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Speaker 1
I am sick of living in a neurotypical world. If you are neurodivergent. Here are the ten survival tips that you need to know in order to get on in this place that wasn't built for your brain. Welcome to late bloomers, where we are getting our.

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Speaker 2
Lives together.

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Speaker 1
Eventually. Thank you for not whispering. Brought to you by our amazing sponsor, Loop earplugs. This is big. Huge. I haven't got any cards.

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Speaker 2
Do I not need any cards? You don't need any. You're taking. Come full, come full ownership.

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Speaker 1
Full fluff roll.

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Speaker 2
Yeah.

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Speaker 1
Yeah.

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Speaker 2
You're just owning it.

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Speaker 1
I'm owning it.

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Speaker 2
Can I contribute, though? Or is it just the you thing? Today?

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Speaker 1
I got ten things.

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Speaker 2
Oh, of course.

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Speaker 1
You okay? This is like, how to survive, right? In a neurotic world, if you are neurodivergent. Love that. It's a manifesto. Yeah. It's the ten things that we've learned over the last five years. Being engrossed and absorbed in this world of neurodivergent listening to our community all boiled down to ten rules.

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Speaker 2
Commandments.

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Speaker 1
The didn't I call it that.

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Speaker 2
The Ten Commandments.

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Speaker 1
Neurodivergent ten commandments. Are you ready?

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Speaker 2
Yes.

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Speaker 1
Number one.

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Speaker 2
Yes.

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Speaker 1
Protect your energy like it is gold.

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Speaker 2
Oh, I'm so good at this. It's harder for you. Yeah. X people pleaser over here. Yeah. Really took a toll on your energy levels, right? Yeah. And now you say no.

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Speaker 1
It's saying no. It's not making plans. It's understanding that, like, our energy really fluctuates in a way it doesn't seem to or at least neurotypical expectations like 9 to 5 job. And then you relax at weekend. Then you see friends reply to text every day. There's all these expectations. It doesn't work for us, and the world will not protect our energy.

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Speaker 1
We have to do it literally. Your energy is gold. It's like the highest valuable resource that you have. And if you try and live the neurotypical way, you'll lose all of it. You'll go bankrupt.

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Speaker 2
I also think just around saying no and stuff is leaving things early. If you want to like I do.

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Speaker 1
It's wherever your energy is being taken away and you haven't got it to give. It might be as simple as you're at a family barbecue and after an hour you've had enough socializing and you want to leave.

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Speaker 2
I've got a question, though. Go on. So for you to be able to do that, you need to have an awareness of your energy levels in the moment. Yeah. And that's easier said than done when you're in the moment. Like you could inadvertently overextend yourself energy. Like stay around a group of people for far too long, do too much people and then be wiped out for two days.

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Speaker 2
And my other point? The little ADHD check is you also need to be able to predict future energy levels. So like when you say yes to making plans and and think about future you, which you do find quite tough.

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Speaker 1
Yeah, I often will say yes to something in a good mood and then regret it. Hey guess what? Cancel plans, change plans. Make it more local to you. Make it a video call. Like, stop extending yourself to meet the expectations of the world. You don't want to have to have three days in bed.

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Speaker 2
No.

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Speaker 1
After something. So. Yeah. By the way, I don't get all of these right. Neither do you. But we are going to try and live by them. So that's protect your energy like gold.

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Speaker 2
Commandment number one.

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Speaker 1
Number two. Customize your environment.

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Speaker 2
What?

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Speaker 1
Stop living. Breathing, existing in spaces that don't make you feel good and calm. Inside the house and outside the house. Inside the house. We don't have any big lights anymore because both of us are a little light sensitive. There's no big lights. There is like warm mood lighting. There's blue LEDs for nighttime, and that makes us feel.

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Speaker 2
All red depending on the mood, you know? Wink, wink.

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Speaker 1
So customize your environment at home. Do you get really hot in bed? Have a fan?

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Speaker 2
Yeah.

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Speaker 1
Light sensitive. Don't have any lights. Need a nice smell. Have a lovely candle. Like. Make your home a calming, beautiful sanctuary. It isn't only home. It's also when you leave the house, you are going to be wearing loop earplugs if you come to one of my gigs.

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Speaker 2
Yeah.

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Speaker 1
Do anything you can to make your environment as comfortable as possible.

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Speaker 2
I couldn't agree more. And actually, you know, that's our sponsor getting a little early shout out. You'll hear more about that later. But but legit ear plugs are life changing for me.

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Speaker 1
Yeah.

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Speaker 2
Or if I'm not wearing them sometimes noise canceling headphones.

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Speaker 1
Noise canceling headphones all the time. It might be fidget rings.

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Speaker 2
Oh yeah.

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Speaker 1
That people need it might be having a cap if you don't want to be seen or wearing comfortable clothes, it's you shopping and buying 50 t shirts at Hollister. So that's all you have, wherever you can add comfort into your environment. You do it.

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Speaker 2
So yours is listening to stuff, isn't it? Whether it be music or podcast, that you will picture yourself as a main character in whatever song or whatever you're listening.

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Speaker 1
To, really do that anymore?

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Speaker 2
Well, okay, what I am saying is if you leave the house without your music, you don't like it.

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Speaker 1
I like music, I like podcasts. I like comfortable shoes. I will never wear high heels. Basically customize everything. Be comfortable.

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Speaker 2
Love that.

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Speaker 1
Are you ready for the third rule?

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Speaker 2
Come on.

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Speaker 1
Master, the art of strategic masking.

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Speaker 2
Master the art of strategic masking.

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Speaker 1
This is used for safety, for social situations, for important goals. At home. With our people, with our crew. We want to unmask. We want to get to know who we are, where we've been faking it so we can stop burning out so we can live authentic lives. However, there are times when you will have to mask and it can be really important for your work, your reputation, maybe even your friends and family.

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Speaker 1
Master the art of strategic masking. Where are you willing to turn it on a bit for it to help your life?

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Speaker 2
I think there's different degrees of masking as well, because if I think about what I'm like at home with you, I'm like a weirdo. So are you. We will make weird noises. We'll dance randomly. If a if a theme to a show comes on, that's quite like we'll be dancing in bed and doing like we I don't like.

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Speaker 2
So even to my closest to family, I'm not like, a super weirdo all the time. And I say that in an endearing way. I love the weirdo. But yeah, there's different degrees of masking. There's. Am I in a professional corporate environment? Am I with close people so I can be myself and unmask? But I'm not. I'm not turning full weird yet.

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Speaker 2
And then. So I reckon I've got three.

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Speaker 1
Yeah. No, I think that's good. Have different levels that you're willing to move through and move into so that you can achieve your goals. So that can have good relationships. And also always make sure if you have had to mask up, you've got recovery time because you're going to need to protect your energy.

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Speaker 2
I think the best bit of advice on this whole number three is like, be conscious of it. So like know when you're doing it because then you can compartmentalize. You can then know that you might need a bit of rest later on, because you've been masking for a long period of time or whatever. So many years, so many neurodivergent people mask subconsciously because they try and fit in and they don't know when's off and on and all that sort of stuff.

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Speaker 1
Yeah. So it's putting you back in control. Yeah. No. Right. I'm asking up now because I need to do this thing for work and I want to give this impression. Love it. Masking off. Going home. Okay. Number four. Are you ready? Honor your need for both deep focus and deep rest.

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Speaker 2
Yes.

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Speaker 1
So if you look at the sort of way the world works, there's an expectation of just like constant mid-level productivity.

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Speaker 2
Or high level.

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Speaker 1
Or high level, constant productivity. We don't work like that. It isn't a constant. It's a wave. There's going to be days, weeks, months, minutes of incredible work and hyper focus. Then there's going to be days or weeks of rest where things don't move, where things might feel like they stagnate, where your foot is off the gas. It has to go like that.

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Speaker 1
That's how you do your best work. If you never allow yourself to deeply rest, you'll never get that deep focus.

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Speaker 2
And I think as well, in the society that we're in, certainly now, the internet is full of how to be the most productive all of the time. And it's such a joke. Like I saw a joke clip. I thought it was funny, but I saw a joke clip and I'm not being mean. But it was about diary of a CEO and they were like, oh, we got we got Hughes for free because they had sponsor, which was great.

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Speaker 2
But then we realized that the three minutes it took to drink it was getting in the way. So we just tapped it into our veins and stuff like it. So it was funny. It was a joke, but like, the internet is crazy.

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Speaker 1
Yeah, it will make you feel like if you're not grinding 24 over seven burning out, that you can't have success. And I'm not saying don't work hard. No. If you own your at a virgin, you are going to lock in in a way that not many other people can do. But you have to have those evenings, those days, those weekends of deep rest, or else you will burn out.

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Speaker 2
On busy days where you're locked in, you will work from ten in the morning till midnight. Yeah, nonstop. But then you'll need most of the next day doing nothing.

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Speaker 1
When I'm on tour, I'm working every single day. And then I need a week in bed. When I get home, you just have to have an eye on the top of the wave and the crash, and make sure you're getting a bit of both. Love it and don't feel guilty about the rest. The rest is a weapon. We need the rest.

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Speaker 1
Yeah. Okay. You ready for the big old number five? Yeah. Oh, redefine success on your own terms. That's both your career, your relationships, your life. Neurotypical success is like one ladder going one way. Like going up. Yeah. Get a job, get a promotion. Do the training. Become regional manager. Like keep going. Keep earning more money. Keep growing milestones.

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Speaker 1
Get a partner. Get married. Get buy a house. Have a kid in your 20s.

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Speaker 2
What I complete this is really close to my heart, because I was on the corporate ladder for 20 years, and I became, I became societal expectation of successful and actually redefining success. I used to be like, it's easy for somebody like that's successful to say, but when I left the bank for the first couple of years, we had loads less money, but I would I, I was happy because it was fun.

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Speaker 2
It was different. It was we had more freedom, like, oh, it's not all about.

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Speaker 1
So that's it. Like success isn't always stability, longevity, growing finances, success can be joy, fun, freedom. Yep. Flexibility. So it's understanding what do you value and bring in more of that into your life. Also relationship milestones. If you haven't met the one in your 20s, it doesn't matter whether that's the partner or a job. Experiment a bit. Get around like learn and live.

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Speaker 1
Yeah, do you know what I mean?

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Speaker 2
I do. Well, we were 35 when we when we met. Is that right?

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Speaker 1
I mean, that sounds bloody young to me now. Yeah.

00:13:16:00 - 00:13:16:21
Speaker 2
Yeah, I mean, it.

00:13:16:21 - 00:13:51:14
Speaker 1
Is, it is, it is anyway. Yes. Redefine success. And before we get on to the next one, a quick word from our gorgeous sponsor. We are incredibly lucky on the Late Bloomer podcast because our sponsor is the amazing Loop earplugs. If you are neurodivergent, there is a high chance that you might be sensitive to sound. That can mean that going out to a restaurant can be full of distractions, and going to a gig might actually be physically painful for your gorgeous little ears.

00:13:51:14 - 00:14:14:09
Speaker 1
And luckily for you, there is a pair of loop earplugs for all of those things. We have put our favorites on our website with loop earplugs, and you can find it in the show notes of this episode or in our social media bios. Every single one of our listeners gets 20% off, and we really hope that you enjoy it.

00:14:14:10 - 00:14:22:10
Speaker 1
Right back to the manifesto. Number six, stop apologizing for existing.

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Speaker 2
Yeah.

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Speaker 1
Or just being you. Okay, so whether it is an ADHD person that feels they're oversensitive or they're struggling because they're losing things, that they've forgotten something, or whether it's an autistic person that has to leave the barbecue early, you haven't got to be like, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. I'm I'm being rude. I'm so sorry. That's like, you know what?

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Speaker 1
I'm I am sorry. Here's why, but I love you. Let's go. Like, you haven't got to live under shame.

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Speaker 2
Humans like not stop apologizing is good advice for everyone. Neurodivergent people do it far more. But like, it's even on its simplest level, like I heard someone talk about. It was another social media video. You can tell what I do with my time, but there's this clip of someone speaking through the concept of he was just standing on a pavement, someone was walking.

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Speaker 2
He moved out the way and said sorry at the same time. Like what? What are you saying? Sorry for guys out here just apologizing for existing. What?

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Speaker 1
You're divergent. People do that all the time because we live with this low level, constant guilt that we're failing at being normal members of society. So you're sorry? Sorry? You're afraid of your own shadow? No, actually, you don't have to be like, yes, sometimes you might need to explain your struggles. Yes. Sometimes this situation may happen when you need to say sorry, but not every day, not shoulders slumped in shame.

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Speaker 1
You are great as you are. You're wired a bit differently. You're going to show up a bit differently, and you're still going to do amazing things. You don't need to apologize for just.

00:16:09:22 - 00:16:10:11
Speaker 2
Existing.

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Speaker 1
Existing. Completely and being a bit strange. The strange ones.

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Speaker 2
Yeah.

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Speaker 1
Aren't they? They're really just amazing. I think it comes down to understanding that neurodivergent is not a character flaw. Yeah, it just is. Neurodivergent. Yeah. Why would a wonderful. Okay. Number seven, are you ready? Set boundaries. Like your sanity depends on it because it does.

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Speaker 2
I mean, this is quite closely linked with energy levels as well isn't it. But it also it could be people pleaser. Like it's not just about energy. I guess it's about honoring yourself without sounding to.

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Speaker 1
I love it when you're saying there is an expectation.

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Speaker 1
In the world that we are constantly available.

00:17:05:22 - 00:17:13:20
Speaker 2
Yeah, well, in fairness, if you go back five years, I was you literally were always available.

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Speaker 1
Do you need me tonight when I travel on a train? Don't worry. I'll fly over like my needs. Bottom of the pile. Your needs. Top of the pile. Even simpler than that. That's a deep, weird people pleaser thing that I've been in there before is the expectation to constantly text back and forth. Like every day they text, you must reply like that is so draining and it's so damaging because you just end up in constant shame.

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Speaker 1
And by the way, when we say like set boundaries, that isn't texting your best mate, I'm setting a boundary that I will not be replying to. Your text like that is not how to do it, but like be real, be human. It's like, hey, just so you know, I love you to pieces. I'm a bit of shit on texts.

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Speaker 1
I always hear if you need me, I'll always be here. But I may not be day to day.

00:18:09:19 - 00:18:12:19
Speaker 2
Maybe don't say I'll always be here. I'll be well.

00:18:12:19 - 00:18:29:04
Speaker 1
No. If. If I got a text from from any of my mates that were like emergency, I need to speak to on the phone, it doesn't matter what I'm doing, it will cut through. But that day to day. What are you up to? How you. I can't. Yeah, it would be a full time job. That's a small example.

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Speaker 2
Too much responsibility, isn't it?

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Speaker 1
No. Bound is. You've got to keep yourself safe. Keep on trucking.

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Speaker 2
I love the sound effects. Yeah, yeah.

00:18:39:22 - 00:18:55:15
Speaker 1
My manifesto sound effects. Okay. You ready? Number eight. Embrace radical self-acceptance, which is also like, stop trying to be neurotypical.

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Speaker 2
Yeah.

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Speaker 1
It's probably like, the best advice you could ever get is stop trying to be like them.

00:19:02:13 - 00:19:08:10
Speaker 2
Well, you're never going to. You're just going to be exhausted if you do and fail.

00:19:08:11 - 00:19:10:10
Speaker 1
So you'll burn yourself out.

00:19:10:12 - 00:19:11:06
Speaker 2
Whilst failing.

00:19:11:07 - 00:19:36:21
Speaker 1
Whilst failing. Yeah, that sounds rubbish. So to the ADHD as you probably aren't going to be the most organized, most on time people in the world probably aren't. To the autistics, you probably aren't going to maybe be the most social and life and soul of the party. Oh my god, who cares? There's so much other stuff you can do.

00:19:36:22 - 00:19:46:12
Speaker 2
Well, you were interviewed not long ago by someone. I saw the clip of it and your advice was just like, double down on the things you are good at.

00:19:46:14 - 00:20:10:15
Speaker 1
This at Download Festival. Yeah. Someone said, what's the number one advice? Double down. If you are neurodivergent, you will spend your whole life trying to be neurotypical and it's wasted time. You'll burn out and you will fail. But when you claim back that energy and you pour it like fuel on a fire, things you're already good at. But you can do some epic stuff.

00:20:10:16 - 00:20:11:16
Speaker 2
Yeah.

00:20:11:18 - 00:20:21:23
Speaker 1
Like in ways that other people won't be able to. So it can be beautiful. But you got to stop trying to like, fix it, get rid of it, hide it.

00:20:22:01 - 00:20:31:19
Speaker 2
You'll be a ball of anxiety as well. We know people that are nerdy virgin that just forced themselves into being and they're just not healthy. Are they all happy?

00:20:31:23 - 00:20:53:16
Speaker 1
No. That's it. Radical acceptance. And that's uncomfortable. It is going to look like feeling awkward, being weird. Is it okay to say this to my partner or wear this or not do that or not want to follow it as standard. But it's a beautiful journey and it will set you free in the end. Okay. Number nine, are you ready?

00:20:53:17 - 00:20:54:24
Speaker 2
Yeah.

00:20:55:01 - 00:21:28:05
Speaker 1
Build neurodivergent friendly routines. And funnily enough, cracking back to your lad Stephen Bartlett on here. I've written no rigid mornings and just flexibility. So again, the neurotypical world is like, do the same thing every day. That's success. That's routine. Wake up at the same time every day. Go to the gym at the same time every day. Eat the same thing, then do the to do list, then work.

00:21:28:07 - 00:21:31:01
Speaker 1
But that doesn't work well.

00:21:31:03 - 00:21:40:21
Speaker 2
Bit of a challenge on this one. It could depend on your specific flavor of neurodivergent, because autistic people might absolutely love that.

00:21:40:22 - 00:21:48:14
Speaker 1
So what would be for you? Like a neurodivergent friendly routine for a morning?

00:21:48:16 - 00:21:55:22
Speaker 2
Mine is the opposite. Mine would be protecting my routine in the morning and not letting anyone derail it.

00:21:56:03 - 00:22:03:03
Speaker 1
Because you need your pants. Maybe it's like depending on your neuro type.

00:22:03:05 - 00:22:03:21
Speaker 2
Yeah, yeah.

00:22:03:22 - 00:22:26:11
Speaker 1
You build a routine that doesn't shame and works for you and is lovely. Yeah, that's kind of the important thing, isn't it? Yeah. And it isn't that yours is never going to wake up at five and do two hours of workout. Like, it's not that there's still a lot of comfort. You love a lay in and like not having an alarm, loving the lights.

00:22:26:12 - 00:22:39:03
Speaker 2
You make the coffee though. Now, Bobby, don't you? I that routine. I know it's not my routine, but it's so like my routine of my coffee in bed with dogs been out. He comes and has a cuddle. I have the iced coffee. I like a dream.

00:22:39:04 - 00:22:45:16
Speaker 1
So we do actually have a rigid morning routine, but it just isn't. Wake up at half one and go to the gym.

00:22:45:17 - 00:22:48:17
Speaker 2
What? It's forged out of fun. Rather than.

00:22:48:18 - 00:23:02:01
Speaker 1
I go down and make iced coffees, feed the dog and then he comes up and cuddles you. You drink our coffee in bed and my routine is don't even talk to me about anything. To have work until my coffee has been drunk. Yeah, and I protect that.

00:23:02:01 - 00:23:08:11
Speaker 2
Sometimes I, I make a mistake and try to. And you look at me like, what are you doing?

00:23:08:13 - 00:23:22:20
Speaker 1
There's coffee in this cup. I'm not ready. That's just our wonky way of doing it. But whatever your routine is, routine isn't something to shame yourself by. Failing. Routine is there to support.

00:23:22:23 - 00:23:25:23
Speaker 2
Make your own one. Whether it's flexible or inflexible.

00:23:26:04 - 00:23:37:11
Speaker 1
Does this routine support you? Cool. It's. It's a routine you should pursue. Does it make you feel like a constant failure? No. Then it's not the point of a routine.

00:23:37:12 - 00:23:38:19
Speaker 2
Yeah. Like it?

00:23:38:21 - 00:23:49:04
Speaker 1
Write your own routines. God, I just feel the manifesto energy flooding through my veins today. Are you ready for number ten? It's the last one.

00:23:49:06 - 00:23:54:03
Speaker 2
Hey, yeah, I am, it's sad. It's come to come to an end so quickly.

00:23:54:05 - 00:23:57:11
Speaker 1
Are you sarcasm? Are you.

00:23:57:13 - 00:23:59:22
Speaker 2
Like, in a playful way, right?

00:23:59:24 - 00:24:04:07
Speaker 1
Okay. Nothing.

00:24:04:09 - 00:24:08:03
Speaker 1
Find your people and build community.

00:24:08:05 - 00:24:26:14
Speaker 2
Well, I love it. And actually, the beautiful, beautiful thing about this one is you probably don't need to try that hard for this, because neurodivergent people flock together and, like, just go towards that. I would say.

00:24:26:15 - 00:24:35:22
Speaker 1
I think it's so funny when someone gets late diagnosed in a friendship and then all the other friends are like, that's. But I'm like that.

00:24:35:24 - 00:24:40:08
Speaker 2
It's or someone saying like, oh, I'm there. But all my friends and I wrote a version.

00:24:40:09 - 00:24:47:22
Speaker 1
Like, oh, that's like the first warning sign. Well, that was you like your entire partner and kids and friends.

00:24:47:24 - 00:24:49:00
Speaker 2
And you.

00:24:49:02 - 00:24:49:22
Speaker 1
I'm the partner.

00:24:49:23 - 00:24:50:14
Speaker 2
Oh, yeah.

00:24:50:20 - 00:25:25:04
Speaker 1
Silly belly. But yeah, living in a neurotypical world. And I can, like, laugh with joy now because so many of our friends work colleagues are all neurodivergent. They're all weirdos, like, in the best way. But if I go back 15 years, it wasn't like that. And when you're deeply ashamed of who you are and when you're masking, you actually feel completely alone in the world, but you feel like you're the only one that struggling to stay on top of the housework or remember birthdays or open letters.

00:25:25:04 - 00:25:52:11
Speaker 1
You just feel like this big old lonely loser. And it is so sad. And it actually causes a lot of mental health problems. So like, don't. You're not meant to go through it alone. There is all these awesome weirdos out there struggling with everything that you're struggling with. I love it so much. You know, in terms of building community, obviously we've got our gorgeous online spaces, but my favorite one is our Derby community.

00:25:52:12 - 00:25:53:13
Speaker 2
Yeah.

00:25:53:15 - 00:26:17:11
Speaker 1
Like and it blows my mind. We have a Facebook group for anyone that doesn't know. We run a body doubling app called dubby. Eight live sessions every day where we just come and clean our houses together. It's just beautiful. And we have a Facebook group, thousands of people in there, and people just share their cleaning victories or they ask for help or people will join and say, I'm so ashamed, here's my room.

00:26:17:11 - 00:26:30:16
Speaker 1
It's so messy. Hundreds of people don't feel shame. This was me to like. The moment you see your struggles reflected in somebody else, you actually start to just feel like it's going to be okay.

00:26:30:18 - 00:26:31:09
Speaker 2
Yeah.

00:26:31:10 - 00:26:33:04
Speaker 1
That's why it's important to build community.

00:26:33:05 - 00:26:37:14
Speaker 2
I'll be honest with you. The last things that you were saying. Yeah, I was listening.

00:26:37:15 - 00:26:38:15
Speaker 1
Okay.

00:26:38:17 - 00:26:42:17
Speaker 2
But before that, you said we are living in a neurotypical world.

00:26:42:18 - 00:26:43:02
Speaker 1
Yeah.

00:26:43:03 - 00:26:45:04
Speaker 2
And it made me think of the song.

00:26:45:10 - 00:26:51:22
Speaker 1
We are living. Yeah. Neurotypical. And. And you're a divergent girl.

00:26:51:23 - 00:26:58:00
Speaker 2
That was going over and over and over in my head, and you were talking about something else. I was like, oh, no, stop thinking about this.

00:26:58:00 - 00:27:01:24
Speaker 1
No. What a perfect way to end.

00:27:02:00 - 00:27:05:04
Speaker 2
I knew I could rely on you to get the melody right as well.

00:27:05:09 - 00:27:11:08
Speaker 1
Oh, yeah. I'm gonna be singing that all day. I know, are you a.

00:27:11:10 - 00:27:11:23
Speaker 2
Well.

00:27:12:00 - 00:27:34:23
Speaker 1
I want to sing it again. But I've immediately forgotten. If you are living in. And you're a typical world, and you and you're a divergent girl, it's going to be okay. We love celebrating weirdness here. And wow, that was it. That was our ten rules for surviving and Euro. Typical world. We hope it's been helpful. We want to hear what rules you've got.

00:27:34:24 - 00:27:43:09
Speaker 1
What have we missed out? If you've enjoyed it give us a like. Give us a follow. Give us a subscribe and we will see you back again.

00:27:43:09 - 00:27:44:07
Speaker 2
Next week.

00:27:44:09 - 00:27:45:06
Speaker 1
Next week.