00:00:00
Speaker 1: Period of Essendon, the specter of James Hurd, the Essendon person, the exhaustive process. These are all bold, broad concepts that we will be discussing again this week on the cod AFL Show. I'm joined by Dan Cherney and Scott Going, gentlemen, another big week at Essendon.

00:00:17
Speaker 2: Solid week. Damn, I mean gift that keeps giving for us. I mean they're dragging their feet. But James Hurd is a front and center.

00:00:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's I suppose been allowed a bit of a blank canvas because no one else wants to put their hand up and everyone's been scared off and John long Wire is leaving everyone guessing as to his intentions. And you know, the likes of Ken Hinckley and Adam Simpson have said not for me, thanks not certainly not for the time being.

00:00:40
Speaker 4: Well, well, James.

00:00:41
Speaker 3: Hurd is still in the mix. It's been an extraordinary political exercise. I've got full respect for the Herd camp for just the way, whether you like James Hurd as a coaching candidate or not, the way it's been played out is chef's kiss.

00:00:58
Speaker 4: It's been beautiful.

00:01:00
Speaker 3: My view is that James Hurd is I don't think he's the best candidate per se. But unless it's John Longmeyer, I don't know how they can give it to anyone else because anyone else is going to be looking over the shoulder with large swathes of the fan base and also of the political beasts that emanated around the Western Football Club wanting James Hurd. So I think John long Wi is the only one with the gravitas to other than picking a current AFL coach. And they're not going to be being Chris Scott to replace his brother, who has the standing of the game. To suppose put James Herd back to size.

00:01:38
Speaker 5: We are in step.

00:01:39
Speaker 2: It rarely happens in this newsroom, Edward that I agree totally.

00:01:42
Speaker 1: Can I just interrogate John Longmyer has more gravitas than a Ken Hinckley would can can be looking over his shoulder if he was taped, Yessen and John.

00:01:50
Speaker 5: I think Kim could handle it. Kim could handle it.

00:01:52
Speaker 2: He's because he's been there, done that, and just his personality the way he kem could handle it. But I don't know whether Ken he's desperate to get back in and Essendon would be. I think he's more Tasmania liking the media, Whereas I think Longmire has had a year out and clearly from what all the information we hear, is wants to get back in. So I think those two could handle it. But I'm with Dan. If they put Adam, who's a you know, a Josh Carr for those types, straight back into Essendon, it's just Brad. They've tried to get the new blood. The new blood was Brad Scott. Didn't work, John Worsfold, Matthew Knights, it didn't work.

00:02:33
Speaker 5: I mean, we've got to understand this club.

00:02:35
Speaker 4: Is what it is.

00:02:36
Speaker 5: It's not changing so good better otherwise.

00:02:40
Speaker 3: I mean you touch on the Ken Hinckley think there's no more political club I think than.

00:02:44
Speaker 4: Port Adelaide some of the bizarre.

00:02:45
Speaker 3: I mean he lived with the whole tread row thing and exactly so I think Ken is Ken could handle it in himself. But it's just would he be set up to fail and I think just the gravitas. Ultimately, Ken for ally achieved a Port Sarah and I didn't make a Grand final, so you lack that premiership gravitas and Longwy's played in a coach in five Grand finals. Although I was joking with a couple of ston people that you know, there's a pretty strong uncle James heard because he's never lost a Grand Finals coach, where as long as lost four.

00:03:17
Speaker 5: But the other one, I think the lazy narrative.

00:03:19
Speaker 2: I'm not lazy, but yes, he hasn't been the coach's block for a decade. But I could tell you that a lot of coaches don't focus on the game plan, the data analysis, all that sort of stuff. That's why you have assistance. So I'm not as I think the detractors and there are plenty, and there's various other lines you could detract James here. But the eye hasn't been in the hot seat for a decade. And we wrote about today like you get two or three smart assistants around you, James is there to motivate managed plakator, like this job's not just the x's and o's, And I think that's how Sin has to look at it. It's too easy to go. He hasn't been the hot seat for a decade, so I can't do it.

00:03:58
Speaker 3: If the Barcelona Olympics was the dream team and then James heard one point, oh at Essendony ten eleven was the dream teams, just make this the ninety six Atlanta Games dreams, we're.

00:04:07
Speaker 5: Going all over again.

00:04:08
Speaker 2: So I just think that's just a lazy way of approaching. I mean, basically, we've got a sort out. If they're going into process, I mean Andrew Welsh, I think enough time. He wanted to give it a week. I get that, But otherwise we're going to have backpage leads every day.

00:04:22
Speaker 4: So please don't stop.

00:04:22
Speaker 2: Actually keep it going, of course, but just go right. He's in the pro as he should be in the process, and the process involves this. I don't think they should talk to fifty coaches. I don't think essen and Carlton might do you with that. I think Essenon it should be we've got six guys we've spoken to, and herds one of them and then work it out.

00:04:41
Speaker 1: James It's spoke with plenty of gravitas on his show Footy Classified again last night. It's the weekly time that we hear from him. There's some really good insight into his TV strategy and the way that the media was a shaping up over Herd's push for this job on the Integrity Unit podcast, which you can find on.

00:04:57
Speaker 6: Code Sports and other places at your podcast.

00:05:00
Speaker 1: But in terms of his recruiting a team, and he was challenged on your story Scott last night, he said he did not formulating in his head. He basically said he went to bed dreaming of his of his dream team. He'd been preparing for this moment for thirty five to forty years, he said.

00:05:16
Speaker 5: Oh, the second coming. No, he's played it smartly.

00:05:18
Speaker 2: I mean he knows he can't go in head to head with a current assistant and go I know the game, So he has to come armed. And if he comes armed with if I'm on board, you get X y Z and I think you get him him developments your problem. I bring Brenda McCartney, Dyson Hepple's ex Skipper. I can bring him and I'll have two or three assistants. Mark Mvay's a good friend. So it all makes sense. And I think it's a smart play because, as we said, he goes head to head in an interview about the game styles the modern game. I'm still saying he knows the modern game.

00:05:52
Speaker 5: But you know what I mean.

00:05:53
Speaker 2: I mean he's got to come armed with something else and he's ace up his sleeve. As a team.

00:05:58
Speaker 1: Your stories for us to find at the moment, mart Who's ruling themselves in and out of team herd rather than the actual race for the coaching job. Are you with team heard? Have you declined his approach? That could be the story. Another thing that has been bubbling away and was first reported by cal Toomey last night was that Essendon has opened up negotiations with the AFL for draft assistance.

00:06:19
Speaker 6: It's a very murky.

00:06:20
Speaker 1: Clubs like to approach the league just the first ask can we ask for this? And then the league will give them like an early indication of whether they want draft assistance. Then the process moves further along from there that what do you think about our secret herds?

00:06:35
Speaker 5: Then what do you think?

00:06:37
Speaker 3: Look the thing about it, there's nothing against Essendon for asking, because that's just that's the way these things are done. And if you just before I make my main point, if you put Essendon up against the claims of West Coast or North Melbourne or Gold Coast or Carlton or Brisbane over the last decade, I think Eston's sacks up pretty well. Haven't won a final in twenty two years down the bottom the ladder, yes, people say, oh well they haven't had all these missteps, but most of the clubs. You only really end up in this spot. Yes, there's some systemic disadvantage that might hurt you, but you generally only end up in a spot where you are talking about help if you've made some missteps. And obviously the saga was the main one, but then you've had various recruiting issues like you know, when they hold a dyll and shield, Jake Stringer, Adam Sad Devin Smith just hasn't paid off poor draft picks. It's their own doing, so leave that to one side, whether they deserve it per se. But the whole idea that clubs need to make a presentation to get a draft pick is just the biggest waste of time and just it is one of the stupidest things in football by so far, it's not even funny. I mean, so are we saying that they're going to be sitting their AFIL house and Essendon are coming to come with a PowerPoint presentation or a flipbook or whatever it is, I don't know, an Instagram real these days for those who you know, show how rubbish we are a younger pid Yeah, oh, look look at all the games we've lost, Like what the AFL can't just look at the stats from the last five.

00:07:56
Speaker 5: They don't get well.

00:07:58
Speaker 3: I just think that the should every year have a review if they believe that there should be some some of equalization mechanisms over and above the ordinary mechanism, which obviously change you to year. Anyway, because of the to and fro about academies and draft picks and father sons able to say, hey, Eston, we think you deserve extra assistance or you don't. No one should need to go cap in hand. Not that it's humiliating for the club, which it is, but that's not even the point.

00:08:22
Speaker 4: It's just a.

00:08:23
Speaker 3: Waste of resources and it's just such a ridiculous process.

00:08:26
Speaker 4: I just can't fathom it.

00:08:28
Speaker 2: What about the gripe which every club and every sport are the draft. We've got to get the draft closer to being a real draft. Okay, ah, another assistance, Sorry you gotta. It's just it goes against all those strategies which we think the AFL are trying to implement. I'm against it because of yes, you've lost all these games, but yes you draft all these bad players, Yes you did this from so why.

00:08:52
Speaker 4: They need Well, the why is because of all these other clubs.

00:08:55
Speaker 5: When you get rid of Zach Merritt last year. You're in the draft, you've got to have this.

00:08:59
Speaker 3: They've got to decide is this something they're going to do ongoing going forward or they're just almost on an amnestey.

00:09:04
Speaker 4: That's the end of assistant packages. There's nothing more.

00:09:07
Speaker 3: But having said that, I'll say that in the next administration will come in and I'll bring it back. I mean, look that maybe that's why you asked, because you don't ask, you don't get.

00:09:13
Speaker 4: But to me, it's just a fascical process.

00:09:15
Speaker 6: So I've leaked.

00:09:17
Speaker 1: They didn't actually leak it to me, but West Coast presentation of the AFL last year would have included that they had won nine games in their last three seasons three twenty five.

00:09:25
Speaker 3: They actually spent three days on AFL tables just counting them the nine games.

00:09:29
Speaker 1: They had finished in the bottom three for four consecutive years. They ended up with an end of first round pick, so that was picked nineteen and four extra rookie spots for the next three seasons, and the AFL reserved the right to review those. So if West Coast went gang busters next season and maybe eight, the AFL might go, hey, guys, you got to the list four rookies like you're out of You're out of time.

00:09:48
Speaker 2: Laws of Yeah, the game has good teams and bad teams, and Essenden's been bad by their own doing for a decade and they'll find a way.

00:09:56
Speaker 3: I want some killed to have a retrospective package for the first one hundred years the club's history.

00:10:01
Speaker 1: This time two years ago, Essendon was second on the ladder, So that's the thing that sticks with me and will fell off during the bar rounds, but round eighteen twenty twenty four they were still in the top four.

00:10:10
Speaker 5: That won't be in the power point.

00:10:12
Speaker 1: Another thing that clubs will do on an ad hoc basis in the AFL, other than asking for a draft assistance packages, is sell their home games. And Dan Melbourne's had the wind knocked out of its sales two years in a row. Now with this Alice Springs home game, they're both games. One was against Sint Kilda last year. They probably would have won that on the MCG. I reckon the way they were going gws this year, it's hard to argue they wouldn't have fared better on the MCG. What do you think of continuing to sell this game? And how it's affected the demons.

00:10:39
Speaker 3: Oh, look, I mean I think in this particular instance, it's very hard to argue. Now, I know they got touched up in the end, but they kicked very inaccurately and Giants very accurately. Look, we can never know the counter factual, but you know, all we know the facts that Melbourne are unbeaten on the MSAG this year.

00:10:52
Speaker 4: They are in the mix.

00:10:53
Speaker 3: Well, they had been sort of hoping a top six spot which now probably more probably more back in the wildcard mix now obviously long still to go in the season. They've handed the Giants, who are one of their competitors for those spots, a victory by by playing that game.

00:11:07
Speaker 4: Well it probably helps that that cause by playing the game in other springs.

00:11:11
Speaker 3: Look, they get a lot of money from it, at seven figures or so, they're about million dollars.

00:11:15
Speaker 4: I get it.

00:11:15
Speaker 3: But it just entrenches the haves and have nots, because look, I think Geelong at the best, Geelong has the best way of having its cake and eating it too. Here they get ten genuine home games because no one else plays games, and Gelong they got one at the MCG Collingwood does the difference between.

00:11:33
Speaker 5: Colin been away games at your home game at your home.

00:11:35
Speaker 3: True, but Collingwood most of them when they play teams at the MCG, five or six of them teams that also play routinely at the MCG. I agree with that, Whereas if you're Geelong, you're playing ten outright home games and then you're playing another six or seven at the MCG where you play routinely anyway.

00:11:50
Speaker 4: So I think if you look through history and then you look at that, I'm not having to go to Geelong.

00:11:54
Speaker 5: Yeah.

00:11:54
Speaker 4: But the point is that if you look through history.

00:11:55
Speaker 3: The one team who has made their home away from home, well a couple, but the major one is Hawthorne made it a fortress.

00:12:01
Speaker 4: But that's because they were playing there four times a year. They are a very good teams through that period.

00:12:05
Speaker 3: But if you're playing there regularly, then you can make it a fortress, you can get used to playing there. If you're only going once a year, you're not building any huge homebread advantage. The Sons of Sons have done a bit in Darwin, but they have the issue when they come back and they're talking about even stripping that back a bit. There've been a lot of examples through through the last couple of decades.

00:12:21
Speaker 4: Where teams of solo games.

00:12:22
Speaker 3: Richmond infamously to Cans lost that game to Carmichael Hunts and the one the previous year the Saints through myriad venues China dating back to Long System. They even Brett Ratten's last year they lost by one point to Port Adelaide and Cans. So there's a lot of examples here, and I think for Melbourne's it does hurt. But there's a chance that if they played this, if they took this game back, they wouldn't actually be playing but the g.

00:12:43
Speaker 4: They'd been playing in the Docklands.

00:12:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean, Devil's advocate, you're taking football to areas that love it, don't see enough of it tick and the money, I mean that's the fact. I mean, in particularly Melbourne, sponsors like dripping a million dollars out of somewhere else they can't do.

00:12:58
Speaker 5: So I don't think.

00:12:59
Speaker 2: It's a's gone away, to be honest, and I think every coach and football department just cringes, but suck it up and get it done.

00:13:06
Speaker 1: I think you have to consider the trip this year of failure just because they couldn't get out into the community either. McFarlan reported last week that the dip theory outbreak that they couldn't go in. They were told by the AFL's medical boss not to put on any clinics, so they didn't really get the outreach impact that they would have wanted out either. So yeah, that thing with Marvel Stadium though, is important. I think the mcg tenant clubs don't consider much of those Marvel Stadium home games. That's why Richmond has sold games to Hoe, but over the next two seasons they don't want to play those games at Marvel.

00:13:34
Speaker 6: So I want to watch as we move forward.

00:13:37
Speaker 1: He Dany had a busy night last night with the news that the Melbourne Stars and Melviourn Renegades are winding up as identities in the BBL. Eddie McGuire was very flat about it. You spoke to him. He was obviously behind the Stars initially got them entrenched at the MCG won a lot of Collingwood supporters across from the footy side of it, looks like we're going to lose a pretty important association.

00:13:57
Speaker 4: It's been a big week in franchise cricket.

00:13:59
Speaker 3: To borrow a phrase from Eddie, no yeah, interesting their ramifications from footy. Look, there was a big move made in twenty nineteen when they cricket Victoria brought to the Stars and the Renegades boards back in house and it dissolved the boards and you know they became both run and I think history does not look at that change very well.

00:14:22
Speaker 4: There were several key Apel.

00:14:23
Speaker 3: Identities involved in both clubs, obviously, any of the being first and foremost. But you know you've also got Jason Dunstall, one the greatest goal because of all time, who was chairman of the Renegades for a period.

00:14:32
Speaker 4: So too James Brayshaw.

00:14:33
Speaker 3: Before him, obviously ex North Melbourne chair and prominent AFL broadcaster Leam Pickering player agent who had been on the Renegade board and it was a very good cricketer himself, and I think that.

00:14:43
Speaker 4: That has been a misstep.

00:14:46
Speaker 5: So yeah, I don't know.

00:14:47
Speaker 3: I'm interesting to see what sort of affiliations these clubs will have with footy. I mean, there's a lot we've got coming up next year. The big tension piece around the fixture actually Lauren and I reported yesterday around this fixture for clash coming up late in the season with the Bank sh test and around twenty three to twenty four tests, so.

00:15:06
Speaker 2: Ugly, what is this always going to happen? It's good that it's happening. Now you agree with it, disagree.

00:15:12
Speaker 4: Been on the cars for a while. My gut is I I think, I think I agree with it.

00:15:18
Speaker 3: I think in the end it's probably a good thing to have one main Victorian brand and the other it'll end up being.

00:15:26
Speaker 4: I think.

00:15:29
Speaker 5: Not sure.

00:15:29
Speaker 4: I'm hoping the bush Rangers. I'm not sure they're gonna bring them back.

00:15:31
Speaker 3: Of course they are talking about that, but I think it'll be a bit.

00:15:36
Speaker 4: Like Melbourne Victory in Melbourne City.

00:15:38
Speaker 3: That's probably Victory, who is sort of the local, locally owned team wearing the big V so to speak. City is the foreign owned franchise, globalist sort of team. Clearly they'll try to tap into the South Asian community, which is obviously very significant from a cricket perspective.

00:15:53
Speaker 4: So look, it's gonna be interesting.

00:15:56
Speaker 1: And I just want to get your tips on some eight point games that we got this weekend. So Adelaide Gelong Thursday Night, Adelaide over, what are we thinking?

00:16:03
Speaker 2: No eyes at rank and the thrill seeker means Geelong for me, but I think ad Laida going to come good.

00:16:10
Speaker 5: But that worried me.

00:16:11
Speaker 6: A thrill second meaning Raleghilthorpe for anyone who's we.

00:16:16
Speaker 3: Don't you nickname Scotty and Eddie not just kidding, no we do.

00:16:20
Speaker 4: Yeah, glean for me.

00:16:21
Speaker 6: To and Melbourne Collingwood King's birthday.

00:16:24
Speaker 2: I think Melbourne on the nose a little bit. I think they had that amazing start and Collingwood played well last week. I mean they can't kick a goal to save themselves, but this will be one of those wetty stark, gloomy you know, ten goals to nine and I think they'll win.

00:16:40
Speaker 3: I'll give my tips generally about one point five seconds thought before each tip.

00:16:43
Speaker 5: In this pine you're not supposed to say that, and this was.

00:16:46
Speaker 3: And this one I gave it about probably five seconds, which is more more than most.

00:16:50
Speaker 4: I really I tossed.

00:16:51
Speaker 5: A bit here.

00:16:52
Speaker 3: Melbourne if gone to the head, but it's it's it's tight.

00:16:55
Speaker 6: Yeah, its interesting one Melbourne.

00:16:57
Speaker 1: I think I think the Monday afternoon game will feel a bit like a Sunday afternoon game one that we didn't touch on North. Melbourne sold those games to Wa so they're in Bunbury this week against Freemantle. They're back to Perth next week against West Coast for another home game. They're five and six at the moment, the seasons on the line. How do we think they'll fare in Bunbury against the Dockers.

00:17:13
Speaker 2: Not well, but i'd want you'd want to win the next one. Look fra Mantle flying. I don't think they're going to have the banana peel game over in the West against North to improving.

00:17:23
Speaker 4: But it did work quite well for North last year. They ran they actually ran forever.

00:17:28
Speaker 3: It not that it matter really so far down the ladder, but they ran for every closely in that home game and they did beat West Coast.

00:17:35
Speaker 4: Else it's a disaster agree with that.

00:17:37
Speaker 1: Well, Big Round thirteen coming up. This has been the Code AFL Show. It's been great to have you with us. You can follow on all our footy coverage on the Code AFL and Herald some websites