[SPEAKER_01]: Michael Mera, Radio Entertainment.

[SPEAKER_01]: Hocus, Pocus, by Focus.

[SPEAKER_01]: for those of you who had a top 40 interest.

[SPEAKER_01]: You've heard us talk about the movie, Tapal Wingo, starring our friend, Chad Duke's, and now's your chance to see it for yourself.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's available now, streaming everywhere that you can rent movies, please do this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Today, we're bringing one of the film's greatest rival who's straight to the Michael Maras Show.

[SPEAKER_01]: Joining us is the man Chad desperately wants to take down in the movie, Nate Skug.

[SPEAKER_01]: played by none other than John Heeter.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, that John Heeter, the legend behind Napoleon Dynamite, blades of glory, bench warmers and countless portable moments that defined awkward comedy greatness.

[SPEAKER_01]: John, thank you for being here and welcome to the Michael Marishel.

[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for having me, uh, Mike, or I mean, no, Mike's not here today.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm so sorry.

[SPEAKER_01]: We were discussing it that you wanted to get to know Mike a little better before you wish that he felt better.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we'll send you some stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think it's very fair.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, normally I do promote self, I mean, you know, well, well being on all persons of the world.

[SPEAKER_02]: That said, we all have those people that we think.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, they probably could use a little bit of a come-up.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's they probably could use a little humbling.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I, who, who might have speak?

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, clearly has some success, but who's or what expense?

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, we've had a lot of guests on the show.

[SPEAKER_01]: We've never had that take.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have to ask you this, starting about a tapowing go, we all watched it, we all loved it.

[SPEAKER_01]: My son loved it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think one of the highest pieces of praise I can give it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And Josh agrees with me on this.

[SPEAKER_01]: We were about five or ten minutes into the film.

[SPEAKER_01]: when we said, I can't wait to watch this again, I mean, even before the movie was done, it was so rich with stuff that was fun to hear and look at.

[SPEAKER_01]: When you look at a movie like that, and of course, that's, you know, Napoleon Dynamite was the same way, but let's focus on Tapauingo.

[SPEAKER_01]: When you saw the final product on the screen, were you pleased with the richness of the presentation and the fact that there's just so much to take in?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh yeah, for sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, we were, I mean, like, you know, when you're shooting it, you're like, gosh, day, there's so much for shooting and there's so much like in the script.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I mean, knowing we're going to have to take stuff out.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it still feels like it's jam packed.

[SPEAKER_02]: full of things that, you know, that made it into the film.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then there's, you know, so much that didn't make it in and, you know, it's hard being a filmmaker when you know what you're missing, but yeah, audience doesn't know.

[SPEAKER_02]: So as long as they like what they see, that's really what we are shooting for, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to get a four hour mega cut with all the stuff that was removed.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, if it was up to the director, you will gladly put a director's cut on the DVD, a director's director's cut, there's going to be a two hour, four hour, um, yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, I'm sure it all got so lot more.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think there's talk at one moment when, you know, in the editing process, like, what if we put in theaters with an intermission?

[SPEAKER_02]: And like, I don't know if that works, maybe on the DVD.

[SPEAKER_00]: When you read a script, and it's clearly that it's an eyeball character like Napoleon, so you've learned that you like the script, but then you're putting your hands into this director you've never worked with before.

[SPEAKER_00]: How does that trust process go down?

[SPEAKER_00]: How do you decide, yeah, I trust him with this story?

[SPEAKER_00]: That I'm going to be a part of it.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's not much to it,

[SPEAKER_02]: In this you just hope you just hope I mean I don't even know if it's I call it trust you just kind of a zoom and hope like all right It's in your hands and I'm gonna do what I can.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you know, I am me I ultimately can't be forced to do anything.

[SPEAKER_02]: I can maybe be persuaded or pushed in a certain direction And ultimately if my performance is bad.

[SPEAKER_02]: I rarely whatever blame that on the director.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's still gonna be being that said

[SPEAKER_02]: You know, it could be, and it was like, well, it was a bad for, you know, maybe it was a bad for formulas, maybe if I had been directed well and stuff, it's still on my part.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I have to hope, and yeah, somewhat trust that the director and I will see I, and that we will, you know, see this character and it's full glory, 100% in sync with each other.

[SPEAKER_01]: you know, we spoke with your director, Dylan Nareng, and it's feel that it sounds like you guys got along quite well.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And one thing that we talked about and I want to ask you about it is the pacing of the movie is sort of an offbeat rhythm and being raised as a radio guy,

[SPEAKER_01]: When we do our job, I don't like silence, but when you do silence on screen, it's nothing short of brilliant.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's brave.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, when someone has got the focus of the crowd, and they're not really chewing the scenery, you're just there quietly reacting, and it's

[SPEAKER_01]: It's sensational.

[SPEAKER_01]: Did you pick that up along the way?

[SPEAKER_01]: Is that sort of the way you are in real life?

[SPEAKER_01]: Just you pause in a such a way that it makes an awkward scene even more awkward.

[SPEAKER_02]: I, that's just a personal, like, I love that.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love it in films and in characters and in myself, like, I just, I think, you know, in comedies and in real life.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it's just, you can, you can talk a ton and so many jokes and movies come through the dialogue.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: Thanks so much is can be said in, you know, this, not just the subtext, but literally,

[SPEAKER_02]: someone will say something but it's almost like the set up of a, you know, of a joke.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then the silence is in the imagination of the audience, like the punchline is kind of like what you don't just hear.

[SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, coming up with the punchline yourself while the characters on screen are giving you the time, the silence to figure it out.

[SPEAKER_02]: If that makes sense and that's, I think

[SPEAKER_02]: It makes 100%.

[SPEAKER_01]: It makes 100% to me because I mean the reason a joke normally works is the ending is something unexpected and if we're expecting a hammered in punch line and you don't give it to us, it's funny because it's not usual or sometimes it's like sometimes we'll say a line and then there'll be a joke and the silence gives you time to just kind of also digest

[SPEAKER_02]: how you would react to it with the other characters.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think it also is strong on building a world with not just characters.

[SPEAKER_02]: So often comedies are more about like you have one or a couple of funny people.

[SPEAKER_02]: But they're telling the joke to you, the audience.

[SPEAKER_02]: So you're the one who's going to react to where in these kind of movies, I say these kind of the kind of comedies that I like, yes, all in some of the top of Wingo,

[SPEAKER_02]: As an audience member are becoming, you're not just sitting there in the audience, you're hanging out in their world.

[SPEAKER_02]: So you are watching, the part of the joke is watching the reaction of the other characters, the people.

[SPEAKER_02]: So you can become one of them.

[SPEAKER_02]: And that's the essence.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, my favorite example of that in tapowing go is you sitting there eating breakfast.

[SPEAKER_00]: When Tom Ron just comes and puts his hand on your shoulder.

[SPEAKER_00]: And there's no words necessary.

[SPEAKER_00]: Everyone knows what's going on there.

[SPEAKER_01]: John Ratzonberger.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so beloved, I have just a quick aside.

[SPEAKER_01]: Was it cool to work with him?

[SPEAKER_01]: I imagine we're in the same age demo.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you probably watch cheers growing up.

[SPEAKER_01]: So what was there when you met him?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it was amazing.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's like anything.

[SPEAKER_02]: When you work with someone that you've watched a lot of their work, I've seen every episode of cheers.

[SPEAKER_02]: Sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, and not, you know, all the other stuff, but like,

[SPEAKER_02]: That's just like, you know, yeah, this is him.

[SPEAKER_02]: And yet, and you think, you just like, I don't know, I thought he said, it's such a beautiful job on this film.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's so really great.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's so many great laughs.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's wonderful.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was really cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: All right.

[SPEAKER_01]: Back to the timing and pacing of the film, I, you know, in my head, you're still a relative newcomer to Hollywood.

[SPEAKER_01]: What, 35 years now, 30 years?

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's just the way my wiring is messed up.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think Napoleon's 21 years.

[SPEAKER_02]: 21, close to the 20 years, but give or take a decade, Jesus.

[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, well, I'm feeling old.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not you.

[SPEAKER_01]: You look marvelous.

[SPEAKER_01]: I, you know, I've got one foot in the grave, but what I wanted to ask is when you started 20 some years ago,

[SPEAKER_01]: Was it weird when there would be a lingering close up on your face while filming?

[SPEAKER_01]: Did that feel awkward to you?

[SPEAKER_01]: And if it did, could you use that awkwardness?

[SPEAKER_02]: I guess it depends on the project you're thinking, you know, when I did Napoleon by first movie for threat, that was all like we loved it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like anytime the camera was close or even got close, the closer the better.

[SPEAKER_02]: And if it wasn't close, it doesn't matter like we had a language and a

[SPEAKER_02]: and a sense of exactly what we wanted it and I'd say we as Jared and I and all the filmmakers, like we knew what we were doing for that film, but also, you know, we didn't have the stress of like this was in a studio film.

[SPEAKER_02]: There was no producer sitting behind the scenes like, all right, you got to try this and this isn't going to work.

[SPEAKER_02]: Whereas, you know, cut to like a few years after Napoleon, I'm doing bigger studio films, right, and you got a big camera or a

[SPEAKER_02]: You're almost like, oh shoot, now I'm in the big leagues, like, of course you're going to think that way and you're going to be, now let's, whether or not you handle it professionally or not, you're certainly feeling the pressure, yeah, and I wouldn't call it anxiety, but yeah, you, you feel more of the pressure, now are you able to use that pressure?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think, you know, for the, I mean, I feel I do.

[SPEAKER_02]: I've always enjoyed it because I think I started my career doing the close-ups and doing.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you're going to do close-ups and film, and especially with a movie like Napoleon, where you have

[SPEAKER_02]: the awkward silences and you really have so much to be said in the acting of the in-between the moments of talking.

[SPEAKER_02]: How you look and how you move, I think is so important and so having some starting out with that kind of experience, that helped me for future projects for shared.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just, you mentioned Napoleon and I just think of certain rhythm breaks in the film like the jumping of the bike that really, you don't expect that to be in the movie when they take the bike up the ramp and it's not the best jump.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it's just, it's a great, it's, it's like the dot on the eye.

[SPEAKER_01]: It makes the gag absolutely work.

[SPEAKER_01]: Question for you as a performer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Do you look at your daily's?

[SPEAKER_01]: Do you watch the film as it comes along or do you leave that in the hands

[SPEAKER_02]: I that's one of the things I leave in the hands of the director.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm just kind of like

[SPEAKER_02]: I think if I were the director, I'd totally make sense.

[SPEAKER_02]: You watch everything, but as an actor, you're like, well, there's so much I could say about my performance in this scene, but then I might get distracted by something else.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I don't see exactly what he's saying or putting the story together the same way.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I just leave it alone.

[SPEAKER_02]: It would be too hard.

[SPEAKER_02]: And that goes for even the final cut of the film.

[SPEAKER_02]: Or the rough cuts of the film as it comes along this film top of Wingo for example, you know You kept trying to show me like hey can I send you this this is the most recent cut like no Done, I mean I As a filmmaker yes, I want to see how it's coming but I also

[SPEAKER_02]: who not being on the producer side or the, you know, and I was, I was kind of a producer on this.

[SPEAKER_02]: I worked very closely with the director, giving lots of notes back and forth.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I did end up watching, yes, rough versions.

[SPEAKER_02]: And this one I took a little bit more of a producer's standpoint.

[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_02]: role where I would watch it and then I would give him notes like I think this because I was very much invested in this project not just as an actor portraying my character but I really wanted the story to come through.

[SPEAKER_02]: I wanted everybody as you know like this film has an amazing cast

[SPEAKER_02]: crazy characters.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I wanted them all to shine.

[SPEAKER_02]: I wanted the story to work.

[SPEAKER_02]: And like any film, you just, you just want the whole project to work.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so I put more into this one that I have in other films.

[SPEAKER_01]: Because you had John the movie seemed personal.

[SPEAKER_01]: It feels like you are very much invested in it.

[SPEAKER_01]: When you first saw it, though, be it a rough cut.

[SPEAKER_01]: were you dazzled by the color and did you expect the color to look like that?

[SPEAKER_01]: It is a beautiful film.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it just screams color.

[SPEAKER_01]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_02]: I did expect that.

[SPEAKER_02]: I remember we know shooting it and being being the main character, like I interact with every character the film I was in almost every shot.

[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it was, you know, being there on set and seeing the meticulousness of

[SPEAKER_02]: not just the DP but dilling the ring as well just being like hey I want every shot to have this and that and you know I saw the wardrobe and I remember thinking I mean when we're shooting I was like this is a very colorful film this is very but not having seen because it's very frame friendly you know the way they shot they wanted it to look like every shot is a frame every shot and it felt like that I mean it was

[SPEAKER_02]: shooting.

[SPEAKER_02]: I've never done so much like on this film hitting your mark acting.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, I mean, a lot of people probably know about that, you know, as an actor, you've got to hit your mark to like, to get to the right spot so that you're not like, okay, I land and I'm over here.

[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's right.

[SPEAKER_02]: You can't see you.

[SPEAKER_02]: So you've got to hit your marks, but this one is not just like where you're standing, but where you're holding things.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you pick something up, it was like 3D XYZ axis acting, where I think they're like, hold the little button right here.

[SPEAKER_02]: Hold the ding-dong right here, and you don't go any higher lower.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it was so precise.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I was like, this movie better look awesome.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well it does look awesome.

[SPEAKER_01]: It really, really doesn't we spoke to your director about it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he said one of the rings, things they're trying to convey is that this movie, although it's not really easy to place the exact year it takes place.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's obviously in the past a little bit.

[SPEAKER_01]: And when you have memories of the past, they're more vivid than they are in say real life.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so without even realizing it,

[SPEAKER_01]: Dreamlike is not the word, but sort of like I'm remembering it already because the color is just really dazzling.

[SPEAKER_01]: I really, I really, I really, really like that.

[SPEAKER_00]: That bill that's only had something he was going for.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, there's nostalgia, you know, and it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of a romantic size.

[SPEAKER_02]: version of the crusty 1981 backroads across the train tracks kind of world.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's what I love about it because it's like in another, in other, in another director's hands,

[SPEAKER_02]: this could have been shot in a way that was like very raw.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, very kind of like really looks authentic from that time and shooting in a different way where it's floating.

[SPEAKER_02]: And that could have worked as well.

[SPEAKER_02]: But this felt to me more like I said or romanticized like, yeah, I love how you brought me made it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like it sounds like, yeah, it's nostalgia and how we remember it, we're going to exaggerate just a little bit to more of this colorful, fun, it's a positive look back on that time.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just think it's fantastic.

[SPEAKER_01]: Um, I want to ask you about one of your co-stars Kim Matula, dummy saying Matula, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: Leave so far as I know.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's fun.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's funny to me that, you know, what starts out as a very, your sort of an odds with her.

[SPEAKER_01]: and then you really end up having a chemistry with her and you're not a couple in the movie tapowing or you're not a couple that you would picture together and yet you fall in so nicely together.

[SPEAKER_01]: Was it easy to work with her as some of that or real-life chemistry that came through?

[SPEAKER_02]: I thought she was so perfectly cast for that role.

[SPEAKER_01]: Agreed.

[SPEAKER_02]: When I read it, this was one of the few times I read the script.

[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, not having seen the movie before and reading the script, she is not that her character, you do not see them getting together.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because you kind of like, not something you're not on your side, you're you're following Nate's story.

[SPEAKER_02]: He just comes in like, oh, she's the bag girl.

[SPEAKER_02]: But like, she's no good.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: And a rotten, she kind of gives this feel like.

[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know,

[SPEAKER_02]: in the script, she's like, you know, she's hot, but you know, that's all it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, like, oh, she's just this hot mama who's really just treats everybody like dirt and you're like, oh, he's gonna like her, but really it's gonna be like, no, she was bad for you.

[SPEAKER_02]: You need to like look into yourself and see that you're better than that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like that's honestly where I was going when I read the script, but then as you kept reading the script by the end, you're like, oh,

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I see what they're doing and I loved that.

[SPEAKER_02]: I loved it then because it was unexpected and I thought so after reading it and then, you know, kind of getting a little bit involved in the casting process and, you know, Dylan sent me stuff.

[SPEAKER_02]: I thought Kim was perfect.

[SPEAKER_01]: She was really great.

[SPEAKER_02]: She plays it well and on set we got along great and so it just worked nicely.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that's what I was wondering just with the cast as a whole how much you were involved in that because there's so many odd characters in this and everyone is a star in their own way in this movie.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I totally agree.

[SPEAKER_02]: I, again, you know, I was attached to this first and then Dylan would just send me tapes, you know, unlike, hey, we're casting right now.

[SPEAKER_02]: What do you think of this person?

[SPEAKER_02]: What do you think?

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you're favorite.

[SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, it was nice to have.

[SPEAKER_02]: a bit of a, a bit of a say and like who I'm going to be working with in this in that.

[SPEAKER_02]: But in most of them, I think all of them I never worked with and they just, and they were, they were great.

[SPEAKER_02]: They were perfect.

[SPEAKER_02]: Everybody was just perfect.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can feel there is almost an understated camaraderie.

[SPEAKER_01]: Everybody just works well together.

[SPEAKER_01]: Even when Gina Gurshan takes the time to ugly herself up.

[SPEAKER_01]: which is a shame.

[SPEAKER_01]: I imagine she'll agree to them from here, but yeah, I didn't recognize her.

[SPEAKER_01]: I knew she was in the movie, but I didn't recognize her because you did such a great job making that character.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that was her.

[SPEAKER_02]: That was her.

[SPEAKER_02]: She came in.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, she did that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, dot, dot was like,

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, there was like, and that's, you know, again, a great example of when it's sometimes just due to casting and you get an actor and there's a certain take that the writer takes in the script and then when you get a certain actor, it's not that they disagree with it, but they know how to work towards their strengths and it just brought a little bit of a different vibe than what her character was in the script and it just worked great.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it was

[SPEAKER_02]: I want to do this.

[SPEAKER_01]: And it speaks highly of the director that he allows it to happen.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And turn it into something as great as it was.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's that's very cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking to John Heeter.

[SPEAKER_01]: He is the star of Tapal Wingo.

[SPEAKER_01]: To look at the two of us, you wouldn't think that Josh and I are very similar.

[SPEAKER_01]: But we both had one.

[SPEAKER_01]: Big takeaway from the movie that we both agreed upon and that is the car.

[SPEAKER_01]: Your car is so great.

[SPEAKER_00]: Josh, I mean... Well, it fits into that dream aspect of being a 20-year-old kid, the type of vehicle you'd want to drive to kind of run around town in.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it just fits with the character so well that the car and all the cars throughout the movie become stars in their own of this.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, it was the tomb bug he always in the script or how did that how do you find the perfect vehicle for you to run them around and I believe the tomb bug he was in the script and don't 100% remember, but I'm pretty sure it was because I got early on, you know reading the script.

[SPEAKER_02]: I thought, okay, I can see where there's some Napoleon parallels here, but what I loved about it is that this is a guy who has taken the time since high school, to kind of now like he might have been an awkward guy in high school, but now

[SPEAKER_02]: and he still lives at home but he doesn't see it as a loser thing like now he's in his 30s possibly his 40s who knows and he has collected the elements in his life to make him feel like no this is rad like whether he's saved up enough and he got the doom buggy he's got the cool close he's got the cool hair style like he's a cool dude and he kind of knows it and he is just like rock and

[SPEAKER_02]: And there's like this badass kind of quality to him that doesn't carry even though there is obviously some major, you know, he's super lacking in certain skills.

[SPEAKER_02]: Sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so this is that, but like he still's like, no, no, no, he owns that doom buggy.

[SPEAKER_02]: And

[SPEAKER_02]: And yeah, I mean, that was a big part of, I believe it was in the script, because I remember, you know, we're even before getting to location like, and flying into Virginia where we shot it, the director just showing me pictures and saying, get ready, you're going to get some lessons on how to ride this.

[SPEAKER_02]: because that sucker was, he was not easy.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, not easy to ride, but once you got that, that thing flying, it was really fun.

[SPEAKER_02]: But it's, and it was fun, but it was loud as can be.

[SPEAKER_02]: I still don't know how we got through the audio on that, but it was super loud.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was hard to start.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was hard to like, again,

[SPEAKER_02]: like I said, hitting marks.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh boy, we have some things where you get it exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's like, this thing was a monster and it wasn't like something.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, people forget and, you know, movies maybe most, you know, studio films.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you can probably get exactly what you need.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you need a card that looks old, but runs well, you can get that.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is not the case.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is like, it looks the part right, but in order to look that, it's authentic in there for it was a

[SPEAKER_01]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think it is it might not be badmobile level, but it isn't iconic car, and I think you will be attached to it for a while.

[SPEAKER_01]: I put it above Jim Rockford's fireberg.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a great part now.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was read one of my favorite jokes in the movie very subtle is when you first

[SPEAKER_01]: pickup Oswald and you say take off your glasses they're gonna blow off and he says no they won't and they promptly do and it's just it's exactly what you want to happen now how old I know the movie is you finished filming a couple of years ago how old was Sawyer Williams when he made the movie I know he was 13

[SPEAKER_01]: He turns in a hell of a performance for a 13 year old.

[SPEAKER_01]: Was he fun to work with?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah, I mean, it was like, I love work with, you know, like the young people on he was right at that age where he really was just an awkward kid, you know, transitioning from childhood to teenager down.

[SPEAKER_02]: And sure, he had the voice crack and everything.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he was trying.

[SPEAKER_02]: So there was still

[SPEAKER_02]: a large level of humility there, which, you know, is a way to end any professional actor.

[SPEAKER_02]: But you know, he was, this is his first gig.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, this is his first movie.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so it was great.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Did he know you from Napoleon?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: I assume everyone knows you as Napoleon.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, I said not as Napoleon.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: From Napoleon.

[SPEAKER_00]: From Napoleon.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but he knows me as Napoleon.

[SPEAKER_02]: They hopefully know me from Napoleon.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm curious.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's a couple pretty intense.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you keep talking about hitting marks.

[SPEAKER_01]: I hadn't thought about that.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I think it was Spencer Tracy who said, If you know your lines hit your marks and don't bump into the furniture, you can be a movie star.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's that's what he said, but there are some choreograph sequences.

[SPEAKER_01]: What was the hardest thing to shoot in the movie?

[SPEAKER_01]: Is there one scene that was daunting or you had to keep going back to or did the whole thing run rather smoothly?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I'm trying to think, um,

[SPEAKER_02]: I had to sit down and like watch it all I mean there's so many different locations and setups The fight is one of the kinds of times like it was hard in a way.

[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't like crazy technical if you watch it It's pretty pathetic I love that it all comes down to this and it's just the lamest fighting and so it's on purpose, you know, yeah

[SPEAKER_02]: it was still it was hard because it was it was so hot and we were in Virginia and the summer it was yeah you're a you're like Richmond adjacent right yeah middle of summer shot that we shot that whole scene enrichment that was enrichment but most of it takes place in Hopewell or it was shot in Hopewell which is about like 45 minutes south of Richmond

[SPEAKER_01]: Richmond because of its location between the river and the mountains is the hottest, most miserable city in the summer.

[SPEAKER_01]: I went to school there.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I can not a lot of sweating in the movie.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have to applaud your makeup crew because I know everyone had to be drenched.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's times I was like, don't wipe off too much you guys.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it's like, you know, 80, like, I want us to look a bit shiny.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to be a little shiny, um, I don't think we were shiny enough.

[SPEAKER_02]: But, um, yeah, that was hard.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I'm trying to think there was not a ton.

[SPEAKER_02]: There was, I mean, every shot was hard because we were, again, very specific.

[SPEAKER_02]: We had besides the doom buggy, there's the big, um,

[SPEAKER_02]: mobile home that the twin of course was also like a total lemon and with just hard to drive.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, everything was really I had to learn how to ride that little mini bike.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it was fun.

[SPEAKER_02]: We had some fun wheels on that.

[SPEAKER_00]: film, but it was, uh, speaking of vehicles, did I hear that Billy Zayn's vehicle got impounded while shooting the movie?

[SPEAKER_02]: Like his personal vehicle?

[SPEAKER_00]: No, no, the vehicle in the movie.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, he drives.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't remember.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: Few things I didn't shoot was his scenes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, I don't remember.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

[SPEAKER_00]: I believe I was told something about that, but I'll have to double check.

[SPEAKER_00]: I would have

[SPEAKER_00]: That's pretty funny.

[SPEAKER_01]: That is funny.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, I've been in Richmond.

[SPEAKER_01]: They love taking your car away.

[SPEAKER_01]: They love it.

[SPEAKER_01]: They absolutely love it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Um, you have the greatest, you know, lineage.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think maybe the most portable movie in the past 50 years might be Napoleon Dynamite.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I have to tell you this, just off, that is a movie that I loved the first time I saw it, and every time I watched it since, I've liked it better.

[SPEAKER_01]: Both my kids loved it, my wife loves it, my grandfather, and 89 loved Napoleon Dynamite.

[SPEAKER_01]: We'd watch it on a fairly regular basis, and there's so many great catchphrases from it.

[SPEAKER_01]: When you go into a movie like this, do you think that can be a catchphrase?

[SPEAKER_01]: This is something that's going to be remembered by the movie or does that stuff happen organically?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, man.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's just like,

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's more organic, you know, I mean, some movies we see, you know, where, again, if you have studio budget, studio marketing, they try to shove it in your face and name.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And they can almost, to a degree, I mean, if a movie stinks, it stinks, no matter how much marketing or money you throw at it, but we've seen certain things that, I mean, I believe that there's certain lines from some movies that maybe,

[SPEAKER_02]: might never have made it if they hadn't been marketed that way.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, I see, go up down your throat, but for the most part, people quote things because, you know, they have the stain power, the hits.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that's up to the audience.

[SPEAKER_02]: You know, if they like it, I think this is the kind of film that does,

[SPEAKER_02]: let, you know, you frame the dialogue, you know, like we were talking about the way you framed the visuals, like Napoleon, like West Anderson, like this kind of film, you know, you frame the dialogues in a way so that it's not muddled up when and it's hard to, you know, you

[SPEAKER_02]: get through all the dirt in the muck to like single out some of these lines.

[SPEAKER_02]: These get their own petos each line gets its own pedestal and and you know some of them are going to be quoteable and hopefully you know these stick.

[SPEAKER_01]: When you were making Napoleon, when you were a young Hollywood up in summer, did you feel that there was the potential for the catchphrases to go wild?

[SPEAKER_02]: I did it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I did you hope.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, it was more like, I guess I hoped.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was more like, I think I had the potential.

[SPEAKER_02]: I knew the way I looked at it was always, and was the reality of the situation.

[SPEAKER_02]: I knew I was in an independent film.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was being made by college students that may never see the light of day.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I knew it was like, well, for all we know, like, nobody will see this movie.

[SPEAKER_02]: Even if we think it's great,

[SPEAKER_02]: if people see this, I don't see why they wouldn't totally quote it, but only if they get it and because I was going off of like, we did a short film of Napoleon first, a couple years prior, and that worked so well, but it was a short film, you have a small group of people who see that thing, but those who did see it, quote it it, I loved I was like, this is the kind of event,

[SPEAKER_02]: You know, we had different cast, we shot it in color, we shot it on, it was just shot differently.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was like, maybe this won't translate, maybe not, but if it does, oh, we've got all these characters, each one with their own catch phrases.

[SPEAKER_02]: And not, and again, not that we were shooting for that because they weren't like repeating, yeah, I'm Napoleon says is

[SPEAKER_02]: Gosh.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Idiot.

[SPEAKER_02]: And you'll say that over and over.

[SPEAKER_02]: But it felt less like a, I believe it felt, we didn't want it to feel like an SNL sketch.

[SPEAKER_03]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: That was running the lines, you know, over and over and over, just to get it stick.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was more like.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was simple stuff that, you know, you would say in real life anyway.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'd never felt like the here's this word again, it'd never felt unorganic during Napoleon whereas by the time it's the third sketch of a recurring character on Saturday and I live, you're done because they've done everything they can do with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: You majored in computer animation and 3D animation, it bring them young?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, how cool was it in 2012 when you got to do the Napoleon Dynamite cartoons?

[SPEAKER_01]: Was that your first toe dip into real big animation?

[SPEAKER_02]: No, I had done a voice work for animations before that.

[SPEAKER_02]: on Monster House, on a couple other projects.

[SPEAKER_02]: So by the time this came around, this was more like this felt less animation and just again doing more of Napoleon.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it was all the same cast, the same writer and uh, did you get to record with the other cast members or was it done separately?

[SPEAKER_01]: Cause it had to be a blast to get in there with the same people and revisit the characters and not have to do makeup.

[SPEAKER_02]: it was it was amazing and it really was like you know we have always me and the rest of the cast have always seen each other throughout the years for reunions or lows.

[SPEAKER_02]: Special screenings of movie like this has brought us together you know over the

[SPEAKER_02]: over the course of the last 20 years and so doing the animation wasn't like oh we hadn't seen but yeah there was still a handful of some of the cast that we had not seen plus getting together everybody at the same time when we did the table reads yeah or the animations that was like magic because everybody at once wears when we recorded you may be recorded the same time as one other person

[SPEAKER_01]: so you've been married a long time.

[SPEAKER_01]: How long?

[SPEAKER_01]: 22 years?

[SPEAKER_01]: 23.

[SPEAKER_01]: 23 years.

[SPEAKER_01]: How many and you have three kids?

[SPEAKER_01]: Four.

[SPEAKER_01]: Four.

[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_01]: I saw sources that said both.

[SPEAKER_01]: So four kids.

[SPEAKER_01]: I won't tell you which one.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wrong all day.

[SPEAKER_00]: I know.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to tell which kid I forgot because they'd hate me.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm curious how old are the kids and are they aware of what you do?

[SPEAKER_02]: My oldest is 18, I guess, and then I have a 16 and a 12 year old and an eight year old, so obviously they know what you do.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they know what I do, and my two oldest are kind of like, you know, they're the teenagers where my two younger ones were the younger ones, a little bit of a split there.

[SPEAKER_02]: but I've seen two of them go through teenager them and at first, you know, when they were younger, they were like, okay, this is cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because, but it's different because like anything else, they were introduced to the movie first and thought, this is a great movie.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, whoa, it's you, dad, you know, they see dad and before they even see the movie, they just know, Napoleon Dynamite to them is a magic word.

[SPEAKER_02]: If we say that word, if we hear that in public that people are going to react, and it was almost like not just a magic word, but yeah, they could use it.

[SPEAKER_02]: My two younger kids, my one, my 11, my 12-year-old would like three or four, you know, three years ago, I remember him just loving to say like, when we were in public, he's the only time.

[SPEAKER_02]: He knew what he said it.

[SPEAKER_02]: then he would get reaction.

[SPEAKER_02]: So he could have control.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's pretty similar.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think the younger kids think it's more, you know, like, oh, this is cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: My daughter, my youngest one, she likes the movie.

[SPEAKER_02]: So she's the only one who actually says she likes.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think my 12 year old will

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's cool that you're in it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do I like it?

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think you think anything other and my teenage or teenagers don't have an opinion if they I don't think they think of it as bad or good.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're just like it's a home video.

[SPEAKER_01]: minor 23 and 25.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now you're going to get a lot cooler in the next five years.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just want you to know that they're going to love what you do.

[SPEAKER_01]: We're talking to John Heater about his new movie Tapowing Go, which starts today, available to rent anywhere you rent movies.

[SPEAKER_01]: I do have, you've been so generous with your time.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've one last question.

[SPEAKER_01]: I read that you are a Led Zeppelin fan.

[SPEAKER_02]: What's their best L.P?

[SPEAKER_02]: even recently.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I've always, you know, they're my favorite band.

[SPEAKER_02]: But only like recently this year because I read downloaded the new remastered off of Apple.

[SPEAKER_02]: And so I've been like going through all that and trying to teach my 12-year-old like the beat bit.

[SPEAKER_02]: because he loves immigrant song because it was in one of the Thor movies and then sometimes like, well, if you like that, let me and so I've been playing a lot of it recently, so it's very funny to ask.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I, you know, if you've always wanted that question, because I've never had a direct answer like one or two or three or four, but you know what, I feel like I feel like two,

[SPEAKER_02]: Let's implement two might be the most solid from beginning to end, not one.

[SPEAKER_02]: They don't have bad songs, I don't think in any of their others, but I could just like the way it flows.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's just kind of perfection.

[SPEAKER_02]: I kind of feel that way about the fourth one as well.

[SPEAKER_01]: I agree, the fourth is my favorite, because I know you care.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I do care.

[SPEAKER_02]: You're your Zeppelin head.

[SPEAKER_02]: You know, Zeppelin.

[SPEAKER_02]: I just I care.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love them all so much.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they feel like my baby is just be careful because my daughter really stole my copy of Led Zeppelin 3 and then denied it.

[SPEAKER_01]: I said, I don't find my copy of Led Zeppelin 3 around here.

[SPEAKER_02]: She's like, I don't know where it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: Something more than happy of my kids were stealing my CDs.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think that would be great.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because you don't like anything when they're younger.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're like, listen, as you music, and they think it's cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now they get, and then they get in their teens and like, oh my gosh, are you kidding?

[SPEAKER_02]: None of your stuff is good.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was like, that is a lie and you know it because you are

[SPEAKER_02]: quoting, I know your musical history, and you're only listening to that because of this, which I introduced you to, you know, like you said, probably in five years, I'll get some appreciation.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, good for you, John Heeter, tapowing go is streaming or rentable today, anywhere you can stream movies, you work charming and a thrill to speak to, and I just can't say thank you enough.

[SPEAKER_01]: I really appreciate you joining us today.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, thank you for having me.

[SPEAKER_01]: And so check out Tapowingo.

[SPEAKER_01]: You will like it.

[SPEAKER_01]: That is my personal guarantee to you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Again, thank you to John Heeter.

[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you to Chad Dukes.

[SPEAKER_01]: And thank you to Dylan.

[SPEAKER_01]: Our fine director who made all this happen.

[SPEAKER_01]: Go check this movie out.

[SPEAKER_01]: You'll like it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Have a great day everybody.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if it's not too early John, this will be the first time I say it this year.

[SPEAKER_01]: Merry Christmas.

[SPEAKER_02]: Merry Christmas.

[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much.

[SPEAKER_01]: See you later.