00:00:00.14
alexei sayle
Hi everybody and welcome to episode 100. Yes, episode 100. We've made it to 100 of the Alexis Help podcast. We were going to do all kinds of exciting features, get back all the guests we've had on. Lenny Henry, Jeremy Corbyn,

00:00:17.83
alexei sayle
um da

00:00:20.44
Talal K
Bloody Maxine peak.

00:00:22.56
alexei sayle
Maxine Peake, Diane Morgan, and but we haven't done any of that. i was going to impersonations of them. Hello, Jeremy. Hello Alexi! ah Hi Lenny!

00:00:33.64
alexei sayle
Hi! Alexi!

00:00:34.73
Talal K
Why did I think they were actually going be...

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alexei sayle
but Er, I don't even bother with that. Eh?

00:00:39.90
Talal K
Why did I think they were actually going to be impressions?

00:00:43.02
alexei sayle
Oh no, no.

00:00:44.37
Talal K
Of course, in your inimitable style.

00:00:47.26
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:00:48.98
Talal K
and We could... Hi, Tyg. How was it on the flotilla? What happened, Tyg?

00:00:53.53
alexei sayle
Oh yeah. That was terrible.

00:00:57.40
Talal K
Well, glad you're safe back home, Tyg, and solidarity...

00:00:58.93
alexei sayle
Yeah, I am really. It feels a bit disrespectful.

00:01:03.98
Talal K
Yeah, I chose the worst possible

00:01:09.65
Talal K
one. Amazing to see that he's back home, but it's still shocking that so many so many people are still being held captive um from the flotillas, um especially any Arab participants.

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alexei sayle
Yeah.

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Talal K
and I know there were some Jordanians on the boats and stuff.

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alexei sayle
Really.

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Talal K
There's still a couple Irish members who are still being held. And sounds like their treatment wasn't great.

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alexei sayle
Yeah,

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Talal K
But the message they keep repeating is that if that's how they treated us, imagine how they're treating the thousands of Palestinians being held.

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alexei sayle
yeah, yeah. Yeah.

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Talal K
But ah we come to you this week with news of ceasefires and 21-step plans to peace and ah big old blah, blah, blah.

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alexei sayle
yeah

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Talal K
What do you think? What do you make of it all?

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alexei sayle
ah Yeah, well, I've been avoiding the the mainstream media, actually, because I didn't... I think it would infuriate me too much to see their interpretation of it. I mean, it's... I mean, it's good that the killing stopped, you know. I mean, if... if I mean, obviously, there's supposed to be ceasefire in the in the Lebanon, but, um you know, they they've they they've attacked the Lebanon over 4,000 times since that supposed ceasefire.

00:02:26.19
alexei sayle
has been in effect. So whether or not um they will respect the Gaza ceasefire remains to be seen.

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Talal K
cheese. Mm-hmm.

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alexei sayle
But, um you know, I mean, but they're so brave and resilient, the people in Gaza, that that, you know, just as we said before, you know, just existing is an act of resistance, really. I hope that something not too bad can come out of this. i I don't know. We'll see, really. I mean, certainly. I mean, I think, I mean, in a sense,

00:02:54.33
alexei sayle
I mean, you know, the, the, the I mean, it's a terrible price to pay, but the, the, the boycott movement towards Israel, I think has come on a loss.

00:03:05.44
alexei sayle
You it's now accepted part of dialogue, you know, the idea of Israeli genocide, that the, of the um the injustice of the state of Israel is, you know, is is is come on a lot, you know, and um so I suppose, you know, mean, it's a very, it's a ridiculously heavy price to pay.

00:03:17.81
Talal K
Yeah.

00:03:23.07
alexei sayle
You know, the suffering of the Palestinian people is much for, you know, I mean, Israel is now despised around the world. I mean, I read somewhere, you that Israeli media is full of, ah stories of israelis being attacked you know when they're on their holidays abroad and um also you know israelis i mean but israel will have so i mean israel i mean again there are accounts of you know massive numbers of suicides and ptsd and uh you know the the um

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Talal K
the id in the IDF.

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alexei sayle
and the idea that Israel is stored up because you know people who commit these atrocities, a proportion of them will will suffer massively for doing that, and their economy apparently is is in in tatters.

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alexei sayle
ah So it's also damaged Israel, so which is a good thing.

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Talal K
There, yeah, like obviously the Palestine's liberation has been has has dominated the global conversation in ah more than ever before.

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alexei sayle
Yeah.

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Talal K
And like you say, the price they paid can't be worth it, you know, all those lives.

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alexei sayle
No, not really, no.

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Talal K
But ah the conversation now has to, if if this ceasefire holds, The conversation has to shift from genocide over to occupation and liberation, you know, because that is the next step.

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alexei sayle
Yeah.

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Talal K
The fight, if you ask me, Alexei, the fight isn't over until Palestine is is free and has self-determination and right of return and, you know, equal rights.

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alexei sayle
Mm.

00:05:02.57
alexei sayle
No, indeed. Yeah. that Yeah, no, I agree. Yeah, yeah.

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Talal K
It can't stop. You know, there's a big... Tomorrow's March, we're recording this on Friday, was ah scheduled to be the biggest one yet.

00:05:22.29
alexei sayle
How much it still will be, but I don't know.

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Talal K
and

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Talal K
I hope that, you know, just because this ceasefire, ah lots of people won't be like, oh, well, we can stay home, have that have that lunch we were hoping to have, whatever, you know.

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alexei sayle
Yeah.

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Talal K
No, the fight's not over yet. And...

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alexei sayle
No, no, no, it is not. No, nowhere near, you know. But at least those, you know, those things have happened.

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alexei sayle
And it was obviously, you know, the Palestinian struggle was being sidelined before the Abraham Accords and so on. You know, it was just, it was just,

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Talal K
The ceasefire itself is, you know, the main thing to focus on is the end, the stopping of the killing, but the ceasefire itself is, is, is a continuation of occupation and of the siege of Gaza.

00:06:06.83
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:06:15.34
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah.

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Talal K
Tight controls, restricted political activity for the Palestinians. It's, but, Cease fire and rebuilding and you know as long as people don't get dispossessed and moved out of Gaza and they get to stay and and oversee the rebuilding of their town.

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alexei sayle
yeah

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Talal K
and

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alexei sayle
Yes, indeed.

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Talal K
Makes me nervous to be honest.

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alexei sayle
Yes, no, I'm not. um I agree. I mean, I think I'm also, yeah, just, you know, things could things could remain.

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alexei sayle
um mean, the likelihood is, I don't know, that things will remain pretty bad, really.

00:07:02.30
alexei sayle
But hopefully...

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Talal K
Where's D-Ream when we need them?

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alexei sayle
things can only get worse as I was.

00:07:10.46
Talal K
that's That's probably ah the Ream.

00:07:12.56
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Talal K
They re-released that track.

00:07:15.84
alexei sayle
um Yeah, well but let's let's, you know, let's hope, maybe, we'll see. I know it's just, mean, because Trump wanted Nobel Peace Prize that they've Linda handed me a note saying it went to that Maria Machado, who's a,

00:07:33.11
alexei sayle
member the leader of the opposition in Venezuela, and she has said that if she wins, she will move the Venezuelan embassy to Jerusalem to support Israel. So while the Nobel Peace Prize didn't go to Trump, it went to some other bastard.

00:07:50.74
alexei sayle
I mean, I'm no particular fan of the Maduro, the regime in Venezuela, but I don't think much of Maria Machado, and I can't see that she's really done much for her.

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Talal K
Shit, and they gave it.

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alexei sayle
Peace.

00:08:05.77
alexei sayle
So, there you go.

00:08:08.92
Talal K
bit of a joke, isn't it?

00:08:09.91
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's ah highly political.

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Talal K
Yeah.

00:08:12.82
alexei sayle
I mean, it's generally absurd, isn't it, the Peace Prize, really, yeah when they gave it to Obama.

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Talal K
Yeah.

00:08:22.53
alexei sayle
That time was ridiculous.

00:08:25.44
alexei sayle
But certainly Maria Machado doesn't sound like she deserves it.

00:08:30.87
alexei sayle
ah So, i have what of what what's on the what's on the agenda today, Talal?

00:08:38.50
Talal K
Well, we're finally, Alexei, going to do an improv scene. You and me.

00:08:44.50
alexei sayle
You haven't told me about this. I was not aware of this.

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Talal K
I was going to actually just ah to keep harking on ah the Your Party trumpet.

00:09:01.31
alexei sayle
All right.

00:09:02.65
Talal K
So I woke up this morning to a post by Zara, our right honourable friend, Zara Soltan. And there's the picture, her and Jeremy, fists in the air.

00:09:10.66
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah.

00:09:14.49
Talal K
We're not here to beg for crumbs off the table. We're coming for the lot. The billionaires already have three parties working for them. It's about time the rest of us had one. Joinyourparty.uk today. And then the comments are all...

00:09:31.41
Talal K
Please work with the Green Party. If your party joined the Green Party, it would be the revolution we all want. Oh, Zara, we all had such high hopes. We really did. The absolute ideal so solution here would be to join up with the Greens.

00:09:43.78
Talal K
If you don't join up with the Greens, who already have the momentum, the political infrastructure, blah, blah, then your venture is purely egotistical. Please work with the Greens. If it really is our party, please listen to what the people are saying.

00:09:56.25
Talal K
Blah, blah. It's like... she everyone is just pounding on this same message. And anyone who's not is just seems still very scarred from you know the whole hoo-ha that happened.

00:10:11.61
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, it was a, yeah.

00:10:14.35
Talal K
And I'm kind of stuck in the middle. I do really like this new direction that the Greens seem to be going in. And apparently at the party conference

00:10:22.49
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:10:26.18
Talal K
There was a lot of very socialist kind of movements voted in and stuff. So, but I haven't canceled my membership yet of the Your Party.

00:10:33.00
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:10:38.09
alexei sayle
No.

00:10:38.26
Talal K
I'm i'm holding out till the November conference.

00:10:41.26
alexei sayle
I think, yeah, I think we have to really see what happens with that. I mean, I agree. They've done a brilliant job, Zara and Jeremy, of dissipating all that enthusiasm and excitement.

00:10:51.89
Talal K
It's so heartbreaking.

00:10:52.09
alexei sayle
And I was just, yeah, it was, it was heartbreaking. I mean, i would just say, as we yeah, that idea that, um you know, that like Andrew has in here in Camden and, um,

00:11:06.93
alexei sayle
of having ah a party with a different structure, you know, a democratic structure ah from the bottom up, you know, um is still something I think that would be worth trying really, as far as I know about the structure of the Green Party, it's structured as a conventional party.

00:11:11.87
Talal K
Hmm.

00:11:23.01
alexei sayle
So we'll, yeah, I mean, I think we have to wait until the conference in November and see what emerges from that really.

00:11:24.51
Talal K
Hmm.

00:11:30.22
Talal K
Because it could emerge that that is the decision is that they should merge with the Greens.

00:11:30.29
alexei sayle
But yeah,

00:11:34.67
Talal K
Like that could be what everyone votes for because that's the whole point of the conference is that they're going to listen to, ah they're to have motions that were created by the members.

00:11:35.15
alexei sayle
Maybe. Yeah. Yeah.

00:11:45.61
Talal K
They're going to listen to what the members' opinions are and then hold votes. And so that could just be where it all ends up.

00:11:52.23
alexei sayle
I think it's possible, yeah.

00:11:52.32
Talal K
Yeah.

00:11:54.09
alexei sayle
Yeah. I mean, it does seem a ready-made... so i I don't know. I mean, I'm not... It does seem like a ready-made solution in a way. so But, i you know, I'd like something which is explicitly more socialist myself.

00:12:08.50
alexei sayle
But...

00:12:08.88
Talal K
me too and that's kind of yeah i said it before like that is the the thing that got them as well is that they were they were too democratic and that's they were acting well maybe not actually no because it's quite uh

00:12:22.92
alexei sayle
um I wasn't democratic at all.

00:12:25.08
Talal K
No, well it was just her on her own releasing the link.

00:12:27.38
alexei sayle
Well, yeah.

00:12:27.52
Talal K
But but she was trying to just accelerate the memberships ah joining up and stuff.

00:12:29.04
alexei sayle
We don't quite know. the

00:12:37.76
alexei sayle
Yeah, the the process, yeah, because you feel like you've...

00:12:39.65
Talal K
and But I don't know. Yeah. You know, we give them we give them benefit of the doubt over and over again.

00:12:45.60
alexei sayle
We will see. Let's...

00:12:48.83
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:12:48.95
Talal K
I've got a couple more to give them. I do.

00:12:51.55
alexei sayle
Yeah, they spoke together, didn't they, St George's Hall in Liverpool and Monday.

00:12:55.33
Talal K
Yes, I think that's where the photo was from.

00:12:57.41
alexei sayle
The Wi-Fi failed.

00:12:59.19
Talal K
Really?

00:13:00.12
alexei sayle
Yeah. But there is, I don't know whether that's sabotage or just probably incompetence. Or just, you know, bad luck. ah But I think there is a recording. But though they they they did appear together. I've actually seen no reports of what went on there, but...

00:13:22.58
Talal K
Um.

00:13:23.16
alexei sayle
be interesting to know.

00:13:25.42
Talal K
Well, I, at the same time, you know, ah really like Zach as well. And I actually ah just on an individual basis, I like his character and his personality, his energy.

00:13:36.36
alexei sayle
Yes, he's right he's he's very good at with the media, you know.

00:13:37.74
Talal K
It seems very...

00:13:40.02
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:13:40.50
Talal K
But we were last week in our show in Shoreham, which thank you everyone for the lovely comments and messages about that show.

00:13:44.11
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:13:47.72
alexei sayle
Mm.

00:13:48.50
Talal K
I had a lot of fun. um but we had a bit of banter at Zach's expense because we were, I was, I brought up the story of 12 years ago, he got caught by an undercover journalist and who basically he offered her, he was a hypnotherapist at the time and he offered her um a session where he could hypnotize her boobs bigger, basically. That's the story and that's how the story was presented. and

00:14:20.85
alexei sayle
yeah yeah

00:14:21.71
Talal K
um And we were having a bit of a laugh about that, but I got this interesting email from Nick, Nicola, which I'll just read to you now.

00:14:34.06
Talal K
Hi there, Alexi and Talal.

00:14:34.34
alexei sayle
yeah

00:14:35.66
Talal K
Please research about Zach and hypnotherapy. He has been misrepresented. He was asked to do this hypnotherapy, said it wouldn't work, but they insisted. So he agreed to do it without payment.

00:14:48.42
Talal K
on the understanding that he would not normally do this and didn't think it would work. Now he is having the Sun's false reporting thrown at him. I heard this on an interview with maybe Navarra, but I haven't been able to find it to send to you.

00:15:04.67
Talal K
It's really important to challenge the right wing stories about left wing parties and not perpetuate their myths. The Greens are, yeah, the Greens are an increasingly important voice now that your party have squandered

00:15:12.35
alexei sayle
ah Yes, Diego.

00:15:19.08
Talal K
what was a great moment with enormous potential by having their disagreements in public, a very sad time. Hope you can apologize for this in the next podcast and maybe get Zach on the show at some point.

00:15:29.41
alexei sayle
that well in Yeah, yeah.

00:15:29.71
Talal K
Hoping for socialism in my time.

00:15:31.95
alexei sayle
Certainly be happy to have Zach on the show. And yes, I mean, she's right, actually. I mean, you shouldn't take these. I mean, you the sun is, I mean, all the newspapers, particularly the right wing ones are full of lies. So I suppose we shouldn't really. And that does sound typical of the kind of stitch up that they would do really.

00:15:49.42
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:15:50.39
Talal K
And as as we should know, exactly.

00:15:52.41
alexei sayle
yeah So we shouldn't have.

00:15:52.43
Talal K
Like what we went through with Jeremy and everything, like we should know that the centrists and the rights will do anything to make make our people look bad, isn't it?

00:15:55.05
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:16:01.18
Talal K
Why do I feel like a teacher like really just scolded me and made me stand in the corner of the class?

00:16:01.23
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:16:06.15
alexei sayle
but is we're both Well, we do we we do we have we we you know we perhaps did fall below the high standards we set ourselves on this podcast. you know So, um yeah, that sounds all too believable that that that is what would happen. It is typically what ah the sun would do.

00:16:28.67
Talal K
Yeah.

00:16:30.32
alexei sayle
Why were they targeting him back then? Yeah.

00:16:35.83
Talal K
No, they were targeting him now by by digging up that old.

00:16:39.91
alexei sayle
I know, but why did they target him back then? soon as he wasn't anybody back then, was he?

00:16:45.97
Talal K
That's a good point.

00:16:46.90
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:16:48.46
Talal K
Yeah.

00:16:49.36
Talal K
i can

00:16:51.32
alexei sayle
I mean, whether they were just going after it all. Hypnotherapy, I don't, you know, seems odd to put them.

00:16:56.63
Talal K
Maybe they were doing an expose on hypnotherapy. Yeah.

00:16:59.65
alexei sayle
Maybe, yeah, it's odd they targeted him.

00:17:04.47
alexei sayle
I'm sure we could look more into that. and

00:17:08.66
Talal K
Yeah. I will report back to you once I find out.

00:17:10.97
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yep.

00:17:14.90
Talal K
But sorry, Nicola, sorry, Zach.

00:17:17.30
alexei sayle
Yeah, sorry, everybody.

00:17:19.75
Talal K
um I just wanted to, just wanted to hear Alexi say boobs, really. That's why I did it.

00:17:30.56
Talal K
You know?

00:17:33.22
Talal K
um I got a question for you.

00:17:36.64
alexei sayle
Yes.

00:17:37.40
Talal K
What is a skill that you don't have that you would wish you could you could learn or you could have.

00:17:45.95
alexei sayle
I'd like to be able to sing properly, even though I've had a top 20 hit single. I'd like to be able to, I'd like to have a lovely voice.

00:17:55.68
alexei sayle
I mean, of of you know, unless we we're talking absurd skills like flying or, you know, heat rays or something.

00:18:01.18
Talal K
No, no, I meant skills.

00:18:01.99
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah, no.

00:18:03.10
Talal K
That's more like you would need some sort of physical transmutation on your voice box in order to have a lovely singing voice.

00:18:08.58
alexei sayle
Probably, yeah. I mean, you could learn ah you could kind of learn how to, but when we do songs, when we do songs on Sandwich Bar, for instance, they did the recording just takes quite long.

00:18:21.04
alexei sayle
we We often do them sort of line by line, really, and Tim's, yeah, Tim takes me, or, you know, certainly verse by verse, because cause I'll just wander off the, you know, Tim has to take me through it, he's like, no, he goes, you know.

00:18:23.95
Talal K
Oh really?

00:18:39.88
alexei sayle
um Tim Sutton who does the songs has to painstakingly take me through it or anything.

00:18:46.72
Talal K
okay

00:18:47.32
alexei sayle
Unless it is, I think the one we did on the last series was more a kind of spoken thing. is Didn't require quite as much singing. But yeah, I mean, for instance, the theme song, you know.

00:18:57.18
Talal K
Yeah, it sounds so beautiful.

00:18:57.36
alexei sayle
Behold my sandwich bar, but the bargain prices. Yeah, i mean, I think that took quite a long time to record.

00:19:02.97
Talal K
Right.

00:19:03.41
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:19:05.44
Talal K
Okay. Okay, good answer.

00:19:07.76
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:19:07.83
Talal K
um But what about something with like like like your hands or something like juggling or something like that, like a skill skill?

00:19:15.00
alexei sayle
Not really.

00:19:18.50
alexei sayle
Not particularly. I mean...

00:19:20.67
alexei sayle
um

00:19:22.93
alexei sayle
um mean but don't know. it's not's just not I've never noticed the lack of really... say singing is really the one I would... Singing and playing a musical instrument, I suppose.

00:19:35.06
alexei sayle
I mean, I was always very jealous because it's a music. but I mean, and we we I remember we were on When we had a house in Spain, it was winter, and we were on the beach at Salabrenia, and two kind of gypsies came along singing a song, and all the Spanish people in the... The women, I think, mostly, joined in with this song about Maria from Salabrenia, but they're all imperfect...

00:20:01.51
alexei sayle
you know, harmony and pitch. I mean, they all sang it completely professionally, you know.

00:20:04.93
Talal K
wow yeah

00:20:06.85
alexei sayle
I mean, it was extraordinary, you know, whereas I think in Britain it would just be people, you know, singing but not, it would be pretty raucous noise, really.

00:20:18.27
alexei sayle
But, yeah, they they all sang it beautifully and it was that a hard-stopping moment, really.

00:20:22.34
Talal K
and through it oh she offers me protection like that that's how the english groups it's very very much built into the culture in europe and the middle east and

00:20:27.11
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, that kind thing, yeah.

00:20:35.18
Talal K
fucking all, ah most of the world learning to sing from when you're young, learning these ah traditional songs and stuff.

00:20:35.36
alexei sayle
Singing, yeah. Singing properly, yeah. Yeah. Right.

00:20:43.62
alexei sayle
Yeah, because not something we have at all. And yeah, it was just really impressive.

00:20:48.17
Talal K
We would have 50 years ago or so, or even more perhaps, but

00:20:55.09
alexei sayle
Yeah, but I always thought, mean, like Dr. Robert, our friend in the village, you know, from the Blow Monkeys, he could, one of the ways he got in with the Spaniards was because he could play guitar, you know.

00:21:05.88
Talal K
Right.

00:21:06.21
alexei sayle
And they always, you know, they would always respect that, really. Whereas I couldn't really do stand-up. I hate Keir Starmer. Okay. You know, it's not the same kind of transferable skill, really.

00:21:21.38
Talal K
Lee in the Patreon says, I saw Alexi last night compar comparing for slapstick benefit. Speaking of your standup, Alexi, it was great to see him bring his dance moves.

00:21:27.27
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:21:31.26
Talal K
I was amazed at how quick he got up off his knees.

00:21:34.18
alexei sayle
It

00:21:35.60
Talal K
He's more than a decade older than me and I would have needed 10 minutes. um And I spoke to you about it. It was a show with Stuart Lee and

00:21:44.90
alexei sayle
says it amazed Alistair Beckett King and Arthur Smith.

00:21:47.26
Talal K
Alistair Beckett King. Mm-hmm.

00:21:52.77
alexei sayle
It was really good. It was a great benefit. I mean, I kept things... the only stand-up I've done like this year, I think. and I kept things bubbling along.

00:22:03.52
alexei sayle
But also it was quite good that there were um there only four acts, really. You know, I mean, compared to that, you these, i mean, particularly Palestinian benefits would just go on for hours, you know.

00:22:16.15
alexei sayle
Because everybody, I mean, a' fair enough, everybody wants to be on the bill and show their support, but

00:22:16.33
Talal K
Yes.

00:22:20.87
alexei sayle
You know, they just grind. This was, like, tight. couple of hours. Everybody did their best material. And it was was great, you know.

00:22:32.01
Talal K
And how, and how did it feel for you just to be doing stand up again, you know?

00:22:37.97
alexei sayle
Felt fantastic. Yeah, felt really fantastic. Yeah. Yeah. I really enjoyed it. When I was out, yeah. It was just nice being backstage with everybody and just...

00:22:49.94
alexei sayle
Also, ah just ah yeah doing it, you know, being out there. big it big i mean, I think, i don't know how many there was there, about maybe 8.50 or something, you know, but working in a big crowd. I mean, they were a lovely audience. They were very nice.

00:23:05.89
Talal K
Well, I'm proud of you, my son.

00:23:08.35
alexei sayle
Thank you.

00:23:09.73
Talal K
It's good to see you back out there on the pitch.

00:23:12.35
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:23:13.34
Talal K
and Yeah, let's do let's get you doing more, man.

00:23:17.69
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:23:19.22
Talal K
um Or would you ever consider running or like me running a monthly stand-up night somewhere local to you? Yeah.

00:23:29.45
alexei sayle
um I don't really know. I mean, it's um something that says...

00:23:32.46
Talal K
we'd call it Alexis sales comedy club or something.

00:23:33.74
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah.

00:23:34.74
Talal K
And you and me could host it or I'll take care of all the admin.

00:23:35.30
alexei sayle
Yeah,

00:23:39.25
Talal K
um

00:23:40.20
alexei sayle
it'd be a way to... Think about It'd be a way to generate new material, wouldn't it? I mean, the Museum of Comedy is the obvious spot.

00:23:47.94
Talal K
Of course, of course.

00:23:50.84
alexei sayle
Are you hearing that Roland sanding something? Are you picking it up?

00:23:58.14
Talal K
No.

00:23:59.04
alexei sayle
I find.

00:23:59.91
alexei sayle
ah It's worth a thought. Yeah, i have... Yeah. Not this week, but yeah.

00:24:05.06
Talal K
No, but I just thought of it now. That would be that could be cool.

00:24:07.80
alexei sayle
Yeah?

00:24:08.45
Talal K
Alexi Sayles Imaginary Stand-Up Club or something.

00:24:08.76
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:24:12.04
alexei sayle
Okay.

00:24:13.31
Talal K
um And we could just book comedians that we like and that we ah we agree with politically.

00:24:19.20
alexei sayle
Yeah. Well, that's how I started out, really. When I got back into it, I did... four shows, I think, at the Soho Theatre with, ah you know, people like Josie Long and ah very yeah various acts who were on the circuit in those days.

00:24:38.62
alexei sayle
And, you know it was a way for me to sort of use my way back, and then I did bits in between them. long time ago now, like 2012 or something. But, ah yeah, that's how I got back into it, really.

00:24:50.52
Talal K
I remember that's how, the first time I kind of hung out with you as an adult was coming to that show with my, no, it was your full show, it was your first full return.

00:24:56.48
alexei sayle
That's right. that I mean, that wasn't the... the you Yeah, yeah. That was great. That was really great.

00:25:03.16
Talal K
And you were like, I think the big gag was that, um you know, all my material used to be about Thatcher.

00:25:03.39
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:25:08.96
alexei sayle
Yes.

00:25:09.83
Talal K
but now I could still do that same material and just say David Cameron instead. And there was a big section of that where you were clearly doing Margaret Thatcher jokes, but just saying David Cameron.

00:25:13.98
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:25:19.61
alexei sayle
dizz he Yeah. Yeah. They said to it about Dizzy Rask. I can't remember how went now. Some people think I'm... Crazy aunties. Yeah, i can't remember how it went now.

00:25:32.43
Talal K
And then you took my family to the Groucho Club afterwards down the road.

00:25:32.62
alexei sayle
But yes.

00:25:35.81
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah.

00:25:39.45
Talal K
And then we all kind of just sat awkwardly. ah Because you don't chat much when we're not but you're not on stage. You like to just chill.

00:25:47.61
alexei sayle
No, well, especially not because i you know, just come off stage.

00:25:50.14
Talal K
It's similar to my dad.

00:25:52.85
alexei sayle
ah ah god Oh, thank you very much.

00:25:53.52
Talal K
So like...

00:25:55.10
alexei sayle
You fucking abandoned me in Brixton after rope tackle. You drove me to Brixton and then threw me out. I think, oh, I'm all right. Thank you very much.

00:26:05.44
Talal K
I'm glad to hear it.

00:26:05.68
alexei sayle
You left me in Brixton at midnight.

00:26:08.07
Talal K
Yeah, with all the crazies out there.

00:26:09.59
alexei sayle
Yeah, elderly man.

00:26:11.21
Talal K
I thought you'd fit in quite well in Brixton on a Saturday night.

00:26:11.26
alexei sayle
confused I went... I said, it was weird. I went, you know, because it's the end of Victoria Line. And...

00:26:21.46
Talal K
Wait, wait, wait. Just to clarify for the audience. ah We finished in Shoreham. You were going to get the train home.

00:26:28.22
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:26:28.57
Talal K
but um oh but you were going to You jumped in the car with me back to London.

00:26:33.70
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:26:34.26
Talal K
And if I was to drive you to your door, it would have added almost an hour to my journey because I live in South London and you live closer to Central.

00:26:38.54
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:26:41.84
alexei sayle
yeah

00:26:42.79
Talal K
And you suggested I could just throw you out of Brixton so because it was a very easy train ride home.

00:26:47.99
alexei sayle
yeah

00:26:49.31
Talal K
And now you're making me feel awful about it. So, yeah, what what happened, Alexi?

00:26:52.18
alexei sayle
That's deliberate. Well, I went and there's two platforms because that's the end of the line. The trains pull in and they go out.

00:26:59.85
Talal K
Yeah.

00:27:00.08
alexei sayle
And so I went to, I didn't, I was a bit tired and confused. I went and there was a few people.

00:27:05.19
Talal K
God, I should have taken you.

00:27:07.14
alexei sayle
They're taking me onto the platform, really. They, yeah there's a few people sort of sit and waiting for a trains, but there wasn't going to be any train for like 20 minutes. don't what they were doing there.

00:27:18.85
Talal K
Oh, really?

00:27:18.98
alexei sayle
And then realised all the trains were leaving him from the other platform, so I missed one. I think I only missed one. And then I went through and...

00:27:24.86
Talal K
Shit.

00:27:26.47
alexei sayle
No,

00:27:28.51
Talal K
Is that it? I thought you were going to tell me more thrilling.

00:27:30.81
alexei sayle
no. And then I got home.

00:27:33.76
Talal K
I quite like traveling in London at night with all the drunks and stuff like the night buses and the tube. Yes, occasionally you'll get like really annoying, someone really annoying next to you, but mostly it's just kind of, you're just seeing life happening around you and laughter and and groups of people who are having great nights.

00:27:51.41
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, no, it was all very, yeah, yeah.

00:27:54.04
Talal K
And like you you know you mentioned Brecht's idea of the theater of the street and all that, and that's it, like turned up to 11, you know, it can be a really fun atmosphere.

00:28:00.82
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah, no, it was, ah yeah, it was not, you know, it was not leery in any way at all. Everybody was happy, mostly happy.

00:28:12.63
Talal K
ah can't say I can't say I didn't feel guilty at all. like I felt bad leaving you there.

00:28:17.39
alexei sayle
van didn't admit Because it wasn't even by the station. to walk. i was about five minutes away from the station.

00:28:21.34
Talal K
come on, don't exaggerate.

00:28:25.69
alexei sayle
I had to walk to the station.

00:28:29.27
Talal K
And you got out the car and you dropped your car keys and you almost walked off and I could have let you just walk off and leave your car keys on the floor.

00:28:34.94
alexei sayle
it Yeah, I didn't.

00:28:38.09
Talal K
I

00:28:38.69
alexei sayle
Yeah, but you didn't. And um on the way, I got the Elizabeth line to Reading for the Hexagon show because your Freedom him Pass, there's a tip for all you elderly.

00:28:41.55
Talal K
didn didn't.

00:28:49.97
alexei sayle
um Your Freedom Pass works as far as Reading on the Elizabeth line.

00:28:54.30
Talal K
No way.

00:28:56.28
alexei sayle
A man gave me a seat,

00:29:00.68
alexei sayle
which was very kind, on the al yeah because it was busy on the outbound journey. I got like five o'clock train to Reading.

00:29:06.41
Talal K
Did you see Alistair Beckett King's set?

00:29:08.44
alexei sayle
Yeah, it was good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:29:09.60
Talal K
He's good, isn't he?

00:29:13.10
Talal K
I gigged with him very early on um and he is just blown up.

00:29:13.24
alexei sayle
so

00:29:18.07
Talal K
He did it right way because he got really good at stand up and he's very intelligent. stuff um You know, some people might think it's a bit hoity-toity, but he's funny as fuck. But he got really good at stand up and then he blew up on social media making very clever videos.

00:29:31.84
alexei sayle
Right.

00:29:33.53
Talal K
He's like a master at these... he does special effects and on these incredibly tightly edited videos and he's playing all the parts and he does all these costumes and hair and,

00:29:38.34
alexei sayle
Right.

00:29:44.09
Talal K
and special effects and animation, and he does it all himself. It's quite mind-blowing, which then you know blew up his status, and then he got better and better gigs out of it.

00:29:57.06
Talal K
But he was already good at stand-up.

00:29:57.69
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:29:58.54
Talal K
A lot of these people, they just get really big on social media, and then they get booked to do shows, and they suck life because they don't know what they're doing.

00:30:01.95
alexei sayle
yeah

00:30:08.75
alexei sayle
Yeah, I've seen him on YouTube before.

00:30:08.89
Talal K
But Alistair smashed it.

00:30:12.24
alexei sayle
But yeah, he was good, you know, very very skilled, good material.

00:30:15.77
Talal K
All right, I got a question on Patreon.

00:30:19.31
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:30:20.66
Talal K
Patreones.

00:30:21.81
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:30:22.79
Talal K
Really enjoyed the last episode. This from Wallow. ah Really enjoyed last episode. Especially Alexi's justification of being caught quaffing champagne.

00:30:35.23
Talal K
ah But please, check can you check something with him? In the mid-1980s, I used to spend my weekends at my grandma's house in Kirkdale. I'm convinced that on one occasion I was in the back of my dad's car, driving up Everton Valley, and I noticed what I thought was Alexei walking along the roadside.

00:30:56.42
Talal K
He gave me a funny look. I was about 10 at the time before carrying on in the mid-80s.

00:31:00.71
alexei sayle
When was this?

00:31:03.85
Talal K
Could it possibly have been him?

00:31:04.31
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, my... Because my mum lived in Anfield and Linda's ah parents lived on Scotland Road, so I would walked down Everton Valley to go between the two of them.

00:31:16.50
alexei sayle
So, yeah, it's perfectly possible that I was walking down Everton Valley, yeah.

00:31:19.19
Talal K
Wow.

00:31:21.80
Talal K
Look at that wallow.

00:31:23.18
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:31:24.34
Talal K
There you go.

00:31:24.44
alexei sayle
Actually, interestingly, um there so right there's a... There's a very successful amount American writer called Jim Vallely. Look up now.

00:31:37.100
Talal K
Yes, sir.

00:31:38.88
Talal K
Jim Vallely.

00:31:39.12
alexei sayle
make Make this a bit.

00:31:43.52
Talal K
What does he do? He's a comedian.

00:31:45.50
alexei sayle
No, he's just writer, comedy writer.

00:31:47.01
Talal K
American producer and screenwriter.

00:31:47.22
alexei sayle
but

00:31:49.23
Talal K
Yeah, Jim Vallely. Yeah, got him.

00:31:50.55
alexei sayle
Yeah. And what's he done?

00:31:53.45
Talal K
American television producer, screenwriter. He's written and produced for The Golden Girls.

00:31:59.19
alexei sayle
Well, that's what, but what's he...

00:32:01.15
Talal K
Two and a Half Men, My Wife and Kids. I love my wife and kids. ah Movies and Shows.

00:32:09.16
Talal K
ah Double Trouble, Brotherly Love, Running Wild, Arrested Development.

00:32:13.79
alexei sayle
Arrested Development, yes yeah.

00:32:16.08
Talal K
What are you looking for? what do you want me to say here?

00:32:17.34
alexei sayle
Well, no, because he's heard the podcast. He's heard me talking about Golden Palace, and he's ringing me this evening to tell me what from the States to tell me what really went on. which is not what I think went on.

00:32:31.20
Talal K
What, it wasn't to do with tomatoes?

00:32:34.04
alexei sayle
It was not, apparently, on me. No? On my bad tap dancing.

00:32:42.98
Talal K
can feet Can't we record this conversation?

00:32:46.11
alexei sayle
Well, I don't know, really. I didn't really want to ask him whether. He just seems to want to talk on the phone. Yeah.

00:32:54.00
Talal K
Well, can you ask him what it was like making Surf Ninjas with Leslie Nielsen in 1993, please?

00:33:00.15
alexei sayle
Okay.

00:33:02.41
Talal K
Surf...

00:33:02.45
alexei sayle
I'm speaking to him at six anyway, my time.

00:33:04.33
Talal K
Oh, my God. Okay, you're going to fill us in next week, right? I need you to take extensive notes so that you don't forget a single detail.

00:33:09.55
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah.

00:33:14.68
alexei sayle
It's nice that he listens to the podcast.

00:33:16.46
Talal K
Very nice. Hello, Jim. Thanks for listening, buddy.

00:33:20.66
alexei sayle
Because I thought it was Mitch Harewitz from Arrested Development. He said I got standing ovation in the pilot. But in a way, I mean, it did. i don't know what would have happened to it I mean it did I mean I came back to the UK and then I was Jim Moyer that had the head of comedy was very nice to me and I did I did two more i did two more very good series with Graham and Arthur writing so I did come back to the UK but I don't know what would have happened really if I stayed in the States or I yeah I don't really know it did affect me really I mean

00:33:57.50
alexei sayle
getting fired from that show on my 40th birthday.

00:34:00.53
Talal K
so Oh, buddy.

00:34:02.51
alexei sayle
know, yeah, yeah.

00:34:05.33
Talal K
Well, at Jim, Valerie, if you're listening, I'm a jobbing actor. And if you brought me to America to cast me in something, I would behave very well.

00:34:15.09
alexei sayle
to

00:34:16.18
Talal K
I could fill that Alexa-shaped hole. Um...

00:34:20.61
alexei sayle
I think the circus has moved on.

00:34:23.80
Talal K
We had another thing i need to address from last week's show.

00:34:29.20
Talal K
If you don't mind, Alexi.

00:34:30.59
alexei sayle
Yeah, sure.

00:34:31.23
Talal K
We were talking about Riyadh Comedy Festival.

00:34:31.46
alexei sayle
Well, I know. Yeah.

00:34:36.29
Talal K
And, you know, i think we ah we fell on the side of, you know, it's not right to take state you know government money to go and do a state-sponsored comedy show in an oppressive country.

00:34:45.18
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:34:48.19
alexei sayle
No.

00:34:53.89
Talal K
But I think yesterday, Ahmed Jalili wrote an article in The Guardian about it.

00:35:01.72
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:35:02.75
Talal K
There was some ah chat in the Patreon chat room about it. um Mark showed us a conversation Omid was having with a commenter on his Instagram. Someone was asking him, how could you be doing this festival? And he said, it's very important I do this festival and you'll find out why soon.

00:35:19.92
Talal K
I'm gonna write about it. um And he has written about it in the Guardian.

00:35:26.89
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:35:27.16
Talal K
um

00:35:28.52
Talal K
I think it's interesting. It echoes a bit of the kind of, I made the devil's advocate counterpoint last week. There were echoes of that there. But do you want me to read it to you and you can interrupt me at any point?

00:35:40.44
alexei sayle
I'll have read it, but you can read it again to me if you want.

00:35:43.36
Talal K
ah Read it to our listeners. Please interject.

00:35:45.60
alexei sayle
There's been about eight articles about the re-ed comedy festival in The Guardian. This is obviously something they get their teeth into.

00:35:49.49
Talal K
Where's it I bet, yeah. Well, it's been in the zeitgeist, in a very bigly fashion.

00:35:54.25
alexei sayle
yeah

00:35:57.73
Talal K
um All right, here's Ahmed in The Guardian. After 15 years of turning down offers to perform stand-up in Saudi Arabia due to the country's human rights records, this time I took the gig.

00:36:10.34
Talal K
Why? There's a push for change in Saudi and signs are discernible, yet many from the outside world, many from the outside would rather comedians in the West stayed away at a time when freedom of speech is under attack.

00:36:24.65
Talal K
The backlash against comedians, comedians who participated in the Riyadh Comedy Festival reflects our ongoing ongoing struggle to find consensus on this and many issues affecting humanity.

00:36:38.36
Talal K
I'm no stranger to cancel culture. I was canceled after 9-11 simply for being Middle Eastern, and as Arab terrorists were behind the attacks on the Twin Towers. This is despite the fact that I'm not Arab, nor am I, contrary to popular opinion, terrorist.

00:36:55.85
Talal K
We'll stop playing Arabs then. um Where's the next slide? There we go.

00:37:03.44
Talal K
In certain circles, there have been calls to boycott my UK tour. Namaste is shown, which I tried to explore the nuances, blah, blah, blah. After explaining that the restrictions on performing in Saudi were exactly the same as in Dubai.

00:37:16.12
Talal K
Basically, no jokes about the royals, no disrespecting Islam and no humiliation of the government. A concerned friend texted me. I think you're at risk of invalidating your right to make jokes about anything important.

00:37:28.81
Talal K
um My show in Riyadh had a lot of material about the Saudis themselves. The perception that we as comedians were all being paid to be silent was as laughable as the idea that Dave Chappelle, worth $70 million, dollars was doing his show in Riyadh for the money.

00:37:47.86
Talal K
Any thoughts yet?

00:37:49.30
alexei sayle
Well, yeah, I'm reluctant to, obviously, I'm a friend of the show, and, you know, i um i don't

00:37:54.32
Talal K
Yeah.

00:37:59.06
alexei sayle
I don't think there is much positive. I mean, from what I've read in The Guardian, again, there doesn't seem to be a lot of, like, movement in in many ways in saudi arabia towards you know but i mean they're still executing um uh they're still executing um you know satirists and stuff like that so um i think you know i don't know as i say it's not it's not for me to yeah it's a friend and i don't really yeah i yeah i

00:38:23.01
Talal K
It

00:38:29.04
Talal K
is a tricky one. He is a friend. ah um But, you know, he's putting this out there. So it's, you know, he's...

00:38:38.26
alexei sayle
I think, you know, they I think the Saudi government seems to be to be incredibly repressive and that this ah that this festival of all was an effort to, um you know, comedy wash that without really changing their nature.

00:38:58.25
alexei sayle
i don't know. ah but from Again, from what I've read The Guardian, I would, you know, maybe somebody, had some expert could tell me that things are different.

00:39:06.63
Talal K
Well, he mentions that dubai Dubai is a very different place now to what it was when he first performed there in 2008,

00:39:16.91
Talal K
largely because of the import of culture and performance and stuff like, and that, you know, allowing international performances in Saudi

00:39:20.67
alexei sayle
yeah

00:39:27.39
Talal K
especially comedy, that it subtly broadens what's thinkable and sayable in society. Every laugh at taboo subject shifts norms. Okay, that is a good point.

00:39:36.60
alexei sayle
Yeah, I mean, somebody made the point again that apparently 2% of the population are actual literal slaves. I mean, I saw Nish Patel on there, on and they're from the Indian subcontinent talking about this on YouTube, that yeah there are there is literal slavery in Saudi Arabia.

00:39:55.14
Talal K
Yeah.

00:39:56.66
alexei sayle
So that's problem. I also have just disclosed as well that not Saudi Comedy Festival, but Newcastle United have been after me to play a central midfield role.

00:40:09.53
alexei sayle
And I've turned that down as well. i'm not going I'm not going to play for Newcastle United.

00:40:16.02
Talal K
why Why wouldn't you do that? Okay.

00:40:18.20
alexei sayle
Well, because they're owned by the Saudis. That's the only reason. The only reason I won't play central midfield in that false number nine sweeper running the channels, sweeper-keeper role, the only reason now I won't do that is because Newcastle United is owned by the Saudi government.

00:40:39.24
Talal K
Well, yeah.

00:40:41.31
alexei sayle
So there you are. So you'll be...

00:40:44.23
Talal K
That's very righteous of you. And I don't, yeah, I think it seems like Ahmed would do it if he was offered that position.

00:40:45.73
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, thank you, thank you, thank you.

00:40:51.74
alexei sayle
Play for Newcastle United.

00:40:53.02
Talal K
Yeah. Because, you know, it's he's made a couple of good points, but I think the the bad points outweigh, you know, he mentions that the government, you have to remember that governments are not their people, but this was a government funded event.

00:41:00.21
alexei sayle
I think it's problematic.

00:41:07.60
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:41:07.67
Talal K
You know, it's not.

00:41:10.67
Talal K
Yeah.

00:41:13.02
alexei sayle
ah Film club.

00:41:13.14
Talal K
It's interesting.

00:41:14.16
alexei sayle
Film club.

00:41:15.10
Talal K
Oh, Film Club.

00:41:18.96
alexei sayle
So I finally watched, you haven't watched it, finally watched Battle for Algiers.

00:41:23.38
Talal K
Yeah, okay, let's do it. This is the first time I've not watched the film.

00:41:26.85
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:41:28.20
Talal K
I'm sorry.

00:41:29.62
alexei sayle
Well, the Battle for Algiers, I hope all the listeners have watched it now.

00:41:33.62
Talal K
a lot of them have.

00:41:33.74
alexei sayle
and I know we've delayed it a bit.

00:41:35.46
Talal K
Yeah, I think a lot of them have watched it and forgotten all about it.

00:41:38.42
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah.

00:41:39.10
Talal K
And you sneaky little ninja watched it without telling me, Alexei.

00:41:42.14
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:41:45.22
Talal K
So tell us about Battle 4 of Algiers.

00:41:45.28
alexei sayle
Um...

00:41:49.07
alexei sayle
battle for al I think it's Battle for Algiers. It's a directed by Ponte Corvo in the the Italian new wave, neo-realist style music by Ennio Morricone.

00:42:03.91
alexei sayle
And it's a kind of, it's an account of the sort of the FLN struggle in Algiers. I mean,

00:42:15.30
alexei sayle
of a kind of a cell or a group of the FLN who are gradually kind of rolled up by the French, Mathieu, the French paratrooper commander.

00:42:28.78
alexei sayle
Really interesting film, though. mean, like, Mathieu makes the point that, you know, a lot of them, people call them colonialists, but a lot of them fought in the resistance, and some of them had actually survived Dachau and Buchenwald concentration camps.

00:42:42.44
alexei sayle
I was surprised because there's quite an extended passage where the FLN are planting bombs in... cafes and milk bars where people are dancing the twist and so i was i mean it was shocking really i think i don't know what i was the first time i saw it but it seemed deeply shocking that those kind of actions really of of killing and stuff is i had assumed also that the flm were but without knowing anything about um algeria The FLM were you know secular and Marxist like the PLO, but in fact they are, from I think one sees in this film that they are Islamist or they are relatively Islamist.

00:43:23.36
alexei sayle
yeah relatively islamist so

00:43:27.14
Talal K
Tell us about the FLN, you know you have to talk to us like we're

00:43:29.32
alexei sayle
I don't know anything about the Front a front Liberation National, I think. I don't know anything about it. mean, they were just... I mean, it's... I've done no research and know nothing about the Algerian struggle for liberation, really.

00:43:49.51
alexei sayle
I mean, apart from how it impinged on France.

00:43:53.07
Talal K
National Liberation Front, Front de Liberation National, Nationalist Political Party in Algeria.

00:43:54.72
alexei sayle
National Liberation Front.

00:43:58.51
alexei sayle
Not sure now. Yeah.

00:44:03.32
Talal K
It's the main nationalist movement during the Algerian war and the sole legal and ruling party of the Algerian states until 1989.

00:44:03.38
alexei sayle
yeah

00:44:11.30
alexei sayle
Yeah, i think it's pretty repressive now, isn't it i mean like all those

00:44:11.88
Talal K
Yeah. until nineteen eighty nine yeah

00:44:16.14
alexei sayle
I mean, like all those liberation movements, they all as soon as they got into power, like the ANC or the PLO, it all instantly became both corrupt and autocratic. So there's that going on. I think it's it's still pretty... I think there's the way... I know there was a very...

00:44:37.07
alexei sayle
unpleasant civil war in the 90s i'm thinking which is which really really cruel islamist groups who i think were eventually put down by the government i mean i think that you know you could say the trauma of that i mean it was a it was a really savage war of clon the french were pretty brutal although that the israelis made them look like top-handed gentlemen or knights of you chivalric knights of old but i mean um it seems pretty But interestingly enough, there is this this have you seen the movie that everybody's talking about? Is one is is

00:45:14.93
alexei sayle
one battle at a time?

00:45:17.44
Talal K
One battle after the other after another.

00:45:17.64
alexei sayle
the One battle after another, yeah.

00:45:21.16
Talal K
haven't watched it yet.

00:45:22.28
alexei sayle
Leonardo DiCaprio. Paul Thomas Anderson, of whom I am a fan. with Amazing movies like Magnolia.

00:45:28.56
Talal K
Yeah, he's one of my favorites.

00:45:30.54
alexei sayle
Yeah, it's really worth seeing. um

00:45:35.18
Talal K
I'm just put off by Johnny Greenwood being involved, you know.

00:45:38.45
alexei sayle
Oh, well, I think, you know, I think that's cutting your nose off to spite your nose or anything. I mean, it's, um I think, you know, really, it's not...

00:45:50.64
alexei sayle
It's a really interesting film, but also there is one scene, I think, where I think somebody, the police maybe raid, Leonardo DiCaprio's watching, I think Leonardo DiCaprio's watching the TV, and he's watching the battle for Algiers, and so there's a there's ah clearly a kind of reference there to that film, and it is in a way, you mean, the thing Paul Thomas Anderson does of having the music very high up in the mix, you know, and

00:46:04.64
Talal K
Oh. Yeah.

00:46:18.35
alexei sayle
in a way that really propels the the action, I think is is is also...

00:46:22.52
Talal K
yeah

00:46:24.34
alexei sayle
um You see that in... I mean, Ponte Corvo uses that in Battle for Algiers.

00:46:32.70
alexei sayle
And so... Yeah, no, I mean, it's really an interesting film, really, and it's... um

00:46:42.24
Talal K
tell us a bit of about pontiorvo's Tell us a bit about filmmaking.

00:46:44.97
alexei sayle
I don't know what you think

00:46:47.30
Talal K
how How is it shot?

00:46:49.68
alexei sayle
Well, I think that, I mean, there was a, again, I'm really pushing it.

00:46:49.78
Talal K
and

00:46:53.11
alexei sayle
I should have done some research and then people be more impressed with me. I mean, my understanding is that there was a, in the immediate post-war years in Italy, there was this um new wave of kind of neorealism,

00:47:11.22
Talal K
Italian neorealism, yeah.

00:47:12.40
alexei sayle
Italian neorealism the most the most obvious example of that is bicycle thieves and what they did from this is all from my memory is that they would use often use real people would use real situations so there's never they're always shot on location there's never any use of sets and it's an attempt to really to get at the um I think it's an attempt to kind of get at reality in, ah you know, movie making really is to, is to, is to, like you say, a kind of realism rather than felt you know, movie being a a kind of, you know, softly lit fable or these are films that attempt to replicate reality.

00:48:04.51
alexei sayle
You know, mean, ah Bicycle, um who directed Bicycle,

00:48:08.93
Talal K
It was often about class as well. Like they would tell lower class, working working class people's stories.

00:48:12.85
alexei sayle
Yes. Yes. yeah

00:48:16.30
Talal K
um People, you know, they would tell the story of the majority of the population.

00:48:19.61
alexei sayle
Yes. People who got the bus, think. is that Yeah.

00:48:21.86
Talal K
Yeah.

00:48:23.14
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:48:24.24
Talal K
um

00:48:24.93
alexei sayle
um

00:48:25.14
Talal K
And yeah, it was kind of almost documentary style filmmaking.

00:48:30.95
alexei sayle
Yeah. yeah Yeah, a lot of handheld camera and grainy. mean, I don't know whether they shot them on 16mm or 35mm, but...

00:48:44.18
alexei sayle
who directed bicycle thieves I've forgotten yeah

00:48:49.82
Talal K
Was it Rossellini or? Let me find you've got La Strada as well, which is a lovely film.

00:48:55.16
alexei sayle
yeah

00:48:59.98
Talal K
Vittorio De Sica.

00:49:01.49
alexei sayle
Vittorio De Sica, right.

00:49:03.37
Talal K
Yeah.

00:49:03.95
alexei sayle
Whereas, um I mean, you also got that. I mean, Fellini is, of course, but is is very different. I mean, it's a kind of dreamy kind of, um you know, magical quality about Fellini's films, which are very much a contrast to the neorealism of De Sica and Ponticova.

00:49:26.72
Talal K
Right.

00:49:28.77
alexei sayle
But it's I think it's a film that's... A friend of mine who is a psychoanalyst or psychotherapist, they used to have a film club which was held at Freud's house, which is also a museum.

00:49:41.23
alexei sayle
and the the

00:49:41.77
Talal K
Yeah, I've been there, yeah.

00:49:42.79
alexei sayle
Yeah, the gift shop's hilarious, isn't it? You can buy all kinds of Freud-themed slippers and stuff like that.

00:49:50.24
Talal K
I don't remember the gift shop.

00:49:50.29
alexei sayle
um Yeah. ah But they had a film club there, and that it was hosted by... the person showing Battle for RGS was somebody who taught at the um war studies, I think, at Bradford University at the time, or peace studies.

00:50:09.08
alexei sayle
And i remember him using the phrase, which I'm very fond of and I think I've used before, is engrunage, which French phrase literally means getting dragged into the machinery. But it's it's kind of, you know, what happens in the struggle, you know, you start out,

00:50:24.26
alexei sayle
But like the American United States involvement in Vietnam, you you start out very small and you gradually, events kind of drag you in until until you're involved in a large-scale conflict.

00:50:34.75
alexei sayle
you know But I think engrunage is a very useful phrase for...

00:50:35.15
Talal K
Right.

00:50:41.70
alexei sayle
So something to watch out for is, you know, getting yourself dragged into the machinery, you know, getting getting involved in some um debate or that, you know, you didn't really intend to get involved in, really. But you find yourself forced into taking a position, for example. example

00:51:00.51
Talal K
I've just found a quote from the movie. It's hard to start a revolution, even harder to continue it and hardest of all to win it. But it's only afterwards when we have one that the true difficulties begin.

00:51:17.48
Talal K
In short, Ali, there's still much to do.

00:51:21.44
alexei sayle
Yes, that's the the main boss talking to the sort of centre. If there is a centre of figure, it's a guy, this guy, Ali Lapointe, who starts out as a small petty criminal and is gradually drawn into the revolutionary struggle and ends up dying when the French blow up the house that he's in.

00:51:41.60
alexei sayle
ah But, yeah, ah that's what the head says to him.

00:51:47.73
Talal K
So as is quite typical, this is a revolution that results in ah and a long-running dictatorship kind of thing, isn't it?

00:51:55.84
alexei sayle
Yes, I think so. I mean, that's not what the film is saying, obviously. The film was made in 1966. I mean, yeah.

00:52:00.78
Talal K
No, the film is just the revolution bit, isn't it?

00:52:03.25
alexei sayle
and the yeah the yeah

00:52:03.28
Talal K
Yeah.

00:52:05.57
alexei sayle
the And i mean they ah they got their independence from France in 1962, so a lot of the people, presumably, in the film had been involved in the liberation struggle.

00:52:18.01
alexei sayle
was only four years afterwards that it was made, so it was all very, very rare.

00:52:23.84
alexei sayle
There's one shot towards the end where there's a a Soviet, I think it's like a Soviet sort of tank. Well, it's not a tank.

00:52:33.47
Talal K
I was just about to tell you about this.

00:52:34.20
alexei sayle
I forget what they're called. Tank destroyer.

00:52:36.79
Talal K
Yeah, this is listed as one of the goofs in the film.

00:52:38.89
alexei sayle
Yeah, i so I spotted it immediately. I thought, what's that doing there? Because it's...

00:52:43.61
Talal K
was waiting for you to say this.

00:52:45.24
alexei sayle
Yeah, because it was...

00:52:46.29
Talal K
Yeah, during the big protest at the end, the the police the French police are backed by armoured vehicles. They are Soviet-made tank destroyers.

00:52:55.96
alexei sayle
Let's see what I'm... Yeah.

00:52:57.60
Talal K
These were part of the Algerian military when the film was made in 1966 after independence, but wouldn't have been present or used by the French at any time.

00:53:02.12
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:53:07.20
alexei sayle
No, it does... I mean, obviously, most people wouldn't notice, but it did really stand out because it it's clearly a...

00:53:10.05
Talal K
Really drags you out of it, doesn't it?

00:53:13.62
alexei sayle
It's clearly a... Save your piece of equipment. somebody in the comments said i'm a reactionary for supporting the 88 they support the uh 120 millimeter gun in the the i to the soviet um yeah youtube or the week before yeah but i think the 100 the 120 millimeter in the

00:53:27.92
Talal K
in the comments from our show last week.

00:53:38.94
alexei sayle
In the IS-2, the Joseph Stalin II tank um had, I don't know, two-part ammunition, so it was at a very, very slow rate of fire. So I'll stick with, I'm not saying, you know, I'll stick with the 88 if you don't mind.

00:53:50.06
Talal K
Yeah, really did, yeah.

00:53:54.66
alexei sayle
um And the gun, the most common gun is this French sub-machine gun, 9mm sub-machine gun, the Mat 49 is what the the the revolutionaries steal them from the French police. and There's some M1 carbines and some French bolt-action rifles.

00:54:19.56
alexei sayle
The most common gun is the Mat 49.

00:54:23.52
alexei sayle
But it's funny, ahubs to somebody yeah somebody actually noticed the the ah Soviet piece of equipment there. Yeah.

00:54:32.06
Talal K
One more thing about Italian nealism neorealism I think is interesting I want to point out I've just read here that it came about from ah the end of the war, World War two The Italian movie industry was like obliterated and after Mussolini fell and uh so it came out of necessity this you know this creativity that you know they were starting from the ground up they didn't have the big so access to the big studios special effects which you know Hollywood had influenced um over the decades you know that cinema technique of you know using massive sound stages amazing lighting as you mentioned and all this and

00:54:53.41
alexei sayle
Right.

00:55:12.31
Talal K
And then, you know, in an instant, that's all gone. So what do we do now? We still want to make movies. We want to tell our stories and we're working class and we want. And so they just had a camera, the sun as they're lighting and the streets, you know, they and created this whole movement, which some of, you know, cinema's finest work, some finest, most iconic movies have come out of.

00:55:36.62
Talal K
And I think that's just kind of. a beautiful thing about how you know necessity breeds creativity and that's like a really, really nice example of that.

00:55:47.71
alexei sayle
Yeah, yeah.

00:55:50.35
Talal K
And even ah you know after a couple decades where they still have, they have regained ah access to better effects and techniques, you know the the the movement carried on ah through to the late 60s maybe, yeah.

00:56:07.39
Talal K
so Pretty cool, Lex.

00:56:09.18
alexei sayle
Yeah, good for them. Well done.

00:56:11.27
Talal K
I got a package. I got very nice care package. Look at this golden packaging. All right. And i you've been You've been talking about myths quite a lot lately.

00:56:22.82
alexei sayle
o

00:56:24.73
Talal K
Okay. I had a... A listener of the show reach out to us.

00:56:31.56
Talal K
How do i navigate this?

00:56:33.60
Talal K
How do I navigate this?

00:56:35.42
Talal K
George and Miri, okay. um

00:56:41.23
Talal K
I should probably find the original email actually, that might make more sense.

00:56:48.97
Talal K
yeah

00:56:51.85
Talal K
Okay, original email. Hi Talal, I'm a long like long-time listener of the podcast and based on the recent mythology content, thought I'd reach out. Me and my partner run a side project. and He's a state school teacher and she's a video games journalist.

00:57:06.83
Talal K
And they try trying to democratize the study of ancient history and mythology.

00:57:13.75
alexei sayle
Right.

00:57:14.48
Talal K
It's called Working Classicist. The project is 50% fueled by our love of the subjects and 50% by a visceral hatred of private schools and educational inequality.

00:57:28.32
Talal K
Our first book, a period table A Periodic Table of Greek Mythology, was published this year and gave platform to more than 100 working class writers. A total anomaly in the world of classics.

00:57:42.63
Talal K
um They want to send us a copy each. They sent me two copies.

00:57:47.85
alexei sayle
That sounds interesting. It's true. My impersonation of Stephen Fry usually just goes, blah, blah, blah, Cicero, blah, blah, blah.

00:57:54.81
Talal K
ah

00:57:55.48
alexei sayle
Punic Wars, blah, blah, blah, blah.

00:58:00.34
Talal K
ah So here it is. It's huge.

00:58:05.38
alexei sayle
Well.

00:58:06.13
Talal K
A periodic table of Greek mythology. Working classicists. Edited by Miri Txera. Txera? Is that a Basquean name?

00:58:19.22
alexei sayle
could be.

00:58:22.06
Talal K
And the hero he wrote me a letter here. which I'm going to pass on to you, Alexei, because you've you've been shown lots of interest in mythology recently.

00:58:28.07
alexei sayle
Thank you.

00:58:31.27
alexei sayle
Yeah.

00:58:32.38
Talal K
And he starts off saying like, I'm just going to write you this little note and then it ends up being six pages long.

00:58:38.65
alexei sayle
but

00:58:39.49
Talal K
He says, oh, I got a bit carried away at the end.

00:58:39.83
alexei sayle
See why they're books over there.

00:58:43.02
Talal K
And he also included a copy of Michael Parenti's Marxist interpretation of the murder of Julius Caesar. It's sensational.

00:58:50.29
alexei sayle
oh Sounds interesting.

00:58:52.45
Talal K
So I might pass that on to you as well.

00:58:53.92
alexei sayle
Yeah, please. Yeah.

00:58:54.87
Talal K
Enjoy the book. Keep up the excellent work. Freedom for Palestine. I don't want to read this whole letter, but it's very nice. But basically, why is the classics only a reserved for the upper class and for people in private schools?

00:59:08.00
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah.

00:59:10.33
Talal K
Why can't? Why isn't, not necessarily just Latin, but just access to mythology and that whole area of history.

00:59:16.13
alexei sayle
yeah yeah

00:59:19.61
alexei sayle
I agree.

00:59:20.47
Talal K
It's a very important thing to learn.

00:59:21.12
alexei sayle
Yeah, that' which is these these are the myths of our society.

00:59:25.29
Talal K
And there genuinely is in the book, if you were a patron, you'd be able to see um what I'm holding up for the screen and stuff, but there is a periodic table.

00:59:40.32
Talal K
of Greek myths and you know if I just go to a random page, so Odysseus, and it's like each Greek myth has its own page. It's kind of just distilled down.

00:59:53.16
Talal K
Very accessible, very easy to digest. I've been flicking through, basically I'll sit with my partner and I'll say say stop while I flick through the book and we'll just learn about a different myth each day.

01:00:05.64
Talal K
um It's lovely, it's really nicely put together, presented. It's a periodic table of Greek mythology. ah think even if you've got like a teenage kids, you know, you don't have to be that.

01:00:19.78
Talal K
I think all ages could digest this. Maybe not the very small, but it's really nice. Nice ah imagery in there as well. So thank you, George and Mary, for sending us that.

01:00:33.18
Talal K
Please support the show. Go to patreon.com forward slash AlexiCellPodcast. We want to do 100 more of these, don't we, Alexi?

01:00:39.37
alexei sayle
Yeah, we do. certainly do.

01:00:42.58
Talal K
And we don't ever want to have adverts on the show. And so we are fully reliant on your generous

01:00:45.74
alexei sayle
No.

01:00:50.51
Talal K
um ah support.

01:00:52.52
alexei sayle
Patreon and Edge.

01:00:54.61
Talal K
Patreonage.

01:00:55.48
alexei sayle
Patreon and Edge.

01:00:55.77
Talal K
patronage So go to patreon.com forward slash Alexis Hill podcast. Please don't use the Patreon app. on your iPhone, they take a massive cut and they don't take it from us.

01:01:08.44
alexei sayle
Do they?

01:01:09.52
Talal K
They take it from you.

01:01:10.11
alexei sayle
Focus.

01:01:10.48
Talal K
So you pay more to join on Apple app on the iPhone app. I don't understand why they get, how they get away with this, but they add their own surcharge onto the membership.

01:01:22.50
Talal K
Just go to the website, even on your iPhone, go into your web browser, go to the website, patreon.com forward slash Alexa podcast, sign up there. um I think by the time this podcast drops, I'll have finished our second episode of Alexi, Lisa and Nigel. Watch the young ones.

01:01:40.11
Talal K
You're watching episode two of the young ones. I will never post that on YouTube because it will get copyright banned and all that. And it's a really fun one. It's really nice.

01:01:50.13
alexei sayle
Yeah.

01:01:51.95
Talal K
That's the plug I need to say.

01:01:55.26
alexei sayle
All right, Demo, I think we're done for this 100th edition.

01:01:59.60
Talal K
What thrilling edition, Alexi.

01:02:01.81
alexei sayle
Yeah. Yeah, it was.

01:02:04.51
Talal K
Could it be any more gripping?

01:02:06.65
alexei sayle
It's hard to imagine how.

01:02:08.98
Talal K
i I can't imagine. Maybe we could shout out some new patrons, I just realized. We've had some new patrons join up, like Robert, Rachel and Paul and Sally.

01:02:20.74
Talal K
And Tompkins, oh, Tom Tompkins. Sorry I said your full name. ah Hello, all of you and Tobias. Hello, thank you so much for joining.

01:02:30.05
alexei sayle
Hello. Thank you so much.

01:02:31.64
Talal K
What have you got to say to them?

01:02:34.13
alexei sayle
So much. So, so much. So much. Thank you so much.

01:02:42.65
alexei sayle
So, so much.

01:02:44.15
Talal K
All right, Lex, anything else?

01:02:45.84
alexei sayle
Now I think that's how we've covered the waterfront for today. I'll just say bye-bye.

01:02:53.55
alexei sayle
Bye-bye.