Megan Riksen (00:17): Hello and welcome to the work like a Laker podcast. I'm Megan Riksen. Today I'm joined by my co-host, Dani Lauer. Dani Lauer (00:24): Hello. Megan Riksen (00:26): Hello. So today we are diving into something that feels a bit personal, but also is really important when it comes to your career and so we're talking about values. Kind of thinking about the question, how do you know if the work you're doing really lines up with what matters most to you? Dani Lauer (00:43): Yeah. I'm curious, Megan, when you think about your own values, how do you see them showing up in your work? Megan Riksen (00:50): Great question. Yeah. I feel like I value relationships and that's something I get to work on a lot in the career center. Not only relationships with students, faculty and staff, and our employer partners, but then certainly just the relationships we have here with each other. In the career center, Which is one of the best parts of working here. Dani Lauer (01:12): Absolutely. Right. Megan Riksen (01:13): Is the people. So it would be really hard for me to, for example, leave this role and go to something that was like 100% remote, where it was all project based, no interaction with people, because I think I value that a lot in the work environment. Dani Lauer (01:29): That makes sense. I would say the same for me too. Relationships are in for so many of the reasons that you shared but I think also that sense of like, I'm helping other people. I think that really matters in my work that I'm making a difference, that I'm helping. I also really think I value a sense of like achievement or purpose that like the work that I'm doing matters and I think that does kind of come back to relationships too, and that helping so, I mean, it's all connected, but feeling just a sense of maybe accomplishment from my work. That I'm doing things that are like, good for the world. Megan Riksen (02:12): Moving Things forward. Dani Lauer (02:13): Yeah. In a positive way. Dani Lauer (02:15): Yeah. So I, I think we probably are similar. Megan Riksen (02:19): I think so too. Yeah. I think so too. Love getting things done as well. Yeah. Dani Lauer (02:25): Helping people, getting things done. Megan Riksen (02:26): Yeah. Boom. That's our motto right here. So yeah, we talk a lot on this podcast about career exploration and the different directions you can take, but this kind of feels like a deeper layer. It's not just what job you have, but whether that job and the people around you are helping you grow in the ways you want to. That's so important in a future career. Dani Lauer (02:47): Yeah, definitely and I just, I love that idea that when you find people that kind of share values, like similar to you and I just sharing like similar things. We value similar things. That professional networking kind of stops feeling like the chore, the have to like, ugh, I have to. Megan Riksen (03:05): Yeah, that's a good point. Dani Lauer (03:06): It feels like I'm building a community that energizes me because I'm talking about things that get me excited that bring me life and that just is gonna feel better than like a boring dull conversation. Megan Riksen (03:19): Like what a good inner thing to listen to inside of you. Like, am I energized by this? Or is this completely draining me? Dani Lauer (03:26): Totally. Megan Riksen (03:27): It's a really good sign right there. So on today's episode, we're going to help you start identifying what matters most to you and reflect on whether your current work supports that or kind of what you're imagining as your future work and just as important are the people around you helping you grow in that direction. So we'll explore how building professional communities rooted in shared values can make networking feel less like a task on the to-do list and more like a source of energy, connection and purpose. Dani Lauer (03:58): Joining us to share some insights on this topic is Renata Ellis. Renata is the owner of the Life Room Connection, and she's a featured coach on our alumni career coaching database. She's a seasoned educator, she's been a certified leadership coach. She's got two decades of experience directing equity based educational and employment readiness programs and the heart of her work in her coaching practice is really helping individuals not only land, you know, that next career opportunity, but clarifies really what that why is for each individual person for building just meaningful, impactful, sustainable life and career. So welcome to the podcast, Renata. Thank you so much for being here. Renata Ellis (04:47): Thank you for having me. Dani Lauer (04:48): So we're gonna jump right in and ask you some questions and so to start off, we would love to know just what strategies do you use to help clients identify their core values? And then how can someone really begin that process on their own? Maybe if they're not working with a coach, how can someone go about that process? Renata Ellis (05:11): Yeah, we're going in all the way around the values part to start. First off, I would say that even if you don't have a coach, you have people in your life that are supporting and guiding you. And so even though I believe in the power of having a coach, it's beneficial. If your life circumstances and finances allow for that, I highly encourage you to have just that person to walk alongside you but as we talk about your values and actually your core values. I think it really starts with deep listening and in our society, there's just like so many voices. There's so many things out there. We read all the articles, we have the books, but the deep listening comes from within and starting to trust ourselves enough to reflect on our experiences. So whether it's in the coaching space or just you sitting down with a piece of paper to really start being reflective and thinking about what are the moments in my life that have truly defined me? Renata Ellis (06:29): And that don't just go to the good stuff. Like that, that's very easy to say. Like, "yes, these are my wins. Right?" but also just think about the things that, those lessons, those hard lessons, especially that, you know, really that's what defines us how we overcome you know even in that murky, mundane, like what were those moments that really defined us? And in that really start tracking those, like who was I at the start of that? Who am I now coming out of that and then who are the people around you? Because That gives you insight to your values so that's where I will start and people want a clear answer. They want the answer. So when we're talking about our core values, it's a journey. It's writing things down, going back, looking at them six months or six years and being like, "Hmm, I don't know about that". Renata Ellis (07:38): But it really is about this process of introspection around your life's journey. That's what I would say. You're gonna start there whether you are in the coaching space and we're going on this narrative journey, or you're just one-on-one by yourself. Dani Lauer (07:54): I really like that because that is something that a person can do at any time. Right? Renata Ellis (08:01): Absolutely. Dani Lauer (08:01): As long as you're open to that self-reflection and, you know, have maybe a piece of paper to jot something down or write it in a note on your phone, like that's such an accessible way to start this process is just having that, you know, time built in to reflect and to really figure out what was present in those moments. Renata Ellis (08:21): Yeah. Just like what bubbles up and not just the one time there as you look at and reflect, you're going to see themes and patterns. There are gonna be things that are like, this keeps occurring, or this is where I continue to lean in. I'm like, "Ooh, I am in my happy place or my purposeful place when I am doing this" . Whereas when I have to do this, I am drained, I am frustrated, I'm thinking of getting out of the situation. That those are all just like those pinpoints that are telling us something about what we value and what we do not value. Dani Lauer (09:03): Yeah and I think that's it. It makes me think about like, what, what was your energy level? Renata Ellis (09:09): Exactly. That idea, like what... Dani Lauer (09:11): Gave me life, what was energizing? What was draining, like that's a really good indicator. Renata Ellis (09:17): And it's not always the easy. In my former life, I was a special educator and then went into becoming a director of special education and those were some long, hard days, but looking back, I didn't see it that way because there was so much purpose and I wasn't drained but now at eight o'clock at night when I'm doing paperwork, I'm like, oh, this is the draining part. So it's that tension of life to help you figure out, "oh, this is, this is really bringing me life" and "this not so much". It doesn't mean we, you know, have to say, "oh, I'm not gonna do those things" but it does just let us know how we're wired and then what we value. Dani Lauer (10:05): That makes a lot of sense. So I'm thinking about aligning our work with our values, and we're kind of starting to talk in, we're heading into that territory but I'm wondering, like, have you noticed any just common barriers that prevent people from really aligning their work with their values? And then if so, like how do people overcome those barriers? Renata Ellis (10:32): Yeah. I don't ever want to generalize because we're all coming into this reflective part of life. Like either you're stuck or you're wanting something more when you're starting to think about your values. But one of the things that I notice is how do you get clear about your core values versus these aspirational values. And I talk about this a lot, and it's really rooted in some of those aspirational values are they're deep into what other people are gonna think about us and so some of that is that like maybe our family pressure or peer pressure, social pressures what I think I should value. And so that is a big barrier that I see with working with individual clients, is that we really have to differentiate between something that I'm aspiring to versus my core values, either from an external force or even sometimes an internal force. Renata Ellis (11:53): So let me explain, right? Like, you know and this is one, this is just an example. A core value could be that you, you really value being secure, whether it's financially secure, relationally secure, that is a core value, but maybe you feel like you should be a risk taker or adventurous. And so when you show up to start thinking about your values, when you're circling on a piece of paper or the story you're telling, it's about this idealized or fantasy self. Like, you know, "if I could be you know, funny", like "I'm gonna be, I value humor". Right? And you may, but it may not be at your core that you value those things. So it is really that is a barrier. Is this something you really want or is this something that you think you should want or you think that you should value that it's the more purposeful, you know, thing, right? Dani Lauer (13:07): Yes, and it's the should, right. Renata Ellis (13:09): It's the should, the should takes up a lot of space and then when we give ourselves the grace to be like, you know, I'm just doing the best I can, but there are some things that really matter to and it's okay if someone else thinks that they're trivial and it's okay if even sometimes I have to get through this stage of not feeling like that's not a good enough value and just own it. So that is a big part of this barrier system. It's all internal work, like we think it's external, but it is the internal of owning it, owning this is, first you name it because you name it kind of subtly, and then after a while you get bolder with it and being like, yes, I'm okay with that value. It's mine. Yes. Dani Lauer (14:03): Yeah. Well, and everything you're saying makes me think of like, "Ooh, that takes so much confidence". Right? Like, you just talked about this, like owning it, like that takes so much confidence. And that can be really tough. Maybe if you're in a place where you're not super sure of yourself or you're in a job, or, you know, working at a place where you aren't feeling that amount of confidence. Right, and so it's, it's kind of mustering that as well to really own like you're saying these core values that you have. Renata Ellis (14:36): Oh, yeah and I think that's the illusion that this is going. I'm gonna put this on paper, I'm gonna name it and then I'm gonna live it out. Dani Lauer (14:46): Right. Renata Ellis (14:48): And that sounds so easy. That sounds amazing but the one thing I would like to go back to around like the confidence. So many things, even like today, like I love talking to people but being on like the mic and talking it is never probably gonna be a confident space for me. So what I would encourage you to do as you are working to live out, like first acknowledge and kind of know and name your values, and then starting to live it out is just to practice. Don't get so worried about even the confidence in it, just naming it and it can be a shaky situation that you're walking into it. So there's all these slogans about "Do It Afraid" and you know, I believe that really like, do it when your voice is shaking and cracking because with your core values, you're always going to be walking into new situations that are going to make you question, that are gonna make you doubt. That's just being human. I think we want to like think when I arrive, the yucky and the murky and the swampiness of it all goes away. And that's just really not how life works. Dani Lauer (16:18): So true. Renata Ellis (16:18): Hopefully one day, like in my mind, I'm gonna be like, yes, when I'm speaking and there's gonna be a mic, I'm gonna be like that person, that girl that I see and envision, but it may never be, and that is okay. It's okay. Dani Lauer (16:37): I love that. Just to be able to say it's okay. Dani Lauer (16:42): Yes, it is. I'm curious, you know, thinking about making a career transition around values, right? So you've kind of named them, you're feeling confident in them, and then maybe you notice that the career you're in isn't really aligned with those values. Do you have any examples? Has anyone you've worked with like made that shift from a career where they didn't feel aligned to kind of a more aligned career path with their values? What did that look like? Renata Ellis (17:16): I think several individuals come to mind. I primarily work with women as they transition usually from let's say their first five to seven years of their career as they are moving into leadership, strategic leadership or management and so some of that they are in that tension of what do I value versus what I should be achieving or what that looks like and so for me, when you asked me that question, what I really thought about is first and that's why being in college and university is such an amazing time to do some of this introspective work. Even though we know you may have a limited life experience, you're still getting a lot of valuable experiences that are opening the doors to some of these conversations. Renata Ellis (18:19): Like with internships and then opportunities to work either on campus or off campus or have leadership roles throughout the university. So those are all giving you insight. So when you start walking into the workforce, you have some kind of, what I would say an outline of your core value. They're not really truly, they're formed in some ways, but these new work life experiences are gonna give you more insight into that process. So then when you're starting to work and you're getting opportunities, I feel like even, even if you love your career, you still come to this pivotal moment of it's what I'm doing, really what I wanna be doing for the next stage or mountain of life. And so with that, I think it's really important to not think about shifting yet, because we always think maybe it's, I need a new career, I need the new thing. Renata Ellis (19:27): But sometimes it's just looking at what's in front of you with a different perspective and so in one of the situations I'm thinking about at helping a client, they had did the shift they moved from non-profit world to corporate philanthropy. Because Development and philanthropy is what they are passionate about and then they got in this whole new space, which there were so many learning curves. You know, there's a lot of growing edges. And so this person started feeling very misaligned from their grassroots nonprofit world where they had so many, they had a lot of autonomy to get a lot of things on the ground done. They were able to interact with so many people and really have this one-on-one relationship with partners. Then they move into this corporate space. Renata Ellis (20:29): It's so different, the language is different, the expectations are different. You're starting to talk about KPOs and a whole different world, you know, all of these things and so they were feeling like my work does not align. So we had to really go back in this situation to say, what is your why? What was your why for taking this position? And once we really got to the nitty gritty of it, it wasn't really about a career change. It was not, because they already made the career change. So even if you are going to make the move, or have made the move, it's always being rooted back into your why and when you are really connected to your why, then it gives you clarity about how to move forward, right where you're at, so many times when people are talking about alignment, it's really a question of how do I use my voice in the workplace? Renata Ellis (21:29): How do I start advocating for the projects that I really want to work on? How do I start using my network to get more opportunities within my organization and outside of my organization? So that is where my curiosity always goes. Not so much in change because it's looking back a lot of times in what is your why, and then reconnecting to that why, and then thinking differently about like, what can I do in the here and now? Especially around voice, around like, how do I not advocate for myself? And so I feel misaligned with my values because I am not valuing myself in this space to then ask for what I want and what I need. Dani Lauer (22:30): Yeah. That's so good and that's, so I love that because I do think a lot of us are wired in like, this doesn't feel right, which then we automatically jump to like, I have to make a change and what you're saying is that's not necessarily always the case. Renata Ellis (22:52): Not some now, sometimes it is. You stay too long, it is time to make the leap, right? But many times, even if you are, it's a yes. You need to make that leap. You need to be asking yourself those questions and how are you going to be represent your values really in your new space because if you go with that same approach, is it the place? Dani Lauer (23:14): You might be asking the same questions in a different, in a different place. Renata Ellis (23:21): Or even if you are not rooted in your values, you can really get distraction distracted about the carrots dangling when you're looking for the new opportunity and it's still going to be misaligned if you do not do the work of what do I really want? Who am I? What's the best fit for me based on my values and what I want? Dani Lauer (23:43): I do think it's so practical and that's actually my next question is, I mean, and you've answered this a little bit, but even just that practical first step to make a move closer and maybe, you know, you would go back to it's asking for what you want. It's asking for what you need. It's identifying those things that you truly care about and what your why is that is really a very easy exercise in the sense that it's accessible. It might not be easy to do on your own for yourself. Renata Ellis (24:20): It may not be easy, but it's, you can do it. But one, one step I would always say around this is getting advice. Getting advice is really critical and crucial when you're making, when you're making moves, right? Like asking people who you value their opinion, they know who you are. They know you usually in, not just in the workplace, they know you holistically, they know you as a person and getting just some advice about what they think and to kind of like an objective assessment of what's going on. So that, that's always gonna give you information because you want data about to evaluate your current reality and the reality that you are strategically planning for so I would say that's a step. Like many times before we make a move, we've had a vision for it and so even if that move doesn't come for like, two years, we're in this planning stage and sometimes that is the most crucial, I would say the most crucial step, no matter what step you're taking, is the planning. Planning is productive. Dani Lauer (25:45): I love, that! Renata Ellis (25:47): It's some of the most productive work is the planning. So sometimes there may be, you may feel like you're not doing like, tangible outcomes yet to whatever you want to do but the planning, getting the data, researching where you wanna go researching yourself, like, who am I? What's going on here? That is a part of this step, and getting really kind of like strategic about it. Kind of like making that your part-time gig, is this gig of where you're going. Dani Lauer (26:25): Yeah, and I think about, right, that networking piece and communicating those values when you're networking and finding networks that help you feel more aligned with who you are. Like seeking out communities that align with your values. Renata Ellis (26:42): I call it the community of your professional community. You need a professional community. I know people do not like the word network, it's a scary word, but it's really not scary, but it sounds scary. I know why it's scary because, and people have told me this in the coaching space, they feel like it's a used car salesman approach. No, judgment on people who sell used cars, thank you for that service. For them, they have a negative impression of what they're asking someone out of the blue and so, but when you have, and this is not a next step this is a continual ongoing practice as a professional that you need to have. Is to maintain and build a professional community. So what do I mean by that? Renata Ellis (27:41): I mean that you have people in your network who it is not icky when you reach out to them to tell them like, "Hey, I've been at my job around three years, I've gotten great I've got great kind of like opportunities, but I really feel like at this time it's probably time for me to move on in the next 18 to 24 months. I'm just like, you're a part of my network and just want you to know, so if you see anything that you think you know, fits me or that I could be interested in, you know, please feel free to reach out to me. Or if you have any contacts in this particular field or industry I'd love for you to connect me with that person". And you're like, whoa! Right? About using your voice. Renata Ellis (28:35): But when you have people that like you've kept in touch with, so like, let's use the incubator of university life or grad school, you know, you have a few professors, you had an internship, you should be, not banging on their door like every week, but periodically, maybe like four months after university, you're sending people an update about your life. You know, like, "Hey, this is what my summer experience was blah, blah, blah, blah, blah". Let's say, okay, you didn't keep in touch with anybody. Right, but the new happening in your life is that you just had your first child. You can say like, at one point in my life, you were very important and inspirational to me. You helped me in so many ways. Customize it for whoever you're sending it to, and I just like to update that I'm now a parent and I'm going to be stewarding this young person. I would love to stay in touch, especially as I pivot to... So there's all these ways to connect. Yeah. But connecting is key throughout this whole process. Dani Lauer (29:50): Yeah. What I'm hearing you say is that just this idea of being genuine in your relationships. Renata Ellis (29:57): Yes! Dani Lauer (29:58): Just connecting with people to connect with people because relationships matter and we all need each other. Right. Like having that, that genuine curiosity about other people and being willing to share your life with others... Renata Ellis (30:14): And keep it on a schedule. So t's genuine but it's also strategic. Like I believe to be true, I believe in the executive functioning. So Yes. For people in your life, let's say you have, let's say that list is 12 after you really sit down, right? You have those 12 people on a list somewhere, and you just make sure that you're checking in periodically throughout the year. Like maybe you found an amazing article that would interest six people on that list. It doesn't have to be these customized thing. It could be like, I really enjoyed this article was thinking of you when I read it. Hope you are doing well, sharing. That's it. But if you're doing that two times a year in 24 months from now when you're like, Hey, this is going on, can you be of help? It's an easy intro. Right. But you have to be, I think in our society, and I'm not trying to put anything on it, we talk a lot about being genuine and authentic. But it takes a lot of effort. Dani Lauer (31:24): Yes. Renata Ellis (31:25): And intentionality. It doesn't seem like a lot, but if you're not being thoughtful along the way, you know, it's hard to be authentic and intentional. You know, at that point but doing that thing and then you're like, oh, I can reach back. It's such an ease versus the, but yeah. If I haven't talked to someone in seven years, it gets harder. It gets harder to make that connection and so these relationships are not like your ride or die tribe, like the person you're gonna cry with, you know, after some hard thing but maybe that your professional, sometimes our professional and personal do connect. I have those people in my life but they are people that are still a part of your community and that's why I name it your professional community and still reaching back at different times. Dani Lauer (32:20): Yeah. I love that and I think, I mean, that's such great advice. The planning is productive and being strategic, I think that's so important. Something I think we don't always consider when we're thinking about networking, and I think about, you know, sending that article that does communicate your values in some ways to the people, right. Like this, I found something in this article that was meaningful to me, that connected with a part of Renata Ellis (32:47): You? Dani Lauer (32:47): Yes, let me share it with you. We share, we might share this in common and I think that's so cool to be able to share your values with others in that way that does feel professional, but you know, is subtly communicating that to the people around you. Renata Ellis (33:04): Yeah. You are living out your values now. You're living them out. You know, many of us say like, we value like people. This is a way for you to show that you value people. Dani Lauer (33:16): That's so good. So to wrap up, I'm curious, you know, do you have a favorite book resource assessment? Like anything that, you know, you would recommend if someone's wanting to learn more about their value, you know, clarifying values, discovering their own values any resources that you might recommend? Renata Ellis (33:39): So there's two things. I'm gonna try to keep it brief.That's not my forte. One of the things I really would stress I do use a few resources anytime you can find, like, I know there's living in your values from Dare to Lead by BrenŽ Brown, and I use Elena Aguilar, 'The Art of Coaching'. She does a lot of narrative work and the reason I really like both of those types of resources is around storytelling. Dani Lauer (34:13): Yes. Renata Ellis (34:14): It's really important to be able to tell your story and many times when people come for career coaching, you know, we start with re-imagining or I do re-imagining your resume, not because you don't know how to write a resume and now with all of technology, there's many different resources to support that, but it's really being able to tell that value story. It's very, we've named the value. So that's why like a list and you circle them or like say, "Hmm"? But that is really just the start for you to be able to say, I value community you know, I value adventure, I value honesty. Renata Ellis (35:06): And then it's that pause, right? It's in this, can you tell the stories around what you value? And many times if you can't tell the story around that value, if you don't have as they say, receipts for whatever you're saying, your valuing, is that a value or is that this going back to that aspirational value? Right. So that is what I really encourage and challenge in the coaching space around like, and you can do this with your friends anywhere. Sure. You're telling your story around your value. If you value you know, working with marginalized populations, if that's something you value if you value you know that what are your stories and how do you uplift those stories in conversation with your community of your professional community of network not just in an interview, but when you are just out and about. Renata Ellis (36:13): How are you really telling those stories in your day-to-day? You don't have to be a blogger to tell your story. But that is what those type of resources are really like key to my practice. But really going away from resourcing and getting people to sit and be able to kind of like make their own resource, their own life's journey and be able to tell that. So that is my real, my big piece of advice. We're all storytellers, but we're storytellers mostly because many of us are not going to be on the New York Times bestselling list and that's okay, that's okay. But we have a bestseller and it is our story. So I really encourage people to just start telling their story. Telling their story, their values through those stories and even if they're shaky, right. Even if it's a little awkward the first few times or 20th time, just keep telling it because that's going to give you insight to what you really value and it's also going to support you to keep living those values out authentically. Dani Lauer (37:34): That's such a good, it's such great advice and yeah, I think about even like from an assessment, we have Pathway U as a resource for our students. Alumni's can use Pathway U and I know there's a section on that. Even if you don't even know where to start, you know, maybe taking that assessment. Renata Ellis (37:53): Yes. Dani Lauer (37:55): Seeing what that tells you, like these might be some things that you value using that as some preliminary data doesn't, you know, don't take that as like absolutely... Renata Ellis (38:04): Don't take it and run with it. Right? Dani Lauer (38:06): Yeah. But being able to say like, okay, let me get curious about some of these things and see if that makes sense for me. But I think that's another great free resource we have here at the Career center that can be really helpful. Renata Ellis (38:19): Yes and I would suggest take advantage of all the resources available to you. Like that's the first step. Renata Ellis (38:29): Used all the resources. Dani Lauer (38:31): Absolutely. Yeah. Well this has been such a great conversation. Renata Ellis (38:35): Oh, thank you for having me. Dani Lauer (38:37): Thank you for being on the, the podcast. So if folks wanna learn more about you and your coaching practice, where can they find you? Renata Ellis (38:45): Yeah, they can find me at my website at the https://www.liferoomconnection.com/ That is probably the best way to go to that and sign up for a free another resource discovery call. Dani Lauer (38:57): I love it. Yes. And Renata is also one of our alumni career coaches, so if you are a GV alumni listening and are wanting to work with a career coach, you can find her on our career coaching database as well. But yeah, we really appreciate you being here. And thank you so much to everyone here for listening, and we hope you tune into a future episode soon.