women are 10 years older_mixdown (1) ===

Speaker: [00:00:00] Hello everyone and welcome to the Miss. Hi

Speaker 2: there. Pick me in the man. Did you forget the title of our show? Welcome to the Mr. Pick Me. I forgot

Speaker: why I'm here to

Speaker 2: And the Man Hater Show Radio Broadcast Owl. No, no Radio. Skittles. I wish, I wish Response. I don't know the Skittles. They're, they're a part of a big company. They're probably terrible,

Speaker 3: but they're tasty.

Speaker 2: They're tasty.

Speaker 3: Taste the

Speaker: rainbow. Uh mm-hmm. Hey friends. So we're back. Uh, I am Reagan, AKA, the man hater, even though I don't hate men. And Jessica, he's been picked.

Speaker 2: Wait, you said my life.

Speaker 4: Oh my God, there's a man I've never seen before. Jessica's got glasses on everybody. He just Superman. The

Speaker 2: visual humor, again, your weekly visual humor.

Did you start complimenting by making a joke? Compliment, and then it [00:01:00] grossed you out so bad you had to stop.

Speaker 4: No, no. I almost said you superman. This, but there's, that's a term for a graphic thing, a graphic sexual thing. So I, I didn't,

Speaker 2: I've never heard that term before.

Speaker 4: Well, don't look it up

Speaker 2: now. Now I'm thinking about, I, I get, I, I think I can imagine what is where you're, you're, you're flying around the room?

No. Or you're in a, is it, are you in like a hanging, like a satchel?

Speaker 4: No, like a swing. Look. Look it

Speaker 2: up. Well, you just told me not to. Okay. Well look it up

Speaker 4: because I don't wanna say it. You look it up. Is it

Speaker 2: where you lift somebody off the ground, like you're so strong? No. Well, I wanna get, I wanna see if I can figure it out.

Before

Speaker: you

Speaker 2: make, is it just the way where you're lying on top of them?

Speaker: You make someone a cape?

Speaker 2: Wait, the man or the woman is,

Speaker: I don't wanna do this.

Speaker 2: No. Wait. Okay, now I have to Google it. Reagan just cut out. A 10 minute diatribe where we discuss something inappropriate for the [00:02:00] internet. I need that to be clear to everybody that I am not for censorship.

Reagan does not feel you all are adult enough to hear people discussing DC

Speaker 4: Hero,

Speaker 2: Superman.

Speaker 4: Grotesque things. Yeah, no, I'm, I'm gonna pass on that. What's something else grotesque that men say or do? Just go

Speaker 2: that A 20 what, maybe a half. Rewind that this is going great. I think we're gonna get a bunch of new listeners this week based on my, uh, my guest, uh, guesting on a, on a very large podcast.

Girl's Gotta Eat. Uh, and so they're, this is a great intro to our podcast of how professional we are.

Speaker: Yeah. With your, uh, using his ear pods as his microphone because his microphone's packed somewhere. I should

Speaker 2: talk about that. I just moved this past week, so I can't find any of my podcast gear. So the, if I sound bad this week, I let, this happened once [00:03:00] before and we got so many comments from people that were like.

Can you guys buy Checo? A new fucking microphone. Hey, Checo, maybe invest in a microphone. I get it. I have one. It's a nice one. It's, it just, it's somewhere in a box in my house in a mystery. If you wanna come over to my house. No, I know. I'm not gonna fight strangers over my house to look through all my items.

I promise you I own a nice microphone. If I can't find it by next week, I'm gonna order a new one. But if I sound bad this week, it's because I don't know what box I went through all my boxes and I can't find it. Anyways,

Speaker: the timing is great though, because you did just, you were just on a very popular podcast.

It's the perfect timing for us to have shit audio this's,

Speaker 2: perfect timing for us to have the worst fucking show. Of our entire run, and today we're gonna talk about how 35 year olds are just little babies.

Speaker 5: You want bad advice, man? I'll give it out. Glad I got some good [00:04:00] advice for you. No, you don't.

Speaker 2: You don't.

I got some good advice for you.

Speaker 5: Don't you don't.

Speaker 6: Oh, JustCo. Now I'm gonna have a weird search history from that Superman

Speaker 2: stuff I did. So good. I was so professional on that podcast this week. Yeah. What

Speaker: happened? Where is that energy for this podcast?

Speaker 2: That's, that's not what I bring. That's not why the people pay the big bucks here.

I, Mr. Pick. Me and the man hater. This is where they want unhinged.

Speaker 4: Well, they certainly get it, at the very least, whether they want it or not.

Speaker 2: Unscripted. Unplanned unprepared.

Speaker 4: Let's

Speaker 6: listen to this. This is a guy neither of us likes, um, who has a lot of bad takes, but looks really

Speaker: cool. He's like one of those fake podcasters where like he sets it up to look like he has a podcast, but like, clearly he's not recording a podcast.

Speaker 2: I wanna, I wanna set the scene. It looks like he's kind of at a piano, [00:05:00] which at the first time I saw his video I was like, is he playing the piano while doing this? Yeah, he's not, it's just music in the background. But it kinda looks like he's playing the piano, uh, because he also has like a turtleneck short sleeve shirt on, which is quite a bold fashioned statement and a ABO

Speaker: nation.

Speaker 2: I am not a one to judge fashion. Sure. I wanna be clear. Yeah. But if I were to judge someone's fashion, I don't think the turtleneck short sleeve shirt is the way to go.

Speaker: He looks kind of like a priest pianist.

Speaker 2: Oh, pianist.

Speaker 5: Sick.

Speaker 2: Sick JustCo. I mean, both. I was like, that's not a far off description. I see what you're saying though. Both are accurate. Whatever you heard, that's, that's what you should be imagining as you hear this clip.

Speaker 6: That's why I say piano player. I know what the right word is, but it's too close. All right, hold on.

Let's just play. This guys.

Speaker 7: A 25-year-old woman is older than a 30 5-year-old [00:06:00] man, but most men don't understand this brutal truth. Today, half of men in their twenties haven't even approached a woman in public. They're isolated. They're grinding alone, building their worth from zero. But the average 25-year-old woman, she's seen it all.

Her inboxes flooded with offers luxury trips, VIP, access and endless attention. By 25, the world has rolled out a red carpet at her feet. In raw lived experience. She's decades ahead of a man of her same age. That's why when she's 25, she's way older than you are at 35.

Speaker: Okay. Uh, there's so much wrong with that.

Speaker 2: So much. There's actually layers to this conversation. We need to break down.

Speaker: Half of men in their twenties haven't even approached a woman in public. They're isolated. Mm-hmm. And they're grinding alone, which I'm like, yeah, they are.

Speaker 2: I mean, that's, that's kinda how it works [00:07:00]

Speaker: there. I know that's not what he means.

I know he means hustle culture. Yeah. But I was like, I mean, it's not wrong. So most men in their twenties haven't even approached a woman. Yeah. What? I don't, what are you talking about? I got the most, like men were, well, I guess young, I guess boys were relentless in high school. What do you mean? At 20?

You've never approached a woman.

Speaker 2: Now, Reagan, keep in mind that by his metrics, you're older than me.

Speaker: I'm an old crone by his metrics. Right. I'm basically deceased, I think.

Speaker 2: Right?

Speaker: The assumption that all men who are 20 in their twenties haven't even talked to a woman,

Speaker 2: anybody. Which is, it's, it's such a, uh, that I think you, when you isolate yourself into this like manosphere

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Bro,

Speaker 2: podcast culture

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: You end up seeing what you wanna see. Right. It's also, there's, there's, the only guys he's [00:08:00] interacting with are 25 year olds who I've been, are in this hustle culture who are terrified of women

Speaker 8: Yes. Who are

Speaker 2: only using apps and their only experience with women is through dating apps.

Speaker: It's weird because it's like hustle culture being consumed by more incel. Or inexperienced men. If you're in your twenties and you've never approached a woman, you're probably not a part of the hustle culture. 'cause a lot of times the people who are in the hustle culture do interact with women. Right.

That's like a huge part of their, so it's like you can't apply the hustle culture experience to men you're now saying are in their twenties and have and and have none and have no like social experience. That's so weird.

Speaker 2: How often do you see this happen though? Over and over? Where somebody, one of these guys usually these red pill kind of podcasts mm-hmm.

Will say something extremely unique to how they experience life. Right. And just be like, this is clearly, [00:09:00] everybody went through this exact thing I went through. I didn't even talk to a woman outside of my mom till I was

Speaker: happy. Listen, listen, Mr. T-shirt, turtleneck. I am pretty sure maybe you didn't talk to girls until you were in your thirties, and that's fine, but don't assume it's everybody else.

They've never approached a woman in public. Mm-hmm. What

Speaker 2: does that mean? Mm-hmm.

Speaker: Were you approaching them private? Like how did you get them there?

Speaker 2: I genuinely believe that one of the core issues within this kind of manosphere culture is their insistence in only using these dating apps, on using Tinder, on using, oh, all of these things for meeting women is because their entire, I do believe he, for him, this has been his experience, right?

Right. That their entire understanding of how to interact with women mm-hmm. In a dating capacity is in this very [00:10:00] weird kind of like environment where you have 10% of the people, 20% of the people using this app are women and 80% are men, and they're also not actually. Swiping on women that they actually are into or reading their profiles.

Right. And just swiping on everyone in hopes of it. And so their, their interaction with women are with people that are not even one, one, they're not even interested in two, in this weird environment where it's, it's like this, this weird mix of 80% men and 20% women. Mm-hmm. Um, and so then they, they, they take that and they apply it to the real world as if that's what real life is like.

Speaker: Well, yeah. Like the way he talks about how they're all, they're isolated. They're, but they're grinding, like associating isolation and hustling together as if men are only isolated because they're just working so hard. Like clearly this is mm-hmm. For more incel style bros. Like who have been alone, who want to think, well, I've only been [00:11:00] alone.

Mm-hmm. Because I've been working so hard, I've only been alone 'cause I'm building empire as they love to say. Mm-hmm. And then he goes on to say. That men have to build up their worth from zero. And that's such a weird fucked up talking point from the manosphere. Mm-hmm. Which is this idea that like, women are born with their worth and they just have to keep it.

Right. They're, they're like constantly at threat of losing it. As they age, they lose it. Whereas men come at, come in at zero and have to build it, which I actually think is incredibly insulting to men. Like

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Speaker: You're born with zero worth. Like,

Speaker 3: who, why is this, why are these people your coaches? That's fucking hor That's a horrible thing to say to somebody.

Mm-hmm. You have no worth. Mm-hmm. Until you build it, you have no inherent worth.

Speaker 2: Well, and that's, that's what also then ends up leaving with these memoir. They get so entrenched mm-hmm. In this line of thinking then is like, they, it it's the, uh, they love nagging each other.

Speaker 3: Yeah, I know, right? They're they're doing the same thing where, yeah.

Speaker 2: And so then they end up leaving these guys, they're like, yeah, I have no worth. [00:12:00] This is the only way I build worth. And so they sp they, they end up devoting. Countless hours to meeting these standards that women aren't even saying that they care about. And then when it doesn't work, they can't then because it's, it's the, the sunk cost fallacy, right?

Yeah. They can't just admit that they just wasted 10 years of their life doing something that, that the women that they claim to want don't even care that isn't even on their list of priorities. Right. When they, they, they can't interact with women. They don't have any sort of, uh, emotional capacity or any emotional intelligence.

Yeah. 'cause they've only been interacting with these other emotionally immature men who are hustling and trying just to make money who are only listening to these guys and on this hustle culture thing and not interacting with women on any platonic sort of level. And so they, it's, it's, they become these, these hollow men, right.

That are then stuck without, they either have to start over from scratch or just double down. And hope they find somebody [00:13:00] who will, kind of what I said in that clip from, uh, the podcast that I was on earlier, that they become thousandaires and they have to find someone that they convi convinced that that is impressive.

Speaker: And it's interesting because it really showcases how like self-centered these men are and then how much they center men as a whole. Because instead of saying, we haven't gotten the experience we should, we're behind. Mm-hmm. They basically just age women up.

Speaker 8: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: They're like, they're like, right. It's not that women, you know, are more emotionally intelligent.

It's not that. You know, they've learned how to communicate and how to make friends and how to have relationships. Mm-hmm. It's that they're just basically 10 years older because they're, you know, they have inherit worth when they're born and like everybody just gives them whatever they want and that's why they're the head of the game.

Mm-hmm. It's not that we've failed, it's not that we're not socializing. It's not that we don't know how to build communities, it's just that, you know, to quote him, [00:14:00] there are inboxes flooded with VIP access and luxury trips.

Speaker 2: I meant to ask you about that. How, what was it like for you? Oh

Speaker: God.

Speaker 2: When you were getting all of those VIP luxury trip offers?

I mean, just, what's Dubai? I've never been to Dubai. What's that like?

Speaker: Amazing. I, the, the yacht trips, you know, that are flooding my inbox, the millionaires. I'm saying, no, that's totally Bezos. Get out of here. I don't wanna go on your yacht.

Speaker 2: Like, whatcha talking again?

Speaker: What the hell goes on in these men's head?

What? Mm-hmm. It's, you know what it is? Your, your inbox is flooded with dick pics. That's what it is. Mm-hmm. That's what you're getting. Mm-hmm. You're getting unsolicited private parts,

Speaker 2: luxury.

Speaker: All of this is to justify their own beliefs. All of this is to justify their low expectations of men and their hate and sustain of women.

Like they have to think, oh, well, I've been working away. Women are just given these things. They're given luxury. Mm-hmm. They're given VIB trips. They're just able to use their [00:15:00] sexuality or their sensuality to get whatever. They was like, no dude. They're getting hit on by creeps in the bar. They're trying to get home without being murdered.

That's what they got.

Speaker 2: This is, it's another great example of what happens when you don't have any women that are your friends. Yes. Is that you're like, well, they, he must, I mean, I don't have anybody in my life I can ask to double check this from the luxury trips they went on. Yeah. Because I've been taught that women are icky and being friends with them is gross.

And that I, I should only want them for sex. And so, uh, when I hear this man saying that even average what, whatever he defines fucking average is, uh, right. Even an average woman is getting all of these v there's VIP treatment and access to everything around the world. Uh, so clearly like, what, what world are these guys living in?

Speaker: A world where they don't talk to women? You're exactly right. Mm-hmm. They don't have any experience. If they talk to one woman, she'd [00:16:00] be like, oh, no, that doesn't happen. That

Speaker 2: doesn't happen. It does make, it's a type of coping, I think too, that yes. That's the only way they can explain why as a 25-year-old she said no to you.

Mm-hmm. It couldn't be because she just didn't like you. Mm-hmm. It's because you didn't have the yacht. Right. That's the only explainable thing is that because all women, only one luxury yachts airplane rides private jets. Right. VIP treatment at the club. Right. That's the only thing that the singular entity of women Uhhuh wants.

And so if they didn't want me, it has to be because I don't have that yet. So I have to work my ass off and sacrifice everything to do that.

Speaker: And you know what, Jessica, you will not convince me that the second part of this video would not have been. And that's why age gap relationships.

Speaker 2: Right.

Speaker: And that's why a 22-year-old should date a 40-year-old.

Speaker 2: I mean, that is the implication there though. Oh,

Speaker: a hundred percent. 'cause why, why say it? Like what's your point is mm-hmm. There's always like that [00:17:00] secondary point. There's always subtext of what they're saying. I mean, he says they have raw lived experience that's decades ahead. Decades.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Decades.

Speaker: Uh, oh, what is that?

Mm-hmm. What are we saying? How young are we going and how old is the man? Mm-hmm. Because that's what they're talking, it's just, it's made up. It's so mm-hmm. Unbelievably made up. Even if, even if a 25, which it's not happening, I, I don't know, I don't know any 25-year-old women who have VIP access and luxury trips flooding their inbox.

Mm-hmm. But say that did happen. What experience do you think she's getting from that? Like mm-hmm. Do you expect older men usually because mm-hmm. As we know, 25 year olds aren't doing it. Right, according to him, older men taking younger women onto yachts, do you think they're maturing, they're really understanding communication?

Is that what you think? Mm-hmm. Happens that they're aged by all of this knowledge and mm-hmm. This social [00:18:00] interaction? No. If anything, they're aged through trauma probably.

Speaker 2: Right. You

Speaker: know what I mean? Like, oh,

Speaker 2: absolutely. Women do age, I think, uh, like, like in internally faster because of the shit they have to go through a hundred percent.

Uh, being a woman in our society, I, I do think that is actually on point in a sense, uh, of that, but not for the reasons he's,

Speaker: that's not what he's talking about though. He's like talking about, yeah. Uh, it's almost like he's talking about their ability to, mm-hmm. Get relationships, like their ability to find partners.

So is this all, listen here, listen here, Mr. Priest, give me your confession actually. Okay. Number one, where did you get your turtleneck?

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: Number two, is this just because you need an excuse for why men don't have game? Is that what it is? Mm-hmm. Why these younger men who you have called isolated? I think we all know what that means.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: Little bit of culture here.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: Uh, why [00:19:00] they're not getting with women? Because the, the end explanation is that well, women just have so much more experience than you, and that's why they're basically 10 years older than you. Okay. So it's probably you hating on older women. You wanting, I think it's three things you hating on older women.

Right? You, you seeing them as older, like age is a problem always. Mm-hmm. You wanting older men and younger women to get together and you rationalizing why younger men are struggling to get with women.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. I think there's a couple components to this too. I think one of the, this is a great example. I think people, when they imagine incel, I feel like they imagine Carmen from South Park, but I think the majority of that culture are guys like this, right?

Uh, they, they, there are guys that they don't look, I think it's funny, the, the, the way that social media and, and popular culture is painted in souls is different than the reality. It's these dating coaches, right? Yeah. It's these [00:20:00] guys that are these muscle bound, uh, you know, short sleeve turtleneck, wearing piano playing pianist is pinis penises.

Uh, penises who think that they, they understand everything. Yeah. Because of the fact that they've listened to other men who are also raised in this incel culture. Mm-hmm. Telling them that, that all women are the exact, exact same thing. The one thing want one thing?

Speaker: Oh my God. JustCo. He's wearing a priest's outfit and he's celibate involuntarily.

Speaker 2: My God.

Speaker: We've, we've got covered it.

Speaker 2: Um, there was a really interesting video. I haven't had time to really digest and think about it. So let's do it together. Live on the air. Live we'll do it

Speaker 5: live.

Speaker 2: But there's someone I follow. She, uh, she debated Charlie Kirk in like Oxford or something. She was one of the people, the blonde woman.

The blonde, yeah. Uh, Tilly. I've seen her, I think is her name. I, um, yeah, but it was. Lily Tilly. It's, [00:21:00] there's an ly Hold on, let me, let me I look it up. Let's get it right. So her name is Tilly Hurst, which is a very British name.

Speaker 9: We love that. For her it feels, it

Speaker 2: feels very, I love that. It's a very, very posh name.

Speaker 9: Yeah.

Speaker 2: Uh, it feels like, I have no idea if that actually what that even means in that culture, but here we are anyways. She was on a podcast. I can't find the clip. I'll look for it. Maybe we can post it here if we, if I find it. Mm-hmm. Um, but she, she gave an interesting perspective on age gap relationships.

Mm-hmm. I've never heard before. And she said that a lot. She's, she's Gen Z, she's younger. Um, and she said that the reason a lot of Gen Z women are dating millennial men mm-hmm. Is because millennial men didn't, weren't as, uh, uh, exposed to this red pill culture. Right. Yeah. So there, there, there, well there are, don't get me wrong, there are millennials that are definitely a part of it that are Right.

But as, as a whole, like men my age and a little bit younger, we kind of miss this overwhelming social media. Barrage of these guys pushing these red [00:22:00] pill manosphere. This is how, what it means to be a man, right? Uh, and that's not to say men my age are not toxic. That's absolutely not true. Yeah. Far from the truth, right?

There's a lot of toxic stuff that my my age do, but it's a different type. It's kind of like your old school, run of the mill.

Speaker: Well, I feel like, um, for us it was like social capital because it was in public, like, you know, it was at school, it was like going to parties. There was so much less interaction online.

You were expected to be able to talk to girls like you were expected mm-hmm. To be able to socialize and get girls and that was how you became po popular like and mm-hmm. Where I grew up. Like it was that ability to get with women that like really made people popular. Mm-hmm. Versus now you have so many of these little pockets and these dark, the dark alleys of the internet where mm-hmm.

People who are not getting with women can just like fester their hatred and why women actually are the ones [00:23:00] that suck. Whereas before it was like, you still. It, it was still necessary to interact with women in order to have social capital with other men, right?

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: But now, like Intels, they can be cool amongst the Intels, you know?

Mm-hmm. They can be cool in their little, uh, discord servers and whatever else. Mm-hmm. And so they like can absolutely silo themselves. Mm-hmm. They can just live in these worlds without engaging with the outside world. They're not getting any feedback. They're not getting, you know, any other voices or any other opinions, and so they're just like festering in this absolute hate and disdain for women.

It's like, mm-hmm. Yeah. That's really scary and like, I agree with your point. Of the fact that like incel look different than you think. Mm-hmm. I do think a lot of these hustle culture bros are speaking to incel and, and act, and the Intels feel like they're more hustle than they are. Mm-hmm. Like, it's not that I'm an incel, it's not that I can't sleep with women.

It's literally I could, I

Speaker 2: could totally sleep with women if I wanted to. [00:24:00] Right.

Speaker: I just am working so hard at my whatever fake thing. Mm-hmm. I'm an entrepreneur, dammit. Which a lot of times just means unemployed, like they are identifying with a group that they're not a part of. Mm-hmm. I would bet like a majority of the viewership of the hustle culture bros.

Is not hustle culture bros. I think it's probably a lot of in insults. Mm-hmm. A lot of men who are not getting to where they need to be, but like, like seeing these things, like seeing like, well maybe I'm, I'm just, you know, I, I'm building my future, you know, that's what I'm doing. That's, I'm per, you know, I'm not getting with women and that's okay because I'm not meant to, because I'm gonna get my model mm-hmm.

When I turn 35. Mm-hmm. And it's like, it's so bizarre because Mr. Mc turtleneck, uh, that he's not getting, I would assume, not getting with all the ladies. Mm-hmm. But he's pretending to, to do this hustle culture, real bullshit. Mm-hmm. And then he's speaking to guys who aren't hustlers, who aren't successful, who aren't making all this money.

But are. Mm-hmm. But want to believe [00:25:00] that they are because it makes them feel good. So everything's imaginary and they're talking about women in a way that doesn't exist. Mm-hmm. That's not real either. So like mm-hmm. Nothing's real here. Like, it's, it's, it's, it's like delusion, you know? 'cause like women aren't having this experience, like, I'll speak for my own like at 25.

It's not like I was having the red carpets rolled out for me. Like, it's not that life mm-hmm. Was just inherently, uh, easier. I mean, what a fucking bold claim. Mm-hmm. In a patriarchal society in which women absolutely have less rights, like by law than men to be saying how easy it is for them and how life's just handed to them.

And everything is so easy. Uh, bold, bold statement considering they don't even have autonomy over their own fricking bodies.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: You know, it, it's just like it's made up and it's a bunch of people li lying and lying about who they are and them all just buying into their own bullshit.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: And [00:26:00] facilitating this endless cycle and culture and silo that, um, they just live in.

And then the danger becomes when they interact with someone outside of that because they're going to have their perception of themselves and the world immediately challenged. Mm-hmm. And that's when we see scary situations.

Speaker 2: Well, and, and I think the thing that they also. Have a lot of trouble. And it comes back to the same kind of idea where they, they only view women as a single entity that, that, and they also view women as some, as a, a, um, what's the word I'm looking?

As? As, as a product. Right? Right. As something to be consumed as something that they want to get as opposed to someone, they, they're not looking for someone that they want to enjoy being with. Right. They already have the people they enjoy being with, they're guys. Right. They're looking for the commodity of, of that next step of, of having woman to show off to the, the people they care about.

The other guys. Right. And so when, like [00:27:00] I, when I was dating, when, back in, in, in my day, uh, right. You had 800 years ago. 800 years ago, you had to, uh, you had to go do stuff Yeah. To meet people. Right. Like, I didn't, there was not, I guess there was like match.com when I was in college, but nobody was on there.

Right. Right. It was not, it was not like, Tinder didn't even come out until I was like, years and years into marriage. Mm-hmm. Um, and so like, but, but like the, I, I would go on dates and, and it would go, you know, some would go good, some would go bad and, and nothing, I don't have any, sadly don't have any tragic dating stories to like really, um, bring on maybe positively don't have any really tragic stuff to, to bring up Ho

Speaker 9: ho Jessica.

Speaker 2: Yeah. But, uh, the, but, but the reality is though, like, you know, it didn't work out. I move on, right? And, and you go and you go do some more activities. You see, if you click with somebody, I remember specifically, I, I had had multiple kind of dating, uh, incident incidences or dating. What the hell were, I can't talk, [00:28:00] I forgot how words work.

Um, I had multiple dates in a row that just didn't go well, where I just didn't click with them. Right. Uh, like it was like, like over a period of like six months, I wa I was like, this is just like I'm maybe ar this. I was living in Arizona for graduate school. I was like, eh, maybe I'm just not gonna, maybe culturally this is just not where I'm gonna find somebody.

It's not gonna happen. Um, and then I went and took a class in something. I was interested in theater for youth and theater for social change. Uh, and lo and behold, there was a woman in there that, there was a

Speaker 4: lady in there, there was a lady in there

Speaker 2: that had a boyfriend that I became friends with.

Speaker 9: Yeah.

Speaker 2: That eventually became my wife. Right. And so that, that way I eventually ended up marrying Right. But we, we met each other, not because I was seeking out the next person on the hunt, the next person on the hunt for a date, but we had a mutual shared interest in theater and, and, and, and doing like [00:29:00] projects for social change, speaking out against injustice.

And we met each other and we became friends and lo and behold, we fell in love with each other. And that's kind of what, but I mean, that's, that's the point is like the, the, they're so stuck on, on not ever finding someone that they actually, they don't care if they like the person. Right. Right. And in fact, it's acquisition

Speaker 9: rather than connection.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. And if you are, if that's what your modus opera is, right. Ymo is, then you're not ever going to find real happiness. Or, or if you do, it's, it's against all odds. Yeah. Right. You're setting yourself up for failure.

Speaker: And I, I think an important element of that is. When you went on the date and it didn't work out, your immediate thought wasn't, oh, well, women suck.

Fuck, women. No. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: As a whole is women. No, you're all of,

Speaker: you're terrible. Well, but, but here's the thing, like if you think about it, like I, I can under, I don't [00:30:00] understand them, but I can see how they're formed. Because if you're a young guy and mm-hmm. You don't socialize other than online, which you can actually get away with.

Like, maybe it sucks at school, because I still think at school you would have to interact with people and Right. Like in school, like you'd probably be pretty lonely, but

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Speaker: You could chat with all people online and you could only hear, because again, you. Social media's a silo if you want it to be.

Mm-hmm. If you only wanna hear shit you like, you can absolutely do that, especially on like TikTok or any, uh, reels. Like anything, any algorithm that's picking up what you like. So then you're only hearing that women suck and you should get what you want. And it's not your fault that you're the way you are and you don't need to change or socialize.

You just need to hustle or get fit or, you know, build your empire and then women will flock to you. And women live on easy mode and you just have to struggle now and then it's going to be great and fine. And all these men agree with you and that's the only, only viewpoint you're ever [00:31:00] getting. And those are the only interactions you're ever having.

And then you go on a date and guess what? Women are real people and have real goals mm-hmm. And desires and don't operate like these imaginary, uh. You know, evil beings that you've made them out to be. Mm-hmm. And so they don't respond the way that you've been told they will. Mm-hmm. And all you have is what you like, you have this heavy weight of information and culture and, you know, community you've built of other, you know, people that hate women and hustle culture and whatever the, like an interaction with a woman.

So more often than not, men are not gonna say, oh shit. Like, this is an outlier like this. This shows me that maybe I'm not right, like maybe what these men have told me and that I've spent thousands of dollars on, or at least spent thousands of hours on. Mm-hmm. Maybe is, is not the most helpful. Maybe won't help me be successful in love and life.

[00:32:00] No. They're gonna say, oh, see, women do suck. Mm-hmm. I would rather hold onto this hateful belief than have to feel like I'm less than, and I think that's what they're doing. It's like, I, I can see why this is happening. It's 'cause like the second they have a problem with women, they just revert back to what they've been told, which is like, yeah, women suck, man.

If it doesn't go your way, women suck. If she won't sleep with you, women suck. If she won't date you, it's because she sucks. Like mm-hmm. It never, never reflects back on them.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I think we're, we're. On point.

Speaker: It pisses me off because it's so made up.

Speaker 2: Yeah. Like

Speaker: it's, none of it's real. The co the, the coaches aren't real.

They're lying about their experience. Mm-hmm. They're lying about who they are. The people listening aren't real because they're bullshitting half the time. The mm-hmm. What they're talking about isn't real. The way they talk about women, not like, nothing this guy said is based in reality. Mm-hmm. Like it's all just bullshit, but they just believe it because it makes them [00:33:00] feel better about themselves.

And it's so dangerous because you do not want to be the woman that challenges this belief.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: You're gonna get. You're gonna get the fire, like the vengeance of the internet. The vengeance of the incel, because you are proof like, oh, well no, this shouldn't be that way. You should sleep with me. Like someone rejecting you doesn't make them a bitch.

Someone rejecting you doesn't make them a horrible person. You know, someone being a woman doesn't mean their life was easy. You've struggled. That doesn't mean other people didn't struggle either, but they wanna like it. It's so self-centered in the fact that they think their struggles are the worst.

They've had the hardest time. Mm-hmm. They wanna assume women have just lived the easiest lives ever, because then it's easier to hate them. Like if you've struggled your whole life to socialize and you've been told that women just literally wake up and they're like, good morning. Oh, a yacht. Oh, an invitation to go to a premiere.

Oh, money. Thank you. Like if that's what you think their life is while you're like isolated and struggling. Of course you hate [00:34:00] women, but you don't hate real women. You hate this false projection of what women are. This idea

Speaker 2: of women. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: That, that is used to sell you shit.

Speaker 2: Right. No Reagan. You've never been rejected though, as a woman, right?

You've never felt the experience of rejection. Correct.

Speaker: NI have never, ever, not once, never been rejected,

Speaker 2: never once. Mm-hmm. Because that's a solely male experience is what, is what they, they tell me online, no heartbreak,

Speaker: no. Mm-hmm. No emotional torment, you know? Mm-hmm. I haven't been, haven't dated any nurse.

Um, no. I mean, I don't have a podcast, literally that I've spoken for hours upon hours of all the, you know, the bad interactions I've had over the years. Mm-hmm. No, it's just been, it's just been great. I've just been swimming in my pool of gold and just telling my, my, the, the pool boys to bring me drinks.

Speaker 2: And we've, we've talked about the empathy gap before, but I think this all comes back down to also [00:35:00] that men are not, not omen, uh, are, but the, the guys that consume this media, obviously, are so focused on. What does it take to get her in bed? What does it take to trick her into, uh, into being with you that they never consider the impact?

That tricking somebody and manipulating someone into being with you is going to have on the person that you are manipulating and tricking. Right? Right. They have no, the, you never ever hear that discussion that, about there being another person on the other end of these interactions. Only there isn't.

Speaker: They don't see that because

Speaker 2: they, because they don't see it, and it's so hard. And that's, that's the most disheartening thing when I hear them. That it's like, do you genuinely, and I, maybe the answer is yes, but like, do you genuinely not ever consider the fact that you're like fucking somebody up so badly by like just straight up [00:36:00] creating a character for them to fall in love with, only for them to find out that it has this person that they thought they were meeting.

I thought they were dating. It's completely something that you Googled, right? That you learned about how to create,

Speaker: how to be someone that gets sex.

Speaker 2: T-P-G-G-T-P, I can't talk today. Uh, what, what is person, what is good man?

Speaker: What is man who gets sex?

Speaker 2: Yes. Make, make men who good sex go and then copy and paste that in.

Speaker: The way they talk about women is they make them these caricatures. They make them these evil women, these evil people who have the best things in life. Everything's easy for them. They have value right away, you know? Mm-hmm. They're this like exaggeration, again, a caricature of what a real woman is. And so no, they don't, because they don't have empathy for that.

Because anytime they're gonna come back to this same shit, which is like. [00:37:00] Why would I feel bad? She, she doesn't have to work for anything. She can get a guy out whenever she wants. Yeah. So I lied to her, so I lied to her. Mm-hmm. But that's what I have to do as a man because it's on me. Okay. Speaking of this, hold on.

I wanna share a, a graphic with you, but I'll describe it. Okay?

Speaker 5: Okay.

Speaker: I'll put it on the screen if this is, if you're watching on YouTube, how to attract your Life partner. There's a guy, a ripped guy on the left, and a stick figure woman on the right. Here's, here's what the guy side says, side says, must always have a job.

Have friends and be sociable. Be really good at something. Be at least somewhat muscular. Constantly approach women. Don't be meaningfully shy, ever. No noticeable disabilities. Oh my God. Have sexual experience, have relationship, experience, have a low body fat percentage. Have the intelligence to succeed in life, but don't actually be a nerd.

Don't have bad skin. Can't cover it up either. Anti [00:38:00] makeup, be able to provide for kids regardless of if she says she wants any. Have your own home slash apartment, have a car and drive it. Have more potential than her. Be older than her. Be taller than her, have more educational experience than her. Be willing to give up time and energy to chase her.

And do you know what's on the woman's side exist?

Speaker 2: Finally, someone who gets it,

Speaker: someone underneath said hilarious. You think women are even remotely interested in you doing things that you, that will make you more attractive to men. Have you considered actually asking women what they want from you?

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.

Which

Speaker: I'm like, yeah, but also it's

Speaker 2: like they, they act as if like some of these things are so outlandish in the world. Like that's the thing. I think that that gets under my skin, that annoys me. It's like. When you're dating you, you're allowed to want things. Right? Right. So same with men. You're allowed to want, so you're allowed to be attracted to certain things.

You're allowed to, to have certain things that you like in a [00:39:00] partner that exists out there and pretending like all women want every single one of these things and every man, and that's it. End of list. Right. Then that is, that's where it, it's the absurdity of it once again, comes back to having never interacted with women outside of watching them on social media street interviews.

Right? Yeah. Or from what or or hearing about women from the perspective and from the gaze of a men describing the women they've dated. 'cause God knows every man has only ever accurately described their exes. Crazy man. Shockingly, every single one Yeah. Was just completely bad shit. Yeah. It was just, and it had nothing to do with me,

Speaker: uh, as a woman who, like, I mean, I was gay the whole time, so.

Mm-hmm. But like, I, I had to try really hard, like, because I. [00:40:00] Like, I, I didn't realize I was gay, but I knew, like, I, I was like, oh God, I, I was trying to be what I thought men wanted, right? Like I, mm-hmm. I didn't inherently, I was not that. So I was like, okay, let me figure it, make, lemme figure this out. There is a huge fucking list of what men want because I knew what the list was and I was trying to do it.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Like, I've had guys tell me like exactly like what type of hair they like, like I have curly hair. Most of them wanted it to be straight. Mm-hmm. Like shoes, like outfits, like there was always, uh, an expectation of what you should be, like, how you should act. You have to be cool with everything.

Like you, you know, like I would, there would be, you would have like the boyfriend at home and then the boyfriend that, how he would act in public, you know what I mean? Mm-hmm. Like there was like, it's like they were constantly performing too, but it was always for other men.

Speaker 3: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: And you would just have to deal with it.

Like, I know so many women who have stories of like, they would date guys. Who would like use them for, for their performance, like mm-hmm. I want you [00:41:00] to look really good, but I'm gonna leave you and go talk to the guys. And you just have to like wait around because I wanna look cool, but I want you to be there 'cause you're kind of the trophy.

Mm-hmm. It's like. You don't have to tell women about what it's like to have these, this crazy list of expectations. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 8: Like

Speaker: there's beauty standards for a reason. Like you should be a certain weight, you should be a certain height. Your makeup should be a certain way, you should have, you know, you should wear makeup because you need to try, but you can't wear too ma too much makeup because like, you don't wanna be a clown.

I don't have wanna have to take you to the pool on the first date to see what you really look like. Mm-hmm. But don't let yourself go. Also

Speaker 2: pluck your eyebrows. Yep. Pl shave all body hair. Mm-hmm. Do your hair a specific way. Wear you're right. Do enough makeup where it looks like you're not wearing makeup.

Mm-hmm. But, but not enough where it doesn't look like you're not even trying.

Speaker: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And, and like dress up, but like. I want you to look good, but I don't want you to look too good. But I also don't like, I want you to be attractive to me, but I don't want you to look like you're marketing yourself for other men.

I don't want, you know, you, I

Speaker 2: like when you're revealing, but only when you're [00:42:00] revealing to me. Mm-hmm. When you're with me though, on the date, after we've gone on two dates, I need you to start dressing differently than you've dressed your entire life, because now you're, that's only for me to see.

Speaker 8: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. What, how are you posting on social media? What, what kind of stuff are you allowed to post on social media without being shamed? How are you able to, it, it's so, it's just dumb. It's dumb and it, it's just, it's the, it goes back to never having interacted with any, anyone. I had, but two of my old roommates in college were women.

Right. If you wanna, if you think that all they had to do was exist, you've never lived around a woman before. No,

Speaker: but it's, I think it's also like. It showcases how low their standards are, because like, they would probably sleep with anyone. Like I do think that's part of it. Like, I think they're like, yeah, you just have to exist and I'd sleep with you.

It's like, that says stuff about you. Mm-hmm. That's showing you, dude, that shows that you don't care. You don't care what she's like. You don't care what her goals are. Her dreams are, you don't wanna talk to her, you don't wanna build a life with her. You literally wanna sleep with her. Mm-hmm. You wanna use her as a human trophy and [00:43:00] personification of the fact that you're successful.

Mm-hmm. Like, that's what she is to you. So like mm-hmm. Yeah. Of course. If you think of women as that, like all she has to do is exist and all sleep with her. It's like, that's a you problem, man. Like, mm-hmm. Oh, just go help me.

Speaker 2: I, I think we're both flabbergasted.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker 2: Because of the fact that we're, we're both, uh, not, not, I, I it has to, there there's a level of effort it takes to be this ignorant.

Yes. About. What everything it you, you don't just casually walk into this ignorance about what it's like to exist as a man, God or a woman. Oh my

Speaker: gosh. I'm so ignorant. I just walked right. It, I just so

Speaker 2: willing into not know to, to ignoring everything every woman has ever told me in my life. I guess you've never spoken to a woman to your 35 though, so nevermind.

Uh, well,

Speaker: even in the picture, like the man is this like elegantly drawn muscle man. Mm-hmm. She's a literal stick figure. Tell me how you feel about women without telling me, like, [00:44:00] that's how you, they're not real to you. Like, and also you made yourself ripped. Like how I, I almost feel like at this point, these expectations, like everything they've listed here, a majority of men who subscribe to these beliefs and this culture, this incel culture or hustle culture, like they're probably incel who subscribe to hustle culture.

Mm-hmm. Um. They don't fucking look like that, and they don't have those things. So it's almost just a tool for self-loathing. It's almost just a tool to explain why they're not successful. Like, because mm-hmm. They aren't, they don't have these things, like, they don't look like that they, they don't have mm-hmm.

Like they don't have this solid job. Like, and, and so to, to set that as the standard that you think it's like you're setting yourself to hate yourself and hate women even more. Mm-hmm. You're the one that's doing that. You could set, you could believe something else, but you choose to believe something that, that underneath said belief system, you will never succeed.

Speaker 8: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: Like, can [00:45:00] you imagine purposely believing something that sets you up for failure?

Speaker 2: No. That's why it's so, that's why it's so. Uh, flu mixing. I'm using a lot of words to or or so flu

Speaker: mixing my gosh. Yeah. Frustrating

Speaker 2: to see this happen. And, and it's what, what I think really makes me angry and one of the reasons I make the content I do online to counter this kind of stuff though, is they're seeking out and they're targeting boys like young boys Yeah.

Hundred who don't know any better, who are, are impressionable enough that they want men to guide them. They want guys who have been through it, who understand what, what, what they're supposed to be doing. And instead of seeking out men who are actually in happy long-term relationships, they're seeking out guys that are pretending to sell these courses and, and selling this lifestyle of, of, of that isn't happy.

Right. None of these guys are, are, that are, that are showing like they, that are, are, are doing. These sort of things are actually. Ever [00:46:00] someone I'd look at and like, yeah, that guy looks content. Right. If you're constantly seeking out something else because you're, you have this big gaping hole in your life Yeah.

That, that is, feels empty. Maybe it's because all you're doing is seeking out hollow relationship after hollow relationship where you are purposefully advertising yourself as, as an object. Like even men. This is men objectify. It's one thing I've talked about before. Men objectifying themselves and then being upset when they're objectified.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker 2: Right. Not understanding. Well, I don't understand. Why don't you want me for more than, than just my money is 'cause all you, there you are not offering anything else. Right. You haven't developed anything else. You, she doesn't even know who you are to like or dislike because you've created a caricature of yourself that you think she's going to sleep with.

Speaker: Mm-hmm. And, and in this stage of capitalism too, like mm-hmm. Everybody's working man. Like everybody is working. Like it is so [00:47:00] rare that a woman does not have a job if all you bring to the table is that you provide. Mm-hmm. And that's saying that you do, because half these midnights don't, I don't think, don't have the jobs to provide.

Right. But like, say they did, if that's all you're bringing, so is she.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: So can she, they

Speaker 2: don't, they don't want tribe wives. They want tribe wives who are making full-time incomes as tribe wives on the internet who are showcasing the tribe wife lifestyle to make brand deals. And who are actually working fulltime without realizing it or without, you know.

Well,

Speaker: no, because then she's getting too much attention. They would hate that. Mm-hmm. Because she's going to, it's like you're not bringing to the table any more than she does. Like, there, you're not bringing anything to the table. I think there used to be a time where like women couldn't have fricking credit cards.

Like literally. Mm-hmm. You know, they couldn't, they didn't have access to land, like they didn't have access to opportunities. Mm-hmm. And so now. That women do. It's like you coming to the table saying, I've got a job. She says, yeah, me too. What else? [00:48:00] Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: Right. Because, and that, that is the cultural shift we're at though in our life.

And it's, I think the issue is in previous generations, like for men specifically, I'll, I'll speak to, um, they, they will go to the older men and say, oh, what did you do to get a woman? What, how did you find someone who loved you? And it was in, in generation, after generation, after generation, it's been the exact same thing for a long time where it was you provide money and because that's easy.

My boy, that's, that's always is you, you provide a living, you work full time. Yeah. At the shop on the corner. And you were able to make enough to buy a home. Uh, just take

Speaker: two dimes and Right. Buy the house. It's very easy

Speaker 2: because there's been such a quick shift in both in, in, uh, uh. Economic, uh, imbalance.

Mm-hmm. Where, where, you know, so much money has gone to the upper 1%. Um, and so people are struggling financially, so they don't even ha they're not even able to provide that lifestyle anymore. Mm-hmm. Um, but then they're also finding out [00:49:00] that be, and because of that, as a result of that, you find more women.

And that combined with the fact that women are able to enter the workforce, are able to, like you mentioned, get credit cards and get bank accounts now. Mm-hmm. So there aren't solely reliant on a man being able to provide that for her, but they're realizing, oh, I have no one to teach me. Right. And this is why as a young men really are victims of these older men that are lying to them in these situations.

Um, I have no one to teach me what it means to be an, a whole man in today's society. Yeah. What it means to be a provider in today's society. It's not just a paycheck, it's not just. Doing, having a gun to protect your home. Right. It's actually being a, I just need a gun. Yeah, you have a gun but can protect your, and the one in a million chance someone is gonna break into your home while you're home.

Which is also a,

Speaker 6: that's a good point. Like,

Speaker 2: yeah, a lot of times you won't be, I work, I work 20 hours a week and I travel all the time for my job, but if I'm home during those, those four hours a week and someone breaks [00:50:00] in, I'm there for you. I'm the protector.

Speaker 9: Yeah. Perfect.

Speaker 2: Perfect. So they have all of this stuff going on and then they're not understanding that when you take away all of those sort of things, of course.

A partner, man, woman, or otherwise, is going to want someone that offers them something beyond a paycheck. Yeah. That is a, is offers them something beyond just being an economic provider that actually offers 'em emotional intimacy. Yeah. That offers them understanding. They can listen to 'em, they can have shared activities you like doing with each other.

You can like your same hobbies. They want someone who is a whole partner and not just this provider of money.

Speaker: You know what that's made me think too is that there's so many younger men and then it turn into men. Shocker. Um, blood twist. Like they don't have like depth, emotional depth in relationships.

Like maybe their mom. Mm-hmm. Maybe their mom. Right. Maybe their dad. Probably not. Mm-hmm. But like they've never experienced it because like [00:51:00] my thought is always how can you, like I women are like straight men for example. Like women are such a huge part of my life. Like I love women to my core.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Like,

Speaker: I, I can't imagine a world in which I gay.

I mean, literally, factually,

Speaker 2: quite literally your major. Yeah. Quite

Speaker: literally. But it's like, I can't imagine what that would be like, like not having that intimacy, like not having those, like I have so many like, incredible women that I'm friends with, like that I can tell anything to, and that like, we talk about our problems and I feel supported by, and like mm-hmm.

I have men that I'm friends. I actually have across the gender spectrum, I have mm-hmm. Really good friends. So, so when men talk like that, I'm like, you're, oh my God, you're missing out. Like, what do you, mm-hmm. How could you just pass this up? You have this opportunity to connect, but I'm, I'm thinking as you, as you were talking, it's like they don't have that to begin with.

They don't even probably know what that feels like. There's so [00:52:00] many men. Who I, I don't even know what the, the, the age is that they, they probably stop at a certain age, like allowing themselves to be vulnerable. Mm-hmm. And then they may na, they may not be in position to feel that again for years. Like mm-hmm.

Like, they don't have guy friends they can open up to. They're not, they don't have like. These relationships where they are heard and understood and where like they get to know each other. Mm-hmm. Because half the time they're only getting to know each other's persona.

Speaker 5: Right.

Speaker: You know what I mean? Like, they're bullshitting half the time too.

Like as, like when I was saying, when I was dating guys in high school, it was something I noticed was like, as I said, there would be like the boyfriend I knew and then what they would do with the guys. And I was like, mm-hmm. Your fucking guy friends don't know you. Mm-hmm. Like you're a really kind, sweet person in private.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And then you put on this fucking persona and it's like half your friends don't, like, do any of your friends know you? Mm-hmm. And so they lived their whole lives never really getting any depth from their relationships. And so like, [00:53:00] yeah, of course. Like with a woman, they're like, why would I care?

I don't do that anyways.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: You know what I'm saying?

Speaker 2: No, you're spot on. Yeah.

Speaker: It's just like, it's so, if if they weren't such assholes about it, you'd feel bad for them because it is like you're, you're missing out on life. Like, like I truly believe human connection is such. A reason why we're here.

Like, like what is the point of living is to connect with other people, I think.

Speaker 8: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: And so to have these people who are never truly know others and maybe never are truly known

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Speaker: To live like that. And like, the only way you relate to women is by wanting sex from them. Mm-hmm. Oh my God. Like the, the vapid nature of that.

Like, of course you're fucking lonely.

Speaker 2: Mm-hmm. Of course, we, we, we've discussed that before. It's like they, the the culture that we've created, especially for this, this newer generation, it, it's always existed, but it's gotten worse in a lot of ways. Um, or at least more, more targeted, um, in so many ways is this [00:54:00] idea that they, they, they don't, there's no separation.

Between sexual intimacy and emotional intimacy. Right. That it can only be achieved. And this is why you don't hear about women being as lonely. Mm-hmm. Uh, when they're not in a relationship anymore is because women are very aware of that. And it's not, and there is, this is part of a patriarchal structure, misogynistic structure, our society that teaches men, you shouldn't have those emotions.

You shouldn't, yeah. You should be closed off of those sort of things versus women are, it's, it's, uh, this is, this is why women have it so lucky in our society. Ho ho. I got, I'm gonna un sure. Oh God. I'm switching. I'm, I'm, something's going on. Oh no. He's being dragged into incel culture. No, but, but I will say that, that the, the reason why you, this, this is such an issue is that men do not under, many men do not under, because I, I definitely, I have male friends.

My, my two best friends I open up with, I have, I have emotional intimacy that we, we've shared our, our, our hopes and our dreams and our, [00:55:00] our fears. Like, that's, that's why they're, they're two of my best friends, right? We can talk about these sort of things about our lives. We've gone on trips with each other, where we've talked about these sort of things.

Um, right. But, so it does exist out there. Uh, but I do meet, like when I meet dads at these, like when I like of like, you know, I do, we'll do play dates and like my wife is always wanting me to meet and some like don't, they're nice guys. A lot of 'em are very kind people. Some of them are, are very nice, but it's so hard to, I can feel that barrier.

Yeah. Whereas I am not that I wanted to be You're craving the mom table. You're like, let

Speaker 6: in

Speaker 2: I, no, there was, I think I might have shared this a long time ago. Mm-hmm. But we went to, when we, early on we went to a party and I sat down with the moms. I was enjoying myself having a conversation. And I could tell though, some of them were, because all the dads were outside.

Mm-hmm. And some of them were looking at me like, fuck are you doing in here? Like that you have to put, and I, and I felt that, I was like, I felt it was palpable at a certain point. Like, yeah, why aren't, why aren't you with [00:56:00] the other dads? And I went outside lit immediately. Like, so, uh, you're into sports.

Speaker 9: Yeah.

Speaker 2: I was like, and I do love sports, like I do like that, but I was like, that's not all I, and it was like we just had a conversation from that hour about basketball.

Speaker: Yeah. I mean that's, I was like, all

Speaker 2: right,

Speaker: that's like with me sometimes. Like at first I wasn't sure, like if my wife was with her friends, I'm like, oh God, do I have to go with the, the men?

Do I have to go? Because you know, you divide Yeah. So many times. Um mm-hmm. I, and like, I actually get along shocker really well with men. Mm-hmm. Like, I have no problem interacting with men. I have a good time talking to men, but like mm-hmm. No, it's, it doesn't feel the same way. There is, there is a such a difference in the ways that men interact and like, it's just, um, it's, it's interesting and like, I, I feel like women and men are like constantly performing, but like mm-hmm.

It feels like women perform to survive. Mm-hmm. Like they per

Speaker 8: mm-hmm.

Speaker: [00:57:00] Perform like. To like, almost for safety in society and men, like they're performing for each other, you know? Mm-hmm. It's like, I, I need to get along within this group. Mm-hmm. Um, on a level that like, I, I don't see with women, like, I do see them at least, at least like letting out their personality, right.

Like at least mm-hmm. Being able to be themselves a little bit more and mm-hmm. It's, it's just, you know, I get, I, I, I can't imagine the loneliness that a lot of men feel. Mm-hmm. If that's how they're behaving. Like if they're mm-hmm. If you, if no one ever, if you never get to be yourself, if you never express your feelings, but you know, this is a prison you've built around yourself.

Mm-hmm. Like, I, you, you got it. Like, I think you should, like, if you are feeling lonely, like. I think you should seek community and seek community. Mm-hmm. That's intention isn't to isolate you. The intention of mm-hmm. The in insult culture is to help people [00:58:00] remain isolated. Mm-hmm. Like, they're not trying to get out of that.

They're, they're like mm-hmm. They're staying within themselves and they're having men give them advice that keeps them there. Like it, it has to mm-hmm. It's a self fulfilling prophecy of like, this, this, this ins insult culture. It never ends because there's nothing that seeks to like truly help them get out.

Like they're not helping themselves get away from it. Right. And I, I wish that, you know, like there, there are tools, there are tools out there. Mm-hmm. There are good men that want you mm-hmm. To feel whole and want you to be able to be vulnerable. Like there, there's stuff out there and I wish mm-hmm. Men took more, uh.

Did that more like, took advantage of everyth things. 'cause it's not, it's not fun, but also you don't have to hate yourself. Like, I just can't believe that these men live in a culture where like they hate themselves.

Speaker 8: Mm-hmm. Like

Speaker: people, you know, they hate women. And I understand that, that that's a huge part of it.

But I truly believe at the end of the day, they have a hate for themselves. They have a life that they don't like. You don't think that way and you don't act that [00:59:00] way unless you are miserable.

Speaker 2: There's like a group of guys, like on social media that I'm in that, you know, that, that talk, speak about these sort of things as well.

And I think that's the a, a main theme you will see across all of our platforms is like, the men who hate men are these aspects Yeah. That are, are spreading this stuff. Like, yeah, I, if I thought all men were terrible, I would not be making videos. Talking to men about how much better it can be, about how, how much happier you can be about how much better life fulfilling life can be when you aren't.

Bound by these rigid rule books made by other men forcing you to act and talk and feel a certain way in only allowable circumstances, but only in certain situations when, when you are it, it's just, it's exhausting.

Speaker 8: Yeah. To

Speaker 2: see, and it's not, that's not to say women don't also have these rigid social standards.

Sure, sure. Obviously they absolutely are. Yeah. But in this particular instance, as far as, uh, uh, when it comes to like emotional intimacy specifically, this is, [01:00:00] this is where it harms men and, and women end up getting harmed in turn then because men then seek out women to be their therapist, to be their only sole outlet for what they're going through when that shouldn't be your job.

Like, don't get me wrong, as in a relationship, in a long-term relationship, especially, you do offer that to each other. You end up being your emotional outlets, but that, that shouldn't be your soul. They that shouldn't be your, that's not your job when you're dating someone. I say especially. Well, and

Speaker: it's scary because like men will go into their relationships not being able to emotionally regulate,

Speaker 2: right?

Speaker: Like they go in with, you know, unhealed, really unhealed shit like trauma. They haven't addressed, uh, they don't have very good coping skills, uh mm-hmm. And, and they just walk into relationships with women who, you know, probably through trauma and the experience of being a woman in this culture have had to learn that.

Like that's

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Speaker: Most of the women I know at a young, probably two young age started to learn how to deal with these things [01:01:00] because they had to, to survive. Mm-hmm. And so you have men coming in who are just unhealed and maybe don't have the skills. Like, and, and that's a recipe for disaster. And it's not your partner's job to teach you how to emotionally regulate.

Mm-hmm. It's, I approach your job to teach you how to express yourself or like to heal your trauma, like. You wanna come into the relationship as much as they're like, oh, with a job? It's like, no, no, just come as a whole person. Mm-hmm.

Speaker 4: Like,

Speaker: I guarantee you women would have a better response to you if you came like as a fully formed human being.

Like, know yourself. Like know what? Know what coping skills work like go to therapy, understand what you've been through, like you deserve to work on your trauma. Like, that's the thing is like, it's not even like this hating thing, like mm-hmm. Oh, you men bring like whatever, like you, you're unhealed, whatever.

It's like everybody's been through things. You gotta address it. You gotta look at yourself. You gotta look at the darker parts of yourself that like need to be healed or need to be worked on, and then come into the [01:02:00] relationship like. As a, as a healthy human being because mm-hmm. It is not fair to put that on women.

And that's the role that we have put them in, which is like, if you think only women can provide that for you, then of course if you're only mm-hmm. Dealing with women when you're 35, you know?

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: If you're 20 years old before you interact, then like, damn, you're bringing a lot to this poor woman whose job is not to do that for you.

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: Along the lines of therapy too, I've seen a common theme among guys that talk about therapy is that be like, well, I got nothing out of it. You know, like, what was the point?

Speaker: You get what you put in though.

Speaker 2: Right. And that, and that's kind of, you have to have some goals going in. Yeah. And I think the, the issue that we're kind of getting at, and when it comes to that lack of emotional awareness is you don't know what you don't know.

Right? Right. And so after two months. You, uh, you may have to achieve nothing. Right. Because you're still kind of getting to know yourself, unpacking and figure out Yeah. What is you're, you're struggling with. 'cause you've never bothered to really look at what it is that [01:03:00] you are struggling with. Like, 'cause you're perfect.

Yeah.

Speaker 8: Right.

Speaker 2: I, I'm a man. I'm perfect. Right? Yeah. I I'm already, I'm already doing all this other stuff. Women just have to exist. Yeah. Right. You know, and so, and so they, they go and they're, and what they end up doing is they go to, they go for two months, they loan, they learn some therapy terms and then they weaponize that and become even worse.

Nailed it. I I

Speaker: Therapy so hard.

Speaker 2: Yeah. I do think therapy. That you, if you're a man going to therapy, you shouldn't be going because someone told you to go to therapy. Right. You should be going with some goals in mind. Right. You should be going with, like, I, I, how can I express my emotions better? Like, how can I unpack my emotions better?

How can I, what are some signs that that I can, you know, look for that shows that I'm not dealing with something in a healthy manner, right. As opposed to just going there and being like, yeah, so this girl, this chick I was dating, this is what she did. Because, because a therapist isn't there to necessarily.

Uh, if you don't, if you don't feel [01:04:00] comfortable, if you're not seeking that, they're not going to be like, okay, well let me tell you everything you're doing wrong.

Speaker 8: Right.

Speaker 2: Right. With, with your life. Because they, they also know that they have to move slowly. Especially if it's someone that is, you know, spraying a bunch of trauma toward them.

They know that they can't just immediately jump on them 'cause then they won't come back.

Speaker 9: Right.

Speaker 2: And so, um, like a therapist's job isn't necessarily to fix you. Right. You have to go there with goals that you want them to help you. Right. Work on if yourself and if you already see yourself as perfect

Speaker 5: Yeah.

Speaker 2: Then you're not actually going to achieve anything in therapy.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 2: Or at least it's gonna take a very long time. You can't just quit after two months and be like, this is a waste of my money,

Speaker: gets this idea. Like, all I have to do is get the woman and then I'll be great. And it's like

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Speaker: It's a relationship.

Unless you're just trying to sleep with women like.

Speaker 5: You

Speaker: are going to have to interact with her. You are going to like, you're going to have, you know, conflict, you're gonna have issues that you don't agree on. And like, the idea is that you would grow together. So if you're coming in [01:05:00] mm-hmm. And thinking, oh, she'll just fix me, uh mm-hmm.

Or she'll adjust to me, a lot of times it's like, I feel like they just think the woman's gonna adjust to like, right. Like, I have my life. And then you're additional to that. Like you're just a little add-on. Mm-hmm. Versus like

Speaker 5: mm-hmm.

Speaker: Oh, let's, let's build a life together. Like, let me change. Right. Like, let it, let's like adapt and make the best life for both of us on.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. They just,

Speaker 2: why would I adapt? I'm perfect though. We just went over that. I have been working really hard and you've been just existing.

Speaker: Yes. Yes. What do I

Speaker 2: have to change? Yeah. And that's kind of the mentality we're working with.

Speaker: Yeah. Well that was fun. Fun. Just our favorite little topics, man,

Speaker 2: we always, we always start off so lighthearted and then end by the end we're like, and so that's why the world sucks.

Speaker: That's

Speaker 6: why I don't sleep at

Speaker: night. Anyways.

Speaker 2: Yeah, if you do wanna find, once again, a more lighthearted, unhinged version of us where we just kind of talk about random shit in our [01:06:00] lives, where can they find us? Reagan,

Speaker 3: the Patreon.

Speaker 2: Yeah, that's where I was going. Oh yes. The Patreon. That was a bad, it was actually a bad setup, but yes, that's what I was referring.

Oh, I got

Speaker: it. It's the Patreon. So make sure to check out our Patreon where we do a full episode, like a full extra episode each week. We talk about all kinds of fun stuff, crazy stuff, whatever we feel like. Usually a rant. And then of course we have our socials, so we have the Mr. Pickery and the Man Hater.

Instagram, we have speech prof. Um, mine's now buckle up babes. So look for that.

Speaker 2: Took me a while to find you, to tag you on our, uh, clip by the Bear podcast.

Speaker: She's gone. She's totally gone. Yes, I changed, I did my, uh, other podcast has had a little bit of a rebrand, so.

Speaker 5: Mm-hmm.

Speaker: That's where I am. But other than that, friends, we will see you next week.

Bye. Love you. Bye.