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right.

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It is no secret around here that
your girl, Sam, here, spent an

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ass load of money on her divorce.

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What is not talked about is the
damage long-term that it had on me.

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I think first and foremost, I am
gonna be completely transparent.

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Transparent.

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I at 47 years old, am still.

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Working on the damage from my divorce
financially back when I was in my

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early thirties, meaning I don't
still carry debt for my divorce.

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That's not what I'm talking about.

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I'm talking about the
financial abuse I went through.

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Still has ill effects on me
because for me, and maybe this

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makes sense to you, listening,
money means I can protect my kids.

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So if I don't have money.

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I can't protect my kids.

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Now let me unpack that in today's episode,
but that's what I'm talking about.

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So today I wanna talk about something
that almost no one really talks

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about when it comes to divorce,
which is the financial burden.

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Nobody leads their communication with
their attorney and saying like, oh,

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your attorney's like no big deal.

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You know it, it'll
barely cost you anything.

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No, it's usually a really
big topic in your divorce.

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and your, conversations with your
attorney is talking about the financial

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burden that it's going to endure.

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And I hope all of you're reading
your contracts and you know what,

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you're gonna be getting charged.

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But when you're in the middle class
or struggling financially, trying to

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make inmates while also protecting
your kids, it can fuck you up.

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The reality is divorce in a custody battle
is not cheap, and the financial scars

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are long lasting after the case is over.

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So this is what it feels
like when you're in it.

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And for those of you listening,
if you know, you know, for many

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parents it, it feels like every
paycheck already has a job.

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Every paycheck already has a place to go.

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Bills are already tight.

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You're also trying to save
for those special moments.

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And then on top of that, you throw in
a divorce, and now we have attorney

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fees, we have court filing fees, we
have mediation or other professionals,

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we have unexpected hearings.

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So you're constantly asking yourself all
the time, like, will I have enough money?

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Will I ever have enough money?

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And for me, again, I am years out
from my co-parenting and my divorce.

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But I'm still dealing with
how traumatic that financial

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loss was all those years ago.

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Constantly in this battle mode, right?

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When you're dealing with a high conflict
co-parent, you never have financial safety

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because it's constantly being spent.

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Just when you save enough
money, the lawyer takes it.

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Just when you save enough
money, they come after it.

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When you save enough money, now
you have another mediation session.

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You're constantly worrying
about the next thing.

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So you're constantly tied up with
money concerns and if somebody doesn't

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understand this, like your friends, your
family, or new, significant others, and

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they're like, don't worry, I'll help you.

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No, you don't get it.

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Just when we have enough,
it's going to go away.

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When Jared got into my life, I was
done for the most part, going to court

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at that point, and I was just getting
my head above water financially.

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I had a savings account again.

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I had a second job where I was
working in MLM and I was making some

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side money and some spending money,
and we had some breathable space.

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When I say my head was above water, I
would say my nose for the first time

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in 10 years was finally above water.

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Before that, my whole body was
underneath water, but I finally

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had had my nose above water.

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He couldn't understand this concept
of why I was constantly trying to

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save or constantly penny pinching or
constantly couponing or constantly

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just building my savings up.

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And I kept saying, Jer,
I call him Bear, bear.

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No matter what.

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We have to have a savings
because he's going to come.

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He always comes, he always files.

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He always motions for something and I
have to have enough money for a lawyer.

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Mind you, I was still paying
off my first lawyer, but.

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I always had this mode of be
prepared for battle, be prepared

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for battle, be prepared for court.

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Always have enough money saved for a
down payment or a retainer of attorney.

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And that is just like this armor
that I had built around me.

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That money meant that I could
protect my kids and no amount

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of money was the right amount.

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And you guys, I do really well in my job.

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I still am battling this now of like,
no amount of money is enough because you

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never know when he is gonna come for you.

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That's the psychological abuse I was
enduring all those years, and I didn't

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understand it because I was in such
fight or flight mode during that process.

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I didn't understand how much money
was going out the window and how

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poor I really was, and how much
I was struggling to pay bills.

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And I was, stealing from my neighbors.

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I was stealing wifi and stealing things
from them to like survive in my household.

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And like I did all these ugly,
gross, disgusting financial

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decisions to provide for my children.

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And it's hung with me for decades
because I didn't recognize it

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when it was happening, and I
didn't get help for it until now.

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Even when I'm making money and there's
no concern of threats anymore, it's done.

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That trauma is still there.

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And no one talks about this.

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No one talks about that financial
trauma that you go through when someone

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continually threatens you and it never
stops, and you get a lot of your friends

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and family are like, just enjoy your life.

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You know, go on the trip, spend
the money, and you're like,

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I need money for an attorney.

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I need to be able to defend myself.

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I need to be able to protect my kids.

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So money stops the feeling of security,
like I can't feel secure with money.

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Those two things don't go together.

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I don't feel comfort with money.

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I don't feel stable.

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Money is survival to me and I
can't live without it because I'll

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lose my kids if I don't have it.

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That was like a true feeling I had that if
I didn't have money, I would lose my kids.

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So surprise to me was even after all
these custody battles were over for me.

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That scar just didn't disappear.

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It hung with me.

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So even though I'm able to talk
about my journey and talk about

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this, I still had money blocks years,
decades later, because money just

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had this connection to protection
and no amount was enough because

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no amount of protection was enough.

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That's just a really, it is not even
embarrassing to say, because I know

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you listening are, feeling the same
way that no amount of money is ever

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enough, and it's a lot of the reasons
why you get blocked from having your

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next relationship because you feel
like number one, is somebody gonna

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be able to deal with the amount of
money I have to spend on attorneys?

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Number two, is somebody gonna understand
my theories around money that I have

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to save, save, save, and conserve
because of the just in case moment,

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I'm not living by the moment, I'm
saving for the moment all the time.

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And you don't want anybody to
have to take on the debt that you.

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From this divorce and being
able to pay it off with you.

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So it is a roadblock that nobody talks
about and it's really frustrating to

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me, but I'm working through it now
because my body is what's held onto it.

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So now, all those years that are behind
me, I can logically see it differently,

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but my body still feels a certain way
and I'm in real time when I'm recording

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this, working through it with therapy
of getting my body to feel safe.

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With a certain amount of any
money, instead of being like,

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oh, that's not enough, that's
not enough, that's not enough.

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That is enough.

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I'm comfortable.

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I am safe.

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My kids are grown, my battle is over,
but my body remembers the stress.

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So even though my brain can
logically look and be like,

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we have abundance, we're fine.

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My body still feels
like, but he could come.

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He could come and you better be ready.

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And that is a horrible thing to feel.

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Even when I knew we were done, back
when I was co-parenting, and I'm like,

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eh, you know, the last kid went out
like we were pretty much settled.

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We just gotta ride this out For
a couple years, my body was still

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remembering the score, right?

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That book is a phenomenal book.

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The body keeps the score and my
body had been trained on that.

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There is no amount of money in the world
that'll make you feel safe because he's

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constantly gonna be coming for you.

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And the part about this also is
that nobody really understands.

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The fear that money brings you, like
when you don't have it, there's a fear

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that takes over when you don't have
it, you go into this ugly survival

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mode and you will do things that
your friends and family will be like.

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You did that?

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Yeah, I had to.

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I had no money.

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You'll contemplate doing illegal
things because of the money.

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It's one of the most popular
questions we get is, Sam, how did

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you pay for a six figure divorce?

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I'll tell you, maxed out credit cards.

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Parents dove into their retirement
funds, which I'm still paying them back.

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It's one of those things where
I robbed Peter to pay Paul.

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I did the unthinkable.

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I got different jobs.

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I was distracted by selling
things or having, garage sales.

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I did a lot of stuff, to help pay for my
kids' sports that I'm not proud of and

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or creative things that I am proud of.

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You do a lot of things to survive
this, but it was not pretty.

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I had a savings account when
I got divorced sure as hell.

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Didn't sold things, sold my wedding
ring, sold a whole bunch of things

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to make sure that I could provide
because money meant protecting my kids.

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So I'm telling you, if you're going
through this right now, even once you

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get through this, that scar may still
be there and I'm no therapist, but it is

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something you really gotta pay attention
to because again, my journey is over.

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My co-parenting journey is over.

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My business is doing well.

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We have abundance, but I still have
a trigger with money of there never

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being enough because of the way my
body feels that it's never enough.

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When I see a number, it's not
enough because it wasn't enough

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for a decade, couple decades.

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And so it's really heavy for
you to talk about this with

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people that just don't get it.

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I get it.

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Your therapist will hopefully get it, but
you have to start making small shifts in

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getting your head wrapped into the idea
that you need money for your divorce.

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You need money to raise children.

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But you also need to have some sanity with
it as well, and not make it a consumption

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like I did, where I was constantly
working, constantly trying to earn

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money, constant, constant, constantly.

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Even when there was nothing going on.

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In my case, I was constantly burdened
with trying to find enough money,

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money, money, money, always, because
again, money meant safety to me.

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So a small ship that
helps, is preparation.

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Okay, maybe I have a couple
thousand dollars saved.

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I'm good coming up with a strategy,
documenting what's going on in your

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00:10:20,018 --> 00:10:23,078
case to where you can maybe see
like, will I have to file, oh, I

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don't have enough money saved yet.

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00:10:24,158 --> 00:10:25,238
Maybe I'll save a little bit more.

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Then I'll go file for a modification or a
contempt, but also just making sure your

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00:10:29,891 --> 00:10:31,901
parenting plan is working for you as well.

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Does it say anything about extra
expenses that they have to help on?

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00:10:35,218 --> 00:10:37,528
Does it say details around
child support and when it's due

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00:10:37,528 --> 00:10:38,638
and how it's due and all that?

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Making sure anything tied to money.

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Has details around it in your divorce.

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00:10:44,143 --> 00:10:48,249
It's not up in the air for questioning
or determining or interpretation, like it

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clearly says when money is due and when
it's not due, but also the other half

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of this is working with your attorney on
your bill and understanding what does your

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contract say, because if you've been here
a while, you know that my attorney sued

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00:11:00,993 --> 00:11:03,333
me 30 days after my judgment was put in.

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00:11:03,634 --> 00:11:07,328
So while I was reeling with the idea
that we just spent all this money and

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eight days in court, we got handed 50
50, which is what we were already doing.

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So to me, we spent all
this money for nothing.

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00:11:13,824 --> 00:11:18,114
We got handed 50, 50, 30 days later,
my attorney sued me for the remainder

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00:11:18,114 --> 00:11:20,364
of my bill, which was roughly $13,000.

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And I had to pay it within I think
seven days or I was going to jail.

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Yes.

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And I didn't have $13,000.

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I didn't fucking have $200.

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00:11:29,194 --> 00:11:36,024
So to me, you really have to understand
what your contract says with your

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00:11:36,024 --> 00:11:38,184
attorney on how you will pay your bill.

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Is there interest?

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What are your payments?

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What about when your case is over?

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What does it look like?

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So my traumas aren't just from my divorce
and my ex-husband, it's also from my

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attorney's office on the person that
represented me for years, within 30 days.

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I was just a number to them.

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A means to an end, and that's
it, which created even more

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trauma around my financial abuse.

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So for me, divorce and custody battles
also take a huge financial toll on

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you, and you need to have the ability
to understand it's emotional scarring

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that's gonna happen around money
over time, that you are gonna have to

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untangle along with making sure your kids
don't have those same financial scars

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because of the scars you went through.

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So a part of healing and recognizing
those patterns is giving yourself

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permission to slowly rebuild a healthier
relationship with money, stability,

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and security, because you don't
want that to bleed into your kids.

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So other episodes that would be
helpful for you would be episode

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nine, where we talked about child
support not being the only expense.

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Then also episode 21, where we talked
about hiring the right kind of attorney

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and knowing all those checks and balances
that you really need to look through.

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So if you're in the middle of a high
conflict divorce and custody situation,

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one of the most important ways to protect
yourself financially is to structure

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your parenting plans that you are
not constantly being drug into court.

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So again, my parenting
plan was four pages long.

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We had to go in and out of court to fix
it, edit it, update it, and that cost

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money each and every time we went back.

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So just when I think, okay, we
got that taken care of, woo.

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Start saving for the next time because
without doubt, three months for later,

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three months later, it was always within
three months, he would file a new motion.

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Our parenting plan would be horrible.

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We'd ha something wouldn't be mentioned
and we'd have to file again, which is more

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financial abuse, more financial burden,
more, more finances going out the window.

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It was just this chaos for years because
my parenting plan was written so poorly.

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Now again, did I have to go
to court all those times?

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I mean, yeah, he was the
one filing the motions.

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I could have just been like,
well, whatever you want,

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well, whatever you want.

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I chose to go into battle and to
not give into his motions because I

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didn't think that's what was best.

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So a lot of it is making sure
you understand by education,

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what your parenting plan can do
for you and not work for you.

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But then also really thinking about
should you be asking others to help

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you with this financial burden?

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I was fortunate enough, I had
parents that were willing.

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To cash in part of their
retirement to help me.

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Did they take a financial hit for that?

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Yes.

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Yes, they did.

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Right?

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And so I am having to, for my own
guilt and shame, pay them back because

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that's what I can do now, but I
couldn't do that for a couple decades.

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And so maybe you're asking your
friends and family to help you out

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financially because it is burdensome
what this divorce will do to you.

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and I'll just say this at the end,
it always impresses me how long rich

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people's divorces drag out years, right?

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It impresses me when there's
one party that has money,

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how long this will drag out.

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I used to work at a nonprofit to help
the lower income families with mediation.

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It's amazing how quick
their divorces get over.

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It's amazing how quick the system pushes
them through when they have no money.

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Maybe there's something there.

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Maybe it means when you have money,
people in the system like lawyers and

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judges and mediators and all that, see
that you have money just a little bit.

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We're not talking millions.

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We're talking just a savings account
and they make sure you don't end that

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divorce with that savings account.

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But it's amazing to me how two
people living off the state and

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have no means to ends, their
divorces get through pretty quick.

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And I'm not saying that's a hundred
percent accurate statement, it's just my

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experience with working at a low income.

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Mediation service for free pro bono
to help those clients out because they

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deserve to have mediation as well.

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How fast those got through the system
versus when one party has a little

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bit of coin, all of a sudden now
we're dragging her out and nothing

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can be settled and determined.

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So food for thought, really think about
why your divorce is being drug out.

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Why is it taking so long?

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And for some of you it's because
the people in your case also

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know you can pay the bill.