Anne Genduso: What if you got a job interview, saw the recruiter's face, heard

their voice, and none of it was real?

Welcome to Nothing Felt Wrong.

I'm Anne Genduso, and if you're fascinated by stories about scams,

deception, and manipulation, take a seat next to me at the Side Eye Society.

Job scams used to be easier to spot: a salary that was way too good to

be true, a sketchy email address, an interviewer who wouldn't get on camera.

But with AI, that's all changed.

Now, scammers can clone voices, deep fake faces to impersonate real people,

and they can even create what feels like a completely legitimate job interview,

all to fool savvy job seekers who are already on the lookout for fraud.

So what happens when you can no longer rely on your eyes and ears for proof?

Today, we're talking with Marc Anthony Dyson, founder and writer of the Job

Scam Report, about how AI is changing job scams and how to know what's real

when almost anything can be faked.

Welcome, Marc, and thanks for joining us today.

Mark Anthony: Thank you, Anne, for the invitation.

Quite honored that you'd ask.

Anne Genduso: Yeah, All right, so over the years, you've done a lot

of writing about jobs and careers.

So how did you become the job scam guy?

Mark Anthony: Because at that particular time when I started to notice a

pattern, I was doing a live show with my great friend and Forbes contributor,

writer friend, uh, Jack Kelly,

Anne Genduso: OK

Mark Anthony: and I was also doing one with my mentor, Damian Birkel.

It was near the end of the pandemic in twenty twenty-two But I was definitely--

I was feeling the pulse of what was going on in the job search landscape,

and what I was noticing were people started to complain about job scams.

I started to get messages about them.

I don't know why they chose me, but they did because a lot of people were looking

for advice around that particular time.

There was a lot of turbulence that was beginning to happen in the job market.

That's when we were seeing job hopping a lot, and they were getting scammed.

I think that's part of the reason why it became at scale at that particular time,

but not as noticeable as the next year.

Anne Genduso: Hmm.

Mark Anthony: I was beginning to follow it and even mentioned it on a couple

of our live shows at that particular time, and, you know, just watching it.

But I knew, having been in the game for a long time, job scams have happened.

Job scams have taken place in various ways.

in two thousand and thirteen, it was a lot of older people who weren't

internet savvy or who were just getting on the internet, and they were getting

phone calls, and so they were easier to spot when you heard the stories.

For this one, I noticed that there were some really smart people getting up in the

Anne Genduso: Yeah

Mark Anthony: and it was happening to even a few people who were tech-savvy.

I said, "This is strange," so I'll start to talk about it.

So I start talking about it more, and more people start to ask me,

and I began to watch for the next two years until twenty twenty-four.

I was saying, "Hey, these things are happening on a regular basis."

And people were like, "Yeah, yeah, yeah." The other misconception is people thought

it was just to the US job seekers when it was happening all over the world.

that's how I followed the trail.

I start with one thing, start to hear what people were saying, what

people were telling me, and it began to turn into something else.

So

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: became very interesting how all of it's just transpired until now.

It's still surging, and the scams are becoming more sophisticated

and very hard to tell for somebody who's not expecting to see them.

Anne Genduso: Yeah.

That's, it's so true, and it's, it's funny.

You mentioned a couple things there.

One was the misconception that, it was maybe people who are older or people who

weren't as tech-savvy, and they're the ones that are getting caught up in scams.

But, I've been noticing, and I'm sure you have, too, right?

That especially the job scams, man, they're so sophisticated, and you throw AI

into the equation, and it can fool anyone.

tell me of like what you've been hearing and what you've been seeing about that.

Mark Anthony: Well, there's quite a range and quite broad, and to

knock it down to simplicity, a lot of these surround impersonation.

Anne Genduso: Mm.

Mark Anthony: In other words, it's a bad actor who's

pretending to be somebody else.

They pretend to be companies, they pretend to be recruiters, they're

pretending to be career coaches, they're pretending to be hiring managers.

They're just pretending all over the place.

So of course, that everything has to do with imitating something

else that appears weird.

one lately is they've gone back to what they used to do, is since people are being

educated on online scams, these can happen without even having a LinkedIn profile.

All they have to do is get the right person and get to point

to somebody who is a legitimate recruiter or hiring manager, but they

don't have to hijack their profile

Anne Genduso: OK。

Mark Anthony: They just say, "I'm this person." And a lot of

people just do that very first, very surfacey level verification.

They go and say, "Oh, this person is on LinkedIn."

So they get reeled in, and many people get scammed that way.

The other side of it is a scammer would hijack a profile, and they

get to send some indirect mails.

You can only send so much direct mail these days in LinkedIn.

Anne Genduso: Mm, okay

Mark Anthony: and they could post as them.

And in some cases where maybe somebody abandoned their profile or lost their

profile the scammers can use AI to scale their messages and scale their postings

if they want it, or even scale their emails in such a way that it points to

the LinkedIn profile for people to see.

And like I said, there's many different sides to it, not just one, but, uh,

those are probably the latest, other than maybe, know, the career coaches.

If you're, have some kind of public profile, you're going to be imitated.

gonna happen.

If you're a recruiter, you're gonna be imitated at scale,

but on another platform.

Facebook Marketplace,

Anne Genduso: Interesting

Mark Anthony: those, those are in the wild, so to speak,

and other social networks.

they're smart enough to see if you have a presence there first,

so they can pretend to be you.

Anne Genduso: so what you're saying is that people, what they're doing is

they're taking someone's, who's real, and taking their identity, maybe their

pictures, their profiles that are on LinkedIn, and creating either what?

A new LinkedIn profile, creating a Fiverr account, is that what you're saying?

And, and saying that they're that person

Mark Anthony: can, they could, yeah, they could do both.

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: do both very well.

So somebody who's not a career coach who's not checking, like I had an episode where

potential clients would go and do the verification and find out and would let

the real person know, "Hey, somebody's saying you're offering this on Fiverr,"

or, "You're offering this on M- on Facebook Marketplace or WhatsApp even."

Anne Genduso: उहं।

Mark Anthony: For people who really do the deep research or may know, be a second

tie to that career coach, they will let them know or ask, "Hey, I heard you were

offering this." And the career coach goes, "I'm not even on Fiverr or Marketplace.

Anne Genduso: Sure

Mark Anthony: it gets really deep.

So I would say again, the heart of these scams are impersonations.

They're pretending to be somebody else.

They're using somebody else's existing profile or they're creating a company.

They can even create a, a company that looks close to the real thing, but

not quite if you look close enough,

Anne Genduso: OK

Mark Anthony: most of us don't have the eyes and trained ears.

Um, I can't say that I even have it,

Anne Genduso: Sure.

Mark Anthony: I know how to verify

Anne Genduso: Okay.

So, well, can you tell us how do you verify that?

Mark Anthony: Well, my framework, I call it the zero trust mindset, it's just

simply clarify, verify, don't just apply.

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: at the bottom of the pyramid, so to speak, is starting with

you don't trust anything, anybody.

These days of deep fake videos and deep fake audio Which, uh,

I don't know how, if you've ever seen those, you probably have and

Anne Genduso: Ja.

Mark Anthony: know that they were.

Anne Genduso: Ja

Mark Anthony: That's where your voice is imitated.

Descript can take certain sample of your audio and create your voice around it,

and even fill in places where if you need to do some really cool editing,

you can do that along with with your voice without having to say anything.

Just write the words and comply with the steps.

You can do that.

Anne Genduso: Mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: and that technology is available to anybody and

everybody who really wants it.

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: So that's at the bottom of the pyramid, is starting with zero trust.

You don't trust anything,

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: to a certain degree, unless you talk to someone or

that you see them interact and you know their MO pretty well,

But outside of that, uh, people who are referring you that you don't know

re- real well or people that are coming up to you that don't know you real

well, you should start with zero trust.

I don't know you.

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: so the next step is to, is to clarify.

Understand what they're asking and what they're asking for.

A lot of times when you ask a lot of questions or you're asking clarifying

questions, scammers will run.

They'll ghost you ev- eventually because they don't wanna get caught,

when they're impersonating someone.

if they say that they're someone and it appears that they're not, of

course, after you've checked and look at someone's post or look at their

website, that should cause you to be very suspicious at that particular point.

The best thing you should do is just pause and stop until you, you know, ask

them to send you a LinkedIn, invitation.

Anne Genduso: Mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: They can't do it.

Anne Genduso: Ah, okay.

Mark Anthony: yeah, so that's another way.

But like I said, there are some hijacked profiles, so you can't rely completely on

Anne Genduso: Right, right

Mark Anthony: you're asking clarifying questions, that really helps.

But I think even more basic level is ask yourself and be

real clear on what you contribute

Anne Genduso: to

Mark Anthony: a company or for a job.

Most scammers don't know what you really contribute.

They won't address it.

All

they know is that they have this profile of a job.

They know that perhaps your Stressed, full of anxiety, you're depressed

about long-term unemployment.

So you are victim where you're saying you just want a job at this particular point.

But if you're making the clarification again, will cut out a good bit of

the scammers who are not willing to answer all of those questions all that.

So that's the clarify part.

So there's two parts to that.

There's the clarifying what you want

Anne Genduso: Mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: and, and, and clarifying what they want.

And of course, if you're looking for jobs in your industries, and

they give you a job description, you know that it doesn't pay that well.

You're gonna wanna know why, and you should wanna know why up front.

Say, "Why are you paying so

Anne Genduso: Right.

Mark Anthony: "But this is way beyond the industry, standard for this position."

Anne Genduso: Mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: have to think in a critical manner here that,

okay, it shouldn't be this way,

Anne Genduso: Right.

Mark Anthony: but

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: saying that it is.

It doesn't make sense.

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: the clarifying part might be the longest part of it, but it could

be the thing that stops that train from running through your home, through

your data, and through your money.

Anne Genduso: Yeah.

So the clarify is almost part of verify, right?

Because when you clarify some of the, and ask some of those questions, and

sometimes they can't answer them, you're verifying whether or not they're real.

Mark Anthony: Yep, you're, at that particular point, it

merges right into verifying.

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: you wanna verify at the highest level.

really, if you just wanna spend just five to 10 minutes, without going to

the next step, two steps that are just, I think, are deal breakers many times.

One is if you debunk the company or you debunk or prove that these are

liars, the recruiter, it should be a done deal at that particular point.

you can use a tool, and one of the strongest tools you can use for

verifying a company is, whois.com.

Anne Genduso: उहम्।

Mark Anthony: You'll go to that site, and you'll put at the top the company

Anne Genduso: URL.

Mark Anthony: Many times it's misspelled.

Now, if it's misspelled, then, the joke is on them.

We know that Microsoft isn't spelt with two Ts at the end.

We just know that that's not true.

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: because people don't generally spell real well, there might

be a URL that says careers-microsoft.com.

That means somebody's created several, false URLs

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: uh, imitated URLs, and they'll even make

it look like the real thing.

They'll do a thing called scraping, which they'll go to the site, and they'll scrape

the, aesthetic but won't have the depth of the information that that site will have.

Anne Genduso: Interesting

Mark Anthony: again, using Microsoft as an example, you'll look on whois.com

and see careers-microsoftt.com,

with the wrong spelling of course, it will give a profile, and that

profile is who owns that site.

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: owns that site.

More than likely, it's a person or organization that has no

ties to Microsoft whatsoever.

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: know, we all know this, the history of Microsoft.

They've been around for decades at this particular point, but

the site was just made last year.

Well, go on, that shouldn't make any sense.

And it was, it was registered to somebody in Russia.

Anne Genduso: Right, right.

Then you have like, "Oh, okay."

Mark Anthony: Hello.

You, you might as well stop right there, disengage, report

and block, and that's it.

Anne Genduso: Sure

Mark Anthony: Once that's done, you don't have to check to see

if it's a valid recruiter or not.

You don't have to see anything else is valid.

Anne Genduso: Right.

Mark Anthony: and if you really wanna add an extra s- step to that, go to the

state, if there's a state for them to be.

You can easily put in, you can find any legal LLC or anyone

that has a legal entity attached to it see if they're legal.

If they're not, that should be another red flag.

Anne Genduso: Mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: I'm not saying small companies, can't be sole

proprietor, can't be a solepreneur.

But if somebody's saying that they're Microsoft and they're not

Anne Genduso: Right.

Mark Anthony: uh,

Anne Genduso: Yeah

Mark Anthony: it's kinda absurd.

And these are real simple.

get even more sophisticated than that,

But if people did just that much with a company, they can verify real well.

Anne Genduso: Yeah

Mark Anthony: the best other tool that you could use for verification is to

call the company and see if they're hiring for the position, if they have

a recruiter by that name, and that they have their contact information.

Anne Genduso: you're right, and it can bypass some of

those, like, deepfakes, right?

Because if you look like you're talking to somebody, if you see them, you hear them,

but You can still take that next step.

Say that, like, you know, you did an interview, and something just felt off

to you and, and maybe you hadn't verified ahead of time, you can still do that.

I think I saw a LinkedIn post about a woman who just had that happen to her,

where she had the entire interview, but just felt like something was off, so she

called the company and found out, no, they weren't hiring for that position.

That job didn't even exist at their organization.

Mark Anthony: Right.

Right.

Yeah, don't assume that video is going to be a true authenticator.

don't trust that audio is, because they're scraping somebody else's audio.

So of course for the naked eyes and ears, unless you're really trained,

like I'm untrained, but, um, I would have to ask some questions, and I

think one thing I go through YouTube

deepfakes

and they're on there, is to look at, okay, what are some common things

that they, uh, that you would see?

And back in the early days, it used to be that they couldn't move a certain

Anne Genduso: Right.

They couldn't, do the three fingers,

Mark Anthony: very awkward Yeah,

Anne Genduso: in their face.

Yeah

Mark Anthony: that, and that's gone.

I used to call about the John Cena test, you know, can you wave your

hand in front of your face, you know, you can't see me kind of a test.

Uh, that, that test is obsolete now I think it's just something a little

bit more simpler in most cases, where you could just look at to see

if the person has natural movement.

And there are patterns to a lot of these deepfakes.

A lot of them are not v- very dynamic.

But having said that,

that's

going to change.

Anne Genduso: Yeah.

Yep.

It's gonna get better and better.

Yep

Mark Anthony: going to, it's gonna get better and better.

And I think one thing that I'm seeing that some platforms are doing in other

websites is them being able to detect if the video or audio has used AI it.

Anne Genduso: Mm, mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: I've heard LinkedIn has that technology where they would

have a little thing where AI is on a video or being used for video, I

don't know if that's foolproof yet, but they are working with the FBI now.

LinkedIn and FBI are joining forces to try to, get rid of a lot of

these fake accounts and, false advertisers and whatever else that

comes along, and that's a good step.

I don't like everything that they're doing, but I appreciate that they

have begun, finally to recognize that this is a pervasive issue.

It's a pandemic.

Anne Genduso: It is.

It really is.

It's interesting that y- I know we've been talking about LinkedIn a lot, but

they've been called out a lot lately.

first of all, it's the number one,

Mark Anthony: Угу

Anne Genduso: professional networking site, right?

So people go there, so that, it, it already is a prime target.

But second, like you said, you know, it's prolific.

It's a pandemic there.

It's everywhere.

And, some big entities are starting to take notice.

So you just mentioned that they're working with the FBI, which

I didn't know, which is good.

But it makes me pause and wonder, is it because they wanted to or because

they feel like they have to now?

especially when, you know, you see things like, I think it's the Texas

Attorney General's office is now asking LinkedIn… Yeah, they're, like,

trying to say, "Oh, we wanna, we need to crack down on LinkedIn job scams."

Mark Anthony: Right.

And I think their concern mostly is more of a LinkedIn process and advertisement.

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: say that, you know, they're charging premium members to

have access to certain jobs, but some of those jobs have been ghost jobs.

So they're saying,

Anne Genduso: Yep.

Mark Anthony: you're advertising and they're ghost jobs?

How can that be?" It, it's like, you know, you don't go to Burger

King and get nothing for paying your

Anne Genduso: Right, right, right.

Mark Anthony: that's,

Anne Genduso: Right.

Okay, I see.

Mark Anthony: if the product is bad, that's one issue, but the issue

with them, I think, if I remember correctly, was the fact that the

premium members are paying for access, and the access is not what they

Anne Genduso: Sure.

Mark Anthony: say it is ultimately.

but have you've heard about the New York bill?

Anne Genduso: Mm-mm.

Tell me

Mark Anthony: actually a bill.

they're holding LinkedIn accountable for the ghost jobs aspect of

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: Now, there's various different dialogues regarding

ghost jobs, 'cause there are people calling, ghost jobs job

scams, and that's not really true.

I understand that it seems like a scam if you're applying to

a job, don't get a call back.

I get that, but that's not particularly what it is.

ghost jobs, you ask most recruiters, the key phrase is evergreen

Anne Genduso: M- right.

Mark Anthony: job that's supposed to stay there forever.

But also, they also do it for future jobs as well,

Anne Genduso: Mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: They collect the data to get an avatar on the type of employee

they want for those particular jobs is one of the reasons why they would do that.

But New York is saying is that you gotta give job seekers the option of

whether, if they wanna apply for it by saying that we're just collecting

information, or that you're actively hiring, and to make the distinction.

And from day one of the job scam report, I've always maintained that

that type of transparency is necessary.

it could be as simple as if it's a ghost job, put a green

leaf by it, by just saying

Anne Genduso: उम, हम, हम।

Mark Anthony: And let job seekers decide.

I think the other part is, I think there needs to be a bill and law

to kind of have required and some sites do this, but a lot of sites

Anne Genduso: OK

Mark Anthony: is that they give you an option of how you want your data

used that when you apply for a job, it's just not a broad, "Oh, you can

send me emails or you can just keep my

Anne Genduso: Ah,

Mark Anthony: in the database," to sell it later on.

We know what the deal is.

Monster and Career Builder, after failing and claiming bankruptcy,

still got $220 million I think, or something like that out of the deal.

Anne Genduso: Oh.

Mark Anthony: data is being sold.

Anne Genduso: Right.

Right

Mark Anthony: Now, I know there'll be recruiters who will probably

want to come for me, but I put it out there on several occasions.

Nobody has corrected me, not even my recruiter friends have yet.

But, we have to kinda look at data, your personal information as an asset.

And if you give a criminal your asset, you have opened yourself

up to financial ruin possibly.

Because they're not gonna just get it and act like a kid in a candy

store in a sense that they're gonna go and get the best candy right away.

They're gonna do what they call bait and wait,

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: is that they're gonna wait and wait until it's the opportune

time for them to pretend it's you.

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: And that's where people need to understand

there's a long game aspect to it.

Anne Genduso: Okay, so they're not just coming right in and asking

for a bunch of money from you.

What, h- tell me more about that.

Like, what does this incremental stage look like?

Mark Anthony: Well, they are getting money but that's the goal,

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: I think.

Anne Genduso: The longer term is the data then?

Mark Anthony: The longer term is the data because they can use it

again, use it again, especially if you let it go undetected.

Now, what I could see happening is that they can use AI to

apply to A home loan, car loan,

Anne Genduso: Mm-hmm.

Mark Anthony: financial loans, all at one time.

Now, will it get approved?

Not really, but behind the scenes, I think, my speculation

is that these companies

they're turning it down as you.

They're not turning it down as a

Anne Genduso: Right.

Right.

Interesting

Mark Anthony: So can you imagine trying to buy a home

Anne Genduso: I need to find out

Mark Anthony: tells you, "But you applied 10 times before"?

Anne Genduso: Ah.

Mark Anthony: Now, I'm not saying that they're all gonna act that way, but

understand what the possibilities are.

Anne Genduso: Sure

Mark Anthony: for that.

They've already done lots of people with, credit card

applications, this, that, and other.

it gets bigger than that.

We can't fathom how big it could possibly get in the future if we know

that, our data's been compromised.

Anne Genduso: Yeah

Mark Anthony: it's a very black hole.

But I think most people have to start treating their data as an asset,

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: even the information on your resume.

Be careful.

Stop putting your, your home addresses on your resumes.

You know who you are.

Anne Genduso: Okay.

Okay.

All right

Mark Anthony: stop putting, putting your real phone number.

Use a Google

Anne Genduso: Interesting.

Okay.

Okay

Mark Anthony: you know, a job search email address instead

of the one that you usually

Anne Genduso: Okay.

Yeah, those are good

Mark Anthony: You know, there's a lot of things that people can practically

do to make a difference for the future.

It may be a small difference, but a lot of small differences will eventually

make big differences in the future

Anne Genduso: Yeah.

No, those are great.

Those are, those are wonderful, and I think they're really important in

terms of the verification part because, like, what you're putting out there, so

you're volunteering some things on your resume, on your LinkedIn profile, but

you can control what you're volunteering.

And then to be a little bit more discerning in terms of

verification part so that you don't make it to the job offer stage.

You're filling out a form.

Well, it's a fake job offer stage.

You're filling out a form, and all of a sudden they have your Social

Security number, and that's where they can do all of those other things.

Mark Anthony: Yep, they could do a lot of damage that way.

Anne Genduso: Yeah

Mark Anthony: these days a job seeker and an employee, anybody else, is gonna

have to have a strong verification game.

Anne Genduso: Yeah

Mark Anthony: That's gonna save you and keep you safe in the future.

And of course, don't apply is the last bit.

And, and really to discourage people from mass applying to jobs.

If you applied to 100 jobs this month, you're doing it wrong.

You're absolutely doing it wrong.

Anne Genduso: Yeah

Mark Anthony: it's a huge, uh, safety issue.

It's not just a reputation issue.

Anne Genduso: Right.

Mark Anthony: issue

Anne Genduso: Right.

Ugh, this was so good.

I'm, I do… You know, I wanna ask you one more question, though, if we can.

Mark Anthony: Sure, sure.

Anne Genduso: Yeah.

Mark Anthony: Okay

Anne Genduso: you know, you talk about trust no one, right?

But how do you walk that line, So how do you be someone who is

on vigilant, on guard when you're applying for jobs or when a new

opportunity comes to you, right?

Because it's… You had said this to me earlier, that it- it's not

necessarily, um, you know, just people who are, like, desperately wanting jobs.

it can be what it looks like for, like, opportunity.

People could be in a job, and a great opportunity comes along.

So how do they walk that line about being someone who trusts

no one, yet isn't paranoid?

Mark Anthony: Well, I think you start out with no trust,

Anne Genduso: OK

Mark Anthony: you're starting at ground zero, so to speak, zero trust.

Anne Genduso: Okay

Mark Anthony: You're starting out that way because you're not assuming anything.

Anne Genduso: Okay.

Yep

Mark Anthony: because somebody says that they're a company doesn't mean

necessarily they're a legal company.

having said that, the other side is just because somebody is a legal company that

they wouldn't even have scammy behaviors.

And now scammy behaviors might be somebody legitimate, but they behave scammily.

So why would you even wanna do business with someone so

you treat them like a scammer?

Anne Genduso: Right.

Right

Mark Anthony: you cut it off, say, "That's okay." 'Cause who

wants to, work with somebody who would lie to you or mislead you?

Anne Genduso: Ja

Mark Anthony: if it was once.

They've given you only one chance to be truthful, you should give them

one chance to be truthful as well.

Now, if they need to correct something, that's fine, but they need to be

forthright and very apologetic.

But who has time for that when you've been in a job search for six months or more

Anne Genduso: Right.

Mark Anthony: a

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: like a lot of people are in these days?

Anne Genduso: Sure

Mark Anthony: why I say start with the zero trust mindset

that You have to prove to me.

The burden of proof isn't on you to prove that they're legitimate.

The burden of proof is on them to prove that they're legitimate

Anne Genduso: Okay.

So you can do that though without being paranoid and thinking

everyone's out to get you.

You just start with kind of that blank slate.

Mark Anthony: it's a silent discernment

Anne Genduso: I love it

Mark Anthony: should be applied.

It's a silent discernment.

If somebody, somebody approaches you, a recruiter, all my recruiter

friends have told me that real recruiters are gonna be very forthright

in showing their credentials.

Anne Genduso: Sure

Mark Anthony: If you're looking at LinkedIn, and they have a LinkedIn

profile, you could see the long tail of credibility they have with the consistent

advice, uh, how sound it is, how they're interacting with other recruiters, that

they're part of certain organizations.

You can ask.

Ask your second ties to that person.

Do you know this person personally, or you

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: with them?

you know, the creepy recruiters are gonna be very quick to get you off the app.

They're gonna wanna send you to Zoom or WhatsApp

Anne Genduso: Watch out.

Yep.

Yep.

Mark Anthony: They're going to be very vague in their answers,

and not gonna be very forthright.

And even some of them say, "Hey, contact this person instead." And

it's a person with a Gmail, but why would a recruiter do that?

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: a recruiter have Gmail?

And there are a few recruiters that have Gmails.

a few legitimate that, but very few.

Anne Genduso: Right

Mark Anthony: You use your own channels to verify information.

Don't use theirs.

Use yours.

use your own verification channels, and you should be able to stay scam-free.

Anne Genduso: that's so good.

Thank you so much.

I really appreciate that you taking the time to come on and share those words of

wisdom because like you said, it's getting worse and people need help because a

lot of people don't even know what they don't know until sometimes it's too late.

So this is very useful

Mark Anthony: Y-yeah

so that it's not too late for them

No, it's not.

Anne Genduso: Job scams are everywhere, and they're only getting

more sophisticated so that they can fool even the savviest people.

And what's so unsettling is that the advice we relied on in the

past comes down to verification.

Talk to a real person, get them on camera, look up the recruiter,

make sure the company exists.

But as we just heard, scammers have found ways to get around those tried

and true measures, and you need to, like, really work diligently

to use your second connections or, other verification methods.

Now, that doesn't mean we have to become paranoid and trust no one.

It means we may have to rethink what proof looks like.

All right, side-eyers, I hope you enjoyed today's episode.

And if you did, make sure to like and subscribe so you never miss a thing.

And if you're listening on a podcast app, please leave a rating or review

so more people can discover the show, become fellow side-eyers, and spot

signs of deception before it's too late.

Let's leave you with this week's side-eye question to get your take.

What would convince you that a job opportunity was real?

So tell us in the comments.

And finally, if you have your own story of deception, scams, or

manipulation, we wanna hear them.

Email us at stories@nothingfeltwrong.com.

We may feature your story in a future episode, and we can keep everything

anonymous for your protection.

The more light we shine on the darkest corners of deception, the

more we erase the shame victims feel.

So together, we can take power back from scammers and fraudsters.

I'll see you next time, and until then, keep your side eye

sharp, because nothing felt wrong

until it did.