As a church, we want to be more known for what we're
for than what we're against.
So I want to speak up in the most positive way I
can, affirming what scripture affirms.
But that also means at times making clear what
scripture disaffirms.
Allowing ambiguity is really doing a disservice
to our people and our culture.
And so I just feel like it's been a time that
calls for greater speaking up.
There are times I have something I'm going to
preach, and I actually tell myself,
"Okay, how could I preach this like even stronger?"
And what's interesting is those hard truths, the
stronger I preach them,
the greater the response is, both from those who
follow Jesus and those who don't yet.
This is the Made to Advance Podcast. I'm your
host, Brian Aulick.
We're here to inspire and equip you for your best
future.
Well, hey, everybody, welcome to Made to Advance.
So good to be with you today.
And before we get started in our conversation, I
want to encourage you to subscribe.
I want to encourage you to rate and review our
show.
It really does help us get the word out to more
people,
and it helps us bring on more great guests like
the one we have today.
So you actually know this guest. His name is Mike
Lipke. He's a personal training coach.
He is the 20-year veteran owner of Vallejo
Training here in Holland, Michigan.
And I had Mike on a number of months ago, and we
talked about a really challenging
visibility, eye vision situation that he deals
with and how he prevails in the midst of that
challenge. So I encourage you, we'll put in the
show notes, make sure you go back and listen.
But Mike texts me a few weeks ago, and he's like,
"Hey, I got an idea. What if I interview you,
Brian?" And I was like, I don't know how I
replied. I think I like put a laughing emoji
or something back. And I'm like, "What are you
even talking about?" And he's like,
"No, really." So I finally realized Mike was
serious, 'cause maybe you'll pick up in this
conversation, Mike likes joking around a little
bit. And so I finally, when I realized it's
serious,
said, "All right, let's do it." So Mike, welcome.
I'm glad you're here, man.
And I'm glad to be here. And that is all that
accurate except for one detail, Brian.
What's that?
You are today's guest on your own podcast.
All right.
That is what they'll be. Yes, prompted by so many
similarities in our background.
Yeah.
Grew up in the great state of Indiana from a
traditional denominational background.
Both of us went to fantastic universities in
Indiana, except you.
[laughter]
I knew it.
And we have been here in West Michigan doing Lord's
work adjacently for almost 20 years now.
It has been a joy to serve with you and be led by
you. And I thought, we're listening to so many
fantastic stories of what God's doing amongst His
people, but I think I'm uniquely qualified
to tease out of you a great story of God's as
well. So if you could bless us all with a little
bit of your background, how you came up, what you
did, where the prompting came to get into
ministry,
what brings you to West Michigan, just lay it out,
brother.
Yeah. Well, I appreciate your kind words. And it's
fun to look back and think how long we've
been doing ministry and leadership together in
West Michigan. And so I appreciate you,
and I value you, and I love your family. And so
even that you came up with this idea,
it's a huge honor. Appreciate it. I'll give you
the nutshell, and then you can press in
where you wanna press in.
And I will.
'Cause we got a lot of years to cover. I'm not...
Neither of us have been getting any younger over
these last 20 years.
That's how it works. That's how it works.
Yeah, I grew up in Fort Wayne, Indiana, and grew
up in a tough situation in many regards. I had
two parents, I'm blessed for that, but we had a
lot of acrimony in our home, I would say. And so
that was a key part of my background. I gave my
life to Jesus in middle school, and then in high
school, I would say I really got serious about
faith. I went through some things that caused me
to really say, "Okay, am I following Jesus or am
I not? Am I gonna have idols of popularity and
friends and these different things, or am I gonna
be all in for Jesus?" And I chose being all in
for
Jesus. So that was a key moment in high school,
and it really set my spiritual trajectory. I had
always wanted to go into business my whole life.
I'm a nerd, man. Starting in middle school, I was
reading books on marketing and sales and
management, leadership, all these things.
And so I went to Indiana University, home of, yes,
the Big Ten Conference title this year,
the Heisman Trophy Award winner. So just a few
things going on, but anyway...
A few things going on. We'd like to make a note
for the record, very little talk of IU basketball.
We'll bring that up later. Bring that up later.
That is true. That is true. So went to IU to get
a business degree and fully expected to go into
the marketplace. I was doing ministry at the
college level that whole time through. And then
right before all these companies are supposed to
come in and interview... In fact, I had a week's
worth of interviews lined up. First week, it was
time to find a real job. And Christina and I,
we were engaged at that point, and we were at a
concert, an outdoor concert. She was with her
friends, I was with mine. And this musician was
talking, not about ministry, but I just sensed
the clearest, clearest leading from the Holy
Spirit that I was supposed to cancel all my
interviews, and I was supposed to head into
ministry and go to seminary first. So that's
what I did. And I actually asked Christina, I'm
like, "You're not gonna believe this." And I said,
"Here's what I was sensing," and she said, "I do
believe it, 'cause I feel like the Lord said the
same thing to me at that time." Crazy, huh? That
is crazy.
So yeah, so made that move. I got a master's
degree in a seminary in Chicago called Trinity
Evangelical Divinity School. And then from there,
ended up, after three years, moving to Holland
because my very first ministry opportunity was at
a church called Central Wesleyan. I was their
young adults pastor, so college and 20s. And I
was there for five years, and just incredible
time of
life change. You come out, and I don't know what
people think of when you think of, oh, you're
called to be a pastor, but it's like anything
else. You're like, "I feel like the Lord's saying
to do this, but I don't know if I can do it." And
so for five years, we had some good fruit.
We saw people come to the Lord, and I was able to
preach. And man, so many times I get done
preaching,
Christina remembers this as well as I do, and I'd
sit down next to her, and I'd be like, "That was
the worst thing I've ever done. I want to quit."
And she'd be like, "Hang in there. It's okay."
And so there were a few of those for sure in the
early years. But about year four is when I sensed
God was saying something new was coming. I didn't
know what it was, and I started just really
praying
and seeking His face. And it had nothing to do
with the church I was at. God was doing great
things. I was fulfilled, all the things. They
were great and supportive of our ministry.
But during that time, the senior pastor said, "Would
you consider church planting here in West
Michigan?" And I was thinking, "Man, I thought
God is going to take us back to Chicago or to New
York
or Indianapolis or something like that." - Always
with those big dreams.
- That was it. And we loved the big city,
partially because there are just so many people
who are far from God there. So that was like our
thing. And through a discernment journey,
God made very clear, again, I won't belabor the
story, but in an incredibly supernatural way,
made it super clear we were supposed to start
what would become a Getty Church.
So that was 20 years ago. And so we said yes to
the Lord on that and got started and just had a
real vision to say, "We want to be an outward-focused
church. We want to make as much difference as we
can on the greatest spiritual needs and physical
needs as we can in our community and around the
world." And that's what we set out to do. And
here we are 20 years later.
- And I think the record speaks for itself. Now,
Jessica, my wife, has been part of the Vine,
which was that ministry, that outgrowth of
Central at Central West End. She was there
at the beginning. I did not join her until after
the marina. And then went and Getty was meeting
at the West Ottawa Cafetorium, multi-purpose
theater, gymnasium, cafeteria space. And here
we are now at absolutely incredible, explosive
growth. Tell us, we were there. Where are we at
now? Some of those KPIs, those kingdom
productivity indexes. What's in Getty at with
current
membership, number of decisions for Christ? What
kind of practical impact is in Getty making now,
20 years later? - Yeah, totally. I'll come back
to that. I'll just say this. It's interesting,
because I would just say at the beginning of Getty,
we never, ever talked about being a big
church. We never talked about, "Oh, when we get
all these resources," or anything like that. In
fact, it was just the opposite. Christina and I
had very real conversations of, "Hey, if this
doesn't work, the worst case scenario is we can
move in with our parents and start over again."
And we were prepared to do that. It was not like,
"Ha ha, we can always move in with the parents."
It was like, "Hey, we don't know." And because
the way we were choosing to do church was
different.
Right from the jump, we said a quarter of our
budgeted income was gonna be directed towards
missions and local global church planting. - And
still today, that's true.
- Still today. And in fact, our hope is to go
beyond that in coming years. It might happen
this year, actually. But I say that to say that
we didn't go in saying, "Oh, we're just trying.
We
just said we just wanna help people meet Jesus,
and we wanna make a difference in the world."
And it turns out that when you have that kind of
relentless focus on being about advancing the
kingdom of God, and you just keep lasered in on
those things, one, it makes a difference for the
kingdom of God, and two, it attracts other people
who wanna be part of something like that.
And so, yeah, so over the years, right now, we
probably have about 23, 2400 people who gather
on Sundays. We have another about 1200 that would
join online on any given week.
- Globally, across the world. - Yeah, across the
world, that's right.
And it is crazy when you look at the map of where
people watch from. It truly is
all across the world. It's super interesting to
think about.
- Where do you see the most growth online? In
what region, internationally?
- Yeah, internationally, it's primarily from
countries we have relationships with. You see
it all... I mean, there's countries... Just the
long list of people who stream, but a number from
Turkey, which is powerful to think that it's very
hard to be a Christian in Turkey, and there are
people in Turkey who are watching and getting
services every week. We see it in Africa, where
we've done work in the past. We see streaming
from Mexico, where we have a lot of relationships.
We
see streaming from Guatemala. So those places are
some of the bigs when it comes to streaming.
- Fantastic, very interesting. - Yeah, so last
year, I know you were
asking about metrics, and it's funny 'cause I was
gonna do the last 12-month run, and we're in the
process, actually, of pulling together those
numbers. I couldn't get you those, but in the
last ministry year, which we... Our ministry year
starts in June, and then it would end in May,
June through May. We saw 714 people make
decisions for Jesus over that time period, 215
people were
baptized. And then it's crazy, we had 215 people
baptized all last ministry year. That ministry
year ends last May. The first baptism in the new
ministry year, which was August baptism, we had
145 people get baptized. It was like nothing I've
ever seen. So it's already this year, just like
people coming to know Christ, it's really, really
exciting to see that happening.
- There is no slowing down to this heavenly
freight train.
- Right. - Brian, isn't Getty a megachurch?
- Yeah, by the definition of what people say, I
mean, kind of in the church world,
a megachurch is any church that gathers 2,000 or
more people on weekends. So by that definition,
yeah, we would be considered a megachurch. - Admittedly,
that does turn some off,
and if someone sees a Google church or something
that is highly polished, corporate,
executing on that kind of a level, on a global
level, on an excellence level, on a scale and
scope, and I hope I'm not misspeaking when I have
said to those who might push on that issue,
I've said that our leader Brian was always going
to be the captain of a multi-million dollar
organization. He is just choosing to use those
gifts and talents for the kingdom. What would
you say to someone who says, "Man, Getty's too
large. Getty's out of focus."
- Yeah, that's a great question. First, thanks
for your belief in me, because again, I was...
- Well, to the listeners... - I started this
thing out with the
basement... - I have prayed with this...
- We're moving to my parents' basement plan, but
I appreciate that.
- I have prayed with you. If anyone has concerns,
our leader, our pastor is a man of prayers,
a man of the word. I testify. Wrong hand, I
testify to that.
- Yeah, I mean, it's interesting, I think, to
really walk with any person through what a hangup
might be in a larger church. You almost have to
press in deeper. So I say that because there are
few things I can say in response to your question,
but where that comes from in someone can vary.
And
so part of me wants to say, "Hey, in the book of
Acts, after Peter preaches, shortly thereafter,
3,000 people come to know Christ." They had a
mega church right in the first century in the
first
church. So anytime somebody's like, "Oh, I just...
I'm not into mega churches. I wanna be like,
I hope you would've been okay with the early
church 'cause they got pretty big pretty fast."
I think that sometimes people get turned off from
mega churches because of a perception that
things are all about... It's impersonal, it's
just about the numbers, these sorts of things.
It's interesting, there was a book written a
number of years ago called, and I'm gonna maybe
butcher this, but it's pretty close, enough to
Google and figure out the right title,
something to the effect, "Beyond Mega Church Myths."
And it basically went through 10 common
myths that people have about mega churches and
really debunked them with research and data.
I'll give you one example. So one of them is, "Oh,
nobody knows you at a mega church,
and it's just about crowds and stuff like that."
And what I found in the first church I worked at
was a mega church. What I found is a big part of
why large churches grow bigger is because they
are ruthlessly intentional about details and
about caring for the one. I always talk about the
one,
like reaching the one and caring for the one. So
an example of that, we would have people,
the very first church I worked at, that would be
in the hospital or have some kind of care need.
And I would visit them as this young 20-something
pastor, and they would say, "I came from a church
of 200. Now I'm in this mega church, and I have
gotten more intentional care and follow-up as
part of this church than I ever did in my smaller
church." Now, that's not to say anything negative
about smaller churches at all, but the reason why
they had that care is because there was an
intentional process in place for how are we gonna
care for each person, how are we gonna walk with
them? And that's why they're... And same,
churches, for them to grow, they have to be
committed to
discipleship. We have to be committed to getting
people into smaller communities and groups.
So I just think that a lot of the things that we
have to do to grow, we have to be intentional
about the right things. And I think that a lot of...
There are just some misconceptions when
it comes to, "Oh, it's all about size." Now, I
would say for some, bigger crowds is a tougher
thing for them just by the nature of their wiring.
That's okay. And different strokes for different
folks. So it's not like... I don't believe big
churches are good and small churches are bad,
or small churches are bad and big churches... I
celebrate any church and recognize that folks
with different needs are gonna find their... Yeah.
I think it's a blessing in Scripture that
there is no instruction on how to do church. It
just says, "Do not give up the habit of meeting
others." And that's about it, because culturally
and historically, the church has needed to
operate differently and will operate differently
maybe in this culture one day. But it's hard to
argue that Ngedi is not very effective right now.
And we're always trying to grow. I mean,
always, always, always with our staff, it's one
of our key values. We're always saying,
what... we analyze ourselves every year and say,
"What are the areas that God's calling us to get
better?" And never, never stop that growth
journey. Speaking of growth, I have observed, and
others
have too, Brian, Alec, from the stage, make more
recently some very definitive statements on the
authority of Scripture, a human's identity in the
one who made us, the sanctity of marriage.
Tell me, what is it like to make what can be
sometimes controversial cultural statements?
Have you received some backlash from standing the
gap, and what's prompted that boldness?
Well, I think that on the one hand, most of what
I've said more frequently and more forcefully
recently, I have said at other times and places
even across the history of Ngedi. That being said,
there are a few topics that I just feel like are
so big in culture right now that they really
require me and us as pastoral leaders and other
kinds of leaders as well to be a little bit more
intentional about speaking about. And I think
that as a church, we want to be more known for
what we're for than what we're against, so I want
to speak up in the most positive way I can,
affirming what Scripture affirms, but that also
means at times making clear what Scripture
disaffirms. And I think that some of these issues
are so consequential to human flourishing,
individual flourishing, and cultural flourishing,
that allowing ambiguity is really doing a
disservice to our people and our culture, and so
I just feel like it's been a time that calls for
greater speaking up. And I think it's interesting
where our culture's at right now, because
I think there's been enough dissatisfaction with
some of the answers our culture is providing
that there is this, "Listen, just give it to me
straight." Like, I would argue there never has
been before in our generation where it's like, "Man,
just..." There are times I have something
I'm going to preach, and I actually tell myself,
"Okay, how could I preach this even stronger?"
And what's interesting is those hard truths, the
stronger I preach them, the greater the response
is, both from those who follow Jesus and those
who don't yet. So it's... Isn't that interesting?
Yeah, so that's the time we live in. That is the
time. It is not difficult to,
in our day and age, find controversy or injustice.
It would be not difficult to find this war,
this genocide, this political movement, this unrighteousness
to speak about. Yet,
and Getty seems to stay focused. Obviously, we
can't care about... We can't give maximum care
to everything or everyone. Through what lens do
you discern and leadership discern, "Hey,
we're gonna support this cause." Black Box, for
example. I was particularly... Just not
particularly
moved by that. Or the state of the church in
Turkey. How is a Getty leadership choosing
what injustices to meet? Yeah, that's a great
question.
And you're right, it's really important for all
of us to realize, I think most people do,
there are so many great causes and important
needs in the world that we literally just can't
help
with all of them, we can't speak to all of them,
we can't pray for all of them. So you really do
have to discern what are the key ones that God is
calling this church to. And it's interesting over
our 20-year span because at the beginning, I
think we really were asking, "What are some of
the greatest humanitarian pains in the world?"
For example, we had a lot of focus on HIV/AIDS
work at the beginning of our church. And then as
our journey progressed, I think one of the things
that really took hold in my heart and our
leadership team's heart is the state of the
unreached in our world. And specifically, there
are a lot of injustices in our world, and I think
when we think of that term or even hear that term,
we think of practical or physical injustices,
of which there are many, and they're important,
and they're heartbreaking. But what we miss is
what I think is probably the greatest spiritual
injustice, which is lack of access to the gospel.
And that took hold of our heart a number of years
ago where we realized temporal or physical
injustices are obviously super important and
matter to the heart of God, but eternal injustices
that
deal with whether a person has access to the
gospel of Jesus, which can save them for all
eternity, have an even greater weight. And so we
started shifting our resources, to be quite
honest,
we started shifting our resources. We said, "Okay,
42% of the world doesn't even have access to the
gospel." Not 42% of the world aren't followers of
Jesus, don't even have access to Jesus. So we
said,
"What we're gonna do is leverage most of our
attention and most of our resources on those
places of need, and then when it comes to
physical needs and injustices that exist,
we will come alongside those kinds of needs and
injustices within the communities that we're
addressing urgent spiritual needs, if that makes
sense." So if it's Turkey, we're there because of
the spiritual need, but then there have been
other needs relative to refugees and other things
that
we step in and say, "Hey, how can we make a
difference?" So that's kind of our criteria.
- I love it, I love it. And have you seen fruit
from that?
- Yeah, I think it's really, really cool to just...
I mean, even I think of the work in Turkey,
now there are multiple churches that have been
planted. We were able to help build a physical
church in... - Church was born there.
- Yeah, yeah. We were able to build a physical
church in Turkey that is now just absolutely
flourishing. We're hearing stories of people
coming to Christ virtually every month. I mean,
we've just helped... Our church is helping
support a podcasting ministry in Turkey that is
getting
the gospel out to thousands and thousands of
Muslims. And so that's really cool. But then,
to your point about Black Box, a ministry that we
support that's based in a country of...
Unnamed country, they're helping train people to
go into their own countries of origin,
where oftentimes it's illegal to share Jesus, and
you might even be persecuted or
arrested, et cetera. And they are training person
after person who is going back to their home
country and sharing Jesus and seeing many come to
Christ. So we're seeing tons of fruit in that,
and it's encouraging. - Like spiritual Navy SEALs.
- Exactly. - That's fantastic.
- That's the idea. - When I was on your podcast
last,
we talked... I'm not talking about my personal
situation, and I'm not wired in such a way to
care about my personal situation, but I don't
feel like I got a chance to say that,
boy oh boy, there is pain, there is suffering,
and a justified hurt, a discrimination, an
illness,
a sick child, that is real pain. And also that it's
those justified hurts that can be the most
dangerous, in that probably only Jesus is capable
of righteous anger, and although we might be
righteously angry, only for a moment turns to
vengeance. And that anger held onto can embitter
us toward God, toward His people, and that can be
the ruin of a lot of people. Leadership can be
painful like this, right? The message or the
messenger dismissed, the vision not seen, the
authority trampled. If you unpack a little bit
maybe of the difficulty or pain of leadership,
especially in ministry, of a large team and a
large group of people.
Yeah, it's a great question, and I do think it's
really important that aspiring leaders realize,
hey, there is pain that comes with leadership,
and those who are on the teams of leaders realize,
sometimes we can see a leader, whether it's a
church leader or a leader of a company or
something
like that, and think, oh man, must be nice to be
in their seat for X, Y, or Z reasons, and you
just
don't realize what's going on behind the scenes.
One of the books I read years ago, and I think
I'll get this title right, is Leadership Pain,
and the author basically argues that the lid to
your leadership is how much pain you can endure
as a leader. It's somewhat of a depressing idea...
Indeed it is.
But incredibly true, I think. And so as you
alluded to, there are all kinds of
pains that come with leadership. I think one of
the great pains for me early on was realizing
that despite my very best intentions and heart,
people have to make their own choice to grow
and to take steps that will lead with Jesus and
through Jesus to freedom. And man, it's just an
ache when you see people have, in a sense, all
the tools and resources at their fingertips to
make
the changes that they or their family desperately
need them to make, and they don't do it, and it
weighs on you. So those are pains, and then there
are pains, like you said, where a friend of mine
was a pastor friend who's just got the greatest
heart and is more of an also kind of an
entrepreneurial
creative leader, and so we get along well, but he's
like, "Even after all these years,
it's like you have an idea to help advance the
kingdom, and still there are some people that
are gonna interpret it through a cynical lens, 'Oh,
they're just trying to do this, oh, they just
that,'" and he goes, "You know, I just wish we
could lead and not have all the peanut gallery
folks having their comments and chat about
whatever." But ultimately, I think this is why
it's so important that we sense that God called
us truly to leadership, and particularly to
ministry
leadership. Charles Spurgeon used to tell
potential pastors, those who are interested in
ministry, "Do anything that you possibly can
professionally other than ministry unless God
is utterly calling you to ministry," because he
knew that this calling comes with some challenges,
and yet God's grace is sufficient when He has
called you to do the thing you're called to do.
People will come to me all the time and think, "I
could never be a pastor, I could never do your
job, I could never," and it's like, "Well, yeah,
you couldn't because you're not called to it."
You're not called to it.
But I am called to it, and so some of the things
that might really wreck one person,
God gives me the grace, and that doesn't mean it's
not painful still, but He gives me the grace to
keep going, and when you're weak, you're strong,
and I think that's really true. So I don't know,
does that answer your question or not really?
It does, and I think it... Well, it begins to
answer the question that that story is gonna
be unique for each leader, and he or she will
have to navigate that in his or her own way. I
think
support around a leader is really important,
which is an opportune time to bring up Christina.
[laughter]
It's maybe not fair to say that the two of you
run in Getty together, but you lead together,
work is here and work is home. What has Christina
meant to the vocation of Brian Aulick, and how do
you guys manage that dynamic in your marriage of
leading such a large team and organization?
Yeah, that's a great question. My marriage to
Christina outside of my relationship with Jesus
is the single biggest blessing in my life, hands
down. And she would be the first one to say
that she believes and feels called to her First
Ministry is not her staff role at church,
it is to our family and specifically to me as her
husband. And that's utterly crucial, because
even before she worked on staff, and she's worked
on staff maybe a little more than 10 years,
and of course we've been around 20, so she's...
And for the listener's sake, what is her role at
Getty?
Yeah, she's the pastor over global missions.
Pastor global missions.
Yeah, so she... On the days where ministry was
particularly hard,
Christina always created this environment, and
this is still true to this day, where you just
couldn't wait, I couldn't wait to come home. I
still can't wait to come home. I literally just
told her that this week. I told her, I said, "Christina,
this is the best part of my day,
is being home with you," even though the day was
filled with good things. So that's still the case
here, 28 years into marriage and 20 years into
Getty. And so I think that we've been able to
celebrate the good times together. Last spring,
we had a baptism, and I think it was right after
Easter, and I think it was like 80-some people
got baptized. And we're just sitting there, we're
crying, and we're up in the front row, and we're
like, "Can you believe what God is doing?" And
it's so fun to sit there with your spouse and to
be able to celebrate those great things God
has done and rejoice and be thankful. And then in
the hard times, to know that's your safest place,
you can talk about everything. And so she's just
been a tremendous source of life and joy,
and that continues literally to this day. I think
on the leadership side of things,
so the way we set it up, and churches do this
differently when there's a spouse involved,
she is not a direct report to me. So we do talk
about all things in Getty together,
but she doesn't direct report to me, she reports
to our executive pastor. And we all have, I mean,
he coaches her well, he encourages her on areas
that she needs to grow, gives her encouragement.
I do too, but I mean, that really is the coaching
dynamic. And so it's nice because
I still weigh in on things global, and she gets
my opinion at different times and stuff like that.
And that's really fun, but the real operational
stuff, I enjoy staying out of.
[laughs]
Leave that to Josh, our executive pastor.
Yes, and I get to hear those stories too from
Josh. Brian is creating another mess,
and Josh has to figure out how to clean it up.
Oh, I love it. Yeah. Well, it's so funny 'cause
sometimes Christina will have these big
issues she's trying to figure out, and I'll say,
"Josh, thank you for being the sounding board
for all of that," 'cause that meant I didn't have
to do it at home. She knows that too.
She's heard me say it, so I appreciate that
though. Our marriage is just like the absolute,
absolute rock. I mean, it's really fun to lead
out of a place of a healthy marriage.
I will echo that. The most important decision you
can make is what to do with the person and work
of Jesus Christ, and the second most important
decision, who you marry.
Do you find that you and Jess are... I guess, has
your marriage, when it comes to your
leadership, has that been a kind of a important
place of refuge or...
It's been an important place of refuge. It has
been difficult. It's been both.
You guys lead closer than we do.
This is the thing. We have a small organization
at the gym, and we have another company with
seven, so very horizontal leadership. And so work
is kind of all the time, but we have the...
We just have one rule, and it's respect the know.
Whether it's a tickle fight or I don't wanna talk
about business, someone says, "Now's not the time,"
it's respect the know.
Yeah, that's a good word. That's good practice.
We have the same where it's sometimes we're in
the mood to like, "Oh, let's talk church." Other
times it's like, "Hey, how about we talk about
anything but church right now?" Which is a good
thing.
But Jess and I operate very similarly to maybe
you and the Josh relationship, the executive
pastor, where she has a much higher function and
a gifting for vision, but has no desire
to carry that out. And I'm the integrator. I will
help you execute your plan, or if I'm not
being a helpful spouse, I will tell you why it
won't work.
Uh-huh, that's good.
Sometimes. Sometimes, right?
Hey, one thing I was gonna mention earlier, I
know that you had...
'Cause right before we got going here, you
bounced over some questions that you might be
asking. I
was thinking about the megachurch thing, and you
had had a question on there about how do we
prevent
the church from being a cult of personality?
I was just gonna get to that.
Were you really? Okay, gotcha.
Well, I thought if it was valuable, I thought I
didn't wanna...
'Cause that could be a good follow-up on the wife
talk. That's a misinterpretation of the
original Hebrew. It's "whoa, man, whoa."
Whoa.
Yeah, I was thinking about that. So maybe you
wanna ask the question on how you were gonna ask
it
about that issue.
So I... And this is the question. And Getty is on
an explosive trajectory. The word is being
preached clearly, exegetically, in an exciting
way. There is momentum here. Clearly,
in 20 years, there's something impressive going
on. I've been in the room with you.
Jokingly, I was on the elder board 14 years ago
as a 29-year-old child.
[chuckle]
Well, that's 'cause the church is... The oldest
person was probably like 34.
Right. And you were clearly the strongest voice
in the room, capable of,
we'll not say coercion, but convincing. It is a gifting.
Brian is excited about something,
he casts a vision, and other people come along
with him. That is a gifting, if it's used for
the kingdom, right? And so the obvious question
is, how do we prevent what checks and balances,
what spiritual practices? And I talked even in
most recent podcast about the spiritual practices.
It's the diet and exercise of this Christian life,
but what is uniquely in place to keep
this organization from becoming a cult
personality?
Yeah, it's a great question. And I think a few
things, but I'll tell you, it's interesting,
'cause I was thinking about that question, and I
guess the first thing I would say is sometimes
in culture, and I don't think this is where you're
coming from, but sometimes in culture,
people almost want to take shots when there is a
visible or known leader, as if that visibility
in and of itself is a bad thing. And I always
want to push back on that, because really,
starting from the early Church, we see key named
figures in the Bible who had a disproportionate
influence on the advancement of the kingdom of
God. Peter was a player. I mean, he got things
moving. And we see Peter's faults, but we also
see God use him in some powerful ways, and we
notice
in Scripture, it's not like, it doesn't refer to
all these people as, "And then someone, and then
someone," it's, "We know who they are. We know
who Martin Luther is, who John Calvin is, who
John
Wesley is." And that is because God used them in
disproportionate ways. So what we want to do is
be careful to say that just because someone maybe
is known or has greater exposure doesn't mean
that
that in itself is a bad thing. Now, to your point,
you want to be careful that an organization
or a Church is not just a personality-driven
celebrity thing kind of a culture. And so,
what do we do about that? By the way, the same
thing's true at a gym, right? We can't build
anything scalable around our personality. To a
point, it can be, you know, it can be too,
but if the story becomes about the Gospel, about
God's Church, that can be scalable. But I
interject. Yeah, no, I think that's a great point.
Yeah, so you want to, on the one hand,
celebrate when there's a person or a figure that
can help advance things, whether it be a business
or a Church, in a significant way, but you also
don't want the whole thing to turn on, "Oh man,
Howard Schultz left Starbucks and now it crashed,"
is kind of a thing. I think for us, a few things
came to my mind when I was thinking about this.
Number one is that we want to have, I mean,
just on the accountability side, we want to have
a board that oversees me that is filled with
strong, experienced, capable leaders. Every year,
we try to increase the quality of our board. We
have extremely accomplished, Jesus-loving, smart,
have-their-own-minds kind of people on our board,
and I think our board has gotten stronger with
each subsequent year, and that's the goal. I love
being in the room with people who push and who
ask good questions, not for the sake of just
being,
like they take perverse joy in being devil's
advocate all the time, but they really strive
for what's best and they ask intelligent
questions to help us get there. True people who
are great
leaders, that actually is a source of joy for
them, not like intimidation. To me, I come alive
when people are smart, driving people, want to
ask, "How do we do this best?" And even recently
with our Grand Rapids campus, I was bringing some
ideas to the table about it, we were processing
it
and our board weighed in, and some of our plans
and execution of that whole project changed
because
of the board in some very critical ways. And I
joke with one of them in particular, I say,
"This part of the building, we should name it in
your honor." But that was because we had smart,
experienced, spiritually mature people who are
able to speak in, and that's something we
literally
ask every prospective board member, "How do you
feel about challenging or confronting Brian?"
They have to be asked that question. Other things
we do here at Agede, I think having a plurality
of teachers from the stage, I'm only up maybe 55
to 60% of Sundays, I think is really good.
Whenever I am using personal illustrations, my
general practice is I want to talk about
my weaknesses and other people's strengths. So
like sermon illustrations, I don't want to come
off like the guy who's just got it, I'm rocking
it on all levels. I wanna come off as the guy
who, "Man, I really struggled here, I blew here."
And even when I do talk about a win,
I talk about it, or at least try to, from the
perspective of, "I was really struggling,
and then look what God did, and here's where I'm
at." So it's like, "Listen, I'm not above the
same
struggle, but I have made some progress." I don't
want them feeling like their pastor's just stuck
in the muck all the time, like God's doing
something. So talk about weaknesses and other
people's wins and strengths, and then preach
about idolatry of people, to be quite honest.
We just did this, 1 Corinthians opening chapters,
and we said, "What is Apollos? What is Peter?
What is Paul?" And I said, "Listen, I don't care
who your favorite preachers are, none of them
matter, there's one name that matters, and it's
Jesus." And so try to talk about that too. And
at the end of the day, I pray and hope that our
culture is one that is not idolizing people. I
can't control, obviously, what goes on in a
person's heart, but I can do everything we can
to set an environment where it doesn't make it
easy to idolize a person, and that's what we're
trying to do. - Your discernment is noted, and it's
appreciated in this next question. God has
been faithful to this point with the Getty, no
question. Worship is on a rocket ship, youth
programs are astounding, my kids personally have
been absolutely blessed. Ministries are popping
up, community needs being met. What is the state
of the Church in West Michigan and in our greater
global area, within Getty's reach, and what do
you see the Holy Spirit doing in the next 20
years?
- Well, I'll take a stab at that, I'd love to
hear your take as well, 'cause you have a whole...
For any of us, we have our little slice of the
world that we're exposed to and experience,
and so you'll have maybe a nuance on this. Let's
start with the local side.
When I think of just kind of what God is doing in
West Michigan, a couple of themes come to my mind.
One is, people who are from around here recognize
that this area has a fairly strong
historical spiritual rootedness in Christ, and I
think that that legacy, you definitely still feel,
it still presents. I don't think it's as strong
as it once was, but I do think we're not living
in secular Seattle, so to speak. You still feel
the legacy of faith in this area, and I really,
I'm grateful for that. I think that increasingly,
at En Getty, I talk to people, and I would say on
that point of the legacy of faith, that is great
from the standpoint of people having some
presuppositions that come out of a Christian
worldview. That is tough in the sense of we still
deal with a fair amount of Christian hypocrisy
and... Cultural evangelicalism?
Yeah, entirely. Cultural kind of pseudo-Christianity,
where it's like, I do the
church thing, but I'm not living it out in any
way. Christian by virtue of the way that I vote?
Exactly. Or being angry at young people.
Yeah, so that's a real challenge still. I
increasingly see people come out of very
unchurched backgrounds, though. All of the time
here at En Getty, I talk to people who say,
"I've never been to church. I've been to church
once or twice. I am an adult who has not been
to church since I was like seven years old." I
hear that story more than I ever have.
But then on the flip side, sounding like I'm
talking out of both sides of my mouth,
there is a passion right now for the gospel, and
a passion particularly amongst young people
to pursue Jesus that I also haven't seen maybe
since I've lived in West Michigan.
It's really, really cool, and including even, I
would say, and led by guys. Guys who are saying,
"We want to get after it when it comes to
following Jesus." So that part's really
encouraging. I think there's a whole move
nationwide even with young people saying,
"We want to follow Jesus." What's your take on
the local side?
I don't disagree. I think the ground, West
Michigan, America more broadly, is ripe for
a revival. I think it is going to require, as you'd
stated earlier, those who preach the word
to do so boldly and definitively. This culture is
not into wish-wash.
Totally.
But we are... I always say as a Christian, I'm a
short-term pessimist and a long-term optimist.
That's good. I like that.
If you're in a tournament, a basketball
tournament, we know we've already won the
tournament,
and for the short time that we're in this game,
we might be playing from behind. In this
particular
time, in this particular place, it feels like the
church is playing from behind a little bit,
but maybe the momentum is on the gospel side,
maybe, maybe. And we'll see when the bench gets
out, where the starters get back in, whatever the
metaphor might be, if the next generation can
continue that, I don't know. I don't know.
Well, it'll be interesting. I think on the
national level, anytime somebody wants to say
with confidence, "Here's what I think is going to
happen 20 years from now," I'd say, "You are
a fool." Because anybody who's trying to come out
with a clear statement, even from five years from
now, that being said, if one was to guess, I feel
like it's going to be really interesting.
On the one hand, I could see even more
polarization, because I think that we're
really seeing a cultural divide right now between
those who are rooted in even cultural
Christianity,
but definitely if they're solid Christians, and
the secular culture, which is just
going in some really bizarre directions, frankly.
So on the one hand, that sets up for greater
polarization. That being said, I think that to
your point about there being the ground is right
for revival, it's interesting. After Easter, I'm
on a text thread, I was talking with a
pastor who's a pastor of a very large church, and
he's on a thread with a ton of other pastors who
are part of large churches. So I've got my own
thread with a bunch of large churches, and then
this guy in particular has got his own thread as
well, and they don't overlap. And it was
interesting,
because as we were talking about how Easter went,
basically everybody was saying, "We have never
seen this many people in church. We've never seen
this many people give their life to Jesus." And
this is all around the country, that this is
coming in. So I'm hearing those stories literally
from coast to coast, and I think you only know if
revival is happening when it's in the
rearview mirror, and you can look back and see
what the fruits were, but I do think something
is happening, and I would love to believe for a
future that...I don't think that there'll ever be
a lack of cultural tension between people of
faith and the broader culture, but I do think
perhaps there will be a greater move towards God
and an appreciation of the Christian worldview,
even by those who don't necessarily share it.
Right, like a Sam Harris.
Sam Harris, yeah. I like Christmas carols.
Elon, it seems like he's saying some positive
things, but Tom Holland, who's a...I
believe he's a historian by trade, but he's wrote
a book called Dominion, and he basically started
out as...you've read it? Yes. He started out
skeptical and realizes, "My gosh, a lot of the
values that we have in our culture for justice
and plurality and all these different things,
they come out of a Christian worldview." They are
Judeo-Christian worldview.
And you can't really build the culture...I mean,
these values that we love and cherish,
they don't stand on anything if you take the Judeo-Christian
heritage out. So you've got
people that aren't even explicitly followers of
Christ who are going, "The whole Judeo-Christian
worldview thing is kind of a big deal, and we
like it even if we're not to the point we're
giving our lives to Christ." So we'll see what
that means for the future.
You have been very, very vocal about victories,
about praises, about God showing up in fantastic,
small, big ways when it comes to obedience, tithing,
marriage, addiction, just a solid prayer
and scripture reading life. Are there any stories
that are left untold? Is there something that,
"Man, this is...the people have just got to hear
about this."
Well, I think that the stories that come to my
mind that we sort of haven't told
are ones that when we get them--and it's
particularly baptism stories, I would say,
that's a big category of where people will give
us a story of how they came to know Jesus and
what they came from, and they will say, "I don't
feel comfortable with this being shared publicly
yet." And I understand that. There are people in
our church who are convicted murderers and have
served time, and they don't want to get up in
front of the church and necessarily name that.
There are people who have done other dark kinds
of things in their past, in many cases their
distant past, and Christ has healed and restored
them, and now they are flourishing in Jesus,
and it's really, really cool to see. I wish I
could share all of those, but I understand where
people say, "Hey, not yet," because I think for
most of us, if you said, "Hey, could you think
about your worst possible sin or failure and then
tell 2,000 people that..." I think many of us are
going to go, "Gulp, let me think about that." But
those are the stories people have come out of at
times. Incredible addiction, they've been abusers,
they've been abused, and to hear them encounter
Jesus and receive healing is just...it melts me.
I was so encouraged that Desiree, just a few
weeks
ago, who had some experience as a young girl in
the adult film industry, she was willing to say
in front of our whole church that's where she'd
been and this is what Jesus has rescued her out
of,
and I was so proud of her for giving testimony to
that, but I would say that not everyone
is willing to be that candid, and I really was
proud of her for sharing that.
God's praised it all.
Totally.
Yeah, for the unnamed thing. All right, very good.
Well, Brian, in the time that we have left,
I was hoping that we could have a little fun.
Maybe some rapid fire questions, maybe
a little bit silly, a little bit fun. We could do...
Got some questions here for you.
Okay, you got notes.
I got notes.
Oh my gosh, watch out.
We will do... We'll throw you a softball.
Yeah.
Right? This first one's multiple guess.
Okay.
All right. The most intelligent person in your
marriage is A, Christina, or B, not you?
Definitely, I mean, boy, I can't lose with that
answer. If Christina here, she would say A or B
for sure.
A or B? That is correct. You see, and it's just
that simple. We're already winning.
This is fantastic. What would Christina say is
your worst habit?
Boy, that's a great question. I mean, she'd have
to... She'd really think about that, and
she'd have a list of different things, nothing
serious. I think if I were to guess, Christina
would say, "I can make jokes that she doesn't
enjoy hearing, and I will continue to make them."
That's the best. That's the fantastic thing about
marriage, captive audience.
Exactly. Unfortunately, her lack of enjoyment of
my jokes is all the more incentive to keep
saying it.
Perfect. I'm married to that person. This is
great. This is good. Audience of one.
Finish this sentence, "God's love is..."
Sacrificial.
Yeah. Good. If someone listens to you preach for
very long, they're gonna know two things,
the tomb is empty, and a guy likes some shoes.
What's on the old grape stompers today?
Right now, I've got some Air Force style boots.
Yep, show the people.
Black boots. There it is.
There it is.
Yeah.
That is... Our pastor is styling.
I get some pushback on these at times. I have
some people that... Literally, I just wore these
into a meeting the other day, and after I was out
of the meeting, somebody goes, "Why does he have
those boots on? What is he doing?" And then there's
another group of 20-somethings that every time I
wear them when I preach, I found out from my
daughter that there's a group that love to make
fun of these massive boots.
This is also good for not becoming a cult of
personality.
Yeah, that's right.
That's good. What book is on the nightstand
currently?
What book is on the night... Okay, I've got my
iPad here, and I love that question,
and I am a huge fan of books. So rather than go
off memory, I am gonna pull up my nightstand.
That's good. Accuracy is important.
Right. Okay, I'm gonna give you two books that I'm
reading right now.
Okay. Get your pens and pencils out.
And you know what? It's funny because I love
reading deep things, but part of my calling,
and I think gifting, is to be able to translate
on the stage at a very popular, accessible level.
Yeah.
But in my heart, I love to nerd out. So anyway,
the first book, and this would be one that
anybody
would really benefit from, is a book called Tim
Keller on the Christian Life,
subtitled The Transforming Power of the Gospel.
And this book was written by, let's see if I can
get his name, Matt... Oh, it just disappeared.
Matt... Looks like Smethurst. And basically,
what he does is he writes a book about the major
themes of Tim Keller's life, teaching, and
ministry, and each chapter is a theme, and then
he takes the best out of Keller's work. And in
some
ways, it's almost easier to read than Keller
himself because he's distilling it at a really
accessible level. So that's book number one.
Okay, book number one.
Commend that to everybody who's listening, and
that book has won a number of best Christian
Book of the Year awards, okay?
Fantastic.
So you need to get it, Mike.
I'm gonna get it. I'm gonna get it on audiobook.
Then, separate book that I'm reading right now is
called The Beechers,
America's Most Influential Family. So Harriet Beecher
Stowe, well, her father, Lyman Beecher,
was the father of, I think, 10 kids, maybe 11, I
can't remember, and what you find...
Many.
They... All right. They can't... What you find
out when you look at history is all of his kids
were
incredibly influential in their own right. And so
I'm just interested in what kind of family
culture
he was creating and cultivating that led his kids
to be so influential, so marked by a desire to
impact the world for the positive for Christ.
Although some of them went a little skewed
theologically, but by and large, these kids did
well. Yeah, exactly. So those are two of my books.
All right, those are the two books. Write that
down. Write that down, listeners. All right,
Missouri Synod, Wisconsin Synod, or ELCA?
[laughter]
This is a...
That was a little esoteric.
That's a Lutheran nerd question, man.
That's a Lutheran nerd question.
Well, I don't have exactly a Lutheran... Well, it's
funny. I don't have a Lutheran background
proper, but my grand... Do you know this? My
grandfather was a Missouri Synod pastor. You
knew that? Okay. So I'm gonna go Missouri Synod.
That's correct. That's correct, yeah. So moving
on.
But I don't know any... I don't really know
anything else, so...
All right, this one for the theologians. "If God
is all-powerful, can He make a rock,"
I want you to settle this once and for all, "so
large that He Himself cannot lift it?"
[laughter]
Oh, that's a funny question.
True or false, someone has threatened to leave in
Getty because you
talk about IU too much from the stage. That is
true, it was me. That is true.
I was gonna say, not to my knowledge, but I
wouldn't be surprised.
That's good. It's definitely me.
I did... I have heard stories, and it's funny
because you asked earlier about pushback that
maybe has come with talking about controversial
things and whatnot, and I have not gotten a whole
lot directly. Mostly what I get is from people
who really appreciate biblical stands, but I did
just
hear a couple of stories of different people who
have walked out during church. And it's funny,
the church is big enough and there are enough
people out in front of me that I don't know,
"Are you going to go in the bathroom? Are you
going to get coffee? Do you have an emergency
meeting?" Yeah, I don't know what's going on. So
that was the first time I'd heard, "Oh, like they
said, I'm done with this." So it wasn't because I
was talking about IU, it was 'cause of other,
let's say, more biblical issues.
You know, you can't win 'em all.
Even though IU's team has had a greatness of
biblical proportions right now.
Indeed they have. The people would like to hear
more about IU basketball,
but it's conspicuously absent from those sermons
is the IU basketball. But moving on...
I hope to shift, we'll see.
Let's see. What is the worst dad joke that you
have told from the stage? We want to hear the
cringiest joke that you have let go.
I would really have to process that to come up
with one, and I say that because...
There's too many.
I don't... There's too many. I don't plan. The
dad humor in particular is generally not planned.
You are genuinely earnest. It just happens.
It just flows, yeah. So it's not like, "Oh, I've
got this joke in my pocket." I will say the most
cringy for my kids is anytime dads probably talk
about sex.
That's without a doubt. Without a doubt.
Somebody just told me they were listening to the...
They were traveling and they were
watching the message with their daughters, and
their daughter's like, "Do we have to listen to
Pastor Brian talk about his sex life?" [laughs]
That's how you know you're doing it right. That's
how you know you're doing it right.
Take their medicine.
Don't you hate it when people one-up you, Brian?
I don't love the spirit of one-upness, but I love
excellence in others.
Well, I love it. I love it.
You just one-upped me and you're loving?
This guy has planned for this stuff. Our producer,
Chuck, he can really keep it together here.
I have notes. Let's see.
Speaking of dad jokes.
A good way to grow at a large church is... finish
the sentence.
Yes, get connected, get connected, get connected.
That could be a serving opportunity, could be a
group, but ultimately growth is gonna come as you
get into community.
Is there really a dangerous prayer to pray?
Trick question.
Like the one for patience.
Trick question. Yeah. My belief is that on the
one hand, the more you're willing to open up
yourself to say, "God," whatever you want,
wherever you want, you could argue, "Oh, that's a
dangerous
prayer to pray," because God can take you
anywhere, but yet I believe the best place you
can be is in
the center of God's will. So that's even back to
the whole calling into ministry and somebody else
is gonna be called into something else that's
more difficult and dangerous than what I'm in,
and I say if you're in obedience to Christ, no
matter where that plays out, you're in the best
possible place you can be. I don't know if that
was supposed to be a funny question, but you got
a serious answer.
Well said. And we love it. We're having a good
time.
Yeah.
A powerful prayer life is... finish the sentence.
I'd say a powerful prayer life... I'm gonna have
to use multiple... there's gonna be commas in
this one. A powerful prayer life is consistent,
it's humble/dependent, it is expectant for God to
show up in big ways, it is faith-filled, that God
can and will do what His Word promises He will do,
and lastly I would say it's marked by a... and
this is related to dependence, but a spirit of
desperation that says, "I need God." These are
not just words I am mouthing, they come out of a
heart
that says, "Apart from His supernatural power and
presence, this will not happen the way that God
wants it to happen."
That is fantastic, and a good note to go out on.
But before we do, I have one small exercise to do.
When I was here last, I didn't feel like I got to
say everything I wanted to say, and I left
thinking, "Man, if I had just gotten a chance to
say that, I'd give this much money." And this,
Brian, is that much money, right?
Oh my gosh. Hold on, I gotta see it, I gotta see
what you're showing.
This is that much money.
Oh my gosh.
Do you know how the Gospel is a free gift from
God by grace and not by works, and all we need to
do
is to receive that gift? This is not like that.
You're gonna have to dance a little bit.
[laughter]
You willing to dance for God's people?
We'll see what that means.
I have in my bag a couple of nice, crisp, flying
pea hats.
Oh my gosh.
It's gonna be great, Brian. Now, it's important,
and we're gonna do this together.
Okay.
I got two, I got matchy hats.
All right.
Matchy hats. We're gonna do this together. This
is gonna be fantastic.
My brother-in-law is gonna love this.
This is gonna be great. He just needs to listen
to the last five minutes of this.
I'm gonna tighten this thing up.
That's fine. You're not gonna keep it anyway. I
got something for you. No, it's fine.
You don't have to keep it. This is important.
Everyone knows this is not a tie. This is to
kingdom builders, right? So God's gonna get His,
but it's up to Brian on whether kingdom builders
gets there or not. We're just gonna need...
People wanna hear a little boiler up for kingdom
builders.
Can I get a boiler up for kingdom builders, Brian?
So, okay, this is ignorance, but when you're
saying "boiler up," you just go "boiler up?"
Boiler up.
Boiler up.
Boiler up for kingdom builders.
Boiler up for kingdom builders.
One more time, Brian. The people can't hear you.
Boiler up for kingdom builders.
That is fantastic, Brian. You've been great.
That includes you too, Alan. I know you're a
boiler fan. You're listening to this right now.
Brian has earned himself a nice... We'll exchange
that. That is a nice... We'll take that one.
Hold on, hold on. Let's look at this. And this is
a nice hat.
It's a nice hat.
Indiana football, no doubt.
Indiana football, which I think is fair. Brian
has worked for it, everybody, and I think that's
fair. It even fits better, honestly. You can tell
these are made for Hoosier heads, and that must
be
made for a pretty...
It must be the smaller brain. This comes size 86
for larger brains, I guess. This is fantastic.
Well, I'm glad we did boiler up because these
resources will be used for kingdom builders.
It's well worth it.
And thank you guys. You guys have been a big part
of kingdom builders this year,
and it's awesome to see that. And God has just
done remarkable things through
the generosity of our church. So thank you for
being part of that.
Yeah, amen.
No, and thank you for being the vision caster for
that. I hope that people got a chance to
know you and know the ministry a little bit
better. And with that said, please make sure
you like and subscribe, rate and review, because
it helps us tell the story about what God's doing
in his kingdom. Thanks for coming in, Brian.
There we go. Thanks for having me at my own
podcast. And Mike, man, I love you. I love your
ride. You guys are an amazing team and couple,
and you're leaders in our community, and not just
leaders in your business. You're leaders for
health in our community. You're leaders for just
what it means to follow Jesus in our community.
And you are the true test of great parents is
how their kids are doing. And you guys are
raising some great, great kids. So...
It's been a pleasure.
Well done.
Thank you. God be praised.
Awesome.
Amen.
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