INTRO: Welcome to the NSPCC Learning Podcast, where

INTRO: we share learning and expertise in child

INTRO: protection from inside and outside of the

INTRO: organisation.

INTRO: We aim to create debate, encourage reflection and

INTRO: share good practise on how we can all work

INTRO: together to keep babies, children and young

INTRO: people safe.

JENNIFER DIXON: Hello and welcome to this NSPCC Learning

JENNIFER DIXON: podcast on emotional resilience.

JENNIFER DIXON: My name is Jennifer Dixon and I'm the

JENNIFER DIXON: team manager in the Scotland Hub.

JENNIFER DIXON: I'm going to introduce two of my

JENNIFER DIXON: colleagues who are joining me today, Jo

JENNIFER DIXON: and Prajapa.

JO GRACE: My name is Jo Grace and I'm a children's

JO GRACE: services practitioner with the NSPCC coming

JO GRACE: up almost 15 years.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Hello, I'm Prajapa Seneviratne and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: I'm the Research and Evaluation

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Officer at NSPCC in Scotland.

JENNIFER DIXON: Thank you both for joining me today.

JENNIFER DIXON: I'm going to facilitate some of the

JENNIFER DIXON: questions and ask you both to talk about

JENNIFER DIXON: one of the projects we all worked on in

JENNIFER DIXON: Govan, but also to talk a bit more about

JENNIFER DIXON: emotional resilience itself.

JENNIFER DIXON: So first of all, Jo, to you, can you tell

JENNIFER DIXON: me a bit about what is emotional

JENNIFER DIXON: resilience to start with?

JO GRACE: So I think probably the easiest way to start is

JO GRACE: almost by giving a definition of what emotional

JO GRACE: resilience is.

JO GRACE: The main one that we used originated from

JO GRACE: the Harvard Centre for the Developing Child

JO GRACE: and they define resilience as having

JO GRACE: the right support to cope,

JO GRACE: adapt and thrive in spite of adverse

JO GRACE: life experiences.

JO GRACE: It's key for managing stress, navigating

JO GRACE: transitions and change, and maintaining healthy

JO GRACE: mental wellbeing.

JO GRACE: Why is emotional resilience important?

JO GRACE: It's a massive life skill.

JO GRACE: It's something that we have to learn.

JO GRACE: So our parents will often be

JO GRACE: our first teachers as models

JO GRACE: of emotional resilience and emotional

JO GRACE: intelligence.

JO GRACE: Positive experiences, along with learning

JO GRACE: self care practices and building trusting

JO GRACE: relationships for children, act

JO GRACE: as protective factors that help build

JO GRACE: strength and the ability to cope.

JO GRACE: So whilst it's important to start developing

JO GRACE: emotional resilience from early childhood,

JO GRACE: resilience is an evolving process and it

JO GRACE: continues to develop throughout our lives.

JO GRACE: It's finding the mental and the emotional

JO GRACE: strength, and the support from others around

JO GRACE: you, to be able to pick yourself up and

JO GRACE: kind of keep going and cope in the face of

JO GRACE: whatever the adversity is.

JENNIFER DIXON: Do you think you could tell me a bit

JENNIFER DIXON: about the emotional resilience programme

JENNIFER DIXON: in Govan that we developed?

JO GRACE: Sure, so the actual emotional resilience

JO GRACE: programme came about as

JO GRACE: a result of the consequences of the COVID

JO GRACE: pandemic. When we returned to

JO GRACE: being in work, loosely in 2021

JO GRACE: and then into 2022, there were seven

JO GRACE: primary schools in Govan — and we had really

JO GRACE: good connections with them anyway prior to

JO GRACE: COVID — so a lot of them contacted us

JO GRACE: to let us know that transition

JO GRACE: back to in-person education after

JO GRACE: the COVID pandemic was really significantly

JO GRACE: impacting the children.

JO GRACE: Their emotional and social connections had been

JO GRACE: massively impacted by the lockdown and

JO GRACE: actually many of the children were carrying

JO GRACE: grief and loss that were unsupported, whether

JO GRACE: that was through direct bereavement

JO GRACE: of family members both locally or

JO GRACE: around the world.

JO GRACE: But also huge losses in terms of socialising

JO GRACE: and friendships and activities and the things

JO GRACE: that they did during, you know, after school

JO GRACE: and all those kind of things, because

JO GRACE: everything had stopped.

JO GRACE: The schools felt that the children needed a

JO GRACE: safe space and some conversations to learn how

JO GRACE: to manage their feelings in order to be able to

JO GRACE: focus on their learning.

JO GRACE: So, the schools asked us if there was anything

JO GRACE: that we could do to try and support that.

JO GRACE: As a team, we all worked together in

JO GRACE: consultation and in co-creation with the

JO GRACE: schools to develop the emotional resilience

JO GRACE: programme.

JO GRACE: The aim of the programme was to build

JO GRACE: resilience in the children through developing

JO GRACE: their emotional awareness,

JO GRACE: their emotional language, their emotional

JO GRACE: intelligence.

JO GRACE: So this included things like being able to

JO GRACE: recognise and name their feelings, developing

JO GRACE: empathy towards others, to know the importance

JO GRACE: of being able to identify a trusted, safe,

JO GRACE: caring, nurturing adult that they would be able

JO GRACE: to reach out to and ask for help; but

JO GRACE: also to know how to take care of themselves and

JO GRACE: their own mental health, as well as that of

JO GRACE: their friends and being supportive to their

JO GRACE: friends. We developed this five-week programme.

JO GRACE: The sessions were 60 minutes in duration

JO GRACE: that we ran over five weeks.

JO GRACE: It was facilitated by two workers

JO GRACE: in each group alongside the class

JO GRACE: teacher.

JO GRACE: We held planning meetings before the

JO GRACE: sessions in order to make sure that we

JO GRACE: understood what the needs of the children in

JO GRACE: the classroom were.

JO GRACE: And we held post-planning debriefs

JO GRACE: with the teaching staff in order to review and

JO GRACE: assess how the programme had gone and the

JO GRACE: benefits that the teachers were seeing or

JO GRACE: hearing from the children.

JO GRACE: Ultimately by 2024,

JO GRACE: we had delivered the programme to just under

JO GRACE: 800 children in the Govan area, which

JO GRACE: was quite incredible.

JENNIFER DIXON: Thank you, Jo. Next question will be, and

JENNIFER DIXON: I'm gonna ask both of you this question.

JENNIFER DIXON: So, Jo, from a practice point of view,

JENNIFER DIXON: Prajapa, from the evaluation point of

JENNIFER DIXON: view, what were the benefits of the

JENNIFER DIXON: programme?

JO GRACE: Schools really welcomed the emotional facility

JO GRACE: programme as a really valuable opportunity to

JO GRACE: connect with and support the children in a

JO GRACE: different way in their classrooms.

JO GRACE: An awful lot of the teachers had said that they

JO GRACE: felt a little bit de-skilled in knowing how to

JO GRACE: manage when you're dealing with the behaviours

JO GRACE: of 30 or 33 children in the class who

JO GRACE: all have different needs.

JO GRACE: The teachers were struggling how to know to

JO GRACE: meet all those needs consistently.

JO GRACE: So by bringing the programme into the class and

JO GRACE: really keeping the teachers as a core part of

JO GRACE: that, that really upskilled the teachers

JO GRACE: in their abilities to connect with the

JO GRACE: children. Alongside that, the teachers told us

JO GRACE: that many of the children had faced significant

JO GRACE: challenges, not just the bereavement that I

JO GRACE: mentioned earlier, but there were other things

JO GRACE: like developmental delays, adjusting

JO GRACE: to being back in the school environment or new

JO GRACE: environments.

JO GRACE: Govan is an incredibly diverse community,

JO GRACE: so there are lots and lots of different

JO GRACE: languages and cultures.

JO GRACE: In one of the schools that we worked in, they

JO GRACE: had children speaking 34 different languages.

JO GRACE: So there was some real significant challenges

JO GRACE: for the teaching staff to be able to understand

JO GRACE: and meet the needs of this really wide ranging

JO GRACE: group of children.

JO GRACE: And the programme was able to meet

JO GRACE: those needs, not just for the schools, but then

JO GRACE: also for the children.

JO GRACE: The feedback that we got from the children was

JO GRACE: really powerful in terms of— we would

JO GRACE: do a safety plan at the end of the programme

JO GRACE: and we would say to them can you name

JO GRACE: for us, can you make a short list

JO GRACE: of the safe, trusted, nurturing adults that you

JO GRACE: know that you can approach? And actually time

JO GRACE: and time again the names of the NSPCC

JO GRACE: staff came up with the children because

JO GRACE: they'd recognised that we were a safe

JO GRACE: space but also within the school we created

JO GRACE: a wider safe space and they knew that lots of

JO GRACE: the teachers were involved in emotional

JO GRACE: resilience and they could go to their

JO GRACE: teachers or their wider community for support.

JENNIFER DIXON: So on question two, Prajapa, from an

JENNIFER DIXON: evaluation point of view, what were the

JENNIFER DIXON: benefits of the programme?

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Yes, so in 2024,

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the NSPCC research team evaluated

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the emotional resilience programme.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: I must say it was a real privilege

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: to understand more about the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: programme through conversations with

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: school staff, the NSPCC staff who

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: had helped design and deliver the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: programme, and teachers in the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: schools where the programme was rolled

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: out. Most importantly, we spoke to

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the children who participated.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Through the evaluation, we found

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: that the emotional resilience

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: programme has clear benefits for

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: children and the schools.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: The children told us that they had

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: learned how to identify different

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: feelings and were able to recognise

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the emotions of others and to show

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: compassion and be kind to each

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: other. Many children had learned and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: practised self-care techniques to

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: manage their emotions, such as deep

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: breathing and taking time out when

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: they needed to. And some children

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: had even shared these techniques

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: with members of their families and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: they were practising this at home.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: The evaluation also found that

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: improving children's awareness of

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: emotional resilience within a

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: supportive school environment can

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: give the children the confidence and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the feelings of safety and comfort

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: that they need to be able to learn

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: and achieve, to be able to concentrate

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: on their learning.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: We also heard how the programme was

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: helping children who were quite

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: anxious, had been through trauma

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: themselves, and were communicating

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: this through their behaviour in

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: different ways; how the activities

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: and discussions in the programmes

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: helped these children feel settled

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: and positive and happy.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Teachers told the evaluation that by

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: being involved in the programme,

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: they felt more confident teaching

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: children about complex emotions.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Evaluation findings also showed that

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: teachers were connecting better with

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: pupils and had a better understanding

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: of their lives and some of the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: challenges that they were facing on

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: a daily basis.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: This helped teachers to better

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: support the children and respond

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: promptly if there were any

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: safeguarding concerns.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: The findings also showed overall

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: that there is a need for emotional

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: resilience programmes in primary

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: schools and early childcare settings

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: in Govan. As Jo was mentioning, they

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: began delivering the programme to

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the upper years in primary school

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: and then soon realised, because of

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: what teachers were telling them, that

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the need was further downstream for

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: younger children too.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: The programme evaluated that it was

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: needed more widely across Scotland

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: as the benefits of the programme

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: align with the health and wellbeing

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: goals of the curriculum for

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: excellence in Scotland.

JENNIFER DIXON: Thanks, Pajapa.

JENNIFER DIXON: Thinking about the adversity that some of

JENNIFER DIXON: the children have faced, Jo, could you

JENNIFER DIXON: tell me about how you felt the programme

JENNIFER DIXON: related to safeguarding when you were in

JENNIFER DIXON: the schools?

JO GRACE: So obviously whilst we were delivering the

JO GRACE: programme, we observed that holding safe and

JO GRACE: honest discussions about emotions helped

JO GRACE: to strengthen the teacher and the children's

JO GRACE: relationships with each other, which then

JO GRACE: encouraged a supportive and trusting

JO GRACE: relationship throughout the school day where

JO GRACE: children felt able to be open and

JO GRACE: honest about things they were struggling with.

JO GRACE: That also included talking

JO GRACE: about things that were difficult at home,

JO GRACE: sometimes that perhaps children hadn't shared.

JO GRACE: At the start of each session with the children,

JO GRACE: we used to hand them out a worksheet and it had

JO GRACE: a picture of a body on it.

JO GRACE: And we would ask the children, using emojis,

JO GRACE: to draw us faces of how they were feeling

JO GRACE: today, but also to show us where they were

JO GRACE: feeling that in their bodies, because often our

JO GRACE: brain-body connection can be a bit disrupted

JO GRACE: and we're not always good at recognising where

JO GRACE: we're feeling things in our body.

JO GRACE: We can have the thoughts in our heads, but not

JO GRACE: recognise that the washing machine feeling that

JO GRACE: we've got going on in our tummy is part of what

JO GRACE: we're thinking about.

JO GRACE: So we were helping the children to understand

JO GRACE: that. We would do these worksheets with the

JO GRACE: children about how they were feeling, and that

JO GRACE: was fascinating because actually one that we

JO GRACE: got really regularly was, "I'm hungry".

JO GRACE: And that was one that we had to be incredibly

JO GRACE: aware, but also sensitive, about.

JO GRACE: And that was doing things like trying to figure

JO GRACE: out whether the family were, for example,

JO GRACE: living in poverty and this was a family who

JO GRACE: were in hardship and it wasn't a safeguarding

JO GRACE: concern. It was much more about ensuring that

JO GRACE: the family had the signposts and the support

JO GRACE: from other organisations to be able to access

JO GRACE: food support or financial support, making sure

JO GRACE: their income was maximised, et cetera, et

JO GRACE: cetera. So we had to tread carefully with the

JO GRACE: children, trying to figure out whether this was

JO GRACE: hunger as a result of, there was no food in the

JO GRACE: house because the family was struggling with

JO GRACE: poverty, or whether this was a child who was

JO GRACE: hungry because there was actually something

JO GRACE: neglectful going on and they weren't maybe

JO GRACE: being cared for in the way that they should

JO GRACE: have. And we would do that very much

JO GRACE: hand in hand with teachers.

JO GRACE: So if we identified anything worrying within

JO GRACE: the class, we would immediately talk with the

JO GRACE: teacher about it, and then the school and

JO GRACE: ourselves were able to gently explore that a

JO GRACE: wee bit further. Sometimes the school had

JO GRACE: context and could explain that they knew what

JO GRACE: was happening with a family and the struggles

JO GRACE: that they were having.

JO GRACE: There was also some other ones that might not

JO GRACE: necessarily be considered safeguarding

JO GRACE: in the, kind of, child protection type

JO GRACE: safeguarding stance, but were

JO GRACE: definitely about looking after and safeguarding

JO GRACE: the wellbeing of children.

JO GRACE: I mentioned earlier that we used to have

JO GRACE: planning meetings with the school before we did

JO GRACE: the group.

JO GRACE: In one of the schools that we went into, we had

JO GRACE: a class of children where there was quite a

JO GRACE: number of neurodiverse children, but there was

JO GRACE: one child in particular who had experienced

JO GRACE: significant adversity in their background, and

JO GRACE: as a result of that trauma, found it really,

JO GRACE: really difficult to sit still in the classroom.

JO GRACE: So what the class teacher had done was

JO GRACE: created a path on the outskirts of the

JO GRACE: class that this child could basically patrol

JO GRACE: the room. So when they became upset,

JO GRACE: when they started to have hyper-vigilant

JO GRACE: symptoms, instead of the teacher telling a

JO GRACE: child to constantly sit down because they

JO GRACE: wouldn't be able to sit at their seat and

JO GRACE: concentrate, all of the children, as

JO GRACE: part of the emotional resilience programme,

JO GRACE: understood that this young person needed to

JO GRACE: just get up and move because that's what made

JO GRACE: them feel them safe, being able to kind of

JO GRACE: patrol the class.

JO GRACE: What was so lovely about it was everybody just

JO GRACE: accepted it. This child was never made fun of.

JO GRACE: There was never any ridicule or joking

JO GRACE: or anything like that.

JO GRACE: Everybody just understood that this was

JO GRACE: something that this child needed to do, and

JO GRACE: then when they were ready, they would be able

JO GRACE: to come and sit back down again and join back

JO GRACE: into the class. Now that may not be seen as

JO GRACE: a traditional kind of safeguarding issue,

JO GRACE: but it actually, in a trauma-informed way,

JO GRACE: was incredible to safeguard the wellbeing and

JO GRACE: the mental health of this child because they

JO GRACE: felt safe in their classroom whilst they were

JO GRACE: hypervigilant — being able to patrol — and felt

JO GRACE: that they were looking out for the wellbeing of

JO GRACE: everybody and then when they were comfortable

JO GRACE: and safe enough and sat down again, that meant

JO GRACE: that their mental health had stabilised for

JO GRACE: that moment. So we dealt with a wide

JO GRACE: range of different kinds of

JO GRACE: safeguarding experiences.

JENNIFER DIXON: Thanks, Jo. That sounds like quite a lot

JENNIFER DIXON: of things that worked well when we were

JENNIFER DIXON: doing the programme.

JENNIFER DIXON: Prajapa, have you got any other insights

JENNIFER DIXON: into what made the programme work?

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Jo has covered a lot of what we

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: heard as being benefits of the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: programme and what made it work.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: We heard very similar things during

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the evaluation of the programme as

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: well. But firstly, I think what made

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the programme so popular among the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: children was that it was fun and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: enjoyable. And as Jo was saying, the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: programme was iterative.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: That is by listening to what was

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: working, by listening to the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: teachers and the children and the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: needs of the classroom, the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: programme was able to adapt, and it

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: did adapt to meet the needs of the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: children, and that was also

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: something that made the programme so

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: live and so effective.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Some of it was adapting the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: resources, some of it was to do with

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: adapting the time that was needed,

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: because some of those activities I

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: think the children took longer.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Even in our evaluation session, we

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: realised that the plan we had before

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: we visited the classroom, was a plan

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: that we could not follow to a T

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: because it took time.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Children engaged with it in

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: different ways and we needed just to

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: be flexible right through it and be

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: responsive, listening and engaging

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: in a way that suited the children,

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: in a way that they were able to take

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: on board and understand and make use

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: of. And I think it was similar with

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the programme as well, when they

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: were delivering it. We had prepared

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: sheets of lesson plans, but, when it

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: was time for delivery, you had to

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: read the room, you had take on board

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: whether it was just soon after PE or

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: soon after lunch and there was a lot

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: of energy in the room, or it was

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: time to go home and therefore

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: children were already packing their

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: bags. So you needed to take all of

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: that into account and you really do

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: appreciate so much what the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: environment does for children and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: their ability to absorb new

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: learning, participate in activities,

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: et cetera, and what teachers have to

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: do to adapt and how flexible they

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: need to be every day of a school

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: week.

JENNIFER DIXON: I think I can add to that as well, Prajapa. Some

JENNIFER DIXON: of the practical things we did for

JENNIFER DIXON: adaptations were — Jo mentioned the

JENNIFER DIXON: school before that had children speaking

JENNIFER DIXON: 34 languages — we would email the sheets

JENNIFER DIXON: to teachers in advance so they could

JENNIFER DIXON: upload to the tablets they were using.

JENNIFER DIXON: The tablets had translation tools on them

JENNIFER DIXON: so that meant they could be interpreted

JENNIFER DIXON: for the children in their language, so

JENNIFER DIXON: that made it more accessible for them.

JENNIFER DIXON: We had a couple of children who had

JENNIFER DIXON: visual impairments, so we created larger

JENNIFER DIXON: text versions and the teacher would tell

JENNIFER DIXON: us what size that child could read at,

JENNIFER DIXON: and we adapted it all and then sent that

JENNIFER DIXON: across. So it wasn't an extra task on the

JENNIFER DIXON: teacher when we were actually in the

JENNIFER DIXON: schools, we did all that part for them.

JENNIFER DIXON: Those planning meetings that we had would

JENNIFER DIXON: always help because we would ask if there

JENNIFER DIXON: was any requirements like that before

JENNIFER DIXON: we'd started the programme, and it gave

JENNIFER DIXON: us time to prepare and make sure that all

JENNIFER DIXON: those children could feel included.

JENNIFER DIXON: One other thing that made it work

JENNIFER DIXON: was the resources that delivered the

JENNIFER DIXON: programme. So we had the class teacher

JENNIFER DIXON: and two NSPCC staff members facilitating

JENNIFER DIXON: and delivering the sessions, and that

JENNIFER DIXON: facilitated really safe conversations

JENNIFER DIXON: with children. Nobody was left out.

JENNIFER DIXON: There was a staff [member] and teacher

JENNIFER DIXON: around to support any child who

JENNIFER DIXON: needed to have a conversation during any

JENNIFER DIXON: of the activities that were run.

JENNIFER DIXON: So the consistency of that team of

JENNIFER DIXON: facilitators was also something that was

JENNIFER DIXON: really valuable within the programme

JENNIFER DIXON: design. Another key feature that made the

JENNIFER DIXON: programme work is that it was delivered

JENNIFER DIXON: by individuals who are trained and

JENNIFER DIXON: confident in managing difficult

JENNIFER DIXON: conversations and safeguarding concerns.

JENNIFER DIXON: So anyone that delivers this type of

JENNIFER DIXON: programme must respond to safeguarding

JENNIFER DIXON: disclosures in a trauma-informed way.

JENNIFER DIXON: They need to have robust safeguarding

JENNIFER DIXON: procedures in place or be supported by

JENNIFER DIXON: the NSPCC to develop them.

JENNIFER DIXON: So Prajapa, you mentioned there about

JENNIFER DIXON: being trauma-informed.

JENNIFER DIXON: Jo, do you think you could tell me more

JENNIFER DIXON: about how practitioners can be

JENNIFER DIXON: trauma-informed when delivering emotional

JENNIFER DIXON: resilience work?

JO GRACE: I think that's an essential skill in any kind

JO GRACE: of work that we do, but particularly when

JO GRACE: working with children, because we hear children

JO GRACE: share really difficult feelings; and on some

JO GRACE: occasions there were significant safeguarding

JO GRACE: disclosures that were shared as well.

JO GRACE: So whoever delivers the programme needs to have

JO GRACE: had some training to be able to identify and

JO GRACE: manage safeguarding concerns, but also to have

JO GRACE: had some training in trauma-informed

JO GRACE: approaches or to be trauma-sensitive;

JO GRACE: to understand how to be with

JO GRACE: a child in their feelings, that it's not just

JO GRACE: about finding solutions, but actually it can be

JO GRACE: sitting with those difficult words, difficult

JO GRACE: feelings that children are sharing and

JO GRACE: not having any judgement around any

JO GRACE: of that, but allowing children the space to

JO GRACE: actually feel safe with that adult and

JO GRACE: to feel listened to and heard.

JO GRACE: I think both those skills go hand-in-hand, both

JO GRACE: in terms of safeguarding and in any kind of

JO GRACE: trauma-informed approach.

JO GRACE: I think it's really essential that

JO GRACE: organisations ensure that any

JO GRACE: staff that would be in place facilitating a

JO GRACE: programme like this would have also

JO GRACE: things like good supervision and also good

JO GRACE: wellbeing pathways, because sometimes you are

JO GRACE: dealing with difficult subject matters.

JO GRACE: So it's important to make sure that staff are

JO GRACE: well looked after and well-trained and

JO GRACE: are able to deliver the programme consistently,

JO GRACE: but in a team, not just as individuals

JO GRACE: like we said at the beginning.

JO GRACE: We always did this with two staff plus a

JO GRACE: teacher to ensure that there was enough people

JO GRACE: around so that if anything did arise,

JO GRACE: there was still people there while someone

JO GRACE: could step out and deal with whatever the

JO GRACE: difficulty was. I think making

JO GRACE: sure that it's in the

JO GRACE: right hands of the people that understand

JO GRACE: empathy and being able to hold those

JO GRACE: feelings and understanding what talking about

JO GRACE: feelings may result in, which can result in

JO GRACE: disclosures or big feelings that are hard

JO GRACE: to manage, then that's a really positive

JO GRACE: approach as well.

JO GRACE: A really essential approach.

JENNIFER DIXON: We've talked a lot about the positives of

JENNIFER DIXON: the programme. Prajapa, could you tell me

JENNIFER DIXON: a bit more about what the challenges were

JENNIFER DIXON: around delivering the emotional resilience

JENNIFER DIXON: programme?

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Yes I can, Jen, and I think rather

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: than challenges, I would frame it as

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: learning because there was so much

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: learning for the NSPCC during the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: planning and also the delivery of

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the programme, as we heard through

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the evaluation.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: I'll briefly run through some of the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: key learnings. So firstly, it took

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: time for children to feel

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: comfortable with NSPCC staff.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: They were external presenters and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the programme required a trusting

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: relationship so that the children

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: were able to share their feelings

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: and really engage in the activities.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Time was key and time was not always

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: afforded to us because we had to fit

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: it all within one classroom time

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: slot within the day.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Secondly, we learned that, because

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: we were delivering it to so many

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: different age groups, a greater

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: variety of delivery methods were

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: needed and it was recommended that

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: sessions included puppets, slides,

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: short videos and pictures to keep

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: the children engaged throughout the

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: one-hour session.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: We learned that some of the resources

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: within the programme had already

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: been introduced to the children

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: through other programmes and events.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: And this showed us the importance of

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: really understanding what programmes

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: exist currently in schools so that

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: we are fully aware of this when

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: introducing any programme or

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: resource kit.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: The evaluation also learned that

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: schools were facing quite a lot of

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: challenges every day with resources

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: and pressures on staff capacity.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: So we need to bear this in mind when

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: scaling up a programme of this

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: nature. This is where the emotional

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: resilience resource pack comes in,

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: as it gives schools and teachers a

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: toolkit to dip in and out of and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: build into their lesson plans as and

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: when needed.

JENNIFER DIXON: Thanks Prajapa. So, following the success

JENNIFER DIXON: of the programme Jo, largely you in our

JENNIFER DIXON: team, created the facilitator's guide.

JENNIFER DIXON: As Prajapa's mentioned, there's other programmes

JENNIFER DIXON: out there as well.

JENNIFER DIXON: What advice would you give to someone who

JENNIFER DIXON: wants to run and implement their own

JENNIFER DIXON: emotional resilience programme with young

JENNIFER DIXON: people?

JO GRACE: I think the first thing would be absolutely it

JO GRACE: needs to be done in partnership with the

JO GRACE: schools or— actually, as Prajapa had

JO GRACE: mentioned about going downstream, we

JO GRACE: started with the older years and then the

JO GRACE: younger years within the schools.

JO GRACE: We ultimately ended up developing emotional

JO GRACE: resilience for nurseries in the early years as

JO GRACE: well because the need was there at that

JO GRACE: very, very early stage and if we can start

JO GRACE: children's emotional resilience and recognising

JO GRACE: their big feelings, you know, from age three

JO GRACE: onwards, that's an amazing step towards

JO GRACE: building their resilience as they grow into

JO GRACE: adulthood. So working in partnership, I think,

JO GRACE: is key.

JO GRACE: Co-creation is also key.

JO GRACE: Have the feedback from parents, from staff,

JO GRACE: from children, from anybody that's involved in

JO GRACE: it. Take that learning and again,

JO GRACE: like Prajapa mentioned, it's iterative,

JO GRACE: it's a moving process.

JO GRACE: You don't just write it and then get stuck on

JO GRACE: it. You have to learn and adapt as

JO GRACE: things change.

JO GRACE: We eventually found a couple of storybooks that

JO GRACE: worked really well.

JO GRACE: We found a game, Buckaroo, which was a

JO GRACE: wonderful example of getting overloaded with

JO GRACE: your feelings when the donkey bucked.

JO GRACE: And so there was some fun, real fun activities

JO GRACE: built into it. So again, make your programme

JO GRACE: fun, keep it quite short and quite light.

JO GRACE: You want the children to want to come back for

JO GRACE: more. And I suppose the biggest key thing,

JO GRACE: going back to that previous question we just

JO GRACE: discussed, is about the relationships.

JO GRACE: It's about the relationships with whoever's

JO GRACE: facilitating. It's about the relationships with

JO GRACE: the school staff, their teachers, their nursery

JO GRACE: educators, whoever it might be, building that

JO GRACE: safe, trusted, nurturing relationship

JO GRACE: where children feel safe enough to test

JO GRACE: out and talk about their big feelings and

JO GRACE: to share how they're feeling or the things

JO GRACE: they're struggling with so that they can learn

JO GRACE: from that. I think the one other thing that I

JO GRACE: would add is about always ensuring

JO GRACE: that the parents are part of it.

JO GRACE: We used to send information home to parents

JO GRACE: to let them know what we were doing, what

JO GRACE: activities the children were taking part in and

JO GRACE: what the aim of the programme was that we were

JO GRACE: doing with the children.

JO GRACE: They would often go home and tell their parents

JO GRACE: stories about it.

JO GRACE: One of the key features of the programme was

JO GRACE: mindfulness and the children really loved

JO GRACE: the active mindfulness exercises that

JO GRACE: we did. So we taught them things like finger

JO GRACE: breathing and superhero breathing.

JO GRACE: One their favourites was bumblebee breathing

JO GRACE: and we were shared a story by

JO GRACE: a parent about how they were now using that at

JO GRACE: bedtime, as part of the routine.

JO GRACE: Because their child found it really, really

JO GRACE: soothing. And actually the parent was quite

JO GRACE: comforted by it as well, that they would

JO GRACE: breathe together and hum and make this kind of

JO GRACE: buzzing sound together, and they would lie

JO GRACE: there laughing on the bed after they'd done it.

JO GRACE: So just make sure parents are a core part of it

JO GRACE: as well.

JENNIFER DIXON: So from our conversation today, what I'm

JENNIFER DIXON: getting is that we would highly recommend

JENNIFER DIXON: that schools prioritise emotional

JENNIFER DIXON: resilience within their settings, as well

JENNIFER DIXON: as other groups if they can. We've

JENNIFER DIXON: mentioned our facilitator guide, which is

JENNIFER DIXON: just one of the number of different tools

JENNIFER DIXON: available for people.

JENNIFER DIXON: One of the big things that has come across

JENNIFER DIXON: from both you and Prajapa speaking is the

JENNIFER DIXON: importance of being responsive to

JENNIFER DIXON: children and listening, active real

JENNIFER DIXON: listening to children.

JENNIFER DIXON: And making it fun. So they want to come

JENNIFER DIXON: and speak to you and build that trust.

JENNIFER DIXON: But I think we're also just very aware of

JENNIFER DIXON: the capacity constraints for teachers and

JENNIFER DIXON: just quite how much they're balancing

JENNIFER DIXON: within the classroom and how many

JENNIFER DIXON: children's needs that they have to meet

JENNIFER DIXON: all at one time, and it's a very hard

JENNIFER DIXON: job. I think what we learned overall

JENNIFER DIXON: is that actually supporting emotional

JENNIFER DIXON: resilience in children is a collective

JENNIFER DIXON: effort; so that could be your local Scout

JENNIFER DIXON: groups, your Rainbows groups as well, you

JENNIFER DIXON: know, bringing in these topics in loads

JENNIFER DIXON: of different arenas.

JENNIFER DIXON: Just places where children have adults

JENNIFER DIXON: they can lean on that feel trusted and

JENNIFER DIXON: safe, and that they can create this sense

JENNIFER DIXON: of connection and safety with.

JENNIFER DIXON: Thank you for both answering all my

JENNIFER DIXON: questions and speaking with me today.

JO GRACE: Thank you.

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: Thank you! If anyone would like to

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: read our evaluation report on our

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: emotional resilience programme, you

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: can find the link in the show notes

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: attached to this podcast, or on our

PRAJAPA SENEVIRATNE: NSPCC Learning website.

OUTRO: Thanks for listening to this NSPCC Learning

OUTRO: podcast.

OUTRO: At the time of recording, this episode's content

OUTRO: was up to date, but the world of safeguarding and

OUTRO: child protection is ever-changing.

OUTRO: So, if you're looking for the most current

OUTRO: safeguarding and child-protection training

OUTRO: information or resources,

OUTRO: please visit our website for professionals at

OUTRO: nspcc.org.uk/learning.