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You back to Money Mechanics Podcast. I'm Sarah Poynton-Ryan, and today we are with Dylan denecha, who is the founder of the purposeful property project. Dylan is one of the UK's leading voices on social housing. And what's very cool about Dylan is I followed Dylan. I've been around Dylan on social media, probably for about 10 years now, actually. And he's got a background in monetary policy. He's got a background in finance, in tech. He's advised African governments. He's advised the United Nations economics commission. He's done all sorts of things. And so today, this conversation, I think, is going to be really interesting, one from a very different perspective than what we've had on the podcast before. So Dylan, do you want to just introduce yourselves? Tell everybody who you are, what you do, and then we'll get into it. Firstly, thank you so much for having me on. And likewise, I've been following you for about the same time, we've been connected on socials, and I've seen this beautiful evolution in your work, which was, you know, that kind of stepping stone, financial freedom for yourself, and then the amazing work that you do and did in property, and then almost like packaging that entire journey up into this like transformational, life changing brand and product and book and day events and podcast days, Money Mechanics. So yeah, I'm delighted to be on thank you so much. I love your journey. I love what you've done before. So this is going to be a really interesting conversation. So yeah, in answer to that question, I'm Phil and Danny church, founder of the purposeful property project. It's kind of one feather in my cap. I will admit massively to being

an insane generalist. I am not a specialist at all. And in fact, that

the this is so relevant to this conversation today, it's like the sixth of October, 15, 15. I've just got back from Dubai, where we are building the blue pie.ai

and blue pie.ai is essentially

a platform that is going to be the analyst in your pocket for anybody looking to get into, you know, futurist frontier AI stocks, because I think that that's a part of the world that is just shrouded in such smoke and mirrors. We've got something called the frontier Fund, which essentially is 31 different stocks across the sector. We're kind of 20 something percent up year on year. We haven't been in it that long, and I'll explain why in a second, one of my investing mantras. So I'm a massive generalist, but what I try and do always, which is, I think why I resonate so much with your work, is try something out, fail fast

as much as I possibly can, sometimes unintentionally, most times unintentionally. And then what I'll try and do is take that out to my tribe, take that out to my following, take that out to even people that don't know who I am, but maybe need this stuff. And so, you know, it did the same with trading the markets. I would then built the Europe's first gold brilliant buying club, where we would essentially, it was like drug dealing, but with gold, which essentially is drug dealing in a sense, you know, we'd find big amounts in Switzerland. The club is still running, chop it up into small pieces, ship it to people's doors in discrete brown envelopes.

And then I kind of doubled down on my property journey. I've been in property since 2011 housing young homeless people and then playing a real key part in the launch of the national and local private sector leasing schemes for the refugee resettlement programmes. Now we have a product called Zen spaces, homes that heal for 16 to 18 year olds. So we essentially develop the real estate and we lease that out to providers of care to 16 to 18 year olds. We've got pilot cities running, and we are looking to expand to 1080

individual sites. Each site has six units, and that doesn't even touch the 14,000 children leaving care every year. So that's that. And then kind of

there's been in the art of being a generalist. We're now deconstructing everything that we've done to have built the frontier fund of these 31 AI and tech stocks, and deconstructing the analysis and technical analysis, fundamental analysis, like all of that stuff, has always been my bag, which is why, when we decide to go into commodities or funds or whatever, they're generally pretty successful. So decon.

Constructing all of that and launching

a platform called Blue pie.ai. And that is like pop off the press this week. So, yeah, so much to talk about. So much to talk about. Back to you. Thank you very much. The intro for anyone who's had already blown up, don't kind of, we'll get into some of this stuff. So Dylan, I'm going to bring you right back. Though. What would you say is your earliest memory of money, and how do you think that has shaped your current beliefs around me?

Such a good question.

Such a good question. I got goosebumps. Oh, my God, that's such a Okay, a very short interruption of the episode. So I want you to get back to listening. I just wanted to remind you that the Money Mechanics weekly newsletter is completely free, and we'll send this out to you every week. All you've got to do is find the link in the show notes and get signed up. When we send this out to you, this weekly newsletter is going to include things that will help you to become a better money mechanic. It could be things like what's happening in the markets, things like budgets, how that's going to impact you, and I'm also going to share a lot of insight into what I'm doing in my own portfolio and in the portfolios of the guests we've got on the podcast to really just help you understand what you could do differently to make your money work as best as it can for you. Make sure you go and find that link and get signed up.

Oh, I said it's such an emotionally charged question as well, isn't it? Like it's not about pocket money, it's not about being bullied at school. It's not about Andrew Gallagher turning up to my door and literally taking the loose change out my mum's SMA tin where she'd keep it's not any, it is all of those things. It was none of those things.

Do you know? Fundamentally, it's a it's a story of giving, and it's a story of kind of

I think giving at the expense of your own well being like I saw my mum and my dad do that

all the time, all the time. They came to this country as refugees in the 70s, they lived on an army camp area west malling. They then got taken in by a host family. They then lived in a student house in Bristol, in a room in London, and then moved into one of the council developments. Peterborough Development Corporation put up huge council estates in the 80s, and they moved into one of those, like late 70s, 80s.

And so whilst that growing up in social housing, and all of the things that social housing entails. It's front and centre of my mind. The General's theme has always been giving, giving beyond your means, and giving in a way that was not

it wasn't the juxtaposition, it wasn't the bringing together of purpose and profits. It was just making a difference, giving shit away, watching my mum and dad do that, and not really. They weren't really that worried about what was coming in. So it wasn't like they were as my mum Zen evolved into telling me about this idea that you're the conduit of wealth, you're the conduit of knowledge, you're the conduit of love, you're the conduit of wisdom. You know, all these beautiful things.

And I think she had these realisations as well through her time, that we're conduits. You can't give what you don't have. And you know that really is what led me to that rock bottom place, 2011 coming back from Rwanda, 106,958

pounds in debt, and having to rebuild from there. You know, at 33 years old, back in the single bed in that little room at my parents house that I kind of grew up in, is looking at the ceiling thinking like, what the absolute, what have I done with my

mind? You know, this was a, this was at the end of an 11 year post graduation period where I'd worked, you know, advised the central banks. I had worked with African nations. I had worked for blocks of consensus here in England, I'd been part of a couple of really good internet starts. Had huge exits, traded the markets, featured on the front page of the independent on Sunday money section. So it wasn't like I just worked this factory job and found myself in the shit. It was just this fundamental mismanagement of the two things that I now care dearly about, which is, you know, living a life of absolute purpose, and doing it in a way that is sustainable. I can fund it sustainably. So bringing pubs and profits together. It's like everything I'm about now in all spheres of life. So yeah, maybe not one single memory, but certainly this theme of giving way beyond our means, and that resulting in the realisation that you can't make a difference without making money, and you can't make money without making a difference. You've got to bring the two together. And of course, now today, in 2025 we call that impact investment. But that wasn't even a thing back then. It's now a thing impact investment. I think it's interesting, because so many people that I speak to, and I'm sure people listening to this like we'll meet people who are either all about the money or all about the giving, and it's actually quite a.

Rare thing to find people who, like you, like me, who actually are trying to blend profitability, sustainability and commercial viability, and business and investment with socially responsible impact on life. And I think it's so refreshing to speak to somebody who I know is a very successful businessman, and you know you, I know you've done lots and lots of things. You know, you've built wealth, you've got your funds, you all these different things. Like,

I think that a lot of people feel like money is a negative thing because they haven't learned to do this balance of the two things. What are your thoughts on? Yeah, I absolutely agree with you. This is what I've done. So I'm as keen to be on here to maybe share some of my stuff as I am to hear about your stuff, because I know we just we like, we're like, two circles, and this piece just overlaps in the middle. And we might be doing all these different things, and we might have been kind of almost following each other, but distant in the sphere. But I know that we just overlap in this one place 100% you are fundamentally right

that the reason I feel that people think money is the root of all evil and eye of a needle and, you know, all of that kind of cool stuff, and even me to a larger, larger or lesser extent, you know, when I got back from Rwanda, absolutely broken,

one of the conversations I kind of had with my Mum through tears, essentially, was

just bizarre that even our cultural heritage has a God of wealth.

And it just seemed so

unnatural to me, and that's where the conversation led. You know, wealth is multiple things, and where the conduits and so on is so on and so forth. For those of you that are in any way tapped into the into the Hindu culture. I'm talking about the Lord Lakshmi. You know, she's the God of wealth. And by now, understand that. I mean, you could call her a god, you could call her a meme. You could call her a deity. I didn't know what she is, but she's something anyway. She's, she's, she's a theme. Let's call it a theme that and that theme of wealth being

more than just money, but absolutely money. You know, she has in one hand, gold coins, you know, pouring out one hand. So it's about the money, because that's the world that we live in. You know, whether we like it or not, there is only one circulatory system other than air and water, precipitation, other than precipitation. There's only one circulatory, system that impacts every single one of the close to 8.8 point 4 billion people on the planet. You know, whether that's the street kids in Brazil that we support living in living, you know, essentially to us, or whether that's the billionaires in Dubai that we happen to, you know, rub shoulders with at these networking events and investment raising rounds and so on and so forth. Like, it doesn't matter who you are, where you are,

money impacts you

all the time. Like, money, you know, people say money doesn't buy happiness. Money is not everything. And I get all of that because, you know, there are some very, very unhappy, very wealthy people that exist. So

thing either sorry, to cut across. Like they No, no, it's fine, not done exactly that same thing. And so it's just that the icing on the cake, or the cherry on the icing on the cake of this piece, is that it's got to be about the money, but it has to be about something more about what the money can allow you to do, and it's what it allows you to do, the choices it affords you, that is where the happiness comes from, or the choices that it robs you of, which is where the depression, the sadness, the suicide. And you know, the financial challenge, or psychological impact of financial challenge brings about. So yes, it's a bit about the money, but it has to be about the money and something else. And you can have one or the other, and you will be

lost, ultimately unhappy you have both, and I think ultimately you will be happy simplification. It's quite simplified, but I also think it's right. You know,

I say often, money will amplify what's already there. And I work with so many clients that you know, when you really get into the nitty gritty of them, and you say to them, Why do you keep sabotaging your like progress? Why do you keep walking away from it when you're just about to get it right? And often, when we really dig into it, is because they're frightened of what they will become if they are successful, because they've never been it, they've never seen it, they've never experienced it. And actually, I say all the time, it will just amplify what's already there. So if you're inherently a like, greedy, horrible human being, yeah, having loads of money will make you more of that. But if you are inherently a good, fine, generous, heart led human being, you will be able to be a much kinder, more generous human being. Do you know I'm laughing because I did a post on exactly that, and I didn't use the word amplify. Called it magnification. You know, money is a magnifier of self. You're a dick with a million pounds now you're a dick with a million pounds. Fabulous person with a million pounds now you're a fabulous person with a million different choices to make the world a better place, like you.

What do you want to be, and you can choose what to

be. Yeah, I love that. I absolutely love that. Another point of resonance, Yeah, amazing. Do you think that everybody should strive to be wealthy? Do you think that's something that everybody should want to be so I live in this world.

Just the context to my answer, of qualifying my answer before we were given it,

because this is going to go out to my following on my list, and so I almost feel I need to qualify this. So I mean, actually, actually, as you can see, so I live in this world like one, one foot is firmly in the like the bead wearing barefoot,

you know, it's the wrong pushing world. Have you got crystals on your desk? Dylan,

do you know I do carry around a crystal? We are big on crystals in the house and sage cleansing. And, you know, same snap, which, for those people that don't know, I also live in that

one. I love you so much. And, you know, there's this kind of, there's that world, and I love that world because it keeps me, it does part of my heritage. You know, I grew up in a religious family, and that's allowed me to kind of evolve into what Gandhi talks about, which is the niraka, which is, your devotion is to the unseen power and the deities, the memes, the gods, if you like, the little statuettes. They're your channel and your point of focus. So you can get to this invisible, shapeless, soundless thing, you know, whatever. Like Einstein calls it the invisible force. Again, he calls it the miracle in Sanskrit. We call it the niraka. So I'm in that world, and when I talk to those people about the moral obligation to be a millionaire, that just there is so much resistance in that world to that phrase, you have a moral obligation. And again, I'm

recalling so many of the posts and so many of the things I've written, written, and so many of the talks I've given, I did a whole year of keynotes on millionaire a moral imperative. And I just went round the country doing this keynote roadshow, talking at all kinds of different events. You know, property events, wealth creation events, meditation events. And by far the biggest resistance I got was from that community. And the idea that money is evil and money is only held by evil people is so firmly rooted in the psyche of that sector, that

sector of society, there's huge resistance. But I'm also in this other world, you know, this kind of, you know, fancy watch wearing, boat sailing. Goodbye, first class flying. So, yeah, you know this other world where actually,

and it's a subset of subset of that world, my network, my peers in that world, I kind of call us all rainmakers. It's a term that I learned in Africa, and a rainmaker is essentially as the term sounds, it's somebody that brings the rain, and somebody that brings the rain is somebody that brings food, brings prosperity, brings this. I call us all the rainmakers, and we have this like rainmakers networking event and so on and so

forth. And the reason I call us rainmakers is because it's a subset of that ultra wealthy community that really gives a shit about making the world a better place like that is all we live and breathe. How do we find a problem that we're passionate about solving and bring our innovation, our investment capital, our out of the box thinking, our network to solve that problem, and now, of course, exponential technologies. How do we you deploy everything we know and love and have in order to solve that problem, there is would be, bizarrely, I can run meditations for these guys, and there's much less resistance to running a money management training in the spiritual sector. And it's changing, at least changing, and that's one of the reasons it's changing, is because I started to switch my narrative. Millionaire moral imperative is perhaps too strong for somebody that has deep rooted I'm

going to call it trauma, because that's that's the real term, deep rooted trauma when it comes to money now, people call it Money Story. People follow your money mindset, but it's psychologically, physiologically, biogenetically, it's former around money. And I think millionaire imperative was too strong once I started talking about money as a flow of love, and how in Japanese, they call it Arigato, where you just butchered the accent and the word, so you might need to edit that out. Arigato is probably maybe more

appropriate to anyone we've offended with accents, we

apologise by torturing of that term. But people may or may not know the term. It's, you know, in context of money supply, and when I spend money, I will say, thank you. I'm saying thank you for spending the money. Thank you on.

Received when I'm signing the bill at a restaurant, or whatever it might be, is when you start thinking about money as a flow of love, and you start thinking about what it is at the moment, which is a flow of fear and greed. You know, it's not so much.

It's not easily shown in the digital environment. But you know, if we got pound, you know, notes and coins, and people hand over their notes and coins, when people pay utility bills with, you know, whatever, online transfers, when people buy something with a credit card or people buy something on finance,

generally, it's one of two extremes of emotion. It's either fear and greed and anger and resentment, or it's like this kind of immediate gratification, short lived excitement that then manifests into fear and anxiety and all these other things. Very rarely is it actually love. You know, when I'm paying a bill, when you're paying a bill, and I encourage anybody to try this, when you're paying a bill, think back to what you've just asked for it. So we're paying water bills and paying electricity bills, one of my early memories of money at university was getting a mobile phone bill. And back in those days, in 1996 97 my first year at university, and it was on the the T Mobile Network. Or back then, it was called One to One. You know, all of your itemised. And you know, you could either have a phone bill that was like two pages long because you hadn't contacted anyone, because you kind of save money just got a mobile or your phone bill like mine, like 30 pages long, you know, just

ridiculous amounts of money on mobile phone, text messages and calls and so on and so on. But, but I would look at that even in those days, not really understanding this concept of money, of love or thanking many people, but I'd just be like, This is amazing. Like, how much of a life have I lived this month, contacting, talking to all these people? This is amazing.

And so the filter that we put on receiving and spending money, I think, fundamentally creates the personality that you have around money. And quite often we've done tonnes and tonnes of regression work in some of the money workshops I used to run, bringing these kind of very active ancient styles of meditation, where you combine deep breathing visualisation and then modern overlays, where we put people into a gamma state using these, like PMF headbands and so like this mad crazy regression work, uncovering people's money stories, and you can do all that. But we had lady one, but she just absolutely blown away by the memory that came up for her, which was, and if you're listening, you will know who you are, and I love you to pieces for allowing me to share this story, because her earliest memory of money through this regression work was

hearing her parents talk about the stroller that they could not afford to buy. This is absolutely nuts.

She was hearing it from the womb, like that smile, old, some of these fine money traumas.

And so do I think everyone should, should get wealthy? I really do, because I think we live in a monetary economy for now anyway, who knows, in a post AI world with demonetization, decentralisation, whether we will live in a monetary world post capitalism. I don't know where that's going yet, where we're on the journey to finding out. But for now, we live in a monetary world. We live in a world where, you know, money gives you choices, to be a dick or not to be a dick, essentially. And so without that money,

there's not a lot you can do. And yeah, you can sit and meditate, and you can be the change you want to see in the world. And you can change yourself to change the world. And you know, all of those kind

of, what you might call them, cliches, perhaps, or mindsets. And you can be the person who sends positive vibes into the world and changes the world in that way.

But actually, you could do all of that stuff and make yourself a decent amount of bank and go and feed some people, house, some people, clothe, some people, build ridiculous businesses that impact lots of people in a positive way. And you could do all of that stuff too. And I come from a mindset and an experience that says both together like now you're an absolute superhero in your own world. You're still small relatively to everybody else doing crazy shit. I'm tiny and insignificant, but I'm the hero of my own movie, in that sense, because I've got the love for the world and all of that stuff and a deep, deep, connection to whatever that unseen force is. But I also have, I think, a God given ability to

create something from nothing. I have this ability to come back fighting when my back's against the wall and I have an ability to join dots because of my generalisation.

Conversation and not my specialisation, because of my generalisation to join doctor when many others can't. And I'm deeply, deeply grateful for having both of those influences in my life, and that comes from my parents. That's my mum and dad. Yes, all my experiences, of course, but that's my parents. And yeah, I'm deeply grateful to have had those kind of exposures and experiences. I think it's really interesting that when I hear you speak, and I mean, I've heard you speak various times, online, offline, etc, and when I hear you speak, one of the things that's really obvious to me is that even the things that have happened in your life that are not positive in inverted commas, that other people would consider positive, you apply a very grateful, thankful approach to whenever you talk about it, whenever you explain things, you always say even the really shit things along the way, I'm grateful that happened to me, because what it's done is allowed me to be this or that, and I have this conversation around debt, because obviously I was in a lot of debt, and at the time, I was really annoyed that I was in debt, and it was always someone else's fault in my mind, and they couldn't possibly have been me that did this. It's the bills and it's the mortgage, and it's the interest rates, and it's this, and it's that, and it's me, you know, they, they took my money, and there was this headspace of that. And I think as I've grown up, obviously, I'm in my 40s now, as we're getting older, I think we start to realise that maybe we're a bit more responsible for stuff as we than we thought we were when we were 25

but also, we have this choice to be able to be thankful and grateful for the things that are happening in our life that are not necessarily positive in inverted commas to everybody. How do you I think for you now, probably the answer is, it's just part of who you are naturally. But if I take you back to kind of 2000 and you know the early 2000s where things weren't as they are, now, how do you think you learned to apply that thankful, grateful approach to the things specifically around money and business and stuff that weren't going to plan, and yet you still learn to say, I'm grateful. I'm thankful that this is happening so that you could become naturally in that headspace. How did you do that? What Belter questions? You've got

absolute belter.

I love these questions. Thank you so much.

So

I've been through peaks and troughs with my relationship with gratitude.

I would say in the earliest days, it was just blind faith, I was told,

probably by someone like Tony Robbins, that gratitude

is the way to be

all right, I've tried everything. I'll try that. Like, what have I got to lose? I'm 106,958

pounds in debt. I'm living back with my parents. I think I'd yo yoed back there. This is like, my third and last time and fourth and last time i Yo yoed back there.

Like, fuck it. I'll just try gratitude. And

in those early days, it didn't really work. And the reason it didn't work is because I could say I'm grateful,

but I wasn't really grateful,

like because I was trying to apply it to something like money that I haven't yet come out the other end of. And so I think it's and then the contradiction to that is, you know, be thankful that the universe, the universe, delivers unto you those things it sees that you're grateful for. So on the one hand, I'm simply grateful for this debt not supposed to get me out of debt. Yeah, if I'm grateful for the debt the university is going to deliver unto me like that which I'm quite grateful this. None of this makes sense to me. And so I found a little hack, and the hack for gratitude for me was actually to ignore my problems in inverted commas, and I'll tell you why that massive debt level I wish was bigger back then in a second. That's not something I've got my notes to talk about, but I will talk about that, and it's all about zeros. I'm just gonna write zeros down so I remember it's really important if anybody's in debt listening to this, which I suspect a lot of people are, this one, concepts can be really powerful for you. So anyway, so this act for gratitude was like gratitude. I'm grateful for my parents. I'm grateful for the roof over my head. I'm grateful, no, I'm not. I want to be in my two bedroom penthouse. Blah blah blah, blah, blah, blah. And

so I started to think about

being grateful for the things I have at the most basic level, arms and legs and breathing and being able to write and being able to think. And then what if I didn't have them? What if I didn't have this right hand to write with? And you know, speech recognition is still in the days of Dragon, so it's i.

Absolutely appalling. Doesn't work. And so that was the hack. It was like, get right back to basics. Be grateful that I am not, you know, one of the kids that I left in Africa essentially through my three or four years. There's just at the tail end of all of that. Be grateful that I'm not one of the villagers who is, you know, essentially dying off because they didn't have $7,000 for an irrigation system, etc, etc. Like, be grateful for all of that. And if that doesn't work, think about what if you were in that place. Just go really deep. It was almost like a Robin's Dickens process without actually knowing what the Robins Dickens process was getting really deep in the idea of, what if you were

that villager, what if you were that child? What if you were that parent? What if you didn't have this right hand to even be writing your gratitude list with, like, absolutely didn't have it. Like, think about that, and then you just, like, I get goosebumps now. Oh, my God, thank you. Oh, my God, it could be a whole world of shit right now, and it's not. And I'm even like now, I am so grateful. I'm so grateful to just have these basics of basic things. Oh my My best friend. So that that just, just to wrap this up, then it's not about actually being grateful for the thing. It's about putting yourself in that vibrational state, that energetic state, whatever that is. And gratitude, I feel, is a is a pathway to the state. It's not the state of gratitude. It's being grateful as a pathway to the state of bliss. And if you think about kind of, you know, vibrational frequency, and you know, all the other all the stuff that you and I read about, you know, power over force, etc, etc, etc, and you're going up the frequency range, it is about putting yourself into that state so that you vibrate at this higher frequency. And then your electromagnetic forces, you know, think about electromagnetic forces the butterfly wing. It gets bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. And the nature of an electromagnet is it then draws opportunity too. So this idea that law of attraction isn't about sitting, and where this the rebellion against law of attraction was it's not about sitting doing nothing. It is about sitting doing nothing in the right state.

And it is about putting yourself in that vibrational frequency so that your electromagnet starts drawing opportunity to you, whether that's invitations to speak on fast or whatever it might be, even ideas you start channelling ideas that otherwise you would not channel through that kind of red mist of rage.

Yeah, and I think sometimes this is for me anyway, it's often around

using different language when I'm speaking to myself, like my best friend says to me all the time, when I'm complaining about going to a spin class at the gym and I'm like, Oh, I don't want to go. I feel like I hate it. I don't, I don't hate it, but I do hate it because spin is horrible. And she always says to me, but Sarah, we get to go, Yeah, we get to afford the gym. We get to go together. We get to have legs that will cycle. We get to be fit enough and well enough to do those things. We get to do that because I because we can. We get to so we have to, and I think even down to, obviously, that's me talking about gym and spin, but in anything like whether it's paying for bills or investing your first 10 pounds when you think you've not got enough to start. Well, I get to invest 10 pounds instead of worrying about the fact that you haven't got 10,000 pounds to invest. And that whole switch of how you treat things and think about things gratitude and thankful. I think it's a really important shift I saw in myself as I moved from having loads of debt to having money and very similar for you, which is really interesting. So have you ever done anything financially irresponsible?

It's always like you written these questions precisely for

me. Yeah, tonnes of shit,

tonnes. So that's one you regret.

I don't regret any of them. Great answer. Look, I really don't. I genuinely mean that. And let me give you an example.

My brother

is amazing, super smart human being lives out in the States, was head hunted by, you know, one of the big four to go and set up their offices in the states like he is, ridiculously smart.

Came to this country at two years old. So he was two when my parents moved, I said, moved here. Didn't move here. They got thrown out and found themselves here. So he went through that entire kind of roller coaster journey of literally having people in their compound that worked for them to then being on an army camp with no toys and no food. And so he had that like the trauma he.

Holds around money is another level. Really smart guy, very prudent.

Doesn't take risks, which is one of the things I want to talk about, etc, etc, etc.

He asked me when I was kind of one of my low points. So 2011 he was still

kind of,

what would I be saying? He was still like in his first decade in the US.

So in his head, he was still building. I mean, by that stage, he could have retired and never worked again. His head, He was still building.

And so this idea of being really vulnerable and really fragile financially. Though, in reality, he was not. He felt it, and his attitude and his filter to that was because we, for him, we were in the same place. I was back at my mom's 106,000 pounds in debt, in debt. He's in his first decade in the US. Hasn't got his citizenship yet, you know, whatever. And I'm like me, we were nowhere near the same journey. But what he said to me, Do you regret now all the dinners that you paid for and the champagne that you paid for and blah, blah, and the one kind of I remember he visited me at university once, and we had this massive falling out, because he was like, dude, like, why are you living like a rock star? Like, what is wrong with you?

Exact words like emblazoned on my heart. I was like, Oh, I'm not a rock star, but I'd quite like to experience living like one. And anyway, I laughed it off, and he wasn't, didn't find it funny. So fast forward 11 years. He's like, Do you regret all of that? And I'm like, No. Like, not in the slightest man like at all. So even then, I didn't regret it. Gonna be grateful. Couldn't be grateful for my experiences without the Hat. I didn't regret anything. Now might be a really good time to talk about the debt, because the

misdemeanours, financial misdemeanours is because they're in debt. And I was always quite

I don't know, nonchalant about the debt, I would say. And you know, my dad would send me spreadsheets when I was at university. My dad's an accountant. In fact, he's still my bookkeeper. He's like, 83 years old, and he's still my bookkeeper. What's what the business is? He's amazing. He's absolutely phenomenal. Human being, super sharp guy. So even back then, he'd send me spreadsheets extrapolating out my over expenditure

deal. He would say, please find attached a cash flow forecast of brackets negative for the next 10 years if you continue to overspend at this rate, here's how it's going to look.

Dad, don't worry, you know, I will pay off 10 years debt in a single year. And actually, that happened 2012 to 13. We had a massive year paid off 10 years worth of debt. It was nuts. Like, everything that I'd said would happen happened because of this. Like nonchalant, naive, just nonsense for whatever it was. I don't know why it was in London, even now, I kind of think it as speaking into reality back then, it was probably just a bit of false bravado.

Maybe I believed it. Maybe I didn't. I don't know. I must have done at some level. I remember sitting in a costa in Peterborough, so I know that number 106958,

like I'd know it to the eight I remember sat in Costa, in Peterborough, and

this is back in the days where there were no like internet. There's no Wi Fi in coffee shops, nothing like that. You know, I was the lone person sat in the back on my laptop connecting to the internet through an infrared connection on my mobile phone on oh two shit reception. But I was just logging into all my bank accounts and credit cards and everything. I had to figure out what the debt number was, and it was 106958

and so I'm doodling on this page, 106958

and I just kind of,

and again, I think that comes down to, you know, at the time, I've got my large, what I used to drink at the time, large soya vanilla latte with my little, like, fructose, whatever it was, like I was not stuck, actually, no imposter. It was the panettone, the citrus panettone. I remember it like it was yesterday, like I was not sacrificing my seven pound fruit or whatever it was in those days, like I'm not here to make seven pound decisions. So I'm like, they're adding up on my desk. And I think the nature of being relaxed about it helps with this stuff. You start channelling shit that you wouldn't otherwise say. So I ended up, like, through my doodles, putting just adding a zero to this number 106958,

and, like my Doer started a zero, and then, like I added a pound sign and another pound sign to the front. So now I'm looking at this number, which is 1069580

1,069,580

pounds.

Looking at that number.

Thinking, fuck it. That's my income target.

That's my income target. And so I create this income target input timeline on it. I didn't say that's what I'm going to make in the next year. All I saw was 106958,

could have been a number to come back to the question about regretting things could have been a number that carried the weight, the weight very much regret and baggage and misdemeanour and self worth issues. And you know, all of my overspend was fall down to a massive lack of self worth in those days. And it really was even giving money away in Africa and getting myself into huge debt was some kind of god complex. I absolutely felt worthy giving money away and knowing that the youngest and the oldest villagers were not going to die because now they've got $7,000 they can put the irrigation system in,

they're not going to die like all of a sudden, you feel a level of self worth that you've never felt before. But it was a false self worth. You know, it was God Complex self worth. That's a different story. And so I started making this income, got this number,

but all I could see was adding a zero onto that like very physically swallows up the 106958106958

went from like the biggest number in my life, the number that could have driven every single decision from then on, the decision not to take any risks, the decision to, you know, kind of stop being the person I was, you know, this free thinking, Libertarian, capitalist slash, socialist slash, wants to make a million quid, wants to change a million lives like it could have changed all of that. And I could have just, you know, gone back to a full time job in one of the big consulting houses. And, you know, never would you and I have met,

and that number 106958,

my deck number, was the biggest number in my life. That's what would have happened. But in one swish of the pen, and it wasn't a mob blog back in those days, it was probably

some probably, you know,

one swish of the pen. It went from the biggest number in my life to actually the smallest number in my life, because it got swallowed up by this bigger number. So it was either a number that was there encouraging me to pay it all off. And, by the way, who the fuck wants to be at zero? Like, why would I want to pay all my debt off? I'm getting My why is my target wanting to be at zero? This is such a stupid target, pay all your debt off. I'm not saying get into that debt and reckless debt and blah, blah, blah. That's not what I'm saying. Bad debt. Different discussion. Yeah, sometimes it gets misconstrued. I'm not suggesting just keep driving yourself into debt, but I'm saying maybe find a different target. So now I've got this income target. And this income target is a number that is, you know, it is made up and infused with hope and optimism and excitement, and it's inspiring, and it's all of the things that the debt number is not which comes back to what we've been talking about previously. It is about being in the right vibrational state in order that I can now think about making all of that stuff happen. And now I'm not chasing zero, I'm chasing an income target, and I know if I hit that income target or come anywhere close to that income target,

it's going to pay my debt off. It'll work. Yeah,

may the 16th, 2014

I remember sending off 36,000 pounds to an MBA Capital One wasn't MBA. It was a Capital One credit, by the way, had a massive credit line, like, because since the age of 18, since I got my first student credit card, I've always been in debt, bad debt, for a long, lot of those years, but a huge credit line, ridiculous credit even now it's like, how have I got this? Because nuts is beautiful, but nuts, in fact, I've had credit cards to shut down like I've had 30 or 40,000 pounds of the credit limit just gone because they shut the card down so I didn't use it gutted anyway. It's a different story. So I remember sending this money off because I promised my now wife that we would be out of debt. It's actually not a promise. There's a promise to her mother, who I love to pieces and promised her I would not get married in debt. And the problem was that I'm sending this money off now thinking

I could do so much more with that. Why am I paying this debt off and like now I'm conflicted. Do I really want to pay this 3.9% for the life of the balance debt off with Capital One, or could I do something else with this money? But I'd made a promise like I teach boding my two year old. You know, when you have to stick to your word, we say something. You've got to you've got to be a human being where your your word is the strongest thing you have. It's a bit Scarface, I know, but that's not how I do. No, I think it's simple.

Really basic thing that not a lot of people can handle. I agree. And so just the tip, I guess, if I want to give a tip, if I'm allowed to give a tip, you are be, you know, add up all the debt that you've got, and be really consciously aware of what that number contains, in terms of the regret, the misdemeanour, the self worth. Or would it be? Get conscious about what that number means to you, all the baggage it contains, and then add a zero to that number, make that new number your income target. Don't set a timeline, and then be really consciously aware about what that income target means to you. And this is not about the how. Don't worry about the how. How am I going to do it that's irrelevant. Keep following Sarah, keep listening to the podcast, keep going through the events. Keep reading the books. Do the work. Don't worry about that. For this exercise, look at that now, that new number, and make a list of all the things that it now makes you feel as you feeling and all of a sudden, let that big number drive your decision making, because you cannot.

You can't let

the debt number

be the driver of decisions for this new life, because the debt number is there because you made some really shitty decisions. And so if you're going to lose that number to drive the decisions that you hope will get you out of debt. You failed the same shit energy before you started. And too many people

won't take risks because they're in debt. And my answer to that is, you know, listen, you've got nothing to lose. You literally got nothing to lose. In fact, you've got minus 106,958

pounds

to not lose. You've already got that you already lost. So actually, to spend another 1000, 2000 pounds, this was me back in those days, you know, to do a course for another grand, two grand, to pay someone 10 grand for some shit that didn't really work out. And who cares? What does that actually mean in terms of my overall debt level? Where can it get me? What's the upside? So I've always been looking at what's the upside versus the downside. How can I increase the probabilities of success? And one of the key things that got me that feature on the independent on Sunday, front page of the money section, this is one of the things I wanted to mention is that, you know, your trades are mutually exclusive. IE, you know, because I've had 10 wins doesn't mean the 11th is going to be win. If I've had 10 losses, it doesn't mean the 11th is going to be a loss. Like every the probabilities of success or failure on every single trades, they're

completely independent of the last train. It's mutually exclusive. The thing that ties it together, and the thing that links your 10 wins to an 11th win, or in most cases, 10 losses to an 11th loss, is the psychological link that you give those decisions. But there is no actual physical link. If you make 10 bad trades,

you've got just as much chance of the 11th trade being a win or a long well as if you haven't made the 10 trades previously, every single trade in life is mutually exclusive from the last. Yes, you take in your learning,

but in probability terms, in strictly financial terms. If you get rid of all the psychological aspects of those previous losses, you're starting from scratch. And so take risk because you cannot. You won't save your way out of debt. Not a chance will you save your way out of debt, because the fact that you're in debt means that you haven't had the inflow of capital

in the surplus amounts that you needed not to get into debt. You've got to invest your way out of debt. Otherwise, you said there about giving yourself the best possible chance for success, right? So if you I'm going to bring you into investor head for a second, if you were starting at the beginning, because a lot of our audience are I'm about to invest my first bit of money. I've never invested before. I've made the decision like I've got 100 pounds or 1000 pounds, or somewhere in that small amount, if you had 1000 pounds now in 2025 given tech AI, humanoids, robots come in Elon doing what he's doing, the political market, like it is the economic market, like it is. What would you do with 1000 pounds right now as a beginner that doesn't want to take massive risks? This is

exactly what I wanted to talk about. This absolutely fantastic. So two principles, number one, follow the big money has been my mantra from the beginning. I wasn't actually a superstar trader through the.com boom and bust. I just followed the big money. And the big capital flows all the way up, and then I followed them all the way down. What does that mean in real terms? There like to somebody who doesn't really know what that means. I.

Means, think about Bitcoin as an example. I got into bitcoin when musk and sailor, Michael Saylor and Elon Musk, when they got into Bitcoin, I got into Bitcoin. So for a lot of people, and for a lot of my peers who bought 1000 Bitcoin when they were like tuppence, I was I was really late to the party, but I did not sacrifice. My demand for that has kept me successful

because lots of hype. I look back and think Amy could have made a sacrifice. Didn't possibly but I didn't follow the big money. So that means you you don't get taken in by the hype. You don't get taken in by, you know, people on Facebook talking about, you know, things going up in the bull runs. What you do is follow large capital flows. So where are the big capital flows going right now this minute,

which brings me on to the next subject, which is allocation. And the two go hand in hand. So right now,

big money flows are going into bizarrely, two different kinds of asset classes. They're going into risk assets and they're going into hedging assets. And this is weird, because normally, and this is why the economic rules

AI post AI is rewriting the economic landscape. For example, in the past, you know when markets are on downturn, real estate's on a downturn, it's wobbly, unemployment is up, interest rates are up, inflation is up. You know those economic cycles generally. You know the investment in risk assets goes down, and the investment in hedging assets like gold goes up, and so therefore you see huge capital flows going into gold. Gold booms, everything else collapses. But that's not the case at the moment. What's happening at the moment, if you look at it, is that you've got massive uncertainty in the market. The gold is at all time highs. I'll talk about gold in a second, how important that is and how practically you follow the big money. But also, the investment in risk assets is at an all time high. It is absolutely nuts. The amount of money that is going into what I'm going to term them, you know, what we call frontier technologies. So even our fund at Blue pie is the frontier fund, and it's 31 different companies across the across the board of Frontier technologies, whether that's kit manufacturing,

energy production, material science company,

bless you,

like whatever that is, we're across the you know, we're across the board 31 different stocks that we invest in. So that's one part of allocation, allocate within your portfolio, and so we've got the full spectrum right the way from like, I say, from energy production to data centres to chip manufacturing to software companies to robotics. So that entire supply chain we're allocated within that blue

pie is being set up to help others do exactly that with Frontier technologies, because it's a scary place to be, but it is the boom sector. You know, for us, dividend paying stocks are great. And you know, I know that you're firm believer in dividend paying stocks to have you know that as part of your stock allocation, but to experience the big growth like we did in the.com boom, these frontier stocks are the ones to really get to know. And we don't do all the stocks. We just, we just talk about the 31 stocks that are in our fund, and when one drops off and another one comes in, we'll talk about that. So it's not confusing people that these are all the things you could do. It is about saying this is our fund. We've done pretty well out of it. We continue to do pretty well out of it. The recommendations I've made around Intel and a number of other companies in there over the last eight weeks have paid huge dividends for people, not in the stock sense, but you know, huge, huge payoffs, essentially. And so allocation follow. The big money is key. Allocation is key. Now, what does that actually mean? Allocation? Let's start with that within your stock portfolio, allocate some dividend paying some frontier stocks, and then within those allocate to different dividend paying stocks, different frontier stocks. Allocation. But

one level up from that is allocating your your essentially your net worth. So our allocation, and I've been talking about this since 2013 before the gold spike, our allocation is 60% land and real estate, 25% hedging assets, 15% risk assets. Now that was until we set up the frontier fund, and then that's good for the kind of markets that we were in between 2013

and like 2020 2121 22 before these frontier stocks really started coming alive, that allocation was great. 25% hedging, waiting for this cataclysmic event that's coming in order that you can liquidate your hedge.

Support your nest egg, your London real estate, and you know, whatever make up for any losses on your risk assets. But since 2022 we've we've kind of restructured that. So we're still 60% London real estate. However, we've dropped our hedging assets right down to 10%

and so now we've got an extra 15% in our risk assets, and now we're 30% risk assets. So 30% really interesting. Yeah, 30% of our net cash flow, our net liquidity at the higher level, 30% of our net worth is held in risk assets. Why? Because we're about to boom exponentially in those risk assets. We call them risk assets, obviously, you call them risk assets. But actually, I was explaining this to a friend yesterday, and she said, Sarah, how do I choose where I allocate, like, what slot and what percentage? What an allocation? For those of you who've never even heard the word allocation, it's just what percentage of your total net worth goes to what slice of the pie, right? That's allocation. And I was explaining. She said, My friend said to me, I don't understand the analysis. I don't know how to read the reports. I don't get it like I want, but I want to invest because I can, at a logical level, understand that there is going to be a boom. And I think when it look when you look at driverless cars, when you look at humanoid robotics, when you look at how AI is going to be working with the healthcare, pharmaceutical industry to completely revolutionise that world. And even just a basic like anybody with no knowledge of the tech, no knowledge of the complexities of it, can look at it at a logical level, at what's happening in the world, and go, there is going to be a

period of vast technological advancement, and if you are on the wrong side of that, you will miss out on opportunity. And even when we're talking about risk, yes, it's going to be potentially volatile, because it's going to jump and drop and jump and drop, and there'll be companies that don't do what they said, Don't do what they said they were going to do. So there is risk associated it, with it, but my question to my friend was, is the risk not bigger

to by missing out on it, by not getting in even a little bit? Because at a logical level, we can all see that this change is coming, and

I'll be curious to know your thoughts on this, like as people are starting to think I had this thing in 2015 I was going to buy bitcoin, and my mentor at the time said to me, you don't want to do that. It's really risky. And it was 250 odd dollars or something, then, and

life will be different for me. Now, had I done that, and I think this is about being on the right side of it is change, because it's coming regardless it is, it is. And if you think about, just to, just to kind of

tangentially speak about the order of magnitude of this change is the same order of magnitude as, I would say, the Industrial Revolution, the Internet revolution, and going further back, when we went from hunter gatherers to settler societies, it is that big. And one of my mentors talks about the future is faster than you think is coming at a rate of knots like we've never seen before. Yeah, it's, it's crazy that when we're looking at so one of the things we do at Blue, blue high is essentially we produce for these 31 stocks, not just buy, hold, sell signals for them, but what we do is produce layman's terms, reports. We do the fundamental analysis. I do the tech analysis, which is the stuff I love. And we've built AI agents that do a lot of that stuff for us now. But we also produce, inside the telegram group, you know, full reports in layman's terms, like, what does this company do? Why are they? Why are they valued at the rate that they're valued. What does it mean to the world if this company gets its product alive? How does it link into the entire supply chain, supply chain to where do they sit in that supply chain? Are they at the kind of the end of that supply chain around longevity, where they've taken advantage of the data centres, the power, the chips, the software, the llms, or are they at the top end of that supply chain? Ie the power company? Where do they sit? So it's all in layman's terms, and I think that's, that's the bit that's missing. The allocation aspect is critical, and it's, I really feel for your friend, and I feel for human beings that look at this stuff. No even where to start. Do I put 10% into Intel? Do I put 4% in? Do I put it all in for 31 stocks? Do I spread it evenly? Do I weigh heavier than power companies, because that's the choke hold, if I even know that, that's the choke hold, or do I weigh more heavily on open my air?

And Nvidia, because they've just done this amazing deal. And Sam Altman is going to lease, you know, he's going to lease GPUs from Nvidia over the next five years. Like, amazing, huge involved, like you and I doing lease options. Essentially, that's what Nvidia and Altman have just created. So I feel for these human beings that don't even know, like, they know the principle of allocation. But where do I even start? And that's what that's what we do at Blue pie. And interestingly, that the whole idea of blue pie, the pie is the past allocation of the allocation. It's the allocation pie and blue, as in the blue planet, because these, these frontier technologies, are fundamentally reshaping our existence as human beings. So we follow the big money, the big capital flows, and everything we do in terms of disseminating that information down to our subscribers and our followers. And naturally, there's a couple of tiers. There's a free tier and a subscriber tier and a premium tier. You know, that's the world I've been in since 2011 so that's the that's how we've built blue pie. But even the free tier gives those buy wholesale tips, give some of the insight, and we then allow people that don't even know how to read big money flows and haven't got the time to research 31 different stocks and a whole new sector, the opportunity to stand on our shoulders and guess what? What this brings to everyday investors in the same way, we're building a fractional ownership blockchain powered platform for social housing to give people access to social housing returns that wouldn't have them the gold bullion buying club was to give people access to the returns and security that gold can give you without having to buy big chunks of gold, in the same way, blue pie is designed to give people access to the growth, inevitable growth of this toast ai, ai, tech boom that otherwise they would not have, because it's such a complicated sector, And so we stand on the shoulders of giants. Follow that big money people hopefully stand on our shoulders and get the benefit of that. And one

is, is frontier fund? Is that accessible? So, like, I invest in funds. So I invest in Ark, that's one of the ones. Not investment advice. Anyone listening? But arc is one of the funds that I invest in that work very much in this space. And I can go on free trade, and I can invest in our like via the platforms. Is frontier, a private fund that you

you'd have to go through you to get to is it something people can buy on the wider market? So the one thing I'm really and have always been

kind of red line. I don't take money off anybody in that sense. I will take money for education. I will, you know, do all of that stuff, yeah, and I'll make sure that there's a 10 100x return on investment like that. I'm absolutely committed to that, but I'm also committed to this rule that I don't take people's investment capital. I will happily give you my stock tips. I will happily give you my tips. I'll happily give you my research, like all of it. I will give you all of it,

but I won't take money. Why not? Because I don't trust myself with it or any of that stuff. Number one, we're not licenced like that, then we never will be licenced. Why I said never, say never, I don't know. But number two, because I don't want that to be the relationship between my tribe and I. I want to be sharing this knowledge completely openly, without that psychological cloud of I have to prove myself to these people and my shit has to be right. You know, I can say this is our thinking, this is our analysis. This is how we're joining some of the dots. These are our results. We've done all right so far. But I can also say I don't know where it's going to go. Let me just share all of this with you, and let me give you some ideas on how you can make the right decision. So our premium tier, you know, we unveil all the allocations, and, you know, we help people build their portfolios and so on and so forth. And if they want me to press some buttons to actually buy the pie, we'll press the buttons and buy the pie with their money. So it's not an open fund. Blue pie is being built. So to all intents and purposes, they can follow the fund, and they can invest in the same stocks, and depending on what tier there are, they can even get access to our all of our allocation ratios. And so that's the way I prefer to do things. Let me teach you how to do it. Let me give you the skills. Rather than you being addicted to my work, you being addicted to our service like you, and almost at the behest of our service. And also the flip side of that me feeling like I've got to prove something to you, because now I've got your money, and I have to make it work, and all those psychological issues about money,

it's really refreshing. And again, the one of the things I say all of the time at Money Mechanics events in the book, everything we do at Money Mechanics.

Is about helping people to become the champion of their own money, so they don't have to hand their money to somebody else and risk losing it in a scam or anything like that. There's so many people I speak to and they say, you know, I was worked for 18 months on a Bitcoin scam, and I gave them a bit and they gave it back, and I gave them a bit more, and then I gave them half a million pound and they disappeared. I actually think that everybody has the ability to invest their own money. There is so many tools available, like what you're talking about, you know, there's a number of different ones, where, if you've got the desire

to learn, if you've got the inclination to want to understand it even just a little bit better than you understand it now, then you can invest and make money and be the champion of your own money, so that you don't have to rely on giving it to other people. And, you know, in a world full of scammers and people who happily take your money and give you not much in return, it's amazing that there are people who are trying to

contrast, yeah, and I think it's about, you know, what I call economic empowerment. You know, if we can empower everybody to be as you are, which is why I love your work, to be economically savvy, and we can give them the knowledge, not just on the processes and the buttons to press and the accounts, you know, all of that stuff to set up the infrastructure, but then we can lay on top of the infrastructure these big principles like follow the big money, allocate, allocate their two levels within your portfolio and your entire networks. And we kind of give them the principles. And then on top of all of that, we give them essentially access to our inner thinking and our minds and our our own portfolios and our own pies and so on and so forth.

Amazing, that's absolutely amazing, and that, for me, is like, that's wholesome work. That's meaningful work. That's not making 1% on every trade because I'm managing your money. Like, this is wholesome meaningful work. In fact, we've got people that have been part of the gold bullion buying club since 2013

I get WhatsApp messages, text messages, DMS every single day, saying, didn't

like I started investing in one gramme per month. And in those days, those grammes per month were 33 pounds. So in a year, in a year, you've not even, you've not even got half an ounce,

like not even half an ounce. In fact, in two years, you don't even have half an ounce without one grammes, not the kind of ounces that people buy on the streets at 28 grammes. This is a problem.

I don't know what you mean. Dylan, yeah.

What I'm saying is that, you know that was so 2000 to 13 to 15, they haven't even got, you know, they've not even got one ounce. And then 2016 and 17, now they've tipped the ounce. And then 18 to 19, when there's a bit more. And as those years have gone on, they've increased their subscription to now two grammes a month, three grammes a month, four grammes a month, five grammes a month. So come 2020,

where when follow the big money comes into play. If you go back to the gold chart at June 2020, everything I've been talking about since 2013 in my keynotes, when we set up the piggy bank, bullying Buyers Club, everything I've been talking about came to a fruition in as it is June 2019, if you look at the gold chart in June 2019

you see the same spike on the technical analysis analyst. So you see the same spike in gold price, which now looks tiny, by the way. But in June 2019 it looked big that we saw three, 2008 French this is what I mean by following the big money. So when we saw that in June 2019 I did a live stream to, you know, what is a big number of people, because it went out for all my lists that I'd been building since 2013 and I just talked about that. Everything I said is happening now. This is emergency live stream. I'm gonna log into all my trading accounts. I'm going to show you doing the withdrawals. As I said, I always would when gold price spikes and we're going to divest into gold, we're going to hang tight, we're going to sit and wait until the shit hits the fan. That is exactly what we did. And that spike now in June 2019 like I said, looks tiny, but in 2019 when gold had been between 2013, and 19, stuck in a range of like 1250, to 1376, something like that, the range, and all of a sudden it pops out of the range. That shows you big capital flows going into gold, because it's pushing price higher. As you know, when money flows into an asset class, essentially the price goes up. And so we didn't know where the money was coming from. We also didn't know why it was going into gold, other than to say gold is a hedging asset. So whatever the big money flows are that are going into gold have got to be coming from risk assets. It's not just new money that's being created. It's people pulling money out of risk selling things to move.

Party gold, other things exactly, putting it into gold, because they know exactly, as they did months before the 2008 crash. And if you go back between 2006 and 2008 look at the gold chart. It follows this same pattern. Just before the 2008 crash, you get this huge, huge, huge influx into gold. You see the spike if you're monitoring hedging assets like this, predictive leading indicators like this, then you see where the big money is going. It's not just about that fourth tier nude story that you're reading. By which time it's too late, by the way, you're actually watching capital flows, which is what we do with Frontier fun. So we saw gold spike in June 2019, put all our money out of risk assets, put it into gold. Sat time.

July came, August came. Nothing happened. Nothing happened. Now I'm getting messages. I could

have been making money. I followed you, who said it was the investment advice. Where's the, where's the, where's the event, where's the event, where's the event. And I'm like, Okay, now I'm starting to kind of doubt this idea. No, no, follow the big money. That's your mantra. Stick to it. Stick to it. Stick to it. Then, then what started happening? Remember, November, December, 2019 people started getting sick. And I remember PRI and I we never get sick. Thankfully, touched, we never get sick. 2019 November, December. We are both like, what is this? Is awful. What like, what is this? And we went through the period, like, eight to 10 weeks,

right through into the new year, like, let me start feeling a little bit better, then we get sick again. Anyway, February 25 I'm at the Battersea Crown Plaza in bats. It's right next to the helipad. It's on the river we've got. I flew to New York that day. Ah, okay, so this is when it was starting to hit. The shit was hit in the ham. So I'm in the Crown Plaza, Battersea. I won't tell you who the bank was. I'm did was delivering a workshop on trading, bizarrely enough, in a technical analysis blah, blah blah, blah, blah, blah blah, talked about what happened in June 2019,

I think this is, I think this was the event by now, because we're starting to hear about Wuhan and starting to hear about Italy. Kind of things are starting to come out in the news. It's like, all right, I have redeemed myself. This is the event. This is why all that money went into gold, and I was out out in the breaks. And I won't say that the name of the bank, it would be not very prudent to do so, but I get chatting to this guy. He's got an international accent, like, What? What? Where he flown in from today. Tells me where he's flown in from tells me, look, between you and I, we are having an emergency meeting, and we are about to decide whether we shut all of our global offices down and get all of our people as a big bang,

get all our people to work from home. In goosebumps. Now I remember texting my dad that night. My dad's got the screenshot, damn shit is about to hit the fan. Get back. My dad, mom and dad were travelling. Get get back now. Like, immediately, get on the next plane out. Shit is gonna hit the fan. And indeed, you know, March came and we all went into lockdown, and shit hit the fan. So when I talk about following the big money, that's what I mean. Like, look at the flow, or look at the flows yourself. Watch the charts, or follow people like you. Follow people like me, and let us tell you what they are, but you have to. You have to have the courage of your own convictions, or the courage of the convictions of the people that you follow. So if you don't believe the people that you follow, and if you're the kind of person to get sucked into hype and so on and so forth. Actually, that's a dangerous game. So find the people that you trust, find the people who resonate with you. Find the people who seem to talk sentence. It's not even about their results. By the way, too many people look at people's results before they fall it's not about results. It is about whether what that person is saying feels like it's making sense, because economic results are down to economic volatility. So sometimes we're up, sometimes we're down. If I if all people did was follow my results, they would only follow me in the up times, because now everything's green and what about when everything's wrecked, which, by the way, just like in the.com crash, it will be read at some point, but at some time, they're able to manage that. And like we followed the.com boom all the way up and then all the way down, we will follow this boom all the way up and all the way down again. And so it's not about the results.

It is about whether what the person is saying seems to make sense to you, what the person is promising seems to make sense to you. You know, we don't promise wins all the time. We don't promise that we'll make people millionaires. We don't think that's the thing as well as people that are promising wins all the time.

Them are usually full of shit. In my experience, like, if you promise, if you're promising, wins all the time. It's not actually possible. Probability. There's no it doesn't make sense on blue blue pie.ai.

We have our ticker at the top. That is the 31 stocks that we invest in, you know, and the ticker runs at the top, blue pie.ai. Check it out. It should be live by the time this goes out. We literally add this to the show notes and everything, so people can come and check so much. Yeah, thank you so much. And so on the top. And like today, Nvidia is red.

There's a couple of stocks that are red. I mean, that's normal, natural, with the way it goes? The markets, right? Intel, are up from since my first recommendation eight weeks ago. You know, they're up like whatever X percent, you know, from 25 to $37 just before I came on, date 713, they were just before I came on, and so, but, I mean, that's great, but they might drop back down to 25 who knows? Target price, 46

we think they'll get to 100 by the end of like, to potentially by the end of quarter 120, 26 maybe sooner. Who knows? Who knows? Is the analysis sound Yes? Are you? Are you riding the right wave, like, yes, or are you riding a completely different wave? Are you riding the pharmaceutical wave, which, if you want it to ride, it then now is the wrong time to ride. It's not the right time correct and and that kind of brings me onto, onto just the tangential point is, when I talk about following the big money, you have to follow the big money that feels morally and ethically aligned with where you are. People ask me, all through lockdown, should I buy AstraZeneca? Should I buy Pfizer? And my answer was like, Are you taking to you? Yeah, are you taking them? And do you believe in the work that they're doing? If you do buy the stock, but you can't be somebody that doesn't believe in the work that they do, and then buy the stock that's completely incongruent. Doesn't make sense. Listen, yeah, I'm conflicted about some of the stocks that we invest in, but when I look at it on the whole, because of some of the individuals running the companies, essentially, and some of their philosophies. But when I look at is this company on the whole,

probably for humanity, or probably worse for humanity. And I think in probability, I've trained my brain to think in problems. By the way, if you can't think in probabilities, a really good book, may I give a book recommendation? Yeah, please do. I'll get it in the show notes I must read. Thinking in bets by Annie Duke. It is a game changer for people that aren't able to think in probabilities and aren't able to take risk. And what she talks about, and I love this, she's, she's the only, or the first, female poker player to, like, win tonnes and tonnes and tonnes of prize money, whatever it was, it's like she's got a record for being the only female poker player to win all these, like, poker series tournaments and blah blah. And she writes this book and has a newsletter, thinking in bets. And what she talks about is people try and play life as a game of chess, where you can see every single move in front of you. You just have to see more moves than the person opposite you, and you can win the game because it's laid bare for you. But actually, life is a game of poker. All you can see is your hand, and you don't know what's coming next. You don't know what other people have got. You can try and deduce what other people have got, but you don't know. So thinking in bets is about saying you've got to think in probabilities. So just coming back to this moral and ethical point, is this company on the whole, probably better for humanity or probably worse?

Take the personalities out of that. And so, yeah, I think we've kind of, we've talked around a lot, but the point here is following the big money is about either understanding the technical analysis, understanding global capital flows, understanding market cycles, you know, all of that stuff, or finding somebody who you trust. And trust is a is not based on what they show you, on their on their results. Trust is, do you resonate with that human being and stand on their shoulders? And you know, I hope that. I genuinely hope that what we do at Blue pie,

you know, manifest in the same way as what we do at purposeful property project, attracting

impact driven human beings that understand the importance of playing the monetary game in order that fundamentally they can win the spiritual game. They win the material game. Fine, that's the byproduct of playing the economic game. But who do you become in the process of playing the material game, who do you become? The process of playing money and economics. That's the thing that you that's the real legacy. You know that who did you become? And who did your children become? Because they saw the way that you operated. Who did you because they saw the way that you operated, and they saw the growth journey that you went on and you.

Know, are you somebody said a while ago that your parents

highs should be your low, so the ceiling that your parents got to should be your floor. Are you taking

the cycles, generational trauma cycles with you, or are you breaking those intergenerational trauma cycles and creating new cycles, and you will take new trauma into the world with you. Of course you will. That's nature. Can't all be can't all be pink candy cloth. But are you breaking the cycles that you need to creating new cycles? Who did you become as a result of winning the monetary, material economic game. Who did you become? Spiritually, I think that fundamentally, is where we're heading or where we should be heading. Thank you so much. I could talk to you about this for hours and hours, days and days, I'm sure, but at some point we have to wrap up. So the last thing we do on the end of every episode is we ask you a question that's come from our previous guest, and then we'll ask you for a question for our next guest. The question that was left by our previous guest is,

do you have a money based success quote that has inspired you to think differently about money

that you can think of the one that springs to mind now is actually not directly related to money, but it is related to getting what you want. And it's a quote by Zig Ziglar, and I'm about to butcher it. And I'm sure there's lots and lots of quotes, you know, like one of my couple of my heroes, Jacqueline Novogratz, the author of blue sweater and founder of acumen. And they've got loads of money quotes, but this particular one, Zig Ziglar, to get more of what you want in life, help other people get more of what they want in life. That's why we set up piggyback bullying. That's one set up purposeful property project. That's why we set up blue blue pie.ai.

Yeah, to get more of what you want, try and help other people get more of what they want. And you know, to put that into visual terms, you know, for me, it's about reaching out

and holding on to the to the hands of those people that are a few steps ahead of me, so I can be carried by them, but also reaching back and allowing others to hold on to our hands. So you become this like virtuous circle of giving and receiving, not, not the kind of circle that you might think immediately, oh, my God. Where did that come from? So, yeah, it's all about,

fundamentally, about giving, giving what you want, giving to others what they want, so that you can get what you want. Yeah, what you want. Amazing. Thank you so much. And what is your question for our next guest.

This is a really tough one.

Do you know what it would

be? It won't it would be, what is the cycle, the money mindset or the money trauma cycle that you've worked hard to break

will not be passed down to future generations. Like, what is the money cycle that you've worked really hard to break that will not be passed down to future generations? That, for me is like, that's the big win in life. What form of cycles are you breaking that you will not pass down to others that creates a better species? I fundamentally believe that. Dylan, thank you so much for your time. As always, you inspire me, incite me all the things. It's been really nice to hang out with you and chat and whatever. So I will get everything that Dylan has mentioned on the podcast. I'll get into the show notes, if anyone wants to get in touch with you, Instagram. Blue pie.ai I'm assuming website is just probably the best direction for you, for now. Blue pie.ai

there is a free Whatsapp group that you can join like that. That's the for this podcast, most relevant place to come.

Lovely. Thank you so much, and I will speak to you soon, no doubt. Thank you so see you later. Bye. Thank you so much for getting to the end of the podcast episode. I really hope that you enjoyed it. I just wanted to take this opportunity to remind you that the weekly Money Mechanics newsletter is available to you completely free. This is the newsletter I'm going to send out every week to just give you some ideas around what's happening in the markets, what's happening at a global level, what's happening at a lot more local level, so that you can better understand what you can do with your money to make it work for you for the future. I'm also going to share in the newsletter what I'm doing in my own portfolio, just to give you some insights into what my ideas are, why I'm making the decisions that I'm making, in the hope that it will help you to make those decisions in your own portfolios as well. All you've got to do is find the link that's with this episode, hit the link and subscribe, and that newsletter will start to come out to you every single week. I'd also really like.

To take this opportunity to invite you to drop me a review. I love the opportunity of getting to share these podcast episodes with you. It really helps me to better understand how we can do the best job that we can here at Money Mechanics, if you tell us your feedback. So drop us a review. Tell us the sort of guests that you want talk to me and connect with me on Instagram, you know, talk to us on YouTube, wherever you are hanging out, tell us how you're finding it, and we can make this the very best podcast it can be. Thank you again for being such a valued listener. I appreciate you all, and I'll speak to you soon. You.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai