[00:00:00] Hello and welcome to the latest edition of Concilio Better Places podcast, where I can genuinely say I'm absolutely delighted to be joined by another Enfield man, councilor Ergen herbal leader of Enfield Council Ergen, thank you very much for joining us today.

Thank you for having me on here, Nick. Oh, no problem.

So appreciate

you have lived all your life in Enfield. I think I'm saying. I, I'm born in,

born in Chase Farm Hospital. Yep. And I've lived in Edmonton my, my whole adult life and pretty much, uh, lived in Enfield North for a little while. Mm-hmm. But from the age of 10, lived in Edmonton and I still lived in Edmonton.

Lived my two kids.

Brilliant. Well, I used to live on St. Peters Road for a few years, so know, know the area very well. Um. You got into politics at quite a young age. How old were you when you first became a counselor?

I was 23 years old. Wow. When I became a counselor. Yeah. For Edmonton Greenwood, my home. Yep.

And it has been, it's been a true, true honor. I'm really proud of the work we've been doing in Edmonton Green. We've, especially with, um. A lot of the new levels of funding [00:01:00] that we're receiving from the government. Mm-hmm. We're doing some great things to create a cleaner and a safer Edmonton and Enfield.

Yeah. So 23 is a young age. Most people at 23, I think it's probably fair to say, aren't dreaming of spending their nights in a council Yeah. Chamber. So what, what inspired you to get involved? Firstly with the Labor Party, just for clarity, you are, um, a Labor party counselor, but, um. Yeah. It's become not just a member of the Labor Party, but also an activist and then a counselor at 20.

Well, you actually started younger than that's around, you know, 2021. What made you want to get involved? I was involved in

grassroots football. Mm-hmm. In Kims Park, in Edmonton. Okay. I used to play every Saturday with, uh, my brother and my friends. Mm-hmm. And counselor Andrew Stafford. May rest in peace. Yes.

Yes. Allowed us, he, he secured grant funding for him and the other counselors of the time mm-hmm. Secured grant funding for our grassroots football. Yeah. And you know, it's like a light bulb went off in my head where I said, yeah, I wanna do this when I, when I, when I finish university. Yeah. And go into local politics.

'cause you can see real change [00:02:00] happening on your doorstep. You can. Improve great things, and it was the likes of Andrew and others who pushed us to get involved in local politics.

Well, I still, I'm still waiting to see you at PIMS Park. Run on a Saturday. That invite is still, still there. Um, so you became a counselor, um, and pretty soon, relatively speaking, you were deputy leader of the council when Neel Kaan was leader.

Yeah. Again, um, more and more responsibility At quite a young age, he must be quite driven to, to really want to deliver for the council.

Absolutely. IL was a great boss. Mm-hmm. She took Enfield from strength to strength and now she's doing a great job as an mp. I served two years as Chief Whip, so as I was in charge of discipline in my labor group in Enfield.

Mm-hmm. And then I spent two years serving as associate cabinet member, and then finally two years as deputy leader to IL and supporting her deputizing for her. And over the past nine to 10 months, I've been the, the new-ish leader Yeah. Of Enfield.

Yeah. So Nestle became [00:03:00] MP for down in barking. Yeah. Um, you.

Well, then unopposed, I believe, um, as Leader of the Council, which is obviously a great show of faith in you from your, from your colleagues. Yeah. Um, it's kind of obvious in some respects, difference between being deputy and the leader. But how have you found it the past nine months, which is extra responsibility?

Yeah.

It's, it's tough. It, uh, the loneliest place in the mountain is at the top of the mountain. Very true. Yeah. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? So it's, it's tough, but. I'm very grateful that I've got a very strong team of colleagues. Mm-hmm. My cabinet members are strong. My, uh, back benches, my labor group.

Yeah. They all, they all get stuck in, they're all very active. Mm-hmm. They all stand up for their, for their communities and their residents. And our officers are great. And as you know, we've got a new. Wave of officers. Mm-hmm. People who have joined the organization. New CEO, new leader. Yes. A new start for Enfield.

Taking Enfield from strength to strength. Mm-hmm. Working really hard day and night for a cleaner and a safer Enfield. And it's [00:04:00] personal to me. Yeah. 'cause like you, I'm raising kids in the borough. Yeah. And like you, I've lived in the borough. For a significantly long time. Mm-hmm. And it is our home and we have to make it safer and cleaner for everyone.

Yeah. No, and I should, I should also declare I'm a former counselor, um, in Enfield, and I know how much hard work is, uh, frankly. Yes. Um, and how much hard work goes in that people don't see, um, being a counselor, I can only imagine as a leader as well. So you, you, you've got a vision that you've set out. Yes.

Uh, since becoming a leader for a fairer, cleaner, greener, safer Enfield, um, how is that translating itself in terms of the priorities you are focusing on?

Yeah, it's a really good question. Safer, cleaner are the priorities. Yeah. For a safer end field, we're working really hard with our police officers.

Mm-hmm. And with our voluntary and community groups in the borough, for example, we've just started weekend patrols in our parks. Yep. Where two police officers and two of our council officers patrol in our parks. Mm-hmm. And they tackle antisocial behavior. They also support people who may need their [00:05:00] support.

Mm-hmm. And they also, um, tackle any noise issues or barbecue issues or anything else. But that's just one example of how we're working with the police. We're also doing Operation Pisces. Okay. We've arrest, we've helped arrest over 600 people in Edmonton, thanks to Operation. And what's that focusing on Pisces tackling, on tackling prostitution, drug dealing, tackling organized crime.

Mm-hmm. We've done a really good job with that, and I'm really proud of the work we're doing. It's not just about arresting people. Mm-hmm. It's also supporting them and making sure they've got the support. They've, they get advice on how to. Get a job in how to get advice from our services and also working with our young people.

Yeah. To just like, I was supported by Andrew when I, all those years ago. Mm-hmm. Playing grassroots football in PIs Park. We want to support the young people of 2025 to make those decisions. And I think

it's about support. That's the key. 'cause I, I remember going to a meeting. Nestle chaired down on Joyce and Snell's?

A few. Well, when she, soon after she became leader of the council, and you know, it was clear [00:06:00] the prostitution challenges there were, and on the one hand we need in enforcement, and it was a real problem, and residents were saying, you know, they don't like living in an area where those issues are. But then you also have the human element of.

A feeling for people who are in that position. And that support is key, isn't it? And that's something your but the council is pursuing.

Absolutely. You have to do the education and the enforcement together. You can't do just one. Yeah. You have to do education and enforcement together. Lemme tell you a quick story.

Mm-hmm. So since we've started Operation Pisces, where I go, where my mechanic is based in Upper Edmonton, Edmonton, angel, where I get my tires changed and my car serviced, his name is Shar. I took my car to Shar recently and he goes. Ed again. You've got more police officers on the street. Your council staff are great.

They're on our high street. We can see a real difference. The crime is down. Mm-hmm. And I was like, wow. Thanks Sarah. Thanks for the positive feedback. We'll keep it up. And then I go and speak to my friend Deme, who lives in Joyce and snails and her kids are similar age to my kids. Yeah. And uh, deme goes again, honestly, [00:07:00] they used to be prostitution in our lifts and in the stairways, and we don't see that anymore.

And it's all been tackled and the drug dealing has been tackled on the estate. And I say, thanks, deme for the positive feedback. And then I go meet Selena who runs a coffee shop on the, on fourth Street, and she says the same thing. So. The positive feedback from the community, from the people we love and we care for in Edmonton.

That feedback is so important for us, and we have to, we have to build on that. We have to build on that. Cool. Well,

fourth Street was looking clean the last time I was there for the Victory Parade. Lovely. Um, for the champions of Europe. But that's, um, another thing, um, we've got the local plan, um, which is generating a lot of.

Headlines in Enfield, so to speak. Yeah. And more in line. It's interesting with the local papers becoming less and less online social media becoming more and more, it's probably best to talk in social media terms. Yeah. A lot of people are talking about the new local plan and, and, and you inherited. Well, you obviously as deputy leader, you were involved, but really I think Nestle would seem to be driving that forward externally.

Yes, it certainly looked like that. So you've become leader with a local plan. How is [00:08:00] that? How is that going? Local plan?

Every borough needs a local plan. Mm-hmm. As you know, it's important that you have a plan for your area to make sure the right homes are built in the right places, the right businesses.

Are built in the right areas and supported. Mm-hmm. And young people are supported. And also that we have a future looking plan to support, to take the borough from strength to strength. The local plan is really important for us. Mm-hmm. It means that if we can get it through, through the stages and if we can, um, adopt the new local plan, we're gonna be able to build family sized homes.

Yeah. Personally, I desperately need a family s size mm-hmm. To go myself as, as leader. And I know other people of my age need that as well. Yeah. I rent a two bed flat with two very small children. Um, we, we and other people in my position live in overcrowded. Yeah. Small, um, settings. So it's important that we build family sized affordable homes.

The only way we can do that is if we have a local plan. Mm-hmm. I know one of the controversial parts of [00:09:00] the local plan is that we're proposing to build on a small section of the green belt. Yeah. That we have in the borough. 40% of the borough is green belt and it's parks and it's open spaces and it's beautiful and we spend 10 million pounds a year to protect our green spaces and parks, and they're so important.

The local plan is suggesting that we only build on 7%. Of that 40%, a tiny amount of the grain, of the green belt that we want to build on. And let me be clear. Mm-hmm. The green belt that I'm talking about is not forests. We're not gonna build on parks, we're not gonna build on forests. We're proposing that we build on the car parks, golf courses, and the garden centers.

Mm-hmm. On already built up areas where we desperately need family sized homes and we have to have that serious conversation.

No, I fully agree with that. I remember attending one meeting and a lady was saying, we can't build on Green Book. We can't, can't do this kind of that. And I don't mean to about, you know, that was her passionate views.

And then the next breath she said, I'm gonna go go see my [00:10:00] grandkids. My son had to move to Harlow 'cause he can't afford to live in Enfield. And I, you know, it is difficult, you know, people do care for Yeah. Um, the environment and, but if we need family homes, surely Yeah. We can't just build. Taller buildings, they have an important role to play, uh, as well in terms of delivering the numbers needed and build to rent.

But we need family homes in Enfield, and I'm the same. It's like I look for my daughter and think, how's she ever gonna be able to afford? It may be possibly a one bed flat somewhere, but yeah. How is she able to afford a house in Enfield at the moment? Absolutely, because we just don't build enough of them in the borough and this, this isn't the land unless we look at greenbelt

and the, the suggestion from the opposition mm-hmm.

Is that we build in already built up areas in already areas that are densely populated, but that is not an option for us. We can. Ask that we build more in places like Hartford Road or all places that already have, uh, flats mm-hmm. And, and high buildings. What we do need is to have a serious conversation about car parks that have been labeled as green [00:11:00] belt.

Yep. And golf courses that have been labeled as these beautiful parks, which they're not. Let's, let's be seriouser, let's be honest with ourselves. And we don you have

public access.

And, and golf courses don't have public access. Yeah. I, I, I took my daughter, she was in the pram at the time. She was a toddler.

Mm-hmm. So we, we walked through white Web's golf course once. Mm-hmm. We were told to get off 'cause people were trying to play Yeah. People were trying to play golf. So, so these places aren't, they don't have public access. I want to make it very clear. Our proposals are to build on car parks, garden centers, and golf courses, not to build on parks or on or on green spaces like

that.

Okay.

Well, last time I played at Trump Park, it was about 15 years ago, and I was so bad. I'd advise not walking anywhere near it when I've got a golf club in my hand. It was that it was that bad. Um, what kind of targets is the local plan setting for? Let's carry on, stay on the theme of housing, but also crucially the employment.

Land as well, because not many people who wear Enfield as well as having 40% green belt has a huge, huge amount of [00:12:00] industrial land, doesn't it? Which, yeah, in certainly from a GLA perspective are actually looking to increase the amount of industrial land there is in London correctly in some ways 'cause of the amount of employment it brings.

But for a borough like Enfield, which has 40% green belt. I'm not sure a percentage. A big chunk of industrial land. Yeah. And the GLA is asking for more to be given. How do you, how do you manage that in the plan process? It must be

quite challenging. It's a really good question. We need to build homes, but like you've very openly and clearly said, we need to build those jobs and skills.

Yeah. And industry as well. Enfield's motto is by industry ever stronger, as you know. Mm-hmm. That's our, that's our slogan. So, and we do have one of the largest industrial estates in Europe. Mm-hmm. The Ely Industrial Estate, brims down industrial estate, all of that eastern corridor and pockets of industrial estate everywhere else.

It's so important that we invest in business, in skills, in jobs. We do four recruitment days every year. Mm-hmm. Uh, over 1000 people join mostly young people. Mm-hmm. Where we give them good job [00:13:00] advice and good job opportunities. We also have a construction skills academy. Mm-hmm. We've also done a business networking event, which I will invite you to the next one.

Thank you. Thank you. Um, we also do procurement 1 0 1 seminars for small businesses. Teaching them how to apply for council contracts. Yeah. And demystifying the process. The local plan will create thousands of jobs and it's as simple as that. Mm-hmm. And it's so important. We need those electricians, plumbers.

Yeah. We need those brick layers. We need those AI experts, those. Tech experts mm-hmm. To, to create a stronger future for the uk, for London, for Enfield. Yeah. And it's only through those strong jobs that we can create. It's only through those strong jobs that we can create a stronger community. And just to go back to how do we balance the industrial and the homes, as you say, we a tale of two cities.

We've got beautiful green space. Mm-hmm. We've got opportunity to build homes. On those spaces that aren't being utilized to their best use, like golf courses, car parks, [00:14:00] and we've got lots of concrete industrial estate. Yeah. Where we can rebuild good industrial areas.

One of the. Major areas in Enfield that many people would've heard of.

Um, is it always amazed me how few people, you know, in London actually aware of what Enfield, um, has in, in many respects. But I think there's been a lot of, certainly in the built environment where we'll talk about marine mortar Yeah. And the potential that has to deliver around 10,000 homes. You mentioned the Skills Academy, which I think must, I assume is the, that's right.

Disciple that's been done with history down at, at Meridian. How is that going from the council perspective? Meridian Water?

It is brilliant. Yeah. And I'm so grateful to all of our partners, Ry. The College of Northeast London and others and all the lovely people that we're working with down there to improve Meridian water.

So there have been some delay delays. There have been, there have been some delays, just like there have been delays with all other construction sites across the country because of crashed economy, Brexit, COVID, you name it. All of these issues have had an impact

every year. There's another thing, isn't it?

Every year there's another thing. Yeah.

I'm really [00:15:00] happy to confirm that last year we built 300 homes in Meridian Water. This year we're gonna build 300 homes, and next year we're gonna build 800 homes in total, 10,000 homes, 6,000 jobs. Mm-hmm. This is changing real lives. I met a new resident of Modine Water where I handed over her keys to congratulate her on securing a a Home.

Her name was Tina. Tina was supported by Enfield Council. She was on our housing waiting list. Mm-hmm. As someone who was a looked after child in Enfield, she secured a one bed flat in mode and water. We also helped her find a job in Central London. Through our advice careers and we built her a train station so she can get to her job water.

Yeah. So those are four ways Yeah. That we have improved Tina's life. There are thousands of Tinas out there. Mm-hmm. There are thousands of young people who we are going to support through the likes of Meridian Water, through our new local plan homes, jobs, a much stronger end field.

It it, it's always struck Meridium Water can be a good example of how.[00:16:00]

Local councils, the Greater London authority and the government, uh, I mean funding is is cut across both. Government to both parties, if you like. That's right. If, if, if all three parts of the public sector work together, it can actually encourage the private sector to then have the confidence absolute to invest.

Absolutely. And I think we seem to be seeing that in reading water. Absolutely. It's an awful lot of money from government has come in to fund the infrastructure which is needed first before the homes are built.

Absolutely. And I'm really grateful to the government mm-hmm. To the mayor of London. To all of our partners for believing in Meridian Water and for investing in it.

And we have reassured them by saying, we are serious. We want to build, we want to improve and field. And also it's working with the lacks of the NHS and the police as well. Mm-hmm. Because some of those new homes are for key workers. Yep. And North Middlesex hospital staff have secured homes there. Yeah.

Thanks to the affordability. And some of those homes are shared ownership. Some of those homes are built to rent. Most of those homes are social, affordable. Mm-hmm. We're also gonna have a GP clinic there. We're also gonna have businesses, [00:17:00] diagnostics clinic. We're, we're gonna have a nighttime economy, leisure facilities.

Mm-hmm. It's gonna be beautiful and I can't wait.

Brilliant. Uh, well, I can't wait to see it sit out. It's gonna be fantastic. And obviously at North Middlesex we also have history, um, the GLA combined and for the proposed development there. And we also have Joyce and Snails estate, which is a, it's a council led scheme, so within wood and water, Joyce and snails.

North, Middlesex North and Edmonton Green within that space. I mean, it's probably one of the largest development areas in London. Yeah. Really. I mean, it, it is quite remarkable how much could, could happen here. But how, how is Joyce and Snell's progressing? Um, because, um, council got planning commission for the redevelopment of.

The estate with the support of residents who supported it in the ballot. So where are we with that now?

It's going really well. And Joyce and Snell's also benefits from Operation Pisces. Mm-hmm. So we're making the estate safer and we're rebuilding the estate. All of the residents who live there, who are council tenants will be offered nicer homes, [00:18:00] much better homes.

Uh, when the redevelopment is finished and we are looking at meanwhile uses mm-hmm. And whatnot, it's going really well and we are, we are close to, um, seeing some construction take place and.

I've cited this as a place where it looks like a council's got it. Right with respect to small businesses and providing space.

Yes. For the genuine local people to set up businesses. Can you just, is it Angel Yard? Can you just explain

a bit more about, about that? Angel Yard is a brilliant, brilliant scheme. Angel Yard, as you know, and I'm really grateful to you for bringing it up. Angel Yard used to be garages. Mm-hmm. They used to attract antisocial behavior.

Yeah. They were not used. So working with the mayor of London and with our partners and with local businesses, we got rid of the garages and instead we put small business units there. Mm-hmm. And it's called Angel Yard. And they're tiny business sheds. I call them business sheds, but they're called business incubators and they're small.

Maybe as big as this room that we're in now. Mm-hmm. Um, they cost about 200, [00:19:00] 300 pound a month for a small business, which is brilliant. It's amazing. Brilliant. Isn't it amazing. Yeah. And you can be a, I've met a small accountant. Mm-hmm. Mr. Ed, I think his name was Ed. I. I was a small accountant. Mm-hmm. He's based there and there's a lovely little nail salon there as well that's growing and that's where I get my nails done actually.

Fantastic. We can go together next time. Oh, um,

yeah. Okay. Yep.

And there's an architect based there. There's a, an artist based there. There's a nice little food space there, Caribbean food space, and it's just brilliant. And this is how we improve our neighborhoods. We give them the business opportunities. We support them through making the area safer, cleaner, and we build brilliant family sized homes.

Mm-hmm.

So, uh, housing obviously does also rely on the pri private sector to have the confidence to invest within a, within a location, um, and to meet the a. Frank challenging housing targets, which have been set not just by GLA, but by both, both governments previous and current for Enfield to deliver, um, a lot more homes than have been delivered.

Um, what kind of [00:20:00] assurance can you give to the private sector about how, you know, how much confidence they should have? It's a, it's a place that they can invest in. Yeah.

Oh, it's a good question. We are really ambitious. Mm-hmm. We want to build thousands of homes because our residents need those homes.

There is a housing crisis. We need to fix it. People who are my age, who need to be able to afford Yeah. Uh, family homes and get onto the property ladder mm-hmm. Are relying on us to do the right thing. Yeah. If the private sector want to work with us and if they want to build our affordable and social homes, our family homes mm-hmm.

If they want to help us improve Enfield, make Enfield a safer and a cleaner place and an improved borough. Yeah. Our doors are open. We want to work with them.

And one of the other challenges, which I don't think many people be aware of is for temporary accommodation. Yes. Um, challenge that you have as a council.

Um, also probably links about, um, HMOs, how houses, multiple occupancy with the stock. Increasingly around where I live, houses are now being converted to HMOs whenever they come under market family homes. [00:21:00] I mean, they're disappearing. To your point about there've not been enough family homes, that's a large reason is because of the, but temporary accommodation is a huge financial challenge to the borough.

Huge. Do you just wanna maybe explain so people are aware the challenges councils are facing at the moment?

It's a huge issue. Yeah. And temporary accommodation and homelessness are massive, massive issues. When I became a counselor. Seven and a half years ago. Mm-hmm. We received about 500 families as homeless every year.

Mm-hmm. Who presented to the council? 500 families homeless every year. Now it's 500 families every month Who present to us as homeless. Yes. That's 6,000 homeless families. Yep. That we have to look after legally, we have to provide them with homes. Mm-hmm.

And you, it's the council has to pay for that as well, isn't it?

The council has to pay for

that. Yeah. And sometimes we have to put them in, uh, you know, in. Accommodation that may be outside of London. Yeah. I didn't get into no politics to do that. I don't want to [00:22:00] ask families to move out of London. Mm-hmm. But we have no other options of the, the only, the only alternative option for us is that the council may go bankrupt if Yeah.

If we don't, um, tackle this homelessness. Issue, which is why I'm really grateful to the new labor government who have given us 17 million more pounds to tackle homelessness. And they're serious. They're serious about tackling the temporary accommodation and the homelessness issue. Mm-hmm. But it's not just about giving those homeless families temporary accommodation.

It's about building. Yeah. It's about building the homes that they so desperately need. HMOs are not the answer. No. Not all HMOs, but most HMOs attract and social behavior. Mm-hmm. Waste issues, flight tipping, rubbish issues. Just this morning I was talking to a wonderful member of Parliament and I was asking her to support our bids to put more controls around HMOs and to prevent more HMOs because they do.

Impact our neighborhoods negatively. I'm sorry to say it. [00:23:00] Yeah. And most of them are in the eastern corridor, but like you've said, they're being built in, uh, in Winmore Hill and Palmers Green, other places as well. We have to stop it. HMOs are not the answer. We need to build homes. We need to build them fast so we can support those families.

What

strikes me with HMOs is once fair. Probably majority on the street. The homeowners, those who are families. Yes. Those whose kids are at the primary schools, which we know, you know, is just not pressure on places. It's the opposite. They're, you know, numbers are dropping, it's 'cause people are leaving because there's so many HMOs.

Absolutely. The impact on, I saw it when I lived in Edmonton. I'm starting to see it now in Palmer Green. It's incredible. And again, like temper accommodation, HMOs, a lot of people aren't aware of the Absolutely. Challenge the councils police, et cetera, have in managing this, this situation.

And Nick, 'cause as you know, your home.

Dictates your environment. Yeah. And it dictates your development as a young person. Mm-hmm. Your home means everything and your home is your castle and your home should be a safe space. Mm-hmm. HMOs and other options, I don't think provide that safe space, especially for young people, but [00:24:00] to give Tina as an example mm-hmm.

Where we've helped that young person find the job. Get her house. We've built the train station so she can get to her job. This is us building a stronger Enfield, a stronger London, a stronger uk. And I'm a strong believer in if we can change our neighborhoods, we can change our towns. If we can change our towns, we can change our boroughs.

If we can change our boroughs, we can change our cities. And if we can change our cities, we can change our country back world. And then we'll go for the world after that one. Absolutely. We'll finish. We'll change the world ly as well. Brilliant. This is what we've got to do.

It's great to see someone with, with such ambition.

For, for, for the borough. Thank. Um, so the local plan is, um, what's the current process? Lot of our listeners are focused on the built environment. So where is the current status of the local plan and when do you think we'll see this, um, increase in house building? Yeah, in the borough. Which, which, which we need.

It's a good question. It's a good question. So currently it's at [00:25:00] stage two. Mm-hmm. And there are examinations going and the inspector is doing his thing with the examinations and whatnot. Our teams are making representations. Mm-hmm. I think I, I'm not too sure towards the end of this year. Yeah. I think we're gonna see some real progress.

Mm-hmm. Brilliant. Well, um, I think on behalf of many people with younger children in the borough, we would like to see that absolutely accelerate. So we can get, we can get the homes built,

and I just want to say as Enfield, we're leading by example. Mm-hmm. Because even before the new government, rightly said, we need to build, we need to back the builders.

We need those homes. We need to rebuild the economy. Even before the new government was saying that, we've been saying that, as you know, for seven years. Il, my predecessor done a fantastic job. She really set the agenda. Mm-hmm. And showed that we've got the backbone. Yeah. We've got the backbone to rebuild the economy.

Fantastic. Well, Ergen, thank you very much for your time today. No, welcome. I very much look forward to seeing, um, Enfield grow and do your leadership in the future. Thank you so much, Nick.

Thank you for your time. Brilliant. Thank you.

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