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[SPEAKER_00]: Hey everybody, JJ Cooper, Jeff Ponce, another of the baseball America Prospect podcast.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And today, we are talking about the Toronto Blue Jays, your AL Champion Toronto Blue Jays.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Your AL also close to World Series Champions, game seven, a thrilling game seven.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Still an incredible season for the Blue Jays, best season in many, many years.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And here they are with a number one prospect in this organization that

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[SPEAKER_00]: We already are well aware of, and we'll spend some time on, but we'll go a little deeper on this deep dive because we've talked about triusavage a good bit, and we're pretty sure that you are pretty well aware of triusavage.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But I will ask you Jeff, the question we start with always.

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[SPEAKER_00]: How difficult was the decision to write triusavage at number one?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Not hard.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It was probably, I mean, JJ weather halt in the car and the system was a pretty easy call.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I would say that this was probably right up there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There was no questions at all.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I knew who the number one prospect was at the end of the season.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And it was only solidified in the last out of the world series.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We kind of know who the number one prospect was going to be for the Blue Jays.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think there's any debate.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There's no one, you know, pounding the table for, for, for, Argentinimala or Jojo Parker.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Any questions are going to be after one.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's, it's clearly, it's average.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We do BA adjusted grades now, and we've done kind of internally, but now we're displaying them to everyone and create a savage adjusted grade is a 55 adjusted grade, which is a pretty high elite level a tier for us.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Arjuna Mala and Jojo Parker are 45s, so that is a 10 point adjusted grade drop that's said two tier drop below.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So when Jeff says that there really wasn't a whole lot of debate at number one,

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[SPEAKER_00]: there really wasn't a whole lot of debate at number one.

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[SPEAKER_00]: The one question I'll ask is with your savages and something we've talked about a little bit, but how I do kind of feel like that the thing that makes tray is savage, so effective, he is the most over the top starting

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[SPEAKER_00]: could be a little bit concerning from a standpoint of we don't see that many pictures that many starting pictures that far over the top is this his biggest strength or is there a possibility that durability wise this could be a little bit of a concern down the road.

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[SPEAKER_00]: How much are you worried about?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think I'm a little more worried about the new R. Yeah, but how much are you worried about?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean this is one of those things that with you savage.

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[SPEAKER_01]: we had heard going back to the actual draft and I would say leading up to that point in time when he did get drafted or even days ahead of it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Probably was the one of the biggest arrow down guys among any of the college eligible players in that draft.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think now like hindsight being 2020, there's probably a lot of teams that picked between 10 and 20 that probably which they did take tray of savage, I would agree.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But the issue here is he's had a track record of handling innings.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, through, I don't have enough numbers in front of me, but at least in terms of the regular season, he threw 112 innings between all up every level of professional baseball through 93 and a third of the year before plus some postseason innings with East Carolina, and that was, you know, after dealing with a collapsed lung situation.

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[SPEAKER_01]: through an acupuncture procedure that just want to ride, you've seen that happen when some guys before.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I was just a dry needle.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think TJ Watt knows something about that as well.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, exactly.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I was leading that right into you, which is like serving it up to the Steelers fan here.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, but yeah, I think, you know, you look at your savages, track record, he's handled the lot of innings.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I've had people tell me he couldn't throw any other way.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know why he would.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Why would he change how he throws what makes him so much success.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's what makes him unique.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's it's a weird operation, but you know, we've seen guys that had buttery smooth mechanics and

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[SPEAKER_01]: They met every mechanical marker, and they've still got an injured.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, it's so hard to sort of project that out, especially when a guy does have kind of the number one thing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think we see with starting pictures, which is a track record of handling and he's dating back to college, pitching in some big moments.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He checks all those boxes.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think the big question is, can he survive without a pitch that really moves gloveside?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, because even his slider moves on side, most of the time, um, the forcing fastball obviously moves that way with a ton of ride and, you know, the devastating splitter, but doesn't have sort of any of the the glove side pitches.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Is he maybe going to try to add one and does that maybe mess with the fastball shape or the splitter or something that remains to be seen, but I think that's the biggest question mark for me, it's not necessarily healthy or the arm slot of the arm action, it's more, you know, can he add something that you know guys just aren't, you know, sitting sort of arm side and everything to be throws.

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[SPEAKER_00]: When you look, the actual I think the more interesting debate, okay?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Number one was a slam dunk, but you have the two short stops.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You have the two high school short stops, prominent picks different years, obviously.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But you have Arjuna Mala, who has shown flashes of greatness, I would say, in the minors, and has had stretches of time where it's like, woo, what's going on with Arjuna Mala?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And then you have Jojo Parker, who they drafted in the 2025 draft.

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[SPEAKER_00]: How close was the decision of who was two and who was three?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, Arjuna Mala has the advantage of proximity playing significant playing time in the minor leagues.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I can see that being the edge there, but was that a tougher decision?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it was a little bit of a tougher decision because I think, you know, the shiny new toy syndrome kind of comes into play sometimes with these draft guys, especially when they go high and there is a lot of talk about the hit tool and power and a lot of people, you know, that know what they're talking about.

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[SPEAKER_01]: that remains to be seen.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But I think in talking to some folks internally, it tend to be more in a mala, the reports that I get on a mala from scouts are more optimistic than I think the slash line might indicate.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's also worth keeping in mind.

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[SPEAKER_01]: just how young he is.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's completed two full years of minor league baseball and just turned 20 years old after the season.

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[SPEAKER_01]: A little week before the end of the world series, he turned 20 years old.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's going to be 20 again for all this year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he was the same age as some draft guys from the 2024 class last year and was in high A.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The thing that I kind of keep going back to in tomorrow, which is a big question mark for Jojo, is the shortstop defense.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think there's anybody I spoke with that thinks that Parker will stick at shortstop.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There's no most nobody that I spoke with, that doesn't think the model will stick at shortstop.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I get consistent 55 to 60 grades in the glove, consistent 55 to 60 plus on the arm.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Some people have even thrown 70s on his arm.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's really accurate.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Makes really good throws.

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[SPEAKER_01]: His internal clock is good.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The actions are good.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's pretty rangey out there and a half wet egg.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I think he's got a really good foundation in that sense.

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[SPEAKER_01]: With the model, we've seen one half a season in the second half and twenty twenty four.

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[SPEAKER_01]: That was phenomenal.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's one of the best teenage hitters in, um, minor league baseball in the second half.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Over the first two months of the season, Argin Amala was arguably the best hitter in high A.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He hit 289 372 528.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He had the strikeout rate down to 17.9%.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This was a guy that looked like he was trending with those.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Right, you know, the defense of ability and the base running, this was a guy that looked like he was trending toward like a top 20 prospect in the game, you know, maybe kind of filling into like where Aiden Miller was, they were kind of headed in opposite directions at that point.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then things really kind of just took a turn for the worst starting in June, and he never really righted the ship over the final few months, the season he hit 184 277 to 90.

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[SPEAKER_01]: That said, the strikeout rate, although it did climb from that 17%, still below his career average, and wasn't bad when he considered

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[SPEAKER_01]: a 19 year old at high a it was like 23.5% he's still walk that in above average rate and had really bad luck on balls and play it 234 baby.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So JJ what I did was I sat down and I watched every single at bat from the first half and then I watched every single this is the longest number one report that I wrote this year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I did this

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, November or whatever, and I watched every single lip bat from the second half, it was a timing issue, and I think that was something that was called out to me on the backfields in 2024 in terms of the PD folks not being sure if he was necessarily ready for a full season level, you know, right out of the gate.

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[SPEAKER_00]: because he did the up and back.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He went to the FSL and then they took him back and then they put him back in it again, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then he really performed.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And some of it was just some adjustments to his posture, which I think is a part of hitting that a lot of people, maybe necessary, like don't necessarily think about is just in terms of like,

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[SPEAKER_01]: you being on time and your swing path can really be adjusted by how squatted or upright you are.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, we even saw this with Colt Emerson this year and he took his big step forward.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It was a matter of kind of adjusting posture, getting a little bit more upright and you know, changing kind of his footing and stuff like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The model was really out in front on everything consistently, which is why I think the strike out rate wasn't so bad.

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[SPEAKER_01]: The Whiff rate did jump on breaking balls, which will happen when you're out in front of stuff.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It was hitting in the first half and doing damage.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He was right on time with a fastball and kind of catching, you know, the breaking stuff, the soft stuff out front at a contact point that he could actually do damage and backspin it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think a lot of it is just going to come down to adjustments in the swing, probably some posture type stuff as you did sort of slouch a little bit more in the box in the second half.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think eventually we'll see him get to a more consistent place in terms of the swing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, this other guy I'm going to compare him to had a lot more success in the miners, but it's not that different from Cody Ballinger, like a really athletic mover and I think it times Bellinger can get out of his swing and I think it's similar with the model.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There's just guys like this that are kind of always having to make adjustments as they settle into some bad habits.

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[SPEAKER_01]: the fact that he's so young has as much experience as he has.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And it has a lot of belief, not only from inside the organization, but I think from a lot of scouts outside the organization.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Whether he ends up with a BlueJays long term or ends up, you know, someplace else is the BlueJays continue to replicate the Dodgers north or whatever there's they're doing right now.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It wouldn't shock me if this guy is, you know, attend a 12-year big league or that plays a whole lot of short-style 20-home run seasons.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So we kind of hung out on that for a little while, but bigger picture, how is the system better or worse than Lester?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think the system is better and I think a lot of it came down to, you can't really say anything negative, which means you can't say anything up or down in terms of Namala because it was kind of

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[SPEAKER_01]: The same kind of season where you had a good first half and a bad second year, bad first half and a good second last year, but the out of town and guy like Jojo Parker, Johnny King took a huge step forward, gain stand for took a huge step forward.

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[SPEAKER_01]: They had an international signing in Juan Sanchez that debuted in the DSL was one of the top prospects in the Dominican summer league, the underlying dad looks really good the scout feedback, not only for myself, but from Josh Norris who's boots in the ground there in the DSL every summer his reports were really good.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think just pitching throughout the organization, credit to Justin Lear and Ricky Mindhold and some of the approach changes that they've made, really focusing on attacking in the zone work consistently with your best stuff, getting guys to kind of zone and tunnel a little bit better.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There's been a lot of success across their pitching development this year, even guys outside of the top 10 that I'm sure we'll talk about later in this podcast.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And even a guy that they traded like a Cal Steven allowed them to go and get Shane Beaver and then of course, you know, he opting in for next year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So that trade looks even better now that helped them go on this long world series run and made some some really important starts for them in October.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I think you look at this system, even though they've dealt some players away, it's a much better top 10.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's a really good top 7, and then you maybe get into a conversation of a little bit more of BlueJ's systems of your where there's guys that are really good death players, but maybe not a whole lot of like lurking future stars in that back half of the system.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And even that, I might be selling a little bit short on.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I think it's better.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think it was trending in the right direction last year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: We said as much on this podcast, we wrote as much and kind of covered it throughout the year.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's at a point now where it's a pretty good top five.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And they have three top 100 prospects.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I would say four or five, maybe even six or seven guys that could be in the conversation at some point this year depending on how, you know, Sanchez's debut is if Ricky Tiedam and comes back fully healthy and impresses again, I'm sure he'll be in conversations and if Johnny King continues to do what he did last year and kind of level up a little bit.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Same with Stanford, both of those guys could maybe be back under the top 100 conversation type of players.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We've kind of talked about this already in some ways, but we know that you savage.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If you've ever just graduated, calamity has struck, because he's not that far away right now.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He's in their opening day rotation.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He will graduate.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He should graduate.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Assuming that, the Mala obviously would be the logical one to go to too.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We've already talked about the Mala.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We've already even talked about Parker.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Is there someone else?

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'll look at this way.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Is there someone else who could end up being their number one prospect?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Is it crazy to think that Sanchez, I struggle to say the Sanchez is going to leap frog those short stops because you just talked about how good Argin the Mala is defensively.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of value in that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: No matter how good a season one Sanchez has, one Sanchez is not gonna have as much defensive value.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think we have video on here on the YouTube viewers.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If you're on the podcast, just trust us when I say, one Sanchez is one of the bigger, stoutor,

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[SPEAKER_00]: infielders that you will see in the Dominican summer late.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Let's just put it that way.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like he's going to be a bat primarily.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Is he got a chance or does someone else have a chance or is it really probably going to be between the short stops?

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[SPEAKER_01]: He would have to come state side and have like a junior caminero type of blow up where it's like he's hitting 300.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's hitting for power.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He underlying metrics are crazy.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's hitting these, um,

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, sort of light tower homers or whatever, but he doesn't have, I mean, he's not like he's he's a really good prospect.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think he compares to a similar

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[SPEAKER_01]: similarities to Cameron Aero when he was in the Dominican Summer League.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's not that level of power just yet.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think you'll get to it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think eventually he will get to sort of maybe 70 raw and maybe even, you know, plus in game.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It was a little more conservative and, you know, I think I put a, I think I put a maybe a 55.

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[SPEAKER_01]: No, I didn't put a 60 on it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know,

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[SPEAKER_01]: There you go.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I think you can get there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It would be even from the perspective of him going to the Florida complex league and having a Rinal Rodriguez season, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: That's maybe a better com.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Because he's not a catcher, he doesn't have the defensive value.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if I can get him there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: What it would have to be is it would have to be bad seasons by Demala, and he starts to really tumble down the list and Parker defense is worse than we think and he doesn't hit quite as much as we hope.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So it might be a bad thing if Sanchez is done for what is the next year, frankly.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I know, I don't know if there's another guy that has

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[SPEAKER_01]: That can't sort of potential.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe Johnny King, I can't craft the Ricky.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I cannot craft the Ricky teedam in case because he would graduate.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, he would graduate.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think they're going to be cautious with his innings this year and rightfully so.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But I think maybe Johnny King is a good one like if King.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it has a great season, you know, maybe starts in to need and and shoves there for two months and they put them on that path that we saw with like just savage and stand up for and Steven and some of those guys and they moved up to Vancouver when it gets a little warmer and he really performs over the course of the season in Vancouver, maybe get some starts late the year similar to stand up for in double a there's me.

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[SPEAKER_01]: King is like one of the top left handed pictures baseball.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if the command is there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And if he's if it's possible for him to take that kind of a step in terms of command, while adding a third pitch, which are two things that he kind of has to do to get to that top 100 conversation be at that level.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's not, you know, impossible, but it's fairly improbable that happens.

18:37.612 --> 18:39.555
[SPEAKER_01]: So what is this or good at developing?

18:40.683 --> 18:42.066
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, that kind of feeds into the last one.

18:42.207 --> 18:43.290
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's pitching right now.

18:43.530 --> 18:54.979
[SPEAKER_01]: I think we stand here a year later and we could talk about the number of guys they've gotten to the majors in terms of,

18:55.145 --> 19:00.292
[SPEAKER_01]: underrated, hit tool-based players, the Davis Schneiders and those types.

19:00.312 --> 19:01.494
[SPEAKER_01]: They've done really well with those guys.

19:01.554 --> 19:05.019
[SPEAKER_01]: Even guys, they found out the scrap people like in early Clement, they've done good with those guys.

19:06.000 --> 19:07.382
[SPEAKER_01]: Addison Barger was homegrown.

19:08.023 --> 19:09.325
[SPEAKER_01]: Boba Shet was homegrown.

19:10.466 --> 19:14.652
[SPEAKER_01]: Flatter-Grunker, Jr., of course is homegrown, though it's been a few years since those guys have gotten out.

19:14.672 --> 19:17.876
[SPEAKER_01]: But they've had a consistent wave of at least decent players that contributed.

19:19.198 --> 19:21.321
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think right now, you look at,

19:22.330 --> 19:27.257
[SPEAKER_01]: the steps that so many of their pitchers have taken over the last year.

19:28.579 --> 19:29.821
[SPEAKER_01]: We wrote about it in depth.

19:29.861 --> 19:36.011
[SPEAKER_01]: There was a full article up on the site still there, talking about the upgrades and the BlueJays pitch and development.

19:36.031 --> 19:37.473
[SPEAKER_01]: And they took a very strategic approach.

19:37.493 --> 19:42.841
[SPEAKER_01]: They took a full year with Ricky Mindhold and the organization kind of assessing things at where they were at in 2024.

19:44.023 --> 19:46.466
[SPEAKER_01]: They made some decisions.

19:47.488 --> 19:50.953
[SPEAKER_01]: They made some changes in terms of personnel.

19:50.933 --> 19:57.822
[SPEAKER_01]: him and Ricky really connected, and I think he was kind of the last piece and them being able to kind of implement some things.

19:58.223 --> 20:08.837
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if they thought it would take off as quickly as it did, but it really did take off, and it wasn't just with guys that they had recently brought in like a savage or a Stephen.

20:09.318 --> 20:10.800
[SPEAKER_01]: It was those guys like Stanford.

20:10.840 --> 20:20.873
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a guy like Johnny King, it was a draft pick, but it's tough with these prep pitching prospects to kind of get them to take

20:21.258 --> 20:25.743
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, eventually he got traded at Kendri Rojas had a pretty decent season as well.

20:25.783 --> 20:27.185
[SPEAKER_01]: So there was a lot of success.

20:27.265 --> 20:30.608
[SPEAKER_01]: I think kind of across this system on the pitching front.

20:31.129 --> 20:34.993
[SPEAKER_01]: And then they have some guys that are returning from injury in a guy like Ricky Cheaman later this year.

20:35.134 --> 20:41.080
[SPEAKER_01]: Jake Bloss is another one that was kind of a breakout prospect with the astros that then got flipped to the jays.

20:41.100 --> 20:42.362
[SPEAKER_01]: It's on their 40 man roster.

20:42.862 --> 20:45.045
[SPEAKER_01]: Those guys could come back and maybe contribute.

20:45.105 --> 20:47.147
[SPEAKER_01]: As well as some of the other guys that

20:47.127 --> 20:53.316
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, there's one guy in particular, we'll talk about, we get into the podcast version, talk at sleepers, that I want to dig into a little bit.

20:53.436 --> 21:04.933
[SPEAKER_01]: But a lot of arms in the system that I think you can be excited about, and as they bring in more talent, got another way from this draft class, be interesting to see how, you know, those guys look a year later.

21:05.622 --> 21:08.085
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, as you said, a little bit of foreshadowing there.

21:08.105 --> 21:11.509
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the end of the video portion of this on the baseball market, YouTube feed.

21:11.870 --> 21:20.841
[SPEAKER_00]: But if you're listening on the podcast, or if you want to go listen on the podcast feed, we'll have more talking about BlueJay sleepers outside of the top 10, right after the quick break.

21:23.904 --> 21:27.569
[SPEAKER_00]: So Jeff, you said you wanted to talk about sleepers, let's talk about sleepers.

21:27.749 --> 21:35.038
[SPEAKER_00]: So who are some of the prospects outside of the top 10 that BlueJay's fans and prospect fans should be paying attention to?

21:35.508 --> 21:43.161
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think everybody knows your Hendrick Pinojo was everybody's favorite rule five selection across Twitter.

21:44.102 --> 21:49.030
[SPEAKER_00]: So we wanted to not get picked with the bad at ball data, the offensive numbers that he has.

21:49.531 --> 21:52.977
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we have a clear answer, but it's a...

21:52.957 --> 21:56.641
[SPEAKER_01]: I put a 30 on the glove JJ and I think it's a 20 maybe.

21:56.821 --> 21:57.722
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it might be a 20.

21:57.802 --> 21:59.164
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think I might be in.

21:59.304 --> 22:01.006
[SPEAKER_01]: I might be polite on that.

22:01.166 --> 22:02.768
[SPEAKER_01]: It's it's we're projecting.

22:03.048 --> 22:05.791
[SPEAKER_00]: We're projecting that you will improve down the road.

22:05.851 --> 22:09.916
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, to get to not the worst events of left field or out there.

22:09.936 --> 22:20.247
[SPEAKER_01]: The organization was making a case that he did get better last year in left field, but as you saw in my highlight video that I had shared with you guys internally when I was doing the the handbook work.

22:21.425 --> 22:21.946
[SPEAKER_00]: Not great.

22:22.768 --> 22:24.192
[SPEAKER_01]: Because you're in a rainbow.

22:24.292 --> 22:28.021
[SPEAKER_00]: I will describe this because we, that's video that we don't have right to do.

22:28.041 --> 22:37.324
[SPEAKER_00]: So that is, but to just describe it, Penango in the outfield, it's not like he, it's not like he just doesn't have range.

22:38.047 --> 22:45.297
[SPEAKER_00]: it does seem at times like that the ball's arrival surprises him that gravity does exist.

22:45.778 --> 22:49.804
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like that it's like, oh, it's here and what do I do with it now?

22:50.484 --> 22:52.087
[SPEAKER_00]: Is that, I mean, how would you describe it?

22:52.107 --> 22:53.969
[SPEAKER_00]: You watched it even more times than I did.

22:54.350 --> 22:59.798
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, there's a lot of plays where the ball and him are just not friends.

22:59.818 --> 23:07.969
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think there's a combination of bad jumps, not a ton of speed.

23:08.506 --> 23:15.082
[SPEAKER_01]: And it ventures streak that he likes to get a little risky.

23:15.182 --> 23:21.236
[SPEAKER_01]: He likes to dive and and he is not one who should be not somebody that should probably dive.

23:21.416 --> 23:22.920
[SPEAKER_01]: He should play the percentages.

23:23.069 --> 23:33.279
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, there were times like just not even just like stuff that he didn't catch or wobbled or bungled or the timing was off, it was like he missed it in the ball and fire while he was diving.

23:33.439 --> 23:40.887
[SPEAKER_01]: And it was like he put in a lot of the center field, there has to back him up constantly because you know that some balls are going to squeak by.

23:40.907 --> 23:42.829
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I know I want to crap on the guy.

23:42.849 --> 23:49.836
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that this is, but this and this summarizes like if you said, well, why did the blue jays not protect him?

23:50.845 --> 23:53.209
[SPEAKER_00]: because they didn't think he would get picked.

23:53.229 --> 23:54.511
[SPEAKER_00]: Why would he not get picked?

23:54.992 --> 24:00.520
[SPEAKER_00]: Because there's not really a room for a rule five to eight.

24:00.660 --> 24:01.442
[SPEAKER_00]: There's just not.

24:01.542 --> 24:05.728
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I mean, I know this happened at once or twice in the 21st century.

24:06.590 --> 24:14.863
[SPEAKER_00]: Chris Shelton was kind of the DH, primarily, you know, drafted the catcher, but first base been sliced DH 20 plus years ago.

24:14.963 --> 24:15.604
[SPEAKER_00]: But,

24:16.023 --> 24:21.511
[SPEAKER_00]: That's why he's available, but okay, so that we did talk about this guy can really hit.

24:22.612 --> 24:38.715
[SPEAKER_00]: But what are the chances that he can get to a playable big league career, I mean, again, I don't know if you're getting to a 30-in-left field, probably doesn't get you to the roster spot.

24:38.775 --> 24:39.096
[SPEAKER_00]: Does it?

24:39.156 --> 24:44.764
[SPEAKER_00]: You have to get to a 40, I would say at least.

24:45.132 --> 24:52.843
[SPEAKER_01]: Actually, I even think that's under selling Davis Schneider to say that he can get the Davis Schneider defensive levels, but I don't think I think that's a dream.

24:52.963 --> 24:57.309
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that that would be exactly outstanding.

24:58.891 --> 25:03.057
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, he's going to have to hit his way into the lineup and it's going to have to be.

25:03.560 --> 25:14.028
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, the angles will have to get a little bit better and all the other stuff will have to stay the same, and then it's going to be like, all right, like this guy is, you know, a legitimate DH, he's an excellent hitter.

25:14.549 --> 25:16.033
[SPEAKER_01]: We have to get him into line up.

25:17.988 --> 25:24.058
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, even if you're a believer, I think 40% seems kind of optimistic that he can pull that off.

25:24.078 --> 25:26.682
[SPEAKER_01]: That's just, it's hard to do that, you know.

25:27.463 --> 25:39.743
[SPEAKER_01]: Especially considering there's a lot of guys whose bats are probably equally as good that are 40 defenders at multiple positions, that might suck up those at bats with teams, and you're looking at 26 mental officers.

25:39.763 --> 25:41.106
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just a tough player to get on.

25:41.847 --> 25:43.810
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he's gonna have to get up.

25:44.667 --> 25:56.953
[SPEAKER_01]: There was an injury or something and they could play him at DH and he hits and then, you know, they could package them in a trade with team that doesn't have a DH like that's kind of the best case scenario as I'm going through, you know, options in my head.

25:57.414 --> 25:58.156
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a fun bad.

25:58.196 --> 25:58.977
[SPEAKER_01]: It's a fun player.

25:59.017 --> 26:03.587
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the kind of guy that fantasy baseball players kind of want to dream on and maybe roster in their leagues, but.

26:03.567 --> 26:15.022
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if it's the kind of guy that actual real life-majority teams want to take the chance on rostrums because it's really hard, and especially considering he's smaller, so he's not going to be a first basement.

26:17.185 --> 26:17.705
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a child.

26:17.725 --> 26:23.733
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so that's one, but there are others who are a little bit more of the conventional sleeper variety.

26:24.073 --> 26:24.274
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

26:24.494 --> 26:25.255
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm sorry.

26:25.420 --> 26:33.632
[SPEAKER_01]: I think right-handers, Silvano, Hatcheveria, they had signed him in 2024 out of Cuba, $240,000.

26:33.652 --> 26:35.655
[SPEAKER_01]: And not a big signing bonus.

26:36.817 --> 26:43.167
[SPEAKER_01]: Was a DSL guy signed late in the, I think you signed in June or May.

26:43.607 --> 26:49.516
[SPEAKER_01]: And like four days later, this affiliated debut in a DSL came state side, 2025.

26:50.097 --> 26:53.402
[SPEAKER_01]: Started the complex, went to low-A.

26:54.074 --> 26:56.417
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, and really performed.

26:56.497 --> 26:58.880
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he was, he was really good this year.

26:58.920 --> 27:00.643
[SPEAKER_01]: One of their best performing pitchers.

27:01.444 --> 27:09.114
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not the most, you know, scanned out stuff, but the stuff isn't bad.

27:09.134 --> 27:14.160
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, still throws three to five, it'll touch 98 miles an hour.

27:14.220 --> 27:17.124
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not crazy release trades or a ton of movement.

27:18.265 --> 27:23.372
[SPEAKER_01]: Does get some some arm side run in the fastball that maybe allows to play up a little bit.

27:23.352 --> 27:34.033
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's a really good slider, probably above average, maybe as he gets more exposure in high A, I might be more comfortable going with a plus there to get some pluses.

27:34.734 --> 27:37.700
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's plus command, you know, control.

27:37.760 --> 27:39.223
[SPEAKER_01]: He throws a ton of strikes.

27:40.165 --> 27:42.610
[SPEAKER_01]: A guy that should move pretty quick, I think.

27:43.687 --> 27:49.764
[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of patient scouts wise looked at him as a potential number five type of starter.

27:50.265 --> 27:59.350
[SPEAKER_01]: And I don't think that's that's crazy to project though he was older obviously last year still going to be 23 years old for all this year.

28:00.106 --> 28:03.151
[SPEAKER_01]: He got a decent amount of time in Vancouver.

28:03.191 --> 28:05.915
[SPEAKER_01]: He got the four or five starts there over the end of the season.

28:05.935 --> 28:07.778
[SPEAKER_01]: It was really good.

28:07.838 --> 28:10.923
[SPEAKER_01]: It wouldn't be all together shocking.

28:10.943 --> 28:14.870
[SPEAKER_01]: And we'll see how the roasters fall together in the spring.

28:15.371 --> 28:19.397
[SPEAKER_01]: If he does make a jump to AA, I think once he's there,

28:19.833 --> 28:30.990
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, there's a chance this guy could pitch his way into the big league picture, you know, we maybe not with the blue days, but we'll see, you know, going into 2027.

28:31.882 --> 28:58.969
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I said, interesting, these big, it's six forward, you know, 220, 225 pounds, kind of already has the grown man frame, prove that he could handle some innings, through, you know, 86 and two thirds last year, probably could have thrown a little bit more, had he not been at complex affiliate, kind of missed the first month of the season, maybe would have exceeded a hundred innings, and I don't think that's crazy to think.

28:58.949 --> 29:05.799
[SPEAKER_01]: Could be a guy that levels up quite a bit next year, especially if the velocity takes another jump and he's more four to six.

29:07.001 --> 29:08.643
[SPEAKER_01]: That would be a little bit more interesting.

29:08.764 --> 29:12.709
[SPEAKER_01]: So, and then then just the quality of the change up, it is kind of a two-page mix.

29:14.572 --> 29:17.376
[SPEAKER_01]: Some, you know, more positive scouts see the number five starter.

29:18.238 --> 29:21.322
[SPEAKER_01]: There's some other guys, maybe see him more, it's like a seventh or eighth inning type guy.

29:23.165 --> 29:26.610
[SPEAKER_00]: So there are a couple of guys that have this in this top 30

29:26.945 --> 29:37.818
[SPEAKER_00]: kind of more of the control profile like Fernando Perez is kind of the the truly the guy who's like if you could just have a little bit more to his stuff, right?

29:38.158 --> 29:44.306
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I feel like there's a lot of people out there who love the guy who can throw the baseball on the black over and over.

29:44.886 --> 29:52.956
[SPEAKER_00]: Fernando Perez is that it's just a question of if you can throw on the black but is it going to go out faster than it came in regularly when he does so?

29:53.436 --> 29:54.758
[SPEAKER_00]: You know is he another guy who

29:55.480 --> 29:59.529
[SPEAKER_00]: if there could be a little bit of development here, or is it probably he's a little bit maxed out?

30:00.652 --> 30:08.089
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, just physically he's not the most death-wedded guy, you know, it's kind of,

30:09.284 --> 30:30.820
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's listed at 170, the way it is probably more like 215 at this point, there's just not a lot of spin trades, there's not a ton of, you know, interesting shapes, not a lot of power in the profile, I mean things could change, it's not an above average pitch in the profile right now.

30:30.800 --> 30:36.366
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, there's an average change up and that's about it, but it is 70 command.

30:36.386 --> 30:42.812
[SPEAKER_01]: You're thinking you had the highest strike rate of starters that threw over 200 pitches or whatever in the minor leagues last year.

30:42.852 --> 30:45.275
[SPEAKER_01]: Just, you know, pounds the zone.

30:45.315 --> 30:46.896
[SPEAKER_01]: That's kind of how we operate.

30:47.437 --> 30:50.600
[SPEAKER_01]: Moves moves the ball around the zone.

30:50.640 --> 30:57.567
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll show you, you know, four different shapes,

30:57.547 --> 31:09.417
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, as an interesting nickname though, he's the goat because there was a video when he signed where they were goats roaming around in the background.

31:09.577 --> 31:16.683
[SPEAKER_01]: And so the scout that was watching it, like called it out and it kind of became a famous video that got passed around the Blue Jays front office.

31:16.723 --> 31:21.628
[SPEAKER_01]: So when he showed up, they let him know that he was known as the goat in the Blue Jays front office.

31:21.688 --> 31:23.569
[SPEAKER_01]: So a good nickname though.

31:23.749 --> 31:26.912
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean,

31:27.702 --> 31:33.013
[SPEAKER_00]: And I write to say, like, that is the one thing why the Blue Jason says is that you said, you get to that 10 list on this.

31:33.614 --> 31:35.899
[SPEAKER_00]: And after that, it kind of does start to tail off.

31:36.540 --> 31:46.200
[SPEAKER_00]: The key thing on the pitching side that jumps out to me is not a whole lot of guys like I always love to find those guys in that 11 to 30 range where it's like, hey,

31:46.180 --> 31:51.428
[SPEAKER_00]: If this guy can really take a step for the greater to control improvement, you can really take off.

31:51.668 --> 32:05.269
[SPEAKER_00]: Or, you know, this guy who, I do the red system is like, well, Luis May has never had great control, Zach Maclo had had great control, but if you throw 103 and he got a slider, maybe you can get that to all work.

32:05.570 --> 32:15.345
[SPEAKER_00]: The blue jays, I feel like that you get to 12 13 14 on this list after that and it's like it's a lot of guys where the stuff could picture wise is a little fringe year.

32:15.365 --> 32:30.048
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, okay, they either have a change up or they have control, but there's not a whole lot of guys where you're like, they have that combination of a breaking ball and arm speed for the fastball to really kind of fit in a bullpen or to kind of take another step forward.

32:30.569 --> 32:32.792
[SPEAKER_00]: That's where I feel like this does kind of tail off a little bit.

32:33.447 --> 32:37.933
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the guys that are, you know, more stuff guys at the back of the list are probably relievers.

32:38.013 --> 32:44.942
[SPEAKER_01]: I'd say the one guy, you could maybe point to, but he's had a very rocky road, is Brandon Barrier.

32:45.002 --> 32:49.127
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, he's in the mound, like the stuff is still there.

32:49.147 --> 32:52.812
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he'll write it up to 95, 96 on the foreseen.

32:54.554 --> 32:56.637
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, the slider is,

32:57.916 --> 32:58.720
[SPEAKER_01]: pretty filthy.

32:59.262 --> 33:03.581
[SPEAKER_01]: He throws like a load of mid 90s cutter now as kind of his primary fastball.

33:04.746 --> 33:07.116
[SPEAKER_01]: It's still a plus slider.

33:08.193 --> 33:22.754
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's interesting, you know, if we can see where the cutter slider combination goes where he's mixing in some four seamers and there's maybe some more control there and he could pitch 65 innings in a year, the given right you see 65, I think we're happy.

33:23.595 --> 33:36.613
[SPEAKER_01]: He's a dude that could take a big step is just he's never been on the mound and you know, he's had a little overweight after his first season lost that way and then got injured and then came back and got injured again.

33:36.948 --> 33:39.054
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just how to vary unusual path.

33:39.214 --> 33:42.223
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is kind of a make or break season for barrier.

33:42.283 --> 33:46.535
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's not the realm of possibility that you show is up and shoves.

33:46.616 --> 33:48.882
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, there is at least nasty stuff there.

33:50.026 --> 33:53.073
[SPEAKER_00]: So let's have a look at some of the sleepers in the BlueJays organization.

33:53.454 --> 33:56.241
[SPEAKER_00]: That was our look at the BlueJays for our deep dive.

33:56.261 --> 34:00.391
[SPEAKER_00]: There are many more of these deep dyes on the Baseball Mercky YouTube channel and the podcast feed.

34:00.552 --> 34:05.624
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you enjoyed this, please leave a review like subscribe to the Baseball Mercky YouTube channel.

34:05.644 --> 34:08.992
[SPEAKER_00]: We want to make sure that you get all the great content that we're producing there.

34:09.333 --> 34:12.420
[SPEAKER_00]: And obviously check out everything that we're doing at Baseball America.com.

34:12.922 --> 34:14.124
[SPEAKER_00]: For Jeff, I'm JJ.

34:14.405 --> 34:15.207
[SPEAKER_00]: So long, everybody.