00:55.67
Nandi K
Welcome back to Right Quick.

00:59.45
Chris
A bite-sized pop culture conversation with your favorite queer unfriendly black hotties.

01:04.63
Nandi K
Today we're unfriendly because white Jesus has never ever gone hard. I'm Nandi K.

01:13.02
Chris
And I'm Chris Jordan. Oh,

01:14.81
Nandi K
Hey, oh my God, guys. Today we have a special guest, aunt queer unfriendly black hottie, my bestie from another messt-y.

01:26.25
Nandi K
Wow, that doesn't make any sense, but it rhymes. Chris Jordan.

01:30.97
Chris
It was cute to me.

01:32.92
Nandi K
Welcome, boo.

01:33.66
Chris
hey. hey

01:36.73
Nandi K
Do you wanna tell the people who you are and what ah you want them to know about you?

01:37.62
Chris
Hello.

01:43.22
Chris
um i am Chris Jordan. I use all the pronouns however you see me. That's how I'm going to um I'm a barber. I'm a creative. And that's about all I want you guys to know.

01:56.70
Nandi K
Oh, wow, um keeping it secret.

01:57.59
Chris
Is there other things about me? Is there any other thing?

01:59.77
Nandi K
No, I just think it's, I think it's just most important that people know that you are one of my best friends, one of my favorite people on this planet.

02:10.33
Nandi K
And, you know, you're becoming something of a podcast maven lately.

02:15.80
Chris
It seems like it.

02:15.89
Nandi K
and you then

02:16.72
Chris
This is my third one this month.

02:19.18
Nandi K
Whoa, three podcasts in a month.

02:23.19
Chris
Went from none to three, one month.

02:24.47
Nandi K
What are you, what are you schooling the people on? What was your other one that I don't know about?

02:30.62
Chris
The other one was this journalist actually comes to the shop, he is taking the extra class and it's about diversity and inclusion based off of LGBT Q community in film and television.

02:44.63
Nandi K
okay film and television. well I mean that's all you do all day is you know get things on your get your letterbox score up

02:44.79
Chris
So you know that was right up my l you know that was right up my my alley.

02:58.58
Chris
*laughs* at this point yes

03:00.28
Nandi K
yeah I didn't realize you were doing that until the Oscars and you were like I gotta watch Marty Supreme and I was like oh

03:08.41
Chris
Yeah, I just add stuff. I just added the Princess and the Frog last night. I rewatched it just to put it on there.

03:12.70
Nandi K
Oh, the Disney one?

03:14.07
Chris
Yeah, great movie.

03:16.34
Nandi K
Okay, that's actually a really great segue. Did you watch it in preparation for our episode today, Chris?

03:24.22
Chris
I did. i did. i did some studying.

03:25.53
Nandi K
Wow. Well, today, yeah we're talking about spirituality. And I wanted to have this conversation with Chris because whenever i have questions about things I want to do, about what I'm seeing, what I'm feeling, what i what rituals I want to carry out, I'd be like, okay, what do I need to do? And I'd send Chris a text and I'd be like, boo.

03:48.28
Nandi K
What should I do? um The Princess and the Frog is great because it has Keith David as the voodoo man in that.

03:58.35
Chris
Mm-hmm.

03:59.93
Nandi K
Which he's so great.

04:00.39
Chris
Absolutely.

04:01.84
Nandi K
He's so good in that. The Oogie Boogie Man, is that the name of that song?

04:07.46
Chris
That's not his, yeah, I think that is the song name.

04:10.58
Nandi K
I think that's the name of the song.

04:10.74
Chris
yeah That sounded like something you made up, but that's correct.

04:13.05
Nandi K
Wow.

04:13.74
Chris
That that sounds about right. I just knew you made that up, but that's you.

04:15.68
Nandi K
I'm like...

04:17.74
Chris
That's right.

04:18.19
Nandi K
I'm no, ah um like, I've watched him perform that song a few times. And I, that's the part that sticks in my mind. mind So he must repeat it Um, well, let's talk a little bit about spirituality. What spirituality practices and beliefs do you ascribe to these days? Sweet Chris.

04:41.85
Chris
These days I am ascribing to hoodoo. I would love to call myself the conjure boi

04:50.17
Nandi K
You don't?

04:50.55
Chris
Still, i think i I think that's why I said still, I think that still fits me.

04:55.38
Nandi K
I agree. Yeah, for sure. How long have you been practicing? Well.

05:00.79
Chris
This is the year of our Lord and Savior, 2026. So maybe

05:04.45
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

05:07.54
Chris
twenty eighteen

05:08.82
Nandi K
Okay. Yeah. Wow.

05:10.17
Chris
mean

05:10.25
Nandi K
You about to hit a decade. Yeah.

05:12.44
Chris
Yeah.

05:12.52
Nandi K
You feel to me very deep in it. How, I mean, we both are like Southern boos. So I think one of my first things when I did start learning more about hoodoo was like, oh, I've been doing hoodoo.

05:30.62
Nandi K
for my whole life in some ways, but what are, what is like the thing that made you like more intentional in your practice?

05:56.02
Chris
So the thing that I noticed that brought me full circle to it was that it's been in my life the whole time, right in my face.

06:01.75
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

06:03.29
Chris
Nobody named it. Nobody did any of the things for it. It was just like, oh, this is what we do. This is our family. But it had a name and nobody named it ever. And I was like, oh, we've been doing this. That's why the Bible's been open in the living room for 27 years on one specific verse.

06:21.66
Nandi K
See, and that's another, and like, this is the thing I always learn every time somebody tells me about like another practice that is hoodoo. I'm like, bitch, I didn't even know that was hoodoo because I can't name a Black household.

06:38.36
Nandi K
Maybe these days, because you know, the children, the children, they don't keep their Bibles. You know, I keep a Bible on me because that's the book I grew up with. And it's the book I know the best.

06:51.58
Nandi K
I definitely don't have it laid out.

06:52.54
Chris
Okay.

06:53.91
Nandi K
But growing up, by everybody had that. Everybody had a Bible laid out. My grandma, her friends, everybody from the church.

07:02.38
Chris
Yep.

07:03.77
Nandi K
Everybody had a Bible laid out. Did you, you grew up in church too, right?

07:09.02
Chris
Absolutely. Deep, deep, deep in it.

07:11.61
Nandi K
Yeah, what denomination did you grow up? Did you grow up Baptist, COGIC?

07:16.22
Chris
I grew up, yeah, I grew up COGIC.

07:18.49
Nandi K
Okay, yeah, yeah, okay. So yeah, and the hoodoo is deep, deep within the COGIC church. What do you think is like, how did what was like growing up in church like and how is that different from

07:38.65
Nandi K
what your practice is now?

07:55.16
Nandi K
So how was growing up in church, like growing up in church, how did that make you feel versus like, like where were you in your spirituality, I guess? That's really more the question. Where were you in your spirituality when you got more intentional about your hoodoo practice?

08:22.67
Nandi K
Hmm.

08:41.88
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

09:29.46
Chris
I was out of church. I had stopped going. I was like, don't say Jesus to me. Don't mention the church house to me. I wanted no parts of anything.

09:41.53
Chris
And it just started slowly creeping up on me, like little stuff.

09:46.62
Chris
And then it was solely deep into, it wasn't even hoodoo for real.

09:50.62
Chris
It was more so me getting into tarot and all of those things. And it gradually moved into hoodoo.

09:58.74
Chris
And me understanding how to connect that the Bible connects with hoodoo. And I was like, Oh dang, I'm right back to where I started from.

10:06.52
Chris
Like I'm, I'm right back in this, but they all just started connecting in one big puzzle piece. And now I got a Bible again.

09:01.17
Nandi K
Yeah, I've been, it's interesting because a lot of hoodoo practitioners use different books. Like everybody doesn't use the Bible if that's not the book that they're like most familiar with. Like, because a lot of and ah Black and African people who came here enslaved were also Muslim.

09:23.10
Nandi K
And most people don't realize that. Like, they either It was either Islam because that slave trade had already been going on long before the transatlantic or their indigenous religions of a myriad of African traditional religions.

*Nigtionary Moment*
Nandi K
African traditional religion refers to the diverse indigenous spiritual beliefs and practices native to Africa passed out orally through generations. These religions are generally monotheistic, focusing on a distant supreme creator alongside the veneration of ancestors and spirits, placing high value on community, nature, and the harmony between the living world and the spiritual world.

09:47.74
Nandi K
Um, i you know, as I've mentioned before, I was in a little cult for a while.

09:55.29
Nandi K
um a white evangelical cult when I moved to New York City, because I also hadn't gone to church in a really long time.

10:05.37
Nandi K
But I also felt like a divine push to move to New York.

10:12.98
Nandi K
And then when I moved there, someone that I knew from Jacksonville was like, oh, why don't you come to this church? And I was like, oh, it's a sign. this is what happens when you grow upindoctrinated. You'd be like, it's a sign. So I ended up going to Hillsong for a few years.

10:28.63
Nandi K
Turns out that was a little bit of a cult. um I also, that was my first time ever dealing with like white people. I also had never gone to a mega church before.

10:41.88
Nandi K
So there was like a bunch of firsts because it was like a multicultural church, but

10:47.20
Chris
I fear they would have gotten me. Cause, I’ve heard some of their songs and… that’s all it woulda took

10:51.69
Nandi K
Bruh, that's how they got me. The songs went so hard. And we used to have church at like literal music venues.

10:58.35
Chris
This is what I’m sayin’. They woulda got me.
11:00.26
Nandi K
So like it was like being out of, that's literally how they got me because the music was fire. Like if the music is fire, that's why I don't go to church now because the music is not good.

11:14.49
Nandi K
I tried to go to Easter last year, Easter service, song selection, whack.

11:23.03
Nandi K
They only did one good song.

12:33.08
Chris
I remember you telling me about this. Yes. Yes. Yo, I just told my wife about this. i don't. So I don't know. I'm real picky on my choirs. I hate an elderly choir.

11:35.06
Nandi K
um don't wanna hear the senior choir neither.

11:38.36
Chris
I'm so sorry. I cannot stand an elderly choir because it just don't hit the same way. Listen, bring me the youthful choir. They just went out Saturday night and now they're back in church the next morning. Not the children. i need, I need these 20 to 45s in here singing their hearts out they're picking good songs.

11:41.91
Nandi K
But not the children.

13:03.01
Chris
They really got, they they really got the flow in them.

11:50.33
Nandi K
Yeah.

13:05.53
Chris
I don't, I don't need to hear Bertha and don't need to hear little Emmanuel.

11:55.03
Nandi K
Yeah, Shaun used to take me to a great church. Yeah, Sean used to take me to Abyssinia and Harlem and New York and baby.

13:16.57
Chris
Ooh.

12:04.28
Nandi K
Ooh, because they had the really good choir that was like the main choir. And then they had the choir that was like the everybody choir, but the everybody choir would do the hits.

12:13.72

12:15.64
Nandi K
And the person who led the everybody choir, his name was LaFrederick. Baby, LaFrederick was doing Hold Up the Light. He was doing stuff I literally had not heard since I was a child.

12:29.98
Nandi K
and that was also lit. But there's definitely a difference between Black Jesus and White Jesus.

13:51.93
Chris
Absolutely. And his music is different.

13:54.09
Chris
He got, he got completely different music. I don't, I don't like the white ones music for real.

12:45.82
Nandi K
Yeah, that ah that was the one thing. like I do like some of the Hillsong stuff, but most of the stuff I like is like the older stuff, like when they still really like possibly like needed stuff from God.

12:58.38
Nandi K
i was really thrown by the fact that white people don't really seem to need shit.

14:18.42
Chris
Bingo.

13:05.22
Nandi K
They used to be like, we worship you for who you are, God.

14:22.97
Chris
That's what's missing from the white music.

13:09.94
Nandi K
You don't have to do a single thing for us, God, and we would still love you. I'ma be real. I don't know if you never did nothing for me if I would love you.

13:21.76
Nandi K
Not a single thing?

14:33.24
Chris
I, I, I know, I know one thing I hate when you put that, that voice on, you've done that several times.

13:29.56
Nandi K
so good so good you gotta like curl your lip over you gotta have like less lip to have that and they still like they punch they like to punch the air yeah

14:41.72
Chris
It scares me. It scares me

14:57.21
Chris
You just made me realize white churches and their music, they're missing the yearning.

13:50.14
Nandi K
yeah there's no yearning yeah

15:02.97
Chris
They're missing the yearning for Jesus and God.

15:05.37
Chris
There's no yearning.

13:53.69
Nandi K
and And I'll say, I'll even say Black churches take the yearning a little bit too far in some places, but I would rather have yearning than not.

14:04.50
Nandi K
Like, yeah, change Jesus to baby and make me question what this song is really about.

15:22.49
Chris
My favorite version of that is love by musiq soulchild. like give it to God when they was changing in it.

14:13.27
Nandi K
Lord, I hated that. said, you Christians must be stopped.

15:27.21
Chris
Yes. Listen, listen, I was in there like this.

15:33.50
Chris
I was in the front row, hands up.

14:22.23
Nandi K
So many peep.

14:23.93
Nandi K
Bye. i know Musiq Soulchild never saw that shit coming. i know he was like, I know y'all fucking lying.

15:44.98
Chris
What a time to be alive.

14:33.50
Nandi K
oh man. That's in Trinitee 5-7 days.

15:50.14
Chris
Oh my gosh. I forgot about them. I wanted to be in their group so bad.

15:53.42
Chris
I wanted to wear my skirt with them. I had long skirts. I didn't even know I had legs above my ankles.

14:43.54
Nandi K
Oh, Trinity five seven made me feel like I was listening to, like, gospel TLC. Like, how was like, yeah, I was doing the Bankhead Bounce.

16:02.78
Chris
Absolutely.

14:53.70
Nandi K
I was like, yeah, nothing but my savior, gospel behavior.

14:58.14
Nandi K
You know how they used that's how gospel rappers rap. um

Chris
And then we got Mary Mary and it was like, yes.

15:04.18
Nandi K
Whoa, Mary, Mary changed the game.

15:08.39
Nandi K
whoa. whoa Now, that's probably why we not Christian no more. Because Mary Mary got the Shackles video on regular TV and Shackles was on regular radio.

16:34.23
Chris
That's true.

15:21.18
Nandi K
it wasn't It wasn't Christian enough.

15:24.12
Nandi K
And that's why we said, you know what?

15:26.08
Nandi K
If Mary Mary can tip out, so can we.

15:30.62
Nandi K
Okay, so you said that you started at seeing you first started getting into other things, which I'm guessing one of those things are astrology.

16:52.98
Chris
Bingo.

15:41.24
Nandi K
Okay, let's do big threes first. Oh, and your Venus.

16:57.08
Chris
All right. So my big three is Libra, Libra, Capricorn, and my Venus is Scorpio.

15:52.15
Nandi K
Okay, my big three is Sagittarius, Taurus, Aquarius, and my Venus is also in Scorpio.

16:00.34
Nandi K
This is why we love each other, though.

17:14.65
Chris
This is why we're deep in it.

16:04.25
Nandi K
Okay, what do these, what does your big three mean for you? Because when I hear you say like Libra, Libra, it's like kind of like hear it when I hear like Dylan, Dylan, Dylan, and Dylan.

16:18.37
Nandi K
It's kind of like I hear the same thing. So what does it mean to you?

16:14.14
Chris
you act like You act like this.

17:36.94
Chris
And I just don't know what to do with it sometimes.

17:39.34
Chris
Like, why do you act this way?

17:42.33
Chris
um It doesn't matter what I say it means to me because you're going to have something to say about it.

16:33.75
Nandi K
No, I'm going to say what mine means to me.

16:35.95
Nandi K
and you're more you're more than welcome to give your opinions as well.

17:53.69
Chris
So Libra is all about balance. I think the misconception that people get is that we're balanced and all this.

18:00.73
Chris
No, we're actually looking for balance.

17:20.02
Nandi K
that sounds correct that's your rising no that's your yes okay that actually does make sense that you're rising as capricorn yeah okay so for me

17:34.42
Nandi K
I'm a Sagittarius, a.k.a. a demon.

17:37.26
Nandi K
So that's what that means.

17:39.38
Nandi K
um I'm a Taurus rising, so I like to be chilling.

17:45.94
Nandi K
I like don't ever invite me to an activity that does not include food. Um, and I like, um, my things, which usually is books right now.

17:58.76
Nandi K
Books are like my main, my main thing.

18:01.72
Nandi K
um I'm an Aquarius moon.

18:02.49
Chris
That's the whole point of being a Libra. We're looking for balance. That's my identity, trying to find balance and being beautiful because...

18:04.85
Chris
So that's my whole sun.

18:10.90
Chris
That's what we are. And when it's when it hits my moon, it's a little different.

18:15.42
Chris
I think it operates as a water sign once it's in the moon position because I'm just emotional.

18:04.16
Nandi K
What does that mean?

18:05.89
Nandi K
I like to march to the beat of my own drum.

18:08.64
Nandi K
I don't care what nobody else is doing. i only care about what I am doing.

18:15.13
Nandi K
um

18:16.25
Nandi K
And I like to question why people keep doing the same things the same way and why they never like thought about, I don't know, maybe updating it for like current times.

18:29.40
Nandi K
ah And then my Venus is in Scorpio, which means, baby, give me your soul.

18:31.06
Chris
It's a lot. But thank God for that Capricorn.

18:37.02
Chris
Yeah, that's my rising. Yeah.

18:41.62
Nandi K
Yeah.

18:45.83
Nandi K
Yep. Oh my God, this is just like that book I'm reading. I low-key want that.

18:50.52
Chris
Yes.

18:51.54
Nandi K
Now, did I tell you about this book where they stole the blood out of Jesus's body and then they gave it to themselves in a ritual and now they're immortal?

19:03.61
Nandi K
No, it was definitely me. It's called My Soul to Keep. Yeah, yeah, it was definitely me. Yeah, I want a movie. And I talked to the author about this. Yes, I was like, please.

19:15.22
Nandi K
Please put Blair Underwood on the screen for this movie. I need it um Yeah, I agree. do you How do you think? art Well, actually, you know way more about this than me. So like how do our charts like match up in terms of like big three? I get a along well with air signs as a fire sign. I feel like that's good and bad.

19:41.14
Nandi K
hey You would.

19:45.43
Nandi K
Yeah, exactly. woof

19:48.63
Chris
Oh, I didn't mention that yes my Venus being in Scorpio is I want all of you, I want you to slit your wrists and pour the blood into a vial and give it to me as a necklace.

19:50.67
Nandi K
It's fun.

20:01.05
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

20:04.44
Nandi K

20:10.94
Nandi K
wow and

20:14.01
Chris
Yes, was it you or was it one of my clients, what's the book.

20:16.54
Nandi K
and don't

20:18.01
Chris
Okay. Yep. It was you. You want it. Did you want a movie? I think he wanted a movie of this. Yes. Absolutely.

20:24.74
Nandi K
uh yeah why should i have to work hard yeah why should we have to work hard why can't we just be cute and like be good people too

20:31.58
Chris
Absolutely.

20:36.98
Nandi K
At the same time. Okay. You don't care about that. Okay. Other spiritual practices and beliefs. So how do you, and also how do you think growing up in the South affected how you approach like other like spiritual practices?

20:52.63
Chris
um I love a fire sign. i Especially me being a Libra, fire signs set me set me up perfectly.

20:54.86
Nandi K
Cause I also recently got into tarot. but it's very recent for me, only like a year that, not that I got into it, but that I actually been doing what I'm supposed to be doing.

20:59.39
Chris
like it it it It boosts. Yes, it look, it just... I am a flame. Just a little ball rolling around with them.

21:06.27
Nandi K
ah Somebody had to bring a stern message from the other side being like, bitch, if you don't pick them cards up, I said,

21:07.67
Chris
um Our big threes match well because you're pretty Venus ruled. And my whole my chart is, you know, my my sun and my moon is also Venus ruled.

21:18.08
Chris
So we connect...

21:19.29
Nandi K
and I have a bitch's brew of cards.

21:19.63
Chris
on those levels. I love beauty. I love, you know, those, all of that aesthetic stuff.

21:22.17
Nandi K
Like I have so many cards.

21:24.31
Chris
And you also do not, you don't want to be anywhere that doesn't look good and doesn't have food. So we just, we, we match very well.

21:31.93
Nandi K
I do.

21:32.07
Chris
We also are very, like what what is the neo song?

21:32.73
Nandi K
That's true. Okay. Yeah, but.

21:35.76
Chris
Lazy love. That's us. Like we want to just lay in love and beauty and that's, that's how we connect. Thank you.

21:46.81
Chris
I think I'm cute.

21:54.93
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

22:01.81
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

22:07.45
Nandi K
Damn.

22:19.54
Chris
Okay.

22:21.02
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

22:28.54
Chris
Exactly. Which is funny because you always gift me cards for my birthday. So,

22:33.50
Nandi K
yeah

22:36.82
Chris
and it's funny, every deck that you've given me has been so personally connected to me. They work like just, they love me. And it's like, it's because my best friend loves me.

22:42.74
Nandi K
Come on, eating his body.

22:44.50
Chris
That's why.

22:44.54
Nandi K
Listen, I'm trying to get a shot of that blood.

22:46.52
Chris
um Growing up in the South and being into astrology and tarot and then coming from Kojic, it was rough.

22:48.65
Nandi K
Hallelujah. It soothes all my doubts of and it calms all my fears.

22:55.38
Chris
A very rough transition because all I kept hearing was that's evil.

22:59.07
Nandi K
Hallelujah.

22:59.10
Chris
That's that's not of God.

23:00.62
Nandi K
Yes. Hallelujah.

23:00.74
Chris
So... I'm practicing tarot. This is where I started with first.

23:04.79
Nandi K
I do. oh yeah, I know what a preacher's supposed to say.

23:05.34
Chris
I'm practicing tarot, pulling my cards, getting used to it.

23:07.19
Nandi K
i Invite me to your church.

23:08.94
Chris
And something bad would happen in my life.

23:09.88
Nandi K
to lead worship, I could come up with a message on the spot.

23:11.14
Chris
And instantly, because I grew up in this Kojic environment, and first thought was, oh it's because I'm playing with the devil.

23:13.32
Nandi K
I never pre-write my messages. I like to just string a lot of song lyrics and Bible verses together to sound profound.

23:18.04
Chris
If I wasn't playing with the devil's tools, this wouldn't be happening. So it was a process for me to be able to keep going in separate and decentralize

23:23.28
Nandi K
Because that's all it takes. I i see ah preachers and I'm like, this is what it takes. I know a lot of gospel songs. I know the gospel cadence.

23:32.87
Chris
Kojic because it was it was eating up everything that I was doing it was taken away from me even really getting into tarot me getting into astrology and damn sure me doing hoodoo I was like oh girl you're not supposed to be playing with this at all like where this this is not this is not godly but then I thought about you know the blood of Jesus is being drank on first Sundays but okay who is me who is me yeah

23:33.94
Nandi K
I know the Bible. Like when they say the devil know the Bible too? Yeah. Yeah.

23:48.92
Nandi K
Oh, yeah.

23:55.19
Nandi K
Wow. The whole ceremony. They don't even do that no more.

24:00.98
Nandi K
That's what used to be my favorite. That's also very witchy, by the way. like that's That's so witchy to like come in and like kneel in front of your throne before you sit on it.

24:15.11
Nandi K
Gotta have that water.

24:15.54
Chris
See, you know what a preacher supposed to sound like.

24:17.91
Nandi K
And also that ah oil that stays up on the um pulpit. Okay, so what was the thing that like made you say, yeah of course, like Jesus' blood is also like feels with you, but like what was the actual awakening that was like, oh, actually, these things are kind of connected, but like when did you really get into the history?

24:44.86
Nandi K
Because one of the greatest hoodoo practitioners ever was

24:46.82
Chris
Yep. Yep.

24:51.80
Nandi K
was like the father of the Kojic church. So like, where did you find, when did you find that out?

24:54.65
Chris
I just want to do the intro of being a preacher. Like I want to walk in real serious while, while everyone's singing.

24:58.90
Nandi K
How did that like come up?

25:00.45
Chris
I have a cloth in my hand and I go sit down. i take my water. I kneel in front of the chair with my head down. Like I'm praying when in reality, I'm probably over there. Like that's crazy.

25:10.74
Nandi K
hey

25:11.77
Chris
Cause that's all I know. I used to see this every Sunday.

25:17.43
Nandi K
Come on.

25:18.01
Chris
It is. it is.

25:25.30
Chris
and the, and the glass of water. Cause you know how often we use water in hoodoo. So I'm just, it,

25:30.94
Nandi K
Yeah.

26:05.57
Nandi K
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

26:07.42
Chris
right

26:08.86
Nandi K
Yeah.

26:14.07
Chris
That came up after slavery. um

26:16.18
Nandi K
yeah

26:17.53
Chris
And I know that's a wild place to start. But once I started connecting God, Jesus to slavery and how he let it happen, I was like, you know what? I actually am holding you too too high on a totem of standards because you allowed all of these bad things to happen to black people.

26:30.81
Nandi K
Yeah, and they the Kojic church covered up so much of his hoodoo history.

26:35.32
Chris
So there's no possible way that you aren't racist and that you are living this life that you're trying to, you know, you're leading on us in this way that they've been pushing towards us.

26:36.65
Nandi K
Like, there's a big-ass shrine to Bishop Charles Mason in wherever his old little church is There's a whole-ass altar of this man.

26:45.34
Chris
After that, I kind of let go and it was, let me start reading books that are based off of

26:48.36
Nandi K
um But they don't talk about that um in the Kojic church.

26:51.06
Chris
this thing that is based off of hoodoo.

26:52.12
Nandi K
And I just think about, like, when I think of Kojic now, I just think about

26:53.14
Chris
I went deep into the history. I wanted to find out all of these things about it.

26:57.37
Nandi K
I am delivered.

26:57.90
Chris
Every book I could find, I was reading um and learning the difference between that are there are people out there that are writing books that are just, you know, not actually need to be writing books about hoodoo.

26:58.81
Nandi K
Cause that also happened in a Kojic church. I have that sound, but I just keep doing it myself. um I could play the sound, but I just feel like doing it myself.

27:07.63
Chris
Cause yo, why your white ass got a pen and paper talking about hoodoo.

27:09.13
Nandi K
But yeah, it's just to think about going from being like such a vibrant people and like black theology itself has its own history.

27:10.79
Chris
Um, But, you know, I went through my stages and I learned all these things, but it really was me going into the history, not just of hoodoo, but also of the church, especially Kojic church.

27:18.54
Nandi K
And there's a lot of parts of the Bible black people wouldn't even read because it's the parts that justify slavery.

27:21.41
Chris
it It was like, oh, all of this is truly connected. Ceremonies, the totems being used, every single thing is connected.

27:26.98
Nandi K
But now you say your family's coaching to generational gifts.

27:29.93
Chris
It was all the same exact thing. It's just labeled differently and

27:34.64
Nandi K
You said they've been doing hoodoo.

27:36.02
Chris
taught to us in a way that makes it seem like you're going to be demonized if you do anything that's not taught in here the way we're teaching you.

27:37.22
Nandi K
What's your generational gifts?

28:01.58
Chris
Yep.

28:06.68
Nandi K
Mm-hmm.

28:09.76
Nandi K
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah.

28:15.85
Chris
Yeah.

28:23.86
Nandi K
Yeah, I love that. Yeah, I wish that's definitely like Sean's gift is also like getting their hands in the dirt. Like,

28:34.46
Nandi K
And I had a reading a while ago that there's definitely people like that in my bloodline. But for me particularly, that's not my call. What I think our generational gift is, is um discernment.

28:45.98
Chris
who

28:52.06
Nandi K
At least that my generation, my mama and her mama for sure major discerners.

28:52.22
Chris
So talking to my mom and my aunt, my grandmother's sister, um I have found out that my great, great grandmother, whenever she was low on cash, she would put a specific herb in her hat, put the hat on and go down to the dog tracks and come home and the bills were all paid.

28:59.59
Nandi K
It drove my mama a little crazy. She can't really handle it. And like honestly, now that I get older, I understand that a little bit more because I'm way more careful with my energy because I saw how my mom was and I wanted to be the opposite of that.

29:12.95
Chris
everything like 10 times what she even asked for it was it was there so this seems to be my generational gift is working roots which is why you know I call myself conjure boy i'm I'm not I can use candles I can use the water I can do all of the things but my gifts really do lie in working with the roots like me touching the herbs and all of those things that's really where my gifts lie and it seems to be passed down

29:15.50
Nandi K
But then I was like, mate, wait, maybe she was right a little bit. I was like, maybe she was a little bit right. And then I'm also really into um crafting.

29:26.02
Nandi K
So like, I've been sewing now. I've always like, like putting stuff together. So I think eventually like woodwork will be like my next thing. But

29:39.29
Nandi K
I do. Yes, I do know that. I forgot you made a ton of furniture. oh yeah, you can come live on my farm and then we can build um little tiny houses on the farm.

29:46.87
Chris
hu

29:55.90
Nandi K
Okay, wow. It's not very communally minded of you, but yeah, I'm really into it.

30:04.28
Chris
That's good. Okay.

30:04.92
Nandi K
Many mansions though. Like many, you don't need a mansion for just you. This is why the planet is burning up. This is literally why the planet is burning up. But yeah, that, and so now also my, on my daddy's side, my grandma and my auntie are both seamstresses.

30:24.25
Nandi K
So I've been wanting to sew for my whole life.

30:24.82
Chris
Okay.

30:26.73
Nandi K
It was only a matter of time before I started sewing, but I literally made something wearable the first time I ever made something.

30:30.95
Chris
Gotcha. Gotcha.

30:35.49
Nandi K
um and of course, music is also like a very much ancestral like gift that we have received through my family on both sides, which is so great, but not big hoodoo religious people outside of like normal stuff.

30:49.58
Chris
I'll teach you that Nandi. You know, I can woodwork, right?

30:52.99
Nandi K
Like, you know, New Year's Eve shit and like the cleaning and like, I mean, there's a bunch of stuff that I didn't realize, like when you wash your walls and all that kind of stuff, but mostly it was like the cleanest stuff.

30:55.16
Chris
Yeah.

31:02.94
Chris
Well, I'm not coming. I'm not coming if we're been building tiny houses.

31:05.40
Nandi K
And my mama is definitely a plant hoe.

31:06.22
Chris
I hate tiny houses. Continue on.

31:08.37
Nandi K
She a Pisces, so you know Pisces. Pisces, baby, everything they touch grow.

31:14.52
Chris
We can have community mansions.

31:16.49
Nandi K
ah She kept a rubber plant I had alive for like 30 years. Like just insane stuff. Well, we're rounding the corner and I want to make sure we talk about ah some media representations of spirituality, which we always like to wrap up with.

31:36.06
Nandi K
ah Chris, you said you wanted to talk about Beyonce's Lemonade.

31:36.99
Chris
Oh.

31:39.46
Nandi K
Please. and Enlighten in the people. Tell us.

31:46.58
Nandi K
Wow.

32:08.13
Nandi K
Mm-hmm. Hold up.

32:09.82
Chris
Yeah.

32:11.99
Nandi K
No, I remember, of course I saw it. I saw it the same day it came out. I participate in all cultural phenomenon.

32:21.46
Chris
Okay. That checks out. Yeah. Yeah.

32:30.26
Nandi K
I wouldn't be surprised.

32:35.29
Nandi K
She's a cancer, right? Yeah, she's a cancer, yeah. Yeah, I was to say Pisces, but I know her birthday is in the summer. So she has to be a Cancer. Yeah.

32:52.02
Nandi K
Like his King?

32:53.56
Chris
I do.

32:53.91
Nandi K
hu

32:56.25
Chris
First of all, sounds disgusting. You talking to me like you just feel like you're like, yeah, let me do my thing.

33:01.46
Nandi K
Yeah.

33:03.94
Chris
Okay.

33:04.25
Nandi K
Yeah. Yeah.

33:05.47
Chris
Lemonade was amazing.

33:06.81
Nandi K
I do agree that from that perspective, I did really like the imagery.

33:06.81
Chris
it was It was covered in ATR. like that's that That was the whole album, all the videos.

33:12.89
Nandi K
I just didn't like the songs that much, but I really did like the imagery.

33:13.75
Chris
i feel like she did a great job of

33:17.23
Nandi K
I watched the whole movie when it came out, the film when it came out.

33:17.43
Chris
Every element. You got some Oshun in there. what was What was that?

33:21.20
Nandi K
I was in l LA, so like it was a big like thing.

33:21.59
Chris
What song was that? Hold up. oh oh Oh, excuse me.

33:25.05
Nandi K
um um i'm just gonna name sinners we talked about this when it came out and now that i've seen it a couple times you know you were like saying that there wasn't enough like conjure and i'm like as many white people as let's see in that movie blessed be i'm glad they didn't really show nothing

33:28.43
Chris
Oh, excuse me.

33:33.08
Chris
um The women having their faces painted on the buses. like It was just all... a lot of spiritual stuff. And I honestly believe it came from Solange more than Beyonce. I feel likeillan like feel like Solange brought Beyonce in and now it's a, it's a family affair.

33:49.38
Nandi K
I'm so glad they didn't really show nothing because, like, I don't want...

33:50.36
Chris
Is she a cancer? Oh, I missed that. I swore she was a Pisces. Okay.

33:53.72
Nandi K
Like, they had mojo bags at Spirit Halloween on, like, a smoke ah and or stack costume, right?

33:57.69
Chris
Oh, there we go. Okay. And I think we got the same energy in that other, the Black album she has, Black black is King.

34:02.24
Nandi K
So, like, I don't want the people knowing nothing about mojo bags.

34:06.36
Chris
Yeah, Black Parade. All of that was very, it references all of the stuff.

34:09.62
Nandi K
I don't want them trying to put nothing together. i don't want...

34:12.22
Chris
Yemiah, all of those things. Oshun, they're all named.

34:14.27
Nandi K
I'm just saying it that was real.

34:15.85
Chris
i

34:16.07
Nandi K
Yes. Unless it was AI, but I'm pretty sure I saw it few different ways.

34:18.15
Chris
There's a lot of artists that do it, though.

34:21.47
Nandi K
And there was like smoking sack costumes and there was like a mojo bag as part of it.

34:33.17
Nandi K
Exactly.

34:33.17
Chris
Okay.

34:33.89
Nandi K
Yeah. that nice so far grand ah

34:37.17
Chris
Okay. That makes sense.

34:47.51
Nandi K
Yeah. um And then for books, I always am going to... You're not going miss... I'm always going to highlight a Zora Neale Hurston reference when it comes to hoodoo.

34:57.24
Chris
yeah

34:57.91
Nandi K
When it comes to really any...

34:58.77
Chris
You're right.

35:00.03
Nandi K
like

35:01.29
Chris
You're right.

35:01.69
Nandi K
black diasporic religions in the u.s like she is the person who documented them all she went through countless initiations so many so i'm recommending of mules and men is that it no tell my horse or tell my horse or both of them Yeah, of Mules and Men. Yeah, that's what I wrote on here.

35:24.95
Nandi K
um Yeah, Zora is that girl.

35:25.51
Chris
Nandi, don't piss me off. What?

35:28.89
Nandi K
um She's the one. She has been through... i mean, she is so studied. And at a time where it was so much more prevalent, because we're talking about within...

35:39.16
Nandi K
within like

35:39.72
Chris
Oh, that's disgusting. Yeah.

35:40.92
Nandi K
100 years still 50 years of the end of enslavement so like really incredible stuff and then a book I just finished which did you finish this The Conjuring of America by Lindsay Stewart

35:41.06
Chris
you In that context, you're right. I feel like if the movie was specifically for us and things segregation was back, that would have been great. and That would have been great to have more that' been great to have more details in there, you know, just to expound on it a bit.

35:54.07
Nandi K
Well, highly recommend.

35:55.51
Chris
But because we're we're intermingling in the world, I accept it.

35:55.76
Nandi K
It tells the story of how many of the remedies and things we know today come from our enslaved ancestors. And they brought them over from Africa from like red drinks to like Kool-Aid and like having black gums, all kinds of like Vicks Vapor Rub.

36:16.83
Nandi K
Truly a beautiful, incredible book that just talks about The Conjure. um um today's episode is sponsored by former church kids against white jesus um jesus was a brown man murdered by the state um he was a brown palestinian and y'all still killing palestinians so yeah we don't fuck with white jesus he's racist um a big thanks to our producer and audio adonis aaron rand freeman

36:26.43
Chris
She did.

36:30.04
Chris
That's exactly what it No, Mules and Men is the one I go for. Yeah.

36:39.29
Chris
That.

36:44.12
Chris
Yeah.

36:51.51
Chris
Mm-hmm.

36:54.33
Nandi K
Chris, who are you and where would you like to be found?

36:55.45
Chris
Yep. Honestly.

37:03.23
Nandi K
Hey, and I'm Nandi Kay. You can find me on Instagram, threads, and blue sky at Nandi Kay, A-Y-Y-Y.

37:05.11
Chris
i haven't. I haven't.

37:10.51
Nandi K
See y'all. see'all

37:36.82
Chris
ah right.

38:10.01
Chris
I am Chris Jordan and you can find me on Instagram. My Instagram tag is hi, Chris Jordan.

38:27.24
Chris
Later.