[SPEAKER_01]: Hey everybody, JJ Cooper Jeff Ponce, another baseball America prospect podcast.

[SPEAKER_01]: We are back post trade deadline edition.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's so many places talking about which teams help themselves towards a world series this year.

[SPEAKER_01]: We'll leave that for others.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to focus.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is the prospect podcast.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to look at the teams today.

[SPEAKER_01]: Some of them.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're not going to get to all of them, but some of the teams today who essentially have folded on twenty twenty five and are looking towards the future.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we want to kind of look at it and say, well, how are they shaping up?

[SPEAKER_01]: Are teams a year away?

[SPEAKER_01]: Are they for many years the way?

[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to look at some of those.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to dive right into it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Great to see a Jeff.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're just starting right off.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to hit it hard and go fast to these, which is the Baltimore Orioles were not a team that we expected to see in this discussion right now.

[SPEAKER_01]: The Baltimore Orioles were supposed to be challenging for a world series title this year.

[SPEAKER_01]: It didn't happen.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, Grayson Rodriguez, we just got the news that he's having surgery to remove bone ships.

[SPEAKER_01]: He is going to not pitch basically effectively not pitch.

[SPEAKER_01]: I know that thinking got on a mound, but not pitching games at count.

[SPEAKER_01]: That matter for Baltimore in twenty twenty five.

[SPEAKER_01]: Calberatish is working back from injury.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, we knew that coming into the season, but he's not back yet.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we are an August.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's close.

[SPEAKER_03]: He has been making rehab starts at full season levels.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think you double A on Sunday.

[SPEAKER_01]: We did double A. But yeah, it's a rehab.

[SPEAKER_01]: But what he pitched.

[SPEAKER_01]: He pitched.

[SPEAKER_01]: Trevor Rogers has emerged.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, the the the the trade that is was truly looking awful for the for the Orioles doesn't look as bad now that Trevor Rogers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Arguably is the Orioles ace.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you can, you know, say that for that.

[SPEAKER_01]: But obviously, this is a season that is not gone the way that Baltimore planned on it going.

[SPEAKER_01]: They sold off at the deadline, Ramon, Loriano, Ryan, O'Hurn, some relievers.

[SPEAKER_01]: They moved Charlie Morton.

[SPEAKER_01]: They moved guys at the same time.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think you could say that any of the moves that they made are like, okay, that this brought in such a hall that you say, okay, this reshapes the team for next year or anything like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: But what we're going to do with this, we're going to kind of start off all these teams and then we'll kind of look at their situations.

[SPEAKER_01]: But we want to kind of ask the question.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'll ask you the question, Jeff.

[SPEAKER_01]: What does this team do well as an organization?

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I think, you know, what they've done well over the years has changed a little bit.

[SPEAKER_03]: They always did a really good job of managing the bottom of the roster and kind of finding guys off the scrap heap who could potentially contribute or take steps forward, Ryan O'Hurn, a name that you just mentioned, was exactly in line with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: They've all been... Oh, Lord Yana, was a low-cost edition this year.

[SPEAKER_03]: It was excellent, you know, and could be really good in San Diego.

[SPEAKER_03]: And then I think you look at the draft and they've always done well when they picked at the top of the draft.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they had some knockout picks in rounds following early, you know, because they had bonus pool money to play with.

[SPEAKER_03]: So when they have bonus pool money to play with, they draft really well.

[SPEAKER_03]: They didn't do that for a few years.

[SPEAKER_03]: They took some risky picks, spent money on guys like Judd Fabian, guys like Vance, you know, honey cut, who so far have not worked out.

[SPEAKER_03]: During those periods of time though, they got really good at identifying interesting starting pitching trades.

[SPEAKER_03]: We'll say after round five or five and in on.

[SPEAKER_03]: So they have some of those guys and we talked about it on this show months ago that that became kind of the strength of their system.

[SPEAKER_03]: They were kind of back with a big bonus pool again this year, maybe not high picks, but a bigger bonus pool.

[SPEAKER_03]: They had a good draft by all accounts.

[SPEAKER_03]: They're good at selling.

[SPEAKER_03]: They did a good job of selling this year.

[SPEAKER_03]: They had a good trade deadline.

[SPEAKER_03]: What they haven't done well in my opinion is take the step forward and acquire majorly pieces that supplement that really strong core that you've built.

[SPEAKER_03]: I have no doubts in my mind that that line up and defensively everything from a position player standpoint will probably be better next season.

[SPEAKER_03]: They'll rebound.

[SPEAKER_03]: The line up will be good.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't have questions with that.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that they added some interesting position players over the last few months that have made that group better, not what it was, but better.

[SPEAKER_03]: Will they acquire majorly quality starting pitching one, two, number three starters?

[SPEAKER_03]: They haven't done that.

[SPEAKER_03]: They tried to maybe a little bit with Evelyn, but he had some question marks.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, two years ago, four of them birds.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they were better.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_03]: When Corbin Burns was there, they were better.

[SPEAKER_03]: Grannish was healthy, they were better.

[SPEAKER_03]: Grayson Rodriguez was healthy, they were better.

[SPEAKER_03]: When they had that rotation, they were better.

[SPEAKER_03]: They don't have the starting pitching depth, and they haven't been aggressive in the windows.

[SPEAKER_03]: They needed to be in order to fix this problem before it caved in.

[SPEAKER_03]: That was the off season.

[SPEAKER_03]: That was maybe even the first month and a half of the season.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they've done, haven't done a great job of maybe trading players when they're at their height of their value.

[SPEAKER_03]: Because I think if you talk to people now, and some of hindsight is twenty-twenty, and some of it is Monday morning quarterbacking, there are our evaluators that will tell you, we like stowers better than cursed stat and some other guys from that outfield core that were ranked ahead of them.

[SPEAKER_03]: They should have sold me a year earlier, you know, that I think a lot of the times with them, they've let stuff kind of rot in the vine because they like just having all the assets and then just seeing how things shake out and thinking that gives them depth, which I think to what extent that's true.

[SPEAKER_03]: But they didn't have the pitching and they needed to turn into something.

[SPEAKER_03]: They haven't done that.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I just don't know if they will.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's not in their nature in terms of Elias and SIG of building a team that way.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's just not what their philosophy is.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I don't know.

[SPEAKER_03]: They don't want with Burns.

[SPEAKER_03]: Will they do it again?

[SPEAKER_03]: Will they go and spend some free agent dollars?

[SPEAKER_03]: We thought with the new ownership group that that was going to be a big change.

[SPEAKER_03]: So far that hasn't come to fruition.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would say the one thing I think that does get lost and we're all kind of doing both what they do well, what they struggle to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're trying to do that with each of these works.

[SPEAKER_01]: One of the things I would say with that is that they've gotten ding for not spending and what they really did is they spread money around and maybe that was not the right approach.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now, some of that they did bring in a remote area on or with that low cost edition ended up being very useful to them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Some of that was a free agent contract with Tyler O'Neill which

[SPEAKER_01]: seemed a slightly odd at the time and seems more odd now, where you're like, okay, how does Tyler O'Neill fit on this team?

[SPEAKER_01]: And again, with a team that already had a lot of outfielders, and if you said, what is the strength of this farm system?

[SPEAKER_01]: It should be outfielders because they have a lot of outfielders in their system.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that was like, okay, you know, they went out and got Charlie Morton.

[SPEAKER_01]: They got, you know, it's a god of they got pictures, but on short term,

[SPEAKER_01]: more back of the rotation pictures on short term deals rather than are you better off having one or two especially but one even from the rotation guy will see if they kind of change that approach.

[SPEAKER_01]: I want to say though when you say like going back to what is this team do well.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like kind of what you were saying.

[SPEAKER_01]: They were really good at building low cost bullpins.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that's kind of gone, like if you said, how did they get to, if you were asking, how did they get to a hundred wins?

[SPEAKER_01]: Now a couple of years ago, I would say that one of the key things is that they build a bullpen with Felix Patista and Yiner Cano and Jorge Lopez who then they turned into Yiner Cano, you know, things like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And most of those guys weren't big money acquisitions, they were

[SPEAKER_01]: When they were bad, they were turning through multiple relievers a month at times.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it's like, OK, nope, that one's not any good.

[SPEAKER_01]: OK, moving on that one.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, we got something here.

[SPEAKER_01]: We'll keep this guy came up with that one moving on.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's harder to do, obviously, when you're good.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is something where now I would say that

[SPEAKER_01]: This is kind of the opportunity for them to try to do that again a little bit when they have this little stretch of time where the gangs don't matter as much for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: They need to kind of find, and maybe some of that is some of their starting pictures and the minors who have really struggled, like Chase McDermott took a big step back this year.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now you've got to decide, is Chase McDermott a starter in your future or is there a relief role here that maybe you can get him into something?

[SPEAKER_01]: They need to figure out

[SPEAKER_01]: I would say like looking at what can they do the rest of this year and ideally building it to next year.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's probably time to find out what Samuel Basillo and Dylan Beaver's can do.

[SPEAKER_01]: Those are both guys who are at AAA who.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think right now we have a clear a clear sign of what their long-term outfield is.

[SPEAKER_01]: To go back to your other point on that, like they need to figure out is Kobe Mayo a long-term part of this plan.

[SPEAKER_01]: If we were talking two years ago, the answer on that would, I think, be obvious.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I say this, I know you've always been a male believer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, they need to give him regular at bats against righties and lefties.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like, and kind of find out what they've got.

[SPEAKER_01]: And basically give him a month where it's like, look, as long as you're healthy, you're playing.

[SPEAKER_01]: And also kind of figure out where he's going to fit in that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Is that, like, how do you see it?

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, you know, I think that's a big question, you know, just in terms of how Mayo fits into the long-term puzzle, Mount Castle was heard.

[SPEAKER_03]: So he was sort of untradable for them.

[SPEAKER_03]: And you know, this is kind of changing directions a little bit.

[SPEAKER_03]: But the things that I've heard post deadline were how

[SPEAKER_03]: low the demand was for position players.

[SPEAKER_03]: And the offers were very low, but how much higher the prices were for relief pitching and starting pitching, which the Orioles didn't obviously have to trade.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I was wonder if some of these guys in some of the decisions they made, almost backfired that a year ago, some of these guys might have had higher trade value.

[SPEAKER_03]: And now they're kind of left holding the bag and figuring out how this all sticks together.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I don't know how Mayo fits into it.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I really look at this outfield now, and sort of have question marks about how it's going to look long-term.

[SPEAKER_03]: Because a lot of their prospects are not necessarily outfielders you want to start every day.

[SPEAKER_03]: And Recate Bradfields probably the best example.

[SPEAKER_03]: And there's a pretty big downgrade from what Cedric Mullins gave you.

[SPEAKER_01]: I will say that that's unfortunate for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Brad feels been hurt.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so like in an ideal world, this would also be the perfect time to say, we're going to give you two months in center field.

[SPEAKER_01]: The defense we hope is going to be at the level where it's like, OK, you figured out the play.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if you just get on base and steel bases, you'll be a valuable part of this team.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, there've been something like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'd you look ahead.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like I will say, though, to kind of wrap this up with this with the Orioles.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can also though kind of lay out a pretty clear path where twenty twenty six could absolutely with just a couple of moves.

[SPEAKER_01]: They could be back where they were like.

[SPEAKER_01]: Brad is should be back and full speed.

[SPEAKER_01]: Grayson Rodriguez should be back in full speed.

[SPEAKER_01]: The rotation looks a lot better with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then again, Trevor Rogers can keep some semblance of what he's been doing lately up.

[SPEAKER_01]: He can slot into that rotation for next year as well.

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[SPEAKER_03]: And there's money coming off the books, too.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like you lose eighteen million on Ephlyn, you know, in final year his deal, thirteen on Sagano's only a single year deal.

[SPEAKER_03]: Gary Sanchez is actually at an eight point five million dollar deal.

[SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, there's maybe twenty or thirty million here for them to play with in terms of signing a starter.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like if there was one available, they could go and get them.

[SPEAKER_03]: And there's still a chance that maybe in the offseason they can trade for

[SPEAKER_03]: a C&D Alcantara or get involved in Joe Ryan talks or something that happens.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think if they land a guy like that, that sort of changes the front end of that rotation.

[SPEAKER_03]: It looks much, much different than it does right now.

[SPEAKER_01]: Two other things I'll say with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: One is it's like, I do, you mentioned Mount Kessel.

[SPEAKER_01]: Matt Kessel is an interesting decision this offseason is like, is he an on tender candidate?

[SPEAKER_01]: Like,

[SPEAKER_01]: He's going to be because of just where he is in the arbitration process.

[SPEAKER_01]: He should be reasonably expensive.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you kind of, this is where the Mayo questions and the Messiah questions and things like these all kind of fit in, where it's like, are you counting on enough production there to be worth what it's going to cost?

[SPEAKER_01]: And I would say again, the other part of this is, is figuring out where Messiah fits in this.

[SPEAKER_01]: the rest of the season ideally, and Michaelis has said, that is part of the plan, that there is an expectation that he will be coming up.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, we've talked about how you can come up later this month and retain rookie eligibility.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that is actually one hundred percent something, you will be stupid not to do that with the PPI picks and all.

[SPEAKER_01]: You want to bring Samuel Bessai a lot at a point where he still qualifies to earn you something that Orioles knows something about already.

[SPEAKER_01]: They've already won the

[SPEAKER_01]: where you earn a draft pick because you can win rookie of the year or down the road, finish an MVP voting or something like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So this is a definite step back year and it definitely kind of leads to some questions.

[SPEAKER_01]: I do think the other thing that we just kind of go back to is, is, okay, are they going to rebuild?

[SPEAKER_01]: Are they going to regain that bullpen building magic that they've had?

[SPEAKER_01]: So we'll see we're moving on.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's one team down.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to see we're going to do two three or four teams depending on how long this takes on this one.

[SPEAKER_01]: If not, we'll get we have more teams to kind of cover on this.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think if y'all like this, we might be able to do this another week as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to do our next team right after this quick break.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we're back and so let's move on to another team that thought they were going to be in this year.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they're not.

[SPEAKER_01]: The Minnesota twins, I would say that of all the teams at the deadline that sold, no one may have sold more than the twins did.

[SPEAKER_01]: Carlos Correa is an astro.

[SPEAKER_01]: The bullpen.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I do mean the bullpen.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean Juan Durán is one of the best closures in the game.

[SPEAKER_01]: Griffin Jackson was the logical replacement for Durán as closer and kind of was their number two, like they were kind of their co-bumbed of true for levers traded.

[SPEAKER_01]: Brock Stewart traded Luis Farland traded like that's That's four that's four key parts of a bullpen.

[SPEAKER_01]: They also, you know, they they brought in all kinds of different types of players to James Outman who is the epitome of the post-type former prospect had a really good year a couple of years ago for the Dodgers and then it's the Dodgers.

[SPEAKER_01]: So like, no, I'm sorry, Andy Pahez is better than you back to triple a you go

[SPEAKER_01]: James Outman has been freed.

[SPEAKER_01]: You could talk for a long time about the blue jays they brought in, and Alan Rodin and Kendri Rojas.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, they brought in one of the two top hundred prospects who was traded in and there were to tie eat.

[SPEAKER_01]: And another one who as we keep saying was just on the fringe of the top hundred in Mick Abel also came back from the Phillies in the Duran trade.

[SPEAKER_01]: You look at it all.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this is at least a reset if not a full rebuild.

[SPEAKER_01]: So as before we kind of look at what they brought, what their structure of all this is, let's start with this again, which is the question of what does this team do well?

[SPEAKER_03]: I think that they've, honestly, after a few years of like, twenty-twenty was maybe a bit of a breaking point for them in the draft, because it's felt like their approach has been very different since.

[SPEAKER_01]: You mentioned layout layout for that, like there was a reason to be at that breaking point.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Keone Kavico, Aaron Sabato, they had some first round picks that, I mean, Keone Kavico, who's been released, did never hit.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, but he never hit.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like if from day one, and then Aaron Sabato who was supposed to be, who's having a better year this year to his credit, but who was supposed to be a fast moving college bat, bat only like you're not getting a lot of positional value.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's drawn walks, but not hit for a whole lot of power.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's been left on, you know, I'm protecting the rule five draft.

[SPEAKER_01]: That one did not work either.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, I interject.

[SPEAKER_01]: So continue.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so you had, you know, some all-time kind of bad picks there, frankly.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, even with Sabata on the back end of that first round, you look at the players that went in that twenty twenty draft after him, you know, it's pretty remarkable.

[SPEAKER_03]: But I think since then, they've done a really good job of identifying players, sort of in the later rounds, especially when it comes to pitching, Kate Poevic, who's now with the Orioles, who's one of theirs.

[SPEAKER_03]: If you remember Christian and Chronoceon Strand was drafted in that twenty twenty one draft,

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, a pretty good player as well, Brandon Birdsell, who didn't sign, but was an interesting player.

[SPEAKER_03]: They also landed David Festa, who started games for them at the big leagues.

[SPEAKER_03]: And that's pretty good.

[SPEAKER_03]: Pearson, also was in that draft.

[SPEAKER_01]: If I could interject, that's what they do better than almost anybody, which is you talked about with the Orioles, the late round starting pitchers, the twin's ability to turn late round.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I mean,

[SPEAKER_01]: mid to late day two and back when there was a day three.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's round on and sometimes ten-thround on picks into productive valuable pictures has been really a strength I feel like.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, the next year in twenty-twenty-two they landed Zebi Matthews in the eighth round.

[SPEAKER_03]: CJ Call Pepper hasn't been up yet, but it's had a really really good season.

[SPEAKER_03]: They landed him in the thirteenth rounds.

[SPEAKER_03]: Andrew Morris has been down this year, but was really upcoming into the year.

[SPEAKER_03]: They landed him in the fourth round.

[SPEAKER_03]: And then I felt the last few years.

[SPEAKER_03]: They've done a really good job in terms of finding like tools he is probably the wrong way to put it, but some of their parts in fielders.

[SPEAKER_03]: that do have interesting tools, right, with like a loop key show and then, you know, call pepper both top one hundred type guys, um, you know, that they landed.

[SPEAKER_03]: Course Walker Jenkins was a really, really good pick.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think that year in the draft that that twenty three class was sort of like you through a stone and you were probably hitting a pretty good player.

[SPEAKER_03]: And then Charlie said, you know, so to look pretty good before that.

[SPEAKER_03]: So they've done well with a lot of those picks, you know, they do have some talented position guys at the top of their top thirty.

[SPEAKER_03]: And this kind of will lead into what they don't do well.

[SPEAKER_03]: Those guys just haven't been healthy.

[SPEAKER_03]: And Kisho falls into that group too.

[SPEAKER_03]: But, you know, I think of all these teams that we're going to talk about today.

[SPEAKER_03]: They have a top of the system that if things go right for once over the next eighteen months.

[SPEAKER_03]: They could have a really exciting, young, majorly core with guys like Jenkins, Emmanuel Rodriguez, Luke Kieshal, Katelyn Cole Pepper.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, and they're all guys that have defensive value too, which I think is sometimes particularly with their infielders, been kind of the question mark.

[SPEAKER_03]: They've had guys that can hit, but maybe don't have true, you know, infield defensive skills.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, Rodriguez can play the outfield.

[SPEAKER_03]: Jenkins can play the outfield.

[SPEAKER_03]: Keesha's a pretty good in field.

[SPEAKER_03]: Their call peppers are good in field.

[SPEAKER_03]: They're, you know, and then there's guys behind them like Kyle the bars and Marick Houston who just made his debut.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's an interesting group now.

[SPEAKER_03]: They've done a better job at targeting hitters the last couple of years, but we go into what they don't do well.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's obviously the injuries because Jenkins and Rodriguez just haven't seen the field a lot.

[SPEAKER_03]: Bucks and this is, you know, Roy's Lewis.

[SPEAKER_03]: This is not a new problem for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, again, injuries, there is a certain amount of luck to that, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, but fire and bucks to being injured every year, you kind of have to account for at this point.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's part of what you, you know, part of the fire and bucks experience.

[SPEAKER_01]: When they sign Carlos Correa, they sign Carlos Correa in part because two other teams looked at his medicals and said, we're not comfortable with this.

[SPEAKER_01]: As you said, Emmanuel Rodriguez, I mean, we're gonna hit the point where Emmanuel Rodriguez is out of options.

[SPEAKER_01]: Before we ever hit the point where Emmanuel Rodriguez has shown, he can play a hundred and twenty-five games in a year.

[SPEAKER_01]: Unfortunately, that's just the reality that we seem to be heading towards.

[SPEAKER_01]: Walker Jenkins, who, when he's on the field, has looked great, but Walker Jenkins is a guy who has really struggled with, you know, foot injuries, really ankle and things like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And then I do think that this season kind of really, you say, what were it fell apart?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's when Pablo Lopez went down and they just, they thought they had starting pitching depth and that starting pitching depth really didn't seem to be capable of handling being put into a heart, you know, a tougher role.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would say one other thing that they struggled to do that I think is going to be important for them in the remainder of twenty five, twenty six and twenty seven.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think you could say that their MLB development

[SPEAKER_01]: especially on the hitting side of players who reached the majors.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's too many of their players, I would say like Eddie Julian was his good, was probably better the first two months that he was in the big leagues than he is now.

[SPEAKER_01]: Jose Miranda was his good early on in his big league career as he ever got.

[SPEAKER_01]: Trevor Larnax seems like he's kind of been at the same level.

[SPEAKER_01]: You could maybe use injuries again in his example.

[SPEAKER_01]: But like they've had a lot of guys, Royce Lewis

[SPEAKER_01]: I know he's had injuries, but Royce Lewis has not really taken a step forward, which they kind of needed him to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's just a lot of these players where you say,

[SPEAKER_01]: If one guy takes a step back, it's one thing, but they need some of these guys, a couple of these guys at least to say, okay, he was here in your one and then he was here in your two and it's been more like he was here in your one and you're trying to hang on to that in your two where sometimes it's like he's here and he and Jose Miranda and Eddie Julian being cases of guys who's like, nope, they're back in the minors now because they're not playable anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's kind of something I do better.

[SPEAKER_01]: I will say now the interesting thing to me kind of going back to what they do well.

[SPEAKER_01]: The games the rest of this season, you know, again, these are, this is an opportunity.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is time to roll out innings.

[SPEAKER_01]: The bullpen they built.

[SPEAKER_01]: Durian I would say is a special case, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: There are a few pictures who have that kind of stuff anywhere in baseball.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so you're not going to go out there and say, okay, we're looking around the miners, who's our next Johan Durian?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because that's something that you're probably not going to produce.

[SPEAKER_01]: But Griffin Jackson and Luis Farland and Brock Stewart, who's kind of a scrap heap sign, those are the kind of things that being able to build those guys into valuable relievers is doable.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I do look at you mentioned, like, who are these starting pictures they have right now, who might end up filling those roles?

[SPEAKER_01]: Because we don't have to go too far back to say with Luis Farland, this is a starter who doesn't seem like he's able to get over the hump as a starter.

[SPEAKER_01]: They move them to the pen, and he's a very valuable reliever.

[SPEAKER_01]: Could that be David Festa?

[SPEAKER_01]: Could that be Marco Raya, who is on the forty man, and maybe we get to see him?

[SPEAKER_01]: Could that be Connor Prelip if he's not, you know,

[SPEAKER_01]: if they kind of at some point decide his durability is not necessarily one that's going to hold up could that be Charlie Soto down the road there's a lot of these guys you mentioned Andrew Morris you could mention there are a number of these guys who kind of fit this criteria of okay

[SPEAKER_01]: If you have Lopez, if you have Ryan, if they keep him in the off season, if you have Bailey Ober back, you hope will be healthier next year.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you also added Tosh Bradley in a deal, and you added Becable.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, okay, that right there could give you five starters, or maybe even six, you throw Simeon Wood Richardson in there, or you throw Zebi in there, or you throw, again, there's a lot of big league, ready starting pitchers here.

[SPEAKER_01]: Some of them end up in the pan here.

[SPEAKER_01]: Are they going to be able to rebuild this bullpen on the fly?

[SPEAKER_01]: And if they do, well, I know that there was understandably fans who look at this and go, wow, why did they trade all these relievers?

[SPEAKER_01]: I would say a lot of times, the shelf life of value for a reliever can be that.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you have a chance, as you mentioned earlier, the trade deadline was one where the, what you could get back for relievers was pretty good.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if that's the case,

[SPEAKER_01]: selling high on guys like Luis Barland who did not have this value not that long ago.

[SPEAKER_01]: could be really beneficial for them, but they do need to also figure out, like again, they can get key shall healthy.

[SPEAKER_01]: If they can get Walker Jenkins through the end of the season, we're hopefully he's able to him and hopefully Amanda Rodriguez can help them in twenty, twenty, six.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's some point.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe him stop day one, but some point.

[SPEAKER_01]: Figuring out between, we mentioned Altman and Alan Roden and Matt Walner, like, okay, who was their corner out, feel gonna look like his Trevor Larnack, part of that picture.

[SPEAKER_01]: can Brooks lead be a short stop or do they need to find a short stop going for or is is that something where you know we're looking at this and saying okay that's more like Kaylin Colpepper maybe who's in double a already so maybe he's not that far away.

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of questions here but there I would say the kind of to go to your point.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not that pessimistic for a team that just.

[SPEAKER_01]: basically put out a yard sell and kind of left themselves feeling like, wow, we sold almost everything that we put a price tag on today.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like other than Joe Ryan.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and I feel like they've gotten the kind of returns that we haven't seen teams get in recent years.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, and they still have Pablo Lopez, they still have Joe Ryan next year in the year after he's got two our beers left.

[SPEAKER_03]: So they could potentially trade him if they're really leaning into this rebuild and feel as if, you know, next year is, you know, maybe a pun here.

[SPEAKER_03]: The same token they could go into the offseason

[SPEAKER_03]: make a couple of adjustments, sign a couple of position players that we know the value is down.

[SPEAKER_03]: And there might be position players based on some of the things that could be coming down the road that are willing to sign more long-term contracts to kind of lock in numbers, especially if there is a salary cap that does eventually show up.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if that's going to happen or not, but if it does,

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, it might change some of the financials of these contracts and the big numbers we've seen this offseason.

[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe they can sign somebody.

[SPEAKER_03]: They also freed up a lot of money with Carlos Correa.

[SPEAKER_03]: So they have a lot of flexibility.

[SPEAKER_03]: They have a lot of talent.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I think the areas where they need to improve.

[SPEAKER_03]: They could potentially improve naturally with just a little health and performance from their position guys.

[SPEAKER_03]: Or

[SPEAKER_03]: they can go out and they can sign a couple of those guys and reinforce that line up a little bit and maybe get some decent deals because they do have two really good stars at the front of the rotation and that's a vision which I think from year to year remains wide open of the tigers are certainly building something.

[SPEAKER_03]: You gotta look at it and say we have a really good shot of getting into the dance next year and you know being a competitive team

[SPEAKER_03]: Are we a championship team?

[SPEAKER_03]: Probably not.

[SPEAKER_03]: But I think for a lot of teams, it's just a matter of getting to the playoffs and then just see how things end up playing out.

[SPEAKER_03]: They're a team that I don't think would be crazy to kind of revamp it in a year.

[SPEAKER_01]: I had two more things I think we need to touch on with them before we move on to our next team, which is there.

[SPEAKER_01]: They are for sale.

[SPEAKER_01]: And there is a lot of talk of I was Rob Manford has said he expects them to be sold in the not too distant future.

[SPEAKER_01]: They kind of I would say at this point kind of need that it does feel like that that is a fan base who is very much kind of

[SPEAKER_01]: frustrated, like if you look at their attendance, their attendance keeps dripping, dipping down further further further.

[SPEAKER_01]: And on top of that, it is something where when you also look at their TV situation, there's kind of questions with that.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot here that's still kind of unresolved for them.

[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know what their payroll is going to look like.

[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of things that could kind of lead to, they have a lot of questions that, you know, that kind of made determine whether they aim for twenty six or they aim for twenty seven is

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, are they going to be a team that is going to be able to, you know, they took a lot of money off the books, but is their payroll going to need to go further down?

[SPEAKER_01]: They're going to go up for next year.

[SPEAKER_01]: We don't know.

[SPEAKER_01]: Those are kind of interesting questions with them, but that leads us to our next team that we want to cover, which is a team that has unfortunately been largely in this role for many a year.

[SPEAKER_01]: Jeff, the pirates have had that little kind of peak, almost a decade ago now, but they have the best picture in baseball.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, Terkscubble, but I would say Paul schemes right now fits that category.

[SPEAKER_01]: They have our number one prospect in baseball in Conner Griffin, but it does feel like

[SPEAKER_01]: you know, having just traded away, bednar, having just made some other moves.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would say not ones that are going to, again, remake the team, but are the pirates just around the corner, or are they still far, far away in your mind?

[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, the pitching staff isn't a question.

[SPEAKER_03]: And it's more than just schemes, too, as you said.

[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, Mitch Keller is under contracted decent dollars until twenty twenty eight.

[SPEAKER_03]: They ended up not moving them.

[SPEAKER_03]: Obviously, you know, they have the contract and the time to sort of wait that one out.

[SPEAKER_03]: They could trade them in next deadline.

[SPEAKER_03]: They could trade them in the offseason heading into twenty twenty seven.

[SPEAKER_03]: And he's still going to have multiple years left at pretty good value.

[SPEAKER_03]: They still got Brian Reynolds for a lot more years.

[SPEAKER_03]: O'Neill Cruz is still super inconsistent in the field and at the play.

[SPEAKER_03]: They do have Connor Griffin coming behind him.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think with this organization, it's not crazy to think the Griffin debut is pretty early next year.

[SPEAKER_03]: That I think that there's a chance that he's no longer the number one prospect of the trade deadline next year because he's got enough at bats to graduate.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think that's crazy to assume, frankly.

[SPEAKER_03]: They should have Baba Chandler in this rotation next year.

[SPEAKER_03]: Jones won't be back until later next year.

[SPEAKER_03]: They do have some decent sort of, you know, arm depth still.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think Thomas Harrington can be a number five starter and probably be fine.

[SPEAKER_03]: Then it's another, you know, a fact that may be fine in one more arm, whether it's Hunter Barco or whoever that fills out that rotation.

[SPEAKER_03]: They have a rotation.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think they can build a bullpen if they're smart.

[SPEAKER_03]: They have some interesting arms in that pen still, even after making some trades.

[SPEAKER_03]: Where does the line up go?

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, so to just summarize, what does he do well?

[SPEAKER_01]: Pitching.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: But this team does well as pitching.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's what they do well.

[SPEAKER_01]: They do.

[SPEAKER_01]: What does this team struggle to do?

[SPEAKER_01]: No one has struggled more with developing hitting.

[SPEAKER_01]: I, as you said, like, O'Neill Cruz has become kind of the poster child of frustration with the pirates, but O'Neill Cruz does things well.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can be frustrated by his defense and center and things like that, but he hits.

[SPEAKER_01]: He strikes out too much, but he hits.

[SPEAKER_01]: Everyone else on this team, almost without fail, position player wise is

[SPEAKER_01]: a fringy player.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we mentioned even like Brian Reynolds, Brian Reynolds is under contract.

[SPEAKER_01]: Brian Reynolds has had a terrible year.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like you have worries that like, okay, they are not a team that can survive Brian Reynolds being a one war player year after year.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he's going to have to work over the last couple months to be a one war player this year.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like that's an O BP that you just would not expect to see from Brian Reynolds.

[SPEAKER_01]: When we look at it, you said, like Connor Griffin, I think we shall also mention that Florentino has been a wonderful Edward Florentino, it's been a wonderful department story now.

[SPEAKER_01]: But how do they get to a representative lineup that could work with this pitching stuff?

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if there's an answer there unless they go out and spend money or trade away from some of their strength, whether that's caler, you know.

[SPEAKER_03]: maybe even or Neil Cruz if you got the right deal, you know, like they sort of need to spread it out because there's not a lot of depth.

[SPEAKER_03]: Florentino isn't low-way.

[SPEAKER_03]: He looks at a great story.

[SPEAKER_03]: He's probably at best two years away.

[SPEAKER_03]: Griffin, like I said, I think there's a chance you see Griffin next year.

[SPEAKER_03]: But then it's still a one or two-man team, you know.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's just such a question as to where the production comes from.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they haven't been aggressive in that mid-tier of free agency.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, I don't expect them to go out and sign, Ryan will hern to a three-year contract at decent money.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, I don't expect them to go and sign a tyleroneal.

[SPEAKER_03]: Those are the kind of deals that if you're a pirate's fan, you're almost begging them to make like go and get some major league fifties and fill the lineup with a bunch of major league regulars.

[SPEAKER_03]: You don't need to have stars and then you hope some of their work ethic, some of their experience, maybe that rubs off on on your cruise, maybe Reynolds bounces back.

[SPEAKER_03]: But they need to go out there and they need to sign four or five regulars and it can't be going and getting rowdy tellers and those sort of players.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think Spencer Horowitz is an interesting player.

[SPEAKER_03]: I know the organization likes him a lot.

[SPEAKER_03]: The blue jays like them a lot.

[SPEAKER_03]: Probably could be a decent piece for you.

[SPEAKER_03]: But you need four or five other bats.

[SPEAKER_03]: I mean, they need guys that can hit twenty home runs and hit two fifty two sixty with, you know, a three forty on base percent just don't have that.

[SPEAKER_01]: Tommy fan and Andrew McCutchen.

[SPEAKER_01]: Ideally, like look, Andrew McCutchen's been one of the great players of the twenty-first century.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, this is nothing against them.

[SPEAKER_01]: Tommy fan, Tommy fan is the best high school hitter from his draft class and it's not close.

[SPEAKER_01]: That said, this is their age, thirty-seven and thirty-eight seasons.

[SPEAKER_01]: In an ideal world, they're like your sixth and seventh best position players where you're like, they provided some additional help as veterans who kind of provide leadership and our solid professional bat hitters.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're pretty much with only a cruise the best that they have in that lineup.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's not what it should be.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's something where they've had like, we're unfortunately we're sitting here.

[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like

[SPEAKER_01]: They came into the year and it's like, okay, is Joy Bart the catcher or is it Henry Davis or is it Andy Rodriguez?

[SPEAKER_01]: And we come out of this year or we're at least in August and it's like, I can't tell you who's their catcher for twenty seven, you know, twenty six, especially twenty seven beyond.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he Rodriguez keeps getting hurt.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if Henry Davis, if you, there's been nothing so far to indicate that he's part of your long-term plans.

[SPEAKER_01]: They have a ton of second basement, but they haven't, you know, Nick has always kind of hasn't really, he's been solid, but there's questions about his defense.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, there's, there's a game that you go and you look at the potential free agents in twenty five twenty six and almost every position just about.

[SPEAKER_03]: Particularly in the infield, you could look at it and say, they're seven or eight guys, they could sign that are upgrades, right?

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, Louis O'Reilly as would be a huge upgrade for them.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yondi Diaz is a club option, but Yondi Diaz and a two-year deal would be an upgrade for them.

[SPEAKER_03]: Reece Hoskins would be an upgrade.

[SPEAKER_03]: Josh Neeler would be an upgrade for them.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, that's just looking at first base.

[SPEAKER_03]: You can go second base.

[SPEAKER_03]: You could go short stop and, you know, there's probably multiple players that are upgrades for them.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, like, they're the kind of team that could go into free agency and like adding Trent, Grisha, and Cedric Mullins would be humongous upgrades.

[SPEAKER_03]: to this lineup.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they don't even probably have to spend all that much money.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's just they have to spend some, you know, you have to at least operate as a mid tier team if you want to open up this competitive window with schemes.

[SPEAKER_03]: And then hopefully, you know, Griffin and some other players come around because you're going to pick pretty high net again next year.

[SPEAKER_01]: The other thing I would say with that, that like the to-do list for this team, you expect that Bob is going to come up post August fifteenth, you know, retain his rookie of the year eligibility for next year, but get him acclimated.

[SPEAKER_01]: I would say with some of this also it is, it's like figure out which of your starters could also upgrade this bullpen.

[SPEAKER_01]: The bullpen's not been terrible.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like the crazy part of this is when we say that pitching versus hitting, there is not, if you go by B-war, there is literally not a position

[SPEAKER_01]: Catcher, first, second, short, third, left center, right, DH, pinch hitters.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's zero positions where the pirates are above average.

[SPEAKER_01]: None.

[SPEAKER_01]: You gotta be somewhere.

[SPEAKER_01]: You have to be, and I'm not talking your best.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm saying, you have to be tenth best somewhere, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: They're

[SPEAKER_01]: They're not tenth best somewhere.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're not fourteenth best somewhere.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's something where, as you said, like, you just gotta figure out a way to improve that.

[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, part, again, I don't want, you hate to see them trade a lot of pitching away because that's the strength of this team.

[SPEAKER_01]: but that said like you at some point you have to balance this a little bit because again it does get old seeing Paul schemes you know leave the game having you know after six strong innings and he's losing one nothing and he loses one nothing when it's all said none or he loses two one or he you know or he gets a no decision because he didn't give up and he runs but the pirates didn't score any which all those things seem to happen

[SPEAKER_01]: This does feel like a team unfortunately, even with the best picture and baseball, even with Bubba Chandler and Connor Griffin being top ten prospects.

[SPEAKER_01]: This is one that feels like it's just unlikely that twenty twenty six is going to be a turnaround year or more.

[SPEAKER_01]: Am I too harsh there or is that realistic?

[SPEAKER_03]: I think it's all in their hands.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's probably not going to be a turnaround year.

[SPEAKER_03]: They are one of the few teams that we've seen where if they went into free agency and signed five position players and they spent eighty million dollars which would never happen.

[SPEAKER_03]: The team would maybe be inside of a competitive window because they're in one of those divisions once again where

[SPEAKER_03]: You don't know what you're going to get out of the brewers next year.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, they've been a fun story.

[SPEAKER_03]: They've been so good.

[SPEAKER_03]: They're going to assume that they're going to be good because they're always good.

[SPEAKER_03]: Ancient is so well run, but at the same time, that lineup could slide down.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, that team could take a step back, right?

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, it's all part of operating as a smaller market team that has to live in the fringes a little bit.

[SPEAKER_03]: Even if they make great decisions, they have good pitching, a couple of injuries, something could change, and they're not going to be super aggressive and going out.

[SPEAKER_03]: but they're in the class of the division.

[SPEAKER_03]: You have the cubs who talk her walks to me, that team looks very different of Tucker walks, right?

[SPEAKER_03]: And you have the reds who are just super inconsistent and haven't been able to sort of find a shape of that team in terms of how they're going to win ball games.

[SPEAKER_03]: It just seems like a division where if you're the pirates, you have

[SPEAKER_03]: Maybe the potential for the best one, two, three punch in terms of your rotation in the division.

[SPEAKER_03]: You just need to score enough runs.

[SPEAKER_03]: And they can invest in that and figure it out.

[SPEAKER_03]: Now, they might be an eighty four wind team if they go out and do that.

[SPEAKER_03]: But that is a hell of a lot better from what they're going to get from this lineup and what they have coming up outside of Connor Griffin and Florentino as we said this years away.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I wouldn't consider him in the description.

[SPEAKER_03]: The other thing I would say is this, I expect him to be a sub-seventy when team again.

[SPEAKER_01]: The other thing I would say is this, if they're payroll, you said aiding million.

[SPEAKER_01]: We both know, they're not gonna go, they're not gonna double their payroll next year.

[SPEAKER_01]: We know that.

[SPEAKER_01]: But the brewers and the reds are spending thirty to thirty five million more per year than they are.

[SPEAKER_01]: And there is not a whole lot of logical explanation for like what you just laid out.

[SPEAKER_01]: how much better this pirates team would be if they were at a hundred and ten hundred and fifteen opening day you know million an opening day payroll compared to eighty five would be dramatic and that's the part where it's like as you said you don't have to go out and sign they have so many positions where they have someone who's a one more player who is a yeah

[SPEAKER_03]: You don't have to go sign Peter Lanzo and Ozzy Alves, like you don't have to sign the top of the market.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I mean, but you say that though, like, Peter Lanzo is an interesting one because Peter Lanzo was hanging out there waiting for a contract for a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: And maybe it was just not possible.

[SPEAKER_01]: But to say if they said, we're going to give you Pete, we're going to give you one year, thirty million.

[SPEAKER_01]: And we won't give you a qualifying offer next year.

[SPEAKER_01]: or something like that, that would have made a massive difference to their lineup.

[SPEAKER_03]: And I think that's what it is.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's a couple of big bats change the way that lineup looks.

[SPEAKER_03]: And it could even be somebody like,

[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, like probably about example now, but like a Lord is curial type of like, you know, production, the guy that can hit to sixty with twenty pumps like that make a big difference for for the pirates, you know, playing every day.

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, maybe he had no interest, but because he just ended up, you know, but Teoska Hernandez, you know, has been a VL bus of free agent and

[SPEAKER_01]: From most teams to Oscar Hernandez comes in and he's an additional useful player for you.

[SPEAKER_01]: For the pirates, if to Oscar Hernandez signs the pirates, he's immediately their best position player.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, well, we got the three.

[SPEAKER_01]: We got the three.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you enjoyed this, leave a comment about another team you want us to cover.

[SPEAKER_01]: We know we really want to cover the Cleveland Guardians.

[SPEAKER_01]: We probably should cover the A's as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we got a couple more of these at the minimum that we want to do.

[SPEAKER_01]: But as we always do before we wrap up,

[SPEAKER_01]: We also like to do our prospect soap boxes, which is, as we always say, we're going to talk about a prospect, but it's always got to be a prospect who's not a top on your prospects.

[SPEAKER_01]: God be someone who's a little bit more obscure than that.

[SPEAKER_01]: So Jeff, you get the, you get the poll position this week.

[SPEAKER_01]: Who is your prospects of funds?

[SPEAKER_03]: So this guy's going to move up big time in the next J's update.

[SPEAKER_03]: And that's Victor Arias.

[SPEAKER_03]: He was player I really liked in spring training came away impressed from the eye test.

[SPEAKER_03]: And then we, we got some data early in May and the numbers popped the EVs were

[SPEAKER_03]: significantly higher than I had anticipated.

[SPEAKER_03]: Like, you know, top two percentile type of ninety of percentile EVs.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's a lot of balls in the ground.

[SPEAKER_03]: He's a pretty good athlete.

[SPEAKER_03]: The swing decisions took a big step forward this year.

[SPEAKER_03]: And subsequently, all of the performances jumped up.

[SPEAKER_03]: Was assigned a high Vancouver out of camp.

[SPEAKER_03]: He hit really well there.

[SPEAKER_03]: He's now in double-aid new Hampshire.

[SPEAKER_03]: He's hitting there opposing scouts.

[SPEAKER_03]: CMAs, you know, I got a Jose Siri compound on today.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's not as big a series, a smaller guy, but from the sense of like these loud tools that sometimes come together for spurts and time and sometimes, you know, it can be a little wild.

[SPEAKER_03]: I don't think the makeup is quite like series.

[SPEAKER_03]: You had some off the field stuff when he was in the minors.

[SPEAKER_03]: It's not like that, but just from the sense of like, in place, centerfield is explosive.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, has some power, has some speed.

[SPEAKER_03]: The field to hit is probably better than series is he's a top time guy.

[SPEAKER_03]: There's some people that think that he's in every day regular in the organization and outside the organization didn't come up a ton in in trade talks for whatever reason and I almost feel like.

[SPEAKER_03]: That was because of what this market was like just based on the tools you would think that models would probably like them quite a bit younger age for level stuff pops the underlying stat cast stuff really pops good swing decisions that really improved year over year that was kind of the big knock in a year ago the bats a ball is there.

[SPEAKER_03]: The angles aren't great, but I think he's a good enough athlete that might be the kind of thing that you can adjust.

[SPEAKER_03]: And just doing some post deadline calls.

[SPEAKER_03]: That was something that a few teams really thought about with Sammy's deferred, though the production hasn't been good, really good athlete, and they felt as if he's a guy that once they got him into their hitting development.

[SPEAKER_03]: could make some adjustments and swing changes and maybe find a better swing.

[SPEAKER_03]: So I think RIS is a guy to keep an eye on, not a top or a hundred prospect, but a guy that's going to sit, I think, eight in a pretty decent, blue-jay system still even after the trades.

[SPEAKER_03]: He's a big green arrow up guy for me, kind of head in the hot season.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think is an interesting player.

[SPEAKER_03]: Good chance he goes to AFL and I think with the EVs and all the stuff that he does while the profile could really take a big step forward in the next six months.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to say one thing about Sammy, about Sephora.

[SPEAKER_01]: I do think he's been more productive than people think.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like the FSL really does kind of hide power and things like that.

[SPEAKER_01]: You look at him as a sub-four hundred slugging and you're like, okay, or write around four hundred for most of the year, you're like, okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: But in the FSL's pretty good, the problem for him is, is, and again, this is something where this is a reds decision.

[SPEAKER_01]: Like, they've moved their guys very slowly, especially their cold weather.

[SPEAKER_01]: They're kind of non-hotbed short stops.

[SPEAKER_01]: Tyson Lewis spent the whole year in the complex, you know, ACL, the whole season so far, until recently.

[SPEAKER_01]: Same stuff for back in the FSL after last year.

[SPEAKER_01]: They've moved these guys slowly, which I don't think has done a whole lot of favors from a prospect that he's standpoint, but like, you know,

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, I know I'm a stifferer defender, but I do look at stifferer and say that I do think there's something here.

[SPEAKER_01]: Good hands, I don't know if he's going to be a six short stop or anything, but he's going to play in the middle and field, things like that, where I'm intrigued.

[SPEAKER_01]: So my soap box, though, is going to go for a guy from the giant organization who, again, we do a lot of these, we will do these where we're like, we're getting in someone and we may not have a chance for doing it for much longer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Bo Davidson is really a name to watch.

[SPEAKER_01]: He's been steadily climbing up our giants list, but this is, again, how about this way?

[SPEAKER_01]: Among full season giants prospects, because I know we have, you know, just wars in the DSL, just for example, is we have Johnny Lovell, who is in the ACLL year.

[SPEAKER_01]: We have Bryce Aldridge.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm including Bryce Aldridge here, but if you said, who's the most intriguing full season position prospect in the giant system?

[SPEAKER_01]: You could argue, you know, like look at Beau, and again, Eldridge is a better prospect.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you look at her rankings, clearly, Bryce Eldridge is a better prospect.

[SPEAKER_01]: But that said, Beau Davidson, Beau Davidson does a lot of things.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, if you give you, you know, the first base profiles of tough one, Bryce Eldridge is gonna have to utterly mash.

[SPEAKER_01]: Beau Davidson could be a guy who provides defense of value in the outfield center field who can run, who can hit, who can hit for power,

[SPEAKER_01]: It's really been a very eye-opening breakout season for him.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you said, who are among the breakout prospects of twenty twenty five?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think you absolutely should put Bodak babes on the list.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he's one of the greatest stories and minors, too, because we are talking when you say, okay, was he a second round pick?

[SPEAKER_01]: No, third, no, fifth, no, twentieth, nope.

[SPEAKER_01]: non-drafted for agent and we mean an honest a goodness non-drafted for agent not a he signed in twenty twenty as part of you know the five round draft we are talking about when on drafted but uh... great scouting find out of a junior college and has really just taken big steps forward this year a name to absolutely keep an eye on the giants out filler boat a bit

[SPEAKER_01]: So Jeff, we got through three.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe we'll do this again next week and get through a couple more, but that was fun to kind of dive into some of the teams that are looking ahead to the to twenty twenty six and beyond.

[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you know, is there a team that you feel like really did kind of help set the stage for them to four twenty six at the deadline, you know, with their cell-off?

[SPEAKER_01]: Or do you think most of all of these are probably looking further down the road?

[SPEAKER_03]: I think if you had to give that to anybody, it's probably the twins and we kind of laid out why, but it's just a direction of what, you know, where the front office goes because they could lean into being more competitive in twenty six or use that as a step back year, acquire more assets and really look more to twenty seven twenty eight.

[SPEAKER_03]: You know, they're kind of the interesting one, because the guardians didn't make a ton of moves, and it wasn't like right now stuff.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think Cal Steve might have been the best buy of the deadline.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think the Orioles sold off some pieces.

[SPEAKER_03]: They're maybe in a better position.

[SPEAKER_03]: We talked about what their question marks are, but I don't think that's just solved internally.

[SPEAKER_03]: It will help and British and some of these other guys are back next year, but they got to seek some help pitching wise outside the organization.

[SPEAKER_03]: I'm just looking at some of the other ones, the A's, et cetera, great trade, the biggest name player that we've seen moved in quite a long time, Leo de Vries.

[SPEAKER_03]: But does that make them better for twenty-six?

[SPEAKER_03]: Probably not.

[SPEAKER_03]: I think if they're good in twenty-six, because their young core takes a step forward, and it doesn't have anything to do with this deadline.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, again, we will be interesting to watch of the remainder of the twenty five season and obviously in the twenty six and beyond four Jeff Ponds.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm JJ Cooper.

[SPEAKER_01]: So long, everybody.