yeah yes.

55:10.65 Talal K got a great basement.

55:12.14 Jen um yeah so tickets aren't available I don't know when tickets are going to be on sale for that but it'll be on on sale very soon so keep an eye out for that all money raised goes to health health workers for Palestine and it's going to be a really insane event with loads and loads of people that musicians and comedians and of lots of famous actor people speaking so it will it will

55:34.35 Talal K So I'm sure that'll be on the Trotsky's website when when the tickets are available.

55:38.12 alexei sayle Is it actually pronounced Chotsky? It's not pronounced Chotsky, is it? Choxy?

55:43.78 Jen Oh shit, it's not Trotsky, is it?

55:45.85 alexei sayle No.

55:45.94 Jen It's that, it's Troxie.

55:46.50 alexei sayle he That's like my mother called, she could never get her head around Wagamama.

55:47.18 Jen But you know, whenever I say, whenever I've played at the Troxie, I've called it the Trotsky. I've just turned into my mother.

55:54.73 Talal K That's funny.

56:01.32 alexei sayle She called it Wagatianis.

56:06.11 Jen Whackety Annies is harder to say than Wagamamas.

56:08.64 Talal K Yep.

56:09.83 alexei sayle Well, you know, we haven't...

56:11.94 Talal K All right, go to the Troxies websites ah intermittently and check out if they've put tickets up.

56:17.08 alexei sayle mean, it should be called then.

56:19.14 Talal K ah Go to jenbrister.co.uk. If you're at Glastonbury, come see Jen Brister or myself ah doing our sets there. And fucking please, to support the show and keep the wheels of turning and keep us in business, go to patreon.com forward slash Alexis L podcast.

56:35.39 Talal K That's patreon.com forward slash Alexis L podcast.

56:35.61 alexei sayle por favor...

56:38.02 Talal K Just a few pennies, please, sir, or madam, or or them.

56:41.18 alexei sayle Oh, please, sir.

56:41.85 Talal K Please come and just throw some pennies in my pocket, please.

56:44.74 alexei sayle Please, sir.

56:45.29 Talal K It would be arms for the poor.

56:46.58 alexei sayle right i

56:48.40 Talal K armsforthepore.com forward slash Lexile podcast.

56:49.30 alexei sayle Just a stale barn would be something.

56:51.85 Talal K Email us at polacksyslpodcast.gmail.com. Follow us at Lexilepod on all the socials. Thank you, Jen Brister, for being here.

57:00.00 alexei sayle Thank you very much, Jen.

57:00.01 Jen Thank you so much, both of you. What a laugh.

57:01.36 alexei sayle Thank you. yeah

57:04.75 Talal K Alexi, last words.

57:06.88 alexei sayle Bye, Mike. this

57:09.29 Talal K Free Palestine.

57:10.14 alexei sayle so Oh, that's good.