Simon is joined by Professor Zachary Green to discuss pandemic psychodynamics in the USA. Zachary is Professor in Leadership Studies at University of San Diego, co-founder and director of Group Relations International. Zachary has three decades of experience studying, coaching and consulting to unconscious and systemic dynamics of global organizations, most notably through the World Bank. Zachary discusses how projections and splitting are creating a secondary wave of challenges for the US that are particularly influenced by political polarization and exacerbated by culture wars. The pandemic is also exposing pronounced racial divides in health and welfare provision like never before. Simon and Zachary reflect on these gaps, and how psychoanalysis teaches us that lack creates desire…. could Covid-19 provoke a new push for greater social cohesion? Faith, psychoanalysis and leadership are in the mix, enjoy this podcast!