00:00:01.37
alexei sayle
Hello everybody, welcome to episode 98, nearly approaching that 100 mark of of the Alexi Selle podcast and episode 19 where we recorded rope tackle in Shoreham next week, all sold out.

00:00:18.84
alexei sayle
yeah I'm going to fly into the Shoreham Aerodrome because of the crash a few years i'm gonna so i'm gonna travel down to sure in my own um mig 21 that i yeah i'll i'll fly out from they'll clear they'll clear high holborn and give me a straight run uh

00:00:31.73
Talal K
Are you flying out from the historic Croydon Airport?

00:00:43.72
Talal K
From High Open.

00:00:44.82
alexei sayle
Yeah, I'm going to fly from High Holborn in my own, like John Travolta, in my own MiG-21, just short takeoff, reek go to reheat as soon as I'm off the ground.

00:00:56.58
alexei sayle
So vertical takeoff.

00:00:56.17
Talal K
Reheat.

00:00:58.75
alexei sayle
fly, and then I'm going to land at Shoreham Airport to do the rope tackle show that that night. So that'll be exciting.

00:01:10.57
Talal K
Whoa, MiG-21 looks crazy. It's got a big pointy nose.

00:01:13.93
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:01:15.73
Talal K
what's the use of What's the point of that? Is that to catch geese? Is that to push geese aside?

00:01:19.21
alexei sayle
It's just sort of just to to direct the air around the air intake, because the air intake is right at the front rather than at the sides.

00:01:23.20
Talal K
Super streamlined, yeah.

00:01:26.97
alexei sayle
In more modern jet aircraft, the the air intake on the MiG-21 was right at the front.

00:01:30.02
Talal K
Fucking hell. Can that thing land and vertically?

00:01:34.61
alexei sayle
No, no, no, no.

00:01:36.87
Talal K
It doesn't hover.

00:01:38.39
alexei sayle
It does not hover.

00:01:38.38
Talal K
No, no, it doesn't, no.

00:01:40.35
alexei sayle
The only Soviet jet that hovered was the Yak-28, I think it was, which looked a bit like a Harrier, but actually had she separate engines for takeoff and lateral flight.

00:01:53.62
Talal K
Wow.

00:01:54.99
alexei sayle
It wasn't a huge success, I think.

00:01:55.72
Talal K
Fascinating.

00:01:59.05
alexei sayle
But, yeah, so and that's how I'm going to land. I think John Travolta lives in one of these because he's got a huge collection. There are housing estates in the United States that have, you know, landing strips. They have runways rather than...

00:02:18.75
Talal K
The driveway.

00:02:19.84
alexei sayle
driveways or roads so you you you have your planes stored in a hangar and then you just you drive onto the runway and take off from your house

00:02:21.03
Talal K
Come on.

00:02:30.06
Talal K
Has he had a near, did he have a plane crash?

00:02:33.48
alexei sayle
as far as i know i know he can fly like i think he don't whether he's's he's he's type approved to fly like a 747 and stuff i think

00:02:41.70
Talal K
Fuck me. Mate, if I was rich, I would definitely learn to fly. Like that's the, what are you see on money? You know, to learn how to fly plane.

00:02:50.40
alexei sayle
You have to be very rich. so's very but I actually once, when I was flying to the States, of the guy next to me was was from the, not the F, whatever, the CAA, I think the ah ah the the ah the the ah the approval body for aircraft in in this country who's flying to the States.

00:03:07.87
alexei sayle
I can't remember why. So he had a very interesting... But he said they're very reluctant approve the private use of fighter jets because he said, like, unlike in the States, he said if you have a problem...

00:03:17.83
Talal K
Well, yeah.

00:03:20.88
alexei sayle
you know' yeah're you're overbrut you know, you're over Aberdeen and you're lightning 1960s fighter jet, but if something goes wrong by the time you crash, you're in Brighton, you know, so, I mean, they go so far.

00:03:33.00
Talal K
Oh, is that why?

00:03:34.01
alexei sayle
Yeah, so he said, you know, it's such a small country that really they don't generally allow people to have single-engine fighters or whatever.

00:03:42.81
Talal K
I was thinking more like if someone has a gun and they lose their mind and they kill some people, but if you owned a fucking fighter jet, the damage you could do.

00:03:53.34
alexei sayle
Yeah, mean, I don't think you'd you'd ever get approval for weapons, but yeah, but even so, yeah, as I said, you you know.

00:04:00.03
Talal K
Right, they move that fast, they really do, yeah.

00:04:01.58
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:04:02.32
Talal K
That's mad.

00:04:03.65
alexei sayle
Yeah. So they were reluctant. I don't know if people are allowed to. Well, that was that hunter that crashed at Shoreham, which is in the Hawker Hunter, I think. I mean, that was privately owned, I think.

00:04:18.84
alexei sayle
So it is allowed, and that did, I mean, that killed a number of people, on the road on the the road that runs up through Shoreham.

00:04:27.44
Talal K
hunter. Is that a fighter jet as well?

00:04:29.61
alexei sayle
Yeah, so 19 British fighter jet.

00:04:34.53
Talal K
So did the you always complain about it's not as impressive looking the hunter. bit I like the curves on it though. It's a curvy little thing.

00:04:43.04
alexei sayle
Yeah, it sold well. I think it was during the time of British...

00:04:47.00
Talal K
Is that a bomber?

00:04:48.46
alexei sayle
No, it's ah ah it's a jet fighter. It may it may may be able to be to bomb, you know, to do precision bombing as well, but essentially a fighter interceptor, I think.

00:04:52.77
Talal K
It's the body of a

00:04:58.68
Talal K
I've got a monitor. So if people watching, oh you see me looking to the right, I can now Google stuff on a separate screen.

00:05:04.80
alexei sayle
don't know.

00:05:05.02
Talal K
I've got little monitor here on my right. So now I can look at all these fucking army planes that you keep talking about. you You complain that, you know, the British made, you know, naval ships and planes, they all fall apart nowadays and they're useless.

00:05:22.63
alexei sayle
Yes.

00:05:24.07
Talal K
But we used to be the gold standard or not.

00:05:27.53
alexei sayle
Yeah, so in some areas. I mean, the Centurion tank of... This has gone in a direction I didn't expect, but Centurion tank, for instance, of the 19... I mean, British tanks during the Second World War were pretty terrible, but the Centurion that came right at the end of the war was the was really the best, certainly the best Western tank of the 1950s. I our fighter jets were...

00:05:51.57
alexei sayle
fine but at that time britain was spending 10 of gdp on military equipment and so you know the money was there to i mean still a lot of it was squandered like having three separate v bombers i think it was insane so it was still there was still a massive over i guess corruption and and you know mis misappropriation of resources so i

00:05:58.79
Talal K
Yeah.

00:06:19.79
Talal K
What's wrong with having three bombers?

00:06:22.18
alexei sayle
You don't need three different bombers to essentially do the same thing. Dunno, disagree with me, listeners.

00:06:26.94
Talal K
All right.

00:06:30.84
Talal K
Oh, three different bombers.

00:06:32.70
alexei sayle
Yeah, the Vulcan.

00:06:32.88
Talal K
They had multiples of each one, right? Surely.

00:06:35.20
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.

00:06:36.01
Talal K
Yeah, okay.

00:06:36.32
alexei sayle
But they had the three different, entirely different models, the Victor, the Vulcan, and the whatever the other third one was called.

00:06:37.80
Talal K
Three different ones. Put your focus on one thing.

00:06:44.96
Talal K
Wow.

00:06:46.02
alexei sayle
But, yeah, I think, you know, I think... we'd reached, yeah we'd reached the peak of kind of efficiency and produce in producing arms by the end of the Second World War, but then that was, that kind of went away again in the 60s.

00:06:58.34
Talal K
Hmm, hmm, hmm.

00:07:02.24
alexei sayle
Should we?

00:07:03.83
Talal K
Should we the podcast then?

00:07:04.70
alexei sayle
Yes, that was, ah so yeah, that was, that was, that was intensely pleasurable for me.

00:07:06.02
Talal K
press record now, shall I?

00:07:11.00
alexei sayle
I don't know if it, how it felt to the listeners. I could go on about, british of course, the British british main battle rifle as well. Maybe we'll do that in another show, the FNFAL.

00:07:25.97
Talal K
You know about Croydon Airport?

00:07:28.62
alexei sayle
They used to be the main airport for London, yeah. The airport sort of hotel or the airport building is still there, isn't it? You go drive-through Croydon.

00:07:36.19
Talal K
Yeah, and it's got a plane out the front of it. Oh shit, what plane is it? I was just reading about it.

00:07:43.39
alexei sayle
Like at the Havilland or something.

00:07:47.70
Talal K
me see. But a historic Croydon. Yeah, it was a a bloody, you know, JFK landed went there as a kid with his dad.

00:08:00.75
Talal K
Who's his bloody dad? um Yeah, it was Britain's first terminal and control tower. But it looks cool, it's got this art deco building and there's this really pretty plane out the front.

00:08:13.87
alexei sayle
Yes, i'm I remember you drive past it, it's lovely, yeah. Yeah.

00:08:17.24
Talal K
I've always wondered what the hell that plane was doing there. And then just, I think there was an article in the Times this week about it.

00:08:22.76
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah.

00:08:25.83
Talal K
Intriguing, I'd love to visit.

00:08:26.42
alexei sayle
I think like amy you know and Amelia Earhart and people flew from, and Amy Johnson flew from, yeah.

00:08:31.68
Talal K
Amy Johnson.

00:08:33.37
alexei sayle
Yes.

00:08:34.10
Talal K
She was the first woman to fly solo to Australia.

00:08:38.00
alexei sayle
yes

00:08:40.87
Talal K
Maybe we could visit and do a video there.

00:08:43.77
alexei sayle
Yes, not that much. always used to like Croydon. We used to see Croydon from... from sort of from sort of South London, and it was sort was it was then... very it was it was a very rare cluster. This is in, like, the 80s or something. It very rare cluster of tower blocks, know, which was was unusual. Then had, like, the city of London, and then you had Croydon, which was... I used to think of that line from the Stevie Wonder song. He says, new year new living for the city, know, New York, just like I pictured it, skyscrapers and everything.

00:09:18.16
alexei sayle
I used to think Croydon, just like I pictured it, skyscrapers and everything. and But it was it was quite a sight, Croydon, seen from a distance in the 80s.

00:09:28.77
Talal K
From a distance.

00:09:30.04
alexei sayle
Yeah, well, you know.

00:09:31.80
Talal K
I used to be terrified of it as a kid, because you'd hear horror horror stories.

00:09:34.09
alexei sayle
Croydon.

00:09:35.29
Talal K
It's really rough, you know, it had their reputation for being really rough.

00:09:36.71
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah,

00:09:39.05
Talal K
But I've had some great nights out there now, you know, as an adult.

00:09:41.27
alexei sayle
yeah no, it's got some nice bits, hasn't it, Croydon? Yeah.

00:09:44.57
Talal K
It's got some great culture and nightlife. They call it the cronks.

00:09:46.48
alexei sayle
Yeah. The crunks, really.

00:09:48.86
Talal K
Yeah, yeah.

00:09:51.69
alexei sayle
Just outside Croydon, I once bought a very disappointing tandoori chicken.

00:09:59.93
alexei sayle
yeah so You can see it still burns now. bought this tandoori chicken. I think I might have even got a parking ticket as well. We were driving, I guess we were driving to Brighton or something on the surface roads and just outside Croydon.

00:10:14.84
alexei sayle
Tandoori chickens and cheap.

00:10:15.13
Talal K
Ouch.

00:10:17.88
alexei sayle
And we parked, had it, and it was really disappointing. So anyway, should we...

00:10:23.89
Talal K
Yeah. After that thrilling segment, what's our next segment?

00:10:27.70
alexei sayle
Yeah, this is...

00:10:29.59
Talal K
Hey, what's been grinding your gears this week, Alexi?

00:10:31.39
alexei sayle
Yeah, what grinds my gears, yeah, is, ah well, let's stick here, Starman.

00:10:31.72
Talal K
We haven't done that in a while.

00:10:36.58
alexei sayle
Linda got a, sent me a really interesting quote from somebody, I think on Twitter or X, where it was going now. Somebody called the Marx, Engels, Lenin, Stalin, Mao Institute. They sound like good people. And there's really good Keir Starmer yesterday in order to try and divert attention from his terrible the Labour Party plotting against him. He's disinterred ID cards again. and Marx, and Engels, Lenin, Stalin, Mao Institute, they say...

00:11:08.76
alexei sayle
This has nothing to do with immigration whatsoever, because he said it was about immigration.

00:11:12.26
Talal K
Yeah. Hmm.

00:11:13.10
alexei sayle
Just as it had nothing to do with terrorism when Blair proposed it, and nothing to do with football violence when Thatcher first floated it. This is another power grab by the security services and a chance for dodgy tech companies to milk cash out of the state for a project that will go billions over budget.

00:11:35.62
Talal K
a

00:11:36.04
alexei sayle
It must be opposed by everyone who values free speech and basic technology. Democratic rights. I think that's a very good point. I mean, just that it is one of these fucking things that they kind of that they that they you know they drag out from time to time.

00:11:54.25
Talal K
Yeah. ah ah So they're using immigration, which is the hot button topic at the moment, which seems to have a lot of people behind this anti-immigration sentiment.

00:12:04.50
Talal K
So they're using that to try and help them.

00:12:07.70
alexei sayle
As an excuse to launch this fucking ID card, yeah.

00:12:10.02
Talal K
No, but to help get support for it, you know, dissuade any people who would say otherwise that this is a bad idea.

00:12:12.90
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah.

00:12:17.11
alexei sayle
But to point out that it's been brought in, you know, floated before and wants to stop football violence and wants to stop terrorism, it's a really, it's a very good point.

00:12:24.15
Talal K
Exactly, it's really, really well done to highlight that.

00:12:28.01
alexei sayle
I mean, that fucking man, honestly. But yeah, so, you know.

00:12:33.79
Talal K
Digital ID cards. What would be the harm of a digital ID card for everyone?

00:12:39.81
alexei sayle
I don't know, because it was a big thing, after because people that had ID cards during the war, and it was a big thing afterwards to get rid of them, and there's footage of people burning their ID cards and saying, no, we are British. It's not in our tradition to have ID cards. and

00:12:58.27
Talal K
Yes.

00:12:58.30
alexei sayle
it you really It was one of the kind of central planks of the post-war the immediate post-war that that we that we no longer had to i did cause because it was no longer necessary and i think that's as true now as it was it was then really in but i mean just fucking starmer i'm sorry i voted for him i didn't um

00:13:23.85
Talal K
you can't You can't burn a digital ID card, can you?

00:13:26.20
alexei sayle
No, you can't. That's true. and But it also will. But, you know, you think of... I was just... Because I was watching a clip somewhere about people talking about the... the um I mean, they cover these things up, but there was a Fujitsu, of course, also responsible for the post office horizon scandal.

00:13:42.42
alexei sayle
They'd also been brought in to do a kind of... To do the NHS...

00:13:50.13
alexei sayle
IT and that went 12 billion pounds over budget 12 billion pounds over budget and I think Linda was saying there was maybe that they're going to give the contract to Palantir as well because we were deeply embedded in the Israeli genocide and one of their founders Peter Thiel is a raving scientist yeah

00:13:55.15
Talal K
Fuck.

00:13:58.15
Talal K
Fuck's sake.

00:14:10.63
Talal K
Fuck's sake. We don't need them.

00:14:12.35
alexei sayle
so

00:14:13.01
Talal K
We've already got everything you need to know about me is already, already accessible by the government.

00:14:15.44
alexei sayle
yeah

00:14:18.09
Talal K
My card, credit card information, my picture, my address.

00:14:18.29
alexei sayle
yeah

00:14:22.87
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:14:23.61
Talal K
it's so unnecessary so absolutely just you gotta think someone's profiting out of this what

00:14:29.60
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, and it's about, I mean, I think it's probably just a distraction, just something to say on the day when he was being attacked by Andy Bannon, but also, yeah, trying to shift the news focus. Yeah, I just say to people, you know, who know who I am, just get a book about comedy. And...

00:14:47.99
Talal K
hmm

00:14:50.09
alexei sayle
and

00:14:50.22
Talal K
What is this Burnham beef? Can you shed any light on that for me?

00:14:53.27
alexei sayle
well that's Not a great deal.

00:14:54.24
Talal K
And other general beefs.

00:14:54.79
alexei sayle
that's why I was thinking that. and I mean, essentially, i mean, Keir Starmer is failing massively. is massively hated. And, you know, he's going to lose the country to reform.

00:15:05.97
alexei sayle
And so people on the left of the party are floating. Andy, you know, ask Andy Bairnham, it does seem kind of personable. I mean, he's not. he's and if you If you remember him when Jeremy won the leadership, he was just another empty soup mouthing neoliberal platitude.

00:15:23.26
alexei sayle
So he's learned it.

00:15:24.01
Talal K
Oh.

00:15:24.86
alexei sayle
But he has ah he's at a he's had a good, you know, the the Hillsborough law, the Hillsborough campaign and also the yeah Manchester Arena bombings. He was impressive as a person during those. So is I suspect he's a much more decent person than...

00:15:42.74
alexei sayle
starmer who's terrible but yeah i don't know whether the i mean the faction around starmer is that they would i think because they're so right-wing i mean i mean again i'm not in the labor party but they seem they control the levers of power so know they would rather have west streeting is their anointed candidate so i don't know whether bernham could

00:15:44.10
Talal K
It's not difficult.

00:16:05.31
alexei sayle
I mean, I guess the membership would support him, but, you know, as we saw during the Corbyn years, they don't matter. So...

00:16:15.63
Talal K
Wes, who looks at Wes Street and thinks there's our next leader?

00:16:16.45
alexei sayle
I know. Yeah, with his film-style good looks.

00:16:23.28
Talal K
He's a worn out flannel.

00:16:25.47
alexei sayle
Yeah, well, they, you know, they're... but they're They're flailing around, really. But, I i mean, in a way, I suppose, i mean, to segue into your party, Shane Hannigan, it would be if Burnham did somehow get the leadership the Labour Party, he would, at least on the service move to the left, I think he would, presumably, he would accept back, you know, people who had been expelled. And he may even have, of course, offered... I mean, it's something I don't understand, really.

00:16:58.44
alexei sayle
I mean, i would friend i was talking to somebody who who knows him well or works with him. So he's still in grief and anger and about being expelled from the Labour Party. Why you would be angry about being expelled from that hateful organisation, I don't really know. But they're all...

00:17:16.21
alexei sayle
those left MPs like MacDonald or Clive Lewis who stay in the Labour Party, that they seem to have this affection for it, which I find inexplicable. And I think Jeremy still does.

00:17:28.05
alexei sayle
And so it would be a sort of, it would perhaps affect... The, you know, because people are partly interested in your party because the Labour Party has moved so far to the right.

00:17:35.93
Talal K
Mm-hmm.

00:17:42.13
alexei sayle
I don't think Burnham would substantially alter the the reality of the Labour Party, but he might also alter the tone, as it were. So he would accept left wingers back. He would maybe be a bit more, know, a bit less supportive of the Israeli genocide and so on and so forth. So...

00:17:59.70
alexei sayle
And so that might be a problem for your part of it, that people would, you know, the best the devil you know and stuff it would be. People might be moved to... but So I...

00:18:11.01
Talal K
And he's not a posh twat.

00:18:12.51
alexei sayle
No, no. Well, neither the street in all fairness, but I mean... So i anyway, i I don't know whether he he could...

00:18:18.03
Talal K
Hmm.

00:18:25.03
alexei sayle
Get the Leadership Labour Party, I think it would it would be a complicated... As if there aren't enough complicating factors already, it would be would be a fairly complicating factor for the nascent political left party at the moment known as your party.

00:18:45.34
Talal K
but How many times did the Tories change leadership without losing without losing power?

00:18:49.51
alexei sayle
Well, many, well, Boris, Boris, what was it? Boris, who came after Boris? Was it Liz Truss after Boris? but And then Rishi Sunak and then Kemi Badenoch.

00:18:56.70
Talal K
Briefly, yeah.

00:18:59.53
alexei sayle
So, I mean, well, that's one of the reasons that they're in the electoral doldrums, isn't it? Because they have changed leaders. The public apparently does not like that, really.

00:19:07.08
Talal K
Yeah.

00:19:08.08
alexei sayle
So changing leaders does not sit well with the voting public, apparently.

00:19:14.26
Talal K
Hmm.

00:19:14.75
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:19:16.36
Talal K
So yeah, this new part, your party shenanigans.

00:19:17.77
alexei sayle
Yes, your party. It's been a troubled them period.

00:19:23.72
Talal K
I...

00:19:25.03
alexei sayle
We're all very excited. i I mean, obviously everybody, so many people are excited about it now, they feel a bit sick.

00:19:33.47
Talal K
Yeah, I was one of the people who, as soon as I saw that email saying, you can now officially become a member.

00:19:33.99
alexei sayle
About the shenanigans.

00:19:41.83
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:19:42.75
Talal K
I signed up. I couldn't have signed up quicker. Couldn't have given them my money quicker.

00:19:47.22
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:19:48.28
Talal K
it was like moments later that he we got another email saying, Hey, ignore that.

00:19:50.82
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:19:54.27
Talal K
That was just Zara acting on a limb and don't, don't listen to her and all that.

00:19:57.72
alexei sayle
yeah

00:19:59.56
Talal K
i'm like, what the fuck? And then Zara released another statement saying they've been really mean to me. And they like had this sexist boys club and,

00:20:10.12
Talal K
been shutting me out of proceedings and I didn't do anything that wasn't agreed on when we first started. And my main reaction was, guys, why are you airing your your dirty laundry like this?

00:20:24.47
Talal K
This a, how can, how could this even fucking happen?

00:20:25.93
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:20:28.85
Talal K
That one person can click a button and and take people's money like that.

00:20:34.56
alexei sayle
Well, yeah.

00:20:35.20
Talal K
It was quite shocking.

00:20:38.03
alexei sayle
I mean, I think that she i mean i think that she's been...

00:20:38.15
Talal K
and

00:20:41.34
alexei sayle
I mean, I think they're all... Both sides are worthy of blame, really. I mean, what she's tried to do, I think, is to, you know, i mean, that's to one one of the things that you can say about Jeremy is he doesn't move fast, really.

00:20:54.94
alexei sayle
And so she's been, by these unilateral the the unilateral declaration of that it was going to be joint leadership, and then by launching the membership portal, she's been attempting to

00:20:55.02
Talal K
Yes.

00:21:08.58
alexei sayle
kick him into action, really. Because if it was, that I mean, he has just, yeah, yeah.

00:21:12.16
Talal K
if that's the case, it seemed to have worked because now Jeremy's announced the launch of the portal, you know.

00:21:16.39
alexei sayle
and So, yeah, exactly. I mean, he should have done this. I mean, he should have launched the Left Party three years ago, really.

00:21:24.04
Talal K
You've been saying it for months that he's like dragging his feet and talking to everyone in the country and...

00:21:24.40
alexei sayle
It's,

00:21:27.84
alexei sayle
yeah. I mean, in a good i mean the sense, you know, his inclinations to be consensual and democratic and talk to literally everybody and their cat, you know, is is ah is it is a good thing.

00:21:35.80
Talal K
Democratic. Extremely democratic.

00:21:43.53
alexei sayle
But sometimes it's a bad thing when it when it is it results in paralysis, as it has been doing in this, you know, it's not, you have to get a move on.

00:21:49.63
Talal K
Yeah.

00:21:53.39
alexei sayle
the vote There's a guy, I'm a member of Camden People's Alliance, which is, you know, which is ah Andrew Andrew Feinstein.

00:21:59.08
Talal K
Yeah. Yeah.

00:22:04.47
Talal K
yeah

00:22:04.85
alexei sayle
And there's a guy who takes the minutes called Archie. I can't remember his second name, but he's got a very good article on the Novara site about the shenanigans, really. So if people want to know,

00:22:18.99
alexei sayle
what's gone on so far i think that's it that's a that's a good place to look really i mean i suppose you can say i mean you the greens or the labor party or whoever you know they you know they they they're they're formed by small groups of people and they grow this is a party which is uniquely really trying to form itself in the bright spotlight of having, you know, 800,000 people, you know, it's only clicking on the link, but nevertheless,

00:22:52.03
alexei sayle
They're trying to you're trying to form a party from scratch while having this intense, while having potentially a massive membership from the get-go.

00:23:01.79
Talal K
Yes.

00:23:02.19
alexei sayle
And, know, whereas most parties start out with very small membership and then they get to define themselves and their ideology and then they grow. this is is This is a kind of reverse position, really.

00:23:15.87
Talal K
They start with a small membership and a strong leadership.

00:23:20.100
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah.

00:23:21.57
Talal K
So this this democrat extreme democrat democracy approach that your party has done is indeed a a double-edged sword approach because...

00:23:29.41
alexei sayle
It is.

00:23:31.02
Talal K
Yeah, it's take it's been slow and it's been fucking messy as hell.

00:23:35.45
alexei sayle
I mean, I don't think that's because of the extreme democracy in all fairness. I think that's because of factual infighting. but ah But yeah, I mean, it will be a big unwieldy beast if if it ist is truly going to be democratic from the bottom up That will be complicated.

00:23:46.97
Talal K
never But even beyond that, just, you know, some of the people involved or not involved, there's been, you know, discussions and disputes about that. and But the the positive side of it,

00:24:01.46
Talal K
is this is the glimmer of hope I've taken away from from this last week, is that the whole point they've been saying from the beginning is that when we launch in November, when we have our conference, it's you that are going to decide who the leaders are.

00:24:15.78
Talal K
Like, we're not we don't we're not promising to be the leaders of the party.

00:24:15.100
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:24:19.14
Talal K
We're just trying to steward its launch, trying to steward it its founding.

00:24:22.08
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:24:23.39
Talal K
You're going to decide who the leaders are. You're going to decide what our manifesto is. And that is, that is just, I'm just waiting for that day.

00:24:28.66
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:24:31.66
Talal K
Cause once that shapes, once that comes into shape, then we can have something that we're going to truly stand behind or we'll just go, you know what?

00:24:31.70
alexei sayle
I'm over here. Yeah.

00:24:36.98
alexei sayle
But.

00:24:40.64
Talal K
I'm going to join the green pot.

00:24:42.31
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, we'll see. Yeah, we'll see to what extent that democracy is is acted out in in the real world, you know.

00:24:49.92
Talal K
It could just get messier. Yeah.

00:24:52.51
alexei sayle
But, yeah, like let's hope. But it's, it has I mean, it's obviously as if we didn't need enough, as we say in Yiddish, suus in our lives, we didn't need enough upset, you know, with the genocide and...

00:25:06.59
Talal K
Yeah.

00:25:08.07
alexei sayle
You know, its the that this should play out the way it has done so far is is just, it's just is you know, it's more like you know it's more it's it's very it's very difficult to handle, really, I think. I'm sympathetic with people who, you know, found it traumatic, really.

00:25:34.29
Talal K
yeah And you can even you can even kind of, there's nothing insidious going on, which I believe.

00:25:36.89
alexei sayle
But hopefully,

00:25:42.72
alexei sayle
what you mean by insidious?

00:25:42.77
Talal K
There's nothing kind of, like nothing, everyone means well who's in there, you know?

00:25:49.88
alexei sayle
Well, yeah. i Yeah, maybe.

00:25:55.36
Talal K
at least Zara and Jeremy, I do believe they mean well.

00:25:55.71
alexei sayle
They're good people.

00:25:58.16
Talal K
and They're trying to create something.

00:25:59.49
alexei sayle
They're good people, yeah. They're both good people, yeah. and Yeah.

00:26:04.34
alexei sayle
that uh yeah we will see no it's just the partly the people well some of the people some of the people around them i think are not may also be good people but are not

00:26:07.68
Talal K
Why, what's your doubts there?

00:26:19.80
Talal K
Yeah.

00:26:22.42
alexei sayle
not going to be effective in this process. I it won't go into names, but, you know, I think them, you know, that there there are others involved who are complicating shit.

00:26:37.92
alexei sayle
No.

00:26:38.79
Talal K
I don't know. I don't. Yeah, I don't like what I've heard about one of the one of the geezers in Jeremy's crew.

00:26:47.26
alexei sayle
No.

00:26:47.56
Talal K
His his position on trans rights and stuff that kind of.

00:26:51.32
alexei sayle
Yeah, I mean, I'm less... I mean, i yeah.

00:26:53.25
Talal K
Yeah.

00:26:55.48
alexei sayle
I don't know whether you were you're going to get anywhere with these purity tests, though, you know. So you anyway, that's us' all to be decided.

00:27:02.06
Talal K
yeah

00:27:05.30
alexei sayle
ye anyway, so...

00:27:05.99
Talal K
Yeah. You put through anyone through the ringer, some shit's going to fall out, it?

00:27:11.25
alexei sayle
Yeah, I think... i mean, i think i think criteria for the... for the membership of the party have got to be much broader. you know youve You've just got to agree to socialism, basically.

00:27:23.03
alexei sayle
What your views are on subjects within that, I think, are not necessarily relevant. You've just got to be committed to equality and socialism.

00:27:36.56
alexei sayle
Internationalism, I think you can't exclude people and in the from the minutiae of beliefs. is my and feeling.

00:27:45.86
Talal K
Reading further into it now, it's not the worst stuff he's said. I've heard a lot worse shit said than that.

00:27:51.48
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, I'm not, yeah. Others.

00:27:55.05
Talal K
But yeah, we've got to build that foundation of socialism. And that's that's what makes them unique as well.

00:27:57.80
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:27:59.84
Talal K
is the I don't think Green Party are outwardly socialist.

00:27:59.99
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:28:03.94
alexei sayle
I don't think they are, mean, I think Polanski would call himself an eco-socialist, I think, but...

00:28:09.27
Talal K
Yeah. Yeah.

00:28:11.34
alexei sayle
No, we will see. we will see. But also, I think there was there was also doubt about this the membership saying you couldn't be a member of another party. so I was at a meeting the other night. And that would mean that je somebody said Jeremy himself wouldn't be able to join your party because he's a member of the Beeson Justice Project, which is a party. so that's, I mean, I don't know whether that's an attempt to not allow people, you know, like the Socialist Workers Party or the Communist Party or whatever, to to be involved in this process.

00:28:42.34
alexei sayle
But I think that's something that's, people see that as a kind of roadblock.

00:28:42.35
Talal K
Oh, shit.

00:28:47.50
alexei sayle
Jeremy has since,

00:28:47.51
Talal K
Well, surely Jeremy's planning on folding that in to to your party.

00:28:51.08
alexei sayle
yeah but Yeah, but anyway, that's another. there are There are obviously doctrinal, yeah there are there are immense complexities.

00:28:55.68
Talal K
That's interesting.

00:29:00.22
alexei sayle
I mean, I'm not, it's not my area of expertise really, but there are areas are areas of complexity that remain to be dealt with.

00:29:12.77
alexei sayle
But we will see.

00:29:15.27
Talal K
Your area of expertise, of course, being hunter, fighter jet,

00:29:17.31
alexei sayle
i think, yeah, pulling funny faces Yes, weapon weaponry.

00:29:25.31
Talal K
that tank we mentioned, I've lost that tab now.

00:29:28.60
alexei sayle
The Centurion.

00:29:29.70
Talal K
Centurion.

00:29:32.50
alexei sayle
Fantastic tank. And...

00:29:34.44
Talal K
Hey, I was at Thought Park last night yesterday,

00:29:37.52
alexei sayle
Yes.

00:29:39.24
Talal K
and i am I was wondering if there was an Alexi land.

00:29:45.24
Talal K
What would be, what would be, so i was at Thought Park yesterday.

00:29:48.17
alexei sayle
Like Banksy's Dismal Land.

00:29:50.66
Talal K
Yeah, like, dismal and yeah, what would be, like if you could design a Thought partt be Park, theme park?

00:29:55.54
alexei sayle
Well, a friend, when I was in LA once years ago, I was actually a relative of my friend. and We were taken around the original Disneyland in Orange County by one of the people who, one of the designers who'd worked there.

00:30:10.39
Talal K
Whoa.

00:30:16.82
alexei sayle
And places where people killed, been killed.

00:30:21.50
Talal K
Fuck.

00:30:21.70
alexei sayle
People had been dragged into the machinery of the Michael Jackson world. and oh the the the yeah Those bears, those animatronic bears had gone wild and torn people's heads up.

00:30:32.42
alexei sayle
But and what the... and But what the disney what Disney would do, of course, was offer people massive compensation and then if they didn't, they would to intimidate them if they didn't if they shut up, if they tried to speak out about these deaths.

00:30:34.66
Talal K
That's not true.

00:30:47.27
Talal K
Fucking hell.

00:30:48.09
alexei sayle
I think with the teacups, Alice's Teacups was a ride and one of them had come loose and flown across the ah ah theme park with people in it.

00:30:56.78
Talal K
Jesus Christ.

00:30:58.03
alexei sayle
then because they do have their own paramilitary police force. And this is also, wrote one of my my best short stories called Big Headed Cartoon Animal, which is about a theme park.

00:31:10.13
alexei sayle
And they are because it's all connected by underground tunnels as well.

00:31:14.44
Talal K
Yeah.

00:31:15.28
alexei sayle
like if you put your waste and rubbish bin it drops straight down into one of these tunnels and then take it away and that's the way because you never see food delivery trucks or anything because it's all delivered underground to the the the concessions

00:31:25.90
Talal K
Wow.

00:31:29.20
Talal K
As seen in Beverly Hill Cop Three.

00:31:33.41
alexei sayle
really really

00:31:33.63
Talal K
Beverly Hills Cop Three. Yeah, it's set in a theme park and he goes underground, runs around. Yeah.

00:31:39.65
alexei sayle
There's one in them the the first two, this is you know film sequences where the first two to it are very good and then the third one's terrible. don't know whether it's National Lampoon. I used to love National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation.

00:31:55.77
alexei sayle
And there's National Lampoon Summer Vacation where they're going Wally World, which is it is a kind of moose.

00:32:03.16
Talal K
Yeah.

00:32:03.39
alexei sayle
And they have adventures along the way.

00:32:03.40
Talal K
Yeah.

00:32:06.02
alexei sayle
Chevy Chase. Is it Chevy Chase? Yes, Chevy Chase.

00:32:08.31
Talal K
yeah

00:32:08.72
alexei sayle
and then and then But the the third one, which I think I might have auditioned for, was they come to Europe. It's National Lampoon's European vacation, and then it's staffed with people like Griffey's Jones and Mel Smith and the people, that you know, English performers they'd hired of the era, and it's catastrophically bad.

00:32:30.65
alexei sayle
So is Beverly Hills Cop 3, is that bad?

00:32:33.69
Talal K
No, it's fine.

00:32:35.06
alexei sayle
it?

00:32:35.89
Talal K
Yeah, it's good. That's a pretty solid trilogy. But this is it I've not seen it in years.

00:32:40.33
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:32:40.49
Talal K
goodness Goodness knows I could be wrong. But I like it. No, there's a pretty thrilling scene where he's climbing up on the Ferris wheel and he's jumping from...

00:32:48.79
alexei sayle
Still Eddie Murphy, is it?

00:32:48.99
Talal K
One, yeah Eddie Murphy, and he's jumping from one, you know, what they called on the Ferris wheels, carriages, whatever they're called.

00:32:49.87
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:32:56.09
alexei sayle
Gondola, I think, is the...

00:32:57.11
Talal K
Yeah, he's jumping from one to the other to save this little kid. the remake on Netflix is but fucking god awful, or the fourth sequel.

00:33:06.10
alexei sayle
Oh, yeah, it's as much as everybody's old and fat and...

00:33:08.17
Talal K
Oh, it's just embarrassing.

00:33:09.66
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:33:11.14
Talal K
Like why bother? It's just such a tiny budget you can't live up to.

00:33:12.96
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:33:16.38
Talal K
It's just a nostalgia, and just cashing in on people's nostalgia.

00:33:20.46
alexei sayle
No, no. and but We should have... Talking to phones, I apologise. We're not looking at A Battle for Algiers this because I haven't watched it yet. I've watched the about the first ten minutes and I haven't watched the rest of it.

00:33:31.55
Talal K
Sorry everyone at home.

00:33:33.09
alexei sayle
Yeah, Lo Ciento. I'm sorry.

00:33:35.70
Talal K
We will get round to it in our own time, thank you very much.

00:33:37.11
alexei sayle
Yeah. sort of theme parks. If you go to, I think we're we're hoping to have Lea Yippee, I don't know if I'm pronouncing that correctly, the Albanian, well, she teaches at the LSE, she teaches Marxism, the but or author of fantastic book, Free, which is about the collapse of communism in Albania.

00:33:57.91
alexei sayle
And she's got a new book out and she hopefully we're getting her on the podcast. but she um you go to Tirana that you know there was there was there was a network of Enverhoja I'd built a network of tunnel of uh block houses pillboxes all over Albania particularly in the capital and some of those have been turned into kind of museums slash theme parks and so you can go down there and You can study the cells where people were tortured and there's a, yeah.

00:34:29.74
Talal K
and Slide down to the third floor to see where the secret police kept the records of everyone's parents.

00:34:30.67
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:34:34.53
alexei sayle
yeah Sigurimi. Yeah, it's ah ah that's a kind of that's a um it's kind of theme park of failed Marxism-Leninism.

00:34:45.12
alexei sayle
and we It's a unique feature of Tirana.

00:34:46.78
Talal K
Jesus.

00:34:48.92
alexei sayle
We went to one of It was very clusterfuck. I mean, there two but mean's it's very narrow corridors. It was too full of tourists, really. I have to say I didn't really like it much.

00:35:02.04
alexei sayle
But, what yeah, what

00:35:03.07
Talal K
but Alexi Land.

00:35:04.76
alexei sayle
Alexi Land. What would it be? Well, I suppose it'd be a historical journey through. There'd be Talal cartoon figures and Alexi.

00:35:18.25
alexei sayle
It'd

00:35:21.51
alexei sayle
be just a trip through my history. Wouldn't start off with the comedy store, recreation the comedy store, 1979, and then the comic strip?

00:35:36.09
alexei sayle
yeah BBC Studios to see a recording of... Recreation of a recording of Stuff.

00:35:43.32
Talal K
Yeah.

00:35:44.10
alexei sayle
All the young ones. And then, you know...

00:35:46.70
Talal K
Oh, you have to have ah holograms of Bobby Chariot giving little tour guides.

00:35:49.55
alexei sayle
Yeah. Oh, yeah, Bobby. Yeah, people playing Bobby. That'd be really good, yeah.

00:35:53.95
Talal K
Oh, yeah. Actors, character actors running around as Bobby and signing little kids autograph books.

00:35:56.46
alexei sayle
i was saying On Pills for Me Names.

00:36:00.73
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah. That'd be good. And... Then, through yeah, through the 1990s, 1990s, Alexis Hale in his Armani suit, realizing he's gone out of fashion. Right.

00:36:14.71
Talal K
What about rides? What kind of ride would you like there?

00:36:16.28
alexei sayle
right so we Yeah, well, we could ride in, you could, like, my my Rover P5B coupe, you could have, that could be mounted on a kind of roller coaster and people could ride.

00:36:28.73
Talal K
And it stops every 50 meters.

00:36:28.98
alexei sayle
Good ride, isn't it?

00:36:30.69
Talal K
It stops.

00:36:31.12
alexei sayle
Breaks down, yeah. And RAC man comes out and says, great cars, these.

00:36:34.88
Talal K
No, a bunch of hip.

00:36:37.77
alexei sayle
So, yeah, well, why am I stuck at fucking Lee Delamere services then if it's such a great fucking car?

00:36:44.36
Talal K
And it gets push started by 50 hippies at the beginning.

00:36:47.33
alexei sayle
by Yeah, hippies, yeah, yeah, recreate Glastonbury.

00:36:53.40
Talal K
You'd have to have a tank, little tank world in there as well or something.

00:36:56.41
alexei sayle
Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, that's true. we could They could have their first Bovington Tank Museum. They could have their, like a branch at Alexi World, yeah.

00:37:06.56
Talal K
Oh, you know, and in Legoland, little kids can get their driver's license. They have a little city built and you drive in a Lego car, get your driver's license.

00:37:12.11
alexei sayle
Right.

00:37:13.88
Talal K
You get your tank license at Alexieland.

00:37:15.41
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah. And, of course, all the catering would be done by Alexi Sales. Imaginary sandwich bar, it'd be a recreation of a sandwich bar.

00:37:27.04
Talal K
Just hundreds of starving people.

00:37:27.40
alexei sayle
Industrial qualities of Coronation chicken and steak and kidney pies and chips and beans at 1980s prices.

00:37:36.17
Talal K
Oh, yes.

00:37:37.74
alexei sayle
Bread and butter pudding. Spotted dick. Yeah, egg mayonnaise.

00:37:43.32
Talal K
Amazing.

00:37:46.95
alexei sayle
Yeah, that'd be...

00:37:47.65
Talal K
You could have an Indiana Jones ride in there.

00:37:49.70
alexei sayle
Yeah, we could do that. the problem Yeah, I don't... Yeah. could do that.

00:37:55.16
alexei sayle
then up to today yeah that doesn't sound too bad does it sounds like a

00:37:55.04
Talal K
I like the sound of that.

00:38:02.11
Talal K
It started off rocky, but then we got some rides in there and now now it's actually sounding more like a theme park.

00:38:05.71
alexei sayle
yeah yeah yeah what we talk about next oh that's true i also yeah

00:38:08.76
Talal K
That's great.

00:38:14.13
Talal K
People at home, send in your drawings of of Alexi Land. Send in your concept art.

00:38:20.78
alexei sayle
I also had a big shout-out to Sufyan. I, am at the big, the big Palestinian benefits at the Chokshi, why wasn't I at the one in Wembley?

00:38:32.71
alexei sayle
People are asking. a man bid £1,000 for a pint with Alexis L.

00:38:40.18
Talal K
here

00:38:41.59
alexei sayle
Sufyan, Sufyan, did you say it?

00:38:42.95
Talal K
Sufyan, you'd pronounce it. Yeah.

00:38:45.29
alexei sayle
Sufyan.

00:38:46.04
Talal K
Yeah.

00:38:47.63
alexei sayle
won it, but he's because he's Muslim, and he doesn't really drink. He's from Qatar. But we went and had a very nice tea. and We went to the Delaunay counter on the Aldwych and had coffee and tea and apple strudel and scones.

00:39:05.27
alexei sayle
And we had a lovely chat. and he But he also owns, he's the owner of one of the Alexei Lego figures as well that he bid for.

00:39:13.33
Talal K
Yeah, he bought the last one in the auction done it and all that donated to he paid hundreds of pounds for it, all donated to medical aid for Palestinians.

00:39:14.67
alexei sayle
yeah Yeah.

00:39:21.97
Talal K
You know, it's not really fair when these auctions, these charity auctions, when and a gulfie strolls into the into the chat.

00:39:22.05
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:39:28.87
alexei sayle
Well, it's still money.

00:39:30.32
Talal K
It's like, well, yeah, you're going to win.

00:39:32.62
alexei sayle
Yeah. three He's not like a super rich shake or anything.

00:39:40.08
alexei sayle
No, he was very nice. We had a very nice we had a very nice chat.

00:39:44.56
Talal K
That's really nice.

00:39:45.12
Talal K
Shout out to you, Sufjan.

00:39:46.61
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:39:47.86
Talal K
Contributing to the cause.

00:39:49.32
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:39:49.67
Talal K
Fan of the show.

00:39:50.99
alexei sayle
yeah Yeah.

00:39:52.42
Talal K
And he studied, you told me he studied here in the 80s and that's how he got into you. And he's a big Alexi fan.

00:39:57.33
alexei sayle
He'd seen The Young Ones, I think, when he was over here in the eighty s

00:39:58.09
Talal K
That's

00:40:02.100
alexei sayle
And yeah, he's been a fan ever since.

00:40:03.05
Talal K
amazing.

00:40:06.04
alexei sayle
he was he was saying who saying, you know, come out and do stand-up. in you know that they Apparently they do stand-up shows now where it's not just... I know there's always been an expat circuit for comedians in the Gulf, and in Abu Dhabi and Doha and Bahrain and stuff. But ah now there's a... but Obviously they're the more anglophone locals come along as well.

00:40:31.96
alexei sayle
But I said, mate, you know, that's not going to work.

00:40:31.93
Talal K
Well, yeah, man, there's...

00:40:35.93
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:40:36.65
Talal K
Well, I don't know, because, like, you know, they the locals in, you know, the Emirates and Saudi, they want to be westernized. You know, they they love western culture and they love absorbing it, consuming it, and...

00:40:44.10
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:40:48.60
Talal K
It also helps them become more worldly and and you know relate and do business with Americans and Brits more if we if they're more in tune with the culture, but it brings them joy.

00:40:57.66
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:41:01.78
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:41:02.35
Talal K
americanic Arabic comedians, Arabic standup in particular, because obviously there's been comedy in the Middle East since forever and it's it's there's some brilliant comedy out there, but the art of standup comedy is a very Western thing is a very American and British thing.

00:41:17.15
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:41:19.20
Talal K
So they are still learning the true art of that.

00:41:19.35
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:41:23.37
Talal K
And there's always been in Dubai, you know, even the the comedy night I'm most affiliated with Arabs are not funny. They've taken the show over to Dubai a couple times.

00:41:35.57
Talal K
it's never been like government sponsored. You know, it's just, you have to be, have to tone it down a bit.

00:41:38.10
alexei sayle
Yeah, but aren't there still limits on what you can say? I mean...

00:41:43.54
Talal K
Yes, indeed.

00:41:44.84
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:41:46.52
Talal K
I think the punishment is a bit less harsh in the Emirates than it would be in Saudi. But I have had some messages on our Patreon asking you or your opinion is on this latest Riyadh in Saudi, Riyadh Comedy Festival.

00:42:03.55
Talal K
and which is government, is well, it's a government funded comedy festival.

00:42:03.95
alexei sayle
I don't know. me about it.

00:42:12.04
Talal K
And they've brought over a a ah slew of Eastern, of Western. ah Let me just bring it up here on my monitor.

00:42:21.87
alexei sayle
Name some names.

00:42:23.36
Talal K
A slew of Western ah comedians are going there. 50 global comedians heading to Riyadh Comedy Festival 2025. Dave Chappelle's doing it.

00:42:37.58
Talal K
Jeff Ross, Gabriel Iglesias, and these are the Americans. And then you've got Jim Owen, very funny guy. Ahmed Jalili is going.

00:42:50.05
Talal K
Oh my God, Aziz Ansari, used to be canceled. Now he seems to be resurfacing.

00:42:54.68
alexei sayle
Oh, yeah. Yeah.

00:42:56.39
Talal K
Kevin Hart, ah Tom Segura.

00:42:56.44
alexei sayle
but

00:43:00.16
Talal K
So none of these, um Andrew Schultz, you know, a lot of these you just expect to do it.

00:43:05.45
alexei sayle
yeah

00:43:06.11
Talal K
But then you've got people like Bill Burr, Maz Jobrani and Omid, who I'd be like, I thought you would know better.

00:43:11.94
alexei sayle
Yeah, I mean, I don't know how. i mean I mean, obviously, the cultural, you know, if we're a cultural boycott, you know, we need to start with Israel, obviously, the Israel. And that's something that is preceding apace. And it's good to see because Israel is actively engaged in a genocide. And it must be, you know, mean, I've been a long time probably founding member of the BDS movement, boycott, divestment, sanction.

00:43:39.07
alexei sayle
And I am very proud to be so, and I think that that needs to carry on. But I'm also, you know, and I did a bit in Sandwich Bar about it, the the sports washing that goes on with Saudi Arabia, obviously them buying like Newcastle United and this stuff like we're seeing here.

00:44:03.30
alexei sayle
if that was linked to a kind of loosening of, you know, if the, the, the the problem is that all this sports washing and comedy washing does not,

00:44:17.52
alexei sayle
signify a loosening of the extraordinary cruelty of the Saudi regime, as as I understand it.

00:44:23.71
Talal K
Exactly.

00:44:25.43
alexei sayle
I mean, there's still that, you know, for instance, they allowed women to drive eventually, but then the women who'd campaigned for it would be most prominent are still, as far as I know, in being held in ah ah unbelievably cruel imprisonment.

00:44:25.47
Talal K
Exactly.

00:44:40.06
Talal K
Yeah. And they're only allowed to drive under 40 miles per hour and they have their own lanes.

00:44:45.48
alexei sayle
Really? I didn't know that.

00:44:46.17
Talal K
No.

00:44:47.30
alexei sayle
Oh, right. I believed you.

00:44:49.55
Talal K
This is

00:44:51.85
Talal K
Yeah, absolutely. Like the road they had to go down to get that. And, and it's,

00:44:55.19
alexei sayle
Yeah, and it's savage. And, of course, there's the you know this' the case of... Khashoggi, who was chopped, went to get his marriage visa or whatever it was at the Saudi embassy and in Istanbul and then was chopped up while alive by Saudi... yeah so

00:45:22.38
Talal K
Secret Service.

00:45:22.59
alexei sayle
what they call... muhabara yeah and it was all recorded on his Fitbit watch.

00:45:24.43
Talal K
Yeah.

00:45:29.15
Talal K
Fuck.

00:45:29.68
alexei sayle
is how we learned about it. But I think there's no, Mohammed bin Salman has not backed off from any of that shit. Saudi Arabia is as restrictive for women and, you know, for dissent as it ever was.

00:45:43.57
alexei sayle
So it's not, so I think really you are, give I mean, I said our main enemy, you know, because Israel is also, Israel is the West. We have to concentrate on Israel.

00:45:53.60
alexei sayle
You know, we're not, we're not, out yet yeah, yeah.

00:45:53.100
Talal K
Yeah, but Saudi also going ahead and trying to normalize relations with Israel. And they're not necessarily, they could have a big part in stopping Israel, what they're doing, and not doing nothing about it

00:45:59.55
alexei sayle
Yeah. And we.

00:46:04.17
alexei sayle
They could. They could. No, no. I mean, and we are. mean, a sense, we are. I think we are. Somebody I was looking at on the, know, said, you know, all problems, all problems in the world come back to Britain, really.

00:46:17.07
alexei sayle
Ultimately, we're responsible for all the bad things in the world. If you go far back, you know, mean, obviously the Balfour Declaration and the founding of the State of Israel, and that's our fault, you know.

00:46:31.59
Talal K
Yeah. Yeah.

00:46:32.78
alexei sayle
the you know, the brutal partition of India and Pakistan, that's all our fault. mean, the United States is our fault really, since it was founded by people who were so unpopular in Britain that they had to sail across the Atlantic.

00:46:49.10
alexei sayle
So everything's our fault. And certainly Saudi Arabia, I think, is our fault in the redrawing of the map after the collapse the Ottoman Empire, after the collapse of the First World War, really.

00:46:58.40
Talal K
yeah

00:47:02.35
alexei sayle
And the installation of this cruelty of the dynasty in Saudi Arabia.

00:47:02.36
Talal K
Yeah.

00:47:07.72
alexei sayle
That's our fault. So, you know, I mean, not that they would... they would yeah i mean I think they probably know. it means I'm sure they don't care if i yeah if I'm there or not. But I think you are.

00:47:23.47
alexei sayle
If you go to Saudi Arabia or if you play for a Saudi sports team or joining a Saudi-sponsored golf tournament, you are helping to cover up massive cruelty, which as far as I know, again, if anybody knows any better,

00:47:43.04
alexei sayle
It's not lessening, really, but it goes on, much as it's always done, really.

00:47:47.22
Talal K
And you're you're kind you're condoning it. You're condoning it all at the very least.

00:47:49.78
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:47:52.57
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:47:52.72
Talal K
You know, you're saying, I don't mind. I didn't mention the biggest night at the Riyadh Comedy Festival, headlined by a celebrant of the Israeli embassy's 60th anniversary, was it? the The host of their party was Jimmy Carr.

00:48:12.08
alexei sayle
Yes, at the British east Museum.

00:48:12.45
Talal K
And... co-headlining with him is probably history's best stand up, but also massive pervert Louis CK.

00:48:21.77
alexei sayle
Not a massive pair of it, just a pair of it. I'm still a fan. yeah It's funny, he has got way... I mean, I've seen some of his stuff. he's He's not the comic he was either, really. I mean, yeah I...

00:48:31.15
Talal K
there's and It's undeniable how hilarious and genius his comedy is, but you know bringing small time female comics into the green room and wanking off in front of them is is fucking gross and and cruel, very cruel abuse of power.

00:48:34.75
alexei sayle
Yeah. I certainly was, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

00:48:42.55
alexei sayle
Yes, awful. Yeah.

00:48:45.70
Talal K
And he kind of deserved all the fucking punishment he got for that.

00:48:46.07
alexei sayle
Yeah, absolutely.

00:48:50.29
alexei sayle
It's a real show. was terribly upset by that, really i did because I did love him as a comic, really.

00:48:54.96
Talal K
But their co-headlining on October six

00:48:58.04
alexei sayle
Jimmy Carr and fucking Louis C.

00:49:00.16
Talal K
Think of the censorship they'll have to do to their sets.

00:49:01.81
alexei sayle
Kent. But also, Louis Kent, mean... i mean

00:49:08.06
alexei sayle
There's so much wrong with that. It's hard to know where to begin, isn't it, really?

00:49:13.37
Talal K
e

00:49:14.28
alexei sayle
Jimmy Carr was very nice to me the one time I met him, have to say, but then, you know, he would be, suppose. think

00:49:23.58
Talal K
Where did you meet Jimmy Carr?

00:49:25.40
alexei sayle
it was that photo. I think it was that... just I think it was something... Dawn French did this series called Boys Who Are Funny or something. I think it was a photo shoot for that or something. I know Dawn was there. and Jimmy Carl was there.

00:49:45.17
alexei sayle
Before he did, he's had extensive facial surgery.

00:49:50.17
alexei sayle
um um I think they're re this' this so they're showing... my Are they showing my Arena documentary? They're showing...

00:49:58.12
Talal K
Yes.

00:50:00.74
alexei sayle
It's quite good, that. There's a song I do, which is a bit painful, I think, in that. no but No, it's not that.

00:50:10.35
Talal K
what a job Hello, John got on motor.

00:50:12.86
alexei sayle
it's about It's called Road. No, it's...

00:50:15.68
Talal K
What's the show? Tell us about the arena documentary. What is it?

00:50:17.75
alexei sayle
Arena. Well, Arena is a documentary strand, which don't know, think is still going. the BBC, it was usually on BBC Two. it was ah There was a kind of group of mavericks within the BBC.

00:50:30.59
alexei sayle
headed by Alan Yentob, late Alan Yentob, Nigel Finch, late Nigel Finch, Anthony Wall, Mary Dickinson, great directors. And they did really interesting documentaries, the famous one the two most famous ones from the 80s, I think, in my way, and the Cortina documentary, which is something like the most watched documentary of all time, is presented, essentially presented by me.

00:50:54.69
alexei sayle
My manager at the time failed to get me a credit. I should have got a writing credit.

00:51:00.24
alexei sayle
on the on the film, but didn't through managerial inefficiency. But, yeah, it's really interesting piece of work.

00:51:10.36
Talal K
And what, they're re...

00:51:12.15
alexei sayle
I think they're re-showing it. I don't know. sounds like you've seen something.

00:51:17.82
Talal K
Well, yeah, i was trying to get you to explain it.

00:51:19.96
alexei sayle
Oh, right, yeah. i think it's but is it an anniver Is it the anniversary of Arena or something?

00:51:24.93
Talal K
just trying.

00:51:25.63
alexei sayle
so I caught a bit of... a Anthony Wall talking about Reina.

00:51:31.69
Talal K
Yeah, so they're doing a BBC for doing ah arena season, probably as part of an anniversary thing.

00:51:36.33
alexei sayle
Right.

00:51:38.82
Talal K
And yeah, the private life of the Ford Cortina will be airing on BBC for

00:51:46.63
alexei sayle
Yeah, well, that's me.

00:51:48.04
alexei sayle
I was talking to my friend about...

00:51:48.55
Talal K
And just just pause there while I finish what I'm saying with actual dates and times.

00:51:49.75
alexei sayle
Okay.

00:51:54.25
alexei sayle
okay

00:51:54.38
Talal K
so Give me a sec. It's not showing up on iPlayer, so it's not that's probably not aired yet. Oh, there we go, Arena. Private Life

00:52:01.77
Talal K
Okay, and then one sec. Let's see.

00:52:13.95
Talal K
Yeah, so as part of the arena season on BBC four, it looks like they've already aired it because I can't find a showtime for it.

00:52:22.55
Talal K
it is on iPlayer. It's come back up on iPlayer Arena, the private life of the Ford Cortina hosted by Alexis Sale.

00:52:32.34
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:52:32.45
Talal K
You know what? You're not even listed in the fucking program description.

00:52:38.02
alexei sayle
It says hosted by Alexi Sala, but then I'm not listed in the program description, though.

00:52:41.90
Talal K
It says, Arena, the private life of the Ford Cortina. This program looks at the history of the Ford Cortina, Britain's most popular, most stolen and most misunderstood car. Full stop. End of everything.

00:52:51.90
alexei sayle
Fuck, yeah.

00:52:53.81
Talal K
That's fucked.

00:52:56.02
alexei sayle
is fucked, it's a you know it's presumably allies of Keir Starmer and Robbie Gibb.

00:53:00.16
Talal K
Yeah, I think so, yeah.

00:53:04.24
Talal K
You're not even in the picture, mate.

00:53:05.76
alexei sayle
Oh, well, people watch it, they'll see more it.

00:53:05.92
Talal K
It's this Jimmy Hill looking guy with the big glasses. It's a famous picture, I've seen the picture before, but i think he's like a car dealer talking about.

00:53:16.95
alexei sayle
ah ah Well, if they watch the documentary, they'll see more than that modern enough of me.

00:53:20.10
Talal K
Yeah, go watch it and then write to the BBC and complain that they didn't mention him.

00:53:20.92
alexei sayle
so Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:53:27.78
Talal K
But it looks like things are heating up for Israel, to be fair. The world isn't taking it lightly that they've been attacking this freedom flotilla.

00:53:37.43
alexei sayle
Right.

00:53:39.05
Talal K
They've like been sending drones over the, so there's the global Samud flotilla. They've sent about 50, Boats full of aid and social media influencers over to Gaza ah to break the blockade and get aid in there.

00:53:53.53
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:53:53.95
Talal K
But it's the the meaning behind it is so much more than the small amount of a aid that they could possibly get through.

00:53:57.98
alexei sayle
Yes.

00:54:00.77
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:54:01.73
Talal K
there's there's ah There's a bigger message and a bigger point they're making, which I think is really fucking beautiful. And our friend Tyg is on one of those po boats.

00:54:08.20
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:54:09.47
Talal K
couple of people that we met when we were shooting with Tyg that one day a few months ago. they're on the boats. We, of course, solidarity and support to all of those fucking heroes.

00:54:19.34
alexei sayle
Yes.

00:54:20.10
Talal K
I wish I was on there with them. I really do. and

00:54:24.75
alexei sayle
And but Spain and Italy have sent warships and we should really be sending one of our crappy destroyers.

00:54:25.75
Talal K
But Israel, sorry?

00:54:31.02
Talal K
Absolutely. Absolutely. It's really heating up, man. I don't know.

00:54:36.39
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:54:36.92
Talal K
Every every now and then you can think, oh the tide is turning, the message is turning, the narrative is changing.

00:54:41.50
alexei sayle
Hmm.

00:54:42.42
Talal K
But things are actually happening here because, you know, Israel, a drone from Yemen just got through and attacked Israel, you know, not celebrating any fucking deaths or anything, but that's quite

00:54:50.40
alexei sayle
Yep.

00:54:56.17
Talal K
But the biggest thing in the last week has been all these countries recognizing the state of Palestine as well. Any thoughts on that, Alexei?

00:55:04.64
alexei sayle
Well, I think it's largely performative.

00:55:04.76
Talal K
I know.

00:55:07.32
alexei sayle
I mean, Claire Starmer is frightened tooth and nail to do absolutely nothing to end genocide or end Israeli apartheid. So I think you have to see it in that context.

00:55:19.55
alexei sayle
Nevertheless, it might... You know, there are also, there's votes to ban Israel from FIFA, from the European Cup and Eurovision.

00:55:26.87
Talal K
Yep. And Eurovision and then the UEFA. Yep.

00:55:30.40
alexei sayle
And I think once that, you know, once that genie is out the bottle, as it were, you can't put it back in. So that, you know, it's painfully slow, but the, and obviously the United States is fighting it every step of the way.

00:55:43.38
Talal K
Yeah.

00:55:44.12
alexei sayle
But, know, and there is a growing rift between you. know, there's been a general strike. It's been not been mentioned on the stinking BBC. I mean, there's been a general strike in Italy for several days now in support of Gaza.

00:55:51.21
Talal K
In Italy.

00:55:56.65
Talal K
Yeah.

00:55:57.46
alexei sayle
Not as far as I've not seen it mentioned at all on the British media, but it's a really big thing.

00:56:03.49
Talal K
They don't want to give us any ideas, do they?

00:56:05.15
alexei sayle
Yeah. And so that, you know, I mean, it's...

00:56:10.88
alexei sayle
The horrors continue day after day, but I think that once that once Israel's isolation is achieved, and then that that yeah there's no going back. People have seen people seen what Israel is, this ethno-fascist apartheid state, and that that knowledge cannot be taken away again.

00:56:34.38
Talal K
Mm-hmm.

00:56:35.01
alexei sayle
aye I sincerely hope so. you know mean, it's... All that is good, really. But, yeah, I mean, I mean i don't know. I'd be interested, you know, I mean, whether... Because these boats are in international waters and being attacked by Israel. I mean, there was... Yeah, I mean, Israel... I mean, there was a boat from Turkey, wasn't it, 10 years ago, the Mavi Mamara, which was boarded by Israeli commandos, and they killed nine Turkish citizens, I think.

00:57:04.24
Talal K
Jesus.

00:57:04.96
alexei sayle
but to without a murmur from Western nations. I don't know if they could get away with that kind of shit anymore. And it is interesting. I mean, we should, the British bloody Navy should be there as well, protecting.

00:57:18.84
alexei sayle
I think these ships are registered as British.

00:57:22.37
Talal K
Some of them are, yeah.

00:57:22.71
alexei sayle
I know that the last in the last flotilla, they were registered as British vessels. And so this is is piracy, what Israel is doing.

00:57:29.45
Talal K
Yep.

00:57:31.15
alexei sayle
And we should be out there protecting our ships.

00:57:36.79
Talal K
We're obliged to, we should be, yeah.

00:57:37.93
alexei sayle
yeah yeah yeah it'd be for the first time in history one those type 46 destroyers that should be doing something useful

00:57:46.60
Talal K
But it is, a it's very nice to see that that Spain and Italy are are stepping up in that, of course.

00:57:54.68
alexei sayle
yeah mean Spain's been really good throughout relatively good throughout you know

00:58:02.45
Talal K
But performative or not, all these countries recognizing the state of Palestine does like lawfully add interesting things into the mix, doesn't it?

00:58:02.71
alexei sayle
Yes, so further news.

00:58:13.92
Talal K
Because now it's not just Israel acting against its own population. Now, on paper, they are attacking another state, another country, right?

00:58:22.50
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:58:23.30
Talal K
And doesn't that add some interesting...

00:58:25.98
alexei sayle
I don't know. I mean, that you know, it was already recognised by 140-odd nations and it really seemed to make any difference.

00:58:27.49
Talal K
and

00:58:32.76
alexei sayle
I mean, one of the things that paralyses things is that veto at the Security Council, so the United States, you know, the United Nations is paralysed by the United States' veto the Security Council.

00:58:42.77
Talal K
Yeah.

00:58:44.98
alexei sayle
I think you've find a way around that, really. hope, you know, that would be a good thing.

00:58:49.79
Talal K
Yeah.

00:58:51.28
alexei sayle
And there's this plan now that Tony Blair is going... I mean... It's also the Palestinian Authority themselves and nothing to write home about. They're corrupt. You know, we've talked about that before.

00:58:59.86
Talal K
Yeah. Oh, mate, he wants a two-state solution, which is so heartbreaking.

00:59:03.74
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:59:05.12
Talal K
He's like, I'm willing to discuss two-state solution. I'm like, dude, have some backbone.

00:59:13.07
alexei sayle
Jesus, Abbas.

00:59:14.61
Talal K
Have some backbone, yeah.

00:59:16.53
alexei sayle
How old is he now? He's looking he in and good nick because he's in his 90s, isn't Full head of hair.

00:59:22.66
alexei sayle
Give him that. Yeah. yeah

00:59:28.68
alexei sayle
We'll see. I mean, i mean it's it's painful. I mean, that and it's painfully slow, but the the the situation vis-a-vis Palestine does seem to be changing.

00:59:41.81
alexei sayle
How many more people will have to die if children be murdered before? There's a resolution I don't know, but, you know you know, people freely use the word genocide now, i think, on the media, even though the BBC says, well, they're...

00:59:56.53
alexei sayle
Israel denies the genocide. I heard, I mean, it would be, I mean, again, they probably won't it, but I heard the son of Mustafa Kharkuti, Barghuti, kind of a relative view.

01:00:10.73
alexei sayle
the The real, the the people, that the they Palestinian Mandela, if there is one, is a guy called Mustafa Barghuti, who's and been imprisoned in by the israelis i think for the last 20 years and tortured and i think he's probably not in a good way now but he is the one you that everybody i think everybody many people in palestine support him more than hamas more than palestinian authority if he could somehow if he's still

01:00:44.06
alexei sayle
functioning and could be allowed, he could be a unifying figure if he could be released from prison. but I know his son was talking, yeah his son was called Arab Barghouti, was talking on the BBC and freely using the word genocide. And the BBC did afterwards, know, didn't confront, you know did afterwards say, know, Israel would of course deny these allegations, but he was allowed to speak frankly about his father's torture and, you know,

01:01:12.30
alexei sayle
about genocide and if somehow he could be released, it would be he would be a unifying figure, I think, for the Palestinian struggle, but that's probably the reason why he will never be released.

01:01:31.39
alexei sayle
There's footage of and the last time he was seen was when I think one of those fuckers, it's either Smotrich or Ben Gavir, was showed was shouting at him in his cell. He was allowed to go into his cell. and And he looked very frail and ill, and and he has clearly been tortured.

01:01:49.76
Talal K
Yeah, and he was like in chains.

01:01:50.48
alexei sayle
That's your Israeli.

01:01:51.57
Talal K
Yeah, we spoke about

01:01:51.71
alexei sayle
That's your Israel. For you, Jimmy Carr. That's your Israel. For you, Maureen Lipman. That's your Israel. Rachel Riley.

01:02:05.48
alexei sayle
Torturing.

01:02:06.55
alexei sayle
A unifying figure.

01:02:07.98
Talal K
anyone with any platform, any any common sense, any intelligence.

01:02:14.38
Talal K
It's like when the Nazis killed anyone with glasses, you know, because they thought that meant they were an intellectual.

01:02:19.64
alexei sayle
I think you're conflating the Khmer Rouge and the Nazis. I don't think the Nazis killed people glasses. The Khmer Rouge did.

01:02:28.92
Talal K
Forgive me.

01:02:32.10
Talal K
But it's... if you're an intellectual, you can see beyond the hypocrisy and the injustice.

01:02:42.03
Talal K
And that makes you a threat.

01:02:44.74
alexei sayle
Yeah.

01:02:47.72
Talal K
Mahmoud Abbas is 89 years old.

01:02:51.28
alexei sayle
89.

01:02:51.98
Talal K
Fuck me. Get him out.

01:02:55.03
alexei sayle
Oh, absolutely, yeah. He won't go, though.

01:02:57.14
Talal K
You can't be that old. And he looks like Jabba the fucking Hutt.

01:03:01.73
alexei sayle
He's a good nick for 89, but, I mean, he shouldn't be there, you know.

01:03:06.31
alexei sayle
No.

01:03:06.55
Talal K
Jesus Christ.

01:03:08.80
alexei sayle
No, they're awful.

01:03:10.27
Talal K
Two state solutions, people love the sound of it, but it will never bring peace. It can't, it literally can't because if you have a two state solution, there will always be people who can't go back to their homes.

01:03:22.96
Talal K
There will always be people whose land has been taken.

01:03:23.13
alexei sayle
yeah i Yeah, I can't see.

01:03:25.35
Talal K
They'll,

01:03:27.36
alexei sayle
I suppose you could have all the... You know, the settlers could stay there and just be ruled by the... but the palestinians they could be citizens of a palestinian state i can't i mean yeah you know why why expel them from those settlements just uh just incorporate them into the state of palestine they can stay there jewish no reason why people of all religions can't live in palestine

01:03:45.17
Talal K
Yeah?

01:03:50.40
Talal K
Yeah?

01:03:54.35
alexei sayle
So that that could be one way that you could have a Palestinian state. Yeah, I mean, I think you just want the killing to stop for now, really, and then deal with this other shit later.

01:04:04.43
Talal K
Absolutely.

01:04:07.97
alexei sayle
But, ah yeah.

01:04:09.16
Talal K
Please, Please, for God's sake, please. Well, let's see what happens in the next week, man. A lot has happened in this last week.

01:04:15.82
alexei sayle
Yeah, lot's happened this week.

01:04:17.100
Talal K
We'll be in Shoreham. It's sold out.

01:04:20.72
alexei sayle
Better be a bit more fucking sprightly than this.

01:04:24.61
Talal K
Yeah, it's pretty low-tempo show today.

01:04:28.27
alexei sayle
I always... Eh?

01:04:30.89
Talal K
Low-tempo, relaxed show today.

01:04:31.20
alexei sayle
i I always come alive. I generally come alive in front of an audience.

01:04:37.02
Talal K
Yeah.

01:04:39.89
alexei sayle
Anyone's all right.

01:04:39.94
Talal K
But so Yeah, yeah, wass good to see you. Nice chat. Absolutely.

01:04:43.67
alexei sayle
Yeah.

01:04:45.52
Talal K
Absolutely. It's always nice to round off my week with a nice chat with ah ah Alexi Sale. And I hope that listeners at home feel the same way. If you want to support what we do, please go to patreon.com forward slash Alexi Sale podcast and throw a few quid our way per month.

01:05:03.60
Talal K
You'll get access to the video, full video episodes of our podcast. you'll You'll get access to Alexi, Lisa and Nigel watching The Young Ones.

01:05:16.46
Talal K
Have I put it out yet? No, I haven't. Fuck, episode two coming out imminently. And you get to join this lovely community in the chat room and ask questions to Alexi and myself. And you might get it read out on air.

01:05:30.57
Talal K
That's patreon.com forward slash AlexiSellPodcast. Follow us at AlexiSellPod on all the socials. Email alexisellpodcast.gmail.com if you have a question or some fan art. Send us your artwork of Alexi world.

01:05:45.57
Talal K
Alexi land. That's the plugs done. Thank you for this, Lex.

01:05:50.35
alexei sayle
Alright.