I don't think anybody's ever ready for a cancer diagnosis, let alone a stage 4 diagnosis. Seems really trivial now, you know, racing bikes in anticlockwise circles. At the time, one of the things that I always used to come back to was it's not life and death. It's just a bike race. And that was what I used to tell myself to cope and to keep the Olympics or the World Championships or whatever it was I was doing, keep it in perspective. And then you throw into this situation where it is life and death.

Welcome to the Breast Cancer Now podcast, providing support and information to anyone affected by breast cancer. This podcast contains the personal stories, opinions, and experiences of its speakers rather than those of breast cancer. Now, today's guest is the sixtime Olympic gold medalist, Sir Chris Hoy. He's best known for his cycling achievements, but for the last couple of years since being diagnosed with incurable prostate cancer, he's also become a voice for the metastatic or stage 4 cancer community. In 2025, he launched the first ever tour, a cycling event that raises vital money for charities, including Breast Cancer Now and Prostate Cancer UK. In its first year, the event raised a whopping 3 million pounds for cancer charities, but it also raised an incredible amount of awareness about this lesserk known stage of the disease. Sir Chris is returning with the second to four cycling challenge in September this year, and he's here to talk to us about the event as well as living with metastatic cancer and why he wants to change perceptions of the disease. Chris, welcome to the podcast.

Thank you. Great to be here.

So, let's start with your life before cancer. So, you'd already retired from professional cycling and you had two children with your lovely wife Sara. Can you paint a picture of what your life was like before diagnosis?

Well, life was just busy, chaotic, like everybody's life, I guess, cracking on with, you know, the day-to-day and focused on all these various activities and various commitments and family life and work and then out of the blue, this diagnosis comes and I don't think anybody's ever ready for a cancer diagnosis, let alone a stage four diagnosis. But yeah, I think in the space of a sentence, your whole world is turned upside down. And I was yeah, I guess immediately it brings into focus what is your priority in life. And it yeah and it brings in the essence of what being alive is all about and what living is all about and trying to really I guess accept it and start finding a way to live with cancer which is easy to say but it's not something that comes immediately and yeah it's my life has changed dramatically since then but in many ways it's exactly the same. You know, I think once you've come to terms with it, and I don't know what your what your take on it is, but I think once you once you accept it and once you find a way to live with it, then it's it's about trying to get back to life and make life as normal as it was before. and finding finding a way to coexist with it and not let it define you and not let it dictate how you feel and how you approach each day. Yeah. I mean everything that you've just said completely resonates with me cuz obviously I'm living with stage four breast cancer as well. Completely different circumstances with you. I found a lump which led to my primary breast cancer and then I 10 years later found out that I started getting bone pain and that's what led to my metastatic diagnosis. Your case was completely different.

Are you able to say what led to the diagnosis in the first place?

Yeah, of course. So I, you know, I well in terms of prostate cancer, my grandpa had it, my my dad's had it, so it is in the family and I was well aware of it and yet I still thought it was like like many men do. You assume it's a cancer that is for older men or for later in life and that it's something that moves slowly and it's something that you will be given warning signs. you'll have symptoms. You'll there'll be early signs. And I was told, you know, the age is always 50. That's the that's the number that you're always told about with prostate cancer. Once you hit 50, start to be aware of it. You know, keep an eye out for warning signs. And I had none of that. So, I was 47 when I was diagnosed straight into stage four. the first thing that I knew was just a couple of aches and pains. I had a pain in my shoulder, a pain in my back, pain in my ribs. I just thought I was getting a bit older and, you know, it was a side effect of just still trying to behave like I was 21, you know, and lifting weights and exercising and doing the same training or similar training to what I was doing when I was you know, a full-time athlete. And this, but yet this pain wouldn't go away. I was getting physio treatment. I was doing all the, you know, the normal stuff to get rid of aches and pains and it wasn't shifting. And I went for a scan assuming it was going to be something like tendinitis or you know just a fairly simple issue and not you know there wasn't even the tiniest hint or thought in my head that this might be cancer. It was it was I literally it hadn't even crossed my mind. And when I sat there and the shoulder surgeons turned the screen around and said, you know, I'm really sorry, but this looks like a tumor. I'm going to pass it on to you know, a different department to do some more tests and to do some more investigation. I was absolutely blown away. completely shocked. Didn't really know what to do. Left the place in a days. Walked back about four miles to my house. and yeah it was that was the moment even then I didn't you know all I was told was that was a it was a tumor and had no idea the extent of it and you know the repercussions or the or what it what it where it had stemmed from and yeah following other tests and other other investigations it was found to be secondary cancer from from pime from prostate cancer. So when you're given that diagnosis, when you're given the stage four diagnosis, the first thing that you know it was it was such a shock and it was so out the blue that you have a very clear image in your head or idea in your head of what a stage what stage four is going to look like and what it means and all that hope is stripped away. And I felt in that moment, you know, that was it. That was the kind of the death sentence, the just there was no possible hope of light or joy or living your life the way that you had done prior to that moment. And yet I do believe it's possible to find a way through that and to find a way to getting back to some sort of normality and finding, you know, a new purpose in your life and appreciating what you already have as well. I think we're so focused, a lot of us, on the next goal, the next thing, the next target, you know, what's tomorrow that we forget to live today. And that's one of the biggest lessons I've learned in the last two and a half years is to try and slow things down a bit and appreciate today and appreciate the smaller things as well. Still appreciate the big things, still look forward to, you know, big targets. And you mentioned the two to four, you know, having things like the two to four to aim for purpose, a new purpose to raise funds and raise awareness and have big things to motivate you, but also don't forget to live in the moment and to just appreciate the here and the now and try not to let little things get to you in the way that they did before before a cancer diagnosis. Yeah, absolutely. And just to clarify to our listeners, we use the terms metastatic, advanced, secondary, stage 4, sometimes the word terminal, although we tend to avoid that. they all mean the same thing pretty much. So that was just to clarify. and you're a professional sports person, an athlete.

As an athlete, you are you learn to you learn resilience. You learn to get back up whenever you're knocked down. You have extraordinary drive. extraordinary positive mental attitude. How has that played into your experience of cancer?

Well, I think you try to I guess everybody when they're given a serious health diagnosis, you're really tested by it. And I think that we all have the ability to deal with with challenges in life, it's only when they're presented to us that we find out we have these the strengths or the resilience to bounce back. And I think a lot of the time we underestimate what we're capable of doing. And you know when you are presented with these challenges, that's when you realize, yeah, you know, I can get through this. I can I can be strong. And often that strength comes from being, you know, a husband, a wife, a mother, a father, having responsibilities, having somebody else that you have to be strong for or a reason to be strong, a reason to keep fighting. And, you know, for me it was Yeah. being a dad, being being a husband, not having, you know, just thinking, well, I'm not going to just lie down and give up. I mean, there's times when you feel like that. I think that's pretty normal, but it's not about, you know, I think people often feel like they're failing or that they're not able to do it. But we all have difficult moments, but it's it's bouncing back. It doesn't matter how many times you get knocked down, you just got to keep getting back up again. And the days when you don't feel like getting out of bed, you just have to go right, you know, this is there's times where it's going to be bad. There's times where it's not going to be great. You can't always put on that face and be super strong for everybody else. But you have to have a reason to get out of bed. And I think for me, it's it's being yeah being that my family being strong for my family, but also the lessons that I've learned from from my sport. I think it's it's not looking too far ahead. you know when there were times where and it seems really trivial now you know racing bikes in anticlockwise circles at the time one of the things that I always used to come back to was it's not life and death you know this race if you don't win this race the world is not going to keep stop revolving you're not you know it's just a bike race and that was what I used to tell myself to cope and to keep the Olympics or the world championships or whatever it was I was doing keep it in perspective and then you're thrown into this situation where it is life and death. But I guess it's coming back to taking it one step at a time and when I was in a difficult stage, you know, training for Olympic games and the workload was huge and you were maybe injured or the training wasn't going so well or your form wasn't great or you were concerned about getting selected or whatever the challenges were. It was about not looking too far ahead and just saying, "What can I do today to be the best I can be to give myself the best chance?" And then within that day, what can I do right now? Don't look forward. Don't don't look too far ahead in the day. Don't look forward to the session this afternoon in the track or even the session this morning in the gym. Just think about what can I do right now. Okay, get out of bed. That's the first thing. Just get out of bed. That's all you got to do. Get those feet on the floor. Get out of bed. Next thing, what you going to do? Have a shower. Get ready. Have your breakfast. One step at a time. And don't think about all the challenges that lie ahead in that day or that week or that month or that year. just think what can I do right now to get through this difficult moment and often it's just getting moving and I find that you know particularly during difficult stages like like during chemo where you're not feeling well and there's points where you feel like it's the cancer that's making you feel unwell but you've got to keep reminding yourself it's it's the treatment that's making you unwell here not the cancer and therefore if you're feeling unwell just think how bad the cancer is feeling right now it's taking an absolute smashing So, it's trying to pivot everything and trying to see, you know, can I can we can you mentally change this into a positive for you and to help you get through this moment. And that's often all you need, just that little moment, get through the difficulty and then the rest of the day kind of becomes a little bit more manageable. That's what I've learned through my cycling and through my sport. And, you know, I try to apply that to my life in general and certainly to my life post diagnosis. Yeah, that's a that's a brilliant a brilliant approach.

Tell us about the tour to four. How did it come about and what is it?

Well, the tour to four is it's a mass participation cycling event. You don't have to be, you know, a mad keen cyclist with all the gear. It's literally for anybody that can ride a bike. and even if you're not well enough or physically able to ride a bike, we have static bikes at the start finish venue in Glasgow at the Veladrome. So, you can sign up for 20 minutes down to just doing one minute pedaling on a bike for one minute. you can still be part of this event. we've got up to 5,000 people taking part this year. The aim was to raise a million pounds for cancer charities across the UK. and we raised 3.1 million which was you know we even the million pounds you kind I came out with the number the figure early on thinking that sounds impressive and then when you start the fundraising process and the logistics of it's actually quite a lot of money to raise particularly in this you know current economic environment where you know charities are are struggling to get funding and to get money it's not an easy thing to do. So this sort of seven figure target just rolled off my my tongue and I thought after a few weeks thinking oh god have I you know built a rod for my own back here. But in the end the efforts of everybody who took part of all the families and supporters of those people they were so incredibly generous and yeah it was a it was a wonderful day. I was a bit concerned that it was going to be sort of emotionally overwhelming with so many people involved. You know, all have their own cancer stories, whether it's themselves or the loved ones or in memory of somebody, but it was it was so uplifting. and I don't know what you how you found it, but it's yeah, to me it felt like we created a community in the in the space of a day and now the momentum that we have, it just feels like it's getting bigger and bigger all the time. And the reason it was called a tour to four was because we wanted to change perceptions of what stage 4 cancer means. And you know, I had this very clear image in my head of what what it what it looked like or what I thought it would look like. But it certainly didn't include thousands of people, you know, riding around in bikes, enjoying life, smiles, laughter, punching back against this, you know, this unfortunate twist in their in their lives. and yeah, it was such a such an incredible day. And I think it's only going to get bigger and better. And you know, we're already ahead of our fundraising targets from last year at the same stage. And there's two main routes. There's a red route which was 50 odd miles and then there's a shorter route which was the blue route which was 30 odd miles. The red route is now sold out, but the blue route is still places. And there's a family loop like a 1k loop where you can ride multiple laps, as many laps as you want with your kids or by yourself. the green route and then we have the static bikes in the track center which are are you know inside develop drrome. You've got people cheering you on. You've got a big screen MC's kind of ging everybody up. in addition to all the cycling and all the physical activity, we had, you know, incredible performances on stage with the Chemical Brothers doing a live DJ set, which was for me as a big Chemical Brothers fan. That was like that's like getting the Beatles down, you know? That was like, if I could have chosen anyone to perform, it was the Chemical Brothers. That was that was to me quite a surreal moment. and I know Tom Rollins. I've known Tom for a while. who's one half of the Chemical Brothers. And I didn't want to I just I couldn't ask him. I was too too embarrassed to sort of put him in that position. And but I asked him along just to take part in the ride because he's a cyclist himself. And it was him. He offered it. He said, "You know, if you'd like, we can come down play if you do a little DJ set." And then he said, "I've asked Ed." And Ed's going to come down, too, so you can get the full Chemical Brothers experience. And there it was. stand, you know, a big crowd in the rain dancing away to the Chemical Brothers. that was one of the highlights of the year last year. Incredible. And it was emotionally overwhelming, but in a good way. I think, you know, there's something about being together with that community, you know, the stage four cancer community, the metastatic cancer community, and all being in the same boat and doing something together that isn't cancer. that doing something together that's you know us being strong and coming together but so you had loads of celebrities taking parts you had Andy Murray Louise Mincen Rebecca Adlington Dan Walker also Derma Mahanhan who is also living with metastatic prostate cancer I've got my medal today and I'm going to be taking part again this year lots of people with with metastatic cancer so you know who who can sign up. Anybody can sign up. That's the point was I didn't want it to be just for cyclists. I didn't want it to be just for people who are living with cancer. It's literally anybody any age. You know, you can bring We had I had my kids there doing the family loop. we had my my auntie who's now in her late 60s, early 70s, I think. I hope she's in her 70s. she she'll kill me about it. you know, all ages, all levels of physical fitness, ability experience. It's just it's a very welcoming place to be. You know, anyone that's got a bike, you can take part. And even if you don't, as I say, you can take part on the static bikes. You can just come down and sign up and, you know, cheer on all these people. We had amazing support in the little villages. So it starts in Glasgow and it goes the route the red route goes up into the campsies these beautiful hills north of Glasgow. The blue route goes kind of not quite as far as that but it's still coming through these little villages and all these crowds came out to support. It felt like the you know the tour to France where all the fans come and cheer on the roadside and I think it's you know cancer it unites communities it unites families unites people because it's it's indiscriminate. It affects everybody and there's nobody I know that hasn't been affected by it in some shape or form to their loved ones or to themselves or to work colleagues or whoever. I think everybody understands what it means and I think people relish the opportunity to do something proactive. You know, when you feel so helpless when someone you love is diagnosed or if you're diagnosed, it's such a you feel like it's happening to you. But I guess doing something like a fundraising charity day, you know, it's twofold. First of all, you're you're fighting back by you're raising funds. You're trying to find trying to support these charities and organizations that are doing amazing things to either find new treatments or cures or to support people who are living with cancer currently. And the second thing that you're doing aside from the fundraising is you're you're changing perceptions of what cancer is and how we can, you know, I guess for me it's in my mind I hope that when the on the day of to the tour to four when it was, you know, on the news and it was on, you know, on the TV, there was somebody that would in the country would have turned on the TV or might have seen it online that week. They might have been given that diagnosis and they might be in the depths of that really dark time where you're you're you're sort of in still in shock. You're still coming to terms with it and you see this event and you think, well, hang on a minute. A lot of these people that are riding these bikes are, first of all, they're riding their bikes. You know, they're out physically active. They're they're taking part in an exciting fun event. They have smiles on their faces. They're they're getting on with living their lives. and that was very, you know, that was contradicting in my mind what initially what I thought stage 4 diagnosis would look like. And so I guess part of me it's to prove to myself that, you know, I want to keep living my life and getting the most out of my life for as long as I can for hopefully a long time yet. But I want to show other people that, you know, it's, you know, none of us live forever. That's a fact. We can't change that. Life is finite. And you know, you have to accept that no matter who you are, no matter what your health situation is, but I think it's just it draws it into focus when you're given a, you know, a stage four diagnosis that do you know what? This is life right now. This is life today. And yes, there you can have big plans and exciting things to look forward to. That's that's really important, too. But don't forget to live for today and to make the most of it and to Yeah. to try and appreciate the moment. Yeah. So the event this year is on the 6th of September. It if you go to tourfor. com, you can see which which routes are still available to sign up to. The red route, I believe, is already fully subscribed, but there's still plenty of other options to get involved with. And yeah, it's once you've once you've signed up for it, then you set up your GoFundMe account and you choose which charity. We've got five main charities that are going to be receiving the all the funds raised, but you can also nominate a cancer charity within the this there's about 100 odd charities that you can choose one that's really close to your heart that's that's that means something special to you. But the five main ones that we're raising funds for are Breast Cancer Now, Prostate Cancer UK, McMillan Nurses, Maggie's Oh, and Cure Leukemia. Yeah, they're they're new on this year and yeah, we're really really proud and pleased that they're they're taking part as well and they're they're going to be a big part of this year's event. And if you like, you can do like I did, which was I am not a cyclist. I have a static bike at home. So, I didn't know what I was capable of. So, I did the blue route last year, which was the second hardest, but I'm doing the red route this year, and I'm Oh, brilliant. I'm I'm blaming you or I'm giving you the credit.

how did you find last year?

What was your So, if you're not a cyclist, so for people that aren't cyclists and maybe are put off by all the Lycra and the carbon bikes and all the jargon and equipment, how was it for you? What was your experience of it? Yeah, it was brilliant. I took my husband with me, so he cycles and he makes me a bit less afraid of the roads. and he cycled for prostate cancer UK and I cycled for breast cancer now. So, we're a duo and yeah, it was fantastic. you know, it's there's nothing scary about it because you're in a group of multiple cyclists like you never lost outside in the in the countryside or anything like that. I found it absolutely doable in terms of the hills and the length of time we were cycling for. You've got your pit stops with these snacks. you've got the wonderful com camaraderie with with other people. yeah, it was just a brilliant event. And you know, I always find with these things, the adrenaline and the crowd support gets you through it. So, yeah, it was entirely positive and uplifting. That's great to hear. Yes. As you say, that the adrenaline and just the atmosphere gets you through it. It's not a race, so you don't have to go any faster than you want to. You can stop. You can get catch your breath. You can take your time on it and enjoy the whole thing. But the roads do the campsies are amongst the most beautiful in that part of Scotland. so it's yeah it's well worth the effort and I think you I think you'll be well I know you'll be fine but I think you'll actually you'll be glad you chose the red route this year. I already I already am glad. Yes.

You were saying before so one of the things about the event is it doesn't just raise all this incredible vital money for cancer charities. It also raises awareness about stage 4 or metastatic cancers and what what that means because a lot of people when I said I had secondary breast cancer, a lot of people just don't know what that what that means and part of the reason for that is we've got multiple different terms for it. what do you want people to know about incurable cancer?

It's a really good question. I and I was one of those people that didn't know. it was kind of explained to me in words of one syllable basically told you know you have incurable cancer it's treatable but it's incurable so yeah in that space of you know one sentence I felt like all my whole world being turned upside down all hope had been taken away and I guess it's kind of up to you to rebuild that hope and to find a way forward it's there's no easy way of hearing that information and getting your head around it. But it takes it takes time as a kind of grieving process. I think you're grieving the life that you thought you know you thought you had ahead of you and how it was going to pan out. But none of us none of us know what's coming tomorrow. And that's not a morbid thing. It's it should be a positive thing to remind us to bring us back to enjoying today and freeing ourselves of a lot of the things we worry about. Actually, do you know what? No one knows what's coming tomorrow. So enjoy today and make the most of it. In terms of the terminology or what stage four means. yeah, I guess stage four or metastatic metastatic it's it's spread from a primary source. It's it's spread around the body. It's not something you can ever truly get rid of. you can, you know, get to the stage where the scans are clear, which is amazing if you can get to that point, but it doesn't mean that they're not going to come back. It means well it will come back at some stage, but it's about controlling that and finding ways to live with your cancer and to try and not let it dictate who you are and not let it be the first thing you think about in the morning when you wake up or the last thing you're thinking about when you go to sleep at night. And I feel that took me probably about six months, maybe maybe more. I don't know. It's I think it's not a sudden day where it stops happening. And there's times where it's, you know, scan times, blood tests, medical meetings, it comes back to the surface. Those feelings come back to the surface when you walk into the oncologist office. It's not a nice feeling, you know, waiting to get news about whatever the latest state of play is, but I feel that you stage four to me is yeah, essentially this is something you will live with for the rest of your life. We don't get to choose what happens to us in life. Nobody does. But we can choose how we respond to those situations. And that's something I repeat to myself and remind myself when it's difficult. You know, you have to understand what you control in life and what you don't control. And if you're still fighting against the things that are out of your control, then you're never going to be happy or you're never going to be settled. You're never going to be able to make the most of whatever situation you're in. Doesn't mean that you just lie down and let things happen to you. you know, you still fight for yourself and you still fight for your situation, but recognizing what you, you know, you can't stand outside and shout at the weather cuz it's not a good, you know, there's things you can't change. and you have to accept them and this has really brought that into focus. I don't know about you when when you were given I know your yours was kind of it wasn't a straight to stage four and diagnosis but one of the difficult things for me in the early days when I went public about my diagnosis is everybody's trying to be positive and trying to say to you ah you can beat this and you know you don't worry you can you've got this you can beat it and you don't want to keep coming back to you well technically I can't you know but I think people try people always try positive and they always try and give you information and oh, you know, have you read this article or have you tried, you know, this remedy or this or that? And it's people just want to try and do something to help you and offer some some kind of positive support. but it's not always helpful. There's times where it's it's almost unhelpful, but you have to remind yourself when they do, it's coming from a place of love. It's coming from a place of positivity. They're trying to help you. but yeah, it's I guess it's an acceptance of what the diagnosis means, but also recognizing, do you know what? I'm going to rage against this. I'm not going to let it define who I am. And in doing so, you know, I'm hoping it's going to demonstrate that to other people. And they say you should embody your philosophies. You shouldn't explain them. And, you know, yes, of course, you can explain it. But I think the best thing you can do as somebody living with stage four cancer is to demonstrate to others, this isn't going to define me and this isn't going to stop me being who I am. It's a challenge and it's something that is part of my life now, but I'm going to keep doing as much of what I did before and living the life the way that I want to and appreciating the day and trying to Yeah. trying to choose to put on, you know, a positive spin on whatever I can in any situation. And that doesn't mean that I've, you know, I sit here saying these words and if somebody's listening to this that's that's in a similar situation and they be thinking, well, I'm not doing that and I feel like a bit of a failure because I can't do that every day. I don't want people to think that's what I'm doing 24/7. There's times where it's really hard and there's times where you aren't able to put a positive spin on the situation and bring yourself back to the moment. You do look to the future. You do worry about things and you are fearful of things. But I think it's totally normal that it's not I'm not saying that you should never feel that way, but it's about being able to turn that around and bring yourself back as quickly as possible. And often that's leaning on your your loved ones, your people close to you. and sometimes it's it's doing that yourself. The battle with cancer, I think, is often, you know, it's up here. It's in your it's in your mind. It's in, you know, your state of mind. and that to me more than the physical side of it is the biggest challenge. But it's the one thing that you do have control over. You have control over how you're thinking and how you're you're perceiving a particular situation. So it's training yourself and repeating to yourself through the difficult times all these little mental mantras or tricks that you that you can to get yourself through that moment and knowing that moment won't last forever. The way you're feeling right now, it won't last forever. good or bad, you know, it's you will get through that moment and you will you will change how you feel in this pretty soon. It's a cliche, but having cancer is a roller coaster. You have these moments where you can't imagine you're ever going to get out of the dip and you have other moments where you're just on top of the world when things are going well and you appreciate life in a different way. Everything just seems heightened. I remember you know going through that phase of trying to appreciate everything around me and you know enjoying you know to an extent that wasn't sustainable. everything was such a an intense experience because I kept feeling this could be my last day you know in the early days of diagnosis I was so so much in the moment that it was almost too intense. so that you find a happy medium. You find a way to live that is appreciating the moment, but also trying to keep things as normal as possible and go on and live your life the way you were before in many ways. I completely relate to so so much of that. In fact, I was listening to a podcast with Tracy Emmen yesterday where she was calling it a second life. She was saying it's like having a second life, a second shot at life. And I actually feel like I've had three lives because I've had the before cancer, the between primary and secondary cancer and then the post metastatic life. But you know everything you were saying there in the first six months of diagnosis you do wake up every single day and sometimes every single second you think think things like I'm dying and someone makes makes a joke like oh I'm dying because they they're dying laughing and you think no I'm actually dying. But if you are, and we are both very fortunate still still to be here, and I know it's not the case for everyone, if you're fortunate enough to have your treatment work and still be here, you do get past that and you do come to a point where you don't wake up every single day thinking about cancer. You don't wake up every day thinking, I've got incurable cancer. and then as you said, you can't control cancer with your mind alone, but you can control your thoughts and your mind with with your mind alone. and maybe sport, maybe exercise is something that can allow you to feel in control when you can't be in control of the cancer. Your comment about exercise is actually a really important one for anybody listening to this that's, you know, perhaps in a similar situation. If you could, you know, if you could make exercise in a pill form, it would be hailed as a miracle drug. And there are numerous studies to show the beneficial effects of exercise on, you know, the efficacy of medication, time to relapse, all these different things that it and aside from the mental benefits too. And it's yeah it's something which you know that there's scientific proof to show all this but it's something that I and I think a lot of people go well that's fine you're an Olympian you've done lots you know it's been part of your life forever what about you know my dad who's in his 70s who's just been diagnosed with prostate cancer who hasn't been to a gym in his life or you know you don't have to do crazy you know amounts of exercise this is simply thing you know for this the studies that show this the benefits of exercise it can be as simple as 20 minutes of exercise three times a week. So going for a walk, getting outside three times a week if you have cancer, that can have a huge positive impact on your treatment and your state of mind. And it's and while you're outside as well or while you're exercising, I think you're it's easier to be more present in your life and to focus on the exercise, focus on your breathing, focus on the effort you're doing. And it does for me, it feels like you're punching back. It feels like you're actively doing something that's helping. And I always finish no matter what I was doing, no matter how tired I am, no matter how exhausted. And during chemo, I was I did something every day, even if it was just literally 10 minutes just just turning my legs on the bike, lit, you know, barely touching the pedals. It was more the symbolic feeling of I'm doing something to fight back against this. Excuse me. But yeah, exercise is hugely important.

I just wanted to ask you about your approach to nutrition after your incurable diagnosis because obviously as an athlete, as a sports person, you probably have a quite a rigorous approach to eating. Just wondering if there's anything you could share with us.

I eat rigorously every day. That's Me too. Yeah, it's funny because it's, you know, it I've always felt like I've been fairly in tune with my body and I've been aware of things and that was why it was almost such a shock when I got my diagnosis that I'd missed this. in terms of diet, in terms of nutrition, I've always felt like I've had a pretty balanced diet. You know, I ate a lot when you were when you were training and competing, you know, six six and a half sometimes 7,000 calories a day just to maintain your your body weight because you're working so hard. Following retirement from sport, I still was very active or still am very active. And I've always been, you know, I've never had any crazy diets or fads or really extreme stuff. It's always been very, I guess, quite sensible, quite balanced, basic things like hydration. Really important to stay hydrated. Trying now to be more mindful of processed foods. you know, not that I had that, you know, my diet's been pretty reasonable always, but I'm fearful of getting drawn into too many of the, you know, there's so many different, oh, you know, I get messages and again, going back to saying people, it's coming from a place of love or positivity. people are trying to help you by saying, "Oh, this is, you know, I've heard of this diet or my, you know, my friend or my relative or whoever has has got cancer and they've started drinking this juice or taking this supplement or doing this and it's now getting they're now getting better or they've been cured or whatever." And it's people are just trying to find something to tell you to help you. often it can be yeah they were also getting treated with you know the standard treatment as well at the same time but they assume that this is the one thing that has made the difference. Yeah. And but no I'm not having a go at anybody that's trying to help other people but I guess I'm mindful of not getting drawn down to anything too extreme. making sure it's not going to be counter productive or affecting you know your medical treatment which is can happen certain supplements can you know impact on your medical treatment. So I guess I'm hydration fresh fruit and vegetables trying to eat lean meats and lean lean proteins but it's also making sure I have enough energy to do all the things that I want to do. So, when I'm out riding my bike and doing, you know, 100 mile rides, you have to fuel yourself really carefully to make sure you don't run out of energy. but it's I think it's there is a temptation to just change everything. And I think that often it's just about making small changes to your life, healthier choices, but still having treats, doing things. You know, I think there's a lot of people with suddenly go right, I've got to change my whole diet, change everything. And there's certain things that they particularly enjoy eating or drinking that they stop. And I think you know what life you've also got to enjoy your time as well. It's, you know, it's it's getting a balance. I think the balance is the best word to remind yourself when you're living with cancer is look after yourself, maintain a really healthy diet if you can, exercise, do all the right things, but also do a bit of the things that you might not enjoy that diet that much, but throw in a few little treats every now and again, things that you appreciate and that are special, but yeah, if they're not good for you, don't have them all the time.

Is there anything you know now that you wish you'd known before your incurable diagnosis?

Well, I think the most basic one would be that you prostate cancer can come earlier than the age 50. You know, men are, you know, I had a message from a guy recently who's 40 who has had metastatic prostate cancer. which is very young, but it shows it is it's possible that it can come that soon, particularly if you have family history. So, I wish I'd known to be more aware you know that it was a high a high risk and that you will not necessarily have symptoms or any warning signs. So, for me it would be be aware of that every I think every man should understand their own prostate cancer risk. You can do that by going very easily by going on to online and just googling prostate cancer UK risk checker and there's like three questions takes 30 seconds. you will basically get a low, medium or high risk assessment and then if you're high risk you can go to your GP and discuss it further. So simple blood test a PSA test would have saved my life if I if I if it had happened earlier. So I think that's the first one is awareness of you know doesn't even have to be changes in your body. Awareness of risk is really important. knowing your family history of all kind types of cancers, discussing it with your GP, knowing these things. before my diagnosis in terms of how I've perceived it or how I've dealt with it, I'd love to say that I wish I could have just not spent so long feeling so sad and grieving that kind of life that I thought you know you thought you had ahead of you and how it was going to pan out. But actually, I think you have to I think we all have to you can't speed that process up. you have to go through it to understand it and to fully accept the situation. and it, you know, during that time you feel like you're you're just an observer. The world's passing you by. It's everything is for everybody else. You know, you feel like you're just, you know, feels like you're on a holiday and it's that last day on your holiday. You're about to get packed up to go home and you think, "Oh, well, this, you know, I can't really this last day in this place. it's all about getting your bags packed and you're going to be heading home tomorrow or today. Whereas in, you know, it's another day of holiday. Enjoy it. And I think when I've got I got through that initial phase, I think looking back now, I would say to myself, just, you know, it will get better. You will you will feel differently about this. your your diagnosis isn't going to change, but your perception of this diagnosis and your ability to deal with it will change and you will you will find a way through. But it's going to be tough and it's going to be hard and it's it takes a huge amount of effort physically, mentally to kind of get yourself to the point where you feel like you are able to live life normally again and to appreciate it. But it is possible. So no matter who you are, don't underestimate the strengths that you have that you that are maybe latent that maybe you haven't used or you aren't even aware that you have. This will bring out the fighter in you. And don't be afraid to lean on people. Don't be afraid to have bad days, difficult days. It doesn't mean you're failing. It just means that you're you're in a dip. But by definition, a dip will will come back out and that trough will disappear and you'll come back out of it. But you just have to batten down the hatches, hang in there when it's tough, and have have a bit of hope. And I think one more thing I would say which I've has really helped me, I think it's putting faith in the medical science and the amazing things that are happening right now. And every single pound that you raise for a lot of these charities is going towards finding new treatments. So they're they're not going to find might not find a cure for your cancer or you know within your lifetime but they might find a new med medication which will extend it a year, two years, 5 years, however long and then you jump onto that new medication and in that 5year period perhaps another medication pops out that gives you another extension and you know so I guess it's it's saying do you know what do what you can to help these people to help these these amazing brains that are coming up with new new treatments and new medicines. And yeah, also I think just for me when when you're given the worst possible news and you're confronted with the worst case scenario, I think you also have to look at the best case scenario. You have to look at okay that we I know what the worst case scenario is. That's that's very clear. What's the longest that somebody in my situation has ever lived for? you know, I want to know what that figure is. And then you start to get because you get given all these, you know, the prognosis and you get given life expectancy and all this stuff. And it's very easy to get drawn into that figure. But I think if you do your own homework and find out, well, how long has what's the longest? Then then you might have a different perspective on it and think, well, I'm not saying that necessarily is going to be me, but it's possible. Yeah, there's a chance. and also the longer the longer you can hang in there, the more chance new medication is going to potentially pop up and appear. So yeah, I would say any and also again about a sixpronged response to this question. Any oncologists or anybody working in cancer care dealing with patients directly, I think you can't underestimate how important it is to be positive and not to I think doctors and anyone anyone in working in that field is so afraid of giving false hope and promising something. Do you know what? I'd rather have that than have somebody greet me with a sad face and, you know, downturned, you know, just a demeanor of, oh no, you know, I'm really sorry and this is this is not good news. We know it's not good news, but I want to know that you're in my corner fighting my fighting for me. Yeah. And you're going to do everything you can within your powers. And you know, when you give bad news, always give something else that's positive to finish it off with. So, you know, for example, you know, the scans aren't great or the bloods aren't great or I'm really sorry. This is this has, you know, gone further than we hoped. However, this is the plan. Yeah. We've got a plan and we're going to fight this and we also have a plan behind this. And I think it's just it's never letting the patient go away feeling as if well I'm on my own here and it's all a bit hopeless and I don't really know what's going on. I think you need to have to feel as if someone is just there absolutely punching your corner for you and that bedside manner and that attitude and that positivity can have a really big impact. It can really help if you have somebody that has that kind of I'm with you on this and we're in it together and I'm going to do everything I can to give you the best chance. Yeah. Thank you so much for the sixpronged response which I really appreciate. It's like the you've got the six gold medals. You've got to respond with six six reasons. thank you. Thank you for all that hope and motivation which I know will help so many people. Thank you for also sharing the risk checker which is really important. And speaking of the dips and troughs and the every pound raised, how can people get involved in the tour to four? Well, thank you. Yeah, they can get involved by going to tour. com and you can sign up. You can take part in the event. If you're not available on September the 6th, if you can't get up to Glasgow then just any support if you can donate. There's a donation link on there. And we're determined to, you know, having already hit a pretty high bar set a pretty high bar last year with the 3.1 million. We have to beat that this year now, don't we? So you know, that's we need everybody to get involved, to donate, and to try and make the tour to an even bigger success this year. and to know that every single pound is going to make a difference, you know, whether it's for helping patients who are going through a cancer diagnosis right now or for future treatments or future medications that could, you know, improve the life expectancy of people with stage four cancer or find a cure. You know, I mean, we all moan about AI and the worries about what AI are going to do to humanity and to society. I think a lot of those are quite justified. But equally in a positive context, AI is going to rapidly speed up the process of new treatments and medical science in general. So things could rapidly improve and rapidly increase in terms of the pace of new breakthroughs thanks to AI. So every pound that you donate will be helping in some shape or form for current or future cancer patients.

And if people take away one thing from this episode, what would you like it to be?

I think for anybody, because it doesn't matter what your current health status is. I think for anyone listening to this, try to appreciate the moment. Trying to appreciate today that right now as you're sitting listening to this podcast, remind yourself this is life right now. And it's, you know, tomorrow no one knows what's going to happen tomorrow. It's an arbitrary thing. The future doesn't exist. It's all we have in life is the present. The past is gone. The present is everything. And you still should have targets and aims and goals and exciting things to look forward to. But don't forget to live in the moment. and often worries, anxieties, fears, it's just us trying to predict the future and we have no control over that. So let it go. Live in the moment. appreciate the small things and yeah, good luck.

Absolutely. And I would add to that, this is the Breast Cancer Now podcast and I would say if there's something you want to do in your life, do it now. As you say, there's there's no point waiting for some future that may never come. Absolutely. Absolutely. And it's Yeah. All these things should be seen as a positive and not as some kind of oh god, you know, no one knows what's happening tomorrow or in the future. It should be a positive. turn it in a positive way and go, you know what, is isn't it amazing that we're here?

You know, the chances of us being that one little swimmer that made it to the egg. I don't know how many millions or billions to one. The chances of you being that one. You were here. You're born. You were born into this world. We're all so lucky to be here. So, make the most of it. And yeah, as you say, if you got something you want to do, make it happen.

Sir Chris Hoy, thank you so much for joining us on the Breast Cancer Now podcast. You've been amazing. Thank you so much. That was great fun. If you enjoyed this episode of the Breast Cancer Now podcast, make sure to subscribe on Apple Podcast, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Please also leave us a rating or review on Apple Podcasts and perhaps recommend it to someone you think would find it helpful. The more people we can reach, the more we can get Breast Cancer Now's vital resources to those who need them. You can find support and information on our website, breastcancernow.org. And you can follow Breast Cancer Now on social media @BreastCancerNow. All the links mentioned in this episode are listed in the show notes in your podcast app. Thank you for listening to the Breast Cancer Now podcast.