1
00:00:00,420 --> 00:00:03,150
Page 94, the Private Eye Podcast.

2
00:00:03,807 --> 00:00:07,137
Andy: Hello, and welcome to
another episode of page 94 this

3
00:00:07,137 --> 00:00:10,137
week, coming to you live from
the Cheltham Literature Festival.

4
00:00:14,984 --> 00:00:18,978
My name's Andrew Hunter Murray, and I'm
here on stage at Cheltham with Helen

5
00:00:18,978 --> 00:00:20,703
Lewis, Ian Hislop and Adam McQueen.

6
00:00:20,703 --> 00:00:21,968
We are here once again to discuss.

7
00:00:22,623 --> 00:00:23,373
The last mag.

8
00:00:23,373 --> 00:00:24,003
The next mag.

9
00:00:24,063 --> 00:00:27,663
We better start with the front
cover of this week's magazine, uh,

10
00:00:27,693 --> 00:00:31,683
Trump's Gaza Triumph, the main, uh,
slogan at the bottom of it world.

11
00:00:31,683 --> 00:00:32,403
Apologizes.

12
00:00:32,493 --> 00:00:33,933
He's not a naughty boy.

13
00:00:34,113 --> 00:00:35,163
He's the Messiah.

14
00:00:40,083 --> 00:00:45,483
Do we all owe Donald a huge, huge
apology for all the years of jokes?

15
00:00:45,663 --> 00:00:45,963
Ian: Yes.

16
00:00:45,963 --> 00:00:48,663
And we're going to issue
it through our lawyers.

17
00:00:48,963 --> 00:00:51,543
Um, it's official.

18
00:00:51,671 --> 00:00:54,191
I actually put in a cart in by Griselda.

19
00:00:54,510 --> 00:00:57,784
she's one of our cartoonists,
and she'd drawn a figure looking

20
00:00:57,784 --> 00:01:01,536
surprisingly like me, in front of
a newspaper saying, East, peace.

21
00:01:01,596 --> 00:01:03,816
And the caption was, oh, bloody Trump.

22
00:01:04,266 --> 00:01:07,806
Uh, which I'm afraid summed
up quite a lot of it.

23
00:01:08,062 --> 00:01:10,222
there was also a, a, a stopped clock.

24
00:01:10,904 --> 00:01:12,854
I think the speech in the Knesset was.

25
00:01:13,664 --> 00:01:15,254
Quite extraordinary.

26
00:01:15,666 --> 00:01:18,486
Helen: I watched all of it too,
just because I, at no point did you

27
00:01:18,486 --> 00:01:19,926
know where it was gonna go next.

28
00:01:20,676 --> 00:01:21,546
Ian: That's unlike Trump.

29
00:01:23,471 --> 00:01:25,341
what do you think the American
audience made of that?

30
00:01:25,898 --> 00:01:29,498
Helen: I mean, I went to a couple of
Trump rallies last year, and I don't

31
00:01:29,498 --> 00:01:31,448
think people listen to a word he says.

32
00:01:31,448 --> 00:01:33,608
I think it's just, it's
like going to a kind of rock

33
00:01:33,608 --> 00:01:34,988
concert or something like that.

34
00:01:34,988 --> 00:01:35,138
Right.

35
00:01:35,138 --> 00:01:37,688
And they would just, there would be
occasional bits that you'd do and

36
00:01:37,688 --> 00:01:40,058
he'd be like, oh, like, you know,
like sort of playing Freebird, but

37
00:01:40,058 --> 00:01:41,828
they'd be always doing the wall, Hey.

38
00:01:42,008 --> 00:01:44,738
And then you'd sort of tune out and
go and get some snacks in between.

39
00:01:44,738 --> 00:01:47,708
So I imagine it was something rather
similar in the NASA, to be honest.

40
00:01:47,815 --> 00:01:51,595
Ian: his main complaint seemed to be that
everyone else had spoken for too long.

41
00:01:53,607 --> 00:01:56,602
I, he literally said, yeah,
good speech, but a bit long.

42
00:01:56,902 --> 00:02:01,552
And they'd showered him with
praise for hours and hours.

43
00:02:01,831 --> 00:02:06,571
and then he decided the best thing to
do was also shower himself with praise.

44
00:02:07,388 --> 00:02:09,398
Obviously everyone's saying
isn't, isn't it good?

45
00:02:09,518 --> 00:02:12,608
You know, the first two points
of the 20 point plan Yeah.

46
00:02:12,638 --> 00:02:16,976
Have been achieved nearly, that
leaves quite a lot to go and,

47
00:02:17,036 --> 00:02:19,346
and quite a lot to go wrong.

48
00:02:19,526 --> 00:02:22,316
Adam: Did you see the truth social
thing he put up after his chat with,

49
00:02:22,316 --> 00:02:25,746
uh, Putin and he said, this is the great
accomplishment of peace in the Middle

50
00:02:25,746 --> 00:02:30,066
East, something that has been dreamed of
for centuries and you think you've got.

51
00:02:30,381 --> 00:02:32,271
Two and a half of the 20 points.

52
00:02:32,271 --> 00:02:33,441
There's quite a long way to go.

53
00:02:33,441 --> 00:02:35,361
You might not, but it is very
much his style, isn't it?

54
00:02:35,361 --> 00:02:38,396
That basically if he says
something, that's it and it's done.

55
00:02:38,945 --> 00:02:40,265
Helen: I mean, he's
got two main qualities.

56
00:02:40,265 --> 00:02:43,505
One, he is a, a bully, and two,
he's completely unreasonable.

57
00:02:43,775 --> 00:02:47,015
And those, it turns out, were an
incredibly good match for this situation.

58
00:02:47,225 --> 00:02:51,845
So the, the, the, the kind of key moment
really came when, um, Israel bomb Qatar.

59
00:02:52,375 --> 00:02:55,525
And, uh, tr do you ever see that amazing
clip where he just came out and for once

60
00:02:55,525 --> 00:02:57,625
he was, he wasn't like camp fake angry.

61
00:02:57,625 --> 00:02:58,405
He was actually angry.

62
00:02:58,405 --> 00:03:00,325
He went, they've been fighting
each other for so long, I dunno

63
00:03:00,325 --> 00:03:01,315
what the fuck they're doing.

64
00:03:01,585 --> 00:03:04,225
And it was just like, kind of,
it had the exact to of your dad

65
00:03:04,225 --> 00:03:05,515
going, I don't get who started it.

66
00:03:06,505 --> 00:03:07,855
I will stop this car.

67
00:03:07,855 --> 00:03:08,845
I swear I'll turn it around.

68
00:03:08,845 --> 00:03:11,335
We won't, the services, I'll,
I'll drop you off there.

69
00:03:11,845 --> 00:03:15,775
Um, and then there was this
extraordinary photo that came out where.

70
00:03:15,850 --> 00:03:17,350
And I wish there was video of this.

71
00:03:17,590 --> 00:03:20,740
He's got Benjamin Netanyahu, um, prime
Minister of Israel with him in the,

72
00:03:20,740 --> 00:03:25,540
in the Oval Office, and he's holding
like an old rotary dial phone and he's

73
00:03:25,540 --> 00:03:28,510
got Benjamin Netanyahu on the phone
to I think the Emir of Qatar going,

74
00:03:28,510 --> 00:03:30,070
I'm sorry, sorry, sorry, sir. Sorry.

75
00:03:31,060 --> 00:03:31,600
Country center.

76
00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:35,350
I went against her and, and, and that
was just the, that was the kind of

77
00:03:35,350 --> 00:03:37,930
extraordinary moment I think that
Donald Trump felt that he had been

78
00:03:37,930 --> 00:03:40,390
personally made a fool of by Israel.

79
00:03:40,691 --> 00:03:42,791
Andy: we, we are saying this
is an actual achievement.

80
00:03:42,821 --> 00:03:46,871
'cause I tend, I tend to take sort of
whatever Trump says, not as non gospels.

81
00:03:46,901 --> 00:03:49,511
You know, I say, well if he has, if he
is claiming his properties in the Middle

82
00:03:49,511 --> 00:03:52,151
East, then he definitely won't have
done but, but there does seem to have

83
00:03:52,151 --> 00:03:54,071
been a bit of knocking heads together,

84
00:03:54,131 --> 00:03:55,156
Helen: provisional achievement.

85
00:03:55,156 --> 00:03:55,276
Right.

86
00:03:55,421 --> 00:03:57,041
And he's got the hostages home.

87
00:03:57,306 --> 00:03:58,416
The ones who are still alive.

88
00:03:58,566 --> 00:04:01,566
And also he has made there to be
a ceasefire, which has allowed

89
00:04:01,566 --> 00:04:02,946
some aid to get into Gaza.

90
00:04:03,096 --> 00:04:03,156
Yeah.

91
00:04:03,156 --> 00:04:04,386
Which is incredibly important.

92
00:04:04,386 --> 00:04:07,686
So even if it doesn't hold that,
those are some achievements.

93
00:04:07,716 --> 00:04:11,196
And I think that's, that's the kind of,
that's the credit I'm willing to give him.

94
00:04:11,196 --> 00:04:15,126
I I'm, I'm just gonna take a wild
outside bet that he probably hasn't

95
00:04:15,126 --> 00:04:16,716
solved the Middle East forever.

96
00:04:18,516 --> 00:04:19,536
Just call me a cynic.

97
00:04:19,686 --> 00:04:20,826
Adam: Yeah, you're a cynic.

98
00:04:20,916 --> 00:04:24,126
Yeah, but it doesn't matter 'cause
he's onto Ukraine now that's.

99
00:04:24,386 --> 00:04:27,056
That's, that's the weekend's job is
just to sort all of that out instead.

100
00:04:27,656 --> 00:04:27,836
Ian: Yeah.

101
00:04:27,836 --> 00:04:28,586
He'll add that.

102
00:04:28,646 --> 00:04:31,946
I mean, we did put on the cover, you've
gotta hand it to him and then another

103
00:04:31,946 --> 00:04:37,196
boy say what the whole of Garza,
um, which, which again may happen.

104
00:04:37,394 --> 00:04:42,208
if the redevelopment into Garza
Largo actually comes off, um,

105
00:04:42,388 --> 00:04:46,468
there will be this, this sort of
visionary Middle Eastern dream.

106
00:04:46,498 --> 00:04:48,238
Well, Tony Blair's gonna
be running it, hasn't he?

107
00:04:48,959 --> 00:04:51,059
the trouble with Trump
is there is no loyalty.

108
00:04:51,209 --> 00:04:54,269
So someone asked him, you know,
the moment on the plane where he

109
00:04:54,269 --> 00:04:59,519
appears from the toilet door, um,
and never quite understood why he

110
00:04:59,519 --> 00:05:01,139
has to do this and give an interview.

111
00:05:02,399 --> 00:05:05,849
Head comes around and someone
said, are you gonna put, you

112
00:05:05,849 --> 00:05:06,934
know Tony Blair in charge?

113
00:05:06,954 --> 00:05:08,879
And he goes, yeah, I dunno.

114
00:05:08,879 --> 00:05:09,989
A lot of people don't like him.

115
00:05:10,079 --> 00:05:10,169
Huh?

116
00:05:12,599 --> 00:05:14,009
We could have told you that for free.

117
00:05:16,079 --> 00:05:19,379
Andy: Helen, I mean, you cover
American Matters a great deal.

118
00:05:19,469 --> 00:05:22,019
Um, and you, you, you fly
back and forth quite a lot.

119
00:05:22,019 --> 00:05:22,589
You see a lot of it.

120
00:05:22,619 --> 00:05:25,889
So, uh, one of the things you
wrote recently, um, after an

121
00:05:25,889 --> 00:05:28,319
exciting experience, uh, at
the Riyad Comedy Festival.

122
00:05:28,519 --> 00:05:31,099
Was that America is becoming
more Saudi, just as Saudi is

123
00:05:31,099 --> 00:05:32,269
trying to become more American.

124
00:05:32,429 --> 00:05:34,739
Helen: Well, so Saudi Arabia
is going through some immensely

125
00:05:34,739 --> 00:05:36,059
quick process of change.

126
00:05:36,059 --> 00:05:39,689
You know, it has Deis Islamized
de Haris in the last 10 years

127
00:05:39,989 --> 00:05:42,749
under its elder millennial Crown
Prince Mohammed bin Salman.

128
00:05:42,869 --> 00:05:44,939
I'd like to say that as another,
a fellow elder millennial.

129
00:05:45,059 --> 00:05:47,759
Finally, we're getting to run the world
and it turns out we're quite bad at it.

130
00:05:48,269 --> 00:05:50,699
Um, but it basically, so I
didn't have to cover my hair.

131
00:05:50,699 --> 00:05:51,869
I didn't have to wear an A bear.

132
00:05:51,899 --> 00:05:52,559
They are now having.

133
00:05:52,614 --> 00:05:54,714
Jimmy Carr, the sign of progress.

134
00:05:55,139 --> 00:05:57,204
Uh, you know what they say?

135
00:05:57,414 --> 00:05:59,184
Jimmy Carr, hoer of Democracy.

136
00:05:59,604 --> 00:06:02,754
Um, so, you know, and it was,
it was just extraordinary that

137
00:06:02,754 --> 00:06:04,704
you had And Louis CK as well.

138
00:06:05,154 --> 00:06:07,404
Um, Jack Whitehall.

139
00:06:07,404 --> 00:06:07,734
Jack Whitehall, yeah.

140
00:06:07,734 --> 00:06:08,754
Um, obviously, basically they

141
00:06:08,754 --> 00:06:10,104
Andy: now have to suffer like we do.

142
00:06:10,224 --> 00:06:13,104
That's the, you don't, at least
if you go to a Jack White hole

143
00:06:13,104 --> 00:06:14,484
gig in the uk, you can drink.

144
00:06:14,574 --> 00:06:16,104
I think that is an important, uh.

145
00:06:16,712 --> 00:06:17,102
None of my

146
00:06:17,102 --> 00:06:19,262
Helen: friends were that sympathetic
to me going up there and I was like,

147
00:06:19,262 --> 00:06:20,522
I don't think they'll get tortured.

148
00:06:20,522 --> 00:06:22,622
And then I said, well, I'm
going to a Jimmy Carl gig.

149
00:06:22,622 --> 00:06:22,952
So,

150
00:06:23,282 --> 00:06:26,707
Andy: but this, this point of yours about
America becoming more Saudi is it Right.

151
00:06:26,707 --> 00:06:27,482
Is a fascinating one.

152
00:06:27,482 --> 00:06:28,082
Under Trump.

153
00:06:28,172 --> 00:06:28,712
Helen: Under Trump.

154
00:06:28,712 --> 00:06:31,322
So the, my point about that is when
you go to Saudi Arabia, now it's full

155
00:06:31,382 --> 00:06:34,352
of almost empty malls, as if they're
waiting for everybody to turn up.

156
00:06:34,352 --> 00:06:36,032
There's a Jamie's Italian in Riyad.

157
00:06:36,032 --> 00:06:39,992
Sort of just waiting for families to be
disappointed by overpriced pasta, right?

158
00:06:40,202 --> 00:06:41,582
If you build it, they will come.

159
00:06:42,182 --> 00:06:44,852
Ian: There are other overpriced
pastors are available,

160
00:06:44,852 --> 00:06:45,212
Helen: any of them.

161
00:06:45,872 --> 00:06:49,202
But, uh, so at the same time, all of those
American brands are obviously piled in.

162
00:06:49,202 --> 00:06:50,672
You know, Christiana Ronaldo was there.

163
00:06:50,672 --> 00:06:51,872
Mr. Beast is over there.

164
00:06:51,872 --> 00:06:52,622
Last weakness.

165
00:06:52,702 --> 00:06:53,872
Riyad fashion festival.

166
00:06:54,022 --> 00:06:56,332
Everybody's just taking
a bit of that Saudi cash.

167
00:06:56,572 --> 00:06:58,942
But at the same time, the other thing
is happening in the other direction,

168
00:06:58,942 --> 00:07:02,662
which is that America is getting
rid of the rule of law, the idea of

169
00:07:02,662 --> 00:07:04,402
a kind of fair trial of your peers.

170
00:07:04,642 --> 00:07:07,282
And the other thing is sending
random members of your family

171
00:07:07,282 --> 00:07:09,322
to do foreign affairs work.

172
00:07:09,622 --> 00:07:12,262
So there's a great line in my colleague
Mike Atlantic colleague Graham Woods piece

173
00:07:12,262 --> 00:07:13,732
about Jared Kushner going over there.

174
00:07:13,737 --> 00:07:17,362
And the Saudi says to him the idea of
sending your unqualified son-in-law

175
00:07:17,362 --> 00:07:18,532
to do quite important business.

176
00:07:18,567 --> 00:07:19,857
We're okay with that over here.

177
00:07:20,067 --> 00:07:21,027
We don't think that's weird.

178
00:07:21,867 --> 00:07:25,387
So, you know, you're having this and,
and if you talk to people who work with.

179
00:07:26,227 --> 00:07:28,177
Some of those Gulf monarchies,
particularly God on

180
00:07:28,507 --> 00:07:30,427
Ian: Prince Andrew was
a trade in for Right,

181
00:07:30,427 --> 00:07:30,997
Helen: exactly.

182
00:07:31,777 --> 00:07:34,237
Maybe just saying an
apology to Prince Andrew.

183
00:07:35,047 --> 00:07:38,137
Um, but they will, they will say that,
that, that the, the people in the Gulf

184
00:07:38,137 --> 00:07:40,837
like dealing with the Trump White House,
because they don't turn up and get a

185
00:07:40,837 --> 00:07:42,667
lecture about human rights abuses anymore.

186
00:07:42,667 --> 00:07:45,157
It's just basically like,
would you give us some money?

187
00:07:45,157 --> 00:07:47,227
And in exchange you
can have a Trump tower.

188
00:07:47,377 --> 00:07:47,557
Right.

189
00:07:47,557 --> 00:07:48,787
It's pure foreign policy.

190
00:07:48,787 --> 00:07:50,347
American foreign policy has given up.

191
00:07:50,517 --> 00:07:53,877
Perhaps it was always a delusion,
that idea of being a kind of the

192
00:07:53,877 --> 00:07:56,277
world's policeman or bringing
a force for liberal democracy.

193
00:07:56,457 --> 00:07:59,817
And now it basically is let's,
you know, let's talk business.

194
00:07:59,877 --> 00:08:03,447
So Qatar, for example, is now a huge ally
of the US and it's gonna be, well, not

195
00:08:03,447 --> 00:08:07,377
only to give Donald Trump that claim,
right, but it's, it's gonna be allowed

196
00:08:07,377 --> 00:08:09,717
to build an air base on American soil.

197
00:08:10,057 --> 00:08:13,147
So dearly, deeply entwined
with Trump's business interest.

198
00:08:13,267 --> 00:08:15,517
He's got huge crypto
interests in the Middle East.

199
00:08:15,637 --> 00:08:15,667
Crowd: Mm.

200
00:08:16,087 --> 00:08:18,907
Helen: Um, and so basically the, the
person we should be doing an apology

201
00:08:18,907 --> 00:08:21,727
to really is naked, corrupt capitalism.

202
00:08:23,497 --> 00:08:24,367
Andy: Ian, I'll organize that,

203
00:08:24,373 --> 00:08:25,957
Helen: put, put that
on the cover next time.

204
00:08:26,857 --> 00:08:28,777
Andy: Um, we've got move on in
just a, a couple of minutes to

205
00:08:28,777 --> 00:08:29,737
our next section of the show.

206
00:08:29,737 --> 00:08:33,187
Are there any, are there any more thoughts
that we haven't expressed about Trump yet

207
00:08:33,217 --> 00:08:34,357
that maybe you'd like to before we do?

208
00:08:37,672 --> 00:08:38,512
Helen: I look forward to the day.

209
00:08:38,512 --> 00:08:40,942
I'll never have to have a thought
about Donald Trump ever again.

210
00:08:41,002 --> 00:08:41,332
Andy: Yeah.

211
00:08:41,362 --> 00:08:43,762
Helen: But I fear it may be
for some decades to come.

212
00:08:44,032 --> 00:08:45,472
Adam: Well, Ian, is it gonna happen?

213
00:08:45,472 --> 00:08:47,542
Is he gonna go for a third term?

214
00:08:47,542 --> 00:08:49,072
Do you reckon, Helen, you've
spent time over there?

215
00:08:49,342 --> 00:08:50,812
Helen: I think he absolutely wants to.

216
00:08:50,812 --> 00:08:52,672
The only thing that's on our side is time.

217
00:08:53,092 --> 00:08:54,472
He's 79 years old.

218
00:08:54,472 --> 00:08:56,962
He's a lot less healthy this term.

219
00:08:57,322 --> 00:08:59,872
And I think people laugh when
I say this, but he's a lot less

220
00:08:59,872 --> 00:09:01,072
coherent than he used to be.

221
00:09:01,402 --> 00:09:01,462
Ian: Yeah.

222
00:09:04,252 --> 00:09:07,132
Helen: But the thing that's fascinating
to me is that JD Vance, the vice president

223
00:09:07,132 --> 00:09:09,142
and everyone, everyone hates him.

224
00:09:09,412 --> 00:09:13,552
So you're getting that classic second term
president dynamic where there's an obvious

225
00:09:13,552 --> 00:09:17,752
heir apparent, but also a lot of other
people are thinking, I could have a go.

226
00:09:17,752 --> 00:09:19,582
I could have a, and I think that will be.

227
00:09:19,897 --> 00:09:22,627
He has to keep talking about whether
or not he's gonna do a third term,

228
00:09:22,777 --> 00:09:26,407
and there are Trump 2028 hats
that they keep sending to Gavin

229
00:09:26,407 --> 00:09:27,877
Newsom of California, for example.

230
00:09:27,937 --> 00:09:30,727
He has to keep that as an idea to
kind of keep the party together,

231
00:09:30,907 --> 00:09:33,277
because at the moment, being a
Republican is incredibly simple.

232
00:09:33,277 --> 00:09:35,737
You don't have to have any
particular thoughts on policy.

233
00:09:36,187 --> 00:09:38,737
It's just do you believe
in dear leader enough?

234
00:09:39,082 --> 00:09:42,022
And that's the one thing you
have to say as a Republican and

235
00:09:42,022 --> 00:09:43,192
everything else is off the table.

236
00:09:43,402 --> 00:09:46,732
And of course, as soon as that breaks
down and there's some idea of a post-Trump

237
00:09:46,762 --> 00:09:49,942
future, there are big divisions in
that party about what, what, what

238
00:09:49,942 --> 00:09:51,412
they should do in terms of policy.

239
00:09:51,592 --> 00:09:53,992
But at the moment it's a,
it's a non policy party.

240
00:09:54,742 --> 00:09:56,512
Adam: So basically he's just
holding things together with

241
00:09:56,512 --> 00:09:57,562
the force of his personality.

242
00:09:57,772 --> 00:09:58,492
Helen: The shit like sort of

243
00:09:58,882 --> 00:10:00,382
Adam: Tito in Yugoslavia or something.

244
00:10:00,382 --> 00:10:01,612
It's all gonna fall apart after him.

245
00:10:01,702 --> 00:10:02,392
Helen: Exactly.

246
00:10:02,602 --> 00:10:02,972
Adam: Right.

247
00:10:05,315 --> 00:10:07,655
Andy: Well look, we should, we
should turn from, from Trump and

248
00:10:07,655 --> 00:10:09,780
the Republicans to the uk, uh, from.

249
00:10:10,760 --> 00:10:17,120
From Trump and you know, a party which has
no obvious heir, apparent, uh, to labor.

250
00:10:20,180 --> 00:10:22,910
Ian: I think it's very,
very unfair on Andy Burnham

251
00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:29,090
whose performance at the Labor
conference was quite extraordinary

252
00:10:29,090 --> 00:10:30,980
in terms of incompetence.

253
00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:32,450
And if that's a bid to lead.

254
00:10:32,510 --> 00:10:33,890
I was impressed.

255
00:10:34,970 --> 00:10:37,490
Adam: The thing is, he didn't, he
managed not to pose with a banana, which

256
00:10:37,490 --> 00:10:39,320
was David Milliman's big, big mistake.

257
00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:40,040
Do you remember that one?

258
00:10:40,100 --> 00:10:40,310
Yeah.

259
00:10:40,610 --> 00:10:41,540
But he's weird with labor.

260
00:10:41,540 --> 00:10:44,690
How you get these, he parents who just
turn up and get talked up from about

261
00:10:44,690 --> 00:10:47,450
three weeks always as the, as the
great big thing that's gonna take over.

262
00:10:47,450 --> 00:10:50,060
And then it just sort of fades
away awfully, doesn't it?

263
00:10:50,270 --> 00:10:53,030
Helen: I'm gonna say something really
cruel about Andy Burnham, but I had

264
00:10:53,030 --> 00:10:56,510
to live through a previous Labor Party
conference where he turned up going, well,

265
00:10:56,510 --> 00:10:57,770
if you don't want care you can have me.

266
00:10:57,950 --> 00:10:58,340
But that.

267
00:10:58,895 --> 00:11:01,295
He didn't beat Jeremy Corbin in 2015.

268
00:11:01,925 --> 00:11:02,135
Right?

269
00:11:02,165 --> 00:11:05,285
He had all of the advantages
of being this, you know, the

270
00:11:05,285 --> 00:11:09,215
establishment center, mainstream,
sensible candidate, and guess what?

271
00:11:09,215 --> 00:11:11,705
He couldn't connect with people
in the way that Jeremy Corbin

272
00:11:11,705 --> 00:11:13,385
did, and he didn't win then.

273
00:11:13,385 --> 00:11:16,085
And now he's on his third go
round at having a crack at it.

274
00:11:16,385 --> 00:11:18,035
I just, at some point.

275
00:11:18,785 --> 00:11:20,795
Adam: He could, he could throw
his hat into the ring to lead,

276
00:11:20,795 --> 00:11:23,705
um, Jeremy and Saltan and, and
Sarai salt's party, couldn't he?

277
00:11:23,705 --> 00:11:25,445
I mean, they're not, they're not
doing a great job of it themselves.

278
00:11:25,925 --> 00:11:27,095
The third co-leader.

279
00:11:27,275 --> 00:11:27,665
Great.

280
00:11:27,935 --> 00:11:30,275
Andy: Um, but I, I suppose the
question I wanted to ask all three

281
00:11:30,275 --> 00:11:34,445
of you is really how did things get
this bad, this fast, uh, for labor?

282
00:11:34,505 --> 00:11:36,425
Because the, the, the levels of.

283
00:11:36,515 --> 00:11:40,145
Unpopularity across the country
are, are, they are extraordinary.

284
00:11:40,145 --> 00:11:43,955
And it, it, it's, it's quite a remarkable
set of figures when you look at it.

285
00:11:44,075 --> 00:11:46,625
And the really interesting thing is
something, something has changed.

286
00:11:46,625 --> 00:11:50,975
So if you look, uh, at every
election since 1983 and what

287
00:11:50,975 --> 00:11:54,455
happened afterwards to the, the
popularity of the relative parties.

288
00:11:55,205 --> 00:11:59,045
Every time, um, the governing
party loses popularity.

289
00:11:59,050 --> 00:12:01,535
Their, their popularity slides a
few points down the scale, or, you

290
00:12:01,535 --> 00:12:05,225
know, five or 10 and the, the Chief
opposition party rises up the scale.

291
00:12:05,375 --> 00:12:10,955
This is the first time since, since all
those records, uh, since 1983, where both

292
00:12:11,015 --> 00:12:15,395
labor and the conservatives have suffered
a drop in popularity since the election.

293
00:12:15,395 --> 00:12:18,755
Now that's obviously because of the rise
of reform, but it is quite striking to

294
00:12:18,755 --> 00:12:20,765
see, and LA and Labor slide has been.

295
00:12:21,335 --> 00:12:23,075
Really precipitous since then.

296
00:12:23,538 --> 00:12:25,638
how has it got so bad so quickly for them?

297
00:12:26,748 --> 00:12:29,418
Ian: Uh, well, I think
it's, it's disappointment.

298
00:12:29,929 --> 00:12:33,019
whereas often someone says, you know,
there's a new conservative leader, and

299
00:12:33,019 --> 00:12:36,546
you go, oh, well, But with Stawa, people
thought this was going to be different.

300
00:12:36,546 --> 00:12:39,876
And obviously if you come in with
a, you know, huge majority, there

301
00:12:39,876 --> 00:12:45,066
is a big burden of expectation, um,
particularly after, you know, a long

302
00:12:45,066 --> 00:12:49,056
period of rule by the opposition
and they disappointed really fast.

303
00:12:49,326 --> 00:12:52,866
Adam: But the really odd thing this
is, isn't it, they came in saying,

304
00:12:52,866 --> 00:12:53,886
everything's gonna be rubbish.

305
00:12:53,886 --> 00:12:56,436
It wasn't like they were promising, kind
of like a golden unicorn for everyone.

306
00:12:56,436 --> 00:12:58,386
They basically said The
country's in a really bad state.

307
00:12:58,716 --> 00:12:59,736
It's gonna be pretty disastrous.

308
00:12:59,736 --> 00:13:00,936
We're gonna have to
really, really rescue it.

309
00:13:00,966 --> 00:13:01,861
You're in for a really bumpy ride.

310
00:13:02,186 --> 00:13:04,076
Still managed to
disappoint even after that.

311
00:13:05,366 --> 00:13:10,346
Ian: Um, and I, I think, you know, a lot
of people, a lot of eye readers were,

312
00:13:10,436 --> 00:13:13,496
were limbing up to say, ugh, typical.

313
00:13:13,496 --> 00:13:15,476
You know what, you're having
a go at the labor government.

314
00:13:15,476 --> 00:13:16,791
Are you, what do you want the Tories back?

315
00:13:17,676 --> 00:13:20,196
Which is what people usually
say when there's change of

316
00:13:20,196 --> 00:13:21,186
government, of private eye.

317
00:13:21,396 --> 00:13:25,386
This time they just said bloody labor,
and he thought then he got in yesterday.

318
00:13:26,046 --> 00:13:29,706
Um, the speed of it was incredible,
but it was, I mean, it was the

319
00:13:29,706 --> 00:13:34,656
suits and the glasses and the
immediate, um, freebies, which was

320
00:13:34,656 --> 00:13:36,696
sort of absolutely extraordinary.

321
00:13:36,696 --> 00:13:40,806
I mean, if, if you've come in on a
wave of people being disillusioned

322
00:13:40,806 --> 00:13:42,486
and disappointed on, you know.

323
00:13:43,101 --> 00:13:48,801
Um, PPE equipment, any number of,
um, sort of, uh, sleaze stories.

324
00:13:48,951 --> 00:13:52,761
Then the first thing you do, literally
the first thing you do is give an

325
00:13:52,761 --> 00:13:58,791
enormous gift wrapped cake, um, to the
opposition and to the, um, uh, Tory

326
00:13:58,791 --> 00:14:01,701
papers to say, you are just as bad.

327
00:14:02,151 --> 00:14:04,101
And even if you aren't just as bad.

328
00:14:04,131 --> 00:14:06,561
'cause the, the amounts
were never quite the same.

329
00:14:06,891 --> 00:14:09,591
You know, we haven't got the
Baroness moan figure yet.

330
00:14:09,901 --> 00:14:13,591
But I do, we certainly haven't got
the money and we're never gonna, yeah.

331
00:14:14,131 --> 00:14:14,701
Um.

332
00:14:15,196 --> 00:14:16,606
But I think that that was amazing.

333
00:14:16,606 --> 00:14:20,626
And then you went, I mean, we know this,
you, you went straight into winter Fuel,

334
00:14:20,776 --> 00:14:26,224
so doing exactly what the opposition,
um, did, which you criticized, and then

335
00:14:26,224 --> 00:14:30,094
choosing as a flagship policy, something
that's going to make you unpopular.

336
00:14:30,094 --> 00:14:31,744
These, these are not forgiven easily.

337
00:14:32,594 --> 00:14:34,784
Helen: I mean, I've got a very
simple explanation of this.

338
00:14:34,784 --> 00:14:38,174
So Tony Blair likes to quote Lee Quaye
y, who's the leader of Singapore,

339
00:14:38,354 --> 00:14:41,414
saying basically, if you've got 2%
economic growth, everyone's happy.

340
00:14:41,414 --> 00:14:43,364
If it's under 2%, everyone's unhappy.

341
00:14:43,724 --> 00:14:47,444
And we have had, since the financial
crisis, basically stagnant wages,

342
00:14:47,504 --> 00:14:47,654
Crowd: right?

343
00:14:47,804 --> 00:14:50,624
Helen: At the same time, we've had an
aging population, which means we just

344
00:14:50,714 --> 00:14:54,614
to even stand still in terms of both
NHS provision and pension provision,

345
00:14:54,734 --> 00:14:56,174
just had to find more and more money.

346
00:14:56,594 --> 00:14:57,464
Out of taxes.

347
00:14:57,614 --> 00:15:00,974
And so I think people just
feel like things are a grind.

348
00:15:01,034 --> 00:15:03,644
They don't feel like things
are on the, the upswing.

349
00:15:03,794 --> 00:15:03,974
Crowd: Yeah.

350
00:15:04,154 --> 00:15:07,454
Helen: Um, and I, and I don't know if
it's, it's a lot more complicated than

351
00:15:07,454 --> 00:15:10,574
that in that labor came in saying we
are gonna get economic growth going.

352
00:15:10,574 --> 00:15:12,494
And people don't feel that.

353
00:15:12,779 --> 00:15:13,199
Yet.

354
00:15:13,559 --> 00:15:16,739
Adam: I think that's true because I
mean, when Blair came in in 1997, it,

355
00:15:16,769 --> 00:15:19,679
there was a feeling and they had more
of a feeling of purpose and mission

356
00:15:19,679 --> 00:15:20,699
than this government have ever had.

357
00:15:21,029 --> 00:15:23,519
But also there was a sort of
upswing in the mood of the country,

358
00:15:23,519 --> 00:15:26,129
which I think was largely down to
economic things, that the economy

359
00:15:26,129 --> 00:15:27,149
was kind of improving at that point.

360
00:15:27,149 --> 00:15:29,189
And I remember at that point,
John Major and a lot of people

361
00:15:29,189 --> 00:15:30,839
from his administration saying,
well, actually it was us.

362
00:15:30,874 --> 00:15:32,644
That did that, we kind of
built it, it was like, yeah.

363
00:15:32,644 --> 00:15:35,734
But you did do that after crashing it in
black Wednesday beforehand, didn't you?

364
00:15:35,734 --> 00:15:37,264
I mean, you did go dang to go up again.

365
00:15:37,354 --> 00:15:37,564
Yeah.

366
00:15:37,564 --> 00:15:40,594
But, um, it, it's a real benefit from,
you know, if you are the person that

367
00:15:40,594 --> 00:15:43,504
happens to be standing when the, when
the economy goes into an upswing,

368
00:15:43,954 --> 00:15:45,364
uh, you can take the credit for it.

369
00:15:45,544 --> 00:15:48,034
Helen: The sympathetic view is
that there's a terrible hangover.

370
00:15:48,129 --> 00:15:51,999
From austerity having basically
hollowed out public services.

371
00:15:51,999 --> 00:15:55,059
So they need a huge level of investment,
like upfront capital investment.

372
00:15:55,359 --> 00:15:59,169
There's a hangover from the so-called
Boris wave of immigration in which Boris

373
00:15:59,169 --> 00:16:03,189
Johnson, with his typical attention to
detail just had no idea what was going on.

374
00:16:03,324 --> 00:16:07,014
There's the fact that, um, you know, after
Brexit, the, the goalpost immediately

375
00:16:07,014 --> 00:16:10,374
then moved to the convention on human
rights, and that small boats have really

376
00:16:10,374 --> 00:16:12,084
not been solved as a, as a problem.

377
00:16:12,979 --> 00:16:16,129
And the fact that if you are
under 45, you're paying half of

378
00:16:16,129 --> 00:16:18,259
your wages out in rent like lots.

379
00:16:18,259 --> 00:16:21,109
That's the situation lots of people
are in, and lots of people are in

380
00:16:21,109 --> 00:16:24,139
that situation, not just in London
and the Southeast, but, but elsewhere

381
00:16:24,139 --> 00:16:27,769
of thinking, will I be able to have
the kind of life that my parents had?

382
00:16:28,369 --> 00:16:31,069
Um, you know, that and, and, and all
of that is the kind of everything,

383
00:16:31,069 --> 00:16:34,309
basically British politics just went
wrong at the financial crisis and it's

384
00:16:34,309 --> 00:16:36,169
never quite dug itself out of that hole.

385
00:16:36,724 --> 00:16:38,254
Andy: I hope you're all
feeling cheerful about this.

386
00:16:38,254 --> 00:16:38,314
Yeah.

387
00:16:38,524 --> 00:16:41,134
Um, but this, it, it's really
interesting because what,

388
00:16:41,164 --> 00:16:42,634
what you're saying is kind of.

389
00:16:43,249 --> 00:16:47,329
That this is not specifically a labor
thing, it's that labor, you know,

390
00:16:47,359 --> 00:16:49,489
made some promises about reform.

391
00:16:49,819 --> 00:16:54,439
Lowercase, uh, are, um, in the hope of
getting elected, got elected things.

392
00:16:54,589 --> 00:16:58,639
They have not been able to restart
2%, 3% economic growth a year.

393
00:16:59,179 --> 00:17:02,809
Is this just not going to be
a, an easily governed country?

394
00:17:02,839 --> 00:17:05,209
Because we will keep on electing people
who promise they'll change things.

395
00:17:05,419 --> 00:17:08,959
I, you know, I suspect reform
uppercase are, uh, don't have.

396
00:17:09,259 --> 00:17:12,679
The answers to solve all of these
like deep structural problems.

397
00:17:13,099 --> 00:17:13,259
Do you think?

398
00:17:13,259 --> 00:17:13,279
Not Andy.

399
00:17:13,279 --> 00:17:14,209
No, I, I'm sorry.

400
00:17:14,209 --> 00:17:17,744
I'm, you know, I'm, I know I'm, I'm
a bit edgy on this podcast, but like,

401
00:17:18,464 --> 00:17:22,729
Ian: I, no, I like the idea that, that,
that, um, they changed their mind on tax.

402
00:17:23,404 --> 00:17:26,224
Immediately, I mean, even
before they've got it, usually

403
00:17:26,224 --> 00:17:27,394
people wait a bit for a uturn.

404
00:17:27,694 --> 00:17:31,909
But, I mean he has years to promise that
he's gonna have massive tax cuts and then

405
00:17:31,909 --> 00:17:33,679
he said, oh, well maybe we won't now.

406
00:17:33,799 --> 00:17:34,159
Andy: Right?

407
00:17:34,219 --> 00:17:36,349
But aren't we just becoming less
governable as a country because

408
00:17:36,379 --> 00:17:38,899
we've got deep seater problems
that there is an easy fix for.

409
00:17:39,218 --> 00:17:43,238
Ian: but you could say we're gonna try
and fix them rather than say, what can I

410
00:17:43,238 --> 00:17:45,158
think of that everyone will really hate?

411
00:17:46,868 --> 00:17:47,513
Um, and it.

412
00:17:47,551 --> 00:17:49,021
The collapse in Popularities.

413
00:17:49,261 --> 00:17:53,491
I mean, other governments have come in and
economically have not done very well, but

414
00:17:53,491 --> 00:17:55,201
they don't have these figures, do they?

415
00:17:55,737 --> 00:17:57,747
Adam: They have made some
weird decisions along the way.

416
00:17:57,747 --> 00:17:59,007
I mean, as you say, the winter fuel thing.

417
00:17:59,007 --> 00:18:03,207
I mean that and then trying to revise Pit
Bennet, I mean, to come in and go, right.

418
00:18:03,447 --> 00:18:06,177
Who can we unite the country by
Really going after old people.

419
00:18:06,207 --> 00:18:06,807
Everyone hates them.

420
00:18:06,807 --> 00:18:07,137
I tell you.

421
00:18:07,137 --> 00:18:08,397
Ask the disabled as well.

422
00:18:08,397 --> 00:18:09,447
We, we'll target them as well.

423
00:18:09,447 --> 00:18:10,557
That will that That'll work.

424
00:18:10,737 --> 00:18:11,007
Yeah.

425
00:18:11,378 --> 00:18:14,078
Helen: I think if you look at the
fact that the, the, this is gonna

426
00:18:14,078 --> 00:18:16,268
be a deeply unpopular thing to say
in any room, but check the edge

427
00:18:16,268 --> 00:18:17,108
Adam: of the audience quickly.

428
00:18:17,108 --> 00:18:17,918
Yeah, I know, right?

429
00:18:18,578 --> 00:18:19,928
Helen: Fellow under 60 brethren.

430
00:18:20,078 --> 00:18:23,708
But I, I do think that actually that
the triple lock is, is unsustainable.

431
00:18:23,708 --> 00:18:24,998
And I'm just, I'm sorry.

432
00:18:25,058 --> 00:18:28,238
Uh, you know, working at, I'm
sorry, but I think, oh, there we

433
00:18:28,243 --> 00:18:28,253
Ian: go.

434
00:18:29,153 --> 00:18:31,538
Helen: And actually, I, I don't
have any problem with means testing

435
00:18:31,538 --> 00:18:32,708
the winter fuel allowance either.

436
00:18:32,708 --> 00:18:34,268
And the other problem is
that realistically, when

437
00:18:34,268 --> 00:18:35,048
you're talking about house.

438
00:18:35,138 --> 00:18:38,948
Building and, and housing costs,
that is also an age related issue.

439
00:18:39,248 --> 00:18:42,488
And it was the one thing that I hoped
would readjust the balance under labor.

440
00:18:42,488 --> 00:18:45,848
You know, the Tories were very much, their
core vote was over 65 and they wanted to

441
00:18:45,848 --> 00:18:49,628
protect pension incomes and protect, um,
the green belt and all that kind of stuff.

442
00:18:49,628 --> 00:18:50,798
And I thought, well, at
least labor will come in.

443
00:18:50,798 --> 00:18:50,898
And thus.

444
00:18:51,053 --> 00:18:55,523
Slightly rebalance it towards working
age people, but um, as you say, winter,

445
00:18:55,528 --> 00:18:59,453
they, they ham fisted winter fuel so
badly in the middle of something else.

446
00:18:59,453 --> 00:19:02,603
I think they're just totally
terrified of revisiting any of that.

447
00:19:02,638 --> 00:19:02,858
Yes.

448
00:19:02,873 --> 00:19:03,218
And the,

449
00:19:03,233 --> 00:19:04,403
Ian: the excuse is always offered.

450
00:19:04,403 --> 00:19:09,503
I mean, it was on that and on the
inheritance tax that, um, somehow the,

451
00:19:09,563 --> 00:19:12,563
um, comms team had failed to communicate.

452
00:19:12,998 --> 00:19:16,538
What was actually happening and you
know, I, I shouldn't have to, you

453
00:19:16,538 --> 00:19:19,328
know, um, accept winter fuel allowance.

454
00:19:19,328 --> 00:19:21,338
I mean, you know, this very old person.

455
00:19:21,608 --> 00:19:24,308
Um, I think I should get cold.

456
00:19:24,548 --> 00:19:26,048
Um, you should burn copies

457
00:19:26,048 --> 00:19:27,638
Helen: of the private iann from,

458
00:19:28,628 --> 00:19:29,438
Ian: well, you never know.

459
00:19:29,438 --> 00:19:30,548
See how sales are.

460
00:19:30,968 --> 00:19:31,418
Um.

461
00:19:32,528 --> 00:19:36,728
But none of that, um, was explained
and the means testing wasn't explained.

462
00:19:36,728 --> 00:19:39,578
And the, and the benefit
reform was not explained.

463
00:19:39,668 --> 00:19:42,608
And everyone says, well, it's,
it's not, it's not the government's

464
00:19:42,608 --> 00:19:43,868
fault, it's their advisors.

465
00:19:43,868 --> 00:19:44,768
It's their PR people.

466
00:19:44,768 --> 00:19:48,638
And in the end, you have to stop
making excuses for PR people and

467
00:19:48,638 --> 00:19:51,098
advisors and senior figures and all
these people and just say, well,

468
00:19:51,128 --> 00:19:53,888
maybe the leadership is a bit useless.

469
00:19:54,158 --> 00:19:54,248
Yeah.

470
00:19:54,248 --> 00:19:56,303
Um, and they need to, um.

471
00:19:57,038 --> 00:20:00,158
Explain policies, give people a
vision, give people a narrative, give

472
00:20:00,158 --> 00:20:04,628
people a reason to vote for them,
and those are not negligible skills.

473
00:20:04,838 --> 00:20:06,818
Andy: Yeah, I mean, Stan does
have an identity, you know,

474
00:20:06,848 --> 00:20:08,018
he is a human rights lawyer.

475
00:20:08,423 --> 00:20:10,223
Like he's, he's, he's a football fan.

476
00:20:10,223 --> 00:20:13,943
I dunno if you know what his dad did
for a living, but he comes from a

477
00:20:13,943 --> 00:20:15,413
relatively underprivileged background.

478
00:20:15,413 --> 00:20:17,963
He certainly wasn't sent to
Dulwich College like Nigel Farage.

479
00:20:17,963 --> 00:20:20,273
You know, there is, there is a
story there, but it's one that

480
00:20:20,273 --> 00:20:23,063
he's, he's always been slightly
resistant and reluctant to tell.

481
00:20:23,123 --> 00:20:23,423
Yeah.

482
00:20:23,483 --> 00:20:25,793
Um, did something amazingly
funny happen in the subtitles?

483
00:20:26,303 --> 00:20:26,543
Right.

484
00:20:26,543 --> 00:20:27,443
All right.

485
00:20:27,563 --> 00:20:30,263
We have a. I thought it
got more than it deserved.

486
00:20:30,323 --> 00:20:30,623
Um,

487
00:20:32,513 --> 00:20:34,763
Adam: but like someone could just
clip that and send it into, we have a

488
00:20:34,763 --> 00:20:36,173
funny cuttings thing and get a tenor.

489
00:20:36,173 --> 00:20:36,653
So, uh,

490
00:20:36,983 --> 00:20:39,083
Andy: but you know, Starr hasn't
made a load of money flogging

491
00:20:39,083 --> 00:20:40,883
gold services like Nigel Farage.

492
00:20:40,883 --> 00:20:44,873
I mean, there there is a, there is a
story that is, that he is able to tell

493
00:20:44,873 --> 00:20:47,123
but is seeming resistant to doing so.

494
00:20:47,273 --> 00:20:51,353
I do think also they are operating in
an extremely hostile media environment,

495
00:20:51,353 --> 00:20:54,383
which, which, you know, is new.

496
00:20:54,593 --> 00:20:57,563
No, I mean, well, sorry it's not
new for stama or for labor, but

497
00:20:57,563 --> 00:20:58,763
it is, you know, it's nuisance.

498
00:20:58,763 --> 00:20:59,333
The election.

499
00:20:59,603 --> 00:21:00,023
Ian: Yeah.

500
00:21:00,233 --> 00:21:02,633
Andy: I mean the rear guard action
fought by the telegraph, the mail,

501
00:21:02,633 --> 00:21:04,673
the express was, was extraordinary.

502
00:21:04,798 --> 00:21:06,988
Helen: Adam, you write about it a
lot and in street of shame, right,

503
00:21:06,988 --> 00:21:10,438
that there is a, there is a phx there
that the left has never quite been

504
00:21:10,438 --> 00:21:11,908
able to recreate in media terms.

505
00:21:11,908 --> 00:21:12,118
Well, what

506
00:21:12,118 --> 00:21:14,548
Adam: I'm really enjoying at the
moment is the bizarre alliances

507
00:21:14,548 --> 00:21:16,823
that are going on, particularly,
you know, this, this story endless.

508
00:21:17,613 --> 00:21:21,123
Really, really targeting Morgan
McSweeney, uh, of off the back of

509
00:21:21,123 --> 00:21:22,803
this book, the Fraud by Paul Holden.

510
00:21:23,163 --> 00:21:27,453
Um, and it's been pushed largely by the
male and the Telegraph, but Paul Holden

511
00:21:27,453 --> 00:21:29,553
is, is about as Corbe Knight as they come.

512
00:21:29,613 --> 00:21:32,343
You know, he's, he, he works with
Andrew Feinstein, who was the guy that

513
00:21:32,343 --> 00:21:34,263
stood against K Dharma in Hogan and St.

514
00:21:34,263 --> 00:21:34,863
Pancreas.

515
00:21:35,103 --> 00:21:38,883
I mean, this really is amazing case of
my, your enemy's enemy is your friend.

516
00:21:39,363 --> 00:21:42,273
These are, these are sort of, not,
not natural bedfellows are they,

517
00:21:42,273 --> 00:21:45,243
but they're, they're coming at
it from, from both, both sides.

518
00:21:45,925 --> 00:21:49,585
. Does anyone under fully understand
the Jonathan Powell and China story?

519
00:21:49,735 --> 00:21:50,305
Helen: No.

520
00:21:50,845 --> 00:21:53,515
Adam: Have we got anyone
in from GCHQ tonight?

521
00:21:55,135 --> 00:21:55,525
That's good.

522
00:21:55,525 --> 00:21:56,305
No one put their hands up.

523
00:21:56,305 --> 00:21:57,025
You would've been sacked.

524
00:21:57,030 --> 00:21:57,200
Yeah.

525
00:21:57,205 --> 00:21:57,215
Yeah.

526
00:21:58,495 --> 00:22:01,495
I'm a bit lost in the D, but again,
this seems like, I mean, of all

527
00:22:01,495 --> 00:22:04,585
the things I'm not think of advice
to Kenny Bain off, but if you're

528
00:22:04,585 --> 00:22:06,895
gonna target starer on one thing.

529
00:22:07,305 --> 00:22:11,985
I would say that he's probably
quite hot on the proper process

530
00:22:12,165 --> 00:22:15,195
of criminal prosecutions,
just as an ex-head of the CPS.

531
00:22:15,195 --> 00:22:17,445
Yeah, that's probably something
he kind of knows the details on.

532
00:22:17,805 --> 00:22:18,135
Helen: Yeah.

533
00:22:18,448 --> 00:22:18,748
Adam: and he's

534
00:22:18,748 --> 00:22:19,768
Ian: not very convincing on it.

535
00:22:20,478 --> 00:22:21,618
Adam: He's really convincing on anything.

536
00:22:21,828 --> 00:22:23,483
That's kind of what we've been
talking about the last 10 minutes.

537
00:22:23,483 --> 00:22:23,808
Isn't he genuine?

538
00:22:23,808 --> 00:22:26,508
Helen: I mean, genuinely, genuinely
loves Arsenal, and if you get him

539
00:22:26,508 --> 00:22:29,868
to talk to about it, he'd just be
like, yeah, I, I really like Arsenal.

540
00:22:29,868 --> 00:22:30,708
It's really great too.

541
00:22:30,858 --> 00:22:34,128
IJ he just cannot convey
even emotion that, you know,

542
00:22:34,128 --> 00:22:35,418
behind the scenes is genuine.

543
00:22:35,828 --> 00:22:38,498
Ian: But you, you people want
to believe that, you know,

544
00:22:38,498 --> 00:22:39,758
Kirstan was absolutely straight.

545
00:22:39,758 --> 00:22:42,848
And, um, you know, his experience
as a lawyer means he really does

546
00:22:42,848 --> 00:22:44,378
understand the law and support the law.

547
00:22:44,588 --> 00:22:47,708
And then we end up in a situation
with this prosecution where the

548
00:22:47,708 --> 00:22:51,908
Deputy National Security Advisor
is somehow seriously to blame.

549
00:22:52,058 --> 00:22:55,628
But the actual national security
advisor, Jonathan Powell, had no idea.

550
00:22:55,718 --> 00:22:57,548
Oh, goodness knows.

551
00:22:57,548 --> 00:22:59,348
I mean, he's not there to
supervise his de, you know,

552
00:22:59,348 --> 00:23:00,398
his deputy for goodness sake.

553
00:23:00,608 --> 00:23:04,778
Um, and you think, well, why doesn't he
know he's the National Security Advisor?

554
00:23:05,123 --> 00:23:07,408
Presumably what we think of China is.

555
00:23:08,048 --> 00:23:09,248
It's his business.

556
00:23:09,458 --> 00:23:13,328
I mean, he's obviously, he's, he's
not elected, um, and he's been

557
00:23:13,328 --> 00:23:15,488
appointed, but that is still his job.

558
00:23:15,608 --> 00:23:17,738
Helen: But it's all built
on this giant lie, isn't it?

559
00:23:17,738 --> 00:23:20,228
Which is the fact that actually lots
of people, if you talk to people in

560
00:23:20,228 --> 00:23:23,348
Whitehall and civil service, they
do regard China as a huge threat.

561
00:23:23,348 --> 00:23:24,693
They know it's always trying to hack us.

562
00:23:25,268 --> 00:23:28,028
They know it's always trying to
send suspiciously attractive ladies

563
00:23:28,028 --> 00:23:29,408
to lib down party conference.

564
00:23:31,273 --> 00:23:32,558
I genuinely think that happened.

565
00:23:32,918 --> 00:23:34,328
Um, you know, but

566
00:23:34,328 --> 00:23:35,348
Ian: okay, they're not that good.

567
00:23:35,348 --> 00:23:36,488
It was the lib down conference.

568
00:23:36,488 --> 00:23:37,028
Yeah.

569
00:23:37,718 --> 00:23:38,828
Helen: Gotta spread Jeanette wide.

570
00:23:39,128 --> 00:23:43,418
Um, but at the same time, they also know
that we are immensely are supply chain.

571
00:23:44,658 --> 00:23:45,528
Andy: Uh, did come up as

572
00:23:46,903 --> 00:23:47,743
Helen: Jeanette Wide.

573
00:23:47,903 --> 00:23:48,463
Andy: Jeanette,

574
00:23:48,768 --> 00:23:50,928
Helen: that is the name of
one of the Chinese spies.

575
00:23:50,928 --> 00:23:51,048
Who?

576
00:23:52,938 --> 00:23:52,998
Yeah.

577
00:23:53,028 --> 00:23:53,358
Come on

578
00:23:53,358 --> 00:23:53,658
Andy: guys.

579
00:23:53,658 --> 00:23:54,408
There's not, I'm sorry.

580
00:23:54,408 --> 00:23:55,128
I haven't a clue.

581
00:23:55,488 --> 00:23:55,818
Um,

582
00:23:57,708 --> 00:24:00,348
Helen: anyway, but that's the
fundamental hypocrisy is that everybody

583
00:24:00,348 --> 00:24:04,428
acknowledges that China is trying
to do, not a hot war against us, but

584
00:24:04,518 --> 00:24:06,378
certainly hostile actions against.

585
00:24:06,618 --> 00:24:09,978
British business is the British state,
but at the same time, we really need

586
00:24:09,978 --> 00:24:12,978
them and we'd quite like them, you know,
to be on good trade terms with 'em.

587
00:24:12,978 --> 00:24:16,968
So we have to very delicately walk
that tightrope and that to me is in

588
00:24:16,968 --> 00:24:20,058
all the back and forth, just exposing
the fact that the government can't

589
00:24:20,058 --> 00:24:22,068
maintain a consistent position on China.

590
00:24:22,338 --> 00:24:24,528
'cause it's like, please
don't make us be mean to them.

591
00:24:24,768 --> 00:24:25,248
We like iPhones.

592
00:24:26,898 --> 00:24:28,788
Adam: The other thing that's really
struck me about that case is kind of how

593
00:24:28,788 --> 00:24:31,263
low rent the stuff they must have been
getting was because it was like awful.

594
00:24:32,093 --> 00:24:35,783
Now we are going to infiltrate Tom
Togan hat's office and see what Tommy

595
00:24:35,783 --> 00:24:37,823
Tugs is really thinking about and one

596
00:24:37,823 --> 00:24:37,973
Helen: of the

597
00:24:37,973 --> 00:24:38,783
Adam: misinformation that we're trying

598
00:24:38,783 --> 00:24:39,113
Helen: to extract.

599
00:24:39,233 --> 00:24:40,133
Sorry, can I just pause there?

600
00:24:40,133 --> 00:24:43,253
Because every time you've been trying to
get the nickname Tommy Tugs to happen,

601
00:24:44,213 --> 00:24:44,543
Adam: I'm going to

602
00:24:44,543 --> 00:24:46,883
Helen: get it there and every
time has been ruthlessly cut

603
00:24:46,883 --> 00:24:49,313
out, but I admire your commitment

604
00:24:49,883 --> 00:24:50,723
Adam: every fortnight.

605
00:24:51,113 --> 00:24:53,183
No, but one of the pieces of information
they were apparently trying to pick

606
00:24:53,183 --> 00:24:56,813
up from these, these, these two
guys was um, whether Jeremy Hunt

607
00:24:56,843 --> 00:24:59,633
was going to go all the way in the
conservative leadership contest.

608
00:24:59,813 --> 00:25:01,463
You think just read a newspaper?

609
00:25:01,613 --> 00:25:01,853
I mean,

610
00:25:01,853 --> 00:25:03,383
Helen: there's pages and pages about this.

611
00:25:04,343 --> 00:25:04,523
Yes.

612
00:25:04,523 --> 00:25:06,683
Why not pick up a
fortnightly News magazine?

613
00:25:06,683 --> 00:25:07,673
It's not James Bond

614
00:25:07,673 --> 00:25:08,063
Adam: versus

615
00:25:08,063 --> 00:25:08,993
Andy: Blofeld, is it?

616
00:25:09,983 --> 00:25:10,343
No.

617
00:25:10,673 --> 00:25:13,703
So are we, are we just doomed to
keep on electing people, being

618
00:25:13,703 --> 00:25:17,753
disappointed and then electing more
disruptive actors, if I can put it

619
00:25:17,753 --> 00:25:18,173
Adam: that way?

620
00:25:19,103 --> 00:25:21,653
Basically you're saying, is Nigel
gonna win the next election, aren't you

621
00:25:21,713 --> 00:25:22,043
Ian: Sure?

622
00:25:22,193 --> 00:25:22,463
Adam: Yeah.

623
00:25:23,033 --> 00:25:24,713
Ian: And would he
disappoint, do you think?

624
00:25:25,163 --> 00:25:25,373
Adam: No.

625
00:25:25,373 --> 00:25:25,523
I mean,

626
00:25:27,053 --> 00:25:30,503
Ian: do you think the depth
of talent in the reform party

627
00:25:31,408 --> 00:25:32,288
would, would, would maybe.

628
00:25:33,073 --> 00:25:34,933
Put on a better performance.

629
00:25:35,173 --> 00:25:37,243
I mean, local councils, it's going well.

630
00:25:37,873 --> 00:25:38,173
Yeah.

631
00:25:38,178 --> 00:25:40,963
I mean, you've, I mean, nearly,
well, some of them haven't resigned,

632
00:25:42,253 --> 00:25:45,313
Andy: but you've had to, you've had
to basically hive off a separate bit

633
00:25:45,313 --> 00:25:49,453
of the rotten Boroughs page solely for
the amazing performances that Reform

634
00:25:49,453 --> 00:25:50,713
councilors have been turning in.

635
00:25:50,983 --> 00:25:51,313
Ian: Yes.

636
00:25:51,343 --> 00:25:54,673
And um, you know, a lot of people
say, well, if you give them more

637
00:25:54,673 --> 00:25:56,713
publicity, they'll do even better.

638
00:25:56,893 --> 00:25:58,273
Um, and I say, well, but.

639
00:25:58,690 --> 00:26:02,553
Am I not meant to cover the fact
that, um, when confronted by, what's

640
00:26:02,553 --> 00:26:06,483
your policy on special needs and
potholes, it's Stop the boats.

641
00:26:07,893 --> 00:26:12,543
Um, which again, you can sort of make a
case, but eventually they've gotta run

642
00:26:12,543 --> 00:26:17,763
something and they've gotta run something
less badly than the previous lot.

643
00:26:18,104 --> 00:26:21,104
which again, I mean, I
think that will be the test.

644
00:26:21,224 --> 00:26:25,904
So are you saying if
people vote for reform.

645
00:26:26,399 --> 00:26:27,869
Will we be disappointed?

646
00:26:28,709 --> 00:26:29,969
My guess is yes.

647
00:26:32,422 --> 00:26:36,142
Andy: now we, we are at a literature
festival and private eye has

648
00:26:36,142 --> 00:26:38,572
a, a strong literary tradition.

649
00:26:39,262 --> 00:26:40,852
Dating all the way back to 1961.

650
00:26:40,852 --> 00:26:45,512
So I think, uh, it's time to hand over
for one of page 90 vols legendary quizzes.

651
00:26:45,932 --> 00:26:48,602
Uh, and Adam, you are going to be
running this one, I believe, the

652
00:26:48,602 --> 00:26:50,432
grand private eye literary quiz.

653
00:26:50,462 --> 00:26:51,392
Adam: Yes, indeed.

654
00:26:51,392 --> 00:26:51,452
So.

655
00:26:52,357 --> 00:26:56,617
Which poet Laureate began a
private eye column, which is

656
00:26:56,617 --> 00:26:58,597
still running to this day.

657
00:26:58,728 --> 00:27:02,328
Andy: I'll just have a wrong guest For a
bit of sport, I'll say Robert Sie in 1819.

658
00:27:02,328 --> 00:27:02,478
Very

659
00:27:02,478 --> 00:27:02,808
Helen: nice.

660
00:27:02,808 --> 00:27:03,288
Very nice.

661
00:27:03,318 --> 00:27:03,588
Andy: Yep.

662
00:27:04,203 --> 00:27:04,743
Dryden,

663
00:27:06,063 --> 00:27:07,143
Ian: uh, I remember him in the office.

664
00:27:08,648 --> 00:27:11,043
Um, that's not true.

665
00:27:11,043 --> 00:27:14,013
It was John Beman who started
the um, Pelosi column.

666
00:27:14,013 --> 00:27:15,933
Adam: Sorry, I'm just enjoying the fact
Kimmy Badden office was saying last week.

667
00:27:15,933 --> 00:27:16,593
Oh, English agrees.

668
00:27:16,593 --> 00:27:17,283
They're no use for anything.

669
00:27:17,283 --> 00:27:20,973
They are brilliant for showing off the
things you remember of 20 years later.

670
00:27:22,383 --> 00:27:24,123
It was John Beman, the
Nooks and Corners column.

671
00:27:24,123 --> 00:27:24,663
Yes, indeed.

672
00:27:24,783 --> 00:27:26,163
The architecture column,
which is still going.

673
00:27:26,613 --> 00:27:26,943
Ian: Yes.

674
00:27:26,943 --> 00:27:30,533
And he handed over to the very
brilliant Gavin Stamp, it's

675
00:27:30,533 --> 00:27:32,693
now run by, um, Jane McKenzie.

676
00:27:32,783 --> 00:27:33,143
Yes,

677
00:27:33,653 --> 00:27:33,983
Adam: indeed.

678
00:27:34,073 --> 00:27:37,748
Ian: And, it's almost a sort of
a cranny in the magazine itself.

679
00:27:37,799 --> 00:27:40,214
some people think it's the
best thing in, in the magazine.

680
00:27:40,214 --> 00:27:41,144
I absolutely love it.

681
00:27:41,174 --> 00:27:44,384
Some people say, oh, why
you always wanging on about

682
00:27:44,684 --> 00:27:46,214
buildings that are falling down?

683
00:27:46,455 --> 00:27:48,645
and the answer is because
it'd be nice if they didn't.

684
00:27:48,795 --> 00:27:52,155
Um, and also that they
weren't set on fire.

685
00:27:52,407 --> 00:27:52,972
uh, no, no, no.

686
00:27:52,977 --> 00:27:53,517
Go on fire.

687
00:27:53,757 --> 00:27:54,987
Go on the phrase Fire.

688
00:27:54,987 --> 00:27:55,317
Yes,

689
00:27:55,377 --> 00:27:56,787
Adam: strangely went on fire.

690
00:27:57,057 --> 00:27:57,207
My

691
00:27:57,207 --> 00:27:59,397
Helen: highly insured
pub has gone on fire.

692
00:28:01,827 --> 00:28:04,137
Andy: Yeah, that page is,
it's a funny mix of charming

693
00:28:04,137 --> 00:28:06,177
heritage and blatant Aon crook.

694
00:28:06,687 --> 00:28:09,687
Yeah, it's a really odd mix.

695
00:28:09,687 --> 00:28:10,377
Crooks and nooks.

696
00:28:10,427 --> 00:28:12,512
Helen: Look, the people from the
Crooked House Pub have, are they,

697
00:28:12,512 --> 00:28:14,897
aren't they gonna have to put that
back to the way it was before it went?

698
00:28:14,897 --> 00:28:15,467
Is very funny.

699
00:28:15,467 --> 00:28:15,827
Fire.

700
00:28:15,947 --> 00:28:16,607
Adam: Very, they have, yes.

701
00:28:16,607 --> 00:28:18,107
And there's also a pub in
London where they did that.

702
00:28:18,107 --> 00:28:20,537
They, they, they had to put it back
exactly with the 1920s frontage

703
00:28:20,537 --> 00:28:21,497
and all the tiling and everything.

704
00:28:21,707 --> 00:28:24,317
One of those victories for Jane
and the Nooks and Corners column.

705
00:28:24,767 --> 00:28:25,487
Absolutely right.

706
00:28:25,487 --> 00:28:26,867
Question number two from 19.

707
00:28:26,962 --> 00:28:30,202
77 to 1979, the eye carried very unlikely.

708
00:28:30,202 --> 00:28:33,712
This a gardening column written
on the pseudonym of Rose Blight.

709
00:28:33,712 --> 00:28:35,062
But who was the real author?

710
00:28:35,062 --> 00:28:36,802
Helen, I'm gonna throw
that one in your direction.

711
00:28:37,102 --> 00:28:37,672
Helen: I've got this.

712
00:28:38,062 --> 00:28:41,782
My brain is delivering like Julian
Barnes or someone like that.

713
00:28:41,842 --> 00:28:42,442
Ian: No, no.

714
00:28:44,457 --> 00:28:44,807
Noian.

715
00:28:45,602 --> 00:28:45,722
Oh, you

716
00:28:45,992 --> 00:28:48,842
Helen: think, uh, five James,
Jermaine Gr Jermaine Greer.

717
00:28:49,682 --> 00:28:49,982
J

718
00:28:49,982 --> 00:28:51,422
Adam: Jermaine Jermaine Greer Indeed.

719
00:28:51,422 --> 00:28:51,692
Yes.

720
00:28:51,692 --> 00:28:52,922
Seven years after the female Euch.

721
00:28:52,922 --> 00:28:53,672
That was what she was doing.

722
00:28:53,702 --> 00:28:56,942
Uh, the Revolting Garden, uh, it
was called, uh, she was recruited

723
00:28:56,942 --> 00:28:59,192
by Richard Ingrams after they
appeared on the news quiz together.

724
00:28:59,612 --> 00:29:01,472
Uh, and God, that was must,
must a big point that.

725
00:29:01,857 --> 00:29:04,917
She resigned after he wound
her up by, uh, threatening to

726
00:29:04,917 --> 00:29:06,477
turn it into a cooking column.

727
00:29:08,247 --> 00:29:08,967
Didn't go down so well.

728
00:29:08,967 --> 00:29:09,297
She's gone off.

729
00:29:09,297 --> 00:29:10,197
Did he basically go and make

730
00:29:10,197 --> 00:29:10,887
Helen: me a sandwich?

731
00:29:10,887 --> 00:29:11,607
Jermaine Greer?

732
00:29:11,607 --> 00:29:11,697
Yes.

733
00:29:11,847 --> 00:29:12,387
Pretty much

734
00:29:12,387 --> 00:29:12,807
Adam: that, yeah.

735
00:29:12,807 --> 00:29:13,977
I see where that trolling happened.

736
00:29:13,977 --> 00:29:14,037
Yeah.

737
00:29:14,037 --> 00:29:14,247
So she

738
00:29:14,247 --> 00:29:17,307
Andy: wrote, she wrote a
gardening sort of like gardening.

739
00:29:17,367 --> 00:29:18,327
What was the gardening element?

740
00:29:18,327 --> 00:29:18,687
It was called the

741
00:29:18,687 --> 00:29:19,527
Adam: Revolting Garden.

742
00:29:19,527 --> 00:29:22,047
I mean, basically it was, it was
saying, um, tear everything out of

743
00:29:22,047 --> 00:29:23,247
your garden and concrete over it.

744
00:29:23,247 --> 00:29:25,647
So it wasn't the traditional
gardening column.

745
00:29:25,767 --> 00:29:26,037
But she's

746
00:29:26,037 --> 00:29:28,857
Helen: retired to run a, a
wood in Australia, so right.

747
00:29:28,932 --> 00:29:29,292
Quite

748
00:29:29,292 --> 00:29:29,682
Andy: on brand.

749
00:29:29,682 --> 00:29:31,602
Leave your bush spray concrete over it.

750
00:29:32,502 --> 00:29:34,902
Helen: Andy, that's gonna be on the
subtitles if you're not careful.

751
00:29:36,792 --> 00:29:36,972
Andy: No.

752
00:29:36,972 --> 00:29:37,362
There we go.

753
00:29:37,722 --> 00:29:38,052
Got away

754
00:29:38,052 --> 00:29:38,382
Ian: without it.

755
00:29:39,402 --> 00:29:40,692
Helen: Concrete over your bush.

756
00:29:40,692 --> 00:29:41,202
That said,

757
00:29:42,552 --> 00:29:43,332
Ian: thank you everyone.

758
00:29:43,602 --> 00:29:46,032
I think I should be employing
the subtitle, right?

759
00:29:47,142 --> 00:29:49,032
Or is this, is this just ai?

760
00:29:49,127 --> 00:29:49,417
Crowd: Yeah.

761
00:29:49,632 --> 00:29:50,142
Ian: Yeah.

762
00:29:50,566 --> 00:29:53,026
Adam: I can't spell AI
properly, so possibly not

763
00:29:54,406 --> 00:29:54,766
Crowd: boy has done,

764
00:29:55,936 --> 00:29:57,586
Adam: see, that's learning,
that's machine learning.

765
00:29:57,586 --> 00:29:57,856
That is

766
00:30:01,756 --> 00:30:03,046
question number three.

767
00:30:03,046 --> 00:30:07,726
The I resident obituary, EJ
Thib went on tour in the 1970s

768
00:30:07,726 --> 00:30:09,076
in the person of long serving.

769
00:30:09,076 --> 00:30:12,316
I joke writer Barry Fantoni, who
sadly died earlier this year.

770
00:30:12,826 --> 00:30:15,826
Uh, which real poet did
he share the bill with?

771
00:30:16,162 --> 00:30:17,812
Larkin, I can see it now.

772
00:30:18,232 --> 00:30:18,847
Helen: Lads on tour.

773
00:30:18,917 --> 00:30:21,562
LA's on, they're shackles
them twosome free.

774
00:30:22,672 --> 00:30:23,152
Adam: Larkin

775
00:30:24,922 --> 00:30:25,462
Helen: Simon Armitage.

776
00:30:26,227 --> 00:30:26,617
Ian: No.

777
00:30:26,977 --> 00:30:29,047
Was it his beat poets?

778
00:30:29,047 --> 00:30:30,037
Was it Horrowitz?

779
00:30:30,217 --> 00:30:30,637
It wasn't

780
00:30:30,792 --> 00:30:31,987
Adam: Horrowitz, but
you're in the right area.

781
00:30:32,617 --> 00:30:33,457
Alan Ginsburg.

782
00:30:33,457 --> 00:30:33,467
Ginsburg.

783
00:30:33,517 --> 00:30:36,337
Not that would've been interesting
in the travel lodge in Chippenham.

784
00:30:36,427 --> 00:30:38,227
Okay, we're just naming
poets now, shall I tell you?

785
00:30:38,227 --> 00:30:38,377
Yeah.

786
00:30:38,467 --> 00:30:40,987
John was Roger McGough
presidential Poetry please.

787
00:30:40,987 --> 00:30:42,397
And beat poet and member of the Scaffold.

788
00:30:42,397 --> 00:30:42,727
Yes.

789
00:30:43,117 --> 00:30:43,507
Okay.

790
00:30:43,507 --> 00:30:47,137
SU's Corner, which novelist on
the i's 50th birthday in 2011

791
00:30:47,317 --> 00:30:50,707
was Crowned Britain's biggest
sued with, at that time a record.

792
00:30:50,707 --> 00:30:55,327
41 entries, Eni SU's Corner, and
an entire corner also devoted

793
00:30:55,327 --> 00:30:57,517
to himself alone in 1996.

794
00:30:58,671 --> 00:30:59,926
Ian: I was gonna say Jeffrey Chard.

795
00:31:00,322 --> 00:31:03,262
But then pseudo intellectual's
not really his thing.

796
00:31:03,832 --> 00:31:04,942
Pseudo does John Benjamin wanna

797
00:31:04,942 --> 00:31:05,992
Helen: jump in on this one at all?

798
00:31:06,052 --> 00:31:06,712
Any ideas?

799
00:31:06,892 --> 00:31:08,662
Jay McInerney featured a lot.

800
00:31:08,662 --> 00:31:09,742
Oh, will Self.

801
00:31:09,742 --> 00:31:10,552
That's a good guest.

802
00:31:10,582 --> 00:31:10,822
Thank you.

803
00:31:11,122 --> 00:31:11,692
Adam: Well done.

804
00:31:11,692 --> 00:31:14,392
Yes, will sell indeed this audience.

805
00:31:14,722 --> 00:31:15,112
Brilliant.

806
00:31:15,112 --> 00:31:15,382
Fantastic.

807
00:31:18,557 --> 00:31:21,652
Have you ever re rejected a suit
for the corner 'cause you felt

808
00:31:21,652 --> 00:31:23,332
it was too profound and moving?

809
00:31:23,632 --> 00:31:23,932
Ian?

810
00:31:24,472 --> 00:31:24,772
Um.

811
00:31:25,582 --> 00:31:25,912
No

812
00:31:27,352 --> 00:31:27,712
Ian: moving on.

813
00:31:27,712 --> 00:31:29,692
No, that's uh, that's
what I was just thinking.

814
00:31:29,692 --> 00:31:35,752
I think I did reject when I was a
student will self's cartoons Really?

815
00:31:35,782 --> 00:31:37,132
Which he tried to get into.

816
00:31:37,668 --> 00:31:38,808
so it's a student magazine.

817
00:31:38,808 --> 00:31:42,348
I was then running and I feel
somehow he's always resented that,

818
00:31:42,858 --> 00:31:43,608
Helen: yes, it's your fault.

819
00:31:43,608 --> 00:31:44,533
He became a novelist

820
00:31:45,858 --> 00:31:46,878
Adam: if you just encouraged.

821
00:31:46,878 --> 00:31:49,308
He could have been just drawing
cartoons for us all this time.

822
00:31:49,338 --> 00:31:49,638
Yeah.

823
00:31:49,698 --> 00:31:50,988
Instead went off and became a sued.

824
00:31:51,378 --> 00:31:51,588
Yep.

825
00:31:51,648 --> 00:31:52,668
Another one missed.

826
00:31:52,833 --> 00:31:52,863
Ian: Uh,

827
00:31:53,232 --> 00:31:56,682
Adam: uh, best known for her long
running romantic series, air of Sorrows,

828
00:31:56,682 --> 00:31:57,912
charting the Love Life of our present.

829
00:31:57,912 --> 00:32:00,522
Monarch Dame Sylvie Cris First
work published in the Eye,

830
00:32:00,522 --> 00:32:02,502
charted another Royal Romance.

831
00:32:03,282 --> 00:32:04,362
Who's and which was it called?

832
00:32:04,362 --> 00:32:05,112
What was it called?

833
00:32:05,892 --> 00:32:07,902
Ian: It was called Love in the Saddle.

834
00:32:08,592 --> 00:32:09,132
Very good.

835
00:32:09,132 --> 00:32:10,812
And it was about Princess Anne.

836
00:32:10,932 --> 00:32:12,612
Adam: Princess Anne and
Captain Mark Phillips.

837
00:32:12,702 --> 00:32:13,002
Yes.

838
00:32:13,002 --> 00:32:13,452
Very good indeed.

839
00:32:13,512 --> 00:32:13,902
Yeah.

840
00:32:14,232 --> 00:32:17,682
Ian: Um, again, this was Barry
Fanna who came up with this stuff.

841
00:32:17,854 --> 00:32:18,484
, they did these.

842
00:32:18,847 --> 00:32:22,117
Accounts of the royal family as
though they were bad romantic novels,

843
00:32:22,117 --> 00:32:23,617
which is a very good approach.

844
00:32:23,995 --> 00:32:27,055
and for years it was Dame Sylvie
Krinn, and now it's Dame Head of

845
00:32:27,055 --> 00:32:33,145
Shoulders, who's, um, who's taken
on the responsibility of covering.

846
00:32:33,634 --> 00:32:35,434
she now does the King of Troubles.

847
00:32:35,510 --> 00:32:39,641
and they, they're stories about Prince
Charles, about Queen Camilla, about his.

848
00:32:40,591 --> 00:32:41,371
Der Barry camp.

849
00:32:41,611 --> 00:32:48,361
Um, so Alan Fitz tightly who, um,
is, is the, the last of the Fitz,

850
00:32:48,361 --> 00:32:51,301
tightly as, as it as it happens.

851
00:32:51,391 --> 00:32:53,426
Um, who, uh,

852
00:32:56,246 --> 00:32:58,861
who develops this rich home life?

853
00:32:58,981 --> 00:33:04,667
Uh, his friend, the Vice Admiral
and he big Abba fans, um, uh, try

854
00:33:04,667 --> 00:33:07,040
and direct, the Monarch into, um.

855
00:33:07,475 --> 00:33:10,085
Uh, ways of seeing the
world that are less gloomy.

856
00:33:10,519 --> 00:33:14,809
and it features obviously Prince Harry and
Meghan and, and William and the others.

857
00:33:14,809 --> 00:33:18,859
And it, it's, it, it's a way
of, of unserious doing the royal

858
00:33:18,859 --> 00:33:21,889
family, which I, I absolutely love.

859
00:33:21,889 --> 00:33:26,179
I mean, uh, writing Sylvie CRI is
incredibly easy 'cause it's just,

860
00:33:26,569 --> 00:33:27,739
I'm sure you could all do it.

861
00:33:27,739 --> 00:33:32,600
Don't, don't, don't let
on, um, uh, because, Royal

862
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:34,790
correspondence are so serious.

863
00:33:35,014 --> 00:33:39,930
they interpret pictures and small
details and tiny bits of, gossip

864
00:33:40,260 --> 00:33:42,600
and take it very, very earnestly.

865
00:33:42,780 --> 00:33:44,460
And it's, it's a pleasure to think.

866
00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:47,730
It's probably, probably
not what this is about.

867
00:33:47,970 --> 00:33:49,957
Mm. yeah, the first one was Princess Anne.

868
00:33:50,341 --> 00:33:51,421
what was the one after that?

869
00:33:51,511 --> 00:33:51,991
Adam: I'm looking.

870
00:33:52,081 --> 00:33:52,771
Oh, there were all sorts.

871
00:33:52,771 --> 00:33:55,591
Andre Previn, Anna Ford, Esther
Ranson, I mean, we mustn't forget.

872
00:33:55,651 --> 00:33:57,181
Um, never too old either.

873
00:33:57,181 --> 00:33:58,411
The Rupert Murdoch story.

874
00:33:58,681 --> 00:33:59,101
Ian: Yes.

875
00:33:59,521 --> 00:34:00,721
Adam: Very, very long running.

876
00:34:00,721 --> 00:34:01,381
How's, is he?

877
00:34:02,071 --> 00:34:02,701
Ian: Yes.

878
00:34:02,791 --> 00:34:07,237
Um, it is just funny the
idea of him going on and on.

879
00:34:07,777 --> 00:34:09,157
Um, and.

880
00:34:09,626 --> 00:34:13,316
his latest wife is a, is a sort
of life scientist and biologist

881
00:34:13,316 --> 00:34:15,386
who's looking for eternal life.

882
00:34:16,256 --> 00:34:19,916
Um, I'm not quite sure that's
what her research says, but I

883
00:34:19,916 --> 00:34:21,266
think that's what it's all about.

884
00:34:21,569 --> 00:34:23,159
and because succession.

885
00:34:23,474 --> 00:34:31,381
Which, um, I'm sure you watched, was
so, um, strongly linked, um, to keep the

886
00:34:31,381 --> 00:34:34,681
lawyers happy, um, to Rupert's own life.

887
00:34:34,741 --> 00:34:39,271
We decided it would be funny if Rupert
had no idea that it wasn't his own life.

888
00:34:39,271 --> 00:34:44,461
So when he lists his children, it's,
it's Lachlan, it's Liz, uh, it's

889
00:34:44,701 --> 00:34:49,381
Kendall Shiv, Kendall Shiv, um, and Tom.

890
00:34:49,411 --> 00:34:50,281
So, um.

891
00:34:51,126 --> 00:34:54,480
Again, it's a, a way of not
taking seriously, things that the

892
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:56,220
papers take very, very seriously.

893
00:34:56,580 --> 00:35:01,890
, And the Murdoch trial, um, in which
he tried to, , essentially disown

894
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:06,600
half of his, well not half of his
children, most of his children bar

895
00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:10,650
one 'cause they weren't right wing
enough, um, to take over the company.

896
00:35:10,830 --> 00:35:13,080
You'd find difficult that to make up.

897
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:15,120
Um, and then that failed.

898
00:35:15,210 --> 00:35:16,530
So he's paid everyone off.

899
00:35:17,078 --> 00:35:17,978
and yet he's still

900
00:35:17,978 --> 00:35:18,248
Adam: there.

901
00:35:18,938 --> 00:35:22,418
And we, as I, I keep saying his
mum lived to 106, so he is got

902
00:35:22,418 --> 00:35:24,458
a good decade and a couple of
wives left in him, me out I think.

903
00:35:25,508 --> 00:35:29,948
Ian: But I did have a sort of Trump moment
of, of when he decided to take on Trump.

904
00:35:30,488 --> 00:35:33,635
You suddenly thought, well,
God, isn't Murdoch great?

905
00:35:34,530 --> 00:35:37,625
Adam: This is what I mean about your
enemy's enemy being your friend, isn't it?

906
00:35:37,685 --> 00:35:38,705
Unlikely Alliance?

907
00:35:38,705 --> 00:35:39,965
Will you, um, will you miss him?

908
00:35:41,295 --> 00:35:41,445
It.

909
00:35:41,445 --> 00:35:42,255
Well, he'll outlive me.

910
00:35:45,165 --> 00:35:47,055
One final literary question, Ian.

911
00:35:47,055 --> 00:35:49,905
Um, we've talked about, uh, Dame
Seal, we've talked about three.

912
00:35:50,025 --> 00:35:53,985
Um, is there any sort of book, uh,
in which perhaps some sort of yearly

913
00:35:53,985 --> 00:35:58,005
collection possibly available in
all good bookshops and in a signing

914
00:35:58,005 --> 00:35:59,625
tent directly after this event?

915
00:35:59,955 --> 00:36:02,025
Uh, in which people could
read some examples of this,

916
00:36:02,025 --> 00:36:03,165
this magnificent literature?

917
00:36:03,495 --> 00:36:04,545
Oh, you've got me

918
00:36:04,545 --> 00:36:04,935
Ian: there.

919
00:36:05,595 --> 00:36:06,855
Um, oh yes.

920
00:36:06,855 --> 00:36:08,565
I think I do know what it is.

921
00:36:08,990 --> 00:36:10,880
It's, um, it's the private DiAnn,

922
00:36:13,005 --> 00:36:17,600
hey, um, which, uh, is a selection
of all the best jokes of the year.

923
00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:20,340
it won't surprise you that
K Stama is on the cover.

924
00:36:21,865 --> 00:36:25,045
Charming look alike, mean alike
with the figure of sadness.

925
00:36:25,705 --> 00:36:30,715
Um, and, um, it's, uh, yeah,
roundup of, of the years jokes.

926
00:36:30,985 --> 00:36:31,945
Everything's in there.

927
00:36:32,065 --> 00:36:35,185
And it's all written
by, uh, private ai, um,

928
00:36:37,255 --> 00:36:42,475
which is, uh, a new technology that we've
developed, uh, that involves human beings.

929
00:36:42,963 --> 00:36:45,663
meeting together in rooms and writing.

930
00:36:46,189 --> 00:36:48,499
it's probably won't catch
on and it may be a bit late.

931
00:36:48,838 --> 00:36:52,898
it has been a, a pretty crazy
year, trying to keep up with the

932
00:36:52,898 --> 00:36:54,698
news cycle, partly 'cause Trump.

933
00:36:55,538 --> 00:36:59,708
Draws, um, the atmosphere out of
old news and makes it about himself,

934
00:37:00,008 --> 00:37:03,788
but partly because there's just been
so much, um, going on elsewhere.

935
00:37:04,058 --> 00:37:07,658
And so it's got photo bubbles,
it's got, um, thread pieces.

936
00:37:07,898 --> 00:37:09,758
It's got my favorite joke on the cover.

937
00:37:09,818 --> 00:37:12,218
Meghan launches a Netflix cookery show.

938
00:37:12,488 --> 00:37:15,128
Lovely picture voice off
saying, what are you making?

939
00:37:15,308 --> 00:37:16,298
And she's saying, money.

940
00:37:21,173 --> 00:37:23,603
Adam: And it's even got the joke
by Andy that a man was arrested

941
00:37:23,603 --> 00:37:25,793
for holding at a, a demonstration.

942
00:37:25,793 --> 00:37:27,593
So, um, mind how you go with your copies?

943
00:37:27,803 --> 00:37:28,583
Yeah.

944
00:37:28,583 --> 00:37:29,693
Um, yes.

945
00:37:29,933 --> 00:37:31,433
Got any more, Andy?

946
00:37:31,433 --> 00:37:31,643
That

947
00:37:32,363 --> 00:37:34,673
Andy: can get our audience
in jail for the evening.

948
00:37:34,703 --> 00:37:36,023
I'm not trying to get anyone arrested.

949
00:37:36,053 --> 00:37:38,253
Well, actually I suppose I
am, but not, not read us.

950
00:37:38,633 --> 00:37:41,573
Um, we should, we should come to the
questions from the audience because

951
00:37:41,573 --> 00:37:47,291
we've had loads in, um, so, let's start
with, uh, one from Jasper, noting the

952
00:37:47,291 --> 00:37:49,121
demographic of the audience here tonight.

953
00:37:49,241 --> 00:37:52,181
Are you confident that you are growing
your younger audience to ensure

954
00:37:52,181 --> 00:37:53,981
the magazine's long-term future?

955
00:37:54,941 --> 00:37:55,631
There's one there.

956
00:37:55,661 --> 00:37:56,411
I can see them.

957
00:37:57,491 --> 00:37:58,721
It's all down to you, sir. Yeah.

958
00:38:00,641 --> 00:38:05,936
Ian: Well, as, as I always say, um, I
quote the example of, um, In communist

959
00:38:05,936 --> 00:38:10,946
Russia, Stalin going in, uh, to a
church which is full of old people.

960
00:38:10,946 --> 00:38:13,886
And he said, ha ha, what will
you do when the old people die?

961
00:38:13,886 --> 00:38:16,316
And the priest said, there
will be more old people.

962
00:38:19,166 --> 00:38:24,146
Um, and when people want to
come to what the eye has to

963
00:38:24,146 --> 00:38:26,456
offer, they're very welcome.

964
00:38:26,556 --> 00:38:29,226
Andy: And also the readership are, are
younger than you would expect, I think.

965
00:38:29,226 --> 00:38:29,407
Andy.

966
00:38:29,407 --> 00:38:29,647
That's

967
00:38:29,647 --> 00:38:30,937
Adam: just that you are getting older.

968
00:38:30,997 --> 00:38:31,117
Oh

969
00:38:31,272 --> 00:38:31,472
Andy: no.

970
00:38:31,682 --> 00:38:35,287
Don't it to seem really old
when you first joined, didn't.

971
00:38:35,287 --> 00:38:35,467
Right.

972
00:38:35,737 --> 00:38:37,657
Let's have, let's have a, a younger.

973
00:38:37,917 --> 00:38:38,637
Brightly a question.

974
00:38:38,637 --> 00:38:42,957
This one comes from Clive Field, 76
years have you considered increasing

975
00:38:42,957 --> 00:38:44,607
the font size of your publication?

976
00:38:45,327 --> 00:38:45,387
Crowd: No.

977
00:38:49,372 --> 00:38:50,122
Andy: Thank you, Clive.

978
00:38:51,002 --> 00:38:53,697
I think we, we have done Al, we
have done already, haven't we?

979
00:38:53,967 --> 00:38:57,655
Ian: And the answer to this is we've done
the font size twice, we've increased it.

980
00:38:58,105 --> 00:39:03,595
Um, we've also, I hope you've noticed,
run a series of ads for, um, magnifying

981
00:39:03,595 --> 00:39:08,965
glasses, reading lights, Specsavers,

982
00:39:09,425 --> 00:39:10,520
so the, the answer is.

983
00:39:11,090 --> 00:39:13,940
We do try and make it readable,
but I think there is partly

984
00:39:13,940 --> 00:39:18,410
people find, as all the surveys
show just reading more difficult.

985
00:39:18,801 --> 00:39:21,771
um, but I don't think on
the whole, our readers do.

986
00:39:21,771 --> 00:39:25,701
And if we, if we say, look, there's,
there's a whole page of type here.

987
00:39:25,791 --> 00:39:26,751
You might have to read it.

988
00:39:26,751 --> 00:39:28,281
I don't think they're gonna be scared.

989
00:39:28,701 --> 00:39:31,611
And certainly not at the
Cheltenham Literary Festival.

990
00:39:31,611 --> 00:39:31,671
Yeah.

991
00:39:31,851 --> 00:39:34,641
Um, I do hope, you know, the
attention span will be more

992
00:39:34,641 --> 00:39:36,681
than, more than 800 words.

993
00:39:36,681 --> 00:39:37,041
Well,

994
00:39:37,491 --> 00:39:38,631
Andy: can we come on then too?

995
00:39:38,631 --> 00:39:39,711
I really like this question.

996
00:39:39,741 --> 00:39:41,181
Uh, no name from this question.

997
00:39:41,181 --> 00:39:44,301
How does private eye remain relevant in
a post-truth world where many get news

998
00:39:44,301 --> 00:39:47,301
from TikTok and similar non-New outlets?

999
00:39:47,691 --> 00:39:48,021
Is that.

1000
00:39:48,696 --> 00:39:50,466
Something you consider,
something you worry about?

1001
00:39:50,916 --> 00:39:51,126
What?

1002
00:39:51,126 --> 00:39:51,666
TikTok?

1003
00:39:51,756 --> 00:39:52,026
Yeah.

1004
00:39:52,176 --> 00:39:52,446
Ian: Yeah.

1005
00:39:52,446 --> 00:39:54,036
I just spent a lot of time on there.

1006
00:39:55,357 --> 00:39:58,777
Adam: there is a weird function that
the is has kind of taken on in that

1007
00:39:58,777 --> 00:40:00,217
has become a slight correction center.

1008
00:40:00,217 --> 00:40:02,647
I mean, certainly the street of shame
pages are just for pointing out what

1009
00:40:02,647 --> 00:40:05,947
bollocks that story was in the Telegraph
last week and that one in the mail and

1010
00:40:05,947 --> 00:40:07,117
what the story really is behind that.

1011
00:40:07,117 --> 00:40:07,207
Yeah.

1012
00:40:07,252 --> 00:40:10,852
So there is a. It's an attempt
to become kind of a reliable

1013
00:40:11,062 --> 00:40:11,422
Ian: source

1014
00:40:11,422 --> 00:40:11,482
Adam: of

1015
00:40:11,482 --> 00:40:12,652
Ian: news at the end of it, isn't it?

1016
00:40:12,802 --> 00:40:15,262
And I think that is in itself a service.

1017
00:40:15,262 --> 00:40:21,202
It's just we run an awful lot about, um,
uh, social media and AB about how, um,

1018
00:40:21,232 --> 00:40:23,542
Twitter works and about AI works and.

1019
00:40:23,602 --> 00:40:24,832
I mean, I love the story.

1020
00:40:24,892 --> 00:40:29,692
Um, in the last issue of, of, um,
the video that Genrich had made, sort

1021
00:40:29,692 --> 00:40:33,772
of wandering around, um, supposedly
in Hansworth where he wasn't, um,

1022
00:40:34,042 --> 00:40:35,632
saying, I can't see a white face.

1023
00:40:35,632 --> 00:40:38,272
And you look at the video
and they, they're behind him.

1024
00:40:41,062 --> 00:40:42,892
There's three people over there.

1025
00:40:43,718 --> 00:40:46,268
Helen: There's a lot of that isn't there
about saying you have to do video, you

1026
00:40:46,268 --> 00:40:47,228
have to do this, they have to do that.

1027
00:40:47,228 --> 00:40:48,518
You have to be on social media.

1028
00:40:48,728 --> 00:40:51,578
And actually I think about 10 years
ago, people kind of said, I can't

1029
00:40:51,578 --> 00:40:54,008
believe the eye not going full
bore onto this internet thing.

1030
00:40:54,008 --> 00:40:54,998
We've always heard so much about.

1031
00:40:54,998 --> 00:40:55,208
No, a lot

1032
00:40:55,208 --> 00:40:57,068
Adam: of people are saying that to
crack young people, you have to start

1033
00:40:57,068 --> 00:40:58,538
doing podcasts and things, aren't they?

1034
00:40:58,538 --> 00:40:59,438
I mean, mad.

1035
00:41:00,863 --> 00:41:04,463
Helen: But I think that actually weirdly,
the internet is now a kind of, it's like

1036
00:41:04,463 --> 00:41:06,293
tam's water have taken it over, basically.

1037
00:41:06,293 --> 00:41:06,503
Right?

1038
00:41:06,508 --> 00:41:06,698
Yeah.

1039
00:41:07,088 --> 00:41:08,098
Crowd: It's just, oh

1040
00:41:08,248 --> 00:41:08,538
Helen: shit.

1041
00:41:12,638 --> 00:41:13,058
Andy: Superb.

1042
00:41:13,358 --> 00:41:14,483
Helen: No, but it's true.

1043
00:41:14,783 --> 00:41:19,463
Whereas you, if you open up private eye,
then there is, that has been written by

1044
00:41:19,463 --> 00:41:23,213
actual journalists and, and checked and
subbed by other actual journalists and

1045
00:41:23,453 --> 00:41:27,023
you know, most of it, you could probably
be fairly assured, is actually not just.

1046
00:41:27,038 --> 00:41:31,718
Some hallucination of some AI bar and,
and that's what I think is a slightly,

1047
00:41:31,958 --> 00:41:35,678
in a way, I also think we're heading for
this kind of post-apocalyptic future where

1048
00:41:35,678 --> 00:41:38,888
people can't pass around copies of sort
of underground magazines to each other.

1049
00:41:39,038 --> 00:41:40,508
'cause it'll be the only
kind of place where you can

1050
00:41:40,508 --> 00:41:41,358
actually find things that have.

1051
00:41:41,843 --> 00:41:42,833
Interesting and true.

1052
00:41:42,833 --> 00:41:43,523
Stop edited.

1053
00:41:43,523 --> 00:41:44,543
Yeah, stop edited.

1054
00:41:44,543 --> 00:41:44,723
Yeah.

1055
00:41:44,723 --> 00:41:44,903
We

1056
00:41:44,903 --> 00:41:46,523
Adam: were discussing in the office
last week when we were putting

1057
00:41:46,523 --> 00:41:47,363
the pages together, weren't we?

1058
00:41:47,363 --> 00:41:50,423
And we're saying, what, what would,
how could we kind of like ape being

1059
00:41:50,423 --> 00:41:51,743
more like a newspaper website now?

1060
00:41:51,743 --> 00:41:55,283
And we thought big post-it notes kind
of like all over the pages with really

1061
00:41:55,283 --> 00:41:57,803
sticky glue on that you really have to
kind of pull off to actually get it.

1062
00:41:57,803 --> 00:41:58,433
Anything you want us.

1063
00:41:58,438 --> 00:42:00,268
See that give much your money.

1064
00:42:00,358 --> 00:42:03,028
The, the, the Marrow
website, um, uh, experience.

1065
00:42:03,058 --> 00:42:03,178
Helen: Yeah.

1066
00:42:03,178 --> 00:42:06,298
You turn the page and every, so the
page just goes blank and reloads.

1067
00:42:06,358 --> 00:42:06,598
Yeah.

1068
00:42:06,598 --> 00:42:07,378
That would be a good experience.

1069
00:42:07,378 --> 00:42:08,243
We should bring to the magazines.

1070
00:42:08,243 --> 00:42:08,878
My magazines crashed.

1071
00:42:09,148 --> 00:42:09,358
Andy: Right.

1072
00:42:09,568 --> 00:42:10,498
We're entering entry time.

1073
00:42:10,498 --> 00:42:12,298
So I'm gonna, I'm gonna try
and whip through a few more.

1074
00:42:12,478 --> 00:42:16,648
Um, if, and it is a big, if as a panel,
you were elected as the next government.

1075
00:42:16,918 --> 00:42:17,488
What do we mean big?

1076
00:42:17,488 --> 00:42:21,208
If Yes, um, what would be your
first acts to improve our country?

1077
00:42:21,668 --> 00:42:22,328
Resign.

1078
00:42:23,978 --> 00:42:24,158
Great.

1079
00:42:25,778 --> 00:42:26,618
Right on we go.

1080
00:42:28,898 --> 00:42:33,278
Uh, how can we express
support for Palestine without

1081
00:42:33,278 --> 00:42:34,748
being called anti-Semitic?

1082
00:42:35,033 --> 00:42:38,453
actually someone, someone did get
recently arrested for a, uh, they had a

1083
00:42:38,453 --> 00:42:40,163
T-shirt that said plaster scene action.

1084
00:42:40,703 --> 00:42:41,453
And it was about,

1085
00:42:42,353 --> 00:42:42,633
Helen: was it morph?

1086
00:42:42,633 --> 00:42:42,988
Was it little morph?

1087
00:42:42,988 --> 00:42:43,163
It was morph.

1088
00:42:43,163 --> 00:42:43,673
It was a pro

1089
00:42:43,673 --> 00:42:44,453
Andy: morph thing.

1090
00:42:44,453 --> 00:42:44,753
Yeah.

1091
00:42:45,443 --> 00:42:48,083
They were briefly, they were briefly
detained and then the police officer

1092
00:42:48,083 --> 00:42:51,083
came over and said, I'm incredibly
embarrassed and you are free to go.

1093
00:42:52,473 --> 00:42:53,588
Ian: I, yes, I mean, I think being.

1094
00:42:54,473 --> 00:42:56,153
Being slightly careful about the wording.

1095
00:42:56,153 --> 00:42:59,363
If you are an Optim student at the
beginning of your life, probably

1096
00:42:59,363 --> 00:43:01,493
not a good idea to be filmed.

1097
00:43:01,523 --> 00:43:04,148
Chanting about putting people
in the ground, put design in

1098
00:43:04,148 --> 00:43:04,348
Helen: the ground.

1099
00:43:04,418 --> 00:43:04,708
Yeah.

1100
00:43:04,788 --> 00:43:05,358
I think that's the, yeah.

1101
00:43:05,403 --> 00:43:05,793
When they're

1102
00:43:05,793 --> 00:43:07,743
Ian: trying to get
people outta the ground.

1103
00:43:07,863 --> 00:43:10,113
I mean, just a certain amount of, of care.

1104
00:43:10,233 --> 00:43:10,533
Yeah.

1105
00:43:11,073 --> 00:43:14,343
Andy: Uh, what intractable problem
would you advise Farage to address in

1106
00:43:14,343 --> 00:43:16,083
order to win his Nobel Peace Prize?

1107
00:43:16,083 --> 00:43:18,753
When he inevitably becomes
our glorious leader?

1108
00:43:21,438 --> 00:43:22,458
Uh, the crypto?

1109
00:43:22,878 --> 00:43:23,118
Yeah.

1110
00:43:23,478 --> 00:43:25,818
Well, we know he's got a direct line
to Russia, so maybe he'll be able

1111
00:43:25,818 --> 00:43:26,928
to sort something out over there.

1112
00:43:27,186 --> 00:43:30,293
Helen: start him small on one of those
kind of lay landi disputes you get in the

1113
00:43:30,293 --> 00:43:34,283
daily mail, work up to something bigger.

1114
00:43:34,913 --> 00:43:35,153
Andy: Brilliant.

1115
00:43:36,443 --> 00:43:41,063
Um, oh, this is, how do you
choose your contributors and

1116
00:43:41,063 --> 00:43:43,223
do you get MI five to vet them?

1117
00:43:43,298 --> 00:43:43,518
Helen: Yes.

1118
00:43:43,523 --> 00:43:43,913
Yes, I've heard that.

1119
00:43:45,173 --> 00:43:46,493
Ian: We've all had the
tap on the shoulder.

1120
00:43:46,943 --> 00:43:52,013
Um, yeah, no, I, we don't on the whole
though, I mean, I have had some ex

1121
00:43:52,253 --> 00:43:54,533
experience with the security forces.

1122
00:43:54,533 --> 00:43:58,553
I dunno if you remember, um, any
of you when, uh, the plans for

1123
00:43:58,553 --> 00:44:01,403
Desert Storm, um, were stolen.

1124
00:44:01,403 --> 00:44:06,323
They were left in a Volvo, um, by a
civil servant outside the showroom.

1125
00:44:06,323 --> 00:44:10,103
And, uh, I had the admiral
who was in charge of the de

1126
00:44:10,103 --> 00:44:11,633
notice committee rang me up.

1127
00:44:12,023 --> 00:44:14,513
I mean, this is security
at a very high level.

1128
00:44:14,903 --> 00:44:15,893
And he said to me, is that Ian?

1129
00:44:15,893 --> 00:44:16,163
His Lo?

1130
00:44:17,063 --> 00:44:17,573
I said, yeah.

1131
00:44:17,573 --> 00:44:19,853
And he said, you know these
plans for Desert Storm?

1132
00:44:21,023 --> 00:44:21,533
I said, yeah.

1133
00:44:21,533 --> 00:44:22,583
And he said, you haven't got 'em.

1134
00:44:22,583 --> 00:44:23,993
Old boy have you.

1135
00:44:28,818 --> 00:44:29,178
Right.

1136
00:44:29,178 --> 00:44:29,808
We're gonna stop there.

1137
00:44:29,808 --> 00:44:30,038
Thank you so.

1138
00:44:30,268 --> 00:44:30,568
Andy: So

1139
00:44:30,568 --> 00:44:31,198
Ian: much for coming.

1140
00:44:31,198 --> 00:44:31,793
Andy: Thank you for being here.

1141
00:44:31,793 --> 00:44:31,918
Thank we.

1142
00:44:31,918 --> 00:44:33,118
Hope we've enjoyed the evening.

1143
00:44:33,628 --> 00:44:35,753
Ladies, give it up for the one team from.