Transcript: Talking about... Digital transformation with CAF Bank

00:00:06 Clare Mills, CFG

Well, hello. Today we're talking about something that affects nearly every charity in the country, and that is banking and specifically what happens when your bank changes the way they do things and things that you've got used to over the years that you've, if you've grumbled about them, you know what you're doing.

00:00:21 Clare Mills, CFG

And.

00:00:21 Clare Mills, CFG

Has changed our guests today are from CAF Bank, an organisation that's recently been through, maybe still going through a major digital transformation. In this conversation, we're going to dig into the why behind every change, we always think about the why the purpose of it? Why did CAF Bank make the changes they've made? What was the thinking behind that? And we're going to explore what charities.

00:00:42 Clare Mills, CFG

And learn from this experience.

00:00:43 Clare Mills, CFG

Things you might be dealing with your own bank, changing their systems or thinking about digital change within your organisation. Importantly.

00:00:50 Clare Mills, CFG

We'll look ahead.

00:00:51 Clare Mills, CFG

So this is a conversation about lessons learned, practical advice and the bigger picture facing charities today. Welcome to Allie Taylor, CEO of CAF Bank, and Richard Hunt, director of customer and lending.

00:01:03

Hi there. Hey there.

00:01:04 Clare Mills, CFG

Thank you so much for joining us today. Shall we start with the big picture context? How would you describe the current environment for both charities and banks? What are some of the challenges you're seeing at the moment?

00:01:16 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

So I think I think the first thing I'd say we probably all need to acknowledge just how intertwined the two sectors are. But all of us who are active in the charity sector, the, the ability to hold and look after our money and move it around safely is incredibly important the charity. So at the moment and I do feel like I've said this many times, but it it never feels more.

00:01:42 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Critical than it than at this stage the charity sector is continuing to operate in a landscape shaped by inflationary cost pressures. The growing competition for funding and ever increasing demand for services our parent organisation charities Aid Foundation undertakes.

00:02:02 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Continuous research with with donors and with charities, and we've just published our CAF UK Charity Insights for 2020.

00:02:10 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Five and they say 44% of charity leaders, citing cost rises as one of their main challenges.

00:02:18 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

That 83% of charities are recording an increase in demand for services over the last 12 months, and only 30% of charity leaders think that the sector is in a healthy position.

00:02:32 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

And I just think you know, these are really concerning stats for anyone that passionately believes in the role of charities in, in the UK economy and in society, which which is very much the role that we want to support charities to fulfil from, from CAF Bank. We've seen donating and volunteering falling.

00:02:53 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

To their lowest level in a decade, and I think for anyone really interested in understanding UK giving trends.

00:03:01 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

The CAF UK, giving a report at 2025, is also now freely available on on the CAF website and there has so much detailed analysis in there. I really recommend anyone that's that's interested to just download your copy of that and and and have.

00:03:17 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

A read.

00:03:18 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

From a banking perspective, we continue to see.

00:03:21 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

A number of banks delivering a poor proposition for charities, and I know Clare, you and and safety have done so much work in this space that I I I know you will recognise what I'm talking about.

00:03:32 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Their digital journeys or designed for businesses and they often struggle to to be navigable by by charities when they come to do their online banking, and in particular we see challenges around KYC and CDD, which often impacts the ability to make international payments in particular. So the charities.

00:03:53 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Seeking to make payments of of aid to high risk jurisdictions that can be really challenging.

00:03:59 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

And so it's all of those issues that we see charity struggling with that that we want to address 3 cats banking and that's why we've gone through the transformation that we have.

00:04:10 Clare Mills, CFG

So that's a really comprehensive picture, Ali and and interesting, you know talking that 44% of charity leaders are seeing cost rises at the pressure that can be one of the triggers for digital transformation, but also so can trying to improve systems and how you interact with your customers or your service users or the people your beneficiary.

00:04:29 Clare Mills, CFG

So what was it that made CAF Bank digital transformation necessary? What were your key drivers to to go down this road?

00:04:36 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

There's a number.

00:04:37 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Of overlapping drivers. The needs of our customers to have same day payments to have access to a greater range of information in one place, to have a much more flexible online banking system. It's something that they're fed back to us extensively over the years and that we needed to do.

00:04:55 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Who?

00:04:56 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

There's an item around future proofing as sales as a bank about making sure that we're able to adapt to changing needs as they come through. And we've seen that through things like confirmation of payee that have been developed over the last couple of years. So making sure that the banks are able to deliver those changes as they come through in a way that's seamless. There's a really important piece about scalability.

00:05:18 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

We are absolutely evangelical, would say about the need for specialist banks and the need for banks that understand the sector. But to do that we need to scale. We need to serve more customers in the.

00:05:30 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Sector.

00:05:31 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And we need to offer a viable alternative for the High Street and our previous platform have reached the end of its scalability. So there is a need to.

00:05:40 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

To build that capacity in and last but not least, there's technology, driver technology changes and the pace of technology change increases over time.

00:05:48 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And the ability to move to cloud computing, the ability to have the security that provides and to manage some of our risk on that front is really important. So you get those items all overlapping and all coming together. That creates a needs to to do this kind of major project and they are major projects.

00:06:08 Clare Mills, CFG

That's one of the huge challenges with change, isn't it? Because sometimes you can make incremental change and you can keep improvements. Sometimes you just have to go for The Big Bang.

00:06:17 Clare Mills, CFG

So when you're thinking about change and I guess this is where we can broaden it out a bit for all sorts of of models of change and and big projects. But how did you prepare for change because you've got a huge range of different stakeholder groups as any charity will be if they're going through a big process of change your transformation?

00:06:37 Clare Mills, CFG

How did you sort out those stakeholder groups? How did you prioritise and what worked? What didn't what?

00:06:42 Clare Mills, CFG

I suppose the key, you know the obvious question. What would you do differently next time? Talk us through some of that, Richard.

00:06:48 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Absolutely. As you say, admins question and we we start by think about our customer base and our our staff team. But there are tremendous number of stakeholders involved in any big transformation projects and part of the discovery at the start is just making sure you have those stakeholders mapped identified and all onboarded.

00:07:08 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

If we think about bank.

00:07:10 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

The simple delivery of a faster payment from 1 into the next involves a number of partners, making sure their systems integrate properly and so that's stakeholder management is really important. But let's think about our customers. So I think they're a really good microcosm of.

00:07:25 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Of where change management happens and something that probably is quite applicable to most people as they think about those that they interact on a transformation. And firstly I'll say it's a long process.

00:07:36 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

I mean for us.

00:07:38 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

This kicked off in earnest in 2020 for a delivery in 2025, not quite intended to be that long. I think that'd be fair to say there was a small pandemic in the middle, but you know that side. It's a long process. Even without that, what you're looking to do is make sure that you bring your.

00:07:55 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

The contact points for us, their customers on board at the appropriate point in that journey. If you bring them on too early, then you lose their interest and their attention and you promise things that you're not yet in a.

00:08:06 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Position to deliver.

00:08:08 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Versus bringing them on too late.

00:08:10 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And you've got a thing through as you you work through that process, all of the risks involved. So for us, there's risks around people not being informed and able to access their banking. There's also risks about fraud and opening our our customers to fraud attacks by providing too much information too early. That allows those bad actors to act. So you're trying to balance those various factors.

00:08:33 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

As we go through.

00:08:35 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

For us, the Custom Commons campaign started in earnest back in summer 2024 for a summer 2025 launch.

00:08:43 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Again, it's it's probably something that fits with many other organisations. The first stage on that was about having clean data. Now I suspect banks are not alone in having people that haven't quite updated the information they hold with them. So we we starting with the process of doing that and I think one of the learnings that we share with other people.

00:09:03 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Is that you need to do that. You see things in multiple ways. So for instance for updating details, not only do we communicate directly with customers, we had a process of when people called in asking them to update their details.

00:09:16 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And we had on our online banking prompt screens to go and update the details and assuming that one method will reach all is simply not viable. It's about having multiple ways through we we then saw a of a very well tracked process based upon e-mail communications going out to customers and.

00:09:36 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

One of the things that we did was to plan that through to make sure that we distributed different bits of information only to the people that were relevant to them. For us, that was about thinking about user groups and thinking about changes that would particularly affect those user groups and communicating that information to them.

00:09:54 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

So that the e-mail that came through to people was relevant to them and they had something to engage with rather than receiving irrelevant information.

00:10:01 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And so it's on the feedback we had was that that helped people make sure they prioritise those one of the other things that we saw was that we were able to track some metrics and not track others.

00:10:14 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And you can track open rates, but you can't always track action rates and what you can't really track is where information is passed on to and making sure it gets to the relevant user. So one of the things that we'd feedback to others is to think about making sure that the distribution is wide enough within the people that interact. And that's particularly with charities.

00:10:35 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

You know, the vast majority of UK charities are small local organisations powered by volunteers and as most of US volunteer, I think we'd all say that there's never quite enough volunteering hours to go.

00:10:45 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And and therefore, what we often find is that people doing banking are holding other roles and doing other things, and therefore it's important to try and help them get the information across to the other users in their organisation that may need it.

00:10:59 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

We also find there's a tremendous variety of structures within the UK charities, so the the wonderfulness of assets that was its diversity, but that also means that the way you deliver a message lands in a different way for different organisations depending on who they have chosen to be their key contacts.

00:11:17 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

When we also think about preparing for change, we also think about what we did in terms of expecting a surge in contact. And so for us, part of that was taking some of our business development resources and repurposing all of that to the preemptive customer contact before the event. So we know that there's a tremendous range of customer.

00:11:38 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Interaction with CAF.

00:11:40 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Bank from small, local charities that might have reasonably minimal interaction to some fairly major names. They have lots of interaction and making sure that we've identified those where they may need an extra helping hands and reached out to them beforehand to make sure they were aware and looking forward to what was coming through.

00:12:00 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And then doing that again afterwards. So after we passed that transition place and for caffeine this year, this was a Big Bang movement that happened in June.

00:12:09 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Having those resources that normally would be devoted to other roles.

00:12:14 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Put on to proactive call, contact reactive calls etcetera. Increased size of call centre teams and making sure that as much.

00:12:24 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

As we can.

00:12:26 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Will reach everyone. Now we know that the first week or two were was significantly challenging in terms of incoming call volumes. I think we had 10 times more calls in a day in the first week.

00:12:39 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

CAF Bank historically has a court weight title of under 2 minutes, which meant that when it was definitely not under 2 minutes and was significantly longer, that was almost even harder to.

00:12:48 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Bear.

00:12:49 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

We saw that move and we saw us increase the number of staff.

00:12:53 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And and we took the the increased levels of continued increase in them all through those first few weeks.

00:12:59 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

One of the things we're feedback to other people think about digital transformation is expect the nature of the queries to change. So we saw the start here. It's being very quick easy queries where people may not have got the message, but people may not have have tagged something as a piece of spam rather than identifying it.

00:13:20 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

To 3-4 weeks down the line, much more detailed nuance queries about their particular areas, and so thinking about how your staff will need to react to that.

00:13:30 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And supports animal resilience.

00:13:33 Clare Mills, CFG

A huge amount to think about there, Richard, and that, you know, when we started off talking about all the different groups of stakeholders, it's come really clear that you were focused really heavily on your customers. Whenever we make a new product or develop a new service, there's always that iterative stage where we need to change this bit. Have you had any changes to make since The Big Bang, but also what have you got planned for the future?

00:13:54 Clare Mills, CFG

Because you've talked about this being scalable and future proof. So what's coming down the track?

00:13:59 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

We certainly have been making a lot of changes since since the launch, so we've been, we've been listening intently to our customer feedback, whether whether positive or negative and to be honest, it's been invaluable in enhancing the proposition that we're offering and and prioritising that ongoing change agenda which you know frankly.

00:14:20 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Now we are in in a sort of continuous change. A lot of that will be small and but there are there are some bigger product changes coming through as well. So I think I think at this stage we've been able to put through high volumes of of necessary changes since since I'll go live.

00:14:40 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

In June and that has been brilliant. That's something that we've really struggled with in the in the past on our legacy systems it was.

00:14:47 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

We're always quite nervous of making changes, to be honest and and this now having the ability ability to be so much more agile and to change it pace is is an absolute game.

00:14:58 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Changer for us?

00:14:59 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

So particular areas that I'd called out since launch, enabling customers to connect properly with QuickBooks.

00:15:07 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Improving search functionality and probably the biggest area of challenge that that we had for some customers was our bulk payments process.

00:15:15 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Yes, and and we have to hold our hands up to that, right. We didn't have a good enough understanding of how some of our customers used bulk payments functionality and we didn't design it to cover all of the use cases that that customers had previously had. And I think that that's our single biggest area of challenge.

00:15:36 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

For customers by a long way.

00:15:38 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Too done a.

00:15:39 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Huge amount of work to rebuild that and to think about alternative options for for customers that are using it in a in a far more extensive way than we had ever anticipated.

00:15:52 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

And so that's something that we're still rolling out the, the the final versions of that and and really in terms of the in terms of the future.

00:16:04 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

You know, this is just a start for CAF Bank providing better services for charities. We're we're aiming to double and then treble our customer numbers over the next few years.

00:16:10 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Well.

00:16:16 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

We want to expand the proposition for loyalty charities like I said, and particularly there, I think, looking at growing our lending and our green financing options, we've got new products to launch around revolving credit facilities and and other loan types and also around home deposits which.

00:16:36 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Unbelievably, on our legacy system, we couldn't. We couldn't properly offer and so I'm very, I'm so relieved that we're we're getting to the point where all of these things that we've had in, in on our wish list for a long time, we'll finally be able to to bring to fruition.

00:16:53 Clare Mills, CFG

It sounds like an exciting future for your customers and for everybody at at CAF Bank as well. And it's a useful reminder, I suppose, that whether you work in a bank supporting charity accounts or whether you work in a charity. However, you volunteer, whatever role you take, we're all part of the charity ecosystem. We're all here to try.

00:17:13 Clare Mills, CFG

And make the world a better place for the people and communities that we serve. And it sounds as though you're giving that a.

00:17:19 Clare Mills, CFG

Huge amount of thought.

00:17:21 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

If I could just jump in on that quickly clear like I'm one of the things that has been really heartening for us is is exactly that sense of ownership. I think that many in the sector have towards CAF Bank, it really is, it is the bank for the sector and that's what we're what we're trying to be here and.

00:17:41 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

And we are mission-led in in what we do and I think we have really felt even at at points that have been really difficult for us. When you know the last thing we ever want to do is disappoint any of our customers and in the in the toughest couple of weeks.

00:17:56 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

When the bulk payments processes were tough and we had.

00:18:00 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

High call volumes.

00:18:02 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

You know, they these were these were really.

00:18:04 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Hard for all of.

00:18:05 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Our staff and and and we were intensely worried about it and I think.

00:18:10

One of the.

00:18:11 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

One of the best things was the amount of goodwill that we felt from most of our customers and and you know just stakeholders across the sector towards us. I think yeah, that that was huge and it really carried the organisation through through those tougher couple of weeks.

00:18:29 Clare Mills, CFG

Yeah, because we talk. That sounds good because we talked about some of our stakeholders and of course our staff or our staff and volunteers in the charity sector are pretty much our high value, high interest, high-powered stakeholders. So it's so important to look after them. We've got a focus at the moment across the sector and.

00:18:47 Clare Mills, CFG

Well-being and.

00:18:48 Clare Mills, CFG

Caring for each other in in quite challenging times, and I think that's coming across.

00:18:53 Clare Mills, CFG

Where what would you share with other organisations or or you know, what's your your key learning from going through a big transformation project? What? What would you? What should people think about at the beginning and what will they be relieved about at the end? Is there ever an end?

00:19:13 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

And I feel like I feel like both of us could probably talk about this for hours to to get to a few sort of pithier lessons learned, I think.

00:19:22 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

I think actually one of one of the one of the key points I'd call out is not getting to the point where you've almost left it too late and you've got really hard deadlines that you're up against the if, if if it's a large scale transformation.

00:19:40 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

You need a lot of time.

00:19:42 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

For planning for requirements gathering for execution and then for for customer readiness, for staff readiness, there's a lot of phases to work through and you need the proper time to to do those really thoroughly. So I think it's really tempting for organisations to look at these digital.

00:20:01 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Transformation aspirations and think my goodness that it's hard. I might leave that.

00:20:05 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

For the next the next crew.

00:20:08 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Or I'll just wait to do this bit of work over here, or I'll just see this feasibility study.

00:20:14 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

That's where a lot of programmes go wrong. Where you you end up, you know, just having to to rush something that is incredibly complex and high risk to.

00:20:23 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Deliver.

00:20:24 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

So being realistic about the timeline, absolutely fundamental.

00:20:30 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Equally, getting the very best people, the best experience that you can possibly afford on the pitch, and that's difficult for so many of us. If you're a small organisation, chances are that your team will not have been through anything like this previously and and you need to import that experience. And it is really expense.

00:20:49 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

So if so, being realistic about that, I think it's it's key.

00:20:54 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

And then I guess really expecting that there will be challenges along the way and having the resilience to deal with that if somebody?

00:21:03 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Has to have.

00:21:03 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

The broad shoulders that that keeps everybody's motivated and confident that come what may, you are going to deliver this, that can be quite at all.

00:21:14 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

All of us, I think from the bank executive.

00:21:16 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

And and you.

00:21:17 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Know board as well.

00:21:18 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Well, there are definitely moments of deep challenge where you really you really question and and and I think then you've got to have your eyes on the outcomes that you're trying to deliver and the the positive benefit you're trying to bring to your customers, not not just for your own organisation.

00:21:37 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

I think that's.

00:21:39 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

I think one of the guiding principles for us is about being really clear about what the outcome you're trying to get to, not the thing. But the the output, the impact that that's going to have.

00:21:50 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

I think there's something also about understanding that in digital transformation actually the technology is only part of it and that the people and the processing the stakeholders are equal and at times bigger parts of it and that the the bit that you do in the middle with the tech will only be just that the the bit that enables it.

00:22:11 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

And I think.

00:22:12 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

There's there's something else about. And you said earlier, Clare, about does change ever end? And there's probably saying now that change doesn't ever end and that actually.

00:22:23 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

This is about putting yourself into a position where you can manage incremental change safely and repeatedly.

00:22:31 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

I'm very much for anyone that's starting to consider their own digital transformation. I very much think about what comes after it as you start it. So to not believing that once you've finished, you have been the sunny uplands where you never have to change again, but understand that this will be the start of a new process of continual improvements.

00:22:52 Clare Mills, CFG

That's really a good note to end on there really, Richard, before kind of wrap up is.

00:22:58 Clare Mills, CFG

Change isn't going to stop because look at the pace of change that's all around us. If we don't lean into that some of the time, at least we we will be ending up in that situation where everything needs to change because we've left it all too late. I think from our perspective here at CFG, where we're implementing a new CRM.

00:23:18 Clare Mills, CFG

It does feel like it's so important, as you say, not to say it's about the shiny thing.

00:23:23 Clare Mills, CFG

But it is about all the things that the shiny thing will help you do, and all of the different ways you'll be able to work, and the different ways you'll be able to meet the needs of your beneficiaries and meet your charitable objectives. Or in your case, you know, meet your meet your business needs and meet your customers needs. And you started your process in 2020. It's now 2025. We have a pandemic, of course.

00:23:43 Clare Mills, CFG

Let's not forget that if there's one thing we know about the charity sector, it's that people are adapted for and people are committed and prepared to do what they can to make lives better for everybody. As I said earlier.

00:23:57 Clare Mills, CFG

It feels like the key takeaways here coming to two categories. First is around digital transformation, I guess, which is.

00:24:03 Clare Mills, CFG

Things like throw the.

00:24:04 Clare Mills, CFG

Rubbish out before you move house, clean your data, get your data in as good a shape as it can be sent. It's a data boot camp because you don't want to have the hassle of moving 100,000 pieces of data that are actually irrelevant.

00:24:17 Clare Mills, CFG

And you could move 40,000 of really valuable bits of data.

00:24:22 Clare Mills, CFG

You want to be taking all of the people with you and really building that sense of excitement and optimism and passion into the change project because you want your data systems to be supporting data-led decision making and helping people do their jobs more effectively and support your customers or your beneficiaries more effectively.

00:24:41 Clare Mills, CFG

But that bigger piece that's really around culture, can I throw in one more question that wasn't on my question List, ally, which is has this had an impact on the culture at the bank, the big change, how or how have you protected the positive cult?

00:24:55

Yeah.

00:24:56 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

I think that's really interesting actually it it it has had has had impacts and I think one of the things I reflect on now is it's given us.

00:25:07 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

A lot more.

00:25:08 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Confidence as an organisation, I think doing something of this magnitude and if I may, you know, compared to some.

00:25:17 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Larger institutions, you know, although we have had some regrettable moments and and we we have caused some difficulty and and and I don't I don't shy away from that for a moment compared to the scale of the.

00:25:30 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Risks that that.

00:25:31 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

There are in it large transformation project I think.

00:25:35 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Many of our people feel rightly proud of the the job that we've done as a as a very little bank, and I think we've got confidence in our ability to deliver change and to do hard things in it in a way that we just didn't have before. So that's probably one of the one of the most critical benefits I think from from our perspective.

00:25:56 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Alongside the fact that nothing has embedded our customer centric focus.

00:26:04 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

This like this because the whole thing has been about what can we deliver for customers, how can we grow to serve more? How can we grow to serve better and and and and what more can we do? And I think because that's gone right across the organisation, it's not just the frontline teams, every part of the bank.

00:26:24 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Has been involved in that journey. Everyone now really understands we're we're all either serving our charity customers or we're helping our colleagues to do it. I think that has really embedded and I'm really pleased with that. And it's also the risk management.

00:26:40 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Peace our broader understanding of collaboration between different areas of the organisation, all of those internal aspects as well, I think we've we've had significant benefits from.

00:26:53 Clare Mills, CFG

So that team building can certainly be a part of the benefits of of a big transformation. So really the key takeaways there are lean interchange because it's coming whether you like it or not, make sure you go along and make a plan. It will take longer than you think it's going to take try and get the best expertise you can find.

00:27:13 Clare Mills, CFG

And ultimately, I think there's an element there of. Also, it's going to be hard, but enjoy the ride because you will learn a lot from it and your teams will learn a lot from it and they will grow as a team. If you can nurture that culture that surrounds you while you're going through change a few things that you might want to look at as listeners, there's numerous resources on banking.

00:27:34 Clare Mills, CFG

And on digital transformation on CFC's website particularly, you might also want to look at CAF Banks, charity resource hub and please share your feedback or any questions you've got for the CFG team buyer or our communication channels here at CFG, stay tuned for future episodes. Obviously, I'd really like to thank Ali Taylor.

00:27:53 Clare Mills, CFG

And Richard Hunt, from CAF Bank for giving up their time to talk to us.

00:27:56 Clare Mills, CFG

Today I could.

00:27:58 Clare Mills, CFG

Listen to and talk about banking challenges for a very long time. Today, they've shown a lot of light on the change that they've been through at CAP bank and I'd like to really also thank you for your honesty and your openness about sharing the journey that you've been on and that we're still on.

00:28:13 Clare Mills, CFG

Thanks very much.

00:28:15 Alison Taylor, CAF Bank

Thanks so much, Clare. Thank you.

00:28:17 Richard Hunt, CAF Bank

Thank you.